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Maniac High — Thu, 20 May 2010 12:22:49 +0000

Buy Reductil No Prescription, From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Mystery and others write about successful openers.

From: "Mystery"
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast, where can i buy cheapest Reductil online, Order Reductil no prescription, Alt.psychology.nlp,alt.hypnosis
References: <37602334.55753831@bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Chat suggestions
Date: Wed, buy Reductil no prescription, Buy Reductil from mexico, 16 Jun 1999 04:58:12 -0700
Lines: 63
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts7-36t-14.idirect.com
Message-ID: <37676655@nemo.idirect.com>
X-Trace: 16 Jun 1999 04:54:45 -0400, ts7-36t-14.idirect.com
Organization: via Internet Direct

Status: O

talk about esp and its impossibility

talk about how you met a bear while hiking

talk about how you were scared shitless rock climbing when your rope snapped

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...

mystery

-----

From nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org Wed Apr 12 07:31:37 2000
From: nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org (Nathan SZILARD)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: After the # close

On Mon, buy Reductil online no prescription, Buy cheapest Reductil, 03 Apr 2000 21:26:22 GMT, Rio wrote:
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| If you did any anchoring on your voice when you met, order Reductil, Buy Reductil without a prescription, now's the time to
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----

From slidewguy@remove-aol.com Wed Apr 12 07:47:28 2000
From: "whoisthis19"
Subject: Some closes
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast

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Lets go outsde for some air.

Any of you guys got ways of getting chicks to leave with you outside
the club.

greg1

Did you sleep with yourself or... did you turn yourself down because
you was too easy.

Doing Successful Openers

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Mystery and others write about successful openers!



From: "Mystery" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast,Alt.psychology.nlp,alt.hypnosis
References: <37602334.55753831@bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Chat suggestions
Date: Wed, 16 Jun 1999 04:58:12 -0700
Lines: 63
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts7-36t-14.idirect.com
Message-ID: <37676655@nemo.idirect.com>
X-Trace: 16 Jun 1999 04:54:45 -0400, ts7-36t-14.idirect.com
Organization: via Internet Direct

Status: O

talk about esp and its impossibility

talk about how you met a bear while hiking

talk about how you were scared shitless rock climbing when your rope snapped

or the time you visited your friends friend with him and your buddy was
almost beaten to death when the friend he visited had a boyfriend who came
out and there was a 20 minute car chase through lights and you were looking
for the cops but lot the crazed boyfriend before you found cops.

or the time you were in the hospital and it changed the way food tastes.
the birds sound clearer now.

or the time you netbused (hacked) into a bank but chickened out and put the
money into a charity

or talk about the famous person you met

does she believe in ghosts?  why?

you like candles and incense.  what does SHE like?  the music game modified
for all types of objects.

play the question game with her

or hotseat (like question game but more brutal)

talk about the time you bladed down a steep hill and survived.

talk about the time you were on stage

...

mystery



-----


From nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org Wed Apr 12 07:31:37 2000
From: nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org (Nathan SZILARD)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: After the # close

On Mon, 03 Apr 2000 21:26:22 GMT, Rio  wrote:
| I was reading elsewhere on a post, that if you instruct her to sound
| cheerful on the phone when you call when you do a # close.

I tried that, it's not a magic bullet. But it's fun.

I now always write some shit along with my phone #:
something like "DO NOT FALL IN LOVE" or "NO STALKING PLEASE".

They find it very funny and show it to their friends, plus
they remember.

| If you did any anchoring on your voice when you met, now's the time to
| unleash them.



----

From slidewguy@remove-aol.com Wed Apr 12 07:47:28 2000
From: "whoisthis19" 
Subject: Some closes
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast

Hand her the slip of paper and pen and have her write down her number.
When she's hands it back, ask her to put it someplace so you will
remeber to call her.  Last time I did this she put it down my pants and
grabbed my cock.  

Ask a gal to trade shirts.  When she balks, keep pressing in a joking
manner then finally ask to her to go outside to trade shirts.  Nothing
better then getting her outside.

Another one is simply saying its too smokey, noisy, smelly in here. 
Lets go outsde for some air.

Any of you guys got ways of getting chicks to leave with you outside
the club?

greg1

Did you sleep with yourself or... did you turn yourself down because
 you was too easy.

A conversation with Mystery! Pickups

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


A conversation with Mystery!

Tips on fieldwork from a pick up artist! on IRC #PUA!


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A Conversation with Mystery, a Pick-up Artist (PUA)

Topics Include: 

The Kiss Close
Clubbing alone
Handling guys
Being a story-teller
Preparation and format
Quality vs. quantity

Lego: Hey Mystery, what's your favorite story to close with?  How 
exactly do you transition from the telling of a story to closing?

Mystery: "The Kiss Close" is my favorite routine.  Once you have three 
indicators of interest (she touches you, laughs consistantly at your 
jokes, leans in towards you, smiles a lot and keeps eye contact, resumes 
chat when you force silence, etc) you then phase shift.  You turn 180 
degrees on a dime.  Go from humorous and non-sexual to saying, "Stop.  
Would you like to kiss me?", right out of the blue.  She will say either 
say, "Uh - no",(which is unlikely as you don't bother performing "The 
Kiss Close" until enough indicators are present) or, "I donno" (they 
rarely say, "Yes"). "I donno" means she actually does want to but feels 
embarrassed on how to say "Yes".  So you reply, "Lets find out", then go 
in slowly and kiss her.  It's very simple and very effective.  If she 
says, "Why?", this is also a yes.  Simply reply, "It looked like you had 
something on your mind.  Would you like to kiss me?"  Wait again for 
her response.  If her response is "No" then reply, "Hey I didn't say you 
COULD.  You just had that look in your eye."

Lego: What do you do if you're interrupted? You're telling your target 
a story and she is all into it but some AFC cock-blocking idiot just 
runs up and starts screaming and yelling and you're like, "What the 
fuck?"

Mystery: Simply ask him if you can borrow his pen.  When he gives it to 
you, throw it away as you say, "Fetch."

Wakeboarder: Hahaha.  Nice!

Lego: What if he's bigger than you?

Mystery: I'd instead call him on his disruptive shit and remark, "Dude, 
what are you attempting here?"  Not good enough?  Then say, "Ladies?  
Shall we discover what adventure awaits us in another room?"

Wakeboarder: Man, none of my buds want to go to the club.

Gamer: Screw them then.

Mystery: Go alone.

Wakeboarder: I need to be made fun of for this comment but I feel like 
a weiner if I go to a club myself

Lego: Bro, your trippin'. I go solo many times. It's good actually.  
It's weird if it's a first night but if I've been there before it's cool.

Mystery: Yeah, I understand ... and yet, staying home alone will make 
you feel so much better?  Go out alone, meet some cool dudes when you 
get there (they will become your wingmen there) and then run around 
getting #'s.  Report to your fellow PUAs what happened.  Whatever happened 
to the concept, "The alphamale gets all the women?"  Shit dude, what are 
you, a mommas boy?  Do you need your hand held?  

Lego: How do you strike up conversations with guys?

Mystery: Walk up and say, "Hey dude, question for ya.  Do you know 
where a good place to score is in this city? 'Cause this place looks like a 
cock farm."

Lego: Good!  You should be able to relate to guys to disarm them.  You 
don't compete; you ELIMINATE COMPETETION.

Gamer: LOL.  Dude, the only results I've had were solo.  My friends 
psych me out too much because they never help.  Instead they just complain 
about my taking too much time.  They laugh at me or just generally piss 
me off.

Mystery: I have MUCH better results (and MUCH more fun) playing "The 
Game" alone.  It forces you to approach.  It's a great motivator.

Lego: Damn! I couldn't have put it better myself.

Gamer: Yep.

Mystery: You wont be alone for more than five minutes once you approach 
your first set anyways.  Gamer, I suggest you call them on their shit 
at some point.  Demonstrate your alphamale characteristics.

Lego: How do you continue talking?  I mean, group set dynamics are much 
different in a one one on one approach.

Mystery: Be a story-teller - THAT is the skill of the PUA.  It isn't 
SEDUCING; it's STORY-TELLING.  It is my personal belief that SS patterns 
arent as 'hypnotic' as they are 'entertaining' stories.

Wakeboarder: Sweet

Lego: Actually with the story stuff I SEE WHAT YOU MEAN.  They just 
follow that lead.

Wakeboarder: Well, I need to stop being a sackless wonder and grow some 
fuckin' balls then!  Hmm, story telling ...

Mystery: Here's an example.  "Ever been camping?  Well I was up in a 
forest up north and was hiking with some girlfriends of mine ... and we 
came along some trail and there was shit on the path.  My friends were 
like, "haaaa someone shit in the woods" and I said, "lets get the fuck 
out of here like NOW."  they thought I was just scared of shit and I 
said, "Girls, you dont get it.  This shit is still warm and its not human.  
Its bear shit.  This is a big fucking bear.  Look at the size of that 
turd."  Notice it's not sexual?  Most hot girls gets get "sex-talk" 
right away from AFCs.  NOT talking sex with them makes them question 
whether you are interested in them.  Leave them guessing until you get 
indicators of interest from them.  If they like your great personality 
(confident, humorous, etc) they will give you subtle but distinct clues.

Gamer: How do you flow from story to story?

Mystery: If there is ONE mental state you should force yourself into, 
its TALKATIVE.  Talk your fucking HEAD off.  Just go from one story 
straight into another one like a comedian does.  Ever find yourself excited 
about something and you talk and talk and talk?  THAT is what must 
happen to get a girl.  You have to ENTERTAIN them.  Look talkative yet not 
desperate.  

Gamer: Heh.

Lego: Dude, I had that going last night. You're so right.  That's an 
excellent example dude.  I was telling this story about getting harassed 
by cops or some shit.  It's a cool story but my delivery sucked and I 
was losing one of the two girls I was telling it to.  What if they fail 
to elaborate on your story?  Besides it being a bad story to begin 
with, how can you fix it on the fly?

Mystery: They don't have to interact with it.  Its a good thing to have 
flexible stories to allow for some comment but it's not nessessary.  
It's YOUR job to perform the material.  It's your audiences job to 
listen,laugh and generally be entertained.  That's it.  At the end of 10 
minutes you will see the girls digging you (positive indicators).  You then 
phase shift abruptly into the close.

Lego: HOW DO YOU PHASE SHIFT?  I've been wondering this. While I didn't 
come off as obvious in last nights case and just told her to kiss me (I 
knew she would anyway), this could have been smoother.

Alpha: Lego, you ad libbed the close?  So working on ad libbing is 
good?

Mystery: Ad libbed material is not as accurate in closing as is 
performing the well constructed and field-tested "Kiss Close" routine.  Ad 
libbing is BONUS material but don't COUNT on it.  Have your material, like 
a good comedian, prepared before performing.  This isn't "A Night at 
the Improv" fellas.

Gamer: Heh.

Mystery: All PUs have a format; a beginning, a middle and an end.  If 
you don't know what the next routine is going to be then you may end up 
with an unfortunate pregnant pause which fucks up your pacing.  You may 
end up filling the silence with the deadly, "So ... um ... what do you 
do?"  Preparation saves face.  Afterall, with your particular close, 
she could have pulled away from your trying to kiss her.  Then what?!!  
Instead, consider engaging her in enthusiastic conversation, then go 
directly into the close.  In other words, stop her in mid-sentence and 
with a curious tone, kiss close.

Wakeboarder: cool.  Lego, what indicators clued you in that she wanted 
the kiss?

Alpha: In what way can you be prepared?  If we're talking about 
story-telling in front of a random girl we just met seconds ago in a random 
place ...

Mystery: Like a good comedian, have your material prepared yet when 
onstage be prepared to dynamically omit certain routines and to add others 
on the fly.  Sometimes certain routines fit the situation better than 
others.  Have 3 to 5 alternative openers (as a comedian would) and enjoy 
performing the one you think best fits the situation will get the best 
reaction for the group you are in front of

Alpha: Gotcha now.  Can you give me a brief example of how you go about 
preparing?

Mystery: Sure.  First, find 3 openers and memorize them.  Write down a 
list of openers (just the headings of each opener to remind you).  
Next, write down some routines (the question game, the music game, the 
photo routine, the bear in the woods story, etc - all on dejanews) and then 
also memorize the kiss close and the # close.  Memorize 3 NEGs too and 
you are good to go.  With the material in your mind, you are prepared 
to work it in the field until you have the timing of the material down 
(again, just like a comedian.)

Alpha: Man, you provide some really eye-opening ideas... (just when I'm 
about to think there's nothing more to learn.

Wakeboarder: So what you're saying is have a routine set up and modify 
it to each situation? Kind of like having a PU template?

Mystery: It's ALL about format.  Know the format and stick to it.  If 
you now what the next step is in the PU, you wont feel scared.  It gets 
fun and you begin to appreciate the strategy behind it all.

Wakeboarder: Yeah like FMAC? That's a simple format.

Mystery: Yes, FMAC.  Each letter in FMAC is an abrupt phase shift.  
"FIND" means having to abruptly disturb your complacency by getting out of 
the house.  It takes effort for many people to do bother getting THIS 
FAR.  "MEET" is a HUGE abrupt change.  "There she is!  3, 2, 1, GO!"  In 
the "ATTRACT" phase, you need to go from the walk up to the TALKATIVE 
performer entertaining story-teller.  You will need A LOT of energy for 
this (enthusiasm is contagious afterall) and for many to go from 
slumping around to being in performer mode is ABRUPT.  Finally you must then 
"CLOSE"; to phase shift from humour to serious is also abrupt.  Each 
phase may FEEL awkward but it looks normal.  When a comedian finishes one 
topic and just goes into an entirely new unrelated topic, the audience 
doesn't care as long as the next topic is entertaining.

Wakeboarder: Very true.

Gamer: Cool.  I'm collecting openers and other routines off the 
layguide right now.

Alpha: Do you believe in the 80/20 'rule'?  Meaning, 80% of the quality 
women are found in 20% of the right places or connections or 
situations.

Mystery: The quality of a woman is SO subjective. Quality is difficult 
to QUANTIFY.  80% of QUALITY?  It's pointless trying to mix and match 
these concepts. INSTEAD consider that there are HOTTIES and UGs (YOU get 
to decide based on your personal criteria) and of the HOTTIES, some 
have pleasant personalities and others do not.  You cannot possibly judge 
her personality until she LIKES you.  So go out ... FIND her, MEET her, 
ATTRACT her and THEN decide if you want to CLOSE her AFTER judging her 
personality.  Judging her by the way she treats you on your approach is 
lame because particularly beautiful women all have their bitch shields 
up and running.  They have to.  They aren't planning on fucking every 
guy that says Hi to them.  The only way to get rid of the guys is to 
oftentimes offend them quickly.  It's not personal.  It's merely a learned 
strategy.  So is the "I have a boyfriend excuse, but that's a different 
story.  I also suggest CLOSING everyone just for the education.  You 
don't actually have to CALL the girls of course.  You simply get to 
practice CLOSING too.  Getting a girls number is merely an OPTION.  You 
don't have to follow up on ALL of them you know.

Keen: Heh.

Wakeboarder: Cool, judging the girls only after you have attracted 
them.  Kind of makes you approach too!  You can't say the bull shit line, 
"She's not my type, I can tell", to get you out of approaching.

Alpha: Do you have a web page?

Mystery: No, not currently.  I'm writing a book though called The 
Mystery Method.  Most of my ramblings can be found on the layguide. 

Ascence: Hey, is it true that the older we get the more money/social 
status becomes and issue?

Mystery: No matter what social status you have (or THINK you have), 
it's still something you must convey in the first 25 minutes of meeting 
her.  We ALL start equal BEFORE meeting her; all men.  The issue is, can 
we congruently convey our social status (real or not) in our 
performance?  That's OUR responsibility.  The best way is not to TELL them about 
it but rather to DEMONSTRATE it.  How?  Well, if you talk about having 
girls always falling for you for instance, it's not NEARLY as good as 
actually having a couple hot girls with you saying what a hottie you are 
infront of the target.  This is called PAWNING.

Keen: I'm going to try doing the story-telling that you talked about.  
It's really hard though. I'm a real bad storyteller.  I've been working 
on it today. that's my lesson today.

Wakeboarder: Tell them about that time you saw a fallen over manequin 
in the department store and you tripped over it.  The security guard 
thought you were trying to make it with the manequin and called you a 
little freak.

Gamer: LOL (Laughing Out Loud).

Wakeboarder: One more question for you Mystery.  What's the meaning of 
life?

Mystery: To fuck. :)

Statement of Intent (SOI)

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Rio introduces a key part of PU: the 'Statement of Intent' (SOI)!

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2000 09:00:50 GMT
Subject: Find Stun Drag Fuck

G'day,

Jonathan Ashton  wrote in message
news:90eati$gpt@nnrp1.deja.com...
> As I've read the twelve-odd messages in this thread, I've been looking
> for something to take home with me, but I'm not finding it.
>
> Rio, how do you do things differently now, based on what you've said?

First thing would be to think about the close. Mystery knows his group work
perfect from how I read it, and I have been using his methods to great
success social-proof wise.

The BIG thing that clocked in my head was the need to STATE YOUR INTENTIONS
to the chick within the first minute of meeting her. I will make that my
rule from now on - as with the 3 second rule.
By this I DON'T mean "Let's fuck" or "Come to Papa baby" or any throw-away
shit like that. It has to be an honest assessment of what YOU feel capable
of doing to the chick after the "Hi" and the first round of fluff/routine
(routine preferred - something humourous). GM does this part BEAUTIFULLY,
because he does it with a sense of fun and humour - and HE KNOWS he is going
to do what he says and so does SHE!
I notice Mr. Sex states this a lot in his past posts - where AFC or shit
PUAs do approaches and talk to the chick, but never get to the point AND the
bitch can tell that the guys want to fuck but are too pussy to go for it.
Ross says something to the tune of "And maybe we could really get to like
each other" when he closes in HTGTWYDIB. I also recall that TokyoPUA did a
statement of intentions on that chick he PUed at night once who was
initially scared of him. Johnny Shack does it by when he just springs dates
on women he just met.
So there's some cross references.

The proper methodological way to get to a statement of intentions part is by
pace and lead. But the point of the matter is, you have to structure the
conversation to show interest and intent VERY soon or you will stall, chick
will get bored, feel teased, and then it's C&B time. Believe me, a LOT of
C&B experience with a LOT of HOT chicks has so far has taught me this
painful lesson.
The best way to put it is in the most honest way possible. I cannot give you
a specific example. But the idea is to get her thinking romantically about
you VERY soon. THEN you HAVE TO DO WHAT YOU SAID you would do to the chick
after DDB. (E.g. If you want to start things off gently by holding her hand,
tell her a scene where want to be holding her hand - and then do it in the
next routine after she is comfortable with this.) If you do NOT DO what you
say you will, eventually your congruence will fuck up when the chick loses
patience. Then the chick will be confused, get scared, and bolt. If this
ever happens and the guy tries to do heavy kino or try for a fuck while the
chick is in this state - It's gonna be RAPE.

In fact, on the matter of Rape. I read in Cosmo (Hey, My chick gets fucked
often and STILL reads this!) that psychologists WARN women against guys that
say "Come to my place to see my pictures" etc. when the idea is to fuck the
chick whilst your intentions aren't known to her - because it is DATE RAPE.
Thus as Maniac found out ages ago, that GROUNDWORK is the key element to
getting the chick over to fuck. That can be done through STATEMENT OF
INTENTIONS - and may not necessarily happen through Kiss closes.
You must remember this - a kiss is just a kiss........

IF that works, THEN we can reward her with more conversation and more
Mystery style routines or whatever (because she is OK with our intentions
then - thus the rewards), and THEN up the ante some more with our STATEMENT
OF INTENTIONS, building on what we established before - to get her more hot
and horny than before. So you may have started on holding her hands, now you
may progress on to hugging, kissing, fucking etc. whatever seems to be the
most logical progression from her actions towards you.

Patterns, routines, psych tests, will help greatly during the chat routines
in-between statements of intentions. Those are what set us apart from the
other PUAs out there.

Eventually we get to a point where the chick is DDB, then we can get to the
Drag (you must take the woman to fuck location, or have her so into you that
she will come to you) and Fuck part (in our world of course). The Our World
routine would then be the ULTIMATE in the STATEMENT OF INTENTIONS series
which would then lead to the deal fuck closed. It is in this one that you
state your relationship expectations and put it in "Our World"

Now the method is Find, Stun, Drag, Fuck.

The point is - FUCK all this bullshit about the woman needs to be done in
the "right way" to match her values. Something tells me now that a woman
made this comment as an attempt to rationalize her unreasonable emotions.
The values she wants ALL ALONG is #1 SEX, and to a lesser extent #2 to be
taken care of after SEX. That goes for ANY woman (thus the universality of
the whole principle). When the guy comes along as does her, she will
rationalise that the guy understood exactly what she felt. That's what some
religious women mean when they beautifully say "God knew when it was the
right time for me". In reality, they KNOW DEEP DOWN they are at the mercy of
guys and what they want to do with her. To her, that is "destiny" and no
wonder so many women are suckers for fortune-telling and the like.

Eliciting is when you want to # close or coffee close and check the girl out
for relationship potential. If it's ONS - hey! ya don't need it! If you
cannot attempt a kiss to fuck close in the given situation - you will have
to # close, but not forget to state that your intentions could well get
beyond just coffee!

The other thing - "Make no excuses for desires as a man" is THE SINGLE MOST
IMPORTANT THING (As Ross Jeffries has already said) but I had to experience
it myself to believe it. ALL of what I explained above IS USELESS in
practical application if you are trying to follow it like a script. The idea
is to GRAB that girl and NOT let her get away! ;) So guys, HOW MUCH DO YOU
WANT THAT GIRL? WHAT ARE YOU PREPARED TO DO?

Also on that note. BE A FUCKING MAN. Act like a guy, and don't think that
mirroring a girl completely is going to make you attractive to her. I know
from experience that the more caveman I go with chicks who KNOW my
intentions, the more they respond sexually.
Talk to chicks as if you were telling your kid brother how to play football
properly, cause your kid brother happens to be shit at football. I
especially like the way Mr. Sex talks to us on ASF - giving pointers and
what-not. I'm sure he talks to chicks exactly the same way IRL - showing
congruence all along.

You can even get around the language barrier! I just about dragged a sexy
Jgirl in a bikini off the beach while babbling to them in English! A
language they didn't even understand! I did that enough and with a smile,
that the chick went DDB and ready to GO when I took her hand. Had it not
been for the cockblock!
Somebody must have taught the "Iranian from hell" this shit!

The way I think about it is much like caveman sex. You see the hot chick,
you bang her on the head with your club, you take her to your cave, you root
her. Thus :- Find Stun Drag Fuck.
Just a bit more aggressive than Find Meet Attract Close, but that's the best
way I could describe what this ugly-as-fuck PUA was doing.

These were the attitudes that I had when I was only just starting to pull
women at incredible speeds while on holiday.

The other point is on Objection handling in regards to the STATEMENT OF
INTENTIONS. What I learned from the PUA I met, is that you fight chick
bullshit with your own bullshit - with a slightly authoritive tone (no need
to REALLY get pissed).
For example :- The chicks said "We have to get to our car" and were ready to
leave
The Playboy said "You can't leave anyway because the gates are closed" even
though the gates aren't closed.
Thus this covers handling chick bullshit - on the phone as well as in real
life.
And one chick on another seduction board I read often typed something to the
tune that she wants to be with a guy that can bullshit his way into her
pants.

So there you go. Find Stun Drag Fuck.
Stun is the hardest.

> There are reasons why most of us step through seduction so gingerly.
> We know that saying or doing one wrong thing can blow up the seduction.
> As far as I can tell, letting her know you intend to fuck her before
> you fuck her is one of those things.  Another reason is that women
> won't tell you when they're ready to fuck.

But DDB does tell all!
That single most common fuckup is what is called LACK OF CONGRUENCE
(definition courtesy of Mr. Sex). Just like when I called that chick I met
yesterday "my friend" in front of her. Doing that is a sign of weakness.
Chicks can get away with having words out of congruence with their actions,
but guys CANNOT.

> You say that when you "lead girls on" and tease them too much, you look
> easy and they hate you.  But this insight doesn't make it any easier to
> recognize when you're "leading them on".  The window between when a
> woman is receptive to a close and when you've stalled her is short, and
> spotting it seems to be harder than superstring theory.  The answer
> seems to be to make hundreds of approaches, and very slowly improve
> through experience.

Well you have body language and other subtle pointers. Plus we are adding
all the time to our STATEMENT OF INTENTIONS in order to find a barrier and
cut off point. I don't doubt that noticing DDB when you have the intuition
becomes easier.

  The one concrete thing I get out of your post is
> that next time two HBs want a foursome with you and your LTR, you'll be
> more likely to recognize it.  Or maybe the situation will be different
> enough that you won't.

I fucked that up because I KNOW those chicks wanted me to go with them, and
I over-teased them and didn't capitulate and then state my intentions to
have a foursome. They would have been up for it!
That's when the Playboy showed up to show me the shit, and then beat me
hands-down in a round of THE GAME. ;)

> You also said, "Now I realise more than fucking EVER what a chick
> wants. She wants a guy to go and GET her, make her feel wanted, and
> then have the shit fucked out of her!"  But you agreed with another
> poster that you can't just walk up to a woman and say "Let's fuck."
> So what's your new insight here?

It's a no-brainer. Is sex ALL you bringing to the table? That's why he
coupled GM styled intention pointers further into the seduction (after the
earlier G-rated ones), and then when they succeeded in not objecting, he
went to Mystery routines as a reward OR to the Drag phase if they were DDB.
You cannot start the seduction with a statement of intention that skips the
buildup - unless the chick is THAT FUCKING HORNY and shameless.
Chicks want to know that you care about them as human beings and not just
sex objects. Thus neutral conversation gets smattered in between, and the
final statement of intentions clearly shows what his intentions are so SHE
KNOWS that you care about her feelings - in that way.

The Playboy I met even went to see a chick he had a threesome with the next
day (cause she was feeling a bit alone). This guy was no cheap "Player"
(which he pointed out in his great Our world styled close routine on this
9). You could tell he cared enough too.

> Have you figure out a better way to know when a woman is ready to
> be closed?  Or a faster way to get her to want to fuck?  Or a way to
> let her know your intentions without scaring her off?  What's the
> difference between your approach now and your approach before you went
> to Guam?  It sounds like you feel you understand things better than
> you did before, but I can't figure out what the new understanding is.

Well, now you have your answer.
Mind you, I'm only getting the framework now that I sit down and try and
explain what I am now doing. This shit became automatic when I had the whole
experience of witnessing this guy and learning from him.

Any questions or comments? Fire away....

Rio
-------

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
References:  <90eati$gpt@nnrp1.deja.com> <63JW5.205t1.56373@nnrp.gol.com> <90i82p$iao@nnrp1.deja.com>
Subject: Re: Find Stun Drag Fuck

Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2000 10:04:46 GMT

Jonathan Ashton  wrote in message
news:90i82p$iao@nnrp1.deja.com...
> In article <63JW5.205t1.56373@nnrp.gol.com>,
>   "Rio"  wrote:
> > Well, now you have your answer.
>
> Yeah, I understand much better now.  Thanks for writing it down.
>
> > Any questions or comments? Fire away....
>
> So I get the abstract idea now:  Make some sort of Statement Of
> Intentions (SOI) to a woman relatively early, and then act congruently
> with it.

More or less, that's it.
The thing is, after dropping routines - get to it or the chick gets confused
and drops out.
Mystery had the right idea with his routines and intros. BUT if you fail to
State your intentions - you can stall things and stale her out. Then it will
be your fault when it appears that the routines don't work! They may have
worked, but she has given up on you as a partner already. You teased too
much.

> Like most people, though, I don't really understand any abstract idea
> until I've seen two or three concrete examples; i.e. HOW to make that
> SOI.

Ross Jeffries has already covered how to do this with his NLP pacing and
leading. I'm just giving a name to the end result of doing that (SOI -
Statement of Intention).

SOIs are SO important to women. They want to know where they stand. Women
you are with and haven't SOIed will think to themselves :- "What am I to
him"?
With my LTR which I sloppily SOIed, she annoyed me for ages if I was her
boyfriend or not. I hadn't said, and was therefore walking thin ice.
That drove her NUTS.

Now, I guess I could show you some fake examples of stuff that you could
launch into your PU - but the reason why I'm not going to do that is because
if ANYBODY creates a list of them - we're going to get the problem that AFC
men ALREADY have with PU Lines. That is, throwing meaningless words into a
conversation and then not being able to back them up.
Either that, or we will develop a single street pickup routine which men
will use the world over with great success before women cotton on to it.
When it comes to SOI, DIY (damn all these acronymns!).

An example of SOI is what I said to the chick I tried to PU on the weekend.
I paced it to the point where we are talking about where we lived, and I
found out that she lived close. Then I said "That's good, so we can get
together really easy and have some fun then."
If she had been far away - no problem "That's too bad. I'll have to travel
far to get together with you and have fun"
If she lives on Mars - no problem "Wow! You live out there! I'll have to
build a rocket to come and see you after you go back there!"

So there you go. Who needs to be excessively GM?

> You gave the example of GM style.  Yep, GM makes a pretty clear SOI.
> I don't think a "recovering nice guy" like me could do GM congruently,
> though.

I have done it once successfully and it Suuure works. But yes, it's hard to
work things up to that because you skip a lot of buildup steps. The flirting
has to take place in a sexual level rather than a much safer level. That is
risky.
That's what I mean when by saying "Let's Fuck" you run the risk of having to
flirt at such a high level where you can fuck up easily. Not that it's
impossible of course.
NEGs (which I forgot to mention before) help especially in the
objection,flirt phase. This phase is like the part where the dog chases
after the bitch to try and fuck her, and the bitch keeps running. The thrill
of the chase!

> You mention TokyoPUA and Johnny Shack references, but it would take
> a lot of searching/guessing to find the specific examples you have in
> mind.  And I don't understand your Ross example - "And maybe we could
> really get to like each other" sounds like a pretty vague SOI; maybe
> I'd understand what you mean if I knew the context?

Search for stuff on the archived layguide for stuff about Johnny Shack. He
also has an online book. Ross has his old free book around the place. Search
Formhandle for TokyoPUA's posts.
By the way, I even went as far as reading ALL of Mystery's decent posts as
well.

> The only example of an SOI I see in your posts is this one from Guam
> PUA:
>
> > As for going for the fuck close? Forget your sexual accelerators.
> > This guy said the whole shit in plain English - and I saw him say
> > this all to to a chick. He basically said that he was a playboy, but
> > not a pickup artist (to frame the idea that he won't fuck and dump),
> > and that when he had sex with the chick (Framing it as if it's going
> > to happen) that she should just enjoy it for fun and not worry about
> > it too much because it's just their private thing (our world style
> > routine), and that he was not an easy guy in reality - that he was
> > quite selective in who he chooses for sex (so he doesn't look like a
> > meat-market man).
> > He said all this straight faced to a chick, and while I was watching
> > the chick he did this on - she was trancing out and playing with her
> > hair. It was totally evil.
>
> So my questions...
>
> Have you ever done a SOI to kiss a girl and not had her object?  If so,
> what did you say?  Have you ever done a SOI to fuck a girl and not had
> her object?  If so, what did you say?  Hell, do you remember the exact
> words of any SOI you've ever said?

I gave you an example above of an SOI above (where I told the chick that we
would hang out in the future). No doubt we can refine the whole shit a lot
better in the future.
And yes. I think everyone at some stage has done an SOI, or the body
language has been good enough to get her into that zone where she KNOWS
maybe at 70% where your intentions are, with or without any routines to help
snag the chick, and the chick has put up some token resistance. The purpose
of the resistance of course, is to set the scene for the chase you know will
end in a fuck if you can just reel the bitch in. You will eventually do it
as long as you have remained congruent throughout.

> What other kinds of SOIs would you use in the buildup?  Tell her you're
> going to give her a neck massage?  (I'm sure that question sounds
> clueless; but I really think the meat is in the details.)

Well pace it:-
"Have you ever felt like having a neck massage? I think you need one, so
I'll give you one"
Sometimes the more direct your SOIs are, the harder she will force you to
keep pushing them.
So let's say the chick flirts and says "Why do you want to? I don't need
one!"
So we have to SOI her again in the second sentence in this example :- "Well
you haven't had one of my massages that can make you feel good all over. Now
relax....."

The idea is to trap the chick at all costs with your intentions that you can
carry out - until she can't get away.
Even "No I can't!" "Yes you can!" "No I can't!" "Yes you can!" fights - if
that's what it comes down to - can win you the day if you persist and not
let her win! Verbal arguments can always be solved with kino - cause you as
the guy are STRONGER. I don't mean hit her, but mauling is OK as long as she
is enjoying it! ;)

Persistance is VERY important. Of course, you may want to dump the chick
after the fuck if she doesn't drop the shit because she is too much work to
obtain sex from in the long run. Just give her an ultimatum "Cut the shit or
you will be lonely!"

At the same time, you can get trapped if you say an SOI that you can't
possibly keep. So watch what you promise to do!
Saying shit like "I'm going to buy you a Rolls Royce!" when she KNOWS you
can't afford it is an extreme example of a shit SOI. There goes your trust
and congruency with that one.

> And as for one other comment you made:
>
> > (E.g. If you want to start things off gently by holding her hand,
> > tell her a scene where want to be holding her hand - and then do it
> > in the next routine after she is comfortable with this.)
>
> You mean you tell her a story about some guy you know who held some
> girl's hand?  Or what?  Methinks I really don't understand here.

You can do that to get her thinking about holding someone's hand - and once
she is feeling it, you may be able to slip in the kino and get away with it.
At least, your chances will be better.

> > Is sex ALL you bringing to the table? That's why he
> > coupled GM styled intention pointers further into the seduction
> > (after the earlier G-rated ones), and then when they succeeded in
> > not objecting, he went to Mystery routines as a reward OR to the
> > Drag phase if they were DDB.
>
> I would LOVE to see these SOIs written down.

Done as above. But make your own!
I re-explained the "Let's Fuck" problem a bit better above as well.

> So here's my deal:  I want to see more examples of SOIs so I can take
> them apart, because I really suspect that the exact wording is crucial.
>
> For example:
>
> GM gets away with his SOIs because they're exaggerated to absurdity,
> and thus they're both funny and unlikely (at least as stated).
> This puts a little distance between the SOI and the girl, so she
> doesn't slap him.

I think it's more of a case of the GM SOIs that fail, he can write them off
as being jokes. That keeps him on track and congruent.
BUT the risk of failure is very high if he doesn't cover his tracks.

> Guam PUA gets away with his SOI (quoted above) because he's talking
> about chicks in general, and not overtly about the particular chick.
> This puts a little distance between the SOI and the girl, so she's
> not pressured to make a decision right then.

This is the all important point. With some SOIs (and especially with
ambiguities in NLP) the SOIs are not in your face, BUT they are vague enough
to get the point across and then judge for a positive reaction from her or
not. However, the vagueness is simply a shot from 50 metres as opposed to a
shot from point-blank. Just make sure you hit the target.
The danger with point-blank SOIs is they are risky in so far as if you say a
dumb one you can't,won't, or don't want to carry out like "I'm going to take
you on holiday!" as opposed to an NLP shot from 50 metres which describes a
holiday and builds on it. "Have you ever been on holiday with someone
special?....."

> Am I on the right track here?  Are there other ways to word SOIs that
> get around direct resistance?  More examples would be appreciated.

You should check out patterning, but remember, a shot from point-blank is
better than 50 metres. The shortest distance between 2 points is a straight
line. There are pros and cons of both styles of course.
You can take the short path across the dangerous ravine, or the long path
around it.

> I gotta say, this whole idea of SOIs is new to me.  Maybe other PUAs
> in this group have been using them without ever realizing/stating the
> importance of them?

I just gave a name to it. People have done this stuff before and I'm just
giving it a name to help explain what I'm doing.

And no, Ray can't trademark this either and claim it's his. We have
discussed why this is enough on ASF. He's filtered anyway and I can't see
his verbal shit.

> Thanks,
> Ash

Thanks for the questions. They help challenge me in trying to explain myself
better.

Rio

-------

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Clearing SOI's up
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 12:15:23 GMT

Maniac,

I came up with the SOI concept after studying what the Guam Playboy did to
chicks. I wish I could have spent longer down there to learn more off this
guy. Oh well, I just need to save up to go again.

SOI (Statements of intention/interest) were comments that the Guam Playboy
made a lot (I assume you read my report on that place - It's nanpa
paradise!). What he did then was control the flirting that followed after
baiting her with a show of interest. He did this by offering a challenge -
when he finished doing that once he went back to fun routines, talking about
parties on the island, jokes, sex personality tests, etc. before he did
another SOI - staring out as indirect and ambiguous, before being VERY
direct. ;)

Basically what I think I have come up with, through trying to explain to the
posters that asked me about him, is a flirting construction kit.

The Guam Playboy NEGged a LOT - and he got away with it every time. He could
even tell chicks AFC things like they were beautiful, and then turn it into
a NEG if he wanted. That's what over 20 years of daily PU did for this guy.

But the NEG is only one kind of flirting (used for dumping a girl's uptight
self image). There are other kinds, such as using ambiguities, physical
light-handed slapping and pushing kino, playing tricks on people, etc. The
Playboy used plenty of variations.

Flirting is this:- One drops the SOI, and then pulls it away out of reach of
the target. Then gives another SOI, and then pulls it away again. Like with
our words, we put images of sex and romance in their heads, then pull it out
again, then out it in, then take it out, then put it back in, then take it
out again........ Mindfucking!
Once the chick is confused and teased enough, she is DDB and safely
mindfucked.

I did a PU once on a chick using the SOIs. I found out where she lived and
then said "Oh that's not far from my place, so I can come down to see you.
It's a pity I am so busy it won't happen today"
(Note that there is a bit of future pacing and presuppositioning in this)
She lapped it up and took my kino from there - despite the BF being a matter
of metres away.

The structure for the Guam Playboy routine went like this:-

- Fun routine or opener (ala Mystery) - some basic fluff - all good things
about himself, what he could do for the women (he played the helpful tour
guide). Be "Disgustingly" Charming! as he put it. The guy wasn't big on
logically drawing out routines for what he did (which is a good thing), he
just went and DID this.... thus he couldn't really explain to me what he was
doing. I had to observe.
- SOI. He said something that hinted that he was interested in the chick
(paced and lead from his opener conversation). This got her emotions going
and her ideas racing. I have found this CRITICAL if the chick is going to
stay interested in you for too long. I bored many chicks out initially when
I wouldn't get to the point.
"What do you look for in guys?" would be sufficient enough as a question to
hint at what you are after (as you have found out yourself Maniac). Starting
off on a topic about guys and relationships usually brings chicks out, but
asking "Do you have a BF?" sucks.
This Ross Jeffries inspired SOI "The more you laugh, the more you'll be
attracted to interesting people......now with me" is an ambiguous SOI.
- Before she could knock him down for any comment, he would then be a
challenge and say something like "I'm not easy", "we don't know each other
well enough yet", "but what would I know, right? ;)","I need to feel passion
first", "Yeah, you know what I'm saying". These basically FORCE the chick to
continue the flirting (initiated by the SOI) along the lines that HE wanted
(and the lines that chicks SAY they want!).
By saying that he "needed time" and "not being easy", the chick already
attracted to him would then come onto him.

Most of the time the chicks would laugh becuase they'd get stuck for a smart
comeback. And he just kept this up, alternating back to party and fun
routines, until he got to the "sex-SOI-Our World-But I'm no sleaze"routine
which would then DDB the target to fuck - or get her ready for it next time
they met.
Negative commands also work great here to spark challenge. Just like I did
with my now LJBF ex-LTR "I'm not going to fuck you".

I've noted in my past failures (too many to count) that when I have dropped
SOI hints - the chicks have taken the flirting into areas which were
impossible for me to control - fucking me up and making me look stupid.
Especially in clubs where chicks do this like child's play to anyone who
"hits" on them. They use their irrational chick logic to fuck themselves
(and you) up. If that happens, your PU is history.
We can't give the women control, especially not in flirting, because they
aren't the ones that are trying to do PU. It's their job as "virtuous" women
to try and get away from PU, or try to fuck our PU up.

Svengali also said in his MLTR theory something which rings home on this. He
said (and I quote):-

"Seventh: If you don't give a woman something to be pissed about every
now and then, she'll find something on her own, and that will be harder
to get out of (because it will be of her making and criteria, not
yours)."

That is also the point of what we should be doing in flirting. To trap the
chick into going along with what your flirting and accepting your advances
(by means of non-objection) while getting her horny at the same time. That
way we avoid snappy comebacks because you've already "Handled her objections
before they came up" (That's something I learnt as a salesman)
This causes the chick to have her token resistance stall out - and puts us
in control.
GM does this with his sex jokes, but he slams any possible retort with "Just
Kidding" thus the chick can't say anything and the flirting goes by GMs
rules and not hers.

Take Mystery's "Nice nails" NEG for example.
He starts off with an SOI "Nice nails". This in and of itself is a
compliment. If he stopped here, the chick would come back (if she were a
bitch) with some smart ass comment to get rid of Mystery.

BUT, he then puts up the CHALLENGE before she gets a chance to reply (like
GM with "Just kidding"). Seemingly innocent too. "Are they real?"

Now the chick is stuck. What's going on? He's complimented me, and now he's
knocking me down! What is he doing? I must stick around for this! What can I
say? Maybe I'll just laugh it off...!? er..?
(Note, some REAL bitches when stalled will look angry at you and say "Huh?"
to which it's GM to the rescue! with "Hide your pleasure!")

So, couple this kind of flirting with lots of things to get her feeling
horny (patterns, sex talk, whatever), and add lots of personality conveying
things thrown in for good measure - and the chick is sufficiently stunned -
and ready for the drag and fuck stage.

Oh, and the Guam Playboy is an ugly fucker. Kipp's seen the pictures.
Looks don't matter for shit. I have great respect for all the older PUAs.

I must get up to Tokyo to see you guys real soon. The inaka sucks.
We can experiment with this some more then. I've been getting rusty since I
got back from Guam.
What I do know is that when this guy's method does work, it is KILLER. We
get Mr. Smooth status and KCs like crazy.

Rio
-------
Dictate the flirting

 wrote in message news:91f5e8$dpn@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Re: SOI's
>
> Rio..
>
> You are on to something big here..
> This is a discovery!
> I will incorporate this.
>
> Please give more specific examples though. I get
> what you are saying, but not yet really how you would
> apply it. .
>
>
> Fucking excellent thread!
>
>
> Maniac
> http://www.pickupguide.com
>
>
> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/

---

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: More on SOIs
Date: Fri, 22 Dec 2000 06:17:41 GMT

THIS IS RIO TYPING IN CAPS. I'M NOT YELLING!

Comments in text below.
After New years, I WILL be ready, and we will hit
the streets.

GREAT. I HAVEN'T BEEN DOING MUCH PU UNTIL YESTERDAY (1 SOLID # FROM A 9 AND
A KC FROM ANOTHER 9) - THUS THIS POST AS I TEST OUT MY THEORY. I HAVE A
FRIEND WHO WOULD LIKE TO COME ALONG. HE'S ALREADY BRIEFED AND VERY
EXPERIENCED IN SCREWING WOMEN IN JAPAN. HE'S READ THE PICKUP GUIDE ALREADY.
HE'S EVEN BEEN SO KIND TO INTRODUCE ME TO SOME WOMEN WHO WANT MERCY FUCKS.
HE ALSO KNOWS SOME GOOD "hole in the wall" PLACES AROUND RAPPONGI WITH LOTS
OF WOMEN (SO HE SAYS).

BTW, Rio; re: 'nomad' player.. mine was fucked up, returned
it for an exchange, new one works..

IT'S SURE BEATS A TAPE RECORDER, DOESN'T IT?

First, this is brilliant material, it is going on the
website, and is core to successful PU I think. It IS what
smooth was doing.. I couldnt identify it, but now it has
been named, and described, I recognize this.. and yes, it
will be TOTALLY lethal..

THANKS. EVERY SUCCESSFUL PUA HAS BEEN DOING SOMETHING LIKE THIS (OF ONE
STYLE OR ANOTHER) TO BED WOMEN. I WENT OUT AND USED THIS FRAME YESTERDAY
WITH INTERESTING AND POSITIVE RESULTS.....

HOWEVER, I MUST SAY IT'S HARD TO GIVE SPECIFIC EXAMPLES UNLESS THEY ARE
SITUATIONALLY BASED. FOLLOWING THE LOGIC HOWEVER, AND USING IT GIVEN THE
SITUATION STILL BRING RESULTS. I WILL DESCRIBE SOME OF WHAT I HAVE BEEN
DOING WITH IT, BUT I CAN'T REMEMBER FOR THE LIFE OF ME WHAT EXACTLY THE GUAM
GUY SAID. (I ONLY RECORDED A SMALL SAMPLE OF OUR CHAT WITH MY MP3 PLAYER.
NONE OF HIS NANPA HOWEVER) WHAT I DO KNOW, IS THAT HE FOLLOWED THIS
STRUCTURE WHICH I HAVE DESCRIBED TO VERY SOME GOOD EFFECTS.

I ASSUME YOU READ MY ORIGINAL STORY ON THE GUAM TRIP.
IF SO, MY REPLY WILL MAKE MORE SENSE.

In article ,
  "Rio"  wrote:
> He did this by offering a challenge -
> when he finished doing that once he went back to fun routines,
talking about

Examples? ?

OK, HE MADE SOME KIND OF COMPLIMENT OR SUGGESTED SOME KIND OF ACTIVITY
(OFTENTIMES WITH SEXUAL OR ROMANTIC UNDERTONES) THAT THEY COULD DO TOGETHER.
(LIKE HANG TIGHT TO EACH OTHER OF THE JET POWERED BANANA BOAT) AND THEN
FOLLOWED THAT WITH A REASON WHY HE WOULD HAVE TROUBLE DOING IT. KINDA LIKE
IN SALES, A SALESMAN WOULD SAY "FOR ONE DAY ONLY SALE", WELL HE WAS LIKE "SO
YOU SHOW UP AT SUCH AND SUCH A TIME, OTHERWISE I WON'T BE ABLE TO SHOW YOU A
GOOD TIME AND I'LL TAKE SOMEONE ELSE" (a takeaway)
SO IN ORDER TO CONTINUE THE FLIRTING, THE CHICK WOULD HAVE TO SHOW UP. HE
WOULD THEN (AFTER HAVING COMPLETED A SOI ROUTINE) SIT BACK AND WATCH THE
CHICK FOLLOW THROUGH. HE WOULD OFTENTIMES BE ABLE TO CONTINUE A CONVERSATION
WITHOUT STALLING - AND MIDWAY HE WOULD SOI HER AGAIN AND DO THE SAME ROUTINE
WITH SOMETHING ELSE. I NEVER SAW HIM GET IT ON WITHIN 20 MINUTES, BUT I SAW
WHAT HE DID TO THE CHICK WITH THIS ROUTINE AND I COULD TELL THAT HE COULD
HAVE IF HE WANTED TO. HE DIDN'T LOOK DESPERATE AT ALL.

> parties on the island, jokes, sex personality tests, etc. before he
did
> another SOI - staring out as indirect and ambiguous, before being VERY
> direct. ;)

Examples ? ?

THIS GUY HAD A STRONG ELEMENT OF GM. THE SEX PERSONALITY TEST IS DOCUMENTED
IN MY POST ON THIS GUY (IT'S ABOUT ICE CREAM) - BUT AFTERWARDS UNLIKE GM, NO
COMMENT OF "JUST KIDDING". HE WOULD THEN SAY SOMETHING ELSE TO DISTRACT
ATTENTION OR PLAY "PRETEND AFC" LIKE "BUT I'M NOT EASY" OR "BUT I DON'T KNOW
YOU THAT WELL"
ALL THE MEANWHILE, GETTING THE CHICK HORNY AND CREATING A CHALLENGE.

> Basically what I think I have come up with, through trying to explain
to the
> posters that asked me about him, is a flirting construction kit.

Examples ? ?

MANIAC, YOU'RE STARTING TO OVERUSE CUT AND PASTE LIKE NYC WHEN HE RIPS APART
AFCS WITH THESE "EXAMPLES??" COMMENTS.........

(QUOTE NYC)
"YOU ARE BEING USED. SHE DOESN'T GIVE A SHIT ABOUT YOU. SHE DOESN'T INTEND
TO FUCK YOU. SHE IS FUCKING OTHER MEN THAT SHE FINDS SEXUALLY ATTRACTIVE.
YOU ARE FOOTING THE BILL FOR HER INTERNATIONAL WHORING. STOP."

HA HA HA ;)

> The Guam Playboy NEGged a LOT - and he got away with it every time.

Such as ? ?

WISH I COULD REMEMBER NOW. BUT WHAT I DID SEE IS HIM COMPLIMENTING LOTS OF
JAP CHICKS AND NOT GETTING ANY NASTY REACTION BACK FROM THEM - BECAUSE THEY
WERE SO SHY AND INEXPERIENCED. SO THE CHICKS JUST LAUGHED BECAUSE THEY HAD
NO BITCH SHIELD OF ANY TYPE.
WHERE HE DID ENCOUNTER A SHIELD, HE WOULD ATTACK HER "NASTY" PERSONALITY -
AND HER LACK OF ABILITY TO BE GRACEFUL WITH COMPLIMENTS.

IN THAT SENSE, HE WOULD ALWAYS SIZE THE CHICK UP AS IF HE WAS LOOKING FOR
LTR POTENTIAL (but we know of course, that LTR was never the plan)

He could
> even tell chicks AFC things like they were beautiful, and then turn
it into
> a NEG if he wanted. That's what over 20 years of daily PU did for
this guy.

Examples ? ?

"YOU'RE REALLY CUTE....(pause to check response)... BUT I DON'T KNOW
ANYTHING ABOUT YOU. (SAID NEGATIVELY OR NOT DEPENDING ON HER RESPONSE). SO
WHO ARE YOU ANYWAY?"

> But the NEG is only one kind of flirting (used for dumping a girl's
uptight
> self image). There are other kinds, such as using ambiguities,
physical
> light-handed slapping and pushing kino, playing tricks on people,
etc.

Such as ? ?

I'VE STOPPED USING KINO IMMIDIATELY NOW, AND SAVING IT FOR WHEN I'VE LANDED
AN SOI ROUTINE AND CAUGHT THE CHICK OUT. WHEN SHE HAS LAUGHED, I SLAP HER
GENTLY.
IT'S ANCHORING.

AS FOR TRICKS ON PEOPLE.... STUPID ONES. I WILL HAVE TO SHOW YOU THEM IN
PERSON.

The
> Playboy used plenty of variations.

Like what ? ?

GIVEN THE SITUATION, HE WOULD TRY DIFFERENT WAYS TO GET HER THINKING
ROMANTICALLY ABOUT BOTH OF THEM TOGETHER. HE WOULD USE WHATEVER WAS IN HIS
SURROUNDINGS, OR THE TOPIC OF CONVERSATION, TO PACE AND LEAD THE CHICK INTO
IMAGINING SUCH A SCENARIO.
THEN HE WOULD YANK IT AWAY BY GIVING SOME KIND OF EXCUSE (LIKE HE WAS BUSY,
HE DIDN'T THINK SHE COULD DO IT) OR HE WOULD PLAY AFC (I DON'T KNOW YOU, I
NEED TO BE IN LOVE FIRST, I'M NOT EASY, I'M NOT A PLAYER, I NEED TIME, I AM
REALLY PICKY, I HAVE BEEN HURT BEFORE, I HAVE A GF)

> Flirting is this:- One drops the SOI, and then pulls it away out of
reach of
> the target.

For example ? ?

I REALLY FEEL VERY CLOSE TO YOU, BUT I NEED TIME.

THE MAGIC WORD IS but

 Then gives another SOI, and then pulls it away again. Like with
> our words, we put images of sex and romance in their heads, then pull
it out

Like ? ?

HIS BRAVEST SOI WAS THE ONE WHERE HE SAID STRAIGHT OUT THAT HE WAS GOING TO
FUCK A CHICK. I WITNESSED THE WHOLE THING. HE SAID THAT HE WAS GOING TO FUCK
HER but (AND THEN HE WENT PRETEND AFC) I'M VERY PICKY, I'M NOT A PUA
BECAUSE THOSE GUYS TEASE WOMEN WITH BULLSHIT, MAKE EMPTY PROMISES, FUCK
THEM, AND THEN DUMP THEM. I AM A PLAYBOY. I LOVE WOMEN AND I DON'T WANT YOU
TO GET TOO ATTACHED TO ME AFTER WE HAVE SEX.

> again, then out it in, then take it out, then put it back in, then
take it
> out again........ Mindfucking!

Example please . .

OK, ANOTHER ONE:-   I WANT TO KISS YOU, BUT SOMEHOW I DON'T THINK YOU LIKE
KISSING.
(btw - this would be an SOI fairly advanced in conversation)
NOTE ALSO THAT THERE'S AN EMBEDDED COMMAND IN THE 2ND PART OF THE ROUTINE.
THAT BEING "YOU LIKE KISSING"
EVIL ISN'T IT?

> Once the chick is confused and teased enough, she is DDB and safely
> mindfucked.

how? describe this. . what exactly did he do?

WELL, THE CHICK THAT HE SAID THE "I'M GOING TO FUCK YOU" SPEECH TO, JUST
STARTED DOING ALL THE TRADEMARK BODYLANGUAGE. SHE JUST SAT THERE STUNNED
AND PLAYED WITH HER HAIR. LIKE A RABBIT LOOKING INTO BRIGHT LIGHTS. THE GUAM
GUY SAID ALL OF IT WITH A SERIOUS FACE TOO, SO SHE COULDN'T LAUGH OFF WHAT
HE WAS SAYING.

THE WAY HE WORKED DIDN'T SEEM TO BE ONE OF "ATTRACTION" PER SE. HE WOULD
EVENTUALLY CORNER THE CHICK AND FLIRT WITH HER UNTIL SHE COULD TAKE NO MORE.
UNTIL SHE GOT STUNNED

> I did a PU once on a chick using the SOIs. I found out where she
lived and
> then said "Oh that's not far from my place, so I can come down to see
you.
> It's a pity I am so busy it won't happen today"

This is good. .

THAT'S A REAL LIFE EXAMPLE OF WHAT THE WHOLE THEORY IS ABOUT. MORE
IMPORTANTLY IS THAT IT WORKED.

> (Note that there is a bit of future pacing and presuppositioning in
this)
> She lapped it up and took my kino from there - despite the BF being a
matter
> of metres away.
>
> The structure for the Guam Playboy routine went like this:-
>
> - Fun routine or opener (ala Mystery) - some basic fluff - all good
things
> about himself, what he could do for the women (he played the helpful
tour

Examples ? ?

READ SOME OF MYSTERY'S OPENERS!
TYPICALLY OFF THE WALL STUFF. WELL, WHEN HE WAS TALKING ABOUT GUAM'S CULTURE
AND PARTIES AND STUFF - FOR ALL THE TOURISTS, ALL THIS NEW INFO TO THEM IS
PRETTY OFF THE WALL.
HE WOULD TELL THE CHICKS ABOUT SOME PARTY WHERE THEY WOULD DIG A HUGE PIT
AND THROW ANIMALS ON IT IN A BIG FEAST WITH A BONFIRE AND DANCING - AND THEN
BRANCHED OUT AND TALKED ABOUT DANCING AND OTHER EXOTIC/EROTIC STUFF.

> guide). Be "Disgustingly" Charming! as he put it. The guy wasn't big
on

Like ? ?

THOSE WERE HIS EXACT WORDS. HE RELIED ON GM A LOT IN THE LATTER PART OF HIS
SEDUCTIONS.

> logically drawing out routines for what he did (which is a good
thing), he
> just went and DID this.... thus he couldn't really explain to me what
he was
> doing. I had to observe.

Yep, he's got experience.. I rarely consciously follow ManiacPlan
anymore.. just it spews out naturally.. learning PU is like learning
a foreign language/lingo.. once you get it, its natural..

I'VE BEEN LEARNING TO PLAY AFC IN MY SEDUCTIONS, AND IT HAS BEEN WORKING
REALLY WELL!

> - SOI. He said something that hinted that he was interested in the
chick
> (paced and lead from his opener conversation). This got her emotions
going

Example?  How?

OK, ANOTHER ONE.

"WOULDN'T IT BE GREAT TO SPEND TIME TOGETHER OVER COFFEE? IT'S SUCH A PITY I
HAVE TO GO TO SOME MEETINGS LATER ON, SO WE WILL PROBABLY HAVE NO TIME TO
SEE EACH OTHER EVER AGAIN BEFORE YOU GO BACK."
(WAIT FOR RESPONSE)
"BUT LET ME KNOW YOUR NUMBER ANYWAY...WHO KNOWS I MAY HAVE TIME."
(might want to save this one after you have dropped several other
SOIs)

> and her ideas racing.

Like what? which ideas? be specific please. .

ROMATIC AND/OR SEXUAL ONES.
HE WOULD START OFF ON ROMANTIC ONES AND MAKE THEM INCREASINGLY SEXUAL UNTIL
HE HIT A SEXUAL FANTASY OF HERS THAT WOULD DDB HER.
LET'S SAY "HOLDING HANDS" OR "SPENDING QUALITY TIME TOGETHER" OR "BEING
CLOSE" AND EVENTUALLY LEADING THAT INTO "TOUCHING BODIES" AND "KISSING" TO
"FUCKING" OBVIOUSLY.
A LOT OF TIME DISTORTION SOIs.

> I have found this CRITICAL if the chick is going to
> stay interested in you for too long. I bored many chicks out
initially when
> I wouldn't get to the point.
[rest deleted]

Rio, this is great stuff. Somehow I understand it.. but I need
examples of it so I can put it together as something I can try
in the field. Do you remember any specifics from this guy?

WELL, WE CAN ALWAYS WAIT FOR THE OFF-SEASON AND GO TO GUAM WITH A VCR AND
MEET THIS GUY (YOU'LL ONLY NEED ABOUT 40,000 YEN FROM TOKYO FOR A 2 DAY
TRIP) OR NEXT TIME WE MEET IN TOKYO WE CAN DO MORE STREET STUFF AND I CAN
SHOW YOU WHAT I KNOW. (I HADN'T FULLY DEVELOPED THE THEORY UNTIL AFTER MY
NIGHT OUT WITH KIPP - I OQed TOO MUCH AND FAILED TO PLACE ANY CHALLENGES
AFTER MY SOIs THAT NIGHT)
THE GUAM PLAYBOY WAS A GRANDMASTER OF STREET PU - HIS WEAKNESS WAS THAT HE
WAS A GREEDY TEAMPLAYER WITH WINGMEN.

If so, please fill in the above spaces where I ask.. it is very
important if this is to work.

Rio
-------

Using SOI’s as a way to tease/attract chicks!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Using SOI's (statements of intent) as a tease to attract a chick!


From: Jonathan Ashton 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Clearing SOI's up
Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 07:04:08 GMT

In article ,
> For example, if we were to drop an SOI on the chick, and then
> IMMEDIATELY follow up with a negative command - WE control the
> flirting so that the chick then has to work for US.
>
> So we can say things like "I want to kiss you"
> And then control the flirting by pulling away again with some reverse
> commands :-
> "BUT I don't really know anything about you, and I haven't known you
> for very long, and I need to feel love first"
> Sounds like the stuff that chicks tell us, right? Well chicks say it
> to flirt, as opposed to meaning what they say!

Omigod!  Rio, this is an awesome post!  Brilliant!  Genius!

"I was thinking about kissing you, but you'd probably slobber too
  much."
"I'd love to take you home, but I know you'd get all clingy."
"I'm just trying to guess if you're any good in bed.  Too bad you're
  too young/weird/conservative for me."
"I bet you'd love the way I do neck massages.  You've been acting up
  too much to deserve one, though."

This is so EASY!  Anyone can think these up on the spot!  There's no
need to think up ambiguous sentences or come up with just the right
innuendo.  Just make a Statement of Intentions, then let her know what
SHE has to offer to make it happen - by telling her that you won't do
it because she's not up to par!  I love it!  I will try it out ASAP!

Howcome I've never seen this idea explained before?  In retrospect,
it's clear that MrSex4uNYC and Mystery do similar stuff, but I've
never seen the dynamic explained this way before.  Ross talks about
setting challenges, but it's always seemed like such a delicate art
to say just the right thing at just the right time.

But this is so easy!  Thank you, Rio.

Ash


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

Game: Color game

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Color Game that can be used in PU!
[Maniac note: got this other list below from the 'Secrets of the cube book'
Also very good, may be appropriate when doing this game:

Red: passion, hot energy, anger warmth
Green: hope, life, nature, money
Blue: spirituality, serenity, cool energy, sadness
Purple: royalty, deep passions, mourning
Yellow: cheerfulness, brightness, eccentricity
Pink: feminity, wamrth
Brown: earthyness, warmth, conventionality
Black: mystery
White: purity
Multicolored: of many interests or moods

END: Maniac note]

From: steviewonder 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: More personality tests
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 20:20:17 GMT

In article <904e0cjv@nnrp1.deja.com>,
  maniac_high@yahoo.com wrote:
> There is good stuff on that site.
>
> I am reworking it to be more appropriate in opener type
> PU's in bars/coffee shops, will present my results of this
> work in late January after it has all been designed and
> field tested.. It will be killer..

Hi guys,

Found this game at

http://www.geocities.com/Broadway/8546/colortest.html

a good one since all the answers are sexual:

QUESTION:

Pick the color that best describes your personality?

ANSWERS:

BLACK
Black color preferences point to black sex. These people are the
misfits of the sex world and seek each other in kinship. They tend to
prefer perverted sex, and are usually masochistic or sadistic in
nature. They are moody and often perform at their peak when under
stress or during unhappy times. Police psychologists claim that many
sex offenders prefer the color black. And it is no coincidence that
the uniform of mobsters and teenaged gangs is black.

BLUE
Lovers of blue are wonderful sex partners. They are sincere,
affectionate, and sensitive to their partner's needs. They consider
lovemaking a fine art, and their approach is elegant. Men who love
blue are like concert pianists; delicately ravaging their partner like
they would play a baby grand. Women in the blue category enjoy sex
to the fullest. They are exciting partners, but their passion might be
compared to tidal waves, rather than fiery aggresion. Both blue men
and women enjoy foreplay and the aftermath of lovemaking as much
as the act. In marriages, a blue person is a wonderful mate, never
failing to please the spouse and never seeking outside interests.

BROWN
For lovers of brown, sex is a 24-hour a day thing. They tend to say "I
love you" often enough. Snuggling by the fire, walking in the rain or
catching snowflakes on their tongue ins a turn-on to a lover of brown.
They need lots of time and privacy to make love. But their emotions
are such that one harsh word could end an affair.

GREEN
Those who prefer green are fresh and innocent in their approach to
sex. Women who love green will make love like virgins all their life.
And a man may also be a trifle clumsy and awkward, but in a charming
and endearing sort of way. Green lovers are gentle, but not
passionate. If chosen as a mate, one will never need to worry about
infidelity.

GREY
The color grey is preferred by people who are indecisive. They can't
get excited about anything - including colors - so they choose a
noncommittal shade. Men who prefer grey look at sex as a means of
relieving tension - nothing more nothing less. It's "wham, bam, thank
you ma'am". Women don't make love, they have intercourse. They
count the cracks in the bedroom plaster until the sex act is over with
and done. When a grey marries another grey, the marriage is not
exactly erotic.

ORANGE
Lovers of the color orange lean toward sexual fantasies. The sex act
is regarded as a dramatic role, a one act play in which they are the
star. Foreplay is as important as the act of love. They whisper sweet
nothings, meaningless dialogue they feel fits their image. Orange
people often do not experience orgasm - but they put on a damn good
act. Men tend to pull their partner's hair and women tend to leave
welts on their sex partner's back!

PINK
Persons who like pink show a reluctance to mature in sexual matters.
Women tend to tease; to promise more than they intend to deliver. In
some cases, they flaunt their femininity, but only because they
secretly hate men. A great percentage of prostitutes boast entire
wardrobes in pink. Men who like pink are the type who make 3 dates
for the same evening and not keep them, preferring to pick up a dish
in some bar instead.

PURPLE
Lovers of purple frequently consider themselves too regal for  fun
romp in the sack. Women sometimes are the type who hate to muss
their hair. Men are businesslike in their approach to lovemaking. In
both sexes, purple partners are more concerned with their
fulfillment then anyone else's gratification.

RED
People who like red tend to be tigers in the sack. They are easily
aroused and enjoy sex in every way imaginable. Once the sexual spark
is lit, it may take hours to extinguish. When two reds get together,
the ensuing erotica would make Lady Chatterly blush. Lovers of red
tend to be the aggressors and weaker colors should beware!

YELLOW
If you tend to favor yellow, your sexual drives are complex and lean
toward the adaptable. The favorite color of homosexuals is yellow!
But don't panic - not everyone who wears yellow is homosexual. In
most cases the person will accommodate to the stronger partner's
desires in a passive manner. You will never enjoy sex to the fullest,
but you will never turn down an invitation from someone you enjoy or
admire.

--
To email me remove the _obvious from this address:
steviewonder_ob@viousfastmail.ca

Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

Handling delusional chicks, karatebabe lives a nightmare!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Re: Mystery: delusional chicks & sympathy lies! 
Date: 11/12/2000 
Author: maniac_high  

 << previous in search  ?  next in search >>  

Re: Mystery: delusional chicks & sympathy lies!
001112
 
Mystery wrote in another post this week regarding lying
to chicks, about how not to underestimate how delusional
a chick is willing to become in order to keep her 'happy'
view of the world.
 
He is absolutely right. And this explains how seeming
'jerk' can get away with what seems like such ridiculous
shit.
 
Case in point, is where I recently did a fuckup, and then
recovered with Karatebabe (see lay report, my page). This
is the chick that would go around my place after sex
cleaning up her own hairs so that "the other chicks"
wouldnt find out about her.
 
Well, one day we are going for coffee, and she asks me
if I had been seeing another chick at the time I started
dating her. Figuring (incorrectly) from her behavior,
that this chick knew totally what the score already was,
I said I had been (wrong answer!).
 
She freaked out and went balistic at me. Shit about "how
I make her fool, go behind her back..and other shit".
In retrospect it was clear though.. she got upset, because
something she merely 'suspected' (even though it was fucking
obvious as shit, as other chicks stuff was all over the
fucking house), now became something 'confirmed', and that
shattered her entire world..
 
I then smartened up and realized what I had just done,
and recovered by saying that I dumped her after I first
started dating you (Karatebabe), a few weeks later.
 
After that, she settled down (even though every week
there was different chick stuff all over the house
after that!). She asked me about it, and I said no,
there are no chicks..
 
She said she accepted that, and that her 'nightmare'
now was over, and everything was fine again.
 
Later she found some makeup and chick stuff in the
bathroom cabinet (another chick must have slipped
it there for someone else to find it), so I had
to think fast on my feet for that one...
 
So I told her that I have a real dark secret and
she might be very disappointed in me (now she is
expecting to hear something about a chick)..
 
Then (remembering she likes gays and stuff) I tell
her that I like to make believe to dress like a girl
(lots of J-guys do it actually, so I know it is not
so far fetched here), and I have guy friends that do it
with me, and sorry I didnt tell you earlier.. (of
course this is TOTALLY false.. Maniac is not even
remotely gay, nor a crossdresser or any of that shit)...
however.. she ACCEPTED that story, and was relieved
(in spite of the fact that I was almost cracking up
when I said it, since I was SURE she would call me
on my bullshit... but she didnt)!
 
Fuck!, the totally ridiculous things you have to
tell a chick...  AND! they accept it (as they
try to internalize it and believe it at least at
some level so that their happy delusional world
doesn't come crashing to bits)..
 
Strange, isnt it..!
 
Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Using the laws of power in PU!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Toecutter, and using the laws of power!




From toecutter@mail.com Mon Oct 23 09:39:39 2000
From: "toecutter" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Lessons from Book: The 48 Laws of Power
Lines: 201


Just reading a book, The 48 Laws of Power by Robert Greene. Definitely
lessons everywhere in the book on what we do here.
The book is amoral, and open about the deception inherit in what he is
teaching. It is largely for life outside the arena of seduction, but
entrirely applicable and there are some seduction examples in it to
illustrate his points (only historical: For example the advice of Ninon de
Lenclos on seduction to the Marquis de Sevigne and what happened when the
Marquis did not follow her advice, etc.). The examples are all pulled from
the Sun Tzu (Chinese, the Art of War), European history, famous con men,
magicians and charlatans, Kings, Queens, Napoleon and other power brokers
such as Al Capone. Perfect for you guys who enjoy Machiavelli. At 450
reasonably large format pages it is fairly long.

It is going to take me several re-readings, but at the moment I see the
messages as really 3 fold: First, play your cards pretty close to your
chest. This creates mystery. The more you say, the more common you appear
and the less in control. Andy Wohol created enigma by not discussing his
work and answering questions by being intentionally vague giving people the
feeling that he was being more profound than he was.  If you do not reveal
all, people will never become bored with you or your presence because you
will continue to represent a challenge, and will be eternally interesting.
Your silence will make other people feel uncomfortable and humans are
machines of interpretation and explanation; they have to know what you are
thinking. When you carefully control what you reveal, they cannot pierce
your intentions and meaning. Your short answers will put them on the
defensive and they will jump in, nervously filling the silence with all
kinds of comments that will reveal valuable information about themselves and
their weaknesses.

This brings me to the second message. Learn everything you can about other
people. Their strengths and weaknesses, their crutches and trance words.
Their motivations. Use these to your advantage whilst revealing as little as
possible about yourself. Keep them the focus of the conversation, and be a
'Spy' on their minds by eliciting values.

The third lesson is to use smoke and mirrors to obscure your objectives and
motivations. Throw decoys out there, use gifts as Trojan horses, and be
circumspect in what is going on. Again, this throws them off your game,
gives you an upper hand.

None of this is to say that you need to be quiet or a bad conversationalist,
just the opposite, by spying and eliciting values, you are encouraging
people to talk about themselves, their own favourite subject. By being brief
about yourself you are creating mystery and interest. It is just that you
are collecting the information in order to use it against them at another
time, whilst manipulating your image and reputation in their minds and
obscuring your real motivations. In some ways it is a book on playing hard
to get while outmanoeuvring the girl. A perfect structure in which to drop
SS.

Some of the content is below. I can post more on it if you would like
further discussion; I am overflowing with ideas on it.

Toecutter.

---

To list some of the laws that are obviously applicable:

Law 3: Conceal your intentions (Keep people off balance and in the dark by
never revealing the purpose behind your actions. If they have no clue what
you are up to, they cannot prepare a defence. Guide them far enough down the
wrong path, envelop them in enough smoke, and by the time they realise your
intentions, it will be too late.)

Law 4: Always say less than is necessary

Law 6: Court attention at all costs

Law 8: Make other people come to you - use bait if necessary

Law 9: Win though your actions, never through argument. (Any momentary
triumph you win though argument is really a Pyrrhic victory: The resentment
and ill will you stir up is stronger and lasts longer than any momentary
change in opinion. It is much more powerful to get others to agree with you
though your actions, without saying a word. Demonstrate, do not explicate.)

Law 10: Infection: Avoid the unhappy and unlucky (it works the other way
also. This is an alternative take on social-proof, or pivots or whatever you
want to call them, as well as wingmen. Also advice on not getting involved
with the wrong girl.)

Law 11: Learn to keep people dependent on you.

Law 12: Use selective generosity to disarm your victim (One sincere and
honest move will cover over dozens of dishonest ones. Openhearted gestures
of honesty and generosity bring down the guard of even the most suspicious
people. Once your selective honesty opens a hole in their armour, you can
deceive and manipulate at will.)

Law 13: When asking for help, appeal to people's self interest, never to
their mercy or gratitude.

Law 14: Pose as a friend, work as a spy.

Law 16: Use absence to increase respect and honour. (Again through mystery
and not stuffing it up by staying too long and doing or saying something
wrong.)

Law 17: Keep others in suspended terror: Cultivate an air of
unpredictability

Law 18: Do not build fortresses to protect yourself - Isolation is
dangerous. (Get out there amongst them).

Law 19: Know who you are dealing with - do not offend the wrong person.

Law 20: Do not commit yourself to anyone.

Law 21: Play a sucker to catch a sucker - appear dumber than your mark. (Let
her think that she is in control and smart, less naive, don't let on you are
a player).

Law 25: Re-create yourself (Do not accept the roles that society foists on
you. Re-create yourself by forging a new identity, one that commands
attention and never bores the audience. Be the master of your own image
rather than letting others define it for you. Incorporate dynamic devices
into your public gestures and actions - your power will be enhanced and your
character will seem larger than life).

Law 26: Keep your hands clean. (You must seem a paragon of civility and
efficiency: Your hands are never soiled by mistakes and nasty deeds.
Maintain such a spotless appearance by using others as scapegoats and cat'
s-paws to disguise your involvement).

Law 27: Play on peoples need to believe to create a cult like following.
(advice in this chapter is on how to become a cult leader or maybe build a
harem. 5 strategies to your dogma! a) Keep it vague; Keep it simple b)
Emphasise the visual and sensual over the intellectual c) Borrow the forms
of organised religion to structure the group d) Disguise your income source
e) set up an us-vs.-them dynamic. I think Ross Jeffries read this one!)

Law 28: Enter action with Boldness. (If you are unsure of a course of
action, do not attempt it. Your doubts and hesitations will infect your
execution. Timidity is dangerous: Better to enter with boldness. Any
mistakes you make through audacity are easily corrected with more audacity.
Everyone admires the bold; no one honours the timid).

Law 29: Plan all the way to the end.

Law 30: Make your accomplishments seem effortless. (Your actions must seem
natural and executed with ease. All the toil and practice that goes into
them, also all the clever tricks, must be concealed. When you act, act
effortlessly, as if you could do much more. Avoid the temptation of
revealing how hard you work - it only raises questions. Teach no one your
tricks or they will be used against you .. I am breaking this rule right
here with this post, as is the Authour of the book.)

Law 31: Control the options: Get others to play with the cards you deal.
(The best deceptions are the ones that seem to give the other person a
choice: Your victims feel they are in control, but are actually your
puppets. Give people options that come out in your favour whichever one they
choose. Force them to make choices between the lesser of two evils, both of
which serve your purpose. Put them on the horns of the dilemma: they are
gored wherever they turn. Note: this is a different view on my idea of
re-framing questions. The questions are re-framed so well that the girl has
no option.)

Law 32: Play to people's fantasies.

Law 33: Discover each mans thumbscrew.

Law 34: Be royal in your own fashion: Act like a king to be treated like
one.

Law 35: Master the art of timing. (Never seem to be in a hurry - hurrying
betrays a lack of control over yourself, and over time. Always seem patient,
as if you know that everything will come to you eventually. Become a
detective of the right moment; sniff out the spirit of the times, the trends
that will carry you to power. Learn to stand back when the time is not yet
ripe, and to strike fiercely when it has reached fruition.)

Law 36: Disdain things you cannot have: Ignoring them is the best revenge.

Law 37: Create compelling spectacles. (Striking imagery and grand symbolic
gestures create the aura of power - everyone responds to them. Stage
spectacles for those around you, then, full of arresting visuals and radiant
symbols to heighten your presence. Dazzled by appearances, no one will
notice what you are really doing.)

Law 40: Despise the free Lunch.

Law 43: Work on the hearts and minds of others.

Law 44: Disarm and infuriate with the mirror effect. (The mirror reflects
reality, but is the perfect tool for deception: When you mirror your
enemies, doing exactly as they do, they cannot figure out your strategy. The
mirror Effect mocks and humiliates them, making them overreact. By holding
up a mirror to their psyches, you seduce them with the illusion that you
share their values; by holding up a mirror to their actions you teach them a
lesson. Few can resist the power of the mirror effect.)

Law 48: Assume formlessness. (By taking a shape, by having a visible plan,
you open yourself to attact. Instead of taking a form for the girl to grasp,
keep yourself adaptable and on the move. Accept the fact that nothing is
certain and no law is fixed. The best way to protect yourself is to be as
fluid and formless as water: never bet on stability or lasting order.
Everything changes.)

Disarming groups of guys around chicks!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

When lots of guys are around 1 girl, you must disarm guys!


From: "Stepleader" 
Subject: Re: She has nice/great body and/or face -- but what about her?
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2000 10:02:45 GMT

great pep talk and I love your posts ... but ...

the situ called for a disarming of the guys.  Here is how.  Approach the
group but pay NO attention to the girl.  Begin the chat with the guys and
make them interested in your story telling.  MALE BONDING comradery.  Turn
you back to HER so she feels out of place.  What you have done is removed
all the attention from her (stolen it).  You are now the center of
attention.  A couple NEGS her way challenges her.  All the other guys were
on her - all but one.  YOU.

Just so you know, this is mystery methods groupset theory and Ive done this
successfully a great # of times.

from this vantage point you may now take her  by the hand and say to the
others, "is it alright if I steal your friend away for a bit?"  they will
say yes and you take her out of earshot.  Id love you to see me work a set
like that.  its brilliant.  and PRACTICAL.

Svengali  wrote in article
<131220002147344283%Svengali_here@use.net>...
> Gentlemen, you're looking for the whole package, not just the
> packaging.  And if all you're focusing on is the packaging, she damn
> well knows it and is in control of you --period!
> 
> You must, repeat, you must be prepared to walk at all times, no matter
> how much you would like to be on/in that body and face.
> 
> Remember, you are screening her to see if she is good enough for
> you, not the other way around.  And the only way you're going to find
> out if she is good enough for you is to learn as much as you can
> about the person that is within that female form.
> 
> Am I saying you must be screening every beauty for a long term
> relationship?  Hell no!  It can be for however long you want.  But
> the moment she sees, and it won't take her long, that you are screening
> her to see whether or not she is good enough for you, is the moment
> the tables get turned and she understands that she has to make herself
> look good in your eyes.
> 
> Now contrast this with all the other guys who are trying to make
> themselves look good in her eyes, so they can get on/in her.
> 
> To illustrate what I am saying, picture this: we're in a manhattan bar,
> and there is this gorgeous looking woman, with the greatest face you've
> seen, talking to a few guys.  One happens to be our own great NYC with
> his magnificient weight-lifting body and his "I'm great" attitude; 
> another is Riker with his patterns, a third is Greg19 with his band of
> ways, and so on.  So basically what you would have is a bunch of guys
> trying to find and give this woman what she wants, so as to get on/in
> her.
> 
> Then there's Svengali, with his Carey Grant looks and ways, who sees
> the woman, walks right up into the group and says "excuse me guys, I
> just wanted to ask the lady where she got, and whose idea it was to get
> those earrings that seems to make her skin sparkle and her eyes glow,
> and then I'll leave." [Turning to her] "So please tell me, where did
> you get, and what made you decide [Svengali's hand goes out to the
> earrings, and in the process, lightly touches the lady's neck] to get
> these earrings that seems to make your skin sparkle and your eyes
> glow?"  {She tells me.}  "Thank you."  "Bye guys, I'm going back over
> there [pointing, so the lady knows where I will be]."
> 
> Look what just occurred: (1) I showed I wasn't afraid of a damn thing. 
> (2) I disarmed my opponents.  (3) I made her feel good.  (4) I showed
> her I wasn't about to hang around and try and get her.  {Of course to
> firmly establish that point, I would engage another woman in
> conversation, and have her positioned in a way that the first woman
> would see her with me, which would have her wondering what kind of nice
> things was I saying to her, that she wasn't getting.}.
> 
> Who do you think the woman is likely to be focused on and thinking
> about: all the guys who are there, still trying to get to her, or the
> guy who said what he wanted, made her feel good/great, left, and is now
> focused on someone else?  {I removed one of her feel good sources, so
> even though the others are there, with theirs, she like nearly everyone
> of us, is focused on the one that's been lost, not the ones that are
> present.}
> 
> Show your interest in her, but also show that you are walking the
> moment *she's* not exactly like you want.
> 
> Now I'll play devil's advocate and say that my little "walk away"
> didn't work.  Do you think I care?  Hell no, and I'll tell you why: the
> one who chases to gets, will always have to chase to have.  So whoever
> would win with the woman, would have to keep providing whatever they
> did to keep her interested.  I, on the other hand, only need to use a
> little charm and then walk away to have her wanting me.
> 
> I ask you, who do you think has an easier time of it?
> 
> -- 
> If you don't know in the first twenty minutes whether or not you're going
to
> have sex with the woman you just met, and whether or not you even want
to,
> you're not a seductionist.
> 
>   'o o'
> Svengali
>

Taking control when things go wrong

Maniac High — Thu, 20 May 2010 12:22:49 +0000

Buy Reductil No Prescription, From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Mystery and others write about successful openers.

Status: O

talk about esp and its impossibility

talk about how you met a bear while hiking

talk about how you were scared shitless rock climbing when your rope snapped

or talk about the famous person you met

does she believe in ghosts. why, Buy Reductil No Prescription.

or hotseat (like question game but more brutal)

talk about the time you bladed down a steep hill and survived. Buy Reductil No Prescription, talk about the time you were on stage

...

mystery

-----

From nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org Wed Apr 12 07:31:37 2000
From: nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org (Nathan SZILARD)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: After the # close

They find it very funny and show it to their friends, plus
they remember, Buy Reductil No Prescription.

| If you did any anchoring on your voice when you met, order Reductil, Buy Reductil without a prescription, now's the time to
| unleash them.

----

From slidewguy@remove-aol.com Wed Apr 12 07:47:28 2000
From: "whoisthis19"
Subject: Some closes
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast

Any of you guys got ways of getting chicks to leave with you outside
the club.

greg1

Did you sleep with yourself or... did you turn yourself down because
you was too easy.

Doing Successful Openers

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Mystery and others write about successful openers!



From: "Mystery" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast,Alt.psychology.nlp,alt.hypnosis
References: <37602334.55753831@bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Chat suggestions
Date: Wed, 16 Jun 1999 04:58:12 -0700
Lines: 63
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts7-36t-14.idirect.com
Message-ID: <37676655@nemo.idirect.com>
X-Trace: 16 Jun 1999 04:54:45 -0400, ts7-36t-14.idirect.com
Organization: via Internet Direct

Status: O

talk about esp and its impossibility

talk about how you met a bear while hiking

talk about how you were scared shitless rock climbing when your rope snapped

or the time you visited your friends friend with him and your buddy was
almost beaten to death when the friend he visited had a boyfriend who came
out and there was a 20 minute car chase through lights and you were looking
for the cops but lot the crazed boyfriend before you found cops.

or the time you were in the hospital and it changed the way food tastes.
the birds sound clearer now.

or the time you netbused (hacked) into a bank but chickened out and put the
money into a charity

or talk about the famous person you met

does she believe in ghosts?  why?

you like candles and incense.  what does SHE like?  the music game modified
for all types of objects.

play the question game with her

or hotseat (like question game but more brutal)

talk about the time you bladed down a steep hill and survived.

talk about the time you were on stage

...

mystery



-----


From nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org Wed Apr 12 07:31:37 2000
From: nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org (Nathan SZILARD)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: After the # close

On Mon, 03 Apr 2000 21:26:22 GMT, Rio  wrote:
| I was reading elsewhere on a post, that if you instruct her to sound
| cheerful on the phone when you call when you do a # close.

I tried that, it's not a magic bullet. But it's fun.

I now always write some shit along with my phone #:
something like "DO NOT FALL IN LOVE" or "NO STALKING PLEASE".

They find it very funny and show it to their friends, plus
they remember.

| If you did any anchoring on your voice when you met, now's the time to
| unleash them.



----

From slidewguy@remove-aol.com Wed Apr 12 07:47:28 2000
From: "whoisthis19" 
Subject: Some closes
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast

Hand her the slip of paper and pen and have her write down her number.
When she's hands it back, ask her to put it someplace so you will
remeber to call her.  Last time I did this she put it down my pants and
grabbed my cock.  

Ask a gal to trade shirts.  When she balks, keep pressing in a joking
manner then finally ask to her to go outside to trade shirts.  Nothing
better then getting her outside.

Another one is simply saying its too smokey, noisy, smelly in here. 
Lets go outsde for some air.

Any of you guys got ways of getting chicks to leave with you outside
the club?

greg1

Did you sleep with yourself or... did you turn yourself down because
 you was too easy.

A conversation with Mystery! Pickups

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


A conversation with Mystery!

Tips on fieldwork from a pick up artist! on IRC #PUA!


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A Conversation with Mystery, a Pick-up Artist (PUA)

Topics Include: 

The Kiss Close
Clubbing alone
Handling guys
Being a story-teller
Preparation and format
Quality vs. quantity

Lego: Hey Mystery, what's your favorite story to close with?  How 
exactly do you transition from the telling of a story to closing?

Mystery: "The Kiss Close" is my favorite routine.  Once you have three 
indicators of interest (she touches you, laughs consistantly at your 
jokes, leans in towards you, smiles a lot and keeps eye contact, resumes 
chat when you force silence, etc) you then phase shift.  You turn 180 
degrees on a dime.  Go from humorous and non-sexual to saying, "Stop.  
Would you like to kiss me?", right out of the blue.  She will say either 
say, "Uh - no",(which is unlikely as you don't bother performing "The 
Kiss Close" until enough indicators are present) or, "I donno" (they 
rarely say, "Yes"). "I donno" means she actually does want to but feels 
embarrassed on how to say "Yes".  So you reply, "Lets find out", then go 
in slowly and kiss her.  It's very simple and very effective.  If she 
says, "Why?", this is also a yes.  Simply reply, "It looked like you had 
something on your mind.  Would you like to kiss me?"  Wait again for 
her response.  If her response is "No" then reply, "Hey I didn't say you 
COULD.  You just had that look in your eye."

Lego: What do you do if you're interrupted? You're telling your target 
a story and she is all into it but some AFC cock-blocking idiot just 
runs up and starts screaming and yelling and you're like, "What the 
fuck?"

Mystery: Simply ask him if you can borrow his pen.  When he gives it to 
you, throw it away as you say, "Fetch."

Wakeboarder: Hahaha.  Nice!

Lego: What if he's bigger than you?

Mystery: I'd instead call him on his disruptive shit and remark, "Dude, 
what are you attempting here?"  Not good enough?  Then say, "Ladies?  
Shall we discover what adventure awaits us in another room?"

Wakeboarder: Man, none of my buds want to go to the club.

Gamer: Screw them then.

Mystery: Go alone.

Wakeboarder: I need to be made fun of for this comment but I feel like 
a weiner if I go to a club myself

Lego: Bro, your trippin'. I go solo many times. It's good actually.  
It's weird if it's a first night but if I've been there before it's cool.

Mystery: Yeah, I understand ... and yet, staying home alone will make 
you feel so much better?  Go out alone, meet some cool dudes when you 
get there (they will become your wingmen there) and then run around 
getting #'s.  Report to your fellow PUAs what happened.  Whatever happened 
to the concept, "The alphamale gets all the women?"  Shit dude, what are 
you, a mommas boy?  Do you need your hand held?  

Lego: How do you strike up conversations with guys?

Mystery: Walk up and say, "Hey dude, question for ya.  Do you know 
where a good place to score is in this city? 'Cause this place looks like a 
cock farm."

Lego: Good!  You should be able to relate to guys to disarm them.  You 
don't compete; you ELIMINATE COMPETETION.

Gamer: LOL.  Dude, the only results I've had were solo.  My friends 
psych me out too much because they never help.  Instead they just complain 
about my taking too much time.  They laugh at me or just generally piss 
me off.

Mystery: I have MUCH better results (and MUCH more fun) playing "The 
Game" alone.  It forces you to approach.  It's a great motivator.

Lego: Damn! I couldn't have put it better myself.

Gamer: Yep.

Mystery: You wont be alone for more than five minutes once you approach 
your first set anyways.  Gamer, I suggest you call them on their shit 
at some point.  Demonstrate your alphamale characteristics.

Lego: How do you continue talking?  I mean, group set dynamics are much 
different in a one one on one approach.

Mystery: Be a story-teller - THAT is the skill of the PUA.  It isn't 
SEDUCING; it's STORY-TELLING.  It is my personal belief that SS patterns 
arent as 'hypnotic' as they are 'entertaining' stories.

Wakeboarder: Sweet

Lego: Actually with the story stuff I SEE WHAT YOU MEAN.  They just 
follow that lead.

Wakeboarder: Well, I need to stop being a sackless wonder and grow some 
fuckin' balls then!  Hmm, story telling ...

Mystery: Here's an example.  "Ever been camping?  Well I was up in a 
forest up north and was hiking with some girlfriends of mine ... and we 
came along some trail and there was shit on the path.  My friends were 
like, "haaaa someone shit in the woods" and I said, "lets get the fuck 
out of here like NOW."  they thought I was just scared of shit and I 
said, "Girls, you dont get it.  This shit is still warm and its not human.  
Its bear shit.  This is a big fucking bear.  Look at the size of that 
turd."  Notice it's not sexual?  Most hot girls gets get "sex-talk" 
right away from AFCs.  NOT talking sex with them makes them question 
whether you are interested in them.  Leave them guessing until you get 
indicators of interest from them.  If they like your great personality 
(confident, humorous, etc) they will give you subtle but distinct clues.

Gamer: How do you flow from story to story?

Mystery: If there is ONE mental state you should force yourself into, 
its TALKATIVE.  Talk your fucking HEAD off.  Just go from one story 
straight into another one like a comedian does.  Ever find yourself excited 
about something and you talk and talk and talk?  THAT is what must 
happen to get a girl.  You have to ENTERTAIN them.  Look talkative yet not 
desperate.  

Gamer: Heh.

Lego: Dude, I had that going last night. You're so right.  That's an 
excellent example dude.  I was telling this story about getting harassed 
by cops or some shit.  It's a cool story but my delivery sucked and I 
was losing one of the two girls I was telling it to.  What if they fail 
to elaborate on your story?  Besides it being a bad story to begin 
with, how can you fix it on the fly?

Mystery: They don't have to interact with it.  Its a good thing to have 
flexible stories to allow for some comment but it's not nessessary.  
It's YOUR job to perform the material.  It's your audiences job to 
listen,laugh and generally be entertained.  That's it.  At the end of 10 
minutes you will see the girls digging you (positive indicators).  You then 
phase shift abruptly into the close.

Lego: HOW DO YOU PHASE SHIFT?  I've been wondering this. While I didn't 
come off as obvious in last nights case and just told her to kiss me (I 
knew she would anyway), this could have been smoother.

Alpha: Lego, you ad libbed the close?  So working on ad libbing is 
good?

Mystery: Ad libbed material is not as accurate in closing as is 
performing the well constructed and field-tested "Kiss Close" routine.  Ad 
libbing is BONUS material but don't COUNT on it.  Have your material, like 
a good comedian, prepared before performing.  This isn't "A Night at 
the Improv" fellas.

Gamer: Heh.

Mystery: All PUs have a format; a beginning, a middle and an end.  If 
you don't know what the next routine is going to be then you may end up 
with an unfortunate pregnant pause which fucks up your pacing.  You may 
end up filling the silence with the deadly, "So ... um ... what do you 
do?"  Preparation saves face.  Afterall, with your particular close, 
she could have pulled away from your trying to kiss her.  Then what?!!  
Instead, consider engaging her in enthusiastic conversation, then go 
directly into the close.  In other words, stop her in mid-sentence and 
with a curious tone, kiss close.

Wakeboarder: cool.  Lego, what indicators clued you in that she wanted 
the kiss?

Alpha: In what way can you be prepared?  If we're talking about 
story-telling in front of a random girl we just met seconds ago in a random 
place ...

Mystery: Like a good comedian, have your material prepared yet when 
onstage be prepared to dynamically omit certain routines and to add others 
on the fly.  Sometimes certain routines fit the situation better than 
others.  Have 3 to 5 alternative openers (as a comedian would) and enjoy 
performing the one you think best fits the situation will get the best 
reaction for the group you are in front of

Alpha: Gotcha now.  Can you give me a brief example of how you go about 
preparing?

Mystery: Sure.  First, find 3 openers and memorize them.  Write down a 
list of openers (just the headings of each opener to remind you).  
Next, write down some routines (the question game, the music game, the 
photo routine, the bear in the woods story, etc - all on dejanews) and then 
also memorize the kiss close and the # close.  Memorize 3 NEGs too and 
you are good to go.  With the material in your mind, you are prepared 
to work it in the field until you have the timing of the material down 
(again, just like a comedian.)

Alpha: Man, you provide some really eye-opening ideas... (just when I'm 
about to think there's nothing more to learn.

Wakeboarder: So what you're saying is have a routine set up and modify 
it to each situation? Kind of like having a PU template?

Mystery: It's ALL about format.  Know the format and stick to it.  If 
you now what the next step is in the PU, you wont feel scared.  It gets 
fun and you begin to appreciate the strategy behind it all.

Wakeboarder: Yeah like FMAC? That's a simple format.

Mystery: Yes, FMAC.  Each letter in FMAC is an abrupt phase shift.  
"FIND" means having to abruptly disturb your complacency by getting out of 
the house.  It takes effort for many people to do bother getting THIS 
FAR.  "MEET" is a HUGE abrupt change.  "There she is!  3, 2, 1, GO!"  In 
the "ATTRACT" phase, you need to go from the walk up to the TALKATIVE 
performer entertaining story-teller.  You will need A LOT of energy for 
this (enthusiasm is contagious afterall) and for many to go from 
slumping around to being in performer mode is ABRUPT.  Finally you must then 
"CLOSE"; to phase shift from humour to serious is also abrupt.  Each 
phase may FEEL awkward but it looks normal.  When a comedian finishes one 
topic and just goes into an entirely new unrelated topic, the audience 
doesn't care as long as the next topic is entertaining.

Wakeboarder: Very true.

Gamer: Cool.  I'm collecting openers and other routines off the 
layguide right now.

Alpha: Do you believe in the 80/20 'rule'?  Meaning, 80% of the quality 
women are found in 20% of the right places or connections or 
situations.

Mystery: The quality of a woman is SO subjective. Quality is difficult 
to QUANTIFY.  80% of QUALITY?  It's pointless trying to mix and match 
these concepts. INSTEAD consider that there are HOTTIES and UGs (YOU get 
to decide based on your personal criteria) and of the HOTTIES, some 
have pleasant personalities and others do not.  You cannot possibly judge 
her personality until she LIKES you.  So go out ... FIND her, MEET her, 
ATTRACT her and THEN decide if you want to CLOSE her AFTER judging her 
personality.  Judging her by the way she treats you on your approach is 
lame because particularly beautiful women all have their bitch shields 
up and running.  They have to.  They aren't planning on fucking every 
guy that says Hi to them.  The only way to get rid of the guys is to 
oftentimes offend them quickly.  It's not personal.  It's merely a learned 
strategy.  So is the "I have a boyfriend excuse, but that's a different 
story.  I also suggest CLOSING everyone just for the education.  You 
don't actually have to CALL the girls of course.  You simply get to 
practice CLOSING too.  Getting a girls number is merely an OPTION.  You 
don't have to follow up on ALL of them you know.

Keen: Heh.

Wakeboarder: Cool, judging the girls only after you have attracted 
them.  Kind of makes you approach too!  You can't say the bull shit line, 
"She's not my type, I can tell", to get you out of approaching.

Alpha: Do you have a web page?

Mystery: No, not currently.  I'm writing a book though called The 
Mystery Method.  Most of my ramblings can be found on the layguide. 

Ascence: Hey, is it true that the older we get the more money/social 
status becomes and issue?

Mystery: No matter what social status you have (or THINK you have), 
it's still something you must convey in the first 25 minutes of meeting 
her.  We ALL start equal BEFORE meeting her; all men.  The issue is, can 
we congruently convey our social status (real or not) in our 
performance?  That's OUR responsibility.  The best way is not to TELL them about 
it but rather to DEMONSTRATE it.  How?  Well, if you talk about having 
girls always falling for you for instance, it's not NEARLY as good as 
actually having a couple hot girls with you saying what a hottie you are 
infront of the target.  This is called PAWNING.

Keen: I'm going to try doing the story-telling that you talked about.  
It's really hard though. I'm a real bad storyteller.  I've been working 
on it today. that's my lesson today.

Wakeboarder: Tell them about that time you saw a fallen over manequin 
in the department store and you tripped over it.  The security guard 
thought you were trying to make it with the manequin and called you a 
little freak.

Gamer: LOL (Laughing Out Loud).

Wakeboarder: One more question for you Mystery.  What's the meaning of 
life?

Mystery: To fuck. :)

Statement of Intent (SOI)

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Rio introduces a key part of PU: the 'Statement of Intent' (SOI)!

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2000 09:00:50 GMT
Subject: Find Stun Drag Fuck

G'day,

Jonathan Ashton  wrote in message
news:90eati$gpt@nnrp1.deja.com...
> As I've read the twelve-odd messages in this thread, I've been looking
> for something to take home with me, but I'm not finding it.
>
> Rio, how do you do things differently now, based on what you've said?

First thing would be to think about the close. Mystery knows his group work
perfect from how I read it, and I have been using his methods to great
success social-proof wise.

The BIG thing that clocked in my head was the need to STATE YOUR INTENTIONS
to the chick within the first minute of meeting her. I will make that my
rule from now on - as with the 3 second rule.
By this I DON'T mean "Let's fuck" or "Come to Papa baby" or any throw-away
shit like that. It has to be an honest assessment of what YOU feel capable
of doing to the chick after the "Hi" and the first round of fluff/routine
(routine preferred - something humourous). GM does this part BEAUTIFULLY,
because he does it with a sense of fun and humour - and HE KNOWS he is going
to do what he says and so does SHE!
I notice Mr. Sex states this a lot in his past posts - where AFC or shit
PUAs do approaches and talk to the chick, but never get to the point AND the
bitch can tell that the guys want to fuck but are too pussy to go for it.
Ross says something to the tune of "And maybe we could really get to like
each other" when he closes in HTGTWYDIB. I also recall that TokyoPUA did a
statement of intentions on that chick he PUed at night once who was
initially scared of him. Johnny Shack does it by when he just springs dates
on women he just met.
So there's some cross references.

The proper methodological way to get to a statement of intentions part is by
pace and lead. But the point of the matter is, you have to structure the
conversation to show interest and intent VERY soon or you will stall, chick
will get bored, feel teased, and then it's C&B time. Believe me, a LOT of
C&B experience with a LOT of HOT chicks has so far has taught me this
painful lesson.
The best way to put it is in the most honest way possible. I cannot give you
a specific example. But the idea is to get her thinking romantically about
you VERY soon. THEN you HAVE TO DO WHAT YOU SAID you would do to the chick
after DDB. (E.g. If you want to start things off gently by holding her hand,
tell her a scene where want to be holding her hand - and then do it in the
next routine after she is comfortable with this.) If you do NOT DO what you
say you will, eventually your congruence will fuck up when the chick loses
patience. Then the chick will be confused, get scared, and bolt. If this
ever happens and the guy tries to do heavy kino or try for a fuck while the
chick is in this state - It's gonna be RAPE.

In fact, on the matter of Rape. I read in Cosmo (Hey, My chick gets fucked
often and STILL reads this!) that psychologists WARN women against guys that
say "Come to my place to see my pictures" etc. when the idea is to fuck the
chick whilst your intentions aren't known to her - because it is DATE RAPE.
Thus as Maniac found out ages ago, that GROUNDWORK is the key element to
getting the chick over to fuck. That can be done through STATEMENT OF
INTENTIONS - and may not necessarily happen through Kiss closes.
You must remember this - a kiss is just a kiss........

IF that works, THEN we can reward her with more conversation and more
Mystery style routines or whatever (because she is OK with our intentions
then - thus the rewards), and THEN up the ante some more with our STATEMENT
OF INTENTIONS, building on what we established before - to get her more hot
and horny than before. So you may have started on holding her hands, now you
may progress on to hugging, kissing, fucking etc. whatever seems to be the
most logical progression from her actions towards you.

Patterns, routines, psych tests, will help greatly during the chat routines
in-between statements of intentions. Those are what set us apart from the
other PUAs out there.

Eventually we get to a point where the chick is DDB, then we can get to the
Drag (you must take the woman to fuck location, or have her so into you that
she will come to you) and Fuck part (in our world of course). The Our World
routine would then be the ULTIMATE in the STATEMENT OF INTENTIONS series
which would then lead to the deal fuck closed. It is in this one that you
state your relationship expectations and put it in "Our World"

Now the method is Find, Stun, Drag, Fuck.

The point is - FUCK all this bullshit about the woman needs to be done in
the "right way" to match her values. Something tells me now that a woman
made this comment as an attempt to rationalize her unreasonable emotions.
The values she wants ALL ALONG is #1 SEX, and to a lesser extent #2 to be
taken care of after SEX. That goes for ANY woman (thus the universality of
the whole principle). When the guy comes along as does her, she will
rationalise that the guy understood exactly what she felt. That's what some
religious women mean when they beautifully say "God knew when it was the
right time for me". In reality, they KNOW DEEP DOWN they are at the mercy of
guys and what they want to do with her. To her, that is "destiny" and no
wonder so many women are suckers for fortune-telling and the like.

Eliciting is when you want to # close or coffee close and check the girl out
for relationship potential. If it's ONS - hey! ya don't need it! If you
cannot attempt a kiss to fuck close in the given situation - you will have
to # close, but not forget to state that your intentions could well get
beyond just coffee!

The other thing - "Make no excuses for desires as a man" is THE SINGLE MOST
IMPORTANT THING (As Ross Jeffries has already said) but I had to experience
it myself to believe it. ALL of what I explained above IS USELESS in
practical application if you are trying to follow it like a script. The idea
is to GRAB that girl and NOT let her get away! ;) So guys, HOW MUCH DO YOU
WANT THAT GIRL? WHAT ARE YOU PREPARED TO DO?

Also on that note. BE A FUCKING MAN. Act like a guy, and don't think that
mirroring a girl completely is going to make you attractive to her. I know
from experience that the more caveman I go with chicks who KNOW my
intentions, the more they respond sexually.
Talk to chicks as if you were telling your kid brother how to play football
properly, cause your kid brother happens to be shit at football. I
especially like the way Mr. Sex talks to us on ASF - giving pointers and
what-not. I'm sure he talks to chicks exactly the same way IRL - showing
congruence all along.

You can even get around the language barrier! I just about dragged a sexy
Jgirl in a bikini off the beach while babbling to them in English! A
language they didn't even understand! I did that enough and with a smile,
that the chick went DDB and ready to GO when I took her hand. Had it not
been for the cockblock!
Somebody must have taught the "Iranian from hell" this shit!

The way I think about it is much like caveman sex. You see the hot chick,
you bang her on the head with your club, you take her to your cave, you root
her. Thus :- Find Stun Drag Fuck.
Just a bit more aggressive than Find Meet Attract Close, but that's the best
way I could describe what this ugly-as-fuck PUA was doing.

These were the attitudes that I had when I was only just starting to pull
women at incredible speeds while on holiday.

The other point is on Objection handling in regards to the STATEMENT OF
INTENTIONS. What I learned from the PUA I met, is that you fight chick
bullshit with your own bullshit - with a slightly authoritive tone (no need
to REALLY get pissed).
For example :- The chicks said "We have to get to our car" and were ready to
leave
The Playboy said "You can't leave anyway because the gates are closed" even
though the gates aren't closed.
Thus this covers handling chick bullshit - on the phone as well as in real
life.
And one chick on another seduction board I read often typed something to the
tune that she wants to be with a guy that can bullshit his way into her
pants.

So there you go. Find Stun Drag Fuck.
Stun is the hardest.

> There are reasons why most of us step through seduction so gingerly.
> We know that saying or doing one wrong thing can blow up the seduction.
> As far as I can tell, letting her know you intend to fuck her before
> you fuck her is one of those things.  Another reason is that women
> won't tell you when they're ready to fuck.

But DDB does tell all!
That single most common fuckup is what is called LACK OF CONGRUENCE
(definition courtesy of Mr. Sex). Just like when I called that chick I met
yesterday "my friend" in front of her. Doing that is a sign of weakness.
Chicks can get away with having words out of congruence with their actions,
but guys CANNOT.

> You say that when you "lead girls on" and tease them too much, you look
> easy and they hate you.  But this insight doesn't make it any easier to
> recognize when you're "leading them on".  The window between when a
> woman is receptive to a close and when you've stalled her is short, and
> spotting it seems to be harder than superstring theory.  The answer
> seems to be to make hundreds of approaches, and very slowly improve
> through experience.

Well you have body language and other subtle pointers. Plus we are adding
all the time to our STATEMENT OF INTENTIONS in order to find a barrier and
cut off point. I don't doubt that noticing DDB when you have the intuition
becomes easier.

  The one concrete thing I get out of your post is
> that next time two HBs want a foursome with you and your LTR, you'll be
> more likely to recognize it.  Or maybe the situation will be different
> enough that you won't.

I fucked that up because I KNOW those chicks wanted me to go with them, and
I over-teased them and didn't capitulate and then state my intentions to
have a foursome. They would have been up for it!
That's when the Playboy showed up to show me the shit, and then beat me
hands-down in a round of THE GAME. ;)

> You also said, "Now I realise more than fucking EVER what a chick
> wants. She wants a guy to go and GET her, make her feel wanted, and
> then have the shit fucked out of her!"  But you agreed with another
> poster that you can't just walk up to a woman and say "Let's fuck."
> So what's your new insight here?

It's a no-brainer. Is sex ALL you bringing to the table? That's why he
coupled GM styled intention pointers further into the seduction (after the
earlier G-rated ones), and then when they succeeded in not objecting, he
went to Mystery routines as a reward OR to the Drag phase if they were DDB.
You cannot start the seduction with a statement of intention that skips the
buildup - unless the chick is THAT FUCKING HORNY and shameless.
Chicks want to know that you care about them as human beings and not just
sex objects. Thus neutral conversation gets smattered in between, and the
final statement of intentions clearly shows what his intentions are so SHE
KNOWS that you care about her feelings - in that way.

The Playboy I met even went to see a chick he had a threesome with the next
day (cause she was feeling a bit alone). This guy was no cheap "Player"
(which he pointed out in his great Our world styled close routine on this
9). You could tell he cared enough too.

> Have you figure out a better way to know when a woman is ready to
> be closed?  Or a faster way to get her to want to fuck?  Or a way to
> let her know your intentions without scaring her off?  What's the
> difference between your approach now and your approach before you went
> to Guam?  It sounds like you feel you understand things better than
> you did before, but I can't figure out what the new understanding is.

Well, now you have your answer.
Mind you, I'm only getting the framework now that I sit down and try and
explain what I am now doing. This shit became automatic when I had the whole
experience of witnessing this guy and learning from him.

Any questions or comments? Fire away....

Rio
-------

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
References:  <90eati$gpt@nnrp1.deja.com> <63JW5.205t1.56373@nnrp.gol.com> <90i82p$iao@nnrp1.deja.com>
Subject: Re: Find Stun Drag Fuck

Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2000 10:04:46 GMT

Jonathan Ashton  wrote in message
news:90i82p$iao@nnrp1.deja.com...
> In article <63JW5.205t1.56373@nnrp.gol.com>,
>   "Rio"  wrote:
> > Well, now you have your answer.
>
> Yeah, I understand much better now.  Thanks for writing it down.
>
> > Any questions or comments? Fire away....
>
> So I get the abstract idea now:  Make some sort of Statement Of
> Intentions (SOI) to a woman relatively early, and then act congruently
> with it.

More or less, that's it.
The thing is, after dropping routines - get to it or the chick gets confused
and drops out.
Mystery had the right idea with his routines and intros. BUT if you fail to
State your intentions - you can stall things and stale her out. Then it will
be your fault when it appears that the routines don't work! They may have
worked, but she has given up on you as a partner already. You teased too
much.

> Like most people, though, I don't really understand any abstract idea
> until I've seen two or three concrete examples; i.e. HOW to make that
> SOI.

Ross Jeffries has already covered how to do this with his NLP pacing and
leading. I'm just giving a name to the end result of doing that (SOI -
Statement of Intention).

SOIs are SO important to women. They want to know where they stand. Women
you are with and haven't SOIed will think to themselves :- "What am I to
him"?
With my LTR which I sloppily SOIed, she annoyed me for ages if I was her
boyfriend or not. I hadn't said, and was therefore walking thin ice.
That drove her NUTS.

Now, I guess I could show you some fake examples of stuff that you could
launch into your PU - but the reason why I'm not going to do that is because
if ANYBODY creates a list of them - we're going to get the problem that AFC
men ALREADY have with PU Lines. That is, throwing meaningless words into a
conversation and then not being able to back them up.
Either that, or we will develop a single street pickup routine which men
will use the world over with great success before women cotton on to it.
When it comes to SOI, DIY (damn all these acronymns!).

An example of SOI is what I said to the chick I tried to PU on the weekend.
I paced it to the point where we are talking about where we lived, and I
found out that she lived close. Then I said "That's good, so we can get
together really easy and have some fun then."
If she had been far away - no problem "That's too bad. I'll have to travel
far to get together with you and have fun"
If she lives on Mars - no problem "Wow! You live out there! I'll have to
build a rocket to come and see you after you go back there!"

So there you go. Who needs to be excessively GM?

> You gave the example of GM style.  Yep, GM makes a pretty clear SOI.
> I don't think a "recovering nice guy" like me could do GM congruently,
> though.

I have done it once successfully and it Suuure works. But yes, it's hard to
work things up to that because you skip a lot of buildup steps. The flirting
has to take place in a sexual level rather than a much safer level. That is
risky.
That's what I mean when by saying "Let's Fuck" you run the risk of having to
flirt at such a high level where you can fuck up easily. Not that it's
impossible of course.
NEGs (which I forgot to mention before) help especially in the
objection,flirt phase. This phase is like the part where the dog chases
after the bitch to try and fuck her, and the bitch keeps running. The thrill
of the chase!

> You mention TokyoPUA and Johnny Shack references, but it would take
> a lot of searching/guessing to find the specific examples you have in
> mind.  And I don't understand your Ross example - "And maybe we could
> really get to like each other" sounds like a pretty vague SOI; maybe
> I'd understand what you mean if I knew the context?

Search for stuff on the archived layguide for stuff about Johnny Shack. He
also has an online book. Ross has his old free book around the place. Search
Formhandle for TokyoPUA's posts.
By the way, I even went as far as reading ALL of Mystery's decent posts as
well.

> The only example of an SOI I see in your posts is this one from Guam
> PUA:
>
> > As for going for the fuck close? Forget your sexual accelerators.
> > This guy said the whole shit in plain English - and I saw him say
> > this all to to a chick. He basically said that he was a playboy, but
> > not a pickup artist (to frame the idea that he won't fuck and dump),
> > and that when he had sex with the chick (Framing it as if it's going
> > to happen) that she should just enjoy it for fun and not worry about
> > it too much because it's just their private thing (our world style
> > routine), and that he was not an easy guy in reality - that he was
> > quite selective in who he chooses for sex (so he doesn't look like a
> > meat-market man).
> > He said all this straight faced to a chick, and while I was watching
> > the chick he did this on - she was trancing out and playing with her
> > hair. It was totally evil.
>
> So my questions...
>
> Have you ever done a SOI to kiss a girl and not had her object?  If so,
> what did you say?  Have you ever done a SOI to fuck a girl and not had
> her object?  If so, what did you say?  Hell, do you remember the exact
> words of any SOI you've ever said?

I gave you an example above of an SOI above (where I told the chick that we
would hang out in the future). No doubt we can refine the whole shit a lot
better in the future.
And yes. I think everyone at some stage has done an SOI, or the body
language has been good enough to get her into that zone where she KNOWS
maybe at 70% where your intentions are, with or without any routines to help
snag the chick, and the chick has put up some token resistance. The purpose
of the resistance of course, is to set the scene for the chase you know will
end in a fuck if you can just reel the bitch in. You will eventually do it
as long as you have remained congruent throughout.

> What other kinds of SOIs would you use in the buildup?  Tell her you're
> going to give her a neck massage?  (I'm sure that question sounds
> clueless; but I really think the meat is in the details.)

Well pace it:-
"Have you ever felt like having a neck massage? I think you need one, so
I'll give you one"
Sometimes the more direct your SOIs are, the harder she will force you to
keep pushing them.
So let's say the chick flirts and says "Why do you want to? I don't need
one!"
So we have to SOI her again in the second sentence in this example :- "Well
you haven't had one of my massages that can make you feel good all over. Now
relax....."

The idea is to trap the chick at all costs with your intentions that you can
carry out - until she can't get away.
Even "No I can't!" "Yes you can!" "No I can't!" "Yes you can!" fights - if
that's what it comes down to - can win you the day if you persist and not
let her win! Verbal arguments can always be solved with kino - cause you as
the guy are STRONGER. I don't mean hit her, but mauling is OK as long as she
is enjoying it! ;)

Persistance is VERY important. Of course, you may want to dump the chick
after the fuck if she doesn't drop the shit because she is too much work to
obtain sex from in the long run. Just give her an ultimatum "Cut the shit or
you will be lonely!"

At the same time, you can get trapped if you say an SOI that you can't
possibly keep. So watch what you promise to do!
Saying shit like "I'm going to buy you a Rolls Royce!" when she KNOWS you
can't afford it is an extreme example of a shit SOI. There goes your trust
and congruency with that one.

> And as for one other comment you made:
>
> > (E.g. If you want to start things off gently by holding her hand,
> > tell her a scene where want to be holding her hand - and then do it
> > in the next routine after she is comfortable with this.)
>
> You mean you tell her a story about some guy you know who held some
> girl's hand?  Or what?  Methinks I really don't understand here.

You can do that to get her thinking about holding someone's hand - and once
she is feeling it, you may be able to slip in the kino and get away with it.
At least, your chances will be better.

> > Is sex ALL you bringing to the table? That's why he
> > coupled GM styled intention pointers further into the seduction
> > (after the earlier G-rated ones), and then when they succeeded in
> > not objecting, he went to Mystery routines as a reward OR to the
> > Drag phase if they were DDB.
>
> I would LOVE to see these SOIs written down.

Done as above. But make your own!
I re-explained the "Let's Fuck" problem a bit better above as well.

> So here's my deal:  I want to see more examples of SOIs so I can take
> them apart, because I really suspect that the exact wording is crucial.
>
> For example:
>
> GM gets away with his SOIs because they're exaggerated to absurdity,
> and thus they're both funny and unlikely (at least as stated).
> This puts a little distance between the SOI and the girl, so she
> doesn't slap him.

I think it's more of a case of the GM SOIs that fail, he can write them off
as being jokes. That keeps him on track and congruent.
BUT the risk of failure is very high if he doesn't cover his tracks.

> Guam PUA gets away with his SOI (quoted above) because he's talking
> about chicks in general, and not overtly about the particular chick.
> This puts a little distance between the SOI and the girl, so she's
> not pressured to make a decision right then.

This is the all important point. With some SOIs (and especially with
ambiguities in NLP) the SOIs are not in your face, BUT they are vague enough
to get the point across and then judge for a positive reaction from her or
not. However, the vagueness is simply a shot from 50 metres as opposed to a
shot from point-blank. Just make sure you hit the target.
The danger with point-blank SOIs is they are risky in so far as if you say a
dumb one you can't,won't, or don't want to carry out like "I'm going to take
you on holiday!" as opposed to an NLP shot from 50 metres which describes a
holiday and builds on it. "Have you ever been on holiday with someone
special?....."

> Am I on the right track here?  Are there other ways to word SOIs that
> get around direct resistance?  More examples would be appreciated.

You should check out patterning, but remember, a shot from point-blank is
better than 50 metres. The shortest distance between 2 points is a straight
line. There are pros and cons of both styles of course.
You can take the short path across the dangerous ravine, or the long path
around it.

> I gotta say, this whole idea of SOIs is new to me.  Maybe other PUAs
> in this group have been using them without ever realizing/stating the
> importance of them?

I just gave a name to it. People have done this stuff before and I'm just
giving it a name to help explain what I'm doing.

And no, Ray can't trademark this either and claim it's his. We have
discussed why this is enough on ASF. He's filtered anyway and I can't see
his verbal shit.

> Thanks,
> Ash

Thanks for the questions. They help challenge me in trying to explain myself
better.

Rio

-------

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Clearing SOI's up
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 12:15:23 GMT

Maniac,

I came up with the SOI concept after studying what the Guam Playboy did to
chicks. I wish I could have spent longer down there to learn more off this
guy. Oh well, I just need to save up to go again.

SOI (Statements of intention/interest) were comments that the Guam Playboy
made a lot (I assume you read my report on that place - It's nanpa
paradise!). What he did then was control the flirting that followed after
baiting her with a show of interest. He did this by offering a challenge -
when he finished doing that once he went back to fun routines, talking about
parties on the island, jokes, sex personality tests, etc. before he did
another SOI - staring out as indirect and ambiguous, before being VERY
direct. ;)

Basically what I think I have come up with, through trying to explain to the
posters that asked me about him, is a flirting construction kit.

The Guam Playboy NEGged a LOT - and he got away with it every time. He could
even tell chicks AFC things like they were beautiful, and then turn it into
a NEG if he wanted. That's what over 20 years of daily PU did for this guy.

But the NEG is only one kind of flirting (used for dumping a girl's uptight
self image). There are other kinds, such as using ambiguities, physical
light-handed slapping and pushing kino, playing tricks on people, etc. The
Playboy used plenty of variations.

Flirting is this:- One drops the SOI, and then pulls it away out of reach of
the target. Then gives another SOI, and then pulls it away again. Like with
our words, we put images of sex and romance in their heads, then pull it out
again, then out it in, then take it out, then put it back in, then take it
out again........ Mindfucking!
Once the chick is confused and teased enough, she is DDB and safely
mindfucked.

I did a PU once on a chick using the SOIs. I found out where she lived and
then said "Oh that's not far from my place, so I can come down to see you.
It's a pity I am so busy it won't happen today"
(Note that there is a bit of future pacing and presuppositioning in this)
She lapped it up and took my kino from there - despite the BF being a matter
of metres away.

The structure for the Guam Playboy routine went like this:-

- Fun routine or opener (ala Mystery) - some basic fluff - all good things
about himself, what he could do for the women (he played the helpful tour
guide). Be "Disgustingly" Charming! as he put it. The guy wasn't big on
logically drawing out routines for what he did (which is a good thing), he
just went and DID this.... thus he couldn't really explain to me what he was
doing. I had to observe.
- SOI. He said something that hinted that he was interested in the chick
(paced and lead from his opener conversation). This got her emotions going
and her ideas racing. I have found this CRITICAL if the chick is going to
stay interested in you for too long. I bored many chicks out initially when
I wouldn't get to the point.
"What do you look for in guys?" would be sufficient enough as a question to
hint at what you are after (as you have found out yourself Maniac). Starting
off on a topic about guys and relationships usually brings chicks out, but
asking "Do you have a BF?" sucks.
This Ross Jeffries inspired SOI "The more you laugh, the more you'll be
attracted to interesting people......now with me" is an ambiguous SOI.
- Before she could knock him down for any comment, he would then be a
challenge and say something like "I'm not easy", "we don't know each other
well enough yet", "but what would I know, right? ;)","I need to feel passion
first", "Yeah, you know what I'm saying". These basically FORCE the chick to
continue the flirting (initiated by the SOI) along the lines that HE wanted
(and the lines that chicks SAY they want!).
By saying that he "needed time" and "not being easy", the chick already
attracted to him would then come onto him.

Most of the time the chicks would laugh becuase they'd get stuck for a smart
comeback. And he just kept this up, alternating back to party and fun
routines, until he got to the "sex-SOI-Our World-But I'm no sleaze"routine
which would then DDB the target to fuck - or get her ready for it next time
they met.
Negative commands also work great here to spark challenge. Just like I did
with my now LJBF ex-LTR "I'm not going to fuck you".

I've noted in my past failures (too many to count) that when I have dropped
SOI hints - the chicks have taken the flirting into areas which were
impossible for me to control - fucking me up and making me look stupid.
Especially in clubs where chicks do this like child's play to anyone who
"hits" on them. They use their irrational chick logic to fuck themselves
(and you) up. If that happens, your PU is history.
We can't give the women control, especially not in flirting, because they
aren't the ones that are trying to do PU. It's their job as "virtuous" women
to try and get away from PU, or try to fuck our PU up.

Svengali also said in his MLTR theory something which rings home on this. He
said (and I quote):-

"Seventh: If you don't give a woman something to be pissed about every
now and then, she'll find something on her own, and that will be harder
to get out of (because it will be of her making and criteria, not
yours)."

That is also the point of what we should be doing in flirting. To trap the
chick into going along with what your flirting and accepting your advances
(by means of non-objection) while getting her horny at the same time. That
way we avoid snappy comebacks because you've already "Handled her objections
before they came up" (That's something I learnt as a salesman)
This causes the chick to have her token resistance stall out - and puts us
in control.
GM does this with his sex jokes, but he slams any possible retort with "Just
Kidding" thus the chick can't say anything and the flirting goes by GMs
rules and not hers.

Take Mystery's "Nice nails" NEG for example.
He starts off with an SOI "Nice nails". This in and of itself is a
compliment. If he stopped here, the chick would come back (if she were a
bitch) with some smart ass comment to get rid of Mystery.

BUT, he then puts up the CHALLENGE before she gets a chance to reply (like
GM with "Just kidding"). Seemingly innocent too. "Are they real?"

Now the chick is stuck. What's going on? He's complimented me, and now he's
knocking me down! What is he doing? I must stick around for this! What can I
say? Maybe I'll just laugh it off...!? er..?
(Note, some REAL bitches when stalled will look angry at you and say "Huh?"
to which it's GM to the rescue! with "Hide your pleasure!")

So, couple this kind of flirting with lots of things to get her feeling
horny (patterns, sex talk, whatever), and add lots of personality conveying
things thrown in for good measure - and the chick is sufficiently stunned -
and ready for the drag and fuck stage.

Oh, and the Guam Playboy is an ugly fucker. Kipp's seen the pictures.
Looks don't matter for shit. I have great respect for all the older PUAs.

I must get up to Tokyo to see you guys real soon. The inaka sucks.
We can experiment with this some more then. I've been getting rusty since I
got back from Guam.
What I do know is that when this guy's method does work, it is KILLER. We
get Mr. Smooth status and KCs like crazy.

Rio
-------
Dictate the flirting

 wrote in message news:91f5e8$dpn@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Re: SOI's
>
> Rio..
>
> You are on to something big here..
> This is a discovery!
> I will incorporate this.
>
> Please give more specific examples though. I get
> what you are saying, but not yet really how you would
> apply it. .
>
>
> Fucking excellent thread!
>
>
> Maniac
> http://www.pickupguide.com
>
>
> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/

---

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: More on SOIs
Date: Fri, 22 Dec 2000 06:17:41 GMT

THIS IS RIO TYPING IN CAPS. I'M NOT YELLING!

Comments in text below.
After New years, I WILL be ready, and we will hit
the streets.

GREAT. I HAVEN'T BEEN DOING MUCH PU UNTIL YESTERDAY (1 SOLID # FROM A 9 AND
A KC FROM ANOTHER 9) - THUS THIS POST AS I TEST OUT MY THEORY. I HAVE A
FRIEND WHO WOULD LIKE TO COME ALONG. HE'S ALREADY BRIEFED AND VERY
EXPERIENCED IN SCREWING WOMEN IN JAPAN. HE'S READ THE PICKUP GUIDE ALREADY.
HE'S EVEN BEEN SO KIND TO INTRODUCE ME TO SOME WOMEN WHO WANT MERCY FUCKS.
HE ALSO KNOWS SOME GOOD "hole in the wall" PLACES AROUND RAPPONGI WITH LOTS
OF WOMEN (SO HE SAYS).

BTW, Rio; re: 'nomad' player.. mine was fucked up, returned
it for an exchange, new one works..

IT'S SURE BEATS A TAPE RECORDER, DOESN'T IT?

First, this is brilliant material, it is going on the
website, and is core to successful PU I think. It IS what
smooth was doing.. I couldnt identify it, but now it has
been named, and described, I recognize this.. and yes, it
will be TOTALLY lethal..

THANKS. EVERY SUCCESSFUL PUA HAS BEEN DOING SOMETHING LIKE THIS (OF ONE
STYLE OR ANOTHER) TO BED WOMEN. I WENT OUT AND USED THIS FRAME YESTERDAY
WITH INTERESTING AND POSITIVE RESULTS.....

HOWEVER, I MUST SAY IT'S HARD TO GIVE SPECIFIC EXAMPLES UNLESS THEY ARE
SITUATIONALLY BASED. FOLLOWING THE LOGIC HOWEVER, AND USING IT GIVEN THE
SITUATION STILL BRING RESULTS. I WILL DESCRIBE SOME OF WHAT I HAVE BEEN
DOING WITH IT, BUT I CAN'T REMEMBER FOR THE LIFE OF ME WHAT EXACTLY THE GUAM
GUY SAID. (I ONLY RECORDED A SMALL SAMPLE OF OUR CHAT WITH MY MP3 PLAYER.
NONE OF HIS NANPA HOWEVER) WHAT I DO KNOW, IS THAT HE FOLLOWED THIS
STRUCTURE WHICH I HAVE DESCRIBED TO VERY SOME GOOD EFFECTS.

I ASSUME YOU READ MY ORIGINAL STORY ON THE GUAM TRIP.
IF SO, MY REPLY WILL MAKE MORE SENSE.

In article ,
  "Rio"  wrote:
> He did this by offering a challenge -
> when he finished doing that once he went back to fun routines,
talking about

Examples? ?

OK, HE MADE SOME KIND OF COMPLIMENT OR SUGGESTED SOME KIND OF ACTIVITY
(OFTENTIMES WITH SEXUAL OR ROMANTIC UNDERTONES) THAT THEY COULD DO TOGETHER.
(LIKE HANG TIGHT TO EACH OTHER OF THE JET POWERED BANANA BOAT) AND THEN
FOLLOWED THAT WITH A REASON WHY HE WOULD HAVE TROUBLE DOING IT. KINDA LIKE
IN SALES, A SALESMAN WOULD SAY "FOR ONE DAY ONLY SALE", WELL HE WAS LIKE "SO
YOU SHOW UP AT SUCH AND SUCH A TIME, OTHERWISE I WON'T BE ABLE TO SHOW YOU A
GOOD TIME AND I'LL TAKE SOMEONE ELSE" (a takeaway)
SO IN ORDER TO CONTINUE THE FLIRTING, THE CHICK WOULD HAVE TO SHOW UP. HE
WOULD THEN (AFTER HAVING COMPLETED A SOI ROUTINE) SIT BACK AND WATCH THE
CHICK FOLLOW THROUGH. HE WOULD OFTENTIMES BE ABLE TO CONTINUE A CONVERSATION
WITHOUT STALLING - AND MIDWAY HE WOULD SOI HER AGAIN AND DO THE SAME ROUTINE
WITH SOMETHING ELSE. I NEVER SAW HIM GET IT ON WITHIN 20 MINUTES, BUT I SAW
WHAT HE DID TO THE CHICK WITH THIS ROUTINE AND I COULD TELL THAT HE COULD
HAVE IF HE WANTED TO. HE DIDN'T LOOK DESPERATE AT ALL.

> parties on the island, jokes, sex personality tests, etc. before he
did
> another SOI - staring out as indirect and ambiguous, before being VERY
> direct. ;)

Examples ? ?

THIS GUY HAD A STRONG ELEMENT OF GM. THE SEX PERSONALITY TEST IS DOCUMENTED
IN MY POST ON THIS GUY (IT'S ABOUT ICE CREAM) - BUT AFTERWARDS UNLIKE GM, NO
COMMENT OF "JUST KIDDING". HE WOULD THEN SAY SOMETHING ELSE TO DISTRACT
ATTENTION OR PLAY "PRETEND AFC" LIKE "BUT I'M NOT EASY" OR "BUT I DON'T KNOW
YOU THAT WELL"
ALL THE MEANWHILE, GETTING THE CHICK HORNY AND CREATING A CHALLENGE.

> Basically what I think I have come up with, through trying to explain
to the
> posters that asked me about him, is a flirting construction kit.

Examples ? ?

MANIAC, YOU'RE STARTING TO OVERUSE CUT AND PASTE LIKE NYC WHEN HE RIPS APART
AFCS WITH THESE "EXAMPLES??" COMMENTS.........

(QUOTE NYC)
"YOU ARE BEING USED. SHE DOESN'T GIVE A SHIT ABOUT YOU. SHE DOESN'T INTEND
TO FUCK YOU. SHE IS FUCKING OTHER MEN THAT SHE FINDS SEXUALLY ATTRACTIVE.
YOU ARE FOOTING THE BILL FOR HER INTERNATIONAL WHORING. STOP."

HA HA HA ;)

> The Guam Playboy NEGged a LOT - and he got away with it every time.

Such as ? ?

WISH I COULD REMEMBER NOW. BUT WHAT I DID SEE IS HIM COMPLIMENTING LOTS OF
JAP CHICKS AND NOT GETTING ANY NASTY REACTION BACK FROM THEM - BECAUSE THEY
WERE SO SHY AND INEXPERIENCED. SO THE CHICKS JUST LAUGHED BECAUSE THEY HAD
NO BITCH SHIELD OF ANY TYPE.
WHERE HE DID ENCOUNTER A SHIELD, HE WOULD ATTACK HER "NASTY" PERSONALITY -
AND HER LACK OF ABILITY TO BE GRACEFUL WITH COMPLIMENTS.

IN THAT SENSE, HE WOULD ALWAYS SIZE THE CHICK UP AS IF HE WAS LOOKING FOR
LTR POTENTIAL (but we know of course, that LTR was never the plan)

He could
> even tell chicks AFC things like they were beautiful, and then turn
it into
> a NEG if he wanted. That's what over 20 years of daily PU did for
this guy.

Examples ? ?

"YOU'RE REALLY CUTE....(pause to check response)... BUT I DON'T KNOW
ANYTHING ABOUT YOU. (SAID NEGATIVELY OR NOT DEPENDING ON HER RESPONSE). SO
WHO ARE YOU ANYWAY?"

> But the NEG is only one kind of flirting (used for dumping a girl's
uptight
> self image). There are other kinds, such as using ambiguities,
physical
> light-handed slapping and pushing kino, playing tricks on people,
etc.

Such as ? ?

I'VE STOPPED USING KINO IMMIDIATELY NOW, AND SAVING IT FOR WHEN I'VE LANDED
AN SOI ROUTINE AND CAUGHT THE CHICK OUT. WHEN SHE HAS LAUGHED, I SLAP HER
GENTLY.
IT'S ANCHORING.

AS FOR TRICKS ON PEOPLE.... STUPID ONES. I WILL HAVE TO SHOW YOU THEM IN
PERSON.

The
> Playboy used plenty of variations.

Like what ? ?

GIVEN THE SITUATION, HE WOULD TRY DIFFERENT WAYS TO GET HER THINKING
ROMANTICALLY ABOUT BOTH OF THEM TOGETHER. HE WOULD USE WHATEVER WAS IN HIS
SURROUNDINGS, OR THE TOPIC OF CONVERSATION, TO PACE AND LEAD THE CHICK INTO
IMAGINING SUCH A SCENARIO.
THEN HE WOULD YANK IT AWAY BY GIVING SOME KIND OF EXCUSE (LIKE HE WAS BUSY,
HE DIDN'T THINK SHE COULD DO IT) OR HE WOULD PLAY AFC (I DON'T KNOW YOU, I
NEED TO BE IN LOVE FIRST, I'M NOT EASY, I'M NOT A PLAYER, I NEED TIME, I AM
REALLY PICKY, I HAVE BEEN HURT BEFORE, I HAVE A GF)

> Flirting is this:- One drops the SOI, and then pulls it away out of
reach of
> the target.

For example ? ?

I REALLY FEEL VERY CLOSE TO YOU, BUT I NEED TIME.

THE MAGIC WORD IS but

 Then gives another SOI, and then pulls it away again. Like with
> our words, we put images of sex and romance in their heads, then pull
it out

Like ? ?

HIS BRAVEST SOI WAS THE ONE WHERE HE SAID STRAIGHT OUT THAT HE WAS GOING TO
FUCK A CHICK. I WITNESSED THE WHOLE THING. HE SAID THAT HE WAS GOING TO FUCK
HER but (AND THEN HE WENT PRETEND AFC) I'M VERY PICKY, I'M NOT A PUA
BECAUSE THOSE GUYS TEASE WOMEN WITH BULLSHIT, MAKE EMPTY PROMISES, FUCK
THEM, AND THEN DUMP THEM. I AM A PLAYBOY. I LOVE WOMEN AND I DON'T WANT YOU
TO GET TOO ATTACHED TO ME AFTER WE HAVE SEX.

> again, then out it in, then take it out, then put it back in, then
take it
> out again........ Mindfucking!

Example please . .

OK, ANOTHER ONE:-   I WANT TO KISS YOU, BUT SOMEHOW I DON'T THINK YOU LIKE
KISSING.
(btw - this would be an SOI fairly advanced in conversation)
NOTE ALSO THAT THERE'S AN EMBEDDED COMMAND IN THE 2ND PART OF THE ROUTINE.
THAT BEING "YOU LIKE KISSING"
EVIL ISN'T IT?

> Once the chick is confused and teased enough, she is DDB and safely
> mindfucked.

how? describe this. . what exactly did he do?

WELL, THE CHICK THAT HE SAID THE "I'M GOING TO FUCK YOU" SPEECH TO, JUST
STARTED DOING ALL THE TRADEMARK BODYLANGUAGE. SHE JUST SAT THERE STUNNED
AND PLAYED WITH HER HAIR. LIKE A RABBIT LOOKING INTO BRIGHT LIGHTS. THE GUAM
GUY SAID ALL OF IT WITH A SERIOUS FACE TOO, SO SHE COULDN'T LAUGH OFF WHAT
HE WAS SAYING.

THE WAY HE WORKED DIDN'T SEEM TO BE ONE OF "ATTRACTION" PER SE. HE WOULD
EVENTUALLY CORNER THE CHICK AND FLIRT WITH HER UNTIL SHE COULD TAKE NO MORE.
UNTIL SHE GOT STUNNED

> I did a PU once on a chick using the SOIs. I found out where she
lived and
> then said "Oh that's not far from my place, so I can come down to see
you.
> It's a pity I am so busy it won't happen today"

This is good. .

THAT'S A REAL LIFE EXAMPLE OF WHAT THE WHOLE THEORY IS ABOUT. MORE
IMPORTANTLY IS THAT IT WORKED.

> (Note that there is a bit of future pacing and presuppositioning in
this)
> She lapped it up and took my kino from there - despite the BF being a
matter
> of metres away.
>
> The structure for the Guam Playboy routine went like this:-
>
> - Fun routine or opener (ala Mystery) - some basic fluff - all good
things
> about himself, what he could do for the women (he played the helpful
tour

Examples ? ?

READ SOME OF MYSTERY'S OPENERS!
TYPICALLY OFF THE WALL STUFF. WELL, WHEN HE WAS TALKING ABOUT GUAM'S CULTURE
AND PARTIES AND STUFF - FOR ALL THE TOURISTS, ALL THIS NEW INFO TO THEM IS
PRETTY OFF THE WALL.
HE WOULD TELL THE CHICKS ABOUT SOME PARTY WHERE THEY WOULD DIG A HUGE PIT
AND THROW ANIMALS ON IT IN A BIG FEAST WITH A BONFIRE AND DANCING - AND THEN
BRANCHED OUT AND TALKED ABOUT DANCING AND OTHER EXOTIC/EROTIC STUFF.

> guide). Be "Disgustingly" Charming! as he put it. The guy wasn't big
on

Like ? ?

THOSE WERE HIS EXACT WORDS. HE RELIED ON GM A LOT IN THE LATTER PART OF HIS
SEDUCTIONS.

> logically drawing out routines for what he did (which is a good
thing), he
> just went and DID this.... thus he couldn't really explain to me what
he was
> doing. I had to observe.

Yep, he's got experience.. I rarely consciously follow ManiacPlan
anymore.. just it spews out naturally.. learning PU is like learning
a foreign language/lingo.. once you get it, its natural..

I'VE BEEN LEARNING TO PLAY AFC IN MY SEDUCTIONS, AND IT HAS BEEN WORKING
REALLY WELL!

> - SOI. He said something that hinted that he was interested in the
chick
> (paced and lead from his opener conversation). This got her emotions
going

Example?  How?

OK, ANOTHER ONE.

"WOULDN'T IT BE GREAT TO SPEND TIME TOGETHER OVER COFFEE? IT'S SUCH A PITY I
HAVE TO GO TO SOME MEETINGS LATER ON, SO WE WILL PROBABLY HAVE NO TIME TO
SEE EACH OTHER EVER AGAIN BEFORE YOU GO BACK."
(WAIT FOR RESPONSE)
"BUT LET ME KNOW YOUR NUMBER ANYWAY...WHO KNOWS I MAY HAVE TIME."
(might want to save this one after you have dropped several other
SOIs)

> and her ideas racing.

Like what? which ideas? be specific please. .

ROMATIC AND/OR SEXUAL ONES.
HE WOULD START OFF ON ROMANTIC ONES AND MAKE THEM INCREASINGLY SEXUAL UNTIL
HE HIT A SEXUAL FANTASY OF HERS THAT WOULD DDB HER.
LET'S SAY "HOLDING HANDS" OR "SPENDING QUALITY TIME TOGETHER" OR "BEING
CLOSE" AND EVENTUALLY LEADING THAT INTO "TOUCHING BODIES" AND "KISSING" TO
"FUCKING" OBVIOUSLY.
A LOT OF TIME DISTORTION SOIs.

> I have found this CRITICAL if the chick is going to
> stay interested in you for too long. I bored many chicks out
initially when
> I wouldn't get to the point.
[rest deleted]

Rio, this is great stuff. Somehow I understand it.. but I need
examples of it so I can put it together as something I can try
in the field. Do you remember any specifics from this guy?

WELL, WE CAN ALWAYS WAIT FOR THE OFF-SEASON AND GO TO GUAM WITH A VCR AND
MEET THIS GUY (YOU'LL ONLY NEED ABOUT 40,000 YEN FROM TOKYO FOR A 2 DAY
TRIP) OR NEXT TIME WE MEET IN TOKYO WE CAN DO MORE STREET STUFF AND I CAN
SHOW YOU WHAT I KNOW. (I HADN'T FULLY DEVELOPED THE THEORY UNTIL AFTER MY
NIGHT OUT WITH KIPP - I OQed TOO MUCH AND FAILED TO PLACE ANY CHALLENGES
AFTER MY SOIs THAT NIGHT)
THE GUAM PLAYBOY WAS A GRANDMASTER OF STREET PU - HIS WEAKNESS WAS THAT HE
WAS A GREEDY TEAMPLAYER WITH WINGMEN.

If so, please fill in the above spaces where I ask.. it is very
important if this is to work.

Rio
-------

Using SOI’s as a way to tease/attract chicks!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Using SOI's (statements of intent) as a tease to attract a chick!


From: Jonathan Ashton 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Clearing SOI's up
Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 07:04:08 GMT

In article ,
> For example, if we were to drop an SOI on the chick, and then
> IMMEDIATELY follow up with a negative command - WE control the
> flirting so that the chick then has to work for US.
>
> So we can say things like "I want to kiss you"
> And then control the flirting by pulling away again with some reverse
> commands :-
> "BUT I don't really know anything about you, and I haven't known you
> for very long, and I need to feel love first"
> Sounds like the stuff that chicks tell us, right? Well chicks say it
> to flirt, as opposed to meaning what they say!

Omigod!  Rio, this is an awesome post!  Brilliant!  Genius!

"I was thinking about kissing you, but you'd probably slobber too
  much."
"I'd love to take you home, but I know you'd get all clingy."
"I'm just trying to guess if you're any good in bed.  Too bad you're
  too young/weird/conservative for me."
"I bet you'd love the way I do neck massages.  You've been acting up
  too much to deserve one, though."

This is so EASY!  Anyone can think these up on the spot!  There's no
need to think up ambiguous sentences or come up with just the right
innuendo.  Just make a Statement of Intentions, then let her know what
SHE has to offer to make it happen - by telling her that you won't do
it because she's not up to par!  I love it!  I will try it out ASAP!

Howcome I've never seen this idea explained before?  In retrospect,
it's clear that MrSex4uNYC and Mystery do similar stuff, but I've
never seen the dynamic explained this way before.  Ross talks about
setting challenges, but it's always seemed like such a delicate art
to say just the right thing at just the right time.

But this is so easy!  Thank you, Rio.

Ash


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

Game: Color game

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Color Game that can be used in PU!
[Maniac note: got this other list below from the 'Secrets of the cube book'
Also very good, may be appropriate when doing this game:

Red: passion, hot energy, anger warmth
Green: hope, life, nature, money
Blue: spirituality, serenity, cool energy, sadness
Purple: royalty, deep passions, mourning
Yellow: cheerfulness, brightness, eccentricity
Pink: feminity, wamrth
Brown: earthyness, warmth, conventionality
Black: mystery
White: purity
Multicolored: of many interests or moods

END: Maniac note]

From: steviewonder 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: More personality tests
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 20:20:17 GMT

In article <904e0cjv@nnrp1.deja.com>,
  maniac_high@yahoo.com wrote:
> There is good stuff on that site.
>
> I am reworking it to be more appropriate in opener type
> PU's in bars/coffee shops, will present my results of this
> work in late January after it has all been designed and
> field tested.. It will be killer..

Hi guys,

Found this game at

http://www.geocities.com/Broadway/8546/colortest.html

a good one since all the answers are sexual:

QUESTION:

Pick the color that best describes your personality?

ANSWERS:

BLACK
Black color preferences point to black sex. These people are the
misfits of the sex world and seek each other in kinship. They tend to
prefer perverted sex, and are usually masochistic or sadistic in
nature. They are moody and often perform at their peak when under
stress or during unhappy times. Police psychologists claim that many
sex offenders prefer the color black. And it is no coincidence that
the uniform of mobsters and teenaged gangs is black.

BLUE
Lovers of blue are wonderful sex partners. They are sincere,
affectionate, and sensitive to their partner's needs. They consider
lovemaking a fine art, and their approach is elegant. Men who love
blue are like concert pianists; delicately ravaging their partner like
they would play a baby grand. Women in the blue category enjoy sex
to the fullest. They are exciting partners, but their passion might be
compared to tidal waves, rather than fiery aggresion. Both blue men
and women enjoy foreplay and the aftermath of lovemaking as much
as the act. In marriages, a blue person is a wonderful mate, never
failing to please the spouse and never seeking outside interests.

BROWN
For lovers of brown, sex is a 24-hour a day thing. They tend to say "I
love you" often enough. Snuggling by the fire, walking in the rain or
catching snowflakes on their tongue ins a turn-on to a lover of brown.
They need lots of time and privacy to make love. But their emotions
are such that one harsh word could end an affair.

GREEN
Those who prefer green are fresh and innocent in their approach to
sex. Women who love green will make love like virgins all their life.
And a man may also be a trifle clumsy and awkward, but in a charming
and endearing sort of way. Green lovers are gentle, but not
passionate. If chosen as a mate, one will never need to worry about
infidelity.

GREY
The color grey is preferred by people who are indecisive. They can't
get excited about anything - including colors - so they choose a
noncommittal shade. Men who prefer grey look at sex as a means of
relieving tension - nothing more nothing less. It's "wham, bam, thank
you ma'am". Women don't make love, they have intercourse. They
count the cracks in the bedroom plaster until the sex act is over with
and done. When a grey marries another grey, the marriage is not
exactly erotic.

ORANGE
Lovers of the color orange lean toward sexual fantasies. The sex act
is regarded as a dramatic role, a one act play in which they are the
star. Foreplay is as important as the act of love. They whisper sweet
nothings, meaningless dialogue they feel fits their image. Orange
people often do not experience orgasm - but they put on a damn good
act. Men tend to pull their partner's hair and women tend to leave
welts on their sex partner's back!

PINK
Persons who like pink show a reluctance to mature in sexual matters.
Women tend to tease; to promise more than they intend to deliver. In
some cases, they flaunt their femininity, but only because they
secretly hate men. A great percentage of prostitutes boast entire
wardrobes in pink. Men who like pink are the type who make 3 dates
for the same evening and not keep them, preferring to pick up a dish
in some bar instead.

PURPLE
Lovers of purple frequently consider themselves too regal for  fun
romp in the sack. Women sometimes are the type who hate to muss
their hair. Men are businesslike in their approach to lovemaking. In
both sexes, purple partners are more concerned with their
fulfillment then anyone else's gratification.

RED
People who like red tend to be tigers in the sack. They are easily
aroused and enjoy sex in every way imaginable. Once the sexual spark
is lit, it may take hours to extinguish. When two reds get together,
the ensuing erotica would make Lady Chatterly blush. Lovers of red
tend to be the aggressors and weaker colors should beware!

YELLOW
If you tend to favor yellow, your sexual drives are complex and lean
toward the adaptable. The favorite color of homosexuals is yellow!
But don't panic - not everyone who wears yellow is homosexual. In
most cases the person will accommodate to the stronger partner's
desires in a passive manner. You will never enjoy sex to the fullest,
but you will never turn down an invitation from someone you enjoy or
admire.

--
To email me remove the _obvious from this address:
steviewonder_ob@viousfastmail.ca

Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

Handling delusional chicks, karatebabe lives a nightmare!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Re: Mystery: delusional chicks & sympathy lies! 
Date: 11/12/2000 
Author: maniac_high  

 << previous in search  ?  next in search >>  

Re: Mystery: delusional chicks & sympathy lies!
001112
 
Mystery wrote in another post this week regarding lying
to chicks, about how not to underestimate how delusional
a chick is willing to become in order to keep her 'happy'
view of the world.
 
He is absolutely right. And this explains how seeming
'jerk' can get away with what seems like such ridiculous
shit.
 
Case in point, is where I recently did a fuckup, and then
recovered with Karatebabe (see lay report, my page). This
is the chick that would go around my place after sex
cleaning up her own hairs so that "the other chicks"
wouldnt find out about her.
 
Well, one day we are going for coffee, and she asks me
if I had been seeing another chick at the time I started
dating her. Figuring (incorrectly) from her behavior,
that this chick knew totally what the score already was,
I said I had been (wrong answer!).
 
She freaked out and went balistic at me. Shit about "how
I make her fool, go behind her back..and other shit".
In retrospect it was clear though.. she got upset, because
something she merely 'suspected' (even though it was fucking
obvious as shit, as other chicks stuff was all over the
fucking house), now became something 'confirmed', and that
shattered her entire world..
 
I then smartened up and realized what I had just done,
and recovered by saying that I dumped her after I first
started dating you (Karatebabe), a few weeks later.
 
After that, she settled down (even though every week
there was different chick stuff all over the house
after that!). She asked me about it, and I said no,
there are no chicks..
 
She said she accepted that, and that her 'nightmare'
now was over, and everything was fine again.
 
Later she found some makeup and chick stuff in the
bathroom cabinet (another chick must have slipped
it there for someone else to find it), so I had
to think fast on my feet for that one...
 
So I told her that I have a real dark secret and
she might be very disappointed in me (now she is
expecting to hear something about a chick)..
 
Then (remembering she likes gays and stuff) I tell
her that I like to make believe to dress like a girl
(lots of J-guys do it actually, so I know it is not
so far fetched here), and I have guy friends that do it
with me, and sorry I didnt tell you earlier.. (of
course this is TOTALLY false.. Maniac is not even
remotely gay, nor a crossdresser or any of that shit)...
however.. she ACCEPTED that story, and was relieved
(in spite of the fact that I was almost cracking up
when I said it, since I was SURE she would call me
on my bullshit... but she didnt)!
 
Fuck!, the totally ridiculous things you have to
tell a chick...  AND! they accept it (as they
try to internalize it and believe it at least at
some level so that their happy delusional world
doesn't come crashing to bits)..
 
Strange, isnt it..!
 
Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Using the laws of power in PU!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Toecutter, and using the laws of power!




From toecutter@mail.com Mon Oct 23 09:39:39 2000
From: "toecutter" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Lessons from Book: The 48 Laws of Power
Lines: 201


Just reading a book, The 48 Laws of Power by Robert Greene. Definitely
lessons everywhere in the book on what we do here.
The book is amoral, and open about the deception inherit in what he is
teaching. It is largely for life outside the arena of seduction, but
entrirely applicable and there are some seduction examples in it to
illustrate his points (only historical: For example the advice of Ninon de
Lenclos on seduction to the Marquis de Sevigne and what happened when the
Marquis did not follow her advice, etc.). The examples are all pulled from
the Sun Tzu (Chinese, the Art of War), European history, famous con men,
magicians and charlatans, Kings, Queens, Napoleon and other power brokers
such as Al Capone. Perfect for you guys who enjoy Machiavelli. At 450
reasonably large format pages it is fairly long.

It is going to take me several re-readings, but at the moment I see the
messages as really 3 fold: First, play your cards pretty close to your
chest. This creates mystery. The more you say, the more common you appear
and the less in control. Andy Wohol created enigma by not discussing his
work and answering questions by being intentionally vague giving people the
feeling that he was being more profound than he was.  If you do not reveal
all, people will never become bored with you or your presence because you
will continue to represent a challenge, and will be eternally interesting.
Your silence will make other people feel uncomfortable and humans are
machines of interpretation and explanation; they have to know what you are
thinking. When you carefully control what you reveal, they cannot pierce
your intentions and meaning. Your short answers will put them on the
defensive and they will jump in, nervously filling the silence with all
kinds of comments that will reveal valuable information about themselves and
their weaknesses.

This brings me to the second message. Learn everything you can about other
people. Their strengths and weaknesses, their crutches and trance words.
Their motivations. Use these to your advantage whilst revealing as little as
possible about yourself. Keep them the focus of the conversation, and be a
'Spy' on their minds by eliciting values.

The third lesson is to use smoke and mirrors to obscure your objectives and
motivations. Throw decoys out there, use gifts as Trojan horses, and be
circumspect in what is going on. Again, this throws them off your game,
gives you an upper hand.

None of this is to say that you need to be quiet or a bad conversationalist,
just the opposite, by spying and eliciting values, you are encouraging
people to talk about themselves, their own favourite subject. By being brief
about yourself you are creating mystery and interest. It is just that you
are collecting the information in order to use it against them at another
time, whilst manipulating your image and reputation in their minds and
obscuring your real motivations. In some ways it is a book on playing hard
to get while outmanoeuvring the girl. A perfect structure in which to drop
SS.

Some of the content is below. I can post more on it if you would like
further discussion; I am overflowing with ideas on it.

Toecutter.

---

To list some of the laws that are obviously applicable:

Law 3: Conceal your intentions (Keep people off balance and in the dark by
never revealing the purpose behind your actions. If they have no clue what
you are up to, they cannot prepare a defence. Guide them far enough down the
wrong path, envelop them in enough smoke, and by the time they realise your
intentions, it will be too late.)

Law 4: Always say less than is necessary

Law 6: Court attention at all costs

Law 8: Make other people come to you - use bait if necessary

Law 9: Win though your actions, never through argument. (Any momentary
triumph you win though argument is really a Pyrrhic victory: The resentment
and ill will you stir up is stronger and lasts longer than any momentary
change in opinion. It is much more powerful to get others to agree with you
though your actions, without saying a word. Demonstrate, do not explicate.)

Law 10: Infection: Avoid the unhappy and unlucky (it works the other way
also. This is an alternative take on social-proof, or pivots or whatever you
want to call them, as well as wingmen. Also advice on not getting involved
with the wrong girl.)

Law 11: Learn to keep people dependent on you.

Law 12: Use selective generosity to disarm your victim (One sincere and
honest move will cover over dozens of dishonest ones. Openhearted gestures
of honesty and generosity bring down the guard of even the most suspicious
people. Once your selective honesty opens a hole in their armour, you can
deceive and manipulate at will.)

Law 13: When asking for help, appeal to people's self interest, never to
their mercy or gratitude.

Law 14: Pose as a friend, work as a spy.

Law 16: Use absence to increase respect and honour. (Again through mystery
and not stuffing it up by staying too long and doing or saying something
wrong.)

Law 17: Keep others in suspended terror: Cultivate an air of
unpredictability

Law 18: Do not build fortresses to protect yourself - Isolation is
dangerous. (Get out there amongst them).

Law 19: Know who you are dealing with - do not offend the wrong person.

Law 20: Do not commit yourself to anyone.

Law 21: Play a sucker to catch a sucker - appear dumber than your mark. (Let
her think that she is in control and smart, less naive, don't let on you are
a player).

Law 25: Re-create yourself (Do not accept the roles that society foists on
you. Re-create yourself by forging a new identity, one that commands
attention and never bores the audience. Be the master of your own image
rather than letting others define it for you. Incorporate dynamic devices
into your public gestures and actions - your power will be enhanced and your
character will seem larger than life).

Law 26: Keep your hands clean. (You must seem a paragon of civility and
efficiency: Your hands are never soiled by mistakes and nasty deeds.
Maintain such a spotless appearance by using others as scapegoats and cat'
s-paws to disguise your involvement).

Law 27: Play on peoples need to believe to create a cult like following.
(advice in this chapter is on how to become a cult leader or maybe build a
harem. 5 strategies to your dogma! a) Keep it vague; Keep it simple b)
Emphasise the visual and sensual over the intellectual c) Borrow the forms
of organised religion to structure the group d) Disguise your income source
e) set up an us-vs.-them dynamic. I think Ross Jeffries read this one!)

Law 28: Enter action with Boldness. (If you are unsure of a course of
action, do not attempt it. Your doubts and hesitations will infect your
execution. Timidity is dangerous: Better to enter with boldness. Any
mistakes you make through audacity are easily corrected with more audacity.
Everyone admires the bold; no one honours the timid).

Law 29: Plan all the way to the end.

Law 30: Make your accomplishments seem effortless. (Your actions must seem
natural and executed with ease. All the toil and practice that goes into
them, also all the clever tricks, must be concealed. When you act, act
effortlessly, as if you could do much more. Avoid the temptation of
revealing how hard you work - it only raises questions. Teach no one your
tricks or they will be used against you .. I am breaking this rule right
here with this post, as is the Authour of the book.)

Law 31: Control the options: Get others to play with the cards you deal.
(The best deceptions are the ones that seem to give the other person a
choice: Your victims feel they are in control, but are actually your
puppets. Give people options that come out in your favour whichever one they
choose. Force them to make choices between the lesser of two evils, both of
which serve your purpose. Put them on the horns of the dilemma: they are
gored wherever they turn. Note: this is a different view on my idea of
re-framing questions. The questions are re-framed so well that the girl has
no option.)

Law 32: Play to people's fantasies.

Law 33: Discover each mans thumbscrew.

Law 34: Be royal in your own fashion: Act like a king to be treated like
one.

Law 35: Master the art of timing. (Never seem to be in a hurry - hurrying
betrays a lack of control over yourself, and over time. Always seem patient,
as if you know that everything will come to you eventually. Become a
detective of the right moment; sniff out the spirit of the times, the trends
that will carry you to power. Learn to stand back when the time is not yet
ripe, and to strike fiercely when it has reached fruition.)

Law 36: Disdain things you cannot have: Ignoring them is the best revenge.

Law 37: Create compelling spectacles. (Striking imagery and grand symbolic
gestures create the aura of power - everyone responds to them. Stage
spectacles for those around you, then, full of arresting visuals and radiant
symbols to heighten your presence. Dazzled by appearances, no one will
notice what you are really doing.)

Law 40: Despise the free Lunch.

Law 43: Work on the hearts and minds of others.

Law 44: Disarm and infuriate with the mirror effect. (The mirror reflects
reality, but is the perfect tool for deception: When you mirror your
enemies, doing exactly as they do, they cannot figure out your strategy. The
mirror Effect mocks and humiliates them, making them overreact. By holding
up a mirror to their psyches, you seduce them with the illusion that you
share their values; by holding up a mirror to their actions you teach them a
lesson. Few can resist the power of the mirror effect.)

Law 48: Assume formlessness. (By taking a shape, by having a visible plan,
you open yourself to attact. Instead of taking a form for the girl to grasp,
keep yourself adaptable and on the move. Accept the fact that nothing is
certain and no law is fixed. The best way to protect yourself is to be as
fluid and formless as water: never bet on stability or lasting order.
Everything changes.)

Disarming groups of guys around chicks!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

When lots of guys are around 1 girl, you must disarm guys!


From: "Stepleader" 
Subject: Re: She has nice/great body and/or face -- but what about her?
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2000 10:02:45 GMT

great pep talk and I love your posts ... but ...

the situ called for a disarming of the guys.  Here is how.  Approach the
group but pay NO attention to the girl.  Begin the chat with the guys and
make them interested in your story telling.  MALE BONDING comradery.  Turn
you back to HER so she feels out of place.  What you have done is removed
all the attention from her (stolen it).  You are now the center of
attention.  A couple NEGS her way challenges her.  All the other guys were
on her - all but one.  YOU.

Just so you know, this is mystery methods groupset theory and Ive done this
successfully a great # of times.

from this vantage point you may now take her  by the hand and say to the
others, "is it alright if I steal your friend away for a bit?"  they will
say yes and you take her out of earshot.  Id love you to see me work a set
like that.  its brilliant.  and PRACTICAL.

Svengali  wrote in article
<131220002147344283%Svengali_here@use.net>...
> Gentlemen, you're looking for the whole package, not just the
> packaging.  And if all you're focusing on is the packaging, she damn
> well knows it and is in control of you --period!
> 
> You must, repeat, you must be prepared to walk at all times, no matter
> how much you would like to be on/in that body and face.
> 
> Remember, you are screening her to see if she is good enough for
> you, not the other way around.  And the only way you're going to find
> out if she is good enough for you is to learn as much as you can
> about the person that is within that female form.
> 
> Am I saying you must be screening every beauty for a long term
> relationship?  Hell no!  It can be for however long you want.  But
> the moment she sees, and it won't take her long, that you are screening
> her to see whether or not she is good enough for you, is the moment
> the tables get turned and she understands that she has to make herself
> look good in your eyes.
> 
> Now contrast this with all the other guys who are trying to make
> themselves look good in her eyes, so they can get on/in her.
> 
> To illustrate what I am saying, picture this: we're in a manhattan bar,
> and there is this gorgeous looking woman, with the greatest face you've
> seen, talking to a few guys.  One happens to be our own great NYC with
> his magnificient weight-lifting body and his "I'm great" attitude; 
> another is Riker with his patterns, a third is Greg19 with his band of
> ways, and so on.  So basically what you would have is a bunch of guys
> trying to find and give this woman what she wants, so as to get on/in
> her.
> 
> Then there's Svengali, with his Carey Grant looks and ways, who sees
> the woman, walks right up into the group and says "excuse me guys, I
> just wanted to ask the lady where she got, and whose idea it was to get
> those earrings that seems to make her skin sparkle and her eyes glow,
> and then I'll leave." [Turning to her] "So please tell me, where did
> you get, and what made you decide [Svengali's hand goes out to the
> earrings, and in the process, lightly touches the lady's neck] to get
> these earrings that seems to make your skin sparkle and your eyes
> glow?"  {She tells me.}  "Thank you."  "Bye guys, I'm going back over
> there [pointing, so the lady knows where I will be]."
> 
> Look what just occurred: (1) I showed I wasn't afraid of a damn thing. 
> (2) I disarmed my opponents.  (3) I made her feel good.  (4) I showed
> her I wasn't about to hang around and try and get her.  {Of course to
> firmly establish that point, I would engage another woman in
> conversation, and have her positioned in a way that the first woman
> would see her with me, which would have her wondering what kind of nice
> things was I saying to her, that she wasn't getting.}.
> 
> Who do you think the woman is likely to be focused on and thinking
> about: all the guys who are there, still trying to get to her, or the
> guy who said what he wanted, made her feel good/great, left, and is now
> focused on someone else?  {I removed one of her feel good sources, so
> even though the others are there, with theirs, she like nearly everyone
> of us, is focused on the one that's been lost, not the ones that are
> present.}
> 
> Show your interest in her, but also show that you are walking the
> moment *she's* not exactly like you want.
> 
> Now I'll play devil's advocate and say that my little "walk away"
> didn't work.  Do you think I care?  Hell no, and I'll tell you why: the
> one who chases to gets, will always have to chase to have.  So whoever
> would win with the woman, would have to keep providing whatever they
> did to keep her interested.  I, on the other hand, only need to use a
> little charm and then walk away to have her wanting me.
> 
> I ask you, who do you think has an easier time of it?
> 
> -- 
> If you don't know in the first twenty minutes whether or not you're going
to
> have sex with the woman you just met, and whether or not you even want
to,
> you're not a seductionist.
> 
>   'o o'
> Svengali
>

Taking control when things go wrong

Maniac High — Thu, 20 May 2010 12:22:49 +0000

Buy Reductil No Prescription, From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Mystery and others write about successful openers.

Status: O

talk about esp and its impossibility

talk about how you met a bear while hiking

talk about how you were scared shitless rock climbing when your rope snapped

or talk about the famous person you met

does she believe in ghosts. why, Buy Reductil No Prescription.

or hotseat (like question game but more brutal)

talk about the time you bladed down a steep hill and survived. Buy Reductil No Prescription, talk about the time you were on stage

...

mystery

-----

From nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org Wed Apr 12 07:31:37 2000
From: nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org (Nathan SZILARD)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: After the # close

They find it very funny and show it to their friends, plus
they remember, Buy Reductil No Prescription.

| If you did any anchoring on your voice when you met, order Reductil, Buy Reductil without a prescription, now's the time to
| unleash them.

----

From slidewguy@remove-aol.com Wed Apr 12 07:47:28 2000
From: "whoisthis19"
Subject: Some closes
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast

Any of you guys got ways of getting chicks to leave with you outside
the club.

greg1

Did you sleep with yourself or... did you turn yourself down because
you was too easy.

Maniac High's Pick Up Girls Guide and Seduction Website! » mystery

Maniac High — Thu, 20 May 2010 12:22:49 +0000

Buy Reductil No Prescription, From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Mystery and others write about successful openers.

Status: O

talk about esp and its impossibility

talk about how you met a bear while hiking

talk about how you were scared shitless rock climbing when your rope snapped

or talk about the famous person you met

does she believe in ghosts. why, Buy Reductil No Prescription.

or hotseat (like question game but more brutal)

talk about the time you bladed down a steep hill and survived. Buy Reductil No Prescription, talk about the time you were on stage

...

mystery

-----

From nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org Wed Apr 12 07:31:37 2000
From: nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org (Nathan SZILARD)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: After the # close

They find it very funny and show it to their friends, plus
they remember, Buy Reductil No Prescription.

| If you did any anchoring on your voice when you met, order Reductil, Buy Reductil without a prescription, now's the time to
| unleash them.

----

From slidewguy@remove-aol.com Wed Apr 12 07:47:28 2000
From: "whoisthis19"
Subject: Some closes
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast

Any of you guys got ways of getting chicks to leave with you outside
the club.

greg1

Did you sleep with yourself or... did you turn yourself down because
you was too easy.

Doing Successful Openers

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Mystery and others write about successful openers!



From: "Mystery" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast,Alt.psychology.nlp,alt.hypnosis
References: <37602334.55753831@bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Chat suggestions
Date: Wed, 16 Jun 1999 04:58:12 -0700
Lines: 63
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts7-36t-14.idirect.com
Message-ID: <37676655@nemo.idirect.com>
X-Trace: 16 Jun 1999 04:54:45 -0400, ts7-36t-14.idirect.com
Organization: via Internet Direct

Status: O

talk about esp and its impossibility

talk about how you met a bear while hiking

talk about how you were scared shitless rock climbing when your rope snapped

or the time you visited your friends friend with him and your buddy was
almost beaten to death when the friend he visited had a boyfriend who came
out and there was a 20 minute car chase through lights and you were looking
for the cops but lot the crazed boyfriend before you found cops.

or the time you were in the hospital and it changed the way food tastes.
the birds sound clearer now.

or the time you netbused (hacked) into a bank but chickened out and put the
money into a charity

or talk about the famous person you met

does she believe in ghosts?  why?

you like candles and incense.  what does SHE like?  the music game modified
for all types of objects.

play the question game with her

or hotseat (like question game but more brutal)

talk about the time you bladed down a steep hill and survived.

talk about the time you were on stage

...

mystery



-----


From nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org Wed Apr 12 07:31:37 2000
From: nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org (Nathan SZILARD)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: After the # close

On Mon, 03 Apr 2000 21:26:22 GMT, Rio  wrote:
| I was reading elsewhere on a post, that if you instruct her to sound
| cheerful on the phone when you call when you do a # close.

I tried that, it's not a magic bullet. But it's fun.

I now always write some shit along with my phone #:
something like "DO NOT FALL IN LOVE" or "NO STALKING PLEASE".

They find it very funny and show it to their friends, plus
they remember.

| If you did any anchoring on your voice when you met, now's the time to
| unleash them.



----

From slidewguy@remove-aol.com Wed Apr 12 07:47:28 2000
From: "whoisthis19" 
Subject: Some closes
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast

Hand her the slip of paper and pen and have her write down her number.
When she's hands it back, ask her to put it someplace so you will
remeber to call her.  Last time I did this she put it down my pants and
grabbed my cock.  

Ask a gal to trade shirts.  When she balks, keep pressing in a joking
manner then finally ask to her to go outside to trade shirts.  Nothing
better then getting her outside.

Another one is simply saying its too smokey, noisy, smelly in here. 
Lets go outsde for some air.

Any of you guys got ways of getting chicks to leave with you outside
the club?

greg1

Did you sleep with yourself or... did you turn yourself down because
 you was too easy.

A conversation with Mystery! Pickups

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


A conversation with Mystery!

Tips on fieldwork from a pick up artist! on IRC #PUA!


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A Conversation with Mystery, a Pick-up Artist (PUA)

Topics Include: 

The Kiss Close
Clubbing alone
Handling guys
Being a story-teller
Preparation and format
Quality vs. quantity

Lego: Hey Mystery, what's your favorite story to close with?  How 
exactly do you transition from the telling of a story to closing?

Mystery: "The Kiss Close" is my favorite routine.  Once you have three 
indicators of interest (she touches you, laughs consistantly at your 
jokes, leans in towards you, smiles a lot and keeps eye contact, resumes 
chat when you force silence, etc) you then phase shift.  You turn 180 
degrees on a dime.  Go from humorous and non-sexual to saying, "Stop.  
Would you like to kiss me?", right out of the blue.  She will say either 
say, "Uh - no",(which is unlikely as you don't bother performing "The 
Kiss Close" until enough indicators are present) or, "I donno" (they 
rarely say, "Yes"). "I donno" means she actually does want to but feels 
embarrassed on how to say "Yes".  So you reply, "Lets find out", then go 
in slowly and kiss her.  It's very simple and very effective.  If she 
says, "Why?", this is also a yes.  Simply reply, "It looked like you had 
something on your mind.  Would you like to kiss me?"  Wait again for 
her response.  If her response is "No" then reply, "Hey I didn't say you 
COULD.  You just had that look in your eye."

Lego: What do you do if you're interrupted? You're telling your target 
a story and she is all into it but some AFC cock-blocking idiot just 
runs up and starts screaming and yelling and you're like, "What the 
fuck?"

Mystery: Simply ask him if you can borrow his pen.  When he gives it to 
you, throw it away as you say, "Fetch."

Wakeboarder: Hahaha.  Nice!

Lego: What if he's bigger than you?

Mystery: I'd instead call him on his disruptive shit and remark, "Dude, 
what are you attempting here?"  Not good enough?  Then say, "Ladies?  
Shall we discover what adventure awaits us in another room?"

Wakeboarder: Man, none of my buds want to go to the club.

Gamer: Screw them then.

Mystery: Go alone.

Wakeboarder: I need to be made fun of for this comment but I feel like 
a weiner if I go to a club myself

Lego: Bro, your trippin'. I go solo many times. It's good actually.  
It's weird if it's a first night but if I've been there before it's cool.

Mystery: Yeah, I understand ... and yet, staying home alone will make 
you feel so much better?  Go out alone, meet some cool dudes when you 
get there (they will become your wingmen there) and then run around 
getting #'s.  Report to your fellow PUAs what happened.  Whatever happened 
to the concept, "The alphamale gets all the women?"  Shit dude, what are 
you, a mommas boy?  Do you need your hand held?  

Lego: How do you strike up conversations with guys?

Mystery: Walk up and say, "Hey dude, question for ya.  Do you know 
where a good place to score is in this city? 'Cause this place looks like a 
cock farm."

Lego: Good!  You should be able to relate to guys to disarm them.  You 
don't compete; you ELIMINATE COMPETETION.

Gamer: LOL.  Dude, the only results I've had were solo.  My friends 
psych me out too much because they never help.  Instead they just complain 
about my taking too much time.  They laugh at me or just generally piss 
me off.

Mystery: I have MUCH better results (and MUCH more fun) playing "The 
Game" alone.  It forces you to approach.  It's a great motivator.

Lego: Damn! I couldn't have put it better myself.

Gamer: Yep.

Mystery: You wont be alone for more than five minutes once you approach 
your first set anyways.  Gamer, I suggest you call them on their shit 
at some point.  Demonstrate your alphamale characteristics.

Lego: How do you continue talking?  I mean, group set dynamics are much 
different in a one one on one approach.

Mystery: Be a story-teller - THAT is the skill of the PUA.  It isn't 
SEDUCING; it's STORY-TELLING.  It is my personal belief that SS patterns 
arent as 'hypnotic' as they are 'entertaining' stories.

Wakeboarder: Sweet

Lego: Actually with the story stuff I SEE WHAT YOU MEAN.  They just 
follow that lead.

Wakeboarder: Well, I need to stop being a sackless wonder and grow some 
fuckin' balls then!  Hmm, story telling ...

Mystery: Here's an example.  "Ever been camping?  Well I was up in a 
forest up north and was hiking with some girlfriends of mine ... and we 
came along some trail and there was shit on the path.  My friends were 
like, "haaaa someone shit in the woods" and I said, "lets get the fuck 
out of here like NOW."  they thought I was just scared of shit and I 
said, "Girls, you dont get it.  This shit is still warm and its not human.  
Its bear shit.  This is a big fucking bear.  Look at the size of that 
turd."  Notice it's not sexual?  Most hot girls gets get "sex-talk" 
right away from AFCs.  NOT talking sex with them makes them question 
whether you are interested in them.  Leave them guessing until you get 
indicators of interest from them.  If they like your great personality 
(confident, humorous, etc) they will give you subtle but distinct clues.

Gamer: How do you flow from story to story?

Mystery: If there is ONE mental state you should force yourself into, 
its TALKATIVE.  Talk your fucking HEAD off.  Just go from one story 
straight into another one like a comedian does.  Ever find yourself excited 
about something and you talk and talk and talk?  THAT is what must 
happen to get a girl.  You have to ENTERTAIN them.  Look talkative yet not 
desperate.  

Gamer: Heh.

Lego: Dude, I had that going last night. You're so right.  That's an 
excellent example dude.  I was telling this story about getting harassed 
by cops or some shit.  It's a cool story but my delivery sucked and I 
was losing one of the two girls I was telling it to.  What if they fail 
to elaborate on your story?  Besides it being a bad story to begin 
with, how can you fix it on the fly?

Mystery: They don't have to interact with it.  Its a good thing to have 
flexible stories to allow for some comment but it's not nessessary.  
It's YOUR job to perform the material.  It's your audiences job to 
listen,laugh and generally be entertained.  That's it.  At the end of 10 
minutes you will see the girls digging you (positive indicators).  You then 
phase shift abruptly into the close.

Lego: HOW DO YOU PHASE SHIFT?  I've been wondering this. While I didn't 
come off as obvious in last nights case and just told her to kiss me (I 
knew she would anyway), this could have been smoother.

Alpha: Lego, you ad libbed the close?  So working on ad libbing is 
good?

Mystery: Ad libbed material is not as accurate in closing as is 
performing the well constructed and field-tested "Kiss Close" routine.  Ad 
libbing is BONUS material but don't COUNT on it.  Have your material, like 
a good comedian, prepared before performing.  This isn't "A Night at 
the Improv" fellas.

Gamer: Heh.

Mystery: All PUs have a format; a beginning, a middle and an end.  If 
you don't know what the next routine is going to be then you may end up 
with an unfortunate pregnant pause which fucks up your pacing.  You may 
end up filling the silence with the deadly, "So ... um ... what do you 
do?"  Preparation saves face.  Afterall, with your particular close, 
she could have pulled away from your trying to kiss her.  Then what?!!  
Instead, consider engaging her in enthusiastic conversation, then go 
directly into the close.  In other words, stop her in mid-sentence and 
with a curious tone, kiss close.

Wakeboarder: cool.  Lego, what indicators clued you in that she wanted 
the kiss?

Alpha: In what way can you be prepared?  If we're talking about 
story-telling in front of a random girl we just met seconds ago in a random 
place ...

Mystery: Like a good comedian, have your material prepared yet when 
onstage be prepared to dynamically omit certain routines and to add others 
on the fly.  Sometimes certain routines fit the situation better than 
others.  Have 3 to 5 alternative openers (as a comedian would) and enjoy 
performing the one you think best fits the situation will get the best 
reaction for the group you are in front of

Alpha: Gotcha now.  Can you give me a brief example of how you go about 
preparing?

Mystery: Sure.  First, find 3 openers and memorize them.  Write down a 
list of openers (just the headings of each opener to remind you).  
Next, write down some routines (the question game, the music game, the 
photo routine, the bear in the woods story, etc - all on dejanews) and then 
also memorize the kiss close and the # close.  Memorize 3 NEGs too and 
you are good to go.  With the material in your mind, you are prepared 
to work it in the field until you have the timing of the material down 
(again, just like a comedian.)

Alpha: Man, you provide some really eye-opening ideas... (just when I'm 
about to think there's nothing more to learn.

Wakeboarder: So what you're saying is have a routine set up and modify 
it to each situation? Kind of like having a PU template?

Mystery: It's ALL about format.  Know the format and stick to it.  If 
you now what the next step is in the PU, you wont feel scared.  It gets 
fun and you begin to appreciate the strategy behind it all.

Wakeboarder: Yeah like FMAC? That's a simple format.

Mystery: Yes, FMAC.  Each letter in FMAC is an abrupt phase shift.  
"FIND" means having to abruptly disturb your complacency by getting out of 
the house.  It takes effort for many people to do bother getting THIS 
FAR.  "MEET" is a HUGE abrupt change.  "There she is!  3, 2, 1, GO!"  In 
the "ATTRACT" phase, you need to go from the walk up to the TALKATIVE 
performer entertaining story-teller.  You will need A LOT of energy for 
this (enthusiasm is contagious afterall) and for many to go from 
slumping around to being in performer mode is ABRUPT.  Finally you must then 
"CLOSE"; to phase shift from humour to serious is also abrupt.  Each 
phase may FEEL awkward but it looks normal.  When a comedian finishes one 
topic and just goes into an entirely new unrelated topic, the audience 
doesn't care as long as the next topic is entertaining.

Wakeboarder: Very true.

Gamer: Cool.  I'm collecting openers and other routines off the 
layguide right now.

Alpha: Do you believe in the 80/20 'rule'?  Meaning, 80% of the quality 
women are found in 20% of the right places or connections or 
situations.

Mystery: The quality of a woman is SO subjective. Quality is difficult 
to QUANTIFY.  80% of QUALITY?  It's pointless trying to mix and match 
these concepts. INSTEAD consider that there are HOTTIES and UGs (YOU get 
to decide based on your personal criteria) and of the HOTTIES, some 
have pleasant personalities and others do not.  You cannot possibly judge 
her personality until she LIKES you.  So go out ... FIND her, MEET her, 
ATTRACT her and THEN decide if you want to CLOSE her AFTER judging her 
personality.  Judging her by the way she treats you on your approach is 
lame because particularly beautiful women all have their bitch shields 
up and running.  They have to.  They aren't planning on fucking every 
guy that says Hi to them.  The only way to get rid of the guys is to 
oftentimes offend them quickly.  It's not personal.  It's merely a learned 
strategy.  So is the "I have a boyfriend excuse, but that's a different 
story.  I also suggest CLOSING everyone just for the education.  You 
don't actually have to CALL the girls of course.  You simply get to 
practice CLOSING too.  Getting a girls number is merely an OPTION.  You 
don't have to follow up on ALL of them you know.

Keen: Heh.

Wakeboarder: Cool, judging the girls only after you have attracted 
them.  Kind of makes you approach too!  You can't say the bull shit line, 
"She's not my type, I can tell", to get you out of approaching.

Alpha: Do you have a web page?

Mystery: No, not currently.  I'm writing a book though called The 
Mystery Method.  Most of my ramblings can be found on the layguide. 

Ascence: Hey, is it true that the older we get the more money/social 
status becomes and issue?

Mystery: No matter what social status you have (or THINK you have), 
it's still something you must convey in the first 25 minutes of meeting 
her.  We ALL start equal BEFORE meeting her; all men.  The issue is, can 
we congruently convey our social status (real or not) in our 
performance?  That's OUR responsibility.  The best way is not to TELL them about 
it but rather to DEMONSTRATE it.  How?  Well, if you talk about having 
girls always falling for you for instance, it's not NEARLY as good as 
actually having a couple hot girls with you saying what a hottie you are 
infront of the target.  This is called PAWNING.

Keen: I'm going to try doing the story-telling that you talked about.  
It's really hard though. I'm a real bad storyteller.  I've been working 
on it today. that's my lesson today.

Wakeboarder: Tell them about that time you saw a fallen over manequin 
in the department store and you tripped over it.  The security guard 
thought you were trying to make it with the manequin and called you a 
little freak.

Gamer: LOL (Laughing Out Loud).

Wakeboarder: One more question for you Mystery.  What's the meaning of 
life?

Mystery: To fuck. :)

Statement of Intent (SOI)

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Rio introduces a key part of PU: the 'Statement of Intent' (SOI)!

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2000 09:00:50 GMT
Subject: Find Stun Drag Fuck

G'day,

Jonathan Ashton  wrote in message
news:90eati$gpt@nnrp1.deja.com...
> As I've read the twelve-odd messages in this thread, I've been looking
> for something to take home with me, but I'm not finding it.
>
> Rio, how do you do things differently now, based on what you've said?

First thing would be to think about the close. Mystery knows his group work
perfect from how I read it, and I have been using his methods to great
success social-proof wise.

The BIG thing that clocked in my head was the need to STATE YOUR INTENTIONS
to the chick within the first minute of meeting her. I will make that my
rule from now on - as with the 3 second rule.
By this I DON'T mean "Let's fuck" or "Come to Papa baby" or any throw-away
shit like that. It has to be an honest assessment of what YOU feel capable
of doing to the chick after the "Hi" and the first round of fluff/routine
(routine preferred - something humourous). GM does this part BEAUTIFULLY,
because he does it with a sense of fun and humour - and HE KNOWS he is going
to do what he says and so does SHE!
I notice Mr. Sex states this a lot in his past posts - where AFC or shit
PUAs do approaches and talk to the chick, but never get to the point AND the
bitch can tell that the guys want to fuck but are too pussy to go for it.
Ross says something to the tune of "And maybe we could really get to like
each other" when he closes in HTGTWYDIB. I also recall that TokyoPUA did a
statement of intentions on that chick he PUed at night once who was
initially scared of him. Johnny Shack does it by when he just springs dates
on women he just met.
So there's some cross references.

The proper methodological way to get to a statement of intentions part is by
pace and lead. But the point of the matter is, you have to structure the
conversation to show interest and intent VERY soon or you will stall, chick
will get bored, feel teased, and then it's C&B time. Believe me, a LOT of
C&B experience with a LOT of HOT chicks has so far has taught me this
painful lesson.
The best way to put it is in the most honest way possible. I cannot give you
a specific example. But the idea is to get her thinking romantically about
you VERY soon. THEN you HAVE TO DO WHAT YOU SAID you would do to the chick
after DDB. (E.g. If you want to start things off gently by holding her hand,
tell her a scene where want to be holding her hand - and then do it in the
next routine after she is comfortable with this.) If you do NOT DO what you
say you will, eventually your congruence will fuck up when the chick loses
patience. Then the chick will be confused, get scared, and bolt. If this
ever happens and the guy tries to do heavy kino or try for a fuck while the
chick is in this state - It's gonna be RAPE.

In fact, on the matter of Rape. I read in Cosmo (Hey, My chick gets fucked
often and STILL reads this!) that psychologists WARN women against guys that
say "Come to my place to see my pictures" etc. when the idea is to fuck the
chick whilst your intentions aren't known to her - because it is DATE RAPE.
Thus as Maniac found out ages ago, that GROUNDWORK is the key element to
getting the chick over to fuck. That can be done through STATEMENT OF
INTENTIONS - and may not necessarily happen through Kiss closes.
You must remember this - a kiss is just a kiss........

IF that works, THEN we can reward her with more conversation and more
Mystery style routines or whatever (because she is OK with our intentions
then - thus the rewards), and THEN up the ante some more with our STATEMENT
OF INTENTIONS, building on what we established before - to get her more hot
and horny than before. So you may have started on holding her hands, now you
may progress on to hugging, kissing, fucking etc. whatever seems to be the
most logical progression from her actions towards you.

Patterns, routines, psych tests, will help greatly during the chat routines
in-between statements of intentions. Those are what set us apart from the
other PUAs out there.

Eventually we get to a point where the chick is DDB, then we can get to the
Drag (you must take the woman to fuck location, or have her so into you that
she will come to you) and Fuck part (in our world of course). The Our World
routine would then be the ULTIMATE in the STATEMENT OF INTENTIONS series
which would then lead to the deal fuck closed. It is in this one that you
state your relationship expectations and put it in "Our World"

Now the method is Find, Stun, Drag, Fuck.

The point is - FUCK all this bullshit about the woman needs to be done in
the "right way" to match her values. Something tells me now that a woman
made this comment as an attempt to rationalize her unreasonable emotions.
The values she wants ALL ALONG is #1 SEX, and to a lesser extent #2 to be
taken care of after SEX. That goes for ANY woman (thus the universality of
the whole principle). When the guy comes along as does her, she will
rationalise that the guy understood exactly what she felt. That's what some
religious women mean when they beautifully say "God knew when it was the
right time for me". In reality, they KNOW DEEP DOWN they are at the mercy of
guys and what they want to do with her. To her, that is "destiny" and no
wonder so many women are suckers for fortune-telling and the like.

Eliciting is when you want to # close or coffee close and check the girl out
for relationship potential. If it's ONS - hey! ya don't need it! If you
cannot attempt a kiss to fuck close in the given situation - you will have
to # close, but not forget to state that your intentions could well get
beyond just coffee!

The other thing - "Make no excuses for desires as a man" is THE SINGLE MOST
IMPORTANT THING (As Ross Jeffries has already said) but I had to experience
it myself to believe it. ALL of what I explained above IS USELESS in
practical application if you are trying to follow it like a script. The idea
is to GRAB that girl and NOT let her get away! ;) So guys, HOW MUCH DO YOU
WANT THAT GIRL? WHAT ARE YOU PREPARED TO DO?

Also on that note. BE A FUCKING MAN. Act like a guy, and don't think that
mirroring a girl completely is going to make you attractive to her. I know
from experience that the more caveman I go with chicks who KNOW my
intentions, the more they respond sexually.
Talk to chicks as if you were telling your kid brother how to play football
properly, cause your kid brother happens to be shit at football. I
especially like the way Mr. Sex talks to us on ASF - giving pointers and
what-not. I'm sure he talks to chicks exactly the same way IRL - showing
congruence all along.

You can even get around the language barrier! I just about dragged a sexy
Jgirl in a bikini off the beach while babbling to them in English! A
language they didn't even understand! I did that enough and with a smile,
that the chick went DDB and ready to GO when I took her hand. Had it not
been for the cockblock!
Somebody must have taught the "Iranian from hell" this shit!

The way I think about it is much like caveman sex. You see the hot chick,
you bang her on the head with your club, you take her to your cave, you root
her. Thus :- Find Stun Drag Fuck.
Just a bit more aggressive than Find Meet Attract Close, but that's the best
way I could describe what this ugly-as-fuck PUA was doing.

These were the attitudes that I had when I was only just starting to pull
women at incredible speeds while on holiday.

The other point is on Objection handling in regards to the STATEMENT OF
INTENTIONS. What I learned from the PUA I met, is that you fight chick
bullshit with your own bullshit - with a slightly authoritive tone (no need
to REALLY get pissed).
For example :- The chicks said "We have to get to our car" and were ready to
leave
The Playboy said "You can't leave anyway because the gates are closed" even
though the gates aren't closed.
Thus this covers handling chick bullshit - on the phone as well as in real
life.
And one chick on another seduction board I read often typed something to the
tune that she wants to be with a guy that can bullshit his way into her
pants.

So there you go. Find Stun Drag Fuck.
Stun is the hardest.

> There are reasons why most of us step through seduction so gingerly.
> We know that saying or doing one wrong thing can blow up the seduction.
> As far as I can tell, letting her know you intend to fuck her before
> you fuck her is one of those things.  Another reason is that women
> won't tell you when they're ready to fuck.

But DDB does tell all!
That single most common fuckup is what is called LACK OF CONGRUENCE
(definition courtesy of Mr. Sex). Just like when I called that chick I met
yesterday "my friend" in front of her. Doing that is a sign of weakness.
Chicks can get away with having words out of congruence with their actions,
but guys CANNOT.

> You say that when you "lead girls on" and tease them too much, you look
> easy and they hate you.  But this insight doesn't make it any easier to
> recognize when you're "leading them on".  The window between when a
> woman is receptive to a close and when you've stalled her is short, and
> spotting it seems to be harder than superstring theory.  The answer
> seems to be to make hundreds of approaches, and very slowly improve
> through experience.

Well you have body language and other subtle pointers. Plus we are adding
all the time to our STATEMENT OF INTENTIONS in order to find a barrier and
cut off point. I don't doubt that noticing DDB when you have the intuition
becomes easier.

  The one concrete thing I get out of your post is
> that next time two HBs want a foursome with you and your LTR, you'll be
> more likely to recognize it.  Or maybe the situation will be different
> enough that you won't.

I fucked that up because I KNOW those chicks wanted me to go with them, and
I over-teased them and didn't capitulate and then state my intentions to
have a foursome. They would have been up for it!
That's when the Playboy showed up to show me the shit, and then beat me
hands-down in a round of THE GAME. ;)

> You also said, "Now I realise more than fucking EVER what a chick
> wants. She wants a guy to go and GET her, make her feel wanted, and
> then have the shit fucked out of her!"  But you agreed with another
> poster that you can't just walk up to a woman and say "Let's fuck."
> So what's your new insight here?

It's a no-brainer. Is sex ALL you bringing to the table? That's why he
coupled GM styled intention pointers further into the seduction (after the
earlier G-rated ones), and then when they succeeded in not objecting, he
went to Mystery routines as a reward OR to the Drag phase if they were DDB.
You cannot start the seduction with a statement of intention that skips the
buildup - unless the chick is THAT FUCKING HORNY and shameless.
Chicks want to know that you care about them as human beings and not just
sex objects. Thus neutral conversation gets smattered in between, and the
final statement of intentions clearly shows what his intentions are so SHE
KNOWS that you care about her feelings - in that way.

The Playboy I met even went to see a chick he had a threesome with the next
day (cause she was feeling a bit alone). This guy was no cheap "Player"
(which he pointed out in his great Our world styled close routine on this
9). You could tell he cared enough too.

> Have you figure out a better way to know when a woman is ready to
> be closed?  Or a faster way to get her to want to fuck?  Or a way to
> let her know your intentions without scaring her off?  What's the
> difference between your approach now and your approach before you went
> to Guam?  It sounds like you feel you understand things better than
> you did before, but I can't figure out what the new understanding is.

Well, now you have your answer.
Mind you, I'm only getting the framework now that I sit down and try and
explain what I am now doing. This shit became automatic when I had the whole
experience of witnessing this guy and learning from him.

Any questions or comments? Fire away....

Rio
-------

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
References:  <90eati$gpt@nnrp1.deja.com> <63JW5.205t1.56373@nnrp.gol.com> <90i82p$iao@nnrp1.deja.com>
Subject: Re: Find Stun Drag Fuck

Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2000 10:04:46 GMT

Jonathan Ashton  wrote in message
news:90i82p$iao@nnrp1.deja.com...
> In article <63JW5.205t1.56373@nnrp.gol.com>,
>   "Rio"  wrote:
> > Well, now you have your answer.
>
> Yeah, I understand much better now.  Thanks for writing it down.
>
> > Any questions or comments? Fire away....
>
> So I get the abstract idea now:  Make some sort of Statement Of
> Intentions (SOI) to a woman relatively early, and then act congruently
> with it.

More or less, that's it.
The thing is, after dropping routines - get to it or the chick gets confused
and drops out.
Mystery had the right idea with his routines and intros. BUT if you fail to
State your intentions - you can stall things and stale her out. Then it will
be your fault when it appears that the routines don't work! They may have
worked, but she has given up on you as a partner already. You teased too
much.

> Like most people, though, I don't really understand any abstract idea
> until I've seen two or three concrete examples; i.e. HOW to make that
> SOI.

Ross Jeffries has already covered how to do this with his NLP pacing and
leading. I'm just giving a name to the end result of doing that (SOI -
Statement of Intention).

SOIs are SO important to women. They want to know where they stand. Women
you are with and haven't SOIed will think to themselves :- "What am I to
him"?
With my LTR which I sloppily SOIed, she annoyed me for ages if I was her
boyfriend or not. I hadn't said, and was therefore walking thin ice.
That drove her NUTS.

Now, I guess I could show you some fake examples of stuff that you could
launch into your PU - but the reason why I'm not going to do that is because
if ANYBODY creates a list of them - we're going to get the problem that AFC
men ALREADY have with PU Lines. That is, throwing meaningless words into a
conversation and then not being able to back them up.
Either that, or we will develop a single street pickup routine which men
will use the world over with great success before women cotton on to it.
When it comes to SOI, DIY (damn all these acronymns!).

An example of SOI is what I said to the chick I tried to PU on the weekend.
I paced it to the point where we are talking about where we lived, and I
found out that she lived close. Then I said "That's good, so we can get
together really easy and have some fun then."
If she had been far away - no problem "That's too bad. I'll have to travel
far to get together with you and have fun"
If she lives on Mars - no problem "Wow! You live out there! I'll have to
build a rocket to come and see you after you go back there!"

So there you go. Who needs to be excessively GM?

> You gave the example of GM style.  Yep, GM makes a pretty clear SOI.
> I don't think a "recovering nice guy" like me could do GM congruently,
> though.

I have done it once successfully and it Suuure works. But yes, it's hard to
work things up to that because you skip a lot of buildup steps. The flirting
has to take place in a sexual level rather than a much safer level. That is
risky.
That's what I mean when by saying "Let's Fuck" you run the risk of having to
flirt at such a high level where you can fuck up easily. Not that it's
impossible of course.
NEGs (which I forgot to mention before) help especially in the
objection,flirt phase. This phase is like the part where the dog chases
after the bitch to try and fuck her, and the bitch keeps running. The thrill
of the chase!

> You mention TokyoPUA and Johnny Shack references, but it would take
> a lot of searching/guessing to find the specific examples you have in
> mind.  And I don't understand your Ross example - "And maybe we could
> really get to like each other" sounds like a pretty vague SOI; maybe
> I'd understand what you mean if I knew the context?

Search for stuff on the archived layguide for stuff about Johnny Shack. He
also has an online book. Ross has his old free book around the place. Search
Formhandle for TokyoPUA's posts.
By the way, I even went as far as reading ALL of Mystery's decent posts as
well.

> The only example of an SOI I see in your posts is this one from Guam
> PUA:
>
> > As for going for the fuck close? Forget your sexual accelerators.
> > This guy said the whole shit in plain English - and I saw him say
> > this all to to a chick. He basically said that he was a playboy, but
> > not a pickup artist (to frame the idea that he won't fuck and dump),
> > and that when he had sex with the chick (Framing it as if it's going
> > to happen) that she should just enjoy it for fun and not worry about
> > it too much because it's just their private thing (our world style
> > routine), and that he was not an easy guy in reality - that he was
> > quite selective in who he chooses for sex (so he doesn't look like a
> > meat-market man).
> > He said all this straight faced to a chick, and while I was watching
> > the chick he did this on - she was trancing out and playing with her
> > hair. It was totally evil.
>
> So my questions...
>
> Have you ever done a SOI to kiss a girl and not had her object?  If so,
> what did you say?  Have you ever done a SOI to fuck a girl and not had
> her object?  If so, what did you say?  Hell, do you remember the exact
> words of any SOI you've ever said?

I gave you an example above of an SOI above (where I told the chick that we
would hang out in the future). No doubt we can refine the whole shit a lot
better in the future.
And yes. I think everyone at some stage has done an SOI, or the body
language has been good enough to get her into that zone where she KNOWS
maybe at 70% where your intentions are, with or without any routines to help
snag the chick, and the chick has put up some token resistance. The purpose
of the resistance of course, is to set the scene for the chase you know will
end in a fuck if you can just reel the bitch in. You will eventually do it
as long as you have remained congruent throughout.

> What other kinds of SOIs would you use in the buildup?  Tell her you're
> going to give her a neck massage?  (I'm sure that question sounds
> clueless; but I really think the meat is in the details.)

Well pace it:-
"Have you ever felt like having a neck massage? I think you need one, so
I'll give you one"
Sometimes the more direct your SOIs are, the harder she will force you to
keep pushing them.
So let's say the chick flirts and says "Why do you want to? I don't need
one!"
So we have to SOI her again in the second sentence in this example :- "Well
you haven't had one of my massages that can make you feel good all over. Now
relax....."

The idea is to trap the chick at all costs with your intentions that you can
carry out - until she can't get away.
Even "No I can't!" "Yes you can!" "No I can't!" "Yes you can!" fights - if
that's what it comes down to - can win you the day if you persist and not
let her win! Verbal arguments can always be solved with kino - cause you as
the guy are STRONGER. I don't mean hit her, but mauling is OK as long as she
is enjoying it! ;)

Persistance is VERY important. Of course, you may want to dump the chick
after the fuck if she doesn't drop the shit because she is too much work to
obtain sex from in the long run. Just give her an ultimatum "Cut the shit or
you will be lonely!"

At the same time, you can get trapped if you say an SOI that you can't
possibly keep. So watch what you promise to do!
Saying shit like "I'm going to buy you a Rolls Royce!" when she KNOWS you
can't afford it is an extreme example of a shit SOI. There goes your trust
and congruency with that one.

> And as for one other comment you made:
>
> > (E.g. If you want to start things off gently by holding her hand,
> > tell her a scene where want to be holding her hand - and then do it
> > in the next routine after she is comfortable with this.)
>
> You mean you tell her a story about some guy you know who held some
> girl's hand?  Or what?  Methinks I really don't understand here.

You can do that to get her thinking about holding someone's hand - and once
she is feeling it, you may be able to slip in the kino and get away with it.
At least, your chances will be better.

> > Is sex ALL you bringing to the table? That's why he
> > coupled GM styled intention pointers further into the seduction
> > (after the earlier G-rated ones), and then when they succeeded in
> > not objecting, he went to Mystery routines as a reward OR to the
> > Drag phase if they were DDB.
>
> I would LOVE to see these SOIs written down.

Done as above. But make your own!
I re-explained the "Let's Fuck" problem a bit better above as well.

> So here's my deal:  I want to see more examples of SOIs so I can take
> them apart, because I really suspect that the exact wording is crucial.
>
> For example:
>
> GM gets away with his SOIs because they're exaggerated to absurdity,
> and thus they're both funny and unlikely (at least as stated).
> This puts a little distance between the SOI and the girl, so she
> doesn't slap him.

I think it's more of a case of the GM SOIs that fail, he can write them off
as being jokes. That keeps him on track and congruent.
BUT the risk of failure is very high if he doesn't cover his tracks.

> Guam PUA gets away with his SOI (quoted above) because he's talking
> about chicks in general, and not overtly about the particular chick.
> This puts a little distance between the SOI and the girl, so she's
> not pressured to make a decision right then.

This is the all important point. With some SOIs (and especially with
ambiguities in NLP) the SOIs are not in your face, BUT they are vague enough
to get the point across and then judge for a positive reaction from her or
not. However, the vagueness is simply a shot from 50 metres as opposed to a
shot from point-blank. Just make sure you hit the target.
The danger with point-blank SOIs is they are risky in so far as if you say a
dumb one you can't,won't, or don't want to carry out like "I'm going to take
you on holiday!" as opposed to an NLP shot from 50 metres which describes a
holiday and builds on it. "Have you ever been on holiday with someone
special?....."

> Am I on the right track here?  Are there other ways to word SOIs that
> get around direct resistance?  More examples would be appreciated.

You should check out patterning, but remember, a shot from point-blank is
better than 50 metres. The shortest distance between 2 points is a straight
line. There are pros and cons of both styles of course.
You can take the short path across the dangerous ravine, or the long path
around it.

> I gotta say, this whole idea of SOIs is new to me.  Maybe other PUAs
> in this group have been using them without ever realizing/stating the
> importance of them?

I just gave a name to it. People have done this stuff before and I'm just
giving it a name to help explain what I'm doing.

And no, Ray can't trademark this either and claim it's his. We have
discussed why this is enough on ASF. He's filtered anyway and I can't see
his verbal shit.

> Thanks,
> Ash

Thanks for the questions. They help challenge me in trying to explain myself
better.

Rio

-------

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Clearing SOI's up
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 12:15:23 GMT

Maniac,

I came up with the SOI concept after studying what the Guam Playboy did to
chicks. I wish I could have spent longer down there to learn more off this
guy. Oh well, I just need to save up to go again.

SOI (Statements of intention/interest) were comments that the Guam Playboy
made a lot (I assume you read my report on that place - It's nanpa
paradise!). What he did then was control the flirting that followed after
baiting her with a show of interest. He did this by offering a challenge -
when he finished doing that once he went back to fun routines, talking about
parties on the island, jokes, sex personality tests, etc. before he did
another SOI - staring out as indirect and ambiguous, before being VERY
direct. ;)

Basically what I think I have come up with, through trying to explain to the
posters that asked me about him, is a flirting construction kit.

The Guam Playboy NEGged a LOT - and he got away with it every time. He could
even tell chicks AFC things like they were beautiful, and then turn it into
a NEG if he wanted. That's what over 20 years of daily PU did for this guy.

But the NEG is only one kind of flirting (used for dumping a girl's uptight
self image). There are other kinds, such as using ambiguities, physical
light-handed slapping and pushing kino, playing tricks on people, etc. The
Playboy used plenty of variations.

Flirting is this:- One drops the SOI, and then pulls it away out of reach of
the target. Then gives another SOI, and then pulls it away again. Like with
our words, we put images of sex and romance in their heads, then pull it out
again, then out it in, then take it out, then put it back in, then take it
out again........ Mindfucking!
Once the chick is confused and teased enough, she is DDB and safely
mindfucked.

I did a PU once on a chick using the SOIs. I found out where she lived and
then said "Oh that's not far from my place, so I can come down to see you.
It's a pity I am so busy it won't happen today"
(Note that there is a bit of future pacing and presuppositioning in this)
She lapped it up and took my kino from there - despite the BF being a matter
of metres away.

The structure for the Guam Playboy routine went like this:-

- Fun routine or opener (ala Mystery) - some basic fluff - all good things
about himself, what he could do for the women (he played the helpful tour
guide). Be "Disgustingly" Charming! as he put it. The guy wasn't big on
logically drawing out routines for what he did (which is a good thing), he
just went and DID this.... thus he couldn't really explain to me what he was
doing. I had to observe.
- SOI. He said something that hinted that he was interested in the chick
(paced and lead from his opener conversation). This got her emotions going
and her ideas racing. I have found this CRITICAL if the chick is going to
stay interested in you for too long. I bored many chicks out initially when
I wouldn't get to the point.
"What do you look for in guys?" would be sufficient enough as a question to
hint at what you are after (as you have found out yourself Maniac). Starting
off on a topic about guys and relationships usually brings chicks out, but
asking "Do you have a BF?" sucks.
This Ross Jeffries inspired SOI "The more you laugh, the more you'll be
attracted to interesting people......now with me" is an ambiguous SOI.
- Before she could knock him down for any comment, he would then be a
challenge and say something like "I'm not easy", "we don't know each other
well enough yet", "but what would I know, right? ;)","I need to feel passion
first", "Yeah, you know what I'm saying". These basically FORCE the chick to
continue the flirting (initiated by the SOI) along the lines that HE wanted
(and the lines that chicks SAY they want!).
By saying that he "needed time" and "not being easy", the chick already
attracted to him would then come onto him.

Most of the time the chicks would laugh becuase they'd get stuck for a smart
comeback. And he just kept this up, alternating back to party and fun
routines, until he got to the "sex-SOI-Our World-But I'm no sleaze"routine
which would then DDB the target to fuck - or get her ready for it next time
they met.
Negative commands also work great here to spark challenge. Just like I did
with my now LJBF ex-LTR "I'm not going to fuck you".

I've noted in my past failures (too many to count) that when I have dropped
SOI hints - the chicks have taken the flirting into areas which were
impossible for me to control - fucking me up and making me look stupid.
Especially in clubs where chicks do this like child's play to anyone who
"hits" on them. They use their irrational chick logic to fuck themselves
(and you) up. If that happens, your PU is history.
We can't give the women control, especially not in flirting, because they
aren't the ones that are trying to do PU. It's their job as "virtuous" women
to try and get away from PU, or try to fuck our PU up.

Svengali also said in his MLTR theory something which rings home on this. He
said (and I quote):-

"Seventh: If you don't give a woman something to be pissed about every
now and then, she'll find something on her own, and that will be harder
to get out of (because it will be of her making and criteria, not
yours)."

That is also the point of what we should be doing in flirting. To trap the
chick into going along with what your flirting and accepting your advances
(by means of non-objection) while getting her horny at the same time. That
way we avoid snappy comebacks because you've already "Handled her objections
before they came up" (That's something I learnt as a salesman)
This causes the chick to have her token resistance stall out - and puts us
in control.
GM does this with his sex jokes, but he slams any possible retort with "Just
Kidding" thus the chick can't say anything and the flirting goes by GMs
rules and not hers.

Take Mystery's "Nice nails" NEG for example.
He starts off with an SOI "Nice nails". This in and of itself is a
compliment. If he stopped here, the chick would come back (if she were a
bitch) with some smart ass comment to get rid of Mystery.

BUT, he then puts up the CHALLENGE before she gets a chance to reply (like
GM with "Just kidding"). Seemingly innocent too. "Are they real?"

Now the chick is stuck. What's going on? He's complimented me, and now he's
knocking me down! What is he doing? I must stick around for this! What can I
say? Maybe I'll just laugh it off...!? er..?
(Note, some REAL bitches when stalled will look angry at you and say "Huh?"
to which it's GM to the rescue! with "Hide your pleasure!")

So, couple this kind of flirting with lots of things to get her feeling
horny (patterns, sex talk, whatever), and add lots of personality conveying
things thrown in for good measure - and the chick is sufficiently stunned -
and ready for the drag and fuck stage.

Oh, and the Guam Playboy is an ugly fucker. Kipp's seen the pictures.
Looks don't matter for shit. I have great respect for all the older PUAs.

I must get up to Tokyo to see you guys real soon. The inaka sucks.
We can experiment with this some more then. I've been getting rusty since I
got back from Guam.
What I do know is that when this guy's method does work, it is KILLER. We
get Mr. Smooth status and KCs like crazy.

Rio
-------
Dictate the flirting

 wrote in message news:91f5e8$dpn@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Re: SOI's
>
> Rio..
>
> You are on to something big here..
> This is a discovery!
> I will incorporate this.
>
> Please give more specific examples though. I get
> what you are saying, but not yet really how you would
> apply it. .
>
>
> Fucking excellent thread!
>
>
> Maniac
> http://www.pickupguide.com
>
>
> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/

---

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: More on SOIs
Date: Fri, 22 Dec 2000 06:17:41 GMT

THIS IS RIO TYPING IN CAPS. I'M NOT YELLING!

Comments in text below.
After New years, I WILL be ready, and we will hit
the streets.

GREAT. I HAVEN'T BEEN DOING MUCH PU UNTIL YESTERDAY (1 SOLID # FROM A 9 AND
A KC FROM ANOTHER 9) - THUS THIS POST AS I TEST OUT MY THEORY. I HAVE A
FRIEND WHO WOULD LIKE TO COME ALONG. HE'S ALREADY BRIEFED AND VERY
EXPERIENCED IN SCREWING WOMEN IN JAPAN. HE'S READ THE PICKUP GUIDE ALREADY.
HE'S EVEN BEEN SO KIND TO INTRODUCE ME TO SOME WOMEN WHO WANT MERCY FUCKS.
HE ALSO KNOWS SOME GOOD "hole in the wall" PLACES AROUND RAPPONGI WITH LOTS
OF WOMEN (SO HE SAYS).

BTW, Rio; re: 'nomad' player.. mine was fucked up, returned
it for an exchange, new one works..

IT'S SURE BEATS A TAPE RECORDER, DOESN'T IT?

First, this is brilliant material, it is going on the
website, and is core to successful PU I think. It IS what
smooth was doing.. I couldnt identify it, but now it has
been named, and described, I recognize this.. and yes, it
will be TOTALLY lethal..

THANKS. EVERY SUCCESSFUL PUA HAS BEEN DOING SOMETHING LIKE THIS (OF ONE
STYLE OR ANOTHER) TO BED WOMEN. I WENT OUT AND USED THIS FRAME YESTERDAY
WITH INTERESTING AND POSITIVE RESULTS.....

HOWEVER, I MUST SAY IT'S HARD TO GIVE SPECIFIC EXAMPLES UNLESS THEY ARE
SITUATIONALLY BASED. FOLLOWING THE LOGIC HOWEVER, AND USING IT GIVEN THE
SITUATION STILL BRING RESULTS. I WILL DESCRIBE SOME OF WHAT I HAVE BEEN
DOING WITH IT, BUT I CAN'T REMEMBER FOR THE LIFE OF ME WHAT EXACTLY THE GUAM
GUY SAID. (I ONLY RECORDED A SMALL SAMPLE OF OUR CHAT WITH MY MP3 PLAYER.
NONE OF HIS NANPA HOWEVER) WHAT I DO KNOW, IS THAT HE FOLLOWED THIS
STRUCTURE WHICH I HAVE DESCRIBED TO VERY SOME GOOD EFFECTS.

I ASSUME YOU READ MY ORIGINAL STORY ON THE GUAM TRIP.
IF SO, MY REPLY WILL MAKE MORE SENSE.

In article ,
  "Rio"  wrote:
> He did this by offering a challenge -
> when he finished doing that once he went back to fun routines,
talking about

Examples? ?

OK, HE MADE SOME KIND OF COMPLIMENT OR SUGGESTED SOME KIND OF ACTIVITY
(OFTENTIMES WITH SEXUAL OR ROMANTIC UNDERTONES) THAT THEY COULD DO TOGETHER.
(LIKE HANG TIGHT TO EACH OTHER OF THE JET POWERED BANANA BOAT) AND THEN
FOLLOWED THAT WITH A REASON WHY HE WOULD HAVE TROUBLE DOING IT. KINDA LIKE
IN SALES, A SALESMAN WOULD SAY "FOR ONE DAY ONLY SALE", WELL HE WAS LIKE "SO
YOU SHOW UP AT SUCH AND SUCH A TIME, OTHERWISE I WON'T BE ABLE TO SHOW YOU A
GOOD TIME AND I'LL TAKE SOMEONE ELSE" (a takeaway)
SO IN ORDER TO CONTINUE THE FLIRTING, THE CHICK WOULD HAVE TO SHOW UP. HE
WOULD THEN (AFTER HAVING COMPLETED A SOI ROUTINE) SIT BACK AND WATCH THE
CHICK FOLLOW THROUGH. HE WOULD OFTENTIMES BE ABLE TO CONTINUE A CONVERSATION
WITHOUT STALLING - AND MIDWAY HE WOULD SOI HER AGAIN AND DO THE SAME ROUTINE
WITH SOMETHING ELSE. I NEVER SAW HIM GET IT ON WITHIN 20 MINUTES, BUT I SAW
WHAT HE DID TO THE CHICK WITH THIS ROUTINE AND I COULD TELL THAT HE COULD
HAVE IF HE WANTED TO. HE DIDN'T LOOK DESPERATE AT ALL.

> parties on the island, jokes, sex personality tests, etc. before he
did
> another SOI - staring out as indirect and ambiguous, before being VERY
> direct. ;)

Examples ? ?

THIS GUY HAD A STRONG ELEMENT OF GM. THE SEX PERSONALITY TEST IS DOCUMENTED
IN MY POST ON THIS GUY (IT'S ABOUT ICE CREAM) - BUT AFTERWARDS UNLIKE GM, NO
COMMENT OF "JUST KIDDING". HE WOULD THEN SAY SOMETHING ELSE TO DISTRACT
ATTENTION OR PLAY "PRETEND AFC" LIKE "BUT I'M NOT EASY" OR "BUT I DON'T KNOW
YOU THAT WELL"
ALL THE MEANWHILE, GETTING THE CHICK HORNY AND CREATING A CHALLENGE.

> Basically what I think I have come up with, through trying to explain
to the
> posters that asked me about him, is a flirting construction kit.

Examples ? ?

MANIAC, YOU'RE STARTING TO OVERUSE CUT AND PASTE LIKE NYC WHEN HE RIPS APART
AFCS WITH THESE "EXAMPLES??" COMMENTS.........

(QUOTE NYC)
"YOU ARE BEING USED. SHE DOESN'T GIVE A SHIT ABOUT YOU. SHE DOESN'T INTEND
TO FUCK YOU. SHE IS FUCKING OTHER MEN THAT SHE FINDS SEXUALLY ATTRACTIVE.
YOU ARE FOOTING THE BILL FOR HER INTERNATIONAL WHORING. STOP."

HA HA HA ;)

> The Guam Playboy NEGged a LOT - and he got away with it every time.

Such as ? ?

WISH I COULD REMEMBER NOW. BUT WHAT I DID SEE IS HIM COMPLIMENTING LOTS OF
JAP CHICKS AND NOT GETTING ANY NASTY REACTION BACK FROM THEM - BECAUSE THEY
WERE SO SHY AND INEXPERIENCED. SO THE CHICKS JUST LAUGHED BECAUSE THEY HAD
NO BITCH SHIELD OF ANY TYPE.
WHERE HE DID ENCOUNTER A SHIELD, HE WOULD ATTACK HER "NASTY" PERSONALITY -
AND HER LACK OF ABILITY TO BE GRACEFUL WITH COMPLIMENTS.

IN THAT SENSE, HE WOULD ALWAYS SIZE THE CHICK UP AS IF HE WAS LOOKING FOR
LTR POTENTIAL (but we know of course, that LTR was never the plan)

He could
> even tell chicks AFC things like they were beautiful, and then turn
it into
> a NEG if he wanted. That's what over 20 years of daily PU did for
this guy.

Examples ? ?

"YOU'RE REALLY CUTE....(pause to check response)... BUT I DON'T KNOW
ANYTHING ABOUT YOU. (SAID NEGATIVELY OR NOT DEPENDING ON HER RESPONSE). SO
WHO ARE YOU ANYWAY?"

> But the NEG is only one kind of flirting (used for dumping a girl's
uptight
> self image). There are other kinds, such as using ambiguities,
physical
> light-handed slapping and pushing kino, playing tricks on people,
etc.

Such as ? ?

I'VE STOPPED USING KINO IMMIDIATELY NOW, AND SAVING IT FOR WHEN I'VE LANDED
AN SOI ROUTINE AND CAUGHT THE CHICK OUT. WHEN SHE HAS LAUGHED, I SLAP HER
GENTLY.
IT'S ANCHORING.

AS FOR TRICKS ON PEOPLE.... STUPID ONES. I WILL HAVE TO SHOW YOU THEM IN
PERSON.

The
> Playboy used plenty of variations.

Like what ? ?

GIVEN THE SITUATION, HE WOULD TRY DIFFERENT WAYS TO GET HER THINKING
ROMANTICALLY ABOUT BOTH OF THEM TOGETHER. HE WOULD USE WHATEVER WAS IN HIS
SURROUNDINGS, OR THE TOPIC OF CONVERSATION, TO PACE AND LEAD THE CHICK INTO
IMAGINING SUCH A SCENARIO.
THEN HE WOULD YANK IT AWAY BY GIVING SOME KIND OF EXCUSE (LIKE HE WAS BUSY,
HE DIDN'T THINK SHE COULD DO IT) OR HE WOULD PLAY AFC (I DON'T KNOW YOU, I
NEED TO BE IN LOVE FIRST, I'M NOT EASY, I'M NOT A PLAYER, I NEED TIME, I AM
REALLY PICKY, I HAVE BEEN HURT BEFORE, I HAVE A GF)

> Flirting is this:- One drops the SOI, and then pulls it away out of
reach of
> the target.

For example ? ?

I REALLY FEEL VERY CLOSE TO YOU, BUT I NEED TIME.

THE MAGIC WORD IS but

 Then gives another SOI, and then pulls it away again. Like with
> our words, we put images of sex and romance in their heads, then pull
it out

Like ? ?

HIS BRAVEST SOI WAS THE ONE WHERE HE SAID STRAIGHT OUT THAT HE WAS GOING TO
FUCK A CHICK. I WITNESSED THE WHOLE THING. HE SAID THAT HE WAS GOING TO FUCK
HER but (AND THEN HE WENT PRETEND AFC) I'M VERY PICKY, I'M NOT A PUA
BECAUSE THOSE GUYS TEASE WOMEN WITH BULLSHIT, MAKE EMPTY PROMISES, FUCK
THEM, AND THEN DUMP THEM. I AM A PLAYBOY. I LOVE WOMEN AND I DON'T WANT YOU
TO GET TOO ATTACHED TO ME AFTER WE HAVE SEX.

> again, then out it in, then take it out, then put it back in, then
take it
> out again........ Mindfucking!

Example please . .

OK, ANOTHER ONE:-   I WANT TO KISS YOU, BUT SOMEHOW I DON'T THINK YOU LIKE
KISSING.
(btw - this would be an SOI fairly advanced in conversation)
NOTE ALSO THAT THERE'S AN EMBEDDED COMMAND IN THE 2ND PART OF THE ROUTINE.
THAT BEING "YOU LIKE KISSING"
EVIL ISN'T IT?

> Once the chick is confused and teased enough, she is DDB and safely
> mindfucked.

how? describe this. . what exactly did he do?

WELL, THE CHICK THAT HE SAID THE "I'M GOING TO FUCK YOU" SPEECH TO, JUST
STARTED DOING ALL THE TRADEMARK BODYLANGUAGE. SHE JUST SAT THERE STUNNED
AND PLAYED WITH HER HAIR. LIKE A RABBIT LOOKING INTO BRIGHT LIGHTS. THE GUAM
GUY SAID ALL OF IT WITH A SERIOUS FACE TOO, SO SHE COULDN'T LAUGH OFF WHAT
HE WAS SAYING.

THE WAY HE WORKED DIDN'T SEEM TO BE ONE OF "ATTRACTION" PER SE. HE WOULD
EVENTUALLY CORNER THE CHICK AND FLIRT WITH HER UNTIL SHE COULD TAKE NO MORE.
UNTIL SHE GOT STUNNED

> I did a PU once on a chick using the SOIs. I found out where she
lived and
> then said "Oh that's not far from my place, so I can come down to see
you.
> It's a pity I am so busy it won't happen today"

This is good. .

THAT'S A REAL LIFE EXAMPLE OF WHAT THE WHOLE THEORY IS ABOUT. MORE
IMPORTANTLY IS THAT IT WORKED.

> (Note that there is a bit of future pacing and presuppositioning in
this)
> She lapped it up and took my kino from there - despite the BF being a
matter
> of metres away.
>
> The structure for the Guam Playboy routine went like this:-
>
> - Fun routine or opener (ala Mystery) - some basic fluff - all good
things
> about himself, what he could do for the women (he played the helpful
tour

Examples ? ?

READ SOME OF MYSTERY'S OPENERS!
TYPICALLY OFF THE WALL STUFF. WELL, WHEN HE WAS TALKING ABOUT GUAM'S CULTURE
AND PARTIES AND STUFF - FOR ALL THE TOURISTS, ALL THIS NEW INFO TO THEM IS
PRETTY OFF THE WALL.
HE WOULD TELL THE CHICKS ABOUT SOME PARTY WHERE THEY WOULD DIG A HUGE PIT
AND THROW ANIMALS ON IT IN A BIG FEAST WITH A BONFIRE AND DANCING - AND THEN
BRANCHED OUT AND TALKED ABOUT DANCING AND OTHER EXOTIC/EROTIC STUFF.

> guide). Be "Disgustingly" Charming! as he put it. The guy wasn't big
on

Like ? ?

THOSE WERE HIS EXACT WORDS. HE RELIED ON GM A LOT IN THE LATTER PART OF HIS
SEDUCTIONS.

> logically drawing out routines for what he did (which is a good
thing), he
> just went and DID this.... thus he couldn't really explain to me what
he was
> doing. I had to observe.

Yep, he's got experience.. I rarely consciously follow ManiacPlan
anymore.. just it spews out naturally.. learning PU is like learning
a foreign language/lingo.. once you get it, its natural..

I'VE BEEN LEARNING TO PLAY AFC IN MY SEDUCTIONS, AND IT HAS BEEN WORKING
REALLY WELL!

> - SOI. He said something that hinted that he was interested in the
chick
> (paced and lead from his opener conversation). This got her emotions
going

Example?  How?

OK, ANOTHER ONE.

"WOULDN'T IT BE GREAT TO SPEND TIME TOGETHER OVER COFFEE? IT'S SUCH A PITY I
HAVE TO GO TO SOME MEETINGS LATER ON, SO WE WILL PROBABLY HAVE NO TIME TO
SEE EACH OTHER EVER AGAIN BEFORE YOU GO BACK."
(WAIT FOR RESPONSE)
"BUT LET ME KNOW YOUR NUMBER ANYWAY...WHO KNOWS I MAY HAVE TIME."
(might want to save this one after you have dropped several other
SOIs)

> and her ideas racing.

Like what? which ideas? be specific please. .

ROMATIC AND/OR SEXUAL ONES.
HE WOULD START OFF ON ROMANTIC ONES AND MAKE THEM INCREASINGLY SEXUAL UNTIL
HE HIT A SEXUAL FANTASY OF HERS THAT WOULD DDB HER.
LET'S SAY "HOLDING HANDS" OR "SPENDING QUALITY TIME TOGETHER" OR "BEING
CLOSE" AND EVENTUALLY LEADING THAT INTO "TOUCHING BODIES" AND "KISSING" TO
"FUCKING" OBVIOUSLY.
A LOT OF TIME DISTORTION SOIs.

> I have found this CRITICAL if the chick is going to
> stay interested in you for too long. I bored many chicks out
initially when
> I wouldn't get to the point.
[rest deleted]

Rio, this is great stuff. Somehow I understand it.. but I need
examples of it so I can put it together as something I can try
in the field. Do you remember any specifics from this guy?

WELL, WE CAN ALWAYS WAIT FOR THE OFF-SEASON AND GO TO GUAM WITH A VCR AND
MEET THIS GUY (YOU'LL ONLY NEED ABOUT 40,000 YEN FROM TOKYO FOR A 2 DAY
TRIP) OR NEXT TIME WE MEET IN TOKYO WE CAN DO MORE STREET STUFF AND I CAN
SHOW YOU WHAT I KNOW. (I HADN'T FULLY DEVELOPED THE THEORY UNTIL AFTER MY
NIGHT OUT WITH KIPP - I OQed TOO MUCH AND FAILED TO PLACE ANY CHALLENGES
AFTER MY SOIs THAT NIGHT)
THE GUAM PLAYBOY WAS A GRANDMASTER OF STREET PU - HIS WEAKNESS WAS THAT HE
WAS A GREEDY TEAMPLAYER WITH WINGMEN.

If so, please fill in the above spaces where I ask.. it is very
important if this is to work.

Rio
-------

Using SOI’s as a way to tease/attract chicks!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Using SOI's (statements of intent) as a tease to attract a chick!


From: Jonathan Ashton 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Clearing SOI's up
Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 07:04:08 GMT

In article ,
> For example, if we were to drop an SOI on the chick, and then
> IMMEDIATELY follow up with a negative command - WE control the
> flirting so that the chick then has to work for US.
>
> So we can say things like "I want to kiss you"
> And then control the flirting by pulling away again with some reverse
> commands :-
> "BUT I don't really know anything about you, and I haven't known you
> for very long, and I need to feel love first"
> Sounds like the stuff that chicks tell us, right? Well chicks say it
> to flirt, as opposed to meaning what they say!

Omigod!  Rio, this is an awesome post!  Brilliant!  Genius!

"I was thinking about kissing you, but you'd probably slobber too
  much."
"I'd love to take you home, but I know you'd get all clingy."
"I'm just trying to guess if you're any good in bed.  Too bad you're
  too young/weird/conservative for me."
"I bet you'd love the way I do neck massages.  You've been acting up
  too much to deserve one, though."

This is so EASY!  Anyone can think these up on the spot!  There's no
need to think up ambiguous sentences or come up with just the right
innuendo.  Just make a Statement of Intentions, then let her know what
SHE has to offer to make it happen - by telling her that you won't do
it because she's not up to par!  I love it!  I will try it out ASAP!

Howcome I've never seen this idea explained before?  In retrospect,
it's clear that MrSex4uNYC and Mystery do similar stuff, but I've
never seen the dynamic explained this way before.  Ross talks about
setting challenges, but it's always seemed like such a delicate art
to say just the right thing at just the right time.

But this is so easy!  Thank you, Rio.

Ash


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

Game: Color game

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Color Game that can be used in PU!
[Maniac note: got this other list below from the 'Secrets of the cube book'
Also very good, may be appropriate when doing this game:

Red: passion, hot energy, anger warmth
Green: hope, life, nature, money
Blue: spirituality, serenity, cool energy, sadness
Purple: royalty, deep passions, mourning
Yellow: cheerfulness, brightness, eccentricity
Pink: feminity, wamrth
Brown: earthyness, warmth, conventionality
Black: mystery
White: purity
Multicolored: of many interests or moods

END: Maniac note]

From: steviewonder 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: More personality tests
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 20:20:17 GMT

In article <904e0cjv@nnrp1.deja.com>,
  maniac_high@yahoo.com wrote:
> There is good stuff on that site.
>
> I am reworking it to be more appropriate in opener type
> PU's in bars/coffee shops, will present my results of this
> work in late January after it has all been designed and
> field tested.. It will be killer..

Hi guys,

Found this game at

http://www.geocities.com/Broadway/8546/colortest.html

a good one since all the answers are sexual:

QUESTION:

Pick the color that best describes your personality?

ANSWERS:

BLACK
Black color preferences point to black sex. These people are the
misfits of the sex world and seek each other in kinship. They tend to
prefer perverted sex, and are usually masochistic or sadistic in
nature. They are moody and often perform at their peak when under
stress or during unhappy times. Police psychologists claim that many
sex offenders prefer the color black. And it is no coincidence that
the uniform of mobsters and teenaged gangs is black.

BLUE
Lovers of blue are wonderful sex partners. They are sincere,
affectionate, and sensitive to their partner's needs. They consider
lovemaking a fine art, and their approach is elegant. Men who love
blue are like concert pianists; delicately ravaging their partner like
they would play a baby grand. Women in the blue category enjoy sex
to the fullest. They are exciting partners, but their passion might be
compared to tidal waves, rather than fiery aggresion. Both blue men
and women enjoy foreplay and the aftermath of lovemaking as much
as the act. In marriages, a blue person is a wonderful mate, never
failing to please the spouse and never seeking outside interests.

BROWN
For lovers of brown, sex is a 24-hour a day thing. They tend to say "I
love you" often enough. Snuggling by the fire, walking in the rain or
catching snowflakes on their tongue ins a turn-on to a lover of brown.
They need lots of time and privacy to make love. But their emotions
are such that one harsh word could end an affair.

GREEN
Those who prefer green are fresh and innocent in their approach to
sex. Women who love green will make love like virgins all their life.
And a man may also be a trifle clumsy and awkward, but in a charming
and endearing sort of way. Green lovers are gentle, but not
passionate. If chosen as a mate, one will never need to worry about
infidelity.

GREY
The color grey is preferred by people who are indecisive. They can't
get excited about anything - including colors - so they choose a
noncommittal shade. Men who prefer grey look at sex as a means of
relieving tension - nothing more nothing less. It's "wham, bam, thank
you ma'am". Women don't make love, they have intercourse. They
count the cracks in the bedroom plaster until the sex act is over with
and done. When a grey marries another grey, the marriage is not
exactly erotic.

ORANGE
Lovers of the color orange lean toward sexual fantasies. The sex act
is regarded as a dramatic role, a one act play in which they are the
star. Foreplay is as important as the act of love. They whisper sweet
nothings, meaningless dialogue they feel fits their image. Orange
people often do not experience orgasm - but they put on a damn good
act. Men tend to pull their partner's hair and women tend to leave
welts on their sex partner's back!

PINK
Persons who like pink show a reluctance to mature in sexual matters.
Women tend to tease; to promise more than they intend to deliver. In
some cases, they flaunt their femininity, but only because they
secretly hate men. A great percentage of prostitutes boast entire
wardrobes in pink. Men who like pink are the type who make 3 dates
for the same evening and not keep them, preferring to pick up a dish
in some bar instead.

PURPLE
Lovers of purple frequently consider themselves too regal for  fun
romp in the sack. Women sometimes are the type who hate to muss
their hair. Men are businesslike in their approach to lovemaking. In
both sexes, purple partners are more concerned with their
fulfillment then anyone else's gratification.

RED
People who like red tend to be tigers in the sack. They are easily
aroused and enjoy sex in every way imaginable. Once the sexual spark
is lit, it may take hours to extinguish. When two reds get together,
the ensuing erotica would make Lady Chatterly blush. Lovers of red
tend to be the aggressors and weaker colors should beware!

YELLOW
If you tend to favor yellow, your sexual drives are complex and lean
toward the adaptable. The favorite color of homosexuals is yellow!
But don't panic - not everyone who wears yellow is homosexual. In
most cases the person will accommodate to the stronger partner's
desires in a passive manner. You will never enjoy sex to the fullest,
but you will never turn down an invitation from someone you enjoy or
admire.

--
To email me remove the _obvious from this address:
steviewonder_ob@viousfastmail.ca

Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

Handling delusional chicks, karatebabe lives a nightmare!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Re: Mystery: delusional chicks & sympathy lies! 
Date: 11/12/2000 
Author: maniac_high  

 << previous in search  ?  next in search >>  

Re: Mystery: delusional chicks & sympathy lies!
001112
 
Mystery wrote in another post this week regarding lying
to chicks, about how not to underestimate how delusional
a chick is willing to become in order to keep her 'happy'
view of the world.
 
He is absolutely right. And this explains how seeming
'jerk' can get away with what seems like such ridiculous
shit.
 
Case in point, is where I recently did a fuckup, and then
recovered with Karatebabe (see lay report, my page). This
is the chick that would go around my place after sex
cleaning up her own hairs so that "the other chicks"
wouldnt find out about her.
 
Well, one day we are going for coffee, and she asks me
if I had been seeing another chick at the time I started
dating her. Figuring (incorrectly) from her behavior,
that this chick knew totally what the score already was,
I said I had been (wrong answer!).
 
She freaked out and went balistic at me. Shit about "how
I make her fool, go behind her back..and other shit".
In retrospect it was clear though.. she got upset, because
something she merely 'suspected' (even though it was fucking
obvious as shit, as other chicks stuff was all over the
fucking house), now became something 'confirmed', and that
shattered her entire world..
 
I then smartened up and realized what I had just done,
and recovered by saying that I dumped her after I first
started dating you (Karatebabe), a few weeks later.
 
After that, she settled down (even though every week
there was different chick stuff all over the house
after that!). She asked me about it, and I said no,
there are no chicks..
 
She said she accepted that, and that her 'nightmare'
now was over, and everything was fine again.
 
Later she found some makeup and chick stuff in the
bathroom cabinet (another chick must have slipped
it there for someone else to find it), so I had
to think fast on my feet for that one...
 
So I told her that I have a real dark secret and
she might be very disappointed in me (now she is
expecting to hear something about a chick)..
 
Then (remembering she likes gays and stuff) I tell
her that I like to make believe to dress like a girl
(lots of J-guys do it actually, so I know it is not
so far fetched here), and I have guy friends that do it
with me, and sorry I didnt tell you earlier.. (of
course this is TOTALLY false.. Maniac is not even
remotely gay, nor a crossdresser or any of that shit)...
however.. she ACCEPTED that story, and was relieved
(in spite of the fact that I was almost cracking up
when I said it, since I was SURE she would call me
on my bullshit... but she didnt)!
 
Fuck!, the totally ridiculous things you have to
tell a chick...  AND! they accept it (as they
try to internalize it and believe it at least at
some level so that their happy delusional world
doesn't come crashing to bits)..
 
Strange, isnt it..!
 
Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Using the laws of power in PU!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Toecutter, and using the laws of power!




From toecutter@mail.com Mon Oct 23 09:39:39 2000
From: "toecutter" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Lessons from Book: The 48 Laws of Power
Lines: 201


Just reading a book, The 48 Laws of Power by Robert Greene. Definitely
lessons everywhere in the book on what we do here.
The book is amoral, and open about the deception inherit in what he is
teaching. It is largely for life outside the arena of seduction, but
entrirely applicable and there are some seduction examples in it to
illustrate his points (only historical: For example the advice of Ninon de
Lenclos on seduction to the Marquis de Sevigne and what happened when the
Marquis did not follow her advice, etc.). The examples are all pulled from
the Sun Tzu (Chinese, the Art of War), European history, famous con men,
magicians and charlatans, Kings, Queens, Napoleon and other power brokers
such as Al Capone. Perfect for you guys who enjoy Machiavelli. At 450
reasonably large format pages it is fairly long.

It is going to take me several re-readings, but at the moment I see the
messages as really 3 fold: First, play your cards pretty close to your
chest. This creates mystery. The more you say, the more common you appear
and the less in control. Andy Wohol created enigma by not discussing his
work and answering questions by being intentionally vague giving people the
feeling that he was being more profound than he was.  If you do not reveal
all, people will never become bored with you or your presence because you
will continue to represent a challenge, and will be eternally interesting.
Your silence will make other people feel uncomfortable and humans are
machines of interpretation and explanation; they have to know what you are
thinking. When you carefully control what you reveal, they cannot pierce
your intentions and meaning. Your short answers will put them on the
defensive and they will jump in, nervously filling the silence with all
kinds of comments that will reveal valuable information about themselves and
their weaknesses.

This brings me to the second message. Learn everything you can about other
people. Their strengths and weaknesses, their crutches and trance words.
Their motivations. Use these to your advantage whilst revealing as little as
possible about yourself. Keep them the focus of the conversation, and be a
'Spy' on their minds by eliciting values.

The third lesson is to use smoke and mirrors to obscure your objectives and
motivations. Throw decoys out there, use gifts as Trojan horses, and be
circumspect in what is going on. Again, this throws them off your game,
gives you an upper hand.

None of this is to say that you need to be quiet or a bad conversationalist,
just the opposite, by spying and eliciting values, you are encouraging
people to talk about themselves, their own favourite subject. By being brief
about yourself you are creating mystery and interest. It is just that you
are collecting the information in order to use it against them at another
time, whilst manipulating your image and reputation in their minds and
obscuring your real motivations. In some ways it is a book on playing hard
to get while outmanoeuvring the girl. A perfect structure in which to drop
SS.

Some of the content is below. I can post more on it if you would like
further discussion; I am overflowing with ideas on it.

Toecutter.

---

To list some of the laws that are obviously applicable:

Law 3: Conceal your intentions (Keep people off balance and in the dark by
never revealing the purpose behind your actions. If they have no clue what
you are up to, they cannot prepare a defence. Guide them far enough down the
wrong path, envelop them in enough smoke, and by the time they realise your
intentions, it will be too late.)

Law 4: Always say less than is necessary

Law 6: Court attention at all costs

Law 8: Make other people come to you - use bait if necessary

Law 9: Win though your actions, never through argument. (Any momentary
triumph you win though argument is really a Pyrrhic victory: The resentment
and ill will you stir up is stronger and lasts longer than any momentary
change in opinion. It is much more powerful to get others to agree with you
though your actions, without saying a word. Demonstrate, do not explicate.)

Law 10: Infection: Avoid the unhappy and unlucky (it works the other way
also. This is an alternative take on social-proof, or pivots or whatever you
want to call them, as well as wingmen. Also advice on not getting involved
with the wrong girl.)

Law 11: Learn to keep people dependent on you.

Law 12: Use selective generosity to disarm your victim (One sincere and
honest move will cover over dozens of dishonest ones. Openhearted gestures
of honesty and generosity bring down the guard of even the most suspicious
people. Once your selective honesty opens a hole in their armour, you can
deceive and manipulate at will.)

Law 13: When asking for help, appeal to people's self interest, never to
their mercy or gratitude.

Law 14: Pose as a friend, work as a spy.

Law 16: Use absence to increase respect and honour. (Again through mystery
and not stuffing it up by staying too long and doing or saying something
wrong.)

Law 17: Keep others in suspended terror: Cultivate an air of
unpredictability

Law 18: Do not build fortresses to protect yourself - Isolation is
dangerous. (Get out there amongst them).

Law 19: Know who you are dealing with - do not offend the wrong person.

Law 20: Do not commit yourself to anyone.

Law 21: Play a sucker to catch a sucker - appear dumber than your mark. (Let
her think that she is in control and smart, less naive, don't let on you are
a player).

Law 25: Re-create yourself (Do not accept the roles that society foists on
you. Re-create yourself by forging a new identity, one that commands
attention and never bores the audience. Be the master of your own image
rather than letting others define it for you. Incorporate dynamic devices
into your public gestures and actions - your power will be enhanced and your
character will seem larger than life).

Law 26: Keep your hands clean. (You must seem a paragon of civility and
efficiency: Your hands are never soiled by mistakes and nasty deeds.
Maintain such a spotless appearance by using others as scapegoats and cat'
s-paws to disguise your involvement).

Law 27: Play on peoples need to believe to create a cult like following.
(advice in this chapter is on how to become a cult leader or maybe build a
harem. 5 strategies to your dogma! a) Keep it vague; Keep it simple b)
Emphasise the visual and sensual over the intellectual c) Borrow the forms
of organised religion to structure the group d) Disguise your income source
e) set up an us-vs.-them dynamic. I think Ross Jeffries read this one!)

Law 28: Enter action with Boldness. (If you are unsure of a course of
action, do not attempt it. Your doubts and hesitations will infect your
execution. Timidity is dangerous: Better to enter with boldness. Any
mistakes you make through audacity are easily corrected with more audacity.
Everyone admires the bold; no one honours the timid).

Law 29: Plan all the way to the end.

Law 30: Make your accomplishments seem effortless. (Your actions must seem
natural and executed with ease. All the toil and practice that goes into
them, also all the clever tricks, must be concealed. When you act, act
effortlessly, as if you could do much more. Avoid the temptation of
revealing how hard you work - it only raises questions. Teach no one your
tricks or they will be used against you .. I am breaking this rule right
here with this post, as is the Authour of the book.)

Law 31: Control the options: Get others to play with the cards you deal.
(The best deceptions are the ones that seem to give the other person a
choice: Your victims feel they are in control, but are actually your
puppets. Give people options that come out in your favour whichever one they
choose. Force them to make choices between the lesser of two evils, both of
which serve your purpose. Put them on the horns of the dilemma: they are
gored wherever they turn. Note: this is a different view on my idea of
re-framing questions. The questions are re-framed so well that the girl has
no option.)

Law 32: Play to people's fantasies.

Law 33: Discover each mans thumbscrew.

Law 34: Be royal in your own fashion: Act like a king to be treated like
one.

Law 35: Master the art of timing. (Never seem to be in a hurry - hurrying
betrays a lack of control over yourself, and over time. Always seem patient,
as if you know that everything will come to you eventually. Become a
detective of the right moment; sniff out the spirit of the times, the trends
that will carry you to power. Learn to stand back when the time is not yet
ripe, and to strike fiercely when it has reached fruition.)

Law 36: Disdain things you cannot have: Ignoring them is the best revenge.

Law 37: Create compelling spectacles. (Striking imagery and grand symbolic
gestures create the aura of power - everyone responds to them. Stage
spectacles for those around you, then, full of arresting visuals and radiant
symbols to heighten your presence. Dazzled by appearances, no one will
notice what you are really doing.)

Law 40: Despise the free Lunch.

Law 43: Work on the hearts and minds of others.

Law 44: Disarm and infuriate with the mirror effect. (The mirror reflects
reality, but is the perfect tool for deception: When you mirror your
enemies, doing exactly as they do, they cannot figure out your strategy. The
mirror Effect mocks and humiliates them, making them overreact. By holding
up a mirror to their psyches, you seduce them with the illusion that you
share their values; by holding up a mirror to their actions you teach them a
lesson. Few can resist the power of the mirror effect.)

Law 48: Assume formlessness. (By taking a shape, by having a visible plan,
you open yourself to attact. Instead of taking a form for the girl to grasp,
keep yourself adaptable and on the move. Accept the fact that nothing is
certain and no law is fixed. The best way to protect yourself is to be as
fluid and formless as water: never bet on stability or lasting order.
Everything changes.)

Disarming groups of guys around chicks!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

When lots of guys are around 1 girl, you must disarm guys!


From: "Stepleader" 
Subject: Re: She has nice/great body and/or face -- but what about her?
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2000 10:02:45 GMT

great pep talk and I love your posts ... but ...

the situ called for a disarming of the guys.  Here is how.  Approach the
group but pay NO attention to the girl.  Begin the chat with the guys and
make them interested in your story telling.  MALE BONDING comradery.  Turn
you back to HER so she feels out of place.  What you have done is removed
all the attention from her (stolen it).  You are now the center of
attention.  A couple NEGS her way challenges her.  All the other guys were
on her - all but one.  YOU.

Just so you know, this is mystery methods groupset theory and Ive done this
successfully a great # of times.

from this vantage point you may now take her  by the hand and say to the
others, "is it alright if I steal your friend away for a bit?"  they will
say yes and you take her out of earshot.  Id love you to see me work a set
like that.  its brilliant.  and PRACTICAL.

Svengali  wrote in article
<131220002147344283%Svengali_here@use.net>...
> Gentlemen, you're looking for the whole package, not just the
> packaging.  And if all you're focusing on is the packaging, she damn
> well knows it and is in control of you --period!
> 
> You must, repeat, you must be prepared to walk at all times, no matter
> how much you would like to be on/in that body and face.
> 
> Remember, you are screening her to see if she is good enough for
> you, not the other way around.  And the only way you're going to find
> out if she is good enough for you is to learn as much as you can
> about the person that is within that female form.
> 
> Am I saying you must be screening every beauty for a long term
> relationship?  Hell no!  It can be for however long you want.  But
> the moment she sees, and it won't take her long, that you are screening
> her to see whether or not she is good enough for you, is the moment
> the tables get turned and she understands that she has to make herself
> look good in your eyes.
> 
> Now contrast this with all the other guys who are trying to make
> themselves look good in her eyes, so they can get on/in her.
> 
> To illustrate what I am saying, picture this: we're in a manhattan bar,
> and there is this gorgeous looking woman, with the greatest face you've
> seen, talking to a few guys.  One happens to be our own great NYC with
> his magnificient weight-lifting body and his "I'm great" attitude; 
> another is Riker with his patterns, a third is Greg19 with his band of
> ways, and so on.  So basically what you would have is a bunch of guys
> trying to find and give this woman what she wants, so as to get on/in
> her.
> 
> Then there's Svengali, with his Carey Grant looks and ways, who sees
> the woman, walks right up into the group and says "excuse me guys, I
> just wanted to ask the lady where she got, and whose idea it was to get
> those earrings that seems to make her skin sparkle and her eyes glow,
> and then I'll leave." [Turning to her] "So please tell me, where did
> you get, and what made you decide [Svengali's hand goes out to the
> earrings, and in the process, lightly touches the lady's neck] to get
> these earrings that seems to make your skin sparkle and your eyes
> glow?"  {She tells me.}  "Thank you."  "Bye guys, I'm going back over
> there [pointing, so the lady knows where I will be]."
> 
> Look what just occurred: (1) I showed I wasn't afraid of a damn thing. 
> (2) I disarmed my opponents.  (3) I made her feel good.  (4) I showed
> her I wasn't about to hang around and try and get her.  {Of course to
> firmly establish that point, I would engage another woman in
> conversation, and have her positioned in a way that the first woman
> would see her with me, which would have her wondering what kind of nice
> things was I saying to her, that she wasn't getting.}.
> 
> Who do you think the woman is likely to be focused on and thinking
> about: all the guys who are there, still trying to get to her, or the
> guy who said what he wanted, made her feel good/great, left, and is now
> focused on someone else?  {I removed one of her feel good sources, so
> even though the others are there, with theirs, she like nearly everyone
> of us, is focused on the one that's been lost, not the ones that are
> present.}
> 
> Show your interest in her, but also show that you are walking the
> moment *she's* not exactly like you want.
> 
> Now I'll play devil's advocate and say that my little "walk away"
> didn't work.  Do you think I care?  Hell no, and I'll tell you why: the
> one who chases to gets, will always have to chase to have.  So whoever
> would win with the woman, would have to keep providing whatever they
> did to keep her interested.  I, on the other hand, only need to use a
> little charm and then walk away to have her wanting me.
> 
> I ask you, who do you think has an easier time of it?
> 
> -- 
> If you don't know in the first twenty minutes whether or not you're going
to
> have sex with the woman you just met, and whether or not you even want
to,
> you're not a seductionist.
> 
>   'o o'
> Svengali
>

Taking control when things go wrong

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Mystery and others write about successful openers!



From: "Mystery" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast,Alt.psychology.nlp,alt.hypnosis
References: <37602334.55753831@bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Chat suggestions
Date: Wed, 16 Jun 1999 04:58:12 -0700
Lines: 63
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts7-36t-14.idirect.com
Message-ID: <37676655@nemo.idirect.com>
X-Trace: 16 Jun 1999 04:54:45 -0400, ts7-36t-14.idirect.com
Organization: via Internet Direct

Status: O

talk about esp and its impossibility

talk about how you met a bear while hiking

talk about how you were scared shitless rock climbing when your rope snapped

or the time you visited your friends friend with him and your buddy was
almost beaten to death when the friend he visited had a boyfriend who came
out and there was a 20 minute car chase through lights and you were looking
for the cops but lot the crazed boyfriend before you found cops.

or the time you were in the hospital and it changed the way food tastes.
the birds sound clearer now.

or the time you netbused (hacked) into a bank but chickened out and put the
money into a charity

or talk about the famous person you met

does she believe in ghosts?  why?

you like candles and incense.  what does SHE like?  the music game modified
for all types of objects.

play the question game with her

or hotseat (like question game but more brutal)

talk about the time you bladed down a steep hill and survived.

talk about the time you were on stage

...

mystery



-----


From nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org Wed Apr 12 07:31:37 2000
From: nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org (Nathan SZILARD)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: After the # close

On Mon, 03 Apr 2000 21:26:22 GMT, Rio  wrote:
| I was reading elsewhere on a post, that if you instruct her to sound
| cheerful on the phone when you call when you do a # close.

I tried that, it's not a magic bullet. But it's fun.

I now always write some shit along with my phone #:
something like "DO NOT FALL IN LOVE" or "NO STALKING PLEASE".

They find it very funny and show it to their friends, plus
they remember.

| If you did any anchoring on your voice when you met, now's the time to
| unleash them.



----

From slidewguy@remove-aol.com Wed Apr 12 07:47:28 2000
From: "whoisthis19" 
Subject: Some closes
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast

Hand her the slip of paper and pen and have her write down her number.
When she's hands it back, ask her to put it someplace so you will
remeber to call her.  Last time I did this she put it down my pants and
grabbed my cock.  

Ask a gal to trade shirts.  When she balks, keep pressing in a joking
manner then finally ask to her to go outside to trade shirts.  Nothing
better then getting her outside.

Another one is simply saying its too smokey, noisy, smelly in here. 
Lets go outsde for some air.

Any of you guys got ways of getting chicks to leave with you outside
the club?

greg1

Did you sleep with yourself or... did you turn yourself down because
 you was too easy.

Maniac High's Pick Up Girls Guide and Seduction Website! » mystery

Maniac High — Thu, 20 May 2010 12:22:49 +0000

Buy Reductil No Prescription, From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Mystery and others write about successful openers.

Status: O

talk about esp and its impossibility

talk about how you met a bear while hiking

talk about how you were scared shitless rock climbing when your rope snapped

or talk about the famous person you met

does she believe in ghosts. why, Buy Reductil No Prescription.

or hotseat (like question game but more brutal)

talk about the time you bladed down a steep hill and survived. Buy Reductil No Prescription, talk about the time you were on stage

...

mystery

-----

From nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org Wed Apr 12 07:31:37 2000
From: nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org (Nathan SZILARD)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: After the # close

They find it very funny and show it to their friends, plus
they remember, Buy Reductil No Prescription.

| If you did any anchoring on your voice when you met, order Reductil, Buy Reductil without a prescription, now's the time to
| unleash them.

----

From slidewguy@remove-aol.com Wed Apr 12 07:47:28 2000
From: "whoisthis19"
Subject: Some closes
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast

Any of you guys got ways of getting chicks to leave with you outside
the club.

greg1

Did you sleep with yourself or... did you turn yourself down because
you was too easy.

Doing Successful Openers

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Mystery and others write about successful openers!



From: "Mystery" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast,Alt.psychology.nlp,alt.hypnosis
References: <37602334.55753831@bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Chat suggestions
Date: Wed, 16 Jun 1999 04:58:12 -0700
Lines: 63
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts7-36t-14.idirect.com
Message-ID: <37676655@nemo.idirect.com>
X-Trace: 16 Jun 1999 04:54:45 -0400, ts7-36t-14.idirect.com
Organization: via Internet Direct

Status: O

talk about esp and its impossibility

talk about how you met a bear while hiking

talk about how you were scared shitless rock climbing when your rope snapped

or the time you visited your friends friend with him and your buddy was
almost beaten to death when the friend he visited had a boyfriend who came
out and there was a 20 minute car chase through lights and you were looking
for the cops but lot the crazed boyfriend before you found cops.

or the time you were in the hospital and it changed the way food tastes.
the birds sound clearer now.

or the time you netbused (hacked) into a bank but chickened out and put the
money into a charity

or talk about the famous person you met

does she believe in ghosts?  why?

you like candles and incense.  what does SHE like?  the music game modified
for all types of objects.

play the question game with her

or hotseat (like question game but more brutal)

talk about the time you bladed down a steep hill and survived.

talk about the time you were on stage

...

mystery



-----


From nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org Wed Apr 12 07:31:37 2000
From: nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org (Nathan SZILARD)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: After the # close

On Mon, 03 Apr 2000 21:26:22 GMT, Rio  wrote:
| I was reading elsewhere on a post, that if you instruct her to sound
| cheerful on the phone when you call when you do a # close.

I tried that, it's not a magic bullet. But it's fun.

I now always write some shit along with my phone #:
something like "DO NOT FALL IN LOVE" or "NO STALKING PLEASE".

They find it very funny and show it to their friends, plus
they remember.

| If you did any anchoring on your voice when you met, now's the time to
| unleash them.



----

From slidewguy@remove-aol.com Wed Apr 12 07:47:28 2000
From: "whoisthis19" 
Subject: Some closes
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast

Hand her the slip of paper and pen and have her write down her number.
When she's hands it back, ask her to put it someplace so you will
remeber to call her.  Last time I did this she put it down my pants and
grabbed my cock.  

Ask a gal to trade shirts.  When she balks, keep pressing in a joking
manner then finally ask to her to go outside to trade shirts.  Nothing
better then getting her outside.

Another one is simply saying its too smokey, noisy, smelly in here. 
Lets go outsde for some air.

Any of you guys got ways of getting chicks to leave with you outside
the club?

greg1

Did you sleep with yourself or... did you turn yourself down because
 you was too easy.

A conversation with Mystery! Pickups

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


A conversation with Mystery!

Tips on fieldwork from a pick up artist! on IRC #PUA!


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A Conversation with Mystery, a Pick-up Artist (PUA)

Topics Include: 

The Kiss Close
Clubbing alone
Handling guys
Being a story-teller
Preparation and format
Quality vs. quantity

Lego: Hey Mystery, what's your favorite story to close with?  How 
exactly do you transition from the telling of a story to closing?

Mystery: "The Kiss Close" is my favorite routine.  Once you have three 
indicators of interest (she touches you, laughs consistantly at your 
jokes, leans in towards you, smiles a lot and keeps eye contact, resumes 
chat when you force silence, etc) you then phase shift.  You turn 180 
degrees on a dime.  Go from humorous and non-sexual to saying, "Stop.  
Would you like to kiss me?", right out of the blue.  She will say either 
say, "Uh - no",(which is unlikely as you don't bother performing "The 
Kiss Close" until enough indicators are present) or, "I donno" (they 
rarely say, "Yes"). "I donno" means she actually does want to but feels 
embarrassed on how to say "Yes".  So you reply, "Lets find out", then go 
in slowly and kiss her.  It's very simple and very effective.  If she 
says, "Why?", this is also a yes.  Simply reply, "It looked like you had 
something on your mind.  Would you like to kiss me?"  Wait again for 
her response.  If her response is "No" then reply, "Hey I didn't say you 
COULD.  You just had that look in your eye."

Lego: What do you do if you're interrupted? You're telling your target 
a story and she is all into it but some AFC cock-blocking idiot just 
runs up and starts screaming and yelling and you're like, "What the 
fuck?"

Mystery: Simply ask him if you can borrow his pen.  When he gives it to 
you, throw it away as you say, "Fetch."

Wakeboarder: Hahaha.  Nice!

Lego: What if he's bigger than you?

Mystery: I'd instead call him on his disruptive shit and remark, "Dude, 
what are you attempting here?"  Not good enough?  Then say, "Ladies?  
Shall we discover what adventure awaits us in another room?"

Wakeboarder: Man, none of my buds want to go to the club.

Gamer: Screw them then.

Mystery: Go alone.

Wakeboarder: I need to be made fun of for this comment but I feel like 
a weiner if I go to a club myself

Lego: Bro, your trippin'. I go solo many times. It's good actually.  
It's weird if it's a first night but if I've been there before it's cool.

Mystery: Yeah, I understand ... and yet, staying home alone will make 
you feel so much better?  Go out alone, meet some cool dudes when you 
get there (they will become your wingmen there) and then run around 
getting #'s.  Report to your fellow PUAs what happened.  Whatever happened 
to the concept, "The alphamale gets all the women?"  Shit dude, what are 
you, a mommas boy?  Do you need your hand held?  

Lego: How do you strike up conversations with guys?

Mystery: Walk up and say, "Hey dude, question for ya.  Do you know 
where a good place to score is in this city? 'Cause this place looks like a 
cock farm."

Lego: Good!  You should be able to relate to guys to disarm them.  You 
don't compete; you ELIMINATE COMPETETION.

Gamer: LOL.  Dude, the only results I've had were solo.  My friends 
psych me out too much because they never help.  Instead they just complain 
about my taking too much time.  They laugh at me or just generally piss 
me off.

Mystery: I have MUCH better results (and MUCH more fun) playing "The 
Game" alone.  It forces you to approach.  It's a great motivator.

Lego: Damn! I couldn't have put it better myself.

Gamer: Yep.

Mystery: You wont be alone for more than five minutes once you approach 
your first set anyways.  Gamer, I suggest you call them on their shit 
at some point.  Demonstrate your alphamale characteristics.

Lego: How do you continue talking?  I mean, group set dynamics are much 
different in a one one on one approach.

Mystery: Be a story-teller - THAT is the skill of the PUA.  It isn't 
SEDUCING; it's STORY-TELLING.  It is my personal belief that SS patterns 
arent as 'hypnotic' as they are 'entertaining' stories.

Wakeboarder: Sweet

Lego: Actually with the story stuff I SEE WHAT YOU MEAN.  They just 
follow that lead.

Wakeboarder: Well, I need to stop being a sackless wonder and grow some 
fuckin' balls then!  Hmm, story telling ...

Mystery: Here's an example.  "Ever been camping?  Well I was up in a 
forest up north and was hiking with some girlfriends of mine ... and we 
came along some trail and there was shit on the path.  My friends were 
like, "haaaa someone shit in the woods" and I said, "lets get the fuck 
out of here like NOW."  they thought I was just scared of shit and I 
said, "Girls, you dont get it.  This shit is still warm and its not human.  
Its bear shit.  This is a big fucking bear.  Look at the size of that 
turd."  Notice it's not sexual?  Most hot girls gets get "sex-talk" 
right away from AFCs.  NOT talking sex with them makes them question 
whether you are interested in them.  Leave them guessing until you get 
indicators of interest from them.  If they like your great personality 
(confident, humorous, etc) they will give you subtle but distinct clues.

Gamer: How do you flow from story to story?

Mystery: If there is ONE mental state you should force yourself into, 
its TALKATIVE.  Talk your fucking HEAD off.  Just go from one story 
straight into another one like a comedian does.  Ever find yourself excited 
about something and you talk and talk and talk?  THAT is what must 
happen to get a girl.  You have to ENTERTAIN them.  Look talkative yet not 
desperate.  

Gamer: Heh.

Lego: Dude, I had that going last night. You're so right.  That's an 
excellent example dude.  I was telling this story about getting harassed 
by cops or some shit.  It's a cool story but my delivery sucked and I 
was losing one of the two girls I was telling it to.  What if they fail 
to elaborate on your story?  Besides it being a bad story to begin 
with, how can you fix it on the fly?

Mystery: They don't have to interact with it.  Its a good thing to have 
flexible stories to allow for some comment but it's not nessessary.  
It's YOUR job to perform the material.  It's your audiences job to 
listen,laugh and generally be entertained.  That's it.  At the end of 10 
minutes you will see the girls digging you (positive indicators).  You then 
phase shift abruptly into the close.

Lego: HOW DO YOU PHASE SHIFT?  I've been wondering this. While I didn't 
come off as obvious in last nights case and just told her to kiss me (I 
knew she would anyway), this could have been smoother.

Alpha: Lego, you ad libbed the close?  So working on ad libbing is 
good?

Mystery: Ad libbed material is not as accurate in closing as is 
performing the well constructed and field-tested "Kiss Close" routine.  Ad 
libbing is BONUS material but don't COUNT on it.  Have your material, like 
a good comedian, prepared before performing.  This isn't "A Night at 
the Improv" fellas.

Gamer: Heh.

Mystery: All PUs have a format; a beginning, a middle and an end.  If 
you don't know what the next routine is going to be then you may end up 
with an unfortunate pregnant pause which fucks up your pacing.  You may 
end up filling the silence with the deadly, "So ... um ... what do you 
do?"  Preparation saves face.  Afterall, with your particular close, 
she could have pulled away from your trying to kiss her.  Then what?!!  
Instead, consider engaging her in enthusiastic conversation, then go 
directly into the close.  In other words, stop her in mid-sentence and 
with a curious tone, kiss close.

Wakeboarder: cool.  Lego, what indicators clued you in that she wanted 
the kiss?

Alpha: In what way can you be prepared?  If we're talking about 
story-telling in front of a random girl we just met seconds ago in a random 
place ...

Mystery: Like a good comedian, have your material prepared yet when 
onstage be prepared to dynamically omit certain routines and to add others 
on the fly.  Sometimes certain routines fit the situation better than 
others.  Have 3 to 5 alternative openers (as a comedian would) and enjoy 
performing the one you think best fits the situation will get the best 
reaction for the group you are in front of

Alpha: Gotcha now.  Can you give me a brief example of how you go about 
preparing?

Mystery: Sure.  First, find 3 openers and memorize them.  Write down a 
list of openers (just the headings of each opener to remind you).  
Next, write down some routines (the question game, the music game, the 
photo routine, the bear in the woods story, etc - all on dejanews) and then 
also memorize the kiss close and the # close.  Memorize 3 NEGs too and 
you are good to go.  With the material in your mind, you are prepared 
to work it in the field until you have the timing of the material down 
(again, just like a comedian.)

Alpha: Man, you provide some really eye-opening ideas... (just when I'm 
about to think there's nothing more to learn.

Wakeboarder: So what you're saying is have a routine set up and modify 
it to each situation? Kind of like having a PU template?

Mystery: It's ALL about format.  Know the format and stick to it.  If 
you now what the next step is in the PU, you wont feel scared.  It gets 
fun and you begin to appreciate the strategy behind it all.

Wakeboarder: Yeah like FMAC? That's a simple format.

Mystery: Yes, FMAC.  Each letter in FMAC is an abrupt phase shift.  
"FIND" means having to abruptly disturb your complacency by getting out of 
the house.  It takes effort for many people to do bother getting THIS 
FAR.  "MEET" is a HUGE abrupt change.  "There she is!  3, 2, 1, GO!"  In 
the "ATTRACT" phase, you need to go from the walk up to the TALKATIVE 
performer entertaining story-teller.  You will need A LOT of energy for 
this (enthusiasm is contagious afterall) and for many to go from 
slumping around to being in performer mode is ABRUPT.  Finally you must then 
"CLOSE"; to phase shift from humour to serious is also abrupt.  Each 
phase may FEEL awkward but it looks normal.  When a comedian finishes one 
topic and just goes into an entirely new unrelated topic, the audience 
doesn't care as long as the next topic is entertaining.

Wakeboarder: Very true.

Gamer: Cool.  I'm collecting openers and other routines off the 
layguide right now.

Alpha: Do you believe in the 80/20 'rule'?  Meaning, 80% of the quality 
women are found in 20% of the right places or connections or 
situations.

Mystery: The quality of a woman is SO subjective. Quality is difficult 
to QUANTIFY.  80% of QUALITY?  It's pointless trying to mix and match 
these concepts. INSTEAD consider that there are HOTTIES and UGs (YOU get 
to decide based on your personal criteria) and of the HOTTIES, some 
have pleasant personalities and others do not.  You cannot possibly judge 
her personality until she LIKES you.  So go out ... FIND her, MEET her, 
ATTRACT her and THEN decide if you want to CLOSE her AFTER judging her 
personality.  Judging her by the way she treats you on your approach is 
lame because particularly beautiful women all have their bitch shields 
up and running.  They have to.  They aren't planning on fucking every 
guy that says Hi to them.  The only way to get rid of the guys is to 
oftentimes offend them quickly.  It's not personal.  It's merely a learned 
strategy.  So is the "I have a boyfriend excuse, but that's a different 
story.  I also suggest CLOSING everyone just for the education.  You 
don't actually have to CALL the girls of course.  You simply get to 
practice CLOSING too.  Getting a girls number is merely an OPTION.  You 
don't have to follow up on ALL of them you know.

Keen: Heh.

Wakeboarder: Cool, judging the girls only after you have attracted 
them.  Kind of makes you approach too!  You can't say the bull shit line, 
"She's not my type, I can tell", to get you out of approaching.

Alpha: Do you have a web page?

Mystery: No, not currently.  I'm writing a book though called The 
Mystery Method.  Most of my ramblings can be found on the layguide. 

Ascence: Hey, is it true that the older we get the more money/social 
status becomes and issue?

Mystery: No matter what social status you have (or THINK you have), 
it's still something you must convey in the first 25 minutes of meeting 
her.  We ALL start equal BEFORE meeting her; all men.  The issue is, can 
we congruently convey our social status (real or not) in our 
performance?  That's OUR responsibility.  The best way is not to TELL them about 
it but rather to DEMONSTRATE it.  How?  Well, if you talk about having 
girls always falling for you for instance, it's not NEARLY as good as 
actually having a couple hot girls with you saying what a hottie you are 
infront of the target.  This is called PAWNING.

Keen: I'm going to try doing the story-telling that you talked about.  
It's really hard though. I'm a real bad storyteller.  I've been working 
on it today. that's my lesson today.

Wakeboarder: Tell them about that time you saw a fallen over manequin 
in the department store and you tripped over it.  The security guard 
thought you were trying to make it with the manequin and called you a 
little freak.

Gamer: LOL (Laughing Out Loud).

Wakeboarder: One more question for you Mystery.  What's the meaning of 
life?

Mystery: To fuck. :)

Statement of Intent (SOI)

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Rio introduces a key part of PU: the 'Statement of Intent' (SOI)!

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2000 09:00:50 GMT
Subject: Find Stun Drag Fuck

G'day,

Jonathan Ashton  wrote in message
news:90eati$gpt@nnrp1.deja.com...
> As I've read the twelve-odd messages in this thread, I've been looking
> for something to take home with me, but I'm not finding it.
>
> Rio, how do you do things differently now, based on what you've said?

First thing would be to think about the close. Mystery knows his group work
perfect from how I read it, and I have been using his methods to great
success social-proof wise.

The BIG thing that clocked in my head was the need to STATE YOUR INTENTIONS
to the chick within the first minute of meeting her. I will make that my
rule from now on - as with the 3 second rule.
By this I DON'T mean "Let's fuck" or "Come to Papa baby" or any throw-away
shit like that. It has to be an honest assessment of what YOU feel capable
of doing to the chick after the "Hi" and the first round of fluff/routine
(routine preferred - something humourous). GM does this part BEAUTIFULLY,
because he does it with a sense of fun and humour - and HE KNOWS he is going
to do what he says and so does SHE!
I notice Mr. Sex states this a lot in his past posts - where AFC or shit
PUAs do approaches and talk to the chick, but never get to the point AND the
bitch can tell that the guys want to fuck but are too pussy to go for it.
Ross says something to the tune of "And maybe we could really get to like
each other" when he closes in HTGTWYDIB. I also recall that TokyoPUA did a
statement of intentions on that chick he PUed at night once who was
initially scared of him. Johnny Shack does it by when he just springs dates
on women he just met.
So there's some cross references.

The proper methodological way to get to a statement of intentions part is by
pace and lead. But the point of the matter is, you have to structure the
conversation to show interest and intent VERY soon or you will stall, chick
will get bored, feel teased, and then it's C&B time. Believe me, a LOT of
C&B experience with a LOT of HOT chicks has so far has taught me this
painful lesson.
The best way to put it is in the most honest way possible. I cannot give you
a specific example. But the idea is to get her thinking romantically about
you VERY soon. THEN you HAVE TO DO WHAT YOU SAID you would do to the chick
after DDB. (E.g. If you want to start things off gently by holding her hand,
tell her a scene where want to be holding her hand - and then do it in the
next routine after she is comfortable with this.) If you do NOT DO what you
say you will, eventually your congruence will fuck up when the chick loses
patience. Then the chick will be confused, get scared, and bolt. If this
ever happens and the guy tries to do heavy kino or try for a fuck while the
chick is in this state - It's gonna be RAPE.

In fact, on the matter of Rape. I read in Cosmo (Hey, My chick gets fucked
often and STILL reads this!) that psychologists WARN women against guys that
say "Come to my place to see my pictures" etc. when the idea is to fuck the
chick whilst your intentions aren't known to her - because it is DATE RAPE.
Thus as Maniac found out ages ago, that GROUNDWORK is the key element to
getting the chick over to fuck. That can be done through STATEMENT OF
INTENTIONS - and may not necessarily happen through Kiss closes.
You must remember this - a kiss is just a kiss........

IF that works, THEN we can reward her with more conversation and more
Mystery style routines or whatever (because she is OK with our intentions
then - thus the rewards), and THEN up the ante some more with our STATEMENT
OF INTENTIONS, building on what we established before - to get her more hot
and horny than before. So you may have started on holding her hands, now you
may progress on to hugging, kissing, fucking etc. whatever seems to be the
most logical progression from her actions towards you.

Patterns, routines, psych tests, will help greatly during the chat routines
in-between statements of intentions. Those are what set us apart from the
other PUAs out there.

Eventually we get to a point where the chick is DDB, then we can get to the
Drag (you must take the woman to fuck location, or have her so into you that
she will come to you) and Fuck part (in our world of course). The Our World
routine would then be the ULTIMATE in the STATEMENT OF INTENTIONS series
which would then lead to the deal fuck closed. It is in this one that you
state your relationship expectations and put it in "Our World"

Now the method is Find, Stun, Drag, Fuck.

The point is - FUCK all this bullshit about the woman needs to be done in
the "right way" to match her values. Something tells me now that a woman
made this comment as an attempt to rationalize her unreasonable emotions.
The values she wants ALL ALONG is #1 SEX, and to a lesser extent #2 to be
taken care of after SEX. That goes for ANY woman (thus the universality of
the whole principle). When the guy comes along as does her, she will
rationalise that the guy understood exactly what she felt. That's what some
religious women mean when they beautifully say "God knew when it was the
right time for me". In reality, they KNOW DEEP DOWN they are at the mercy of
guys and what they want to do with her. To her, that is "destiny" and no
wonder so many women are suckers for fortune-telling and the like.

Eliciting is when you want to # close or coffee close and check the girl out
for relationship potential. If it's ONS - hey! ya don't need it! If you
cannot attempt a kiss to fuck close in the given situation - you will have
to # close, but not forget to state that your intentions could well get
beyond just coffee!

The other thing - "Make no excuses for desires as a man" is THE SINGLE MOST
IMPORTANT THING (As Ross Jeffries has already said) but I had to experience
it myself to believe it. ALL of what I explained above IS USELESS in
practical application if you are trying to follow it like a script. The idea
is to GRAB that girl and NOT let her get away! ;) So guys, HOW MUCH DO YOU
WANT THAT GIRL? WHAT ARE YOU PREPARED TO DO?

Also on that note. BE A FUCKING MAN. Act like a guy, and don't think that
mirroring a girl completely is going to make you attractive to her. I know
from experience that the more caveman I go with chicks who KNOW my
intentions, the more they respond sexually.
Talk to chicks as if you were telling your kid brother how to play football
properly, cause your kid brother happens to be shit at football. I
especially like the way Mr. Sex talks to us on ASF - giving pointers and
what-not. I'm sure he talks to chicks exactly the same way IRL - showing
congruence all along.

You can even get around the language barrier! I just about dragged a sexy
Jgirl in a bikini off the beach while babbling to them in English! A
language they didn't even understand! I did that enough and with a smile,
that the chick went DDB and ready to GO when I took her hand. Had it not
been for the cockblock!
Somebody must have taught the "Iranian from hell" this shit!

The way I think about it is much like caveman sex. You see the hot chick,
you bang her on the head with your club, you take her to your cave, you root
her. Thus :- Find Stun Drag Fuck.
Just a bit more aggressive than Find Meet Attract Close, but that's the best
way I could describe what this ugly-as-fuck PUA was doing.

These were the attitudes that I had when I was only just starting to pull
women at incredible speeds while on holiday.

The other point is on Objection handling in regards to the STATEMENT OF
INTENTIONS. What I learned from the PUA I met, is that you fight chick
bullshit with your own bullshit - with a slightly authoritive tone (no need
to REALLY get pissed).
For example :- The chicks said "We have to get to our car" and were ready to
leave
The Playboy said "You can't leave anyway because the gates are closed" even
though the gates aren't closed.
Thus this covers handling chick bullshit - on the phone as well as in real
life.
And one chick on another seduction board I read often typed something to the
tune that she wants to be with a guy that can bullshit his way into her
pants.

So there you go. Find Stun Drag Fuck.
Stun is the hardest.

> There are reasons why most of us step through seduction so gingerly.
> We know that saying or doing one wrong thing can blow up the seduction.
> As far as I can tell, letting her know you intend to fuck her before
> you fuck her is one of those things.  Another reason is that women
> won't tell you when they're ready to fuck.

But DDB does tell all!
That single most common fuckup is what is called LACK OF CONGRUENCE
(definition courtesy of Mr. Sex). Just like when I called that chick I met
yesterday "my friend" in front of her. Doing that is a sign of weakness.
Chicks can get away with having words out of congruence with their actions,
but guys CANNOT.

> You say that when you "lead girls on" and tease them too much, you look
> easy and they hate you.  But this insight doesn't make it any easier to
> recognize when you're "leading them on".  The window between when a
> woman is receptive to a close and when you've stalled her is short, and
> spotting it seems to be harder than superstring theory.  The answer
> seems to be to make hundreds of approaches, and very slowly improve
> through experience.

Well you have body language and other subtle pointers. Plus we are adding
all the time to our STATEMENT OF INTENTIONS in order to find a barrier and
cut off point. I don't doubt that noticing DDB when you have the intuition
becomes easier.

  The one concrete thing I get out of your post is
> that next time two HBs want a foursome with you and your LTR, you'll be
> more likely to recognize it.  Or maybe the situation will be different
> enough that you won't.

I fucked that up because I KNOW those chicks wanted me to go with them, and
I over-teased them and didn't capitulate and then state my intentions to
have a foursome. They would have been up for it!
That's when the Playboy showed up to show me the shit, and then beat me
hands-down in a round of THE GAME. ;)

> You also said, "Now I realise more than fucking EVER what a chick
> wants. She wants a guy to go and GET her, make her feel wanted, and
> then have the shit fucked out of her!"  But you agreed with another
> poster that you can't just walk up to a woman and say "Let's fuck."
> So what's your new insight here?

It's a no-brainer. Is sex ALL you bringing to the table? That's why he
coupled GM styled intention pointers further into the seduction (after the
earlier G-rated ones), and then when they succeeded in not objecting, he
went to Mystery routines as a reward OR to the Drag phase if they were DDB.
You cannot start the seduction with a statement of intention that skips the
buildup - unless the chick is THAT FUCKING HORNY and shameless.
Chicks want to know that you care about them as human beings and not just
sex objects. Thus neutral conversation gets smattered in between, and the
final statement of intentions clearly shows what his intentions are so SHE
KNOWS that you care about her feelings - in that way.

The Playboy I met even went to see a chick he had a threesome with the next
day (cause she was feeling a bit alone). This guy was no cheap "Player"
(which he pointed out in his great Our world styled close routine on this
9). You could tell he cared enough too.

> Have you figure out a better way to know when a woman is ready to
> be closed?  Or a faster way to get her to want to fuck?  Or a way to
> let her know your intentions without scaring her off?  What's the
> difference between your approach now and your approach before you went
> to Guam?  It sounds like you feel you understand things better than
> you did before, but I can't figure out what the new understanding is.

Well, now you have your answer.
Mind you, I'm only getting the framework now that I sit down and try and
explain what I am now doing. This shit became automatic when I had the whole
experience of witnessing this guy and learning from him.

Any questions or comments? Fire away....

Rio
-------

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
References:  <90eati$gpt@nnrp1.deja.com> <63JW5.205t1.56373@nnrp.gol.com> <90i82p$iao@nnrp1.deja.com>
Subject: Re: Find Stun Drag Fuck

Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2000 10:04:46 GMT

Jonathan Ashton  wrote in message
news:90i82p$iao@nnrp1.deja.com...
> In article <63JW5.205t1.56373@nnrp.gol.com>,
>   "Rio"  wrote:
> > Well, now you have your answer.
>
> Yeah, I understand much better now.  Thanks for writing it down.
>
> > Any questions or comments? Fire away....
>
> So I get the abstract idea now:  Make some sort of Statement Of
> Intentions (SOI) to a woman relatively early, and then act congruently
> with it.

More or less, that's it.
The thing is, after dropping routines - get to it or the chick gets confused
and drops out.
Mystery had the right idea with his routines and intros. BUT if you fail to
State your intentions - you can stall things and stale her out. Then it will
be your fault when it appears that the routines don't work! They may have
worked, but she has given up on you as a partner already. You teased too
much.

> Like most people, though, I don't really understand any abstract idea
> until I've seen two or three concrete examples; i.e. HOW to make that
> SOI.

Ross Jeffries has already covered how to do this with his NLP pacing and
leading. I'm just giving a name to the end result of doing that (SOI -
Statement of Intention).

SOIs are SO important to women. They want to know where they stand. Women
you are with and haven't SOIed will think to themselves :- "What am I to
him"?
With my LTR which I sloppily SOIed, she annoyed me for ages if I was her
boyfriend or not. I hadn't said, and was therefore walking thin ice.
That drove her NUTS.

Now, I guess I could show you some fake examples of stuff that you could
launch into your PU - but the reason why I'm not going to do that is because
if ANYBODY creates a list of them - we're going to get the problem that AFC
men ALREADY have with PU Lines. That is, throwing meaningless words into a
conversation and then not being able to back them up.
Either that, or we will develop a single street pickup routine which men
will use the world over with great success before women cotton on to it.
When it comes to SOI, DIY (damn all these acronymns!).

An example of SOI is what I said to the chick I tried to PU on the weekend.
I paced it to the point where we are talking about where we lived, and I
found out that she lived close. Then I said "That's good, so we can get
together really easy and have some fun then."
If she had been far away - no problem "That's too bad. I'll have to travel
far to get together with you and have fun"
If she lives on Mars - no problem "Wow! You live out there! I'll have to
build a rocket to come and see you after you go back there!"

So there you go. Who needs to be excessively GM?

> You gave the example of GM style.  Yep, GM makes a pretty clear SOI.
> I don't think a "recovering nice guy" like me could do GM congruently,
> though.

I have done it once successfully and it Suuure works. But yes, it's hard to
work things up to that because you skip a lot of buildup steps. The flirting
has to take place in a sexual level rather than a much safer level. That is
risky.
That's what I mean when by saying "Let's Fuck" you run the risk of having to
flirt at such a high level where you can fuck up easily. Not that it's
impossible of course.
NEGs (which I forgot to mention before) help especially in the
objection,flirt phase. This phase is like the part where the dog chases
after the bitch to try and fuck her, and the bitch keeps running. The thrill
of the chase!

> You mention TokyoPUA and Johnny Shack references, but it would take
> a lot of searching/guessing to find the specific examples you have in
> mind.  And I don't understand your Ross example - "And maybe we could
> really get to like each other" sounds like a pretty vague SOI; maybe
> I'd understand what you mean if I knew the context?

Search for stuff on the archived layguide for stuff about Johnny Shack. He
also has an online book. Ross has his old free book around the place. Search
Formhandle for TokyoPUA's posts.
By the way, I even went as far as reading ALL of Mystery's decent posts as
well.

> The only example of an SOI I see in your posts is this one from Guam
> PUA:
>
> > As for going for the fuck close? Forget your sexual accelerators.
> > This guy said the whole shit in plain English - and I saw him say
> > this all to to a chick. He basically said that he was a playboy, but
> > not a pickup artist (to frame the idea that he won't fuck and dump),
> > and that when he had sex with the chick (Framing it as if it's going
> > to happen) that she should just enjoy it for fun and not worry about
> > it too much because it's just their private thing (our world style
> > routine), and that he was not an easy guy in reality - that he was
> > quite selective in who he chooses for sex (so he doesn't look like a
> > meat-market man).
> > He said all this straight faced to a chick, and while I was watching
> > the chick he did this on - she was trancing out and playing with her
> > hair. It was totally evil.
>
> So my questions...
>
> Have you ever done a SOI to kiss a girl and not had her object?  If so,
> what did you say?  Have you ever done a SOI to fuck a girl and not had
> her object?  If so, what did you say?  Hell, do you remember the exact
> words of any SOI you've ever said?

I gave you an example above of an SOI above (where I told the chick that we
would hang out in the future). No doubt we can refine the whole shit a lot
better in the future.
And yes. I think everyone at some stage has done an SOI, or the body
language has been good enough to get her into that zone where she KNOWS
maybe at 70% where your intentions are, with or without any routines to help
snag the chick, and the chick has put up some token resistance. The purpose
of the resistance of course, is to set the scene for the chase you know will
end in a fuck if you can just reel the bitch in. You will eventually do it
as long as you have remained congruent throughout.

> What other kinds of SOIs would you use in the buildup?  Tell her you're
> going to give her a neck massage?  (I'm sure that question sounds
> clueless; but I really think the meat is in the details.)

Well pace it:-
"Have you ever felt like having a neck massage? I think you need one, so
I'll give you one"
Sometimes the more direct your SOIs are, the harder she will force you to
keep pushing them.
So let's say the chick flirts and says "Why do you want to? I don't need
one!"
So we have to SOI her again in the second sentence in this example :- "Well
you haven't had one of my massages that can make you feel good all over. Now
relax....."

The idea is to trap the chick at all costs with your intentions that you can
carry out - until she can't get away.
Even "No I can't!" "Yes you can!" "No I can't!" "Yes you can!" fights - if
that's what it comes down to - can win you the day if you persist and not
let her win! Verbal arguments can always be solved with kino - cause you as
the guy are STRONGER. I don't mean hit her, but mauling is OK as long as she
is enjoying it! ;)

Persistance is VERY important. Of course, you may want to dump the chick
after the fuck if she doesn't drop the shit because she is too much work to
obtain sex from in the long run. Just give her an ultimatum "Cut the shit or
you will be lonely!"

At the same time, you can get trapped if you say an SOI that you can't
possibly keep. So watch what you promise to do!
Saying shit like "I'm going to buy you a Rolls Royce!" when she KNOWS you
can't afford it is an extreme example of a shit SOI. There goes your trust
and congruency with that one.

> And as for one other comment you made:
>
> > (E.g. If you want to start things off gently by holding her hand,
> > tell her a scene where want to be holding her hand - and then do it
> > in the next routine after she is comfortable with this.)
>
> You mean you tell her a story about some guy you know who held some
> girl's hand?  Or what?  Methinks I really don't understand here.

You can do that to get her thinking about holding someone's hand - and once
she is feeling it, you may be able to slip in the kino and get away with it.
At least, your chances will be better.

> > Is sex ALL you bringing to the table? That's why he
> > coupled GM styled intention pointers further into the seduction
> > (after the earlier G-rated ones), and then when they succeeded in
> > not objecting, he went to Mystery routines as a reward OR to the
> > Drag phase if they were DDB.
>
> I would LOVE to see these SOIs written down.

Done as above. But make your own!
I re-explained the "Let's Fuck" problem a bit better above as well.

> So here's my deal:  I want to see more examples of SOIs so I can take
> them apart, because I really suspect that the exact wording is crucial.
>
> For example:
>
> GM gets away with his SOIs because they're exaggerated to absurdity,
> and thus they're both funny and unlikely (at least as stated).
> This puts a little distance between the SOI and the girl, so she
> doesn't slap him.

I think it's more of a case of the GM SOIs that fail, he can write them off
as being jokes. That keeps him on track and congruent.
BUT the risk of failure is very high if he doesn't cover his tracks.

> Guam PUA gets away with his SOI (quoted above) because he's talking
> about chicks in general, and not overtly about the particular chick.
> This puts a little distance between the SOI and the girl, so she's
> not pressured to make a decision right then.

This is the all important point. With some SOIs (and especially with
ambiguities in NLP) the SOIs are not in your face, BUT they are vague enough
to get the point across and then judge for a positive reaction from her or
not. However, the vagueness is simply a shot from 50 metres as opposed to a
shot from point-blank. Just make sure you hit the target.
The danger with point-blank SOIs is they are risky in so far as if you say a
dumb one you can't,won't, or don't want to carry out like "I'm going to take
you on holiday!" as opposed to an NLP shot from 50 metres which describes a
holiday and builds on it. "Have you ever been on holiday with someone
special?....."

> Am I on the right track here?  Are there other ways to word SOIs that
> get around direct resistance?  More examples would be appreciated.

You should check out patterning, but remember, a shot from point-blank is
better than 50 metres. The shortest distance between 2 points is a straight
line. There are pros and cons of both styles of course.
You can take the short path across the dangerous ravine, or the long path
around it.

> I gotta say, this whole idea of SOIs is new to me.  Maybe other PUAs
> in this group have been using them without ever realizing/stating the
> importance of them?

I just gave a name to it. People have done this stuff before and I'm just
giving it a name to help explain what I'm doing.

And no, Ray can't trademark this either and claim it's his. We have
discussed why this is enough on ASF. He's filtered anyway and I can't see
his verbal shit.

> Thanks,
> Ash

Thanks for the questions. They help challenge me in trying to explain myself
better.

Rio

-------

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Clearing SOI's up
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 12:15:23 GMT

Maniac,

I came up with the SOI concept after studying what the Guam Playboy did to
chicks. I wish I could have spent longer down there to learn more off this
guy. Oh well, I just need to save up to go again.

SOI (Statements of intention/interest) were comments that the Guam Playboy
made a lot (I assume you read my report on that place - It's nanpa
paradise!). What he did then was control the flirting that followed after
baiting her with a show of interest. He did this by offering a challenge -
when he finished doing that once he went back to fun routines, talking about
parties on the island, jokes, sex personality tests, etc. before he did
another SOI - staring out as indirect and ambiguous, before being VERY
direct. ;)

Basically what I think I have come up with, through trying to explain to the
posters that asked me about him, is a flirting construction kit.

The Guam Playboy NEGged a LOT - and he got away with it every time. He could
even tell chicks AFC things like they were beautiful, and then turn it into
a NEG if he wanted. That's what over 20 years of daily PU did for this guy.

But the NEG is only one kind of flirting (used for dumping a girl's uptight
self image). There are other kinds, such as using ambiguities, physical
light-handed slapping and pushing kino, playing tricks on people, etc. The
Playboy used plenty of variations.

Flirting is this:- One drops the SOI, and then pulls it away out of reach of
the target. Then gives another SOI, and then pulls it away again. Like with
our words, we put images of sex and romance in their heads, then pull it out
again, then out it in, then take it out, then put it back in, then take it
out again........ Mindfucking!
Once the chick is confused and teased enough, she is DDB and safely
mindfucked.

I did a PU once on a chick using the SOIs. I found out where she lived and
then said "Oh that's not far from my place, so I can come down to see you.
It's a pity I am so busy it won't happen today"
(Note that there is a bit of future pacing and presuppositioning in this)
She lapped it up and took my kino from there - despite the BF being a matter
of metres away.

The structure for the Guam Playboy routine went like this:-

- Fun routine or opener (ala Mystery) - some basic fluff - all good things
about himself, what he could do for the women (he played the helpful tour
guide). Be "Disgustingly" Charming! as he put it. The guy wasn't big on
logically drawing out routines for what he did (which is a good thing), he
just went and DID this.... thus he couldn't really explain to me what he was
doing. I had to observe.
- SOI. He said something that hinted that he was interested in the chick
(paced and lead from his opener conversation). This got her emotions going
and her ideas racing. I have found this CRITICAL if the chick is going to
stay interested in you for too long. I bored many chicks out initially when
I wouldn't get to the point.
"What do you look for in guys?" would be sufficient enough as a question to
hint at what you are after (as you have found out yourself Maniac). Starting
off on a topic about guys and relationships usually brings chicks out, but
asking "Do you have a BF?" sucks.
This Ross Jeffries inspired SOI "The more you laugh, the more you'll be
attracted to interesting people......now with me" is an ambiguous SOI.
- Before she could knock him down for any comment, he would then be a
challenge and say something like "I'm not easy", "we don't know each other
well enough yet", "but what would I know, right? ;)","I need to feel passion
first", "Yeah, you know what I'm saying". These basically FORCE the chick to
continue the flirting (initiated by the SOI) along the lines that HE wanted
(and the lines that chicks SAY they want!).
By saying that he "needed time" and "not being easy", the chick already
attracted to him would then come onto him.

Most of the time the chicks would laugh becuase they'd get stuck for a smart
comeback. And he just kept this up, alternating back to party and fun
routines, until he got to the "sex-SOI-Our World-But I'm no sleaze"routine
which would then DDB the target to fuck - or get her ready for it next time
they met.
Negative commands also work great here to spark challenge. Just like I did
with my now LJBF ex-LTR "I'm not going to fuck you".

I've noted in my past failures (too many to count) that when I have dropped
SOI hints - the chicks have taken the flirting into areas which were
impossible for me to control - fucking me up and making me look stupid.
Especially in clubs where chicks do this like child's play to anyone who
"hits" on them. They use their irrational chick logic to fuck themselves
(and you) up. If that happens, your PU is history.
We can't give the women control, especially not in flirting, because they
aren't the ones that are trying to do PU. It's their job as "virtuous" women
to try and get away from PU, or try to fuck our PU up.

Svengali also said in his MLTR theory something which rings home on this. He
said (and I quote):-

"Seventh: If you don't give a woman something to be pissed about every
now and then, she'll find something on her own, and that will be harder
to get out of (because it will be of her making and criteria, not
yours)."

That is also the point of what we should be doing in flirting. To trap the
chick into going along with what your flirting and accepting your advances
(by means of non-objection) while getting her horny at the same time. That
way we avoid snappy comebacks because you've already "Handled her objections
before they came up" (That's something I learnt as a salesman)
This causes the chick to have her token resistance stall out - and puts us
in control.
GM does this with his sex jokes, but he slams any possible retort with "Just
Kidding" thus the chick can't say anything and the flirting goes by GMs
rules and not hers.

Take Mystery's "Nice nails" NEG for example.
He starts off with an SOI "Nice nails". This in and of itself is a
compliment. If he stopped here, the chick would come back (if she were a
bitch) with some smart ass comment to get rid of Mystery.

BUT, he then puts up the CHALLENGE before she gets a chance to reply (like
GM with "Just kidding"). Seemingly innocent too. "Are they real?"

Now the chick is stuck. What's going on? He's complimented me, and now he's
knocking me down! What is he doing? I must stick around for this! What can I
say? Maybe I'll just laugh it off...!? er..?
(Note, some REAL bitches when stalled will look angry at you and say "Huh?"
to which it's GM to the rescue! with "Hide your pleasure!")

So, couple this kind of flirting with lots of things to get her feeling
horny (patterns, sex talk, whatever), and add lots of personality conveying
things thrown in for good measure - and the chick is sufficiently stunned -
and ready for the drag and fuck stage.

Oh, and the Guam Playboy is an ugly fucker. Kipp's seen the pictures.
Looks don't matter for shit. I have great respect for all the older PUAs.

I must get up to Tokyo to see you guys real soon. The inaka sucks.
We can experiment with this some more then. I've been getting rusty since I
got back from Guam.
What I do know is that when this guy's method does work, it is KILLER. We
get Mr. Smooth status and KCs like crazy.

Rio
-------
Dictate the flirting

 wrote in message news:91f5e8$dpn@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Re: SOI's
>
> Rio..
>
> You are on to something big here..
> This is a discovery!
> I will incorporate this.
>
> Please give more specific examples though. I get
> what you are saying, but not yet really how you would
> apply it. .
>
>
> Fucking excellent thread!
>
>
> Maniac
> http://www.pickupguide.com
>
>
> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/

---

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: More on SOIs
Date: Fri, 22 Dec 2000 06:17:41 GMT

THIS IS RIO TYPING IN CAPS. I'M NOT YELLING!

Comments in text below.
After New years, I WILL be ready, and we will hit
the streets.

GREAT. I HAVEN'T BEEN DOING MUCH PU UNTIL YESTERDAY (1 SOLID # FROM A 9 AND
A KC FROM ANOTHER 9) - THUS THIS POST AS I TEST OUT MY THEORY. I HAVE A
FRIEND WHO WOULD LIKE TO COME ALONG. HE'S ALREADY BRIEFED AND VERY
EXPERIENCED IN SCREWING WOMEN IN JAPAN. HE'S READ THE PICKUP GUIDE ALREADY.
HE'S EVEN BEEN SO KIND TO INTRODUCE ME TO SOME WOMEN WHO WANT MERCY FUCKS.
HE ALSO KNOWS SOME GOOD "hole in the wall" PLACES AROUND RAPPONGI WITH LOTS
OF WOMEN (SO HE SAYS).

BTW, Rio; re: 'nomad' player.. mine was fucked up, returned
it for an exchange, new one works..

IT'S SURE BEATS A TAPE RECORDER, DOESN'T IT?

First, this is brilliant material, it is going on the
website, and is core to successful PU I think. It IS what
smooth was doing.. I couldnt identify it, but now it has
been named, and described, I recognize this.. and yes, it
will be TOTALLY lethal..

THANKS. EVERY SUCCESSFUL PUA HAS BEEN DOING SOMETHING LIKE THIS (OF ONE
STYLE OR ANOTHER) TO BED WOMEN. I WENT OUT AND USED THIS FRAME YESTERDAY
WITH INTERESTING AND POSITIVE RESULTS.....

HOWEVER, I MUST SAY IT'S HARD TO GIVE SPECIFIC EXAMPLES UNLESS THEY ARE
SITUATIONALLY BASED. FOLLOWING THE LOGIC HOWEVER, AND USING IT GIVEN THE
SITUATION STILL BRING RESULTS. I WILL DESCRIBE SOME OF WHAT I HAVE BEEN
DOING WITH IT, BUT I CAN'T REMEMBER FOR THE LIFE OF ME WHAT EXACTLY THE GUAM
GUY SAID. (I ONLY RECORDED A SMALL SAMPLE OF OUR CHAT WITH MY MP3 PLAYER.
NONE OF HIS NANPA HOWEVER) WHAT I DO KNOW, IS THAT HE FOLLOWED THIS
STRUCTURE WHICH I HAVE DESCRIBED TO VERY SOME GOOD EFFECTS.

I ASSUME YOU READ MY ORIGINAL STORY ON THE GUAM TRIP.
IF SO, MY REPLY WILL MAKE MORE SENSE.

In article ,
  "Rio"  wrote:
> He did this by offering a challenge -
> when he finished doing that once he went back to fun routines,
talking about

Examples? ?

OK, HE MADE SOME KIND OF COMPLIMENT OR SUGGESTED SOME KIND OF ACTIVITY
(OFTENTIMES WITH SEXUAL OR ROMANTIC UNDERTONES) THAT THEY COULD DO TOGETHER.
(LIKE HANG TIGHT TO EACH OTHER OF THE JET POWERED BANANA BOAT) AND THEN
FOLLOWED THAT WITH A REASON WHY HE WOULD HAVE TROUBLE DOING IT. KINDA LIKE
IN SALES, A SALESMAN WOULD SAY "FOR ONE DAY ONLY SALE", WELL HE WAS LIKE "SO
YOU SHOW UP AT SUCH AND SUCH A TIME, OTHERWISE I WON'T BE ABLE TO SHOW YOU A
GOOD TIME AND I'LL TAKE SOMEONE ELSE" (a takeaway)
SO IN ORDER TO CONTINUE THE FLIRTING, THE CHICK WOULD HAVE TO SHOW UP. HE
WOULD THEN (AFTER HAVING COMPLETED A SOI ROUTINE) SIT BACK AND WATCH THE
CHICK FOLLOW THROUGH. HE WOULD OFTENTIMES BE ABLE TO CONTINUE A CONVERSATION
WITHOUT STALLING - AND MIDWAY HE WOULD SOI HER AGAIN AND DO THE SAME ROUTINE
WITH SOMETHING ELSE. I NEVER SAW HIM GET IT ON WITHIN 20 MINUTES, BUT I SAW
WHAT HE DID TO THE CHICK WITH THIS ROUTINE AND I COULD TELL THAT HE COULD
HAVE IF HE WANTED TO. HE DIDN'T LOOK DESPERATE AT ALL.

> parties on the island, jokes, sex personality tests, etc. before he
did
> another SOI - staring out as indirect and ambiguous, before being VERY
> direct. ;)

Examples ? ?

THIS GUY HAD A STRONG ELEMENT OF GM. THE SEX PERSONALITY TEST IS DOCUMENTED
IN MY POST ON THIS GUY (IT'S ABOUT ICE CREAM) - BUT AFTERWARDS UNLIKE GM, NO
COMMENT OF "JUST KIDDING". HE WOULD THEN SAY SOMETHING ELSE TO DISTRACT
ATTENTION OR PLAY "PRETEND AFC" LIKE "BUT I'M NOT EASY" OR "BUT I DON'T KNOW
YOU THAT WELL"
ALL THE MEANWHILE, GETTING THE CHICK HORNY AND CREATING A CHALLENGE.

> Basically what I think I have come up with, through trying to explain
to the
> posters that asked me about him, is a flirting construction kit.

Examples ? ?

MANIAC, YOU'RE STARTING TO OVERUSE CUT AND PASTE LIKE NYC WHEN HE RIPS APART
AFCS WITH THESE "EXAMPLES??" COMMENTS.........

(QUOTE NYC)
"YOU ARE BEING USED. SHE DOESN'T GIVE A SHIT ABOUT YOU. SHE DOESN'T INTEND
TO FUCK YOU. SHE IS FUCKING OTHER MEN THAT SHE FINDS SEXUALLY ATTRACTIVE.
YOU ARE FOOTING THE BILL FOR HER INTERNATIONAL WHORING. STOP."

HA HA HA ;)

> The Guam Playboy NEGged a LOT - and he got away with it every time.

Such as ? ?

WISH I COULD REMEMBER NOW. BUT WHAT I DID SEE IS HIM COMPLIMENTING LOTS OF
JAP CHICKS AND NOT GETTING ANY NASTY REACTION BACK FROM THEM - BECAUSE THEY
WERE SO SHY AND INEXPERIENCED. SO THE CHICKS JUST LAUGHED BECAUSE THEY HAD
NO BITCH SHIELD OF ANY TYPE.
WHERE HE DID ENCOUNTER A SHIELD, HE WOULD ATTACK HER "NASTY" PERSONALITY -
AND HER LACK OF ABILITY TO BE GRACEFUL WITH COMPLIMENTS.

IN THAT SENSE, HE WOULD ALWAYS SIZE THE CHICK UP AS IF HE WAS LOOKING FOR
LTR POTENTIAL (but we know of course, that LTR was never the plan)

He could
> even tell chicks AFC things like they were beautiful, and then turn
it into
> a NEG if he wanted. That's what over 20 years of daily PU did for
this guy.

Examples ? ?

"YOU'RE REALLY CUTE....(pause to check response)... BUT I DON'T KNOW
ANYTHING ABOUT YOU. (SAID NEGATIVELY OR NOT DEPENDING ON HER RESPONSE). SO
WHO ARE YOU ANYWAY?"

> But the NEG is only one kind of flirting (used for dumping a girl's
uptight
> self image). There are other kinds, such as using ambiguities,
physical
> light-handed slapping and pushing kino, playing tricks on people,
etc.

Such as ? ?

I'VE STOPPED USING KINO IMMIDIATELY NOW, AND SAVING IT FOR WHEN I'VE LANDED
AN SOI ROUTINE AND CAUGHT THE CHICK OUT. WHEN SHE HAS LAUGHED, I SLAP HER
GENTLY.
IT'S ANCHORING.

AS FOR TRICKS ON PEOPLE.... STUPID ONES. I WILL HAVE TO SHOW YOU THEM IN
PERSON.

The
> Playboy used plenty of variations.

Like what ? ?

GIVEN THE SITUATION, HE WOULD TRY DIFFERENT WAYS TO GET HER THINKING
ROMANTICALLY ABOUT BOTH OF THEM TOGETHER. HE WOULD USE WHATEVER WAS IN HIS
SURROUNDINGS, OR THE TOPIC OF CONVERSATION, TO PACE AND LEAD THE CHICK INTO
IMAGINING SUCH A SCENARIO.
THEN HE WOULD YANK IT AWAY BY GIVING SOME KIND OF EXCUSE (LIKE HE WAS BUSY,
HE DIDN'T THINK SHE COULD DO IT) OR HE WOULD PLAY AFC (I DON'T KNOW YOU, I
NEED TO BE IN LOVE FIRST, I'M NOT EASY, I'M NOT A PLAYER, I NEED TIME, I AM
REALLY PICKY, I HAVE BEEN HURT BEFORE, I HAVE A GF)

> Flirting is this:- One drops the SOI, and then pulls it away out of
reach of
> the target.

For example ? ?

I REALLY FEEL VERY CLOSE TO YOU, BUT I NEED TIME.

THE MAGIC WORD IS but

 Then gives another SOI, and then pulls it away again. Like with
> our words, we put images of sex and romance in their heads, then pull
it out

Like ? ?

HIS BRAVEST SOI WAS THE ONE WHERE HE SAID STRAIGHT OUT THAT HE WAS GOING TO
FUCK A CHICK. I WITNESSED THE WHOLE THING. HE SAID THAT HE WAS GOING TO FUCK
HER but (AND THEN HE WENT PRETEND AFC) I'M VERY PICKY, I'M NOT A PUA
BECAUSE THOSE GUYS TEASE WOMEN WITH BULLSHIT, MAKE EMPTY PROMISES, FUCK
THEM, AND THEN DUMP THEM. I AM A PLAYBOY. I LOVE WOMEN AND I DON'T WANT YOU
TO GET TOO ATTACHED TO ME AFTER WE HAVE SEX.

> again, then out it in, then take it out, then put it back in, then
take it
> out again........ Mindfucking!

Example please . .

OK, ANOTHER ONE:-   I WANT TO KISS YOU, BUT SOMEHOW I DON'T THINK YOU LIKE
KISSING.
(btw - this would be an SOI fairly advanced in conversation)
NOTE ALSO THAT THERE'S AN EMBEDDED COMMAND IN THE 2ND PART OF THE ROUTINE.
THAT BEING "YOU LIKE KISSING"
EVIL ISN'T IT?

> Once the chick is confused and teased enough, she is DDB and safely
> mindfucked.

how? describe this. . what exactly did he do?

WELL, THE CHICK THAT HE SAID THE "I'M GOING TO FUCK YOU" SPEECH TO, JUST
STARTED DOING ALL THE TRADEMARK BODYLANGUAGE. SHE JUST SAT THERE STUNNED
AND PLAYED WITH HER HAIR. LIKE A RABBIT LOOKING INTO BRIGHT LIGHTS. THE GUAM
GUY SAID ALL OF IT WITH A SERIOUS FACE TOO, SO SHE COULDN'T LAUGH OFF WHAT
HE WAS SAYING.

THE WAY HE WORKED DIDN'T SEEM TO BE ONE OF "ATTRACTION" PER SE. HE WOULD
EVENTUALLY CORNER THE CHICK AND FLIRT WITH HER UNTIL SHE COULD TAKE NO MORE.
UNTIL SHE GOT STUNNED

> I did a PU once on a chick using the SOIs. I found out where she
lived and
> then said "Oh that's not far from my place, so I can come down to see
you.
> It's a pity I am so busy it won't happen today"

This is good. .

THAT'S A REAL LIFE EXAMPLE OF WHAT THE WHOLE THEORY IS ABOUT. MORE
IMPORTANTLY IS THAT IT WORKED.

> (Note that there is a bit of future pacing and presuppositioning in
this)
> She lapped it up and took my kino from there - despite the BF being a
matter
> of metres away.
>
> The structure for the Guam Playboy routine went like this:-
>
> - Fun routine or opener (ala Mystery) - some basic fluff - all good
things
> about himself, what he could do for the women (he played the helpful
tour

Examples ? ?

READ SOME OF MYSTERY'S OPENERS!
TYPICALLY OFF THE WALL STUFF. WELL, WHEN HE WAS TALKING ABOUT GUAM'S CULTURE
AND PARTIES AND STUFF - FOR ALL THE TOURISTS, ALL THIS NEW INFO TO THEM IS
PRETTY OFF THE WALL.
HE WOULD TELL THE CHICKS ABOUT SOME PARTY WHERE THEY WOULD DIG A HUGE PIT
AND THROW ANIMALS ON IT IN A BIG FEAST WITH A BONFIRE AND DANCING - AND THEN
BRANCHED OUT AND TALKED ABOUT DANCING AND OTHER EXOTIC/EROTIC STUFF.

> guide). Be "Disgustingly" Charming! as he put it. The guy wasn't big
on

Like ? ?

THOSE WERE HIS EXACT WORDS. HE RELIED ON GM A LOT IN THE LATTER PART OF HIS
SEDUCTIONS.

> logically drawing out routines for what he did (which is a good
thing), he
> just went and DID this.... thus he couldn't really explain to me what
he was
> doing. I had to observe.

Yep, he's got experience.. I rarely consciously follow ManiacPlan
anymore.. just it spews out naturally.. learning PU is like learning
a foreign language/lingo.. once you get it, its natural..

I'VE BEEN LEARNING TO PLAY AFC IN MY SEDUCTIONS, AND IT HAS BEEN WORKING
REALLY WELL!

> - SOI. He said something that hinted that he was interested in the
chick
> (paced and lead from his opener conversation). This got her emotions
going

Example?  How?

OK, ANOTHER ONE.

"WOULDN'T IT BE GREAT TO SPEND TIME TOGETHER OVER COFFEE? IT'S SUCH A PITY I
HAVE TO GO TO SOME MEETINGS LATER ON, SO WE WILL PROBABLY HAVE NO TIME TO
SEE EACH OTHER EVER AGAIN BEFORE YOU GO BACK."
(WAIT FOR RESPONSE)
"BUT LET ME KNOW YOUR NUMBER ANYWAY...WHO KNOWS I MAY HAVE TIME."
(might want to save this one after you have dropped several other
SOIs)

> and her ideas racing.

Like what? which ideas? be specific please. .

ROMATIC AND/OR SEXUAL ONES.
HE WOULD START OFF ON ROMANTIC ONES AND MAKE THEM INCREASINGLY SEXUAL UNTIL
HE HIT A SEXUAL FANTASY OF HERS THAT WOULD DDB HER.
LET'S SAY "HOLDING HANDS" OR "SPENDING QUALITY TIME TOGETHER" OR "BEING
CLOSE" AND EVENTUALLY LEADING THAT INTO "TOUCHING BODIES" AND "KISSING" TO
"FUCKING" OBVIOUSLY.
A LOT OF TIME DISTORTION SOIs.

> I have found this CRITICAL if the chick is going to
> stay interested in you for too long. I bored many chicks out
initially when
> I wouldn't get to the point.
[rest deleted]

Rio, this is great stuff. Somehow I understand it.. but I need
examples of it so I can put it together as something I can try
in the field. Do you remember any specifics from this guy?

WELL, WE CAN ALWAYS WAIT FOR THE OFF-SEASON AND GO TO GUAM WITH A VCR AND
MEET THIS GUY (YOU'LL ONLY NEED ABOUT 40,000 YEN FROM TOKYO FOR A 2 DAY
TRIP) OR NEXT TIME WE MEET IN TOKYO WE CAN DO MORE STREET STUFF AND I CAN
SHOW YOU WHAT I KNOW. (I HADN'T FULLY DEVELOPED THE THEORY UNTIL AFTER MY
NIGHT OUT WITH KIPP - I OQed TOO MUCH AND FAILED TO PLACE ANY CHALLENGES
AFTER MY SOIs THAT NIGHT)
THE GUAM PLAYBOY WAS A GRANDMASTER OF STREET PU - HIS WEAKNESS WAS THAT HE
WAS A GREEDY TEAMPLAYER WITH WINGMEN.

If so, please fill in the above spaces where I ask.. it is very
important if this is to work.

Rio
-------

Using SOI’s as a way to tease/attract chicks!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Using SOI's (statements of intent) as a tease to attract a chick!


From: Jonathan Ashton 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Clearing SOI's up
Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 07:04:08 GMT

In article ,
> For example, if we were to drop an SOI on the chick, and then
> IMMEDIATELY follow up with a negative command - WE control the
> flirting so that the chick then has to work for US.
>
> So we can say things like "I want to kiss you"
> And then control the flirting by pulling away again with some reverse
> commands :-
> "BUT I don't really know anything about you, and I haven't known you
> for very long, and I need to feel love first"
> Sounds like the stuff that chicks tell us, right? Well chicks say it
> to flirt, as opposed to meaning what they say!

Omigod!  Rio, this is an awesome post!  Brilliant!  Genius!

"I was thinking about kissing you, but you'd probably slobber too
  much."
"I'd love to take you home, but I know you'd get all clingy."
"I'm just trying to guess if you're any good in bed.  Too bad you're
  too young/weird/conservative for me."
"I bet you'd love the way I do neck massages.  You've been acting up
  too much to deserve one, though."

This is so EASY!  Anyone can think these up on the spot!  There's no
need to think up ambiguous sentences or come up with just the right
innuendo.  Just make a Statement of Intentions, then let her know what
SHE has to offer to make it happen - by telling her that you won't do
it because she's not up to par!  I love it!  I will try it out ASAP!

Howcome I've never seen this idea explained before?  In retrospect,
it's clear that MrSex4uNYC and Mystery do similar stuff, but I've
never seen the dynamic explained this way before.  Ross talks about
setting challenges, but it's always seemed like such a delicate art
to say just the right thing at just the right time.

But this is so easy!  Thank you, Rio.

Ash


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

Game: Color game

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Color Game that can be used in PU!
[Maniac note: got this other list below from the 'Secrets of the cube book'
Also very good, may be appropriate when doing this game:

Red: passion, hot energy, anger warmth
Green: hope, life, nature, money
Blue: spirituality, serenity, cool energy, sadness
Purple: royalty, deep passions, mourning
Yellow: cheerfulness, brightness, eccentricity
Pink: feminity, wamrth
Brown: earthyness, warmth, conventionality
Black: mystery
White: purity
Multicolored: of many interests or moods

END: Maniac note]

From: steviewonder 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: More personality tests
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 20:20:17 GMT

In article <904e0cjv@nnrp1.deja.com>,
  maniac_high@yahoo.com wrote:
> There is good stuff on that site.
>
> I am reworking it to be more appropriate in opener type
> PU's in bars/coffee shops, will present my results of this
> work in late January after it has all been designed and
> field tested.. It will be killer..

Hi guys,

Found this game at

http://www.geocities.com/Broadway/8546/colortest.html

a good one since all the answers are sexual:

QUESTION:

Pick the color that best describes your personality?

ANSWERS:

BLACK
Black color preferences point to black sex. These people are the
misfits of the sex world and seek each other in kinship. They tend to
prefer perverted sex, and are usually masochistic or sadistic in
nature. They are moody and often perform at their peak when under
stress or during unhappy times. Police psychologists claim that many
sex offenders prefer the color black. And it is no coincidence that
the uniform of mobsters and teenaged gangs is black.

BLUE
Lovers of blue are wonderful sex partners. They are sincere,
affectionate, and sensitive to their partner's needs. They consider
lovemaking a fine art, and their approach is elegant. Men who love
blue are like concert pianists; delicately ravaging their partner like
they would play a baby grand. Women in the blue category enjoy sex
to the fullest. They are exciting partners, but their passion might be
compared to tidal waves, rather than fiery aggresion. Both blue men
and women enjoy foreplay and the aftermath of lovemaking as much
as the act. In marriages, a blue person is a wonderful mate, never
failing to please the spouse and never seeking outside interests.

BROWN
For lovers of brown, sex is a 24-hour a day thing. They tend to say "I
love you" often enough. Snuggling by the fire, walking in the rain or
catching snowflakes on their tongue ins a turn-on to a lover of brown.
They need lots of time and privacy to make love. But their emotions
are such that one harsh word could end an affair.

GREEN
Those who prefer green are fresh and innocent in their approach to
sex. Women who love green will make love like virgins all their life.
And a man may also be a trifle clumsy and awkward, but in a charming
and endearing sort of way. Green lovers are gentle, but not
passionate. If chosen as a mate, one will never need to worry about
infidelity.

GREY
The color grey is preferred by people who are indecisive. They can't
get excited about anything - including colors - so they choose a
noncommittal shade. Men who prefer grey look at sex as a means of
relieving tension - nothing more nothing less. It's "wham, bam, thank
you ma'am". Women don't make love, they have intercourse. They
count the cracks in the bedroom plaster until the sex act is over with
and done. When a grey marries another grey, the marriage is not
exactly erotic.

ORANGE
Lovers of the color orange lean toward sexual fantasies. The sex act
is regarded as a dramatic role, a one act play in which they are the
star. Foreplay is as important as the act of love. They whisper sweet
nothings, meaningless dialogue they feel fits their image. Orange
people often do not experience orgasm - but they put on a damn good
act. Men tend to pull their partner's hair and women tend to leave
welts on their sex partner's back!

PINK
Persons who like pink show a reluctance to mature in sexual matters.
Women tend to tease; to promise more than they intend to deliver. In
some cases, they flaunt their femininity, but only because they
secretly hate men. A great percentage of prostitutes boast entire
wardrobes in pink. Men who like pink are the type who make 3 dates
for the same evening and not keep them, preferring to pick up a dish
in some bar instead.

PURPLE
Lovers of purple frequently consider themselves too regal for  fun
romp in the sack. Women sometimes are the type who hate to muss
their hair. Men are businesslike in their approach to lovemaking. In
both sexes, purple partners are more concerned with their
fulfillment then anyone else's gratification.

RED
People who like red tend to be tigers in the sack. They are easily
aroused and enjoy sex in every way imaginable. Once the sexual spark
is lit, it may take hours to extinguish. When two reds get together,
the ensuing erotica would make Lady Chatterly blush. Lovers of red
tend to be the aggressors and weaker colors should beware!

YELLOW
If you tend to favor yellow, your sexual drives are complex and lean
toward the adaptable. The favorite color of homosexuals is yellow!
But don't panic - not everyone who wears yellow is homosexual. In
most cases the person will accommodate to the stronger partner's
desires in a passive manner. You will never enjoy sex to the fullest,
but you will never turn down an invitation from someone you enjoy or
admire.

--
To email me remove the _obvious from this address:
steviewonder_ob@viousfastmail.ca

Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

Handling delusional chicks, karatebabe lives a nightmare!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Re: Mystery: delusional chicks & sympathy lies! 
Date: 11/12/2000 
Author: maniac_high  

 << previous in search  ?  next in search >>  

Re: Mystery: delusional chicks & sympathy lies!
001112
 
Mystery wrote in another post this week regarding lying
to chicks, about how not to underestimate how delusional
a chick is willing to become in order to keep her 'happy'
view of the world.
 
He is absolutely right. And this explains how seeming
'jerk' can get away with what seems like such ridiculous
shit.
 
Case in point, is where I recently did a fuckup, and then
recovered with Karatebabe (see lay report, my page). This
is the chick that would go around my place after sex
cleaning up her own hairs so that "the other chicks"
wouldnt find out about her.
 
Well, one day we are going for coffee, and she asks me
if I had been seeing another chick at the time I started
dating her. Figuring (incorrectly) from her behavior,
that this chick knew totally what the score already was,
I said I had been (wrong answer!).
 
She freaked out and went balistic at me. Shit about "how
I make her fool, go behind her back..and other shit".
In retrospect it was clear though.. she got upset, because
something she merely 'suspected' (even though it was fucking
obvious as shit, as other chicks stuff was all over the
fucking house), now became something 'confirmed', and that
shattered her entire world..
 
I then smartened up and realized what I had just done,
and recovered by saying that I dumped her after I first
started dating you (Karatebabe), a few weeks later.
 
After that, she settled down (even though every week
there was different chick stuff all over the house
after that!). She asked me about it, and I said no,
there are no chicks..
 
She said she accepted that, and that her 'nightmare'
now was over, and everything was fine again.
 
Later she found some makeup and chick stuff in the
bathroom cabinet (another chick must have slipped
it there for someone else to find it), so I had
to think fast on my feet for that one...
 
So I told her that I have a real dark secret and
she might be very disappointed in me (now she is
expecting to hear something about a chick)..
 
Then (remembering she likes gays and stuff) I tell
her that I like to make believe to dress like a girl
(lots of J-guys do it actually, so I know it is not
so far fetched here), and I have guy friends that do it
with me, and sorry I didnt tell you earlier.. (of
course this is TOTALLY false.. Maniac is not even
remotely gay, nor a crossdresser or any of that shit)...
however.. she ACCEPTED that story, and was relieved
(in spite of the fact that I was almost cracking up
when I said it, since I was SURE she would call me
on my bullshit... but she didnt)!
 
Fuck!, the totally ridiculous things you have to
tell a chick...  AND! they accept it (as they
try to internalize it and believe it at least at
some level so that their happy delusional world
doesn't come crashing to bits)..
 
Strange, isnt it..!
 
Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Using the laws of power in PU!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Toecutter, and using the laws of power!




From toecutter@mail.com Mon Oct 23 09:39:39 2000
From: "toecutter" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Lessons from Book: The 48 Laws of Power
Lines: 201


Just reading a book, The 48 Laws of Power by Robert Greene. Definitely
lessons everywhere in the book on what we do here.
The book is amoral, and open about the deception inherit in what he is
teaching. It is largely for life outside the arena of seduction, but
entrirely applicable and there are some seduction examples in it to
illustrate his points (only historical: For example the advice of Ninon de
Lenclos on seduction to the Marquis de Sevigne and what happened when the
Marquis did not follow her advice, etc.). The examples are all pulled from
the Sun Tzu (Chinese, the Art of War), European history, famous con men,
magicians and charlatans, Kings, Queens, Napoleon and other power brokers
such as Al Capone. Perfect for you guys who enjoy Machiavelli. At 450
reasonably large format pages it is fairly long.

It is going to take me several re-readings, but at the moment I see the
messages as really 3 fold: First, play your cards pretty close to your
chest. This creates mystery. The more you say, the more common you appear
and the less in control. Andy Wohol created enigma by not discussing his
work and answering questions by being intentionally vague giving people the
feeling that he was being more profound than he was.  If you do not reveal
all, people will never become bored with you or your presence because you
will continue to represent a challenge, and will be eternally interesting.
Your silence will make other people feel uncomfortable and humans are
machines of interpretation and explanation; they have to know what you are
thinking. When you carefully control what you reveal, they cannot pierce
your intentions and meaning. Your short answers will put them on the
defensive and they will jump in, nervously filling the silence with all
kinds of comments that will reveal valuable information about themselves and
their weaknesses.

This brings me to the second message. Learn everything you can about other
people. Their strengths and weaknesses, their crutches and trance words.
Their motivations. Use these to your advantage whilst revealing as little as
possible about yourself. Keep them the focus of the conversation, and be a
'Spy' on their minds by eliciting values.

The third lesson is to use smoke and mirrors to obscure your objectives and
motivations. Throw decoys out there, use gifts as Trojan horses, and be
circumspect in what is going on. Again, this throws them off your game,
gives you an upper hand.

None of this is to say that you need to be quiet or a bad conversationalist,
just the opposite, by spying and eliciting values, you are encouraging
people to talk about themselves, their own favourite subject. By being brief
about yourself you are creating mystery and interest. It is just that you
are collecting the information in order to use it against them at another
time, whilst manipulating your image and reputation in their minds and
obscuring your real motivations. In some ways it is a book on playing hard
to get while outmanoeuvring the girl. A perfect structure in which to drop
SS.

Some of the content is below. I can post more on it if you would like
further discussion; I am overflowing with ideas on it.

Toecutter.

---

To list some of the laws that are obviously applicable:

Law 3: Conceal your intentions (Keep people off balance and in the dark by
never revealing the purpose behind your actions. If they have no clue what
you are up to, they cannot prepare a defence. Guide them far enough down the
wrong path, envelop them in enough smoke, and by the time they realise your
intentions, it will be too late.)

Law 4: Always say less than is necessary

Law 6: Court attention at all costs

Law 8: Make other people come to you - use bait if necessary

Law 9: Win though your actions, never through argument. (Any momentary
triumph you win though argument is really a Pyrrhic victory: The resentment
and ill will you stir up is stronger and lasts longer than any momentary
change in opinion. It is much more powerful to get others to agree with you
though your actions, without saying a word. Demonstrate, do not explicate.)

Law 10: Infection: Avoid the unhappy and unlucky (it works the other way
also. This is an alternative take on social-proof, or pivots or whatever you
want to call them, as well as wingmen. Also advice on not getting involved
with the wrong girl.)

Law 11: Learn to keep people dependent on you.

Law 12: Use selective generosity to disarm your victim (One sincere and
honest move will cover over dozens of dishonest ones. Openhearted gestures
of honesty and generosity bring down the guard of even the most suspicious
people. Once your selective honesty opens a hole in their armour, you can
deceive and manipulate at will.)

Law 13: When asking for help, appeal to people's self interest, never to
their mercy or gratitude.

Law 14: Pose as a friend, work as a spy.

Law 16: Use absence to increase respect and honour. (Again through mystery
and not stuffing it up by staying too long and doing or saying something
wrong.)

Law 17: Keep others in suspended terror: Cultivate an air of
unpredictability

Law 18: Do not build fortresses to protect yourself - Isolation is
dangerous. (Get out there amongst them).

Law 19: Know who you are dealing with - do not offend the wrong person.

Law 20: Do not commit yourself to anyone.

Law 21: Play a sucker to catch a sucker - appear dumber than your mark. (Let
her think that she is in control and smart, less naive, don't let on you are
a player).

Law 25: Re-create yourself (Do not accept the roles that society foists on
you. Re-create yourself by forging a new identity, one that commands
attention and never bores the audience. Be the master of your own image
rather than letting others define it for you. Incorporate dynamic devices
into your public gestures and actions - your power will be enhanced and your
character will seem larger than life).

Law 26: Keep your hands clean. (You must seem a paragon of civility and
efficiency: Your hands are never soiled by mistakes and nasty deeds.
Maintain such a spotless appearance by using others as scapegoats and cat'
s-paws to disguise your involvement).

Law 27: Play on peoples need to believe to create a cult like following.
(advice in this chapter is on how to become a cult leader or maybe build a
harem. 5 strategies to your dogma! a) Keep it vague; Keep it simple b)
Emphasise the visual and sensual over the intellectual c) Borrow the forms
of organised religion to structure the group d) Disguise your income source
e) set up an us-vs.-them dynamic. I think Ross Jeffries read this one!)

Law 28: Enter action with Boldness. (If you are unsure of a course of
action, do not attempt it. Your doubts and hesitations will infect your
execution. Timidity is dangerous: Better to enter with boldness. Any
mistakes you make through audacity are easily corrected with more audacity.
Everyone admires the bold; no one honours the timid).

Law 29: Plan all the way to the end.

Law 30: Make your accomplishments seem effortless. (Your actions must seem
natural and executed with ease. All the toil and practice that goes into
them, also all the clever tricks, must be concealed. When you act, act
effortlessly, as if you could do much more. Avoid the temptation of
revealing how hard you work - it only raises questions. Teach no one your
tricks or they will be used against you .. I am breaking this rule right
here with this post, as is the Authour of the book.)

Law 31: Control the options: Get others to play with the cards you deal.
(The best deceptions are the ones that seem to give the other person a
choice: Your victims feel they are in control, but are actually your
puppets. Give people options that come out in your favour whichever one they
choose. Force them to make choices between the lesser of two evils, both of
which serve your purpose. Put them on the horns of the dilemma: they are
gored wherever they turn. Note: this is a different view on my idea of
re-framing questions. The questions are re-framed so well that the girl has
no option.)

Law 32: Play to people's fantasies.

Law 33: Discover each mans thumbscrew.

Law 34: Be royal in your own fashion: Act like a king to be treated like
one.

Law 35: Master the art of timing. (Never seem to be in a hurry - hurrying
betrays a lack of control over yourself, and over time. Always seem patient,
as if you know that everything will come to you eventually. Become a
detective of the right moment; sniff out the spirit of the times, the trends
that will carry you to power. Learn to stand back when the time is not yet
ripe, and to strike fiercely when it has reached fruition.)

Law 36: Disdain things you cannot have: Ignoring them is the best revenge.

Law 37: Create compelling spectacles. (Striking imagery and grand symbolic
gestures create the aura of power - everyone responds to them. Stage
spectacles for those around you, then, full of arresting visuals and radiant
symbols to heighten your presence. Dazzled by appearances, no one will
notice what you are really doing.)

Law 40: Despise the free Lunch.

Law 43: Work on the hearts and minds of others.

Law 44: Disarm and infuriate with the mirror effect. (The mirror reflects
reality, but is the perfect tool for deception: When you mirror your
enemies, doing exactly as they do, they cannot figure out your strategy. The
mirror Effect mocks and humiliates them, making them overreact. By holding
up a mirror to their psyches, you seduce them with the illusion that you
share their values; by holding up a mirror to their actions you teach them a
lesson. Few can resist the power of the mirror effect.)

Law 48: Assume formlessness. (By taking a shape, by having a visible plan,
you open yourself to attact. Instead of taking a form for the girl to grasp,
keep yourself adaptable and on the move. Accept the fact that nothing is
certain and no law is fixed. The best way to protect yourself is to be as
fluid and formless as water: never bet on stability or lasting order.
Everything changes.)

Disarming groups of guys around chicks!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

When lots of guys are around 1 girl, you must disarm guys!


From: "Stepleader" 
Subject: Re: She has nice/great body and/or face -- but what about her?
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2000 10:02:45 GMT

great pep talk and I love your posts ... but ...

the situ called for a disarming of the guys.  Here is how.  Approach the
group but pay NO attention to the girl.  Begin the chat with the guys and
make them interested in your story telling.  MALE BONDING comradery.  Turn
you back to HER so she feels out of place.  What you have done is removed
all the attention from her (stolen it).  You are now the center of
attention.  A couple NEGS her way challenges her.  All the other guys were
on her - all but one.  YOU.

Just so you know, this is mystery methods groupset theory and Ive done this
successfully a great # of times.

from this vantage point you may now take her  by the hand and say to the
others, "is it alright if I steal your friend away for a bit?"  they will
say yes and you take her out of earshot.  Id love you to see me work a set
like that.  its brilliant.  and PRACTICAL.

Svengali  wrote in article
<131220002147344283%Svengali_here@use.net>...
> Gentlemen, you're looking for the whole package, not just the
> packaging.  And if all you're focusing on is the packaging, she damn
> well knows it and is in control of you --period!
> 
> You must, repeat, you must be prepared to walk at all times, no matter
> how much you would like to be on/in that body and face.
> 
> Remember, you are screening her to see if she is good enough for
> you, not the other way around.  And the only way you're going to find
> out if she is good enough for you is to learn as much as you can
> about the person that is within that female form.
> 
> Am I saying you must be screening every beauty for a long term
> relationship?  Hell no!  It can be for however long you want.  But
> the moment she sees, and it won't take her long, that you are screening
> her to see whether or not she is good enough for you, is the moment
> the tables get turned and she understands that she has to make herself
> look good in your eyes.
> 
> Now contrast this with all the other guys who are trying to make
> themselves look good in her eyes, so they can get on/in her.
> 
> To illustrate what I am saying, picture this: we're in a manhattan bar,
> and there is this gorgeous looking woman, with the greatest face you've
> seen, talking to a few guys.  One happens to be our own great NYC with
> his magnificient weight-lifting body and his "I'm great" attitude; 
> another is Riker with his patterns, a third is Greg19 with his band of
> ways, and so on.  So basically what you would have is a bunch of guys
> trying to find and give this woman what she wants, so as to get on/in
> her.
> 
> Then there's Svengali, with his Carey Grant looks and ways, who sees
> the woman, walks right up into the group and says "excuse me guys, I
> just wanted to ask the lady where she got, and whose idea it was to get
> those earrings that seems to make her skin sparkle and her eyes glow,
> and then I'll leave." [Turning to her] "So please tell me, where did
> you get, and what made you decide [Svengali's hand goes out to the
> earrings, and in the process, lightly touches the lady's neck] to get
> these earrings that seems to make your skin sparkle and your eyes
> glow?"  {She tells me.}  "Thank you."  "Bye guys, I'm going back over
> there [pointing, so the lady knows where I will be]."
> 
> Look what just occurred: (1) I showed I wasn't afraid of a damn thing. 
> (2) I disarmed my opponents.  (3) I made her feel good.  (4) I showed
> her I wasn't about to hang around and try and get her.  {Of course to
> firmly establish that point, I would engage another woman in
> conversation, and have her positioned in a way that the first woman
> would see her with me, which would have her wondering what kind of nice
> things was I saying to her, that she wasn't getting.}.
> 
> Who do you think the woman is likely to be focused on and thinking
> about: all the guys who are there, still trying to get to her, or the
> guy who said what he wanted, made her feel good/great, left, and is now
> focused on someone else?  {I removed one of her feel good sources, so
> even though the others are there, with theirs, she like nearly everyone
> of us, is focused on the one that's been lost, not the ones that are
> present.}
> 
> Show your interest in her, but also show that you are walking the
> moment *she's* not exactly like you want.
> 
> Now I'll play devil's advocate and say that my little "walk away"
> didn't work.  Do you think I care?  Hell no, and I'll tell you why: the
> one who chases to gets, will always have to chase to have.  So whoever
> would win with the woman, would have to keep providing whatever they
> did to keep her interested.  I, on the other hand, only need to use a
> little charm and then walk away to have her wanting me.
> 
> I ask you, who do you think has an easier time of it?
> 
> -- 
> If you don't know in the first twenty minutes whether or not you're going
to
> have sex with the woman you just met, and whether or not you even want
to,
> you're not a seductionist.
> 
>   'o o'
> Svengali
>

Taking control when things go wrong

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


A conversation with Mystery!

Tips on fieldwork from a pick up artist! on IRC #PUA!


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A Conversation with Mystery, a Pick-up Artist (PUA)

Topics Include: 

The Kiss Close
Clubbing alone
Handling guys
Being a story-teller
Preparation and format
Quality vs. quantity

Lego: Hey Mystery, what's your favorite story to close with?  How 
exactly do you transition from the telling of a story to closing?

Mystery: "The Kiss Close" is my favorite routine.  Once you have three 
indicators of interest (she touches you, laughs consistantly at your 
jokes, leans in towards you, smiles a lot and keeps eye contact, resumes 
chat when you force silence, etc) you then phase shift.  You turn 180 
degrees on a dime.  Go from humorous and non-sexual to saying, "Stop.  
Would you like to kiss me?", right out of the blue.  She will say either 
say, "Uh - no",(which is unlikely as you don't bother performing "The 
Kiss Close" until enough indicators are present) or, "I donno" (they 
rarely say, "Yes"). "I donno" means she actually does want to but feels 
embarrassed on how to say "Yes".  So you reply, "Lets find out", then go 
in slowly and kiss her.  It's very simple and very effective.  If she 
says, "Why?", this is also a yes.  Simply reply, "It looked like you had 
something on your mind.  Would you like to kiss me?"  Wait again for 
her response.  If her response is "No" then reply, "Hey I didn't say you 
COULD.  You just had that look in your eye."

Lego: What do you do if you're interrupted? You're telling your target 
a story and she is all into it but some AFC cock-blocking idiot just 
runs up and starts screaming and yelling and you're like, "What the 
fuck?"

Mystery: Simply ask him if you can borrow his pen.  When he gives it to 
you, throw it away as you say, "Fetch."

Wakeboarder: Hahaha.  Nice!

Lego: What if he's bigger than you?

Mystery: I'd instead call him on his disruptive shit and remark, "Dude, 
what are you attempting here?"  Not good enough?  Then say, "Ladies?  
Shall we discover what adventure awaits us in another room?"

Wakeboarder: Man, none of my buds want to go to the club.

Gamer: Screw them then.

Mystery: Go alone.

Wakeboarder: I need to be made fun of for this comment but I feel like 
a weiner if I go to a club myself

Lego: Bro, your trippin'. I go solo many times. It's good actually.  
It's weird if it's a first night but if I've been there before it's cool.

Mystery: Yeah, I understand ... and yet, staying home alone will make 
you feel so much better?  Go out alone, meet some cool dudes when you 
get there (they will become your wingmen there) and then run around 
getting #'s.  Report to your fellow PUAs what happened.  Whatever happened 
to the concept, "The alphamale gets all the women?"  Shit dude, what are 
you, a mommas boy?  Do you need your hand held?  

Lego: How do you strike up conversations with guys?

Mystery: Walk up and say, "Hey dude, question for ya.  Do you know 
where a good place to score is in this city? 'Cause this place looks like a 
cock farm."

Lego: Good!  You should be able to relate to guys to disarm them.  You 
don't compete; you ELIMINATE COMPETETION.

Gamer: LOL.  Dude, the only results I've had were solo.  My friends 
psych me out too much because they never help.  Instead they just complain 
about my taking too much time.  They laugh at me or just generally piss 
me off.

Mystery: I have MUCH better results (and MUCH more fun) playing "The 
Game" alone.  It forces you to approach.  It's a great motivator.

Lego: Damn! I couldn't have put it better myself.

Gamer: Yep.

Mystery: You wont be alone for more than five minutes once you approach 
your first set anyways.  Gamer, I suggest you call them on their shit 
at some point.  Demonstrate your alphamale characteristics.

Lego: How do you continue talking?  I mean, group set dynamics are much 
different in a one one on one approach.

Mystery: Be a story-teller - THAT is the skill of the PUA.  It isn't 
SEDUCING; it's STORY-TELLING.  It is my personal belief that SS patterns 
arent as 'hypnotic' as they are 'entertaining' stories.

Wakeboarder: Sweet

Lego: Actually with the story stuff I SEE WHAT YOU MEAN.  They just 
follow that lead.

Wakeboarder: Well, I need to stop being a sackless wonder and grow some 
fuckin' balls then!  Hmm, story telling ...

Mystery: Here's an example.  "Ever been camping?  Well I was up in a 
forest up north and was hiking with some girlfriends of mine ... and we 
came along some trail and there was shit on the path.  My friends were 
like, "haaaa someone shit in the woods" and I said, "lets get the fuck 
out of here like NOW."  they thought I was just scared of shit and I 
said, "Girls, you dont get it.  This shit is still warm and its not human.  
Its bear shit.  This is a big fucking bear.  Look at the size of that 
turd."  Notice it's not sexual?  Most hot girls gets get "sex-talk" 
right away from AFCs.  NOT talking sex with them makes them question 
whether you are interested in them.  Leave them guessing until you get 
indicators of interest from them.  If they like your great personality 
(confident, humorous, etc) they will give you subtle but distinct clues.

Gamer: How do you flow from story to story?

Mystery: If there is ONE mental state you should force yourself into, 
its TALKATIVE.  Talk your fucking HEAD off.  Just go from one story 
straight into another one like a comedian does.  Ever find yourself excited 
about something and you talk and talk and talk?  THAT is what must 
happen to get a girl.  You have to ENTERTAIN them.  Look talkative yet not 
desperate.  

Gamer: Heh.

Lego: Dude, I had that going last night. You're so right.  That's an 
excellent example dude.  I was telling this story about getting harassed 
by cops or some shit.  It's a cool story but my delivery sucked and I 
was losing one of the two girls I was telling it to.  What if they fail 
to elaborate on your story?  Besides it being a bad story to begin 
with, how can you fix it on the fly?

Mystery: They don't have to interact with it.  Its a good thing to have 
flexible stories to allow for some comment but it's not nessessary.  
It's YOUR job to perform the material.  It's your audiences job to 
listen,laugh and generally be entertained.  That's it.  At the end of 10 
minutes you will see the girls digging you (positive indicators).  You then 
phase shift abruptly into the close.

Lego: HOW DO YOU PHASE SHIFT?  I've been wondering this. While I didn't 
come off as obvious in last nights case and just told her to kiss me (I 
knew she would anyway), this could have been smoother.

Alpha: Lego, you ad libbed the close?  So working on ad libbing is 
good?

Mystery: Ad libbed material is not as accurate in closing as is 
performing the well constructed and field-tested "Kiss Close" routine.  Ad 
libbing is BONUS material but don't COUNT on it.  Have your material, like 
a good comedian, prepared before performing.  This isn't "A Night at 
the Improv" fellas.

Gamer: Heh.

Mystery: All PUs have a format; a beginning, a middle and an end.  If 
you don't know what the next routine is going to be then you may end up 
with an unfortunate pregnant pause which fucks up your pacing.  You may 
end up filling the silence with the deadly, "So ... um ... what do you 
do?"  Preparation saves face.  Afterall, with your particular close, 
she could have pulled away from your trying to kiss her.  Then what?!!  
Instead, consider engaging her in enthusiastic conversation, then go 
directly into the close.  In other words, stop her in mid-sentence and 
with a curious tone, kiss close.

Wakeboarder: cool.  Lego, what indicators clued you in that she wanted 
the kiss?

Alpha: In what way can you be prepared?  If we're talking about 
story-telling in front of a random girl we just met seconds ago in a random 
place ...

Mystery: Like a good comedian, have your material prepared yet when 
onstage be prepared to dynamically omit certain routines and to add others 
on the fly.  Sometimes certain routines fit the situation better than 
others.  Have 3 to 5 alternative openers (as a comedian would) and enjoy 
performing the one you think best fits the situation will get the best 
reaction for the group you are in front of

Alpha: Gotcha now.  Can you give me a brief example of how you go about 
preparing?

Mystery: Sure.  First, find 3 openers and memorize them.  Write down a 
list of openers (just the headings of each opener to remind you).  
Next, write down some routines (the question game, the music game, the 
photo routine, the bear in the woods story, etc - all on dejanews) and then 
also memorize the kiss close and the # close.  Memorize 3 NEGs too and 
you are good to go.  With the material in your mind, you are prepared 
to work it in the field until you have the timing of the material down 
(again, just like a comedian.)

Alpha: Man, you provide some really eye-opening ideas... (just when I'm 
about to think there's nothing more to learn.

Wakeboarder: So what you're saying is have a routine set up and modify 
it to each situation? Kind of like having a PU template?

Mystery: It's ALL about format.  Know the format and stick to it.  If 
you now what the next step is in the PU, you wont feel scared.  It gets 
fun and you begin to appreciate the strategy behind it all.

Wakeboarder: Yeah like FMAC? That's a simple format.

Mystery: Yes, FMAC.  Each letter in FMAC is an abrupt phase shift.  
"FIND" means having to abruptly disturb your complacency by getting out of 
the house.  It takes effort for many people to do bother getting THIS 
FAR.  "MEET" is a HUGE abrupt change.  "There she is!  3, 2, 1, GO!"  In 
the "ATTRACT" phase, you need to go from the walk up to the TALKATIVE 
performer entertaining story-teller.  You will need A LOT of energy for 
this (enthusiasm is contagious afterall) and for many to go from 
slumping around to being in performer mode is ABRUPT.  Finally you must then 
"CLOSE"; to phase shift from humour to serious is also abrupt.  Each 
phase may FEEL awkward but it looks normal.  When a comedian finishes one 
topic and just goes into an entirely new unrelated topic, the audience 
doesn't care as long as the next topic is entertaining.

Wakeboarder: Very true.

Gamer: Cool.  I'm collecting openers and other routines off the 
layguide right now.

Alpha: Do you believe in the 80/20 'rule'?  Meaning, 80% of the quality 
women are found in 20% of the right places or connections or 
situations.

Mystery: The quality of a woman is SO subjective. Quality is difficult 
to QUANTIFY.  80% of QUALITY?  It's pointless trying to mix and match 
these concepts. INSTEAD consider that there are HOTTIES and UGs (YOU get 
to decide based on your personal criteria) and of the HOTTIES, some 
have pleasant personalities and others do not.  You cannot possibly judge 
her personality until she LIKES you.  So go out ... FIND her, MEET her, 
ATTRACT her and THEN decide if you want to CLOSE her AFTER judging her 
personality.  Judging her by the way she treats you on your approach is 
lame because particularly beautiful women all have their bitch shields 
up and running.  They have to.  They aren't planning on fucking every 
guy that says Hi to them.  The only way to get rid of the guys is to 
oftentimes offend them quickly.  It's not personal.  It's merely a learned 
strategy.  So is the "I have a boyfriend excuse, but that's a different 
story.  I also suggest CLOSING everyone just for the education.  You 
don't actually have to CALL the girls of course.  You simply get to 
practice CLOSING too.  Getting a girls number is merely an OPTION.  You 
don't have to follow up on ALL of them you know.

Keen: Heh.

Wakeboarder: Cool, judging the girls only after you have attracted 
them.  Kind of makes you approach too!  You can't say the bull shit line, 
"She's not my type, I can tell", to get you out of approaching.

Alpha: Do you have a web page?

Mystery: No, not currently.  I'm writing a book though called The 
Mystery Method.  Most of my ramblings can be found on the layguide. 

Ascence: Hey, is it true that the older we get the more money/social 
status becomes and issue?

Mystery: No matter what social status you have (or THINK you have), 
it's still something you must convey in the first 25 minutes of meeting 
her.  We ALL start equal BEFORE meeting her; all men.  The issue is, can 
we congruently convey our social status (real or not) in our 
performance?  That's OUR responsibility.  The best way is not to TELL them about 
it but rather to DEMONSTRATE it.  How?  Well, if you talk about having 
girls always falling for you for instance, it's not NEARLY as good as 
actually having a couple hot girls with you saying what a hottie you are 
infront of the target.  This is called PAWNING.

Keen: I'm going to try doing the story-telling that you talked about.  
It's really hard though. I'm a real bad storyteller.  I've been working 
on it today. that's my lesson today.

Wakeboarder: Tell them about that time you saw a fallen over manequin 
in the department store and you tripped over it.  The security guard 
thought you were trying to make it with the manequin and called you a 
little freak.

Gamer: LOL (Laughing Out Loud).

Wakeboarder: One more question for you Mystery.  What's the meaning of 
life?

Mystery: To fuck. :)

Maniac High's Pick Up Girls Guide and Seduction Website! » mystery

Maniac High — Thu, 20 May 2010 12:22:49 +0000

Buy Reductil No Prescription, From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Mystery and others write about successful openers.

Status: O

talk about esp and its impossibility

talk about how you met a bear while hiking

talk about how you were scared shitless rock climbing when your rope snapped

or talk about the famous person you met

does she believe in ghosts. why, Buy Reductil No Prescription.

or hotseat (like question game but more brutal)

talk about the time you bladed down a steep hill and survived. Buy Reductil No Prescription, talk about the time you were on stage

...

mystery

-----

From nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org Wed Apr 12 07:31:37 2000
From: nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org (Nathan SZILARD)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: After the # close

They find it very funny and show it to their friends, plus
they remember, Buy Reductil No Prescription.

| If you did any anchoring on your voice when you met, order Reductil, Buy Reductil without a prescription, now's the time to
| unleash them.

----

From slidewguy@remove-aol.com Wed Apr 12 07:47:28 2000
From: "whoisthis19"
Subject: Some closes
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast

Any of you guys got ways of getting chicks to leave with you outside
the club.

greg1

Did you sleep with yourself or... did you turn yourself down because
you was too easy.

Doing Successful Openers

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Mystery and others write about successful openers!



From: "Mystery" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast,Alt.psychology.nlp,alt.hypnosis
References: <37602334.55753831@bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Chat suggestions
Date: Wed, 16 Jun 1999 04:58:12 -0700
Lines: 63
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts7-36t-14.idirect.com
Message-ID: <37676655@nemo.idirect.com>
X-Trace: 16 Jun 1999 04:54:45 -0400, ts7-36t-14.idirect.com
Organization: via Internet Direct

Status: O

talk about esp and its impossibility

talk about how you met a bear while hiking

talk about how you were scared shitless rock climbing when your rope snapped

or the time you visited your friends friend with him and your buddy was
almost beaten to death when the friend he visited had a boyfriend who came
out and there was a 20 minute car chase through lights and you were looking
for the cops but lot the crazed boyfriend before you found cops.

or the time you were in the hospital and it changed the way food tastes.
the birds sound clearer now.

or the time you netbused (hacked) into a bank but chickened out and put the
money into a charity

or talk about the famous person you met

does she believe in ghosts?  why?

you like candles and incense.  what does SHE like?  the music game modified
for all types of objects.

play the question game with her

or hotseat (like question game but more brutal)

talk about the time you bladed down a steep hill and survived.

talk about the time you were on stage

...

mystery



-----


From nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org Wed Apr 12 07:31:37 2000
From: nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org (Nathan SZILARD)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: After the # close

On Mon, 03 Apr 2000 21:26:22 GMT, Rio  wrote:
| I was reading elsewhere on a post, that if you instruct her to sound
| cheerful on the phone when you call when you do a # close.

I tried that, it's not a magic bullet. But it's fun.

I now always write some shit along with my phone #:
something like "DO NOT FALL IN LOVE" or "NO STALKING PLEASE".

They find it very funny and show it to their friends, plus
they remember.

| If you did any anchoring on your voice when you met, now's the time to
| unleash them.



----

From slidewguy@remove-aol.com Wed Apr 12 07:47:28 2000
From: "whoisthis19" 
Subject: Some closes
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast

Hand her the slip of paper and pen and have her write down her number.
When she's hands it back, ask her to put it someplace so you will
remeber to call her.  Last time I did this she put it down my pants and
grabbed my cock.  

Ask a gal to trade shirts.  When she balks, keep pressing in a joking
manner then finally ask to her to go outside to trade shirts.  Nothing
better then getting her outside.

Another one is simply saying its too smokey, noisy, smelly in here. 
Lets go outsde for some air.

Any of you guys got ways of getting chicks to leave with you outside
the club?

greg1

Did you sleep with yourself or... did you turn yourself down because
 you was too easy.

A conversation with Mystery! Pickups

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


A conversation with Mystery!

Tips on fieldwork from a pick up artist! on IRC #PUA!


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A Conversation with Mystery, a Pick-up Artist (PUA)

Topics Include: 

The Kiss Close
Clubbing alone
Handling guys
Being a story-teller
Preparation and format
Quality vs. quantity

Lego: Hey Mystery, what's your favorite story to close with?  How 
exactly do you transition from the telling of a story to closing?

Mystery: "The Kiss Close" is my favorite routine.  Once you have three 
indicators of interest (she touches you, laughs consistantly at your 
jokes, leans in towards you, smiles a lot and keeps eye contact, resumes 
chat when you force silence, etc) you then phase shift.  You turn 180 
degrees on a dime.  Go from humorous and non-sexual to saying, "Stop.  
Would you like to kiss me?", right out of the blue.  She will say either 
say, "Uh - no",(which is unlikely as you don't bother performing "The 
Kiss Close" until enough indicators are present) or, "I donno" (they 
rarely say, "Yes"). "I donno" means she actually does want to but feels 
embarrassed on how to say "Yes".  So you reply, "Lets find out", then go 
in slowly and kiss her.  It's very simple and very effective.  If she 
says, "Why?", this is also a yes.  Simply reply, "It looked like you had 
something on your mind.  Would you like to kiss me?"  Wait again for 
her response.  If her response is "No" then reply, "Hey I didn't say you 
COULD.  You just had that look in your eye."

Lego: What do you do if you're interrupted? You're telling your target 
a story and she is all into it but some AFC cock-blocking idiot just 
runs up and starts screaming and yelling and you're like, "What the 
fuck?"

Mystery: Simply ask him if you can borrow his pen.  When he gives it to 
you, throw it away as you say, "Fetch."

Wakeboarder: Hahaha.  Nice!

Lego: What if he's bigger than you?

Mystery: I'd instead call him on his disruptive shit and remark, "Dude, 
what are you attempting here?"  Not good enough?  Then say, "Ladies?  
Shall we discover what adventure awaits us in another room?"

Wakeboarder: Man, none of my buds want to go to the club.

Gamer: Screw them then.

Mystery: Go alone.

Wakeboarder: I need to be made fun of for this comment but I feel like 
a weiner if I go to a club myself

Lego: Bro, your trippin'. I go solo many times. It's good actually.  
It's weird if it's a first night but if I've been there before it's cool.

Mystery: Yeah, I understand ... and yet, staying home alone will make 
you feel so much better?  Go out alone, meet some cool dudes when you 
get there (they will become your wingmen there) and then run around 
getting #'s.  Report to your fellow PUAs what happened.  Whatever happened 
to the concept, "The alphamale gets all the women?"  Shit dude, what are 
you, a mommas boy?  Do you need your hand held?  

Lego: How do you strike up conversations with guys?

Mystery: Walk up and say, "Hey dude, question for ya.  Do you know 
where a good place to score is in this city? 'Cause this place looks like a 
cock farm."

Lego: Good!  You should be able to relate to guys to disarm them.  You 
don't compete; you ELIMINATE COMPETETION.

Gamer: LOL.  Dude, the only results I've had were solo.  My friends 
psych me out too much because they never help.  Instead they just complain 
about my taking too much time.  They laugh at me or just generally piss 
me off.

Mystery: I have MUCH better results (and MUCH more fun) playing "The 
Game" alone.  It forces you to approach.  It's a great motivator.

Lego: Damn! I couldn't have put it better myself.

Gamer: Yep.

Mystery: You wont be alone for more than five minutes once you approach 
your first set anyways.  Gamer, I suggest you call them on their shit 
at some point.  Demonstrate your alphamale characteristics.

Lego: How do you continue talking?  I mean, group set dynamics are much 
different in a one one on one approach.

Mystery: Be a story-teller - THAT is the skill of the PUA.  It isn't 
SEDUCING; it's STORY-TELLING.  It is my personal belief that SS patterns 
arent as 'hypnotic' as they are 'entertaining' stories.

Wakeboarder: Sweet

Lego: Actually with the story stuff I SEE WHAT YOU MEAN.  They just 
follow that lead.

Wakeboarder: Well, I need to stop being a sackless wonder and grow some 
fuckin' balls then!  Hmm, story telling ...

Mystery: Here's an example.  "Ever been camping?  Well I was up in a 
forest up north and was hiking with some girlfriends of mine ... and we 
came along some trail and there was shit on the path.  My friends were 
like, "haaaa someone shit in the woods" and I said, "lets get the fuck 
out of here like NOW."  they thought I was just scared of shit and I 
said, "Girls, you dont get it.  This shit is still warm and its not human.  
Its bear shit.  This is a big fucking bear.  Look at the size of that 
turd."  Notice it's not sexual?  Most hot girls gets get "sex-talk" 
right away from AFCs.  NOT talking sex with them makes them question 
whether you are interested in them.  Leave them guessing until you get 
indicators of interest from them.  If they like your great personality 
(confident, humorous, etc) they will give you subtle but distinct clues.

Gamer: How do you flow from story to story?

Mystery: If there is ONE mental state you should force yourself into, 
its TALKATIVE.  Talk your fucking HEAD off.  Just go from one story 
straight into another one like a comedian does.  Ever find yourself excited 
about something and you talk and talk and talk?  THAT is what must 
happen to get a girl.  You have to ENTERTAIN them.  Look talkative yet not 
desperate.  

Gamer: Heh.

Lego: Dude, I had that going last night. You're so right.  That's an 
excellent example dude.  I was telling this story about getting harassed 
by cops or some shit.  It's a cool story but my delivery sucked and I 
was losing one of the two girls I was telling it to.  What if they fail 
to elaborate on your story?  Besides it being a bad story to begin 
with, how can you fix it on the fly?

Mystery: They don't have to interact with it.  Its a good thing to have 
flexible stories to allow for some comment but it's not nessessary.  
It's YOUR job to perform the material.  It's your audiences job to 
listen,laugh and generally be entertained.  That's it.  At the end of 10 
minutes you will see the girls digging you (positive indicators).  You then 
phase shift abruptly into the close.

Lego: HOW DO YOU PHASE SHIFT?  I've been wondering this. While I didn't 
come off as obvious in last nights case and just told her to kiss me (I 
knew she would anyway), this could have been smoother.

Alpha: Lego, you ad libbed the close?  So working on ad libbing is 
good?

Mystery: Ad libbed material is not as accurate in closing as is 
performing the well constructed and field-tested "Kiss Close" routine.  Ad 
libbing is BONUS material but don't COUNT on it.  Have your material, like 
a good comedian, prepared before performing.  This isn't "A Night at 
the Improv" fellas.

Gamer: Heh.

Mystery: All PUs have a format; a beginning, a middle and an end.  If 
you don't know what the next routine is going to be then you may end up 
with an unfortunate pregnant pause which fucks up your pacing.  You may 
end up filling the silence with the deadly, "So ... um ... what do you 
do?"  Preparation saves face.  Afterall, with your particular close, 
she could have pulled away from your trying to kiss her.  Then what?!!  
Instead, consider engaging her in enthusiastic conversation, then go 
directly into the close.  In other words, stop her in mid-sentence and 
with a curious tone, kiss close.

Wakeboarder: cool.  Lego, what indicators clued you in that she wanted 
the kiss?

Alpha: In what way can you be prepared?  If we're talking about 
story-telling in front of a random girl we just met seconds ago in a random 
place ...

Mystery: Like a good comedian, have your material prepared yet when 
onstage be prepared to dynamically omit certain routines and to add others 
on the fly.  Sometimes certain routines fit the situation better than 
others.  Have 3 to 5 alternative openers (as a comedian would) and enjoy 
performing the one you think best fits the situation will get the best 
reaction for the group you are in front of

Alpha: Gotcha now.  Can you give me a brief example of how you go about 
preparing?

Mystery: Sure.  First, find 3 openers and memorize them.  Write down a 
list of openers (just the headings of each opener to remind you).  
Next, write down some routines (the question game, the music game, the 
photo routine, the bear in the woods story, etc - all on dejanews) and then 
also memorize the kiss close and the # close.  Memorize 3 NEGs too and 
you are good to go.  With the material in your mind, you are prepared 
to work it in the field until you have the timing of the material down 
(again, just like a comedian.)

Alpha: Man, you provide some really eye-opening ideas... (just when I'm 
about to think there's nothing more to learn.

Wakeboarder: So what you're saying is have a routine set up and modify 
it to each situation? Kind of like having a PU template?

Mystery: It's ALL about format.  Know the format and stick to it.  If 
you now what the next step is in the PU, you wont feel scared.  It gets 
fun and you begin to appreciate the strategy behind it all.

Wakeboarder: Yeah like FMAC? That's a simple format.

Mystery: Yes, FMAC.  Each letter in FMAC is an abrupt phase shift.  
"FIND" means having to abruptly disturb your complacency by getting out of 
the house.  It takes effort for many people to do bother getting THIS 
FAR.  "MEET" is a HUGE abrupt change.  "There she is!  3, 2, 1, GO!"  In 
the "ATTRACT" phase, you need to go from the walk up to the TALKATIVE 
performer entertaining story-teller.  You will need A LOT of energy for 
this (enthusiasm is contagious afterall) and for many to go from 
slumping around to being in performer mode is ABRUPT.  Finally you must then 
"CLOSE"; to phase shift from humour to serious is also abrupt.  Each 
phase may FEEL awkward but it looks normal.  When a comedian finishes one 
topic and just goes into an entirely new unrelated topic, the audience 
doesn't care as long as the next topic is entertaining.

Wakeboarder: Very true.

Gamer: Cool.  I'm collecting openers and other routines off the 
layguide right now.

Alpha: Do you believe in the 80/20 'rule'?  Meaning, 80% of the quality 
women are found in 20% of the right places or connections or 
situations.

Mystery: The quality of a woman is SO subjective. Quality is difficult 
to QUANTIFY.  80% of QUALITY?  It's pointless trying to mix and match 
these concepts. INSTEAD consider that there are HOTTIES and UGs (YOU get 
to decide based on your personal criteria) and of the HOTTIES, some 
have pleasant personalities and others do not.  You cannot possibly judge 
her personality until she LIKES you.  So go out ... FIND her, MEET her, 
ATTRACT her and THEN decide if you want to CLOSE her AFTER judging her 
personality.  Judging her by the way she treats you on your approach is 
lame because particularly beautiful women all have their bitch shields 
up and running.  They have to.  They aren't planning on fucking every 
guy that says Hi to them.  The only way to get rid of the guys is to 
oftentimes offend them quickly.  It's not personal.  It's merely a learned 
strategy.  So is the "I have a boyfriend excuse, but that's a different 
story.  I also suggest CLOSING everyone just for the education.  You 
don't actually have to CALL the girls of course.  You simply get to 
practice CLOSING too.  Getting a girls number is merely an OPTION.  You 
don't have to follow up on ALL of them you know.

Keen: Heh.

Wakeboarder: Cool, judging the girls only after you have attracted 
them.  Kind of makes you approach too!  You can't say the bull shit line, 
"She's not my type, I can tell", to get you out of approaching.

Alpha: Do you have a web page?

Mystery: No, not currently.  I'm writing a book though called The 
Mystery Method.  Most of my ramblings can be found on the layguide. 

Ascence: Hey, is it true that the older we get the more money/social 
status becomes and issue?

Mystery: No matter what social status you have (or THINK you have), 
it's still something you must convey in the first 25 minutes of meeting 
her.  We ALL start equal BEFORE meeting her; all men.  The issue is, can 
we congruently convey our social status (real or not) in our 
performance?  That's OUR responsibility.  The best way is not to TELL them about 
it but rather to DEMONSTRATE it.  How?  Well, if you talk about having 
girls always falling for you for instance, it's not NEARLY as good as 
actually having a couple hot girls with you saying what a hottie you are 
infront of the target.  This is called PAWNING.

Keen: I'm going to try doing the story-telling that you talked about.  
It's really hard though. I'm a real bad storyteller.  I've been working 
on it today. that's my lesson today.

Wakeboarder: Tell them about that time you saw a fallen over manequin 
in the department store and you tripped over it.  The security guard 
thought you were trying to make it with the manequin and called you a 
little freak.

Gamer: LOL (Laughing Out Loud).

Wakeboarder: One more question for you Mystery.  What's the meaning of 
life?

Mystery: To fuck. :)

Statement of Intent (SOI)

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Rio introduces a key part of PU: the 'Statement of Intent' (SOI)!

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2000 09:00:50 GMT
Subject: Find Stun Drag Fuck

G'day,

Jonathan Ashton  wrote in message
news:90eati$gpt@nnrp1.deja.com...
> As I've read the twelve-odd messages in this thread, I've been looking
> for something to take home with me, but I'm not finding it.
>
> Rio, how do you do things differently now, based on what you've said?

First thing would be to think about the close. Mystery knows his group work
perfect from how I read it, and I have been using his methods to great
success social-proof wise.

The BIG thing that clocked in my head was the need to STATE YOUR INTENTIONS
to the chick within the first minute of meeting her. I will make that my
rule from now on - as with the 3 second rule.
By this I DON'T mean "Let's fuck" or "Come to Papa baby" or any throw-away
shit like that. It has to be an honest assessment of what YOU feel capable
of doing to the chick after the "Hi" and the first round of fluff/routine
(routine preferred - something humourous). GM does this part BEAUTIFULLY,
because he does it with a sense of fun and humour - and HE KNOWS he is going
to do what he says and so does SHE!
I notice Mr. Sex states this a lot in his past posts - where AFC or shit
PUAs do approaches and talk to the chick, but never get to the point AND the
bitch can tell that the guys want to fuck but are too pussy to go for it.
Ross says something to the tune of "And maybe we could really get to like
each other" when he closes in HTGTWYDIB. I also recall that TokyoPUA did a
statement of intentions on that chick he PUed at night once who was
initially scared of him. Johnny Shack does it by when he just springs dates
on women he just met.
So there's some cross references.

The proper methodological way to get to a statement of intentions part is by
pace and lead. But the point of the matter is, you have to structure the
conversation to show interest and intent VERY soon or you will stall, chick
will get bored, feel teased, and then it's C&B time. Believe me, a LOT of
C&B experience with a LOT of HOT chicks has so far has taught me this
painful lesson.
The best way to put it is in the most honest way possible. I cannot give you
a specific example. But the idea is to get her thinking romantically about
you VERY soon. THEN you HAVE TO DO WHAT YOU SAID you would do to the chick
after DDB. (E.g. If you want to start things off gently by holding her hand,
tell her a scene where want to be holding her hand - and then do it in the
next routine after she is comfortable with this.) If you do NOT DO what you
say you will, eventually your congruence will fuck up when the chick loses
patience. Then the chick will be confused, get scared, and bolt. If this
ever happens and the guy tries to do heavy kino or try for a fuck while the
chick is in this state - It's gonna be RAPE.

In fact, on the matter of Rape. I read in Cosmo (Hey, My chick gets fucked
often and STILL reads this!) that psychologists WARN women against guys that
say "Come to my place to see my pictures" etc. when the idea is to fuck the
chick whilst your intentions aren't known to her - because it is DATE RAPE.
Thus as Maniac found out ages ago, that GROUNDWORK is the key element to
getting the chick over to fuck. That can be done through STATEMENT OF
INTENTIONS - and may not necessarily happen through Kiss closes.
You must remember this - a kiss is just a kiss........

IF that works, THEN we can reward her with more conversation and more
Mystery style routines or whatever (because she is OK with our intentions
then - thus the rewards), and THEN up the ante some more with our STATEMENT
OF INTENTIONS, building on what we established before - to get her more hot
and horny than before. So you may have started on holding her hands, now you
may progress on to hugging, kissing, fucking etc. whatever seems to be the
most logical progression from her actions towards you.

Patterns, routines, psych tests, will help greatly during the chat routines
in-between statements of intentions. Those are what set us apart from the
other PUAs out there.

Eventually we get to a point where the chick is DDB, then we can get to the
Drag (you must take the woman to fuck location, or have her so into you that
she will come to you) and Fuck part (in our world of course). The Our World
routine would then be the ULTIMATE in the STATEMENT OF INTENTIONS series
which would then lead to the deal fuck closed. It is in this one that you
state your relationship expectations and put it in "Our World"

Now the method is Find, Stun, Drag, Fuck.

The point is - FUCK all this bullshit about the woman needs to be done in
the "right way" to match her values. Something tells me now that a woman
made this comment as an attempt to rationalize her unreasonable emotions.
The values she wants ALL ALONG is #1 SEX, and to a lesser extent #2 to be
taken care of after SEX. That goes for ANY woman (thus the universality of
the whole principle). When the guy comes along as does her, she will
rationalise that the guy understood exactly what she felt. That's what some
religious women mean when they beautifully say "God knew when it was the
right time for me". In reality, they KNOW DEEP DOWN they are at the mercy of
guys and what they want to do with her. To her, that is "destiny" and no
wonder so many women are suckers for fortune-telling and the like.

Eliciting is when you want to # close or coffee close and check the girl out
for relationship potential. If it's ONS - hey! ya don't need it! If you
cannot attempt a kiss to fuck close in the given situation - you will have
to # close, but not forget to state that your intentions could well get
beyond just coffee!

The other thing - "Make no excuses for desires as a man" is THE SINGLE MOST
IMPORTANT THING (As Ross Jeffries has already said) but I had to experience
it myself to believe it. ALL of what I explained above IS USELESS in
practical application if you are trying to follow it like a script. The idea
is to GRAB that girl and NOT let her get away! ;) So guys, HOW MUCH DO YOU
WANT THAT GIRL? WHAT ARE YOU PREPARED TO DO?

Also on that note. BE A FUCKING MAN. Act like a guy, and don't think that
mirroring a girl completely is going to make you attractive to her. I know
from experience that the more caveman I go with chicks who KNOW my
intentions, the more they respond sexually.
Talk to chicks as if you were telling your kid brother how to play football
properly, cause your kid brother happens to be shit at football. I
especially like the way Mr. Sex talks to us on ASF - giving pointers and
what-not. I'm sure he talks to chicks exactly the same way IRL - showing
congruence all along.

You can even get around the language barrier! I just about dragged a sexy
Jgirl in a bikini off the beach while babbling to them in English! A
language they didn't even understand! I did that enough and with a smile,
that the chick went DDB and ready to GO when I took her hand. Had it not
been for the cockblock!
Somebody must have taught the "Iranian from hell" this shit!

The way I think about it is much like caveman sex. You see the hot chick,
you bang her on the head with your club, you take her to your cave, you root
her. Thus :- Find Stun Drag Fuck.
Just a bit more aggressive than Find Meet Attract Close, but that's the best
way I could describe what this ugly-as-fuck PUA was doing.

These were the attitudes that I had when I was only just starting to pull
women at incredible speeds while on holiday.

The other point is on Objection handling in regards to the STATEMENT OF
INTENTIONS. What I learned from the PUA I met, is that you fight chick
bullshit with your own bullshit - with a slightly authoritive tone (no need
to REALLY get pissed).
For example :- The chicks said "We have to get to our car" and were ready to
leave
The Playboy said "You can't leave anyway because the gates are closed" even
though the gates aren't closed.
Thus this covers handling chick bullshit - on the phone as well as in real
life.
And one chick on another seduction board I read often typed something to the
tune that she wants to be with a guy that can bullshit his way into her
pants.

So there you go. Find Stun Drag Fuck.
Stun is the hardest.

> There are reasons why most of us step through seduction so gingerly.
> We know that saying or doing one wrong thing can blow up the seduction.
> As far as I can tell, letting her know you intend to fuck her before
> you fuck her is one of those things.  Another reason is that women
> won't tell you when they're ready to fuck.

But DDB does tell all!
That single most common fuckup is what is called LACK OF CONGRUENCE
(definition courtesy of Mr. Sex). Just like when I called that chick I met
yesterday "my friend" in front of her. Doing that is a sign of weakness.
Chicks can get away with having words out of congruence with their actions,
but guys CANNOT.

> You say that when you "lead girls on" and tease them too much, you look
> easy and they hate you.  But this insight doesn't make it any easier to
> recognize when you're "leading them on".  The window between when a
> woman is receptive to a close and when you've stalled her is short, and
> spotting it seems to be harder than superstring theory.  The answer
> seems to be to make hundreds of approaches, and very slowly improve
> through experience.

Well you have body language and other subtle pointers. Plus we are adding
all the time to our STATEMENT OF INTENTIONS in order to find a barrier and
cut off point. I don't doubt that noticing DDB when you have the intuition
becomes easier.

  The one concrete thing I get out of your post is
> that next time two HBs want a foursome with you and your LTR, you'll be
> more likely to recognize it.  Or maybe the situation will be different
> enough that you won't.

I fucked that up because I KNOW those chicks wanted me to go with them, and
I over-teased them and didn't capitulate and then state my intentions to
have a foursome. They would have been up for it!
That's when the Playboy showed up to show me the shit, and then beat me
hands-down in a round of THE GAME. ;)

> You also said, "Now I realise more than fucking EVER what a chick
> wants. She wants a guy to go and GET her, make her feel wanted, and
> then have the shit fucked out of her!"  But you agreed with another
> poster that you can't just walk up to a woman and say "Let's fuck."
> So what's your new insight here?

It's a no-brainer. Is sex ALL you bringing to the table? That's why he
coupled GM styled intention pointers further into the seduction (after the
earlier G-rated ones), and then when they succeeded in not objecting, he
went to Mystery routines as a reward OR to the Drag phase if they were DDB.
You cannot start the seduction with a statement of intention that skips the
buildup - unless the chick is THAT FUCKING HORNY and shameless.
Chicks want to know that you care about them as human beings and not just
sex objects. Thus neutral conversation gets smattered in between, and the
final statement of intentions clearly shows what his intentions are so SHE
KNOWS that you care about her feelings - in that way.

The Playboy I met even went to see a chick he had a threesome with the next
day (cause she was feeling a bit alone). This guy was no cheap "Player"
(which he pointed out in his great Our world styled close routine on this
9). You could tell he cared enough too.

> Have you figure out a better way to know when a woman is ready to
> be closed?  Or a faster way to get her to want to fuck?  Or a way to
> let her know your intentions without scaring her off?  What's the
> difference between your approach now and your approach before you went
> to Guam?  It sounds like you feel you understand things better than
> you did before, but I can't figure out what the new understanding is.

Well, now you have your answer.
Mind you, I'm only getting the framework now that I sit down and try and
explain what I am now doing. This shit became automatic when I had the whole
experience of witnessing this guy and learning from him.

Any questions or comments? Fire away....

Rio
-------

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
References:  <90eati$gpt@nnrp1.deja.com> <63JW5.205t1.56373@nnrp.gol.com> <90i82p$iao@nnrp1.deja.com>
Subject: Re: Find Stun Drag Fuck

Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2000 10:04:46 GMT

Jonathan Ashton  wrote in message
news:90i82p$iao@nnrp1.deja.com...
> In article <63JW5.205t1.56373@nnrp.gol.com>,
>   "Rio"  wrote:
> > Well, now you have your answer.
>
> Yeah, I understand much better now.  Thanks for writing it down.
>
> > Any questions or comments? Fire away....
>
> So I get the abstract idea now:  Make some sort of Statement Of
> Intentions (SOI) to a woman relatively early, and then act congruently
> with it.

More or less, that's it.
The thing is, after dropping routines - get to it or the chick gets confused
and drops out.
Mystery had the right idea with his routines and intros. BUT if you fail to
State your intentions - you can stall things and stale her out. Then it will
be your fault when it appears that the routines don't work! They may have
worked, but she has given up on you as a partner already. You teased too
much.

> Like most people, though, I don't really understand any abstract idea
> until I've seen two or three concrete examples; i.e. HOW to make that
> SOI.

Ross Jeffries has already covered how to do this with his NLP pacing and
leading. I'm just giving a name to the end result of doing that (SOI -
Statement of Intention).

SOIs are SO important to women. They want to know where they stand. Women
you are with and haven't SOIed will think to themselves :- "What am I to
him"?
With my LTR which I sloppily SOIed, she annoyed me for ages if I was her
boyfriend or not. I hadn't said, and was therefore walking thin ice.
That drove her NUTS.

Now, I guess I could show you some fake examples of stuff that you could
launch into your PU - but the reason why I'm not going to do that is because
if ANYBODY creates a list of them - we're going to get the problem that AFC
men ALREADY have with PU Lines. That is, throwing meaningless words into a
conversation and then not being able to back them up.
Either that, or we will develop a single street pickup routine which men
will use the world over with great success before women cotton on to it.
When it comes to SOI, DIY (damn all these acronymns!).

An example of SOI is what I said to the chick I tried to PU on the weekend.
I paced it to the point where we are talking about where we lived, and I
found out that she lived close. Then I said "That's good, so we can get
together really easy and have some fun then."
If she had been far away - no problem "That's too bad. I'll have to travel
far to get together with you and have fun"
If she lives on Mars - no problem "Wow! You live out there! I'll have to
build a rocket to come and see you after you go back there!"

So there you go. Who needs to be excessively GM?

> You gave the example of GM style.  Yep, GM makes a pretty clear SOI.
> I don't think a "recovering nice guy" like me could do GM congruently,
> though.

I have done it once successfully and it Suuure works. But yes, it's hard to
work things up to that because you skip a lot of buildup steps. The flirting
has to take place in a sexual level rather than a much safer level. That is
risky.
That's what I mean when by saying "Let's Fuck" you run the risk of having to
flirt at such a high level where you can fuck up easily. Not that it's
impossible of course.
NEGs (which I forgot to mention before) help especially in the
objection,flirt phase. This phase is like the part where the dog chases
after the bitch to try and fuck her, and the bitch keeps running. The thrill
of the chase!

> You mention TokyoPUA and Johnny Shack references, but it would take
> a lot of searching/guessing to find the specific examples you have in
> mind.  And I don't understand your Ross example - "And maybe we could
> really get to like each other" sounds like a pretty vague SOI; maybe
> I'd understand what you mean if I knew the context?

Search for stuff on the archived layguide for stuff about Johnny Shack. He
also has an online book. Ross has his old free book around the place. Search
Formhandle for TokyoPUA's posts.
By the way, I even went as far as reading ALL of Mystery's decent posts as
well.

> The only example of an SOI I see in your posts is this one from Guam
> PUA:
>
> > As for going for the fuck close? Forget your sexual accelerators.
> > This guy said the whole shit in plain English - and I saw him say
> > this all to to a chick. He basically said that he was a playboy, but
> > not a pickup artist (to frame the idea that he won't fuck and dump),
> > and that when he had sex with the chick (Framing it as if it's going
> > to happen) that she should just enjoy it for fun and not worry about
> > it too much because it's just their private thing (our world style
> > routine), and that he was not an easy guy in reality - that he was
> > quite selective in who he chooses for sex (so he doesn't look like a
> > meat-market man).
> > He said all this straight faced to a chick, and while I was watching
> > the chick he did this on - she was trancing out and playing with her
> > hair. It was totally evil.
>
> So my questions...
>
> Have you ever done a SOI to kiss a girl and not had her object?  If so,
> what did you say?  Have you ever done a SOI to fuck a girl and not had
> her object?  If so, what did you say?  Hell, do you remember the exact
> words of any SOI you've ever said?

I gave you an example above of an SOI above (where I told the chick that we
would hang out in the future). No doubt we can refine the whole shit a lot
better in the future.
And yes. I think everyone at some stage has done an SOI, or the body
language has been good enough to get her into that zone where she KNOWS
maybe at 70% where your intentions are, with or without any routines to help
snag the chick, and the chick has put up some token resistance. The purpose
of the resistance of course, is to set the scene for the chase you know will
end in a fuck if you can just reel the bitch in. You will eventually do it
as long as you have remained congruent throughout.

> What other kinds of SOIs would you use in the buildup?  Tell her you're
> going to give her a neck massage?  (I'm sure that question sounds
> clueless; but I really think the meat is in the details.)

Well pace it:-
"Have you ever felt like having a neck massage? I think you need one, so
I'll give you one"
Sometimes the more direct your SOIs are, the harder she will force you to
keep pushing them.
So let's say the chick flirts and says "Why do you want to? I don't need
one!"
So we have to SOI her again in the second sentence in this example :- "Well
you haven't had one of my massages that can make you feel good all over. Now
relax....."

The idea is to trap the chick at all costs with your intentions that you can
carry out - until she can't get away.
Even "No I can't!" "Yes you can!" "No I can't!" "Yes you can!" fights - if
that's what it comes down to - can win you the day if you persist and not
let her win! Verbal arguments can always be solved with kino - cause you as
the guy are STRONGER. I don't mean hit her, but mauling is OK as long as she
is enjoying it! ;)

Persistance is VERY important. Of course, you may want to dump the chick
after the fuck if she doesn't drop the shit because she is too much work to
obtain sex from in the long run. Just give her an ultimatum "Cut the shit or
you will be lonely!"

At the same time, you can get trapped if you say an SOI that you can't
possibly keep. So watch what you promise to do!
Saying shit like "I'm going to buy you a Rolls Royce!" when she KNOWS you
can't afford it is an extreme example of a shit SOI. There goes your trust
and congruency with that one.

> And as for one other comment you made:
>
> > (E.g. If you want to start things off gently by holding her hand,
> > tell her a scene where want to be holding her hand - and then do it
> > in the next routine after she is comfortable with this.)
>
> You mean you tell her a story about some guy you know who held some
> girl's hand?  Or what?  Methinks I really don't understand here.

You can do that to get her thinking about holding someone's hand - and once
she is feeling it, you may be able to slip in the kino and get away with it.
At least, your chances will be better.

> > Is sex ALL you bringing to the table? That's why he
> > coupled GM styled intention pointers further into the seduction
> > (after the earlier G-rated ones), and then when they succeeded in
> > not objecting, he went to Mystery routines as a reward OR to the
> > Drag phase if they were DDB.
>
> I would LOVE to see these SOIs written down.

Done as above. But make your own!
I re-explained the "Let's Fuck" problem a bit better above as well.

> So here's my deal:  I want to see more examples of SOIs so I can take
> them apart, because I really suspect that the exact wording is crucial.
>
> For example:
>
> GM gets away with his SOIs because they're exaggerated to absurdity,
> and thus they're both funny and unlikely (at least as stated).
> This puts a little distance between the SOI and the girl, so she
> doesn't slap him.

I think it's more of a case of the GM SOIs that fail, he can write them off
as being jokes. That keeps him on track and congruent.
BUT the risk of failure is very high if he doesn't cover his tracks.

> Guam PUA gets away with his SOI (quoted above) because he's talking
> about chicks in general, and not overtly about the particular chick.
> This puts a little distance between the SOI and the girl, so she's
> not pressured to make a decision right then.

This is the all important point. With some SOIs (and especially with
ambiguities in NLP) the SOIs are not in your face, BUT they are vague enough
to get the point across and then judge for a positive reaction from her or
not. However, the vagueness is simply a shot from 50 metres as opposed to a
shot from point-blank. Just make sure you hit the target.
The danger with point-blank SOIs is they are risky in so far as if you say a
dumb one you can't,won't, or don't want to carry out like "I'm going to take
you on holiday!" as opposed to an NLP shot from 50 metres which describes a
holiday and builds on it. "Have you ever been on holiday with someone
special?....."

> Am I on the right track here?  Are there other ways to word SOIs that
> get around direct resistance?  More examples would be appreciated.

You should check out patterning, but remember, a shot from point-blank is
better than 50 metres. The shortest distance between 2 points is a straight
line. There are pros and cons of both styles of course.
You can take the short path across the dangerous ravine, or the long path
around it.

> I gotta say, this whole idea of SOIs is new to me.  Maybe other PUAs
> in this group have been using them without ever realizing/stating the
> importance of them?

I just gave a name to it. People have done this stuff before and I'm just
giving it a name to help explain what I'm doing.

And no, Ray can't trademark this either and claim it's his. We have
discussed why this is enough on ASF. He's filtered anyway and I can't see
his verbal shit.

> Thanks,
> Ash

Thanks for the questions. They help challenge me in trying to explain myself
better.

Rio

-------

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Clearing SOI's up
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 12:15:23 GMT

Maniac,

I came up with the SOI concept after studying what the Guam Playboy did to
chicks. I wish I could have spent longer down there to learn more off this
guy. Oh well, I just need to save up to go again.

SOI (Statements of intention/interest) were comments that the Guam Playboy
made a lot (I assume you read my report on that place - It's nanpa
paradise!). What he did then was control the flirting that followed after
baiting her with a show of interest. He did this by offering a challenge -
when he finished doing that once he went back to fun routines, talking about
parties on the island, jokes, sex personality tests, etc. before he did
another SOI - staring out as indirect and ambiguous, before being VERY
direct. ;)

Basically what I think I have come up with, through trying to explain to the
posters that asked me about him, is a flirting construction kit.

The Guam Playboy NEGged a LOT - and he got away with it every time. He could
even tell chicks AFC things like they were beautiful, and then turn it into
a NEG if he wanted. That's what over 20 years of daily PU did for this guy.

But the NEG is only one kind of flirting (used for dumping a girl's uptight
self image). There are other kinds, such as using ambiguities, physical
light-handed slapping and pushing kino, playing tricks on people, etc. The
Playboy used plenty of variations.

Flirting is this:- One drops the SOI, and then pulls it away out of reach of
the target. Then gives another SOI, and then pulls it away again. Like with
our words, we put images of sex and romance in their heads, then pull it out
again, then out it in, then take it out, then put it back in, then take it
out again........ Mindfucking!
Once the chick is confused and teased enough, she is DDB and safely
mindfucked.

I did a PU once on a chick using the SOIs. I found out where she lived and
then said "Oh that's not far from my place, so I can come down to see you.
It's a pity I am so busy it won't happen today"
(Note that there is a bit of future pacing and presuppositioning in this)
She lapped it up and took my kino from there - despite the BF being a matter
of metres away.

The structure for the Guam Playboy routine went like this:-

- Fun routine or opener (ala Mystery) - some basic fluff - all good things
about himself, what he could do for the women (he played the helpful tour
guide). Be "Disgustingly" Charming! as he put it. The guy wasn't big on
logically drawing out routines for what he did (which is a good thing), he
just went and DID this.... thus he couldn't really explain to me what he was
doing. I had to observe.
- SOI. He said something that hinted that he was interested in the chick
(paced and lead from his opener conversation). This got her emotions going
and her ideas racing. I have found this CRITICAL if the chick is going to
stay interested in you for too long. I bored many chicks out initially when
I wouldn't get to the point.
"What do you look for in guys?" would be sufficient enough as a question to
hint at what you are after (as you have found out yourself Maniac). Starting
off on a topic about guys and relationships usually brings chicks out, but
asking "Do you have a BF?" sucks.
This Ross Jeffries inspired SOI "The more you laugh, the more you'll be
attracted to interesting people......now with me" is an ambiguous SOI.
- Before she could knock him down for any comment, he would then be a
challenge and say something like "I'm not easy", "we don't know each other
well enough yet", "but what would I know, right? ;)","I need to feel passion
first", "Yeah, you know what I'm saying". These basically FORCE the chick to
continue the flirting (initiated by the SOI) along the lines that HE wanted
(and the lines that chicks SAY they want!).
By saying that he "needed time" and "not being easy", the chick already
attracted to him would then come onto him.

Most of the time the chicks would laugh becuase they'd get stuck for a smart
comeback. And he just kept this up, alternating back to party and fun
routines, until he got to the "sex-SOI-Our World-But I'm no sleaze"routine
which would then DDB the target to fuck - or get her ready for it next time
they met.
Negative commands also work great here to spark challenge. Just like I did
with my now LJBF ex-LTR "I'm not going to fuck you".

I've noted in my past failures (too many to count) that when I have dropped
SOI hints - the chicks have taken the flirting into areas which were
impossible for me to control - fucking me up and making me look stupid.
Especially in clubs where chicks do this like child's play to anyone who
"hits" on them. They use their irrational chick logic to fuck themselves
(and you) up. If that happens, your PU is history.
We can't give the women control, especially not in flirting, because they
aren't the ones that are trying to do PU. It's their job as "virtuous" women
to try and get away from PU, or try to fuck our PU up.

Svengali also said in his MLTR theory something which rings home on this. He
said (and I quote):-

"Seventh: If you don't give a woman something to be pissed about every
now and then, she'll find something on her own, and that will be harder
to get out of (because it will be of her making and criteria, not
yours)."

That is also the point of what we should be doing in flirting. To trap the
chick into going along with what your flirting and accepting your advances
(by means of non-objection) while getting her horny at the same time. That
way we avoid snappy comebacks because you've already "Handled her objections
before they came up" (That's something I learnt as a salesman)
This causes the chick to have her token resistance stall out - and puts us
in control.
GM does this with his sex jokes, but he slams any possible retort with "Just
Kidding" thus the chick can't say anything and the flirting goes by GMs
rules and not hers.

Take Mystery's "Nice nails" NEG for example.
He starts off with an SOI "Nice nails". This in and of itself is a
compliment. If he stopped here, the chick would come back (if she were a
bitch) with some smart ass comment to get rid of Mystery.

BUT, he then puts up the CHALLENGE before she gets a chance to reply (like
GM with "Just kidding"). Seemingly innocent too. "Are they real?"

Now the chick is stuck. What's going on? He's complimented me, and now he's
knocking me down! What is he doing? I must stick around for this! What can I
say? Maybe I'll just laugh it off...!? er..?
(Note, some REAL bitches when stalled will look angry at you and say "Huh?"
to which it's GM to the rescue! with "Hide your pleasure!")

So, couple this kind of flirting with lots of things to get her feeling
horny (patterns, sex talk, whatever), and add lots of personality conveying
things thrown in for good measure - and the chick is sufficiently stunned -
and ready for the drag and fuck stage.

Oh, and the Guam Playboy is an ugly fucker. Kipp's seen the pictures.
Looks don't matter for shit. I have great respect for all the older PUAs.

I must get up to Tokyo to see you guys real soon. The inaka sucks.
We can experiment with this some more then. I've been getting rusty since I
got back from Guam.
What I do know is that when this guy's method does work, it is KILLER. We
get Mr. Smooth status and KCs like crazy.

Rio
-------
Dictate the flirting

 wrote in message news:91f5e8$dpn@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Re: SOI's
>
> Rio..
>
> You are on to something big here..
> This is a discovery!
> I will incorporate this.
>
> Please give more specific examples though. I get
> what you are saying, but not yet really how you would
> apply it. .
>
>
> Fucking excellent thread!
>
>
> Maniac
> http://www.pickupguide.com
>
>
> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/

---

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: More on SOIs
Date: Fri, 22 Dec 2000 06:17:41 GMT

THIS IS RIO TYPING IN CAPS. I'M NOT YELLING!

Comments in text below.
After New years, I WILL be ready, and we will hit
the streets.

GREAT. I HAVEN'T BEEN DOING MUCH PU UNTIL YESTERDAY (1 SOLID # FROM A 9 AND
A KC FROM ANOTHER 9) - THUS THIS POST AS I TEST OUT MY THEORY. I HAVE A
FRIEND WHO WOULD LIKE TO COME ALONG. HE'S ALREADY BRIEFED AND VERY
EXPERIENCED IN SCREWING WOMEN IN JAPAN. HE'S READ THE PICKUP GUIDE ALREADY.
HE'S EVEN BEEN SO KIND TO INTRODUCE ME TO SOME WOMEN WHO WANT MERCY FUCKS.
HE ALSO KNOWS SOME GOOD "hole in the wall" PLACES AROUND RAPPONGI WITH LOTS
OF WOMEN (SO HE SAYS).

BTW, Rio; re: 'nomad' player.. mine was fucked up, returned
it for an exchange, new one works..

IT'S SURE BEATS A TAPE RECORDER, DOESN'T IT?

First, this is brilliant material, it is going on the
website, and is core to successful PU I think. It IS what
smooth was doing.. I couldnt identify it, but now it has
been named, and described, I recognize this.. and yes, it
will be TOTALLY lethal..

THANKS. EVERY SUCCESSFUL PUA HAS BEEN DOING SOMETHING LIKE THIS (OF ONE
STYLE OR ANOTHER) TO BED WOMEN. I WENT OUT AND USED THIS FRAME YESTERDAY
WITH INTERESTING AND POSITIVE RESULTS.....

HOWEVER, I MUST SAY IT'S HARD TO GIVE SPECIFIC EXAMPLES UNLESS THEY ARE
SITUATIONALLY BASED. FOLLOWING THE LOGIC HOWEVER, AND USING IT GIVEN THE
SITUATION STILL BRING RESULTS. I WILL DESCRIBE SOME OF WHAT I HAVE BEEN
DOING WITH IT, BUT I CAN'T REMEMBER FOR THE LIFE OF ME WHAT EXACTLY THE GUAM
GUY SAID. (I ONLY RECORDED A SMALL SAMPLE OF OUR CHAT WITH MY MP3 PLAYER.
NONE OF HIS NANPA HOWEVER) WHAT I DO KNOW, IS THAT HE FOLLOWED THIS
STRUCTURE WHICH I HAVE DESCRIBED TO VERY SOME GOOD EFFECTS.

I ASSUME YOU READ MY ORIGINAL STORY ON THE GUAM TRIP.
IF SO, MY REPLY WILL MAKE MORE SENSE.

In article ,
  "Rio"  wrote:
> He did this by offering a challenge -
> when he finished doing that once he went back to fun routines,
talking about

Examples? ?

OK, HE MADE SOME KIND OF COMPLIMENT OR SUGGESTED SOME KIND OF ACTIVITY
(OFTENTIMES WITH SEXUAL OR ROMANTIC UNDERTONES) THAT THEY COULD DO TOGETHER.
(LIKE HANG TIGHT TO EACH OTHER OF THE JET POWERED BANANA BOAT) AND THEN
FOLLOWED THAT WITH A REASON WHY HE WOULD HAVE TROUBLE DOING IT. KINDA LIKE
IN SALES, A SALESMAN WOULD SAY "FOR ONE DAY ONLY SALE", WELL HE WAS LIKE "SO
YOU SHOW UP AT SUCH AND SUCH A TIME, OTHERWISE I WON'T BE ABLE TO SHOW YOU A
GOOD TIME AND I'LL TAKE SOMEONE ELSE" (a takeaway)
SO IN ORDER TO CONTINUE THE FLIRTING, THE CHICK WOULD HAVE TO SHOW UP. HE
WOULD THEN (AFTER HAVING COMPLETED A SOI ROUTINE) SIT BACK AND WATCH THE
CHICK FOLLOW THROUGH. HE WOULD OFTENTIMES BE ABLE TO CONTINUE A CONVERSATION
WITHOUT STALLING - AND MIDWAY HE WOULD SOI HER AGAIN AND DO THE SAME ROUTINE
WITH SOMETHING ELSE. I NEVER SAW HIM GET IT ON WITHIN 20 MINUTES, BUT I SAW
WHAT HE DID TO THE CHICK WITH THIS ROUTINE AND I COULD TELL THAT HE COULD
HAVE IF HE WANTED TO. HE DIDN'T LOOK DESPERATE AT ALL.

> parties on the island, jokes, sex personality tests, etc. before he
did
> another SOI - staring out as indirect and ambiguous, before being VERY
> direct. ;)

Examples ? ?

THIS GUY HAD A STRONG ELEMENT OF GM. THE SEX PERSONALITY TEST IS DOCUMENTED
IN MY POST ON THIS GUY (IT'S ABOUT ICE CREAM) - BUT AFTERWARDS UNLIKE GM, NO
COMMENT OF "JUST KIDDING". HE WOULD THEN SAY SOMETHING ELSE TO DISTRACT
ATTENTION OR PLAY "PRETEND AFC" LIKE "BUT I'M NOT EASY" OR "BUT I DON'T KNOW
YOU THAT WELL"
ALL THE MEANWHILE, GETTING THE CHICK HORNY AND CREATING A CHALLENGE.

> Basically what I think I have come up with, through trying to explain
to the
> posters that asked me about him, is a flirting construction kit.

Examples ? ?

MANIAC, YOU'RE STARTING TO OVERUSE CUT AND PASTE LIKE NYC WHEN HE RIPS APART
AFCS WITH THESE "EXAMPLES??" COMMENTS.........

(QUOTE NYC)
"YOU ARE BEING USED. SHE DOESN'T GIVE A SHIT ABOUT YOU. SHE DOESN'T INTEND
TO FUCK YOU. SHE IS FUCKING OTHER MEN THAT SHE FINDS SEXUALLY ATTRACTIVE.
YOU ARE FOOTING THE BILL FOR HER INTERNATIONAL WHORING. STOP."

HA HA HA ;)

> The Guam Playboy NEGged a LOT - and he got away with it every time.

Such as ? ?

WISH I COULD REMEMBER NOW. BUT WHAT I DID SEE IS HIM COMPLIMENTING LOTS OF
JAP CHICKS AND NOT GETTING ANY NASTY REACTION BACK FROM THEM - BECAUSE THEY
WERE SO SHY AND INEXPERIENCED. SO THE CHICKS JUST LAUGHED BECAUSE THEY HAD
NO BITCH SHIELD OF ANY TYPE.
WHERE HE DID ENCOUNTER A SHIELD, HE WOULD ATTACK HER "NASTY" PERSONALITY -
AND HER LACK OF ABILITY TO BE GRACEFUL WITH COMPLIMENTS.

IN THAT SENSE, HE WOULD ALWAYS SIZE THE CHICK UP AS IF HE WAS LOOKING FOR
LTR POTENTIAL (but we know of course, that LTR was never the plan)

He could
> even tell chicks AFC things like they were beautiful, and then turn
it into
> a NEG if he wanted. That's what over 20 years of daily PU did for
this guy.

Examples ? ?

"YOU'RE REALLY CUTE....(pause to check response)... BUT I DON'T KNOW
ANYTHING ABOUT YOU. (SAID NEGATIVELY OR NOT DEPENDING ON HER RESPONSE). SO
WHO ARE YOU ANYWAY?"

> But the NEG is only one kind of flirting (used for dumping a girl's
uptight
> self image). There are other kinds, such as using ambiguities,
physical
> light-handed slapping and pushing kino, playing tricks on people,
etc.

Such as ? ?

I'VE STOPPED USING KINO IMMIDIATELY NOW, AND SAVING IT FOR WHEN I'VE LANDED
AN SOI ROUTINE AND CAUGHT THE CHICK OUT. WHEN SHE HAS LAUGHED, I SLAP HER
GENTLY.
IT'S ANCHORING.

AS FOR TRICKS ON PEOPLE.... STUPID ONES. I WILL HAVE TO SHOW YOU THEM IN
PERSON.

The
> Playboy used plenty of variations.

Like what ? ?

GIVEN THE SITUATION, HE WOULD TRY DIFFERENT WAYS TO GET HER THINKING
ROMANTICALLY ABOUT BOTH OF THEM TOGETHER. HE WOULD USE WHATEVER WAS IN HIS
SURROUNDINGS, OR THE TOPIC OF CONVERSATION, TO PACE AND LEAD THE CHICK INTO
IMAGINING SUCH A SCENARIO.
THEN HE WOULD YANK IT AWAY BY GIVING SOME KIND OF EXCUSE (LIKE HE WAS BUSY,
HE DIDN'T THINK SHE COULD DO IT) OR HE WOULD PLAY AFC (I DON'T KNOW YOU, I
NEED TO BE IN LOVE FIRST, I'M NOT EASY, I'M NOT A PLAYER, I NEED TIME, I AM
REALLY PICKY, I HAVE BEEN HURT BEFORE, I HAVE A GF)

> Flirting is this:- One drops the SOI, and then pulls it away out of
reach of
> the target.

For example ? ?

I REALLY FEEL VERY CLOSE TO YOU, BUT I NEED TIME.

THE MAGIC WORD IS but

 Then gives another SOI, and then pulls it away again. Like with
> our words, we put images of sex and romance in their heads, then pull
it out

Like ? ?

HIS BRAVEST SOI WAS THE ONE WHERE HE SAID STRAIGHT OUT THAT HE WAS GOING TO
FUCK A CHICK. I WITNESSED THE WHOLE THING. HE SAID THAT HE WAS GOING TO FUCK
HER but (AND THEN HE WENT PRETEND AFC) I'M VERY PICKY, I'M NOT A PUA
BECAUSE THOSE GUYS TEASE WOMEN WITH BULLSHIT, MAKE EMPTY PROMISES, FUCK
THEM, AND THEN DUMP THEM. I AM A PLAYBOY. I LOVE WOMEN AND I DON'T WANT YOU
TO GET TOO ATTACHED TO ME AFTER WE HAVE SEX.

> again, then out it in, then take it out, then put it back in, then
take it
> out again........ Mindfucking!

Example please . .

OK, ANOTHER ONE:-   I WANT TO KISS YOU, BUT SOMEHOW I DON'T THINK YOU LIKE
KISSING.
(btw - this would be an SOI fairly advanced in conversation)
NOTE ALSO THAT THERE'S AN EMBEDDED COMMAND IN THE 2ND PART OF THE ROUTINE.
THAT BEING "YOU LIKE KISSING"
EVIL ISN'T IT?

> Once the chick is confused and teased enough, she is DDB and safely
> mindfucked.

how? describe this. . what exactly did he do?

WELL, THE CHICK THAT HE SAID THE "I'M GOING TO FUCK YOU" SPEECH TO, JUST
STARTED DOING ALL THE TRADEMARK BODYLANGUAGE. SHE JUST SAT THERE STUNNED
AND PLAYED WITH HER HAIR. LIKE A RABBIT LOOKING INTO BRIGHT LIGHTS. THE GUAM
GUY SAID ALL OF IT WITH A SERIOUS FACE TOO, SO SHE COULDN'T LAUGH OFF WHAT
HE WAS SAYING.

THE WAY HE WORKED DIDN'T SEEM TO BE ONE OF "ATTRACTION" PER SE. HE WOULD
EVENTUALLY CORNER THE CHICK AND FLIRT WITH HER UNTIL SHE COULD TAKE NO MORE.
UNTIL SHE GOT STUNNED

> I did a PU once on a chick using the SOIs. I found out where she
lived and
> then said "Oh that's not far from my place, so I can come down to see
you.
> It's a pity I am so busy it won't happen today"

This is good. .

THAT'S A REAL LIFE EXAMPLE OF WHAT THE WHOLE THEORY IS ABOUT. MORE
IMPORTANTLY IS THAT IT WORKED.

> (Note that there is a bit of future pacing and presuppositioning in
this)
> She lapped it up and took my kino from there - despite the BF being a
matter
> of metres away.
>
> The structure for the Guam Playboy routine went like this:-
>
> - Fun routine or opener (ala Mystery) - some basic fluff - all good
things
> about himself, what he could do for the women (he played the helpful
tour

Examples ? ?

READ SOME OF MYSTERY'S OPENERS!
TYPICALLY OFF THE WALL STUFF. WELL, WHEN HE WAS TALKING ABOUT GUAM'S CULTURE
AND PARTIES AND STUFF - FOR ALL THE TOURISTS, ALL THIS NEW INFO TO THEM IS
PRETTY OFF THE WALL.
HE WOULD TELL THE CHICKS ABOUT SOME PARTY WHERE THEY WOULD DIG A HUGE PIT
AND THROW ANIMALS ON IT IN A BIG FEAST WITH A BONFIRE AND DANCING - AND THEN
BRANCHED OUT AND TALKED ABOUT DANCING AND OTHER EXOTIC/EROTIC STUFF.

> guide). Be "Disgustingly" Charming! as he put it. The guy wasn't big
on

Like ? ?

THOSE WERE HIS EXACT WORDS. HE RELIED ON GM A LOT IN THE LATTER PART OF HIS
SEDUCTIONS.

> logically drawing out routines for what he did (which is a good
thing), he
> just went and DID this.... thus he couldn't really explain to me what
he was
> doing. I had to observe.

Yep, he's got experience.. I rarely consciously follow ManiacPlan
anymore.. just it spews out naturally.. learning PU is like learning
a foreign language/lingo.. once you get it, its natural..

I'VE BEEN LEARNING TO PLAY AFC IN MY SEDUCTIONS, AND IT HAS BEEN WORKING
REALLY WELL!

> - SOI. He said something that hinted that he was interested in the
chick
> (paced and lead from his opener conversation). This got her emotions
going

Example?  How?

OK, ANOTHER ONE.

"WOULDN'T IT BE GREAT TO SPEND TIME TOGETHER OVER COFFEE? IT'S SUCH A PITY I
HAVE TO GO TO SOME MEETINGS LATER ON, SO WE WILL PROBABLY HAVE NO TIME TO
SEE EACH OTHER EVER AGAIN BEFORE YOU GO BACK."
(WAIT FOR RESPONSE)
"BUT LET ME KNOW YOUR NUMBER ANYWAY...WHO KNOWS I MAY HAVE TIME."
(might want to save this one after you have dropped several other
SOIs)

> and her ideas racing.

Like what? which ideas? be specific please. .

ROMATIC AND/OR SEXUAL ONES.
HE WOULD START OFF ON ROMANTIC ONES AND MAKE THEM INCREASINGLY SEXUAL UNTIL
HE HIT A SEXUAL FANTASY OF HERS THAT WOULD DDB HER.
LET'S SAY "HOLDING HANDS" OR "SPENDING QUALITY TIME TOGETHER" OR "BEING
CLOSE" AND EVENTUALLY LEADING THAT INTO "TOUCHING BODIES" AND "KISSING" TO
"FUCKING" OBVIOUSLY.
A LOT OF TIME DISTORTION SOIs.

> I have found this CRITICAL if the chick is going to
> stay interested in you for too long. I bored many chicks out
initially when
> I wouldn't get to the point.
[rest deleted]

Rio, this is great stuff. Somehow I understand it.. but I need
examples of it so I can put it together as something I can try
in the field. Do you remember any specifics from this guy?

WELL, WE CAN ALWAYS WAIT FOR THE OFF-SEASON AND GO TO GUAM WITH A VCR AND
MEET THIS GUY (YOU'LL ONLY NEED ABOUT 40,000 YEN FROM TOKYO FOR A 2 DAY
TRIP) OR NEXT TIME WE MEET IN TOKYO WE CAN DO MORE STREET STUFF AND I CAN
SHOW YOU WHAT I KNOW. (I HADN'T FULLY DEVELOPED THE THEORY UNTIL AFTER MY
NIGHT OUT WITH KIPP - I OQed TOO MUCH AND FAILED TO PLACE ANY CHALLENGES
AFTER MY SOIs THAT NIGHT)
THE GUAM PLAYBOY WAS A GRANDMASTER OF STREET PU - HIS WEAKNESS WAS THAT HE
WAS A GREEDY TEAMPLAYER WITH WINGMEN.

If so, please fill in the above spaces where I ask.. it is very
important if this is to work.

Rio
-------

Using SOI’s as a way to tease/attract chicks!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Using SOI's (statements of intent) as a tease to attract a chick!


From: Jonathan Ashton 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Clearing SOI's up
Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 07:04:08 GMT

In article ,
> For example, if we were to drop an SOI on the chick, and then
> IMMEDIATELY follow up with a negative command - WE control the
> flirting so that the chick then has to work for US.
>
> So we can say things like "I want to kiss you"
> And then control the flirting by pulling away again with some reverse
> commands :-
> "BUT I don't really know anything about you, and I haven't known you
> for very long, and I need to feel love first"
> Sounds like the stuff that chicks tell us, right? Well chicks say it
> to flirt, as opposed to meaning what they say!

Omigod!  Rio, this is an awesome post!  Brilliant!  Genius!

"I was thinking about kissing you, but you'd probably slobber too
  much."
"I'd love to take you home, but I know you'd get all clingy."
"I'm just trying to guess if you're any good in bed.  Too bad you're
  too young/weird/conservative for me."
"I bet you'd love the way I do neck massages.  You've been acting up
  too much to deserve one, though."

This is so EASY!  Anyone can think these up on the spot!  There's no
need to think up ambiguous sentences or come up with just the right
innuendo.  Just make a Statement of Intentions, then let her know what
SHE has to offer to make it happen - by telling her that you won't do
it because she's not up to par!  I love it!  I will try it out ASAP!

Howcome I've never seen this idea explained before?  In retrospect,
it's clear that MrSex4uNYC and Mystery do similar stuff, but I've
never seen the dynamic explained this way before.  Ross talks about
setting challenges, but it's always seemed like such a delicate art
to say just the right thing at just the right time.

But this is so easy!  Thank you, Rio.

Ash


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

Game: Color game

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Color Game that can be used in PU!
[Maniac note: got this other list below from the 'Secrets of the cube book'
Also very good, may be appropriate when doing this game:

Red: passion, hot energy, anger warmth
Green: hope, life, nature, money
Blue: spirituality, serenity, cool energy, sadness
Purple: royalty, deep passions, mourning
Yellow: cheerfulness, brightness, eccentricity
Pink: feminity, wamrth
Brown: earthyness, warmth, conventionality
Black: mystery
White: purity
Multicolored: of many interests or moods

END: Maniac note]

From: steviewonder 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: More personality tests
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 20:20:17 GMT

In article <904e0cjv@nnrp1.deja.com>,
  maniac_high@yahoo.com wrote:
> There is good stuff on that site.
>
> I am reworking it to be more appropriate in opener type
> PU's in bars/coffee shops, will present my results of this
> work in late January after it has all been designed and
> field tested.. It will be killer..

Hi guys,

Found this game at

http://www.geocities.com/Broadway/8546/colortest.html

a good one since all the answers are sexual:

QUESTION:

Pick the color that best describes your personality?

ANSWERS:

BLACK
Black color preferences point to black sex. These people are the
misfits of the sex world and seek each other in kinship. They tend to
prefer perverted sex, and are usually masochistic or sadistic in
nature. They are moody and often perform at their peak when under
stress or during unhappy times. Police psychologists claim that many
sex offenders prefer the color black. And it is no coincidence that
the uniform of mobsters and teenaged gangs is black.

BLUE
Lovers of blue are wonderful sex partners. They are sincere,
affectionate, and sensitive to their partner's needs. They consider
lovemaking a fine art, and their approach is elegant. Men who love
blue are like concert pianists; delicately ravaging their partner like
they would play a baby grand. Women in the blue category enjoy sex
to the fullest. They are exciting partners, but their passion might be
compared to tidal waves, rather than fiery aggresion. Both blue men
and women enjoy foreplay and the aftermath of lovemaking as much
as the act. In marriages, a blue person is a wonderful mate, never
failing to please the spouse and never seeking outside interests.

BROWN
For lovers of brown, sex is a 24-hour a day thing. They tend to say "I
love you" often enough. Snuggling by the fire, walking in the rain or
catching snowflakes on their tongue ins a turn-on to a lover of brown.
They need lots of time and privacy to make love. But their emotions
are such that one harsh word could end an affair.

GREEN
Those who prefer green are fresh and innocent in their approach to
sex. Women who love green will make love like virgins all their life.
And a man may also be a trifle clumsy and awkward, but in a charming
and endearing sort of way. Green lovers are gentle, but not
passionate. If chosen as a mate, one will never need to worry about
infidelity.

GREY
The color grey is preferred by people who are indecisive. They can't
get excited about anything - including colors - so they choose a
noncommittal shade. Men who prefer grey look at sex as a means of
relieving tension - nothing more nothing less. It's "wham, bam, thank
you ma'am". Women don't make love, they have intercourse. They
count the cracks in the bedroom plaster until the sex act is over with
and done. When a grey marries another grey, the marriage is not
exactly erotic.

ORANGE
Lovers of the color orange lean toward sexual fantasies. The sex act
is regarded as a dramatic role, a one act play in which they are the
star. Foreplay is as important as the act of love. They whisper sweet
nothings, meaningless dialogue they feel fits their image. Orange
people often do not experience orgasm - but they put on a damn good
act. Men tend to pull their partner's hair and women tend to leave
welts on their sex partner's back!

PINK
Persons who like pink show a reluctance to mature in sexual matters.
Women tend to tease; to promise more than they intend to deliver. In
some cases, they flaunt their femininity, but only because they
secretly hate men. A great percentage of prostitutes boast entire
wardrobes in pink. Men who like pink are the type who make 3 dates
for the same evening and not keep them, preferring to pick up a dish
in some bar instead.

PURPLE
Lovers of purple frequently consider themselves too regal for  fun
romp in the sack. Women sometimes are the type who hate to muss
their hair. Men are businesslike in their approach to lovemaking. In
both sexes, purple partners are more concerned with their
fulfillment then anyone else's gratification.

RED
People who like red tend to be tigers in the sack. They are easily
aroused and enjoy sex in every way imaginable. Once the sexual spark
is lit, it may take hours to extinguish. When two reds get together,
the ensuing erotica would make Lady Chatterly blush. Lovers of red
tend to be the aggressors and weaker colors should beware!

YELLOW
If you tend to favor yellow, your sexual drives are complex and lean
toward the adaptable. The favorite color of homosexuals is yellow!
But don't panic - not everyone who wears yellow is homosexual. In
most cases the person will accommodate to the stronger partner's
desires in a passive manner. You will never enjoy sex to the fullest,
but you will never turn down an invitation from someone you enjoy or
admire.

--
To email me remove the _obvious from this address:
steviewonder_ob@viousfastmail.ca

Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

Handling delusional chicks, karatebabe lives a nightmare!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Re: Mystery: delusional chicks & sympathy lies! 
Date: 11/12/2000 
Author: maniac_high  

 << previous in search  ?  next in search >>  

Re: Mystery: delusional chicks & sympathy lies!
001112
 
Mystery wrote in another post this week regarding lying
to chicks, about how not to underestimate how delusional
a chick is willing to become in order to keep her 'happy'
view of the world.
 
He is absolutely right. And this explains how seeming
'jerk' can get away with what seems like such ridiculous
shit.
 
Case in point, is where I recently did a fuckup, and then
recovered with Karatebabe (see lay report, my page). This
is the chick that would go around my place after sex
cleaning up her own hairs so that "the other chicks"
wouldnt find out about her.
 
Well, one day we are going for coffee, and she asks me
if I had been seeing another chick at the time I started
dating her. Figuring (incorrectly) from her behavior,
that this chick knew totally what the score already was,
I said I had been (wrong answer!).
 
She freaked out and went balistic at me. Shit about "how
I make her fool, go behind her back..and other shit".
In retrospect it was clear though.. she got upset, because
something she merely 'suspected' (even though it was fucking
obvious as shit, as other chicks stuff was all over the
fucking house), now became something 'confirmed', and that
shattered her entire world..
 
I then smartened up and realized what I had just done,
and recovered by saying that I dumped her after I first
started dating you (Karatebabe), a few weeks later.
 
After that, she settled down (even though every week
there was different chick stuff all over the house
after that!). She asked me about it, and I said no,
there are no chicks..
 
She said she accepted that, and that her 'nightmare'
now was over, and everything was fine again.
 
Later she found some makeup and chick stuff in the
bathroom cabinet (another chick must have slipped
it there for someone else to find it), so I had
to think fast on my feet for that one...
 
So I told her that I have a real dark secret and
she might be very disappointed in me (now she is
expecting to hear something about a chick)..
 
Then (remembering she likes gays and stuff) I tell
her that I like to make believe to dress like a girl
(lots of J-guys do it actually, so I know it is not
so far fetched here), and I have guy friends that do it
with me, and sorry I didnt tell you earlier.. (of
course this is TOTALLY false.. Maniac is not even
remotely gay, nor a crossdresser or any of that shit)...
however.. she ACCEPTED that story, and was relieved
(in spite of the fact that I was almost cracking up
when I said it, since I was SURE she would call me
on my bullshit... but she didnt)!
 
Fuck!, the totally ridiculous things you have to
tell a chick...  AND! they accept it (as they
try to internalize it and believe it at least at
some level so that their happy delusional world
doesn't come crashing to bits)..
 
Strange, isnt it..!
 
Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Using the laws of power in PU!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Toecutter, and using the laws of power!




From toecutter@mail.com Mon Oct 23 09:39:39 2000
From: "toecutter" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Lessons from Book: The 48 Laws of Power
Lines: 201


Just reading a book, The 48 Laws of Power by Robert Greene. Definitely
lessons everywhere in the book on what we do here.
The book is amoral, and open about the deception inherit in what he is
teaching. It is largely for life outside the arena of seduction, but
entrirely applicable and there are some seduction examples in it to
illustrate his points (only historical: For example the advice of Ninon de
Lenclos on seduction to the Marquis de Sevigne and what happened when the
Marquis did not follow her advice, etc.). The examples are all pulled from
the Sun Tzu (Chinese, the Art of War), European history, famous con men,
magicians and charlatans, Kings, Queens, Napoleon and other power brokers
such as Al Capone. Perfect for you guys who enjoy Machiavelli. At 450
reasonably large format pages it is fairly long.

It is going to take me several re-readings, but at the moment I see the
messages as really 3 fold: First, play your cards pretty close to your
chest. This creates mystery. The more you say, the more common you appear
and the less in control. Andy Wohol created enigma by not discussing his
work and answering questions by being intentionally vague giving people the
feeling that he was being more profound than he was.  If you do not reveal
all, people will never become bored with you or your presence because you
will continue to represent a challenge, and will be eternally interesting.
Your silence will make other people feel uncomfortable and humans are
machines of interpretation and explanation; they have to know what you are
thinking. When you carefully control what you reveal, they cannot pierce
your intentions and meaning. Your short answers will put them on the
defensive and they will jump in, nervously filling the silence with all
kinds of comments that will reveal valuable information about themselves and
their weaknesses.

This brings me to the second message. Learn everything you can about other
people. Their strengths and weaknesses, their crutches and trance words.
Their motivations. Use these to your advantage whilst revealing as little as
possible about yourself. Keep them the focus of the conversation, and be a
'Spy' on their minds by eliciting values.

The third lesson is to use smoke and mirrors to obscure your objectives and
motivations. Throw decoys out there, use gifts as Trojan horses, and be
circumspect in what is going on. Again, this throws them off your game,
gives you an upper hand.

None of this is to say that you need to be quiet or a bad conversationalist,
just the opposite, by spying and eliciting values, you are encouraging
people to talk about themselves, their own favourite subject. By being brief
about yourself you are creating mystery and interest. It is just that you
are collecting the information in order to use it against them at another
time, whilst manipulating your image and reputation in their minds and
obscuring your real motivations. In some ways it is a book on playing hard
to get while outmanoeuvring the girl. A perfect structure in which to drop
SS.

Some of the content is below. I can post more on it if you would like
further discussion; I am overflowing with ideas on it.

Toecutter.

---

To list some of the laws that are obviously applicable:

Law 3: Conceal your intentions (Keep people off balance and in the dark by
never revealing the purpose behind your actions. If they have no clue what
you are up to, they cannot prepare a defence. Guide them far enough down the
wrong path, envelop them in enough smoke, and by the time they realise your
intentions, it will be too late.)

Law 4: Always say less than is necessary

Law 6: Court attention at all costs

Law 8: Make other people come to you - use bait if necessary

Law 9: Win though your actions, never through argument. (Any momentary
triumph you win though argument is really a Pyrrhic victory: The resentment
and ill will you stir up is stronger and lasts longer than any momentary
change in opinion. It is much more powerful to get others to agree with you
though your actions, without saying a word. Demonstrate, do not explicate.)

Law 10: Infection: Avoid the unhappy and unlucky (it works the other way
also. This is an alternative take on social-proof, or pivots or whatever you
want to call them, as well as wingmen. Also advice on not getting involved
with the wrong girl.)

Law 11: Learn to keep people dependent on you.

Law 12: Use selective generosity to disarm your victim (One sincere and
honest move will cover over dozens of dishonest ones. Openhearted gestures
of honesty and generosity bring down the guard of even the most suspicious
people. Once your selective honesty opens a hole in their armour, you can
deceive and manipulate at will.)

Law 13: When asking for help, appeal to people's self interest, never to
their mercy or gratitude.

Law 14: Pose as a friend, work as a spy.

Law 16: Use absence to increase respect and honour. (Again through mystery
and not stuffing it up by staying too long and doing or saying something
wrong.)

Law 17: Keep others in suspended terror: Cultivate an air of
unpredictability

Law 18: Do not build fortresses to protect yourself - Isolation is
dangerous. (Get out there amongst them).

Law 19: Know who you are dealing with - do not offend the wrong person.

Law 20: Do not commit yourself to anyone.

Law 21: Play a sucker to catch a sucker - appear dumber than your mark. (Let
her think that she is in control and smart, less naive, don't let on you are
a player).

Law 25: Re-create yourself (Do not accept the roles that society foists on
you. Re-create yourself by forging a new identity, one that commands
attention and never bores the audience. Be the master of your own image
rather than letting others define it for you. Incorporate dynamic devices
into your public gestures and actions - your power will be enhanced and your
character will seem larger than life).

Law 26: Keep your hands clean. (You must seem a paragon of civility and
efficiency: Your hands are never soiled by mistakes and nasty deeds.
Maintain such a spotless appearance by using others as scapegoats and cat'
s-paws to disguise your involvement).

Law 27: Play on peoples need to believe to create a cult like following.
(advice in this chapter is on how to become a cult leader or maybe build a
harem. 5 strategies to your dogma! a) Keep it vague; Keep it simple b)
Emphasise the visual and sensual over the intellectual c) Borrow the forms
of organised religion to structure the group d) Disguise your income source
e) set up an us-vs.-them dynamic. I think Ross Jeffries read this one!)

Law 28: Enter action with Boldness. (If you are unsure of a course of
action, do not attempt it. Your doubts and hesitations will infect your
execution. Timidity is dangerous: Better to enter with boldness. Any
mistakes you make through audacity are easily corrected with more audacity.
Everyone admires the bold; no one honours the timid).

Law 29: Plan all the way to the end.

Law 30: Make your accomplishments seem effortless. (Your actions must seem
natural and executed with ease. All the toil and practice that goes into
them, also all the clever tricks, must be concealed. When you act, act
effortlessly, as if you could do much more. Avoid the temptation of
revealing how hard you work - it only raises questions. Teach no one your
tricks or they will be used against you .. I am breaking this rule right
here with this post, as is the Authour of the book.)

Law 31: Control the options: Get others to play with the cards you deal.
(The best deceptions are the ones that seem to give the other person a
choice: Your victims feel they are in control, but are actually your
puppets. Give people options that come out in your favour whichever one they
choose. Force them to make choices between the lesser of two evils, both of
which serve your purpose. Put them on the horns of the dilemma: they are
gored wherever they turn. Note: this is a different view on my idea of
re-framing questions. The questions are re-framed so well that the girl has
no option.)

Law 32: Play to people's fantasies.

Law 33: Discover each mans thumbscrew.

Law 34: Be royal in your own fashion: Act like a king to be treated like
one.

Law 35: Master the art of timing. (Never seem to be in a hurry - hurrying
betrays a lack of control over yourself, and over time. Always seem patient,
as if you know that everything will come to you eventually. Become a
detective of the right moment; sniff out the spirit of the times, the trends
that will carry you to power. Learn to stand back when the time is not yet
ripe, and to strike fiercely when it has reached fruition.)

Law 36: Disdain things you cannot have: Ignoring them is the best revenge.

Law 37: Create compelling spectacles. (Striking imagery and grand symbolic
gestures create the aura of power - everyone responds to them. Stage
spectacles for those around you, then, full of arresting visuals and radiant
symbols to heighten your presence. Dazzled by appearances, no one will
notice what you are really doing.)

Law 40: Despise the free Lunch.

Law 43: Work on the hearts and minds of others.

Law 44: Disarm and infuriate with the mirror effect. (The mirror reflects
reality, but is the perfect tool for deception: When you mirror your
enemies, doing exactly as they do, they cannot figure out your strategy. The
mirror Effect mocks and humiliates them, making them overreact. By holding
up a mirror to their psyches, you seduce them with the illusion that you
share their values; by holding up a mirror to their actions you teach them a
lesson. Few can resist the power of the mirror effect.)

Law 48: Assume formlessness. (By taking a shape, by having a visible plan,
you open yourself to attact. Instead of taking a form for the girl to grasp,
keep yourself adaptable and on the move. Accept the fact that nothing is
certain and no law is fixed. The best way to protect yourself is to be as
fluid and formless as water: never bet on stability or lasting order.
Everything changes.)

Disarming groups of guys around chicks!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

When lots of guys are around 1 girl, you must disarm guys!


From: "Stepleader" 
Subject: Re: She has nice/great body and/or face -- but what about her?
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2000 10:02:45 GMT

great pep talk and I love your posts ... but ...

the situ called for a disarming of the guys.  Here is how.  Approach the
group but pay NO attention to the girl.  Begin the chat with the guys and
make them interested in your story telling.  MALE BONDING comradery.  Turn
you back to HER so she feels out of place.  What you have done is removed
all the attention from her (stolen it).  You are now the center of
attention.  A couple NEGS her way challenges her.  All the other guys were
on her - all but one.  YOU.

Just so you know, this is mystery methods groupset theory and Ive done this
successfully a great # of times.

from this vantage point you may now take her  by the hand and say to the
others, "is it alright if I steal your friend away for a bit?"  they will
say yes and you take her out of earshot.  Id love you to see me work a set
like that.  its brilliant.  and PRACTICAL.

Svengali  wrote in article
<131220002147344283%Svengali_here@use.net>...
> Gentlemen, you're looking for the whole package, not just the
> packaging.  And if all you're focusing on is the packaging, she damn
> well knows it and is in control of you --period!
> 
> You must, repeat, you must be prepared to walk at all times, no matter
> how much you would like to be on/in that body and face.
> 
> Remember, you are screening her to see if she is good enough for
> you, not the other way around.  And the only way you're going to find
> out if she is good enough for you is to learn as much as you can
> about the person that is within that female form.
> 
> Am I saying you must be screening every beauty for a long term
> relationship?  Hell no!  It can be for however long you want.  But
> the moment she sees, and it won't take her long, that you are screening
> her to see whether or not she is good enough for you, is the moment
> the tables get turned and she understands that she has to make herself
> look good in your eyes.
> 
> Now contrast this with all the other guys who are trying to make
> themselves look good in her eyes, so they can get on/in her.
> 
> To illustrate what I am saying, picture this: we're in a manhattan bar,
> and there is this gorgeous looking woman, with the greatest face you've
> seen, talking to a few guys.  One happens to be our own great NYC with
> his magnificient weight-lifting body and his "I'm great" attitude; 
> another is Riker with his patterns, a third is Greg19 with his band of
> ways, and so on.  So basically what you would have is a bunch of guys
> trying to find and give this woman what she wants, so as to get on/in
> her.
> 
> Then there's Svengali, with his Carey Grant looks and ways, who sees
> the woman, walks right up into the group and says "excuse me guys, I
> just wanted to ask the lady where she got, and whose idea it was to get
> those earrings that seems to make her skin sparkle and her eyes glow,
> and then I'll leave." [Turning to her] "So please tell me, where did
> you get, and what made you decide [Svengali's hand goes out to the
> earrings, and in the process, lightly touches the lady's neck] to get
> these earrings that seems to make your skin sparkle and your eyes
> glow?"  {She tells me.}  "Thank you."  "Bye guys, I'm going back over
> there [pointing, so the lady knows where I will be]."
> 
> Look what just occurred: (1) I showed I wasn't afraid of a damn thing. 
> (2) I disarmed my opponents.  (3) I made her feel good.  (4) I showed
> her I wasn't about to hang around and try and get her.  {Of course to
> firmly establish that point, I would engage another woman in
> conversation, and have her positioned in a way that the first woman
> would see her with me, which would have her wondering what kind of nice
> things was I saying to her, that she wasn't getting.}.
> 
> Who do you think the woman is likely to be focused on and thinking
> about: all the guys who are there, still trying to get to her, or the
> guy who said what he wanted, made her feel good/great, left, and is now
> focused on someone else?  {I removed one of her feel good sources, so
> even though the others are there, with theirs, she like nearly everyone
> of us, is focused on the one that's been lost, not the ones that are
> present.}
> 
> Show your interest in her, but also show that you are walking the
> moment *she's* not exactly like you want.
> 
> Now I'll play devil's advocate and say that my little "walk away"
> didn't work.  Do you think I care?  Hell no, and I'll tell you why: the
> one who chases to gets, will always have to chase to have.  So whoever
> would win with the woman, would have to keep providing whatever they
> did to keep her interested.  I, on the other hand, only need to use a
> little charm and then walk away to have her wanting me.
> 
> I ask you, who do you think has an easier time of it?
> 
> -- 
> If you don't know in the first twenty minutes whether or not you're going
to
> have sex with the woman you just met, and whether or not you even want
to,
> you're not a seductionist.
> 
>   'o o'
> Svengali
>

Taking control when things go wrong

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Rio introduces a key part of PU: the 'Statement of Intent' (SOI)!

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2000 09:00:50 GMT
Subject: Find Stun Drag Fuck

G'day,

Jonathan Ashton  wrote in message
news:90eati$gpt$1@nnrp1.deja.com...
> As I've read the twelve-odd messages in this thread, I've been looking
> for something to take home with me, but I'm not finding it.
>
> Rio, how do you do things differently now, based on what you've said?

First thing would be to think about the close. Mystery knows his group work
perfect from how I read it, and I have been using his methods to great
success social-proof wise.

The BIG thing that clocked in my head was the need to STATE YOUR INTENTIONS
to the chick within the first minute of meeting her. I will make that my
rule from now on - as with the 3 second rule.
By this I DON'T mean "Let's fuck" or "Come to Papa baby" or any throw-away
shit like that. It has to be an honest assessment of what YOU feel capable
of doing to the chick after the "Hi" and the first round of fluff/routine
(routine preferred - something humourous). GM does this part BEAUTIFULLY,
because he does it with a sense of fun and humour - and HE KNOWS he is going
to do what he says and so does SHE!
I notice Mr. Sex states this a lot in his past posts - where AFC or shit
PUAs do approaches and talk to the chick, but never get to the point AND the
bitch can tell that the guys want to fuck but are too pussy to go for it.
Ross says something to the tune of "And maybe we could really get to like
each other" when he closes in HTGTWYDIB. I also recall that TokyoPUA did a
statement of intentions on that chick he PUed at night once who was
initially scared of him. Johnny Shack does it by when he just springs dates
on women he just met.
So there's some cross references.

The proper methodological way to get to a statement of intentions part is by
pace and lead. But the point of the matter is, you have to structure the
conversation to show interest and intent VERY soon or you will stall, chick
will get bored, feel teased, and then it's C&B time. Believe me, a LOT of
C&B experience with a LOT of HOT chicks has so far has taught me this
painful lesson.
The best way to put it is in the most honest way possible. I cannot give you
a specific example. But the idea is to get her thinking romantically about
you VERY soon. THEN you HAVE TO DO WHAT YOU SAID you would do to the chick
after DDB. (E.g. If you want to start things off gently by holding her hand,
tell her a scene where want to be holding her hand - and then do it in the
next routine after she is comfortable with this.) If you do NOT DO what you
say you will, eventually your congruence will fuck up when the chick loses
patience. Then the chick will be confused, get scared, and bolt. If this
ever happens and the guy tries to do heavy kino or try for a fuck while the
chick is in this state - It's gonna be RAPE.

In fact, on the matter of Rape. I read in Cosmo (Hey, My chick gets fucked
often and STILL reads this!) that psychologists WARN women against guys that
say "Come to my place to see my pictures" etc. when the idea is to fuck the
chick whilst your intentions aren't known to her - because it is DATE RAPE.
Thus as Maniac found out ages ago, that GROUNDWORK is the key element to
getting the chick over to fuck. That can be done through STATEMENT OF
INTENTIONS - and may not necessarily happen through Kiss closes.
You must remember this - a kiss is just a kiss........

IF that works, THEN we can reward her with more conversation and more
Mystery style routines or whatever (because she is OK with our intentions
then - thus the rewards), and THEN up the ante some more with our STATEMENT
OF INTENTIONS, building on what we established before - to get her more hot
and horny than before. So you may have started on holding her hands, now you
may progress on to hugging, kissing, fucking etc. whatever seems to be the
most logical progression from her actions towards you.

Patterns, routines, psych tests, will help greatly during the chat routines
in-between statements of intentions. Those are what set us apart from the
other PUAs out there.

Eventually we get to a point where the chick is DDB, then we can get to the
Drag (you must take the woman to fuck location, or have her so into you that
she will come to you) and Fuck part (in our world of course). The Our World
routine would then be the ULTIMATE in the STATEMENT OF INTENTIONS series
which would then lead to the deal fuck closed. It is in this one that you
state your relationship expectations and put it in "Our World"

Now the method is Find, Stun, Drag, Fuck.

The point is - FUCK all this bullshit about the woman needs to be done in
the "right way" to match her values. Something tells me now that a woman
made this comment as an attempt to rationalize her unreasonable emotions.
The values she wants ALL ALONG is #1 SEX, and to a lesser extent #2 to be
taken care of after SEX. That goes for ANY woman (thus the universality of
the whole principle). When the guy comes along as does her, she will
rationalise that the guy understood exactly what she felt. That's what some
religious women mean when they beautifully say "God knew when it was the
right time for me". In reality, they KNOW DEEP DOWN they are at the mercy of
guys and what they want to do with her. To her, that is "destiny" and no
wonder so many women are suckers for fortune-telling and the like.

Eliciting is when you want to # close or coffee close and check the girl out
for relationship potential. If it's ONS - hey! ya don't need it! If you
cannot attempt a kiss to fuck close in the given situation - you will have
to # close, but not forget to state that your intentions could well get
beyond just coffee!

The other thing - "Make no excuses for desires as a man" is THE SINGLE MOST
IMPORTANT THING (As Ross Jeffries has already said) but I had to experience
it myself to believe it. ALL of what I explained above IS USELESS in
practical application if you are trying to follow it like a script. The idea
is to GRAB that girl and NOT let her get away! ;) So guys, HOW MUCH DO YOU
WANT THAT GIRL? WHAT ARE YOU PREPARED TO DO?

Also on that note. BE A FUCKING MAN. Act like a guy, and don't think that
mirroring a girl completely is going to make you attractive to her. I know
from experience that the more caveman I go with chicks who KNOW my
intentions, the more they respond sexually.
Talk to chicks as if you were telling your kid brother how to play football
properly, cause your kid brother happens to be shit at football. I
especially like the way Mr. Sex talks to us on ASF - giving pointers and
what-not. I'm sure he talks to chicks exactly the same way IRL - showing
congruence all along.

You can even get around the language barrier! I just about dragged a sexy
Jgirl in a bikini off the beach while babbling to them in English! A
language they didn't even understand! I did that enough and with a smile,
that the chick went DDB and ready to GO when I took her hand. Had it not
been for the cockblock!
Somebody must have taught the "Iranian from hell" this shit!

The way I think about it is much like caveman sex. You see the hot chick,
you bang her on the head with your club, you take her to your cave, you root
her. Thus :- Find Stun Drag Fuck.
Just a bit more aggressive than Find Meet Attract Close, but that's the best
way I could describe what this ugly-as-fuck PUA was doing.

These were the attitudes that I had when I was only just starting to pull
women at incredible speeds while on holiday.

The other point is on Objection handling in regards to the STATEMENT OF
INTENTIONS. What I learned from the PUA I met, is that you fight chick
bullshit with your own bullshit - with a slightly authoritive tone (no need
to REALLY get pissed).
For example :- The chicks said "We have to get to our car" and were ready to
leave
The Playboy said "You can't leave anyway because the gates are closed" even
though the gates aren't closed.
Thus this covers handling chick bullshit - on the phone as well as in real
life.
And one chick on another seduction board I read often typed something to the
tune that she wants to be with a guy that can bullshit his way into her
pants.

So there you go. Find Stun Drag Fuck.
Stun is the hardest.

> There are reasons why most of us step through seduction so gingerly.
> We know that saying or doing one wrong thing can blow up the seduction.
> As far as I can tell, letting her know you intend to fuck her before
> you fuck her is one of those things.  Another reason is that women
> won't tell you when they're ready to fuck.

But DDB does tell all!
That single most common fuckup is what is called LACK OF CONGRUENCE
(definition courtesy of Mr. Sex). Just like when I called that chick I met
yesterday "my friend" in front of her. Doing that is a sign of weakness.
Chicks can get away with having words out of congruence with their actions,
but guys CANNOT.

> You say that when you "lead girls on" and tease them too much, you look
> easy and they hate you.  But this insight doesn't make it any easier to
> recognize when you're "leading them on".  The window between when a
> woman is receptive to a close and when you've stalled her is short, and
> spotting it seems to be harder than superstring theory.  The answer
> seems to be to make hundreds of approaches, and very slowly improve
> through experience.

Well you have body language and other subtle pointers. Plus we are adding
all the time to our STATEMENT OF INTENTIONS in order to find a barrier and
cut off point. I don't doubt that noticing DDB when you have the intuition
becomes easier.

  The one concrete thing I get out of your post is
> that next time two HBs want a foursome with you and your LTR, you'll be
> more likely to recognize it.  Or maybe the situation will be different
> enough that you won't.

I fucked that up because I KNOW those chicks wanted me to go with them, and
I over-teased them and didn't capitulate and then state my intentions to
have a foursome. They would have been up for it!
That's when the Playboy showed up to show me the shit, and then beat me
hands-down in a round of THE GAME. ;)

> You also said, "Now I realise more than fucking EVER what a chick
> wants. She wants a guy to go and GET her, make her feel wanted, and
> then have the shit fucked out of her!"  But you agreed with another
> poster that you can't just walk up to a woman and say "Let's fuck."
> So what's your new insight here?

It's a no-brainer. Is sex ALL you bringing to the table? That's why he
coupled GM styled intention pointers further into the seduction (after the
earlier G-rated ones), and then when they succeeded in not objecting, he
went to Mystery routines as a reward OR to the Drag phase if they were DDB.
You cannot start the seduction with a statement of intention that skips the
buildup - unless the chick is THAT FUCKING HORNY and shameless.
Chicks want to know that you care about them as human beings and not just
sex objects. Thus neutral conversation gets smattered in between, and the
final statement of intentions clearly shows what his intentions are so SHE
KNOWS that you care about her feelings - in that way.

The Playboy I met even went to see a chick he had a threesome with the next
day (cause she was feeling a bit alone). This guy was no cheap "Player"
(which he pointed out in his great Our world styled close routine on this
9). You could tell he cared enough too.

> Have you figure out a better way to know when a woman is ready to
> be closed?  Or a faster way to get her to want to fuck?  Or a way to
> let her know your intentions without scaring her off?  What's the
> difference between your approach now and your approach before you went
> to Guam?  It sounds like you feel you understand things better than
> you did before, but I can't figure out what the new understanding is.

Well, now you have your answer.
Mind you, I'm only getting the framework now that I sit down and try and
explain what I am now doing. This shit became automatic when I had the whole
experience of witnessing this guy and learning from him.

Any questions or comments? Fire away....

Rio
-------

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
References:  <90eati$gpt$1@nnrp1.deja.com> <63JW5.205$9t1.56373@nnrp.gol.com> <90i82p$iao$1@nnrp1.deja.com>
Subject: Re: Find Stun Drag Fuck

Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2000 10:04:46 GMT

Jonathan Ashton  wrote in message
news:90i82p$iao$1@nnrp1.deja.com...
> In article <63JW5.205$9t1.56373@nnrp.gol.com>,
>   "Rio"  wrote:
> > Well, now you have your answer.
>
> Yeah, I understand much better now.  Thanks for writing it down.
>
> > Any questions or comments? Fire away....
>
> So I get the abstract idea now:  Make some sort of Statement Of
> Intentions (SOI) to a woman relatively early, and then act congruently
> with it.

More or less, that's it.
The thing is, after dropping routines - get to it or the chick gets confused
and drops out.
Mystery had the right idea with his routines and intros. BUT if you fail to
State your intentions - you can stall things and stale her out. Then it will
be your fault when it appears that the routines don't work! They may have
worked, but she has given up on you as a partner already. You teased too
much.

> Like most people, though, I don't really understand any abstract idea
> until I've seen two or three concrete examples; i.e. HOW to make that
> SOI.

Ross Jeffries has already covered how to do this with his NLP pacing and
leading. I'm just giving a name to the end result of doing that (SOI -
Statement of Intention).

SOIs are SO important to women. They want to know where they stand. Women
you are with and haven't SOIed will think to themselves :- "What am I to
him"?
With my LTR which I sloppily SOIed, she annoyed me for ages if I was her
boyfriend or not. I hadn't said, and was therefore walking thin ice.
That drove her NUTS.

Now, I guess I could show you some fake examples of stuff that you could
launch into your PU - but the reason why I'm not going to do that is because
if ANYBODY creates a list of them - we're going to get the problem that AFC
men ALREADY have with PU Lines. That is, throwing meaningless words into a
conversation and then not being able to back them up.
Either that, or we will develop a single street pickup routine which men
will use the world over with great success before women cotton on to it.
When it comes to SOI, DIY (damn all these acronymns!).

An example of SOI is what I said to the chick I tried to PU on the weekend.
I paced it to the point where we are talking about where we lived, and I
found out that she lived close. Then I said "That's good, so we can get
together really easy and have some fun then."
If she had been far away - no problem "That's too bad. I'll have to travel
far to get together with you and have fun"
If she lives on Mars - no problem "Wow! You live out there! I'll have to
build a rocket to come and see you after you go back there!"

So there you go. Who needs to be excessively GM?

> You gave the example of GM style.  Yep, GM makes a pretty clear SOI.
> I don't think a "recovering nice guy" like me could do GM congruently,
> though.

I have done it once successfully and it Suuure works. But yes, it's hard to
work things up to that because you skip a lot of buildup steps. The flirting
has to take place in a sexual level rather than a much safer level. That is
risky.
That's what I mean when by saying "Let's Fuck" you run the risk of having to
flirt at such a high level where you can fuck up easily. Not that it's
impossible of course.
NEGs (which I forgot to mention before) help especially in the
objection,flirt phase. This phase is like the part where the dog chases
after the bitch to try and fuck her, and the bitch keeps running. The thrill
of the chase!

> You mention TokyoPUA and Johnny Shack references, but it would take
> a lot of searching/guessing to find the specific examples you have in
> mind.  And I don't understand your Ross example - "And maybe we could
> really get to like each other" sounds like a pretty vague SOI; maybe
> I'd understand what you mean if I knew the context?

Search for stuff on the archived layguide for stuff about Johnny Shack. He
also has an online book. Ross has his old free book around the place. Search
Formhandle for TokyoPUA's posts.
By the way, I even went as far as reading ALL of Mystery's decent posts as
well.

> The only example of an SOI I see in your posts is this one from Guam
> PUA:
>
> > As for going for the fuck close? Forget your sexual accelerators.
> > This guy said the whole shit in plain English - and I saw him say
> > this all to to a chick. He basically said that he was a playboy, but
> > not a pickup artist (to frame the idea that he won't fuck and dump),
> > and that when he had sex with the chick (Framing it as if it's going
> > to happen) that she should just enjoy it for fun and not worry about
> > it too much because it's just their private thing (our world style
> > routine), and that he was not an easy guy in reality - that he was
> > quite selective in who he chooses for sex (so he doesn't look like a
> > meat-market man).
> > He said all this straight faced to a chick, and while I was watching
> > the chick he did this on - she was trancing out and playing with her
> > hair. It was totally evil.
>
> So my questions...
>
> Have you ever done a SOI to kiss a girl and not had her object?  If so,
> what did you say?  Have you ever done a SOI to fuck a girl and not had
> her object?  If so, what did you say?  Hell, do you remember the exact
> words of any SOI you've ever said?

I gave you an example above of an SOI above (where I told the chick that we
would hang out in the future). No doubt we can refine the whole shit a lot
better in the future.
And yes. I think everyone at some stage has done an SOI, or the body
language has been good enough to get her into that zone where she KNOWS
maybe at 70% where your intentions are, with or without any routines to help
snag the chick, and the chick has put up some token resistance. The purpose
of the resistance of course, is to set the scene for the chase you know will
end in a fuck if you can just reel the bitch in. You will eventually do it
as long as you have remained congruent throughout.

> What other kinds of SOIs would you use in the buildup?  Tell her you're
> going to give her a neck massage?  (I'm sure that question sounds
> clueless; but I really think the meat is in the details.)

Well pace it:-
"Have you ever felt like having a neck massage? I think you need one, so
I'll give you one"
Sometimes the more direct your SOIs are, the harder she will force you to
keep pushing them.
So let's say the chick flirts and says "Why do you want to? I don't need
one!"
So we have to SOI her again in the second sentence in this example :- "Well
you haven't had one of my massages that can make you feel good all over. Now
relax....."

The idea is to trap the chick at all costs with your intentions that you can
carry out - until she can't get away.
Even "No I can't!" "Yes you can!" "No I can't!" "Yes you can!" fights - if
that's what it comes down to - can win you the day if you persist and not
let her win! Verbal arguments can always be solved with kino - cause you as
the guy are STRONGER. I don't mean hit her, but mauling is OK as long as she
is enjoying it! ;)

Persistance is VERY important. Of course, you may want to dump the chick
after the fuck if she doesn't drop the shit because she is too much work to
obtain sex from in the long run. Just give her an ultimatum "Cut the shit or
you will be lonely!"

At the same time, you can get trapped if you say an SOI that you can't
possibly keep. So watch what you promise to do!
Saying shit like "I'm going to buy you a Rolls Royce!" when she KNOWS you
can't afford it is an extreme example of a shit SOI. There goes your trust
and congruency with that one.

> And as for one other comment you made:
>
> > (E.g. If you want to start things off gently by holding her hand,
> > tell her a scene where want to be holding her hand - and then do it
> > in the next routine after she is comfortable with this.)
>
> You mean you tell her a story about some guy you know who held some
> girl's hand?  Or what?  Methinks I really don't understand here.

You can do that to get her thinking about holding someone's hand - and once
she is feeling it, you may be able to slip in the kino and get away with it.
At least, your chances will be better.

> > Is sex ALL you bringing to the table? That's why he
> > coupled GM styled intention pointers further into the seduction
> > (after the earlier G-rated ones), and then when they succeeded in
> > not objecting, he went to Mystery routines as a reward OR to the
> > Drag phase if they were DDB.
>
> I would LOVE to see these SOIs written down.

Done as above. But make your own!
I re-explained the "Let's Fuck" problem a bit better above as well.

> So here's my deal:  I want to see more examples of SOIs so I can take
> them apart, because I really suspect that the exact wording is crucial.
>
> For example:
>
> GM gets away with his SOIs because they're exaggerated to absurdity,
> and thus they're both funny and unlikely (at least as stated).
> This puts a little distance between the SOI and the girl, so she
> doesn't slap him.

I think it's more of a case of the GM SOIs that fail, he can write them off
as being jokes. That keeps him on track and congruent.
BUT the risk of failure is very high if he doesn't cover his tracks.

> Guam PUA gets away with his SOI (quoted above) because he's talking
> about chicks in general, and not overtly about the particular chick.
> This puts a little distance between the SOI and the girl, so she's
> not pressured to make a decision right then.

This is the all important point. With some SOIs (and especially with
ambiguities in NLP) the SOIs are not in your face, BUT they are vague enough
to get the point across and then judge for a positive reaction from her or
not. However, the vagueness is simply a shot from 50 metres as opposed to a
shot from point-blank. Just make sure you hit the target.
The danger with point-blank SOIs is they are risky in so far as if you say a
dumb one you can't,won't, or don't want to carry out like "I'm going to take
you on holiday!" as opposed to an NLP shot from 50 metres which describes a
holiday and builds on it. "Have you ever been on holiday with someone
special?....."

> Am I on the right track here?  Are there other ways to word SOIs that
> get around direct resistance?  More examples would be appreciated.

You should check out patterning, but remember, a shot from point-blank is
better than 50 metres. The shortest distance between 2 points is a straight
line. There are pros and cons of both styles of course.
You can take the short path across the dangerous ravine, or the long path
around it.

> I gotta say, this whole idea of SOIs is new to me.  Maybe other PUAs
> in this group have been using them without ever realizing/stating the
> importance of them?

I just gave a name to it. People have done this stuff before and I'm just
giving it a name to help explain what I'm doing.

And no, Ray can't trademark this either and claim it's his. We have
discussed why this is enough on ASF. He's filtered anyway and I can't see
his verbal shit.

> Thanks,
> Ash

Thanks for the questions. They help challenge me in trying to explain myself
better.

Rio

-------

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Clearing SOI's up
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 12:15:23 GMT

Maniac,

I came up with the SOI concept after studying what the Guam Playboy did to
chicks. I wish I could have spent longer down there to learn more off this
guy. Oh well, I just need to save up to go again.

SOI (Statements of intention/interest) were comments that the Guam Playboy
made a lot (I assume you read my report on that place - It's nanpa
paradise!). What he did then was control the flirting that followed after
baiting her with a show of interest. He did this by offering a challenge -
when he finished doing that once he went back to fun routines, talking about
parties on the island, jokes, sex personality tests, etc. before he did
another SOI - staring out as indirect and ambiguous, before being VERY
direct. ;)

Basically what I think I have come up with, through trying to explain to the
posters that asked me about him, is a flirting construction kit.

The Guam Playboy NEGged a LOT - and he got away with it every time. He could
even tell chicks AFC things like they were beautiful, and then turn it into
a NEG if he wanted. That's what over 20 years of daily PU did for this guy.

But the NEG is only one kind of flirting (used for dumping a girl's uptight
self image). There are other kinds, such as using ambiguities, physical
light-handed slapping and pushing kino, playing tricks on people, etc. The
Playboy used plenty of variations.

Flirting is this:- One drops the SOI, and then pulls it away out of reach of
the target. Then gives another SOI, and then pulls it away again. Like with
our words, we put images of sex and romance in their heads, then pull it out
again, then out it in, then take it out, then put it back in, then take it
out again........ Mindfucking!
Once the chick is confused and teased enough, she is DDB and safely
mindfucked.

I did a PU once on a chick using the SOIs. I found out where she lived and
then said "Oh that's not far from my place, so I can come down to see you.
It's a pity I am so busy it won't happen today"
(Note that there is a bit of future pacing and presuppositioning in this)
She lapped it up and took my kino from there - despite the BF being a matter
of metres away.

The structure for the Guam Playboy routine went like this:-

- Fun routine or opener (ala Mystery) - some basic fluff - all good things
about himself, what he could do for the women (he played the helpful tour
guide). Be "Disgustingly" Charming! as he put it. The guy wasn't big on
logically drawing out routines for what he did (which is a good thing), he
just went and DID this.... thus he couldn't really explain to me what he was
doing. I had to observe.
- SOI. He said something that hinted that he was interested in the chick
(paced and lead from his opener conversation). This got her emotions going
and her ideas racing. I have found this CRITICAL if the chick is going to
stay interested in you for too long. I bored many chicks out initially when
I wouldn't get to the point.
"What do you look for in guys?" would be sufficient enough as a question to
hint at what you are after (as you have found out yourself Maniac). Starting
off on a topic about guys and relationships usually brings chicks out, but
asking "Do you have a BF?" sucks.
This Ross Jeffries inspired SOI "The more you laugh, the more you'll be
attracted to interesting people......now with me" is an ambiguous SOI.
- Before she could knock him down for any comment, he would then be a
challenge and say something like "I'm not easy", "we don't know each other
well enough yet", "but what would I know, right? ;)","I need to feel passion
first", "Yeah, you know what I'm saying". These basically FORCE the chick to
continue the flirting (initiated by the SOI) along the lines that HE wanted
(and the lines that chicks SAY they want!).
By saying that he "needed time" and "not being easy", the chick already
attracted to him would then come onto him.

Most of the time the chicks would laugh becuase they'd get stuck for a smart
comeback. And he just kept this up, alternating back to party and fun
routines, until he got to the "sex-SOI-Our World-But I'm no sleaze"routine
which would then DDB the target to fuck - or get her ready for it next time
they met.
Negative commands also work great here to spark challenge. Just like I did
with my now LJBF ex-LTR "I'm not going to fuck you".

I've noted in my past failures (too many to count) that when I have dropped
SOI hints - the chicks have taken the flirting into areas which were
impossible for me to control - fucking me up and making me look stupid.
Especially in clubs where chicks do this like child's play to anyone who
"hits" on them. They use their irrational chick logic to fuck themselves
(and you) up. If that happens, your PU is history.
We can't give the women control, especially not in flirting, because they
aren't the ones that are trying to do PU. It's their job as "virtuous" women
to try and get away from PU, or try to fuck our PU up.

Svengali also said in his MLTR theory something which rings home on this. He
said (and I quote):-

"Seventh: If you don't give a woman something to be pissed about every
now and then, she'll find something on her own, and that will be harder
to get out of (because it will be of her making and criteria, not
yours)."

That is also the point of what we should be doing in flirting. To trap the
chick into going along with what your flirting and accepting your advances
(by means of non-objection) while getting her horny at the same time. That
way we avoid snappy comebacks because you've already "Handled her objections
before they came up" (That's something I learnt as a salesman)
This causes the chick to have her token resistance stall out - and puts us
in control.
GM does this with his sex jokes, but he slams any possible retort with "Just
Kidding" thus the chick can't say anything and the flirting goes by GMs
rules and not hers.

Take Mystery's "Nice nails" NEG for example.
He starts off with an SOI "Nice nails". This in and of itself is a
compliment. If he stopped here, the chick would come back (if she were a
bitch) with some smart ass comment to get rid of Mystery.

BUT, he then puts up the CHALLENGE before she gets a chance to reply (like
GM with "Just kidding"). Seemingly innocent too. "Are they real?"

Now the chick is stuck. What's going on? He's complimented me, and now he's
knocking me down! What is he doing? I must stick around for this! What can I
say? Maybe I'll just laugh it off...!? er..?
(Note, some REAL bitches when stalled will look angry at you and say "Huh?"
to which it's GM to the rescue! with "Hide your pleasure!")

So, couple this kind of flirting with lots of things to get her feeling
horny (patterns, sex talk, whatever), and add lots of personality conveying
things thrown in for good measure - and the chick is sufficiently stunned -
and ready for the drag and fuck stage.

Oh, and the Guam Playboy is an ugly fucker. Kipp's seen the pictures.
Looks don't matter for shit. I have great respect for all the older PUAs.

I must get up to Tokyo to see you guys real soon. The inaka sucks.
We can experiment with this some more then. I've been getting rusty since I
got back from Guam.
What I do know is that when this guy's method does work, it is KILLER. We
get Mr. Smooth status and KCs like crazy.

Rio
-------
Dictate the flirting

 wrote in message news:91f5e8$dpn$1@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Re: SOI's
>
> Rio..
>
> You are on to something big here..
> This is a discovery!
> I will incorporate this.
>
> Please give more specific examples though. I get
> what you are saying, but not yet really how you would
> apply it. .
>
>
> Fucking excellent thread!
>
>
> Maniac
> http://www.pickupguide.com
>
>
> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/

---

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: More on SOIs
Date: Fri, 22 Dec 2000 06:17:41 GMT

THIS IS RIO TYPING IN CAPS. I'M NOT YELLING!

Comments in text below.
After New years, I WILL be ready, and we will hit
the streets.

GREAT. I HAVEN'T BEEN DOING MUCH PU UNTIL YESTERDAY (1 SOLID # FROM A 9 AND
A KC FROM ANOTHER 9) - THUS THIS POST AS I TEST OUT MY THEORY. I HAVE A
FRIEND WHO WOULD LIKE TO COME ALONG. HE'S ALREADY BRIEFED AND VERY
EXPERIENCED IN SCREWING WOMEN IN JAPAN. HE'S READ THE PICKUP GUIDE ALREADY.
HE'S EVEN BEEN SO KIND TO INTRODUCE ME TO SOME WOMEN WHO WANT MERCY FUCKS.
HE ALSO KNOWS SOME GOOD "hole in the wall" PLACES AROUND RAPPONGI WITH LOTS
OF WOMEN (SO HE SAYS).

BTW, Rio; re: 'nomad' player.. mine was fucked up, returned
it for an exchange, new one works..

IT'S SURE BEATS A TAPE RECORDER, DOESN'T IT?

First, this is brilliant material, it is going on the
website, and is core to successful PU I think. It IS what
smooth was doing.. I couldnt identify it, but now it has
been named, and described, I recognize this.. and yes, it
will be TOTALLY lethal..

THANKS. EVERY SUCCESSFUL PUA HAS BEEN DOING SOMETHING LIKE THIS (OF ONE
STYLE OR ANOTHER) TO BED WOMEN. I WENT OUT AND USED THIS FRAME YESTERDAY
WITH INTERESTING AND POSITIVE RESULTS.....

HOWEVER, I MUST SAY IT'S HARD TO GIVE SPECIFIC EXAMPLES UNLESS THEY ARE
SITUATIONALLY BASED. FOLLOWING THE LOGIC HOWEVER, AND USING IT GIVEN THE
SITUATION STILL BRING RESULTS. I WILL DESCRIBE SOME OF WHAT I HAVE BEEN
DOING WITH IT, BUT I CAN'T REMEMBER FOR THE LIFE OF ME WHAT EXACTLY THE GUAM
GUY SAID. (I ONLY RECORDED A SMALL SAMPLE OF OUR CHAT WITH MY MP3 PLAYER.
NONE OF HIS NANPA HOWEVER) WHAT I DO KNOW, IS THAT HE FOLLOWED THIS
STRUCTURE WHICH I HAVE DESCRIBED TO VERY SOME GOOD EFFECTS.

I ASSUME YOU READ MY ORIGINAL STORY ON THE GUAM TRIP.
IF SO, MY REPLY WILL MAKE MORE SENSE.

In article ,
  "Rio"  wrote:
> He did this by offering a challenge -
> when he finished doing that once he went back to fun routines,
talking about

Examples? ?

OK, HE MADE SOME KIND OF COMPLIMENT OR SUGGESTED SOME KIND OF ACTIVITY
(OFTENTIMES WITH SEXUAL OR ROMANTIC UNDERTONES) THAT THEY COULD DO TOGETHER.
(LIKE HANG TIGHT TO EACH OTHER OF THE JET POWERED BANANA BOAT) AND THEN
FOLLOWED THAT WITH A REASON WHY HE WOULD HAVE TROUBLE DOING IT. KINDA LIKE
IN SALES, A SALESMAN WOULD SAY "FOR ONE DAY ONLY SALE", WELL HE WAS LIKE "SO
YOU SHOW UP AT SUCH AND SUCH A TIME, OTHERWISE I WON'T BE ABLE TO SHOW YOU A
GOOD TIME AND I'LL TAKE SOMEONE ELSE" (a takeaway)
SO IN ORDER TO CONTINUE THE FLIRTING, THE CHICK WOULD HAVE TO SHOW UP. HE
WOULD THEN (AFTER HAVING COMPLETED A SOI ROUTINE) SIT BACK AND WATCH THE
CHICK FOLLOW THROUGH. HE WOULD OFTENTIMES BE ABLE TO CONTINUE A CONVERSATION
WITHOUT STALLING - AND MIDWAY HE WOULD SOI HER AGAIN AND DO THE SAME ROUTINE
WITH SOMETHING ELSE. I NEVER SAW HIM GET IT ON WITHIN 20 MINUTES, BUT I SAW
WHAT HE DID TO THE CHICK WITH THIS ROUTINE AND I COULD TELL THAT HE COULD
HAVE IF HE WANTED TO. HE DIDN'T LOOK DESPERATE AT ALL.

> parties on the island, jokes, sex personality tests, etc. before he
did
> another SOI - staring out as indirect and ambiguous, before being VERY
> direct. ;)

Examples ? ?

THIS GUY HAD A STRONG ELEMENT OF GM. THE SEX PERSONALITY TEST IS DOCUMENTED
IN MY POST ON THIS GUY (IT'S ABOUT ICE CREAM) - BUT AFTERWARDS UNLIKE GM, NO
COMMENT OF "JUST KIDDING". HE WOULD THEN SAY SOMETHING ELSE TO DISTRACT
ATTENTION OR PLAY "PRETEND AFC" LIKE "BUT I'M NOT EASY" OR "BUT I DON'T KNOW
YOU THAT WELL"
ALL THE MEANWHILE, GETTING THE CHICK HORNY AND CREATING A CHALLENGE.

> Basically what I think I have come up with, through trying to explain
to the
> posters that asked me about him, is a flirting construction kit.

Examples ? ?

MANIAC, YOU'RE STARTING TO OVERUSE CUT AND PASTE LIKE NYC WHEN HE RIPS APART
AFCS WITH THESE "EXAMPLES??" COMMENTS.........

(QUOTE NYC)
"YOU ARE BEING USED. SHE DOESN'T GIVE A SHIT ABOUT YOU. SHE DOESN'T INTEND
TO FUCK YOU. SHE IS FUCKING OTHER MEN THAT SHE FINDS SEXUALLY ATTRACTIVE.
YOU ARE FOOTING THE BILL FOR HER INTERNATIONAL WHORING. STOP."

HA HA HA ;)

> The Guam Playboy NEGged a LOT - and he got away with it every time.

Such as ? ?

WISH I COULD REMEMBER NOW. BUT WHAT I DID SEE IS HIM COMPLIMENTING LOTS OF
JAP CHICKS AND NOT GETTING ANY NASTY REACTION BACK FROM THEM - BECAUSE THEY
WERE SO SHY AND INEXPERIENCED. SO THE CHICKS JUST LAUGHED BECAUSE THEY HAD
NO BITCH SHIELD OF ANY TYPE.
WHERE HE DID ENCOUNTER A SHIELD, HE WOULD ATTACK HER "NASTY" PERSONALITY -
AND HER LACK OF ABILITY TO BE GRACEFUL WITH COMPLIMENTS.

IN THAT SENSE, HE WOULD ALWAYS SIZE THE CHICK UP AS IF HE WAS LOOKING FOR
LTR POTENTIAL (but we know of course, that LTR was never the plan)

He could
> even tell chicks AFC things like they were beautiful, and then turn
it into
> a NEG if he wanted. That's what over 20 years of daily PU did for
this guy.

Examples ? ?

"YOU'RE REALLY CUTE....(pause to check response)... BUT I DON'T KNOW
ANYTHING ABOUT YOU. (SAID NEGATIVELY OR NOT DEPENDING ON HER RESPONSE). SO
WHO ARE YOU ANYWAY?"

> But the NEG is only one kind of flirting (used for dumping a girl's
uptight
> self image). There are other kinds, such as using ambiguities,
physical
> light-handed slapping and pushing kino, playing tricks on people,
etc.

Such as ? ?

I'VE STOPPED USING KINO IMMIDIATELY NOW, AND SAVING IT FOR WHEN I'VE LANDED
AN SOI ROUTINE AND CAUGHT THE CHICK OUT. WHEN SHE HAS LAUGHED, I SLAP HER
GENTLY.
IT'S ANCHORING.

AS FOR TRICKS ON PEOPLE.... STUPID ONES. I WILL HAVE TO SHOW YOU THEM IN
PERSON.

The
> Playboy used plenty of variations.

Like what ? ?

GIVEN THE SITUATION, HE WOULD TRY DIFFERENT WAYS TO GET HER THINKING
ROMANTICALLY ABOUT BOTH OF THEM TOGETHER. HE WOULD USE WHATEVER WAS IN HIS
SURROUNDINGS, OR THE TOPIC OF CONVERSATION, TO PACE AND LEAD THE CHICK INTO
IMAGINING SUCH A SCENARIO.
THEN HE WOULD YANK IT AWAY BY GIVING SOME KIND OF EXCUSE (LIKE HE WAS BUSY,
HE DIDN'T THINK SHE COULD DO IT) OR HE WOULD PLAY AFC (I DON'T KNOW YOU, I
NEED TO BE IN LOVE FIRST, I'M NOT EASY, I'M NOT A PLAYER, I NEED TIME, I AM
REALLY PICKY, I HAVE BEEN HURT BEFORE, I HAVE A GF)

> Flirting is this:- One drops the SOI, and then pulls it away out of
reach of
> the target.

For example ? ?

I REALLY FEEL VERY CLOSE TO YOU, BUT I NEED TIME.

THE MAGIC WORD IS but

 Then gives another SOI, and then pulls it away again. Like with
> our words, we put images of sex and romance in their heads, then pull
it out

Like ? ?

HIS BRAVEST SOI WAS THE ONE WHERE HE SAID STRAIGHT OUT THAT HE WAS GOING TO
FUCK A CHICK. I WITNESSED THE WHOLE THING. HE SAID THAT HE WAS GOING TO FUCK
HER but (AND THEN HE WENT PRETEND AFC) I'M VERY PICKY, I'M NOT A PUA
BECAUSE THOSE GUYS TEASE WOMEN WITH BULLSHIT, MAKE EMPTY PROMISES, FUCK
THEM, AND THEN DUMP THEM. I AM A PLAYBOY. I LOVE WOMEN AND I DON'T WANT YOU
TO GET TOO ATTACHED TO ME AFTER WE HAVE SEX.

> again, then out it in, then take it out, then put it back in, then
take it
> out again........ Mindfucking!

Example please . .

OK, ANOTHER ONE:-   I WANT TO KISS YOU, BUT SOMEHOW I DON'T THINK YOU LIKE
KISSING.
(btw - this would be an SOI fairly advanced in conversation)
NOTE ALSO THAT THERE'S AN EMBEDDED COMMAND IN THE 2ND PART OF THE ROUTINE.
THAT BEING "YOU LIKE KISSING"
EVIL ISN'T IT?

> Once the chick is confused and teased enough, she is DDB and safely
> mindfucked.

how? describe this. . what exactly did he do?

WELL, THE CHICK THAT HE SAID THE "I'M GOING TO FUCK YOU" SPEECH TO, JUST
STARTED DOING ALL THE TRADEMARK BODYLANGUAGE. SHE JUST SAT THERE STUNNED
AND PLAYED WITH HER HAIR. LIKE A RABBIT LOOKING INTO BRIGHT LIGHTS. THE GUAM
GUY SAID ALL OF IT WITH A SERIOUS FACE TOO, SO SHE COULDN'T LAUGH OFF WHAT
HE WAS SAYING.

THE WAY HE WORKED DIDN'T SEEM TO BE ONE OF "ATTRACTION" PER SE. HE WOULD
EVENTUALLY CORNER THE CHICK AND FLIRT WITH HER UNTIL SHE COULD TAKE NO MORE.
UNTIL SHE GOT STUNNED

> I did a PU once on a chick using the SOIs. I found out where she
lived and
> then said "Oh that's not far from my place, so I can come down to see
you.
> It's a pity I am so busy it won't happen today"

This is good. .

THAT'S A REAL LIFE EXAMPLE OF WHAT THE WHOLE THEORY IS ABOUT. MORE
IMPORTANTLY IS THAT IT WORKED.

> (Note that there is a bit of future pacing and presuppositioning in
this)
> She lapped it up and took my kino from there - despite the BF being a
matter
> of metres away.
>
> The structure for the Guam Playboy routine went like this:-
>
> - Fun routine or opener (ala Mystery) - some basic fluff - all good
things
> about himself, what he could do for the women (he played the helpful
tour

Examples ? ?

READ SOME OF MYSTERY'S OPENERS!
TYPICALLY OFF THE WALL STUFF. WELL, WHEN HE WAS TALKING ABOUT GUAM'S CULTURE
AND PARTIES AND STUFF - FOR ALL THE TOURISTS, ALL THIS NEW INFO TO THEM IS
PRETTY OFF THE WALL.
HE WOULD TELL THE CHICKS ABOUT SOME PARTY WHERE THEY WOULD DIG A HUGE PIT
AND THROW ANIMALS ON IT IN A BIG FEAST WITH A BONFIRE AND DANCING - AND THEN
BRANCHED OUT AND TALKED ABOUT DANCING AND OTHER EXOTIC/EROTIC STUFF.

> guide). Be "Disgustingly" Charming! as he put it. The guy wasn't big
on

Like ? ?

THOSE WERE HIS EXACT WORDS. HE RELIED ON GM A LOT IN THE LATTER PART OF HIS
SEDUCTIONS.

> logically drawing out routines for what he did (which is a good
thing), he
> just went and DID this.... thus he couldn't really explain to me what
he was
> doing. I had to observe.

Yep, he's got experience.. I rarely consciously follow ManiacPlan
anymore.. just it spews out naturally.. learning PU is like learning
a foreign language/lingo.. once you get it, its natural..

I'VE BEEN LEARNING TO PLAY AFC IN MY SEDUCTIONS, AND IT HAS BEEN WORKING
REALLY WELL!

> - SOI. He said something that hinted that he was interested in the
chick
> (paced and lead from his opener conversation). This got her emotions
going

Example?  How?

OK, ANOTHER ONE.

"WOULDN'T IT BE GREAT TO SPEND TIME TOGETHER OVER COFFEE? IT'S SUCH A PITY I
HAVE TO GO TO SOME MEETINGS LATER ON, SO WE WILL PROBABLY HAVE NO TIME TO
SEE EACH OTHER EVER AGAIN BEFORE YOU GO BACK."
(WAIT FOR RESPONSE)
"BUT LET ME KNOW YOUR NUMBER ANYWAY...WHO KNOWS I MAY HAVE TIME."
(might want to save this one after you have dropped several other
SOIs)

> and her ideas racing.

Like what? which ideas? be specific please. .

ROMATIC AND/OR SEXUAL ONES.
HE WOULD START OFF ON ROMANTIC ONES AND MAKE THEM INCREASINGLY SEXUAL UNTIL
HE HIT A SEXUAL FANTASY OF HERS THAT WOULD DDB HER.
LET'S SAY "HOLDING HANDS" OR "SPENDING QUALITY TIME TOGETHER" OR "BEING
CLOSE" AND EVENTUALLY LEADING THAT INTO "TOUCHING BODIES" AND "KISSING" TO
"FUCKING" OBVIOUSLY.
A LOT OF TIME DISTORTION SOIs.

> I have found this CRITICAL if the chick is going to
> stay interested in you for too long. I bored many chicks out
initially when
> I wouldn't get to the point.
[rest deleted]

Rio, this is great stuff. Somehow I understand it.. but I need
examples of it so I can put it together as something I can try
in the field. Do you remember any specifics from this guy?

WELL, WE CAN ALWAYS WAIT FOR THE OFF-SEASON AND GO TO GUAM WITH A VCR AND
MEET THIS GUY (YOU'LL ONLY NEED ABOUT 40,000 YEN FROM TOKYO FOR A 2 DAY
TRIP) OR NEXT TIME WE MEET IN TOKYO WE CAN DO MORE STREET STUFF AND I CAN
SHOW YOU WHAT I KNOW. (I HADN'T FULLY DEVELOPED THE THEORY UNTIL AFTER MY
NIGHT OUT WITH KIPP - I OQed TOO MUCH AND FAILED TO PLACE ANY CHALLENGES
AFTER MY SOIs THAT NIGHT)
THE GUAM PLAYBOY WAS A GRANDMASTER OF STREET PU - HIS WEAKNESS WAS THAT HE
WAS A GREEDY TEAMPLAYER WITH WINGMEN.

If so, please fill in the above spaces where I ask.. it is very
important if this is to work.

Rio
-------

Maniac High's Pick Up Girls Guide and Seduction Website! » mystery

Maniac High — Thu, 20 May 2010 12:22:49 +0000

Buy Reductil No Prescription, From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Mystery and others write about successful openers.

Status: O

talk about esp and its impossibility

talk about how you met a bear while hiking

talk about how you were scared shitless rock climbing when your rope snapped

or talk about the famous person you met

does she believe in ghosts. why, Buy Reductil No Prescription.

or hotseat (like question game but more brutal)

talk about the time you bladed down a steep hill and survived. Buy Reductil No Prescription, talk about the time you were on stage

...

mystery

-----

From nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org Wed Apr 12 07:31:37 2000
From: nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org (Nathan SZILARD)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: After the # close

They find it very funny and show it to their friends, plus
they remember, Buy Reductil No Prescription.

| If you did any anchoring on your voice when you met, order Reductil, Buy Reductil without a prescription, now's the time to
| unleash them.

----

From slidewguy@remove-aol.com Wed Apr 12 07:47:28 2000
From: "whoisthis19"
Subject: Some closes
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast

Any of you guys got ways of getting chicks to leave with you outside
the club.

greg1

Did you sleep with yourself or... did you turn yourself down because
you was too easy.

Doing Successful Openers

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Mystery and others write about successful openers!



From: "Mystery" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast,Alt.psychology.nlp,alt.hypnosis
References: <37602334.55753831@bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Chat suggestions
Date: Wed, 16 Jun 1999 04:58:12 -0700
Lines: 63
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts7-36t-14.idirect.com
Message-ID: <37676655@nemo.idirect.com>
X-Trace: 16 Jun 1999 04:54:45 -0400, ts7-36t-14.idirect.com
Organization: via Internet Direct

Status: O

talk about esp and its impossibility

talk about how you met a bear while hiking

talk about how you were scared shitless rock climbing when your rope snapped

or the time you visited your friends friend with him and your buddy was
almost beaten to death when the friend he visited had a boyfriend who came
out and there was a 20 minute car chase through lights and you were looking
for the cops but lot the crazed boyfriend before you found cops.

or the time you were in the hospital and it changed the way food tastes.
the birds sound clearer now.

or the time you netbused (hacked) into a bank but chickened out and put the
money into a charity

or talk about the famous person you met

does she believe in ghosts?  why?

you like candles and incense.  what does SHE like?  the music game modified
for all types of objects.

play the question game with her

or hotseat (like question game but more brutal)

talk about the time you bladed down a steep hill and survived.

talk about the time you were on stage

...

mystery



-----


From nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org Wed Apr 12 07:31:37 2000
From: nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org (Nathan SZILARD)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: After the # close

On Mon, 03 Apr 2000 21:26:22 GMT, Rio  wrote:
| I was reading elsewhere on a post, that if you instruct her to sound
| cheerful on the phone when you call when you do a # close.

I tried that, it's not a magic bullet. But it's fun.

I now always write some shit along with my phone #:
something like "DO NOT FALL IN LOVE" or "NO STALKING PLEASE".

They find it very funny and show it to their friends, plus
they remember.

| If you did any anchoring on your voice when you met, now's the time to
| unleash them.



----

From slidewguy@remove-aol.com Wed Apr 12 07:47:28 2000
From: "whoisthis19" 
Subject: Some closes
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast

Hand her the slip of paper and pen and have her write down her number.
When she's hands it back, ask her to put it someplace so you will
remeber to call her.  Last time I did this she put it down my pants and
grabbed my cock.  

Ask a gal to trade shirts.  When she balks, keep pressing in a joking
manner then finally ask to her to go outside to trade shirts.  Nothing
better then getting her outside.

Another one is simply saying its too smokey, noisy, smelly in here. 
Lets go outsde for some air.

Any of you guys got ways of getting chicks to leave with you outside
the club?

greg1

Did you sleep with yourself or... did you turn yourself down because
 you was too easy.

A conversation with Mystery! Pickups

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


A conversation with Mystery!

Tips on fieldwork from a pick up artist! on IRC #PUA!


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A Conversation with Mystery, a Pick-up Artist (PUA)

Topics Include: 

The Kiss Close
Clubbing alone
Handling guys
Being a story-teller
Preparation and format
Quality vs. quantity

Lego: Hey Mystery, what's your favorite story to close with?  How 
exactly do you transition from the telling of a story to closing?

Mystery: "The Kiss Close" is my favorite routine.  Once you have three 
indicators of interest (she touches you, laughs consistantly at your 
jokes, leans in towards you, smiles a lot and keeps eye contact, resumes 
chat when you force silence, etc) you then phase shift.  You turn 180 
degrees on a dime.  Go from humorous and non-sexual to saying, "Stop.  
Would you like to kiss me?", right out of the blue.  She will say either 
say, "Uh - no",(which is unlikely as you don't bother performing "The 
Kiss Close" until enough indicators are present) or, "I donno" (they 
rarely say, "Yes"). "I donno" means she actually does want to but feels 
embarrassed on how to say "Yes".  So you reply, "Lets find out", then go 
in slowly and kiss her.  It's very simple and very effective.  If she 
says, "Why?", this is also a yes.  Simply reply, "It looked like you had 
something on your mind.  Would you like to kiss me?"  Wait again for 
her response.  If her response is "No" then reply, "Hey I didn't say you 
COULD.  You just had that look in your eye."

Lego: What do you do if you're interrupted? You're telling your target 
a story and she is all into it but some AFC cock-blocking idiot just 
runs up and starts screaming and yelling and you're like, "What the 
fuck?"

Mystery: Simply ask him if you can borrow his pen.  When he gives it to 
you, throw it away as you say, "Fetch."

Wakeboarder: Hahaha.  Nice!

Lego: What if he's bigger than you?

Mystery: I'd instead call him on his disruptive shit and remark, "Dude, 
what are you attempting here?"  Not good enough?  Then say, "Ladies?  
Shall we discover what adventure awaits us in another room?"

Wakeboarder: Man, none of my buds want to go to the club.

Gamer: Screw them then.

Mystery: Go alone.

Wakeboarder: I need to be made fun of for this comment but I feel like 
a weiner if I go to a club myself

Lego: Bro, your trippin'. I go solo many times. It's good actually.  
It's weird if it's a first night but if I've been there before it's cool.

Mystery: Yeah, I understand ... and yet, staying home alone will make 
you feel so much better?  Go out alone, meet some cool dudes when you 
get there (they will become your wingmen there) and then run around 
getting #'s.  Report to your fellow PUAs what happened.  Whatever happened 
to the concept, "The alphamale gets all the women?"  Shit dude, what are 
you, a mommas boy?  Do you need your hand held?  

Lego: How do you strike up conversations with guys?

Mystery: Walk up and say, "Hey dude, question for ya.  Do you know 
where a good place to score is in this city? 'Cause this place looks like a 
cock farm."

Lego: Good!  You should be able to relate to guys to disarm them.  You 
don't compete; you ELIMINATE COMPETETION.

Gamer: LOL.  Dude, the only results I've had were solo.  My friends 
psych me out too much because they never help.  Instead they just complain 
about my taking too much time.  They laugh at me or just generally piss 
me off.

Mystery: I have MUCH better results (and MUCH more fun) playing "The 
Game" alone.  It forces you to approach.  It's a great motivator.

Lego: Damn! I couldn't have put it better myself.

Gamer: Yep.

Mystery: You wont be alone for more than five minutes once you approach 
your first set anyways.  Gamer, I suggest you call them on their shit 
at some point.  Demonstrate your alphamale characteristics.

Lego: How do you continue talking?  I mean, group set dynamics are much 
different in a one one on one approach.

Mystery: Be a story-teller - THAT is the skill of the PUA.  It isn't 
SEDUCING; it's STORY-TELLING.  It is my personal belief that SS patterns 
arent as 'hypnotic' as they are 'entertaining' stories.

Wakeboarder: Sweet

Lego: Actually with the story stuff I SEE WHAT YOU MEAN.  They just 
follow that lead.

Wakeboarder: Well, I need to stop being a sackless wonder and grow some 
fuckin' balls then!  Hmm, story telling ...

Mystery: Here's an example.  "Ever been camping?  Well I was up in a 
forest up north and was hiking with some girlfriends of mine ... and we 
came along some trail and there was shit on the path.  My friends were 
like, "haaaa someone shit in the woods" and I said, "lets get the fuck 
out of here like NOW."  they thought I was just scared of shit and I 
said, "Girls, you dont get it.  This shit is still warm and its not human.  
Its bear shit.  This is a big fucking bear.  Look at the size of that 
turd."  Notice it's not sexual?  Most hot girls gets get "sex-talk" 
right away from AFCs.  NOT talking sex with them makes them question 
whether you are interested in them.  Leave them guessing until you get 
indicators of interest from them.  If they like your great personality 
(confident, humorous, etc) they will give you subtle but distinct clues.

Gamer: How do you flow from story to story?

Mystery: If there is ONE mental state you should force yourself into, 
its TALKATIVE.  Talk your fucking HEAD off.  Just go from one story 
straight into another one like a comedian does.  Ever find yourself excited 
about something and you talk and talk and talk?  THAT is what must 
happen to get a girl.  You have to ENTERTAIN them.  Look talkative yet not 
desperate.  

Gamer: Heh.

Lego: Dude, I had that going last night. You're so right.  That's an 
excellent example dude.  I was telling this story about getting harassed 
by cops or some shit.  It's a cool story but my delivery sucked and I 
was losing one of the two girls I was telling it to.  What if they fail 
to elaborate on your story?  Besides it being a bad story to begin 
with, how can you fix it on the fly?

Mystery: They don't have to interact with it.  Its a good thing to have 
flexible stories to allow for some comment but it's not nessessary.  
It's YOUR job to perform the material.  It's your audiences job to 
listen,laugh and generally be entertained.  That's it.  At the end of 10 
minutes you will see the girls digging you (positive indicators).  You then 
phase shift abruptly into the close.

Lego: HOW DO YOU PHASE SHIFT?  I've been wondering this. While I didn't 
come off as obvious in last nights case and just told her to kiss me (I 
knew she would anyway), this could have been smoother.

Alpha: Lego, you ad libbed the close?  So working on ad libbing is 
good?

Mystery: Ad libbed material is not as accurate in closing as is 
performing the well constructed and field-tested "Kiss Close" routine.  Ad 
libbing is BONUS material but don't COUNT on it.  Have your material, like 
a good comedian, prepared before performing.  This isn't "A Night at 
the Improv" fellas.

Gamer: Heh.

Mystery: All PUs have a format; a beginning, a middle and an end.  If 
you don't know what the next routine is going to be then you may end up 
with an unfortunate pregnant pause which fucks up your pacing.  You may 
end up filling the silence with the deadly, "So ... um ... what do you 
do?"  Preparation saves face.  Afterall, with your particular close, 
she could have pulled away from your trying to kiss her.  Then what?!!  
Instead, consider engaging her in enthusiastic conversation, then go 
directly into the close.  In other words, stop her in mid-sentence and 
with a curious tone, kiss close.

Wakeboarder: cool.  Lego, what indicators clued you in that she wanted 
the kiss?

Alpha: In what way can you be prepared?  If we're talking about 
story-telling in front of a random girl we just met seconds ago in a random 
place ...

Mystery: Like a good comedian, have your material prepared yet when 
onstage be prepared to dynamically omit certain routines and to add others 
on the fly.  Sometimes certain routines fit the situation better than 
others.  Have 3 to 5 alternative openers (as a comedian would) and enjoy 
performing the one you think best fits the situation will get the best 
reaction for the group you are in front of

Alpha: Gotcha now.  Can you give me a brief example of how you go about 
preparing?

Mystery: Sure.  First, find 3 openers and memorize them.  Write down a 
list of openers (just the headings of each opener to remind you).  
Next, write down some routines (the question game, the music game, the 
photo routine, the bear in the woods story, etc - all on dejanews) and then 
also memorize the kiss close and the # close.  Memorize 3 NEGs too and 
you are good to go.  With the material in your mind, you are prepared 
to work it in the field until you have the timing of the material down 
(again, just like a comedian.)

Alpha: Man, you provide some really eye-opening ideas... (just when I'm 
about to think there's nothing more to learn.

Wakeboarder: So what you're saying is have a routine set up and modify 
it to each situation? Kind of like having a PU template?

Mystery: It's ALL about format.  Know the format and stick to it.  If 
you now what the next step is in the PU, you wont feel scared.  It gets 
fun and you begin to appreciate the strategy behind it all.

Wakeboarder: Yeah like FMAC? That's a simple format.

Mystery: Yes, FMAC.  Each letter in FMAC is an abrupt phase shift.  
"FIND" means having to abruptly disturb your complacency by getting out of 
the house.  It takes effort for many people to do bother getting THIS 
FAR.  "MEET" is a HUGE abrupt change.  "There she is!  3, 2, 1, GO!"  In 
the "ATTRACT" phase, you need to go from the walk up to the TALKATIVE 
performer entertaining story-teller.  You will need A LOT of energy for 
this (enthusiasm is contagious afterall) and for many to go from 
slumping around to being in performer mode is ABRUPT.  Finally you must then 
"CLOSE"; to phase shift from humour to serious is also abrupt.  Each 
phase may FEEL awkward but it looks normal.  When a comedian finishes one 
topic and just goes into an entirely new unrelated topic, the audience 
doesn't care as long as the next topic is entertaining.

Wakeboarder: Very true.

Gamer: Cool.  I'm collecting openers and other routines off the 
layguide right now.

Alpha: Do you believe in the 80/20 'rule'?  Meaning, 80% of the quality 
women are found in 20% of the right places or connections or 
situations.

Mystery: The quality of a woman is SO subjective. Quality is difficult 
to QUANTIFY.  80% of QUALITY?  It's pointless trying to mix and match 
these concepts. INSTEAD consider that there are HOTTIES and UGs (YOU get 
to decide based on your personal criteria) and of the HOTTIES, some 
have pleasant personalities and others do not.  You cannot possibly judge 
her personality until she LIKES you.  So go out ... FIND her, MEET her, 
ATTRACT her and THEN decide if you want to CLOSE her AFTER judging her 
personality.  Judging her by the way she treats you on your approach is 
lame because particularly beautiful women all have their bitch shields 
up and running.  They have to.  They aren't planning on fucking every 
guy that says Hi to them.  The only way to get rid of the guys is to 
oftentimes offend them quickly.  It's not personal.  It's merely a learned 
strategy.  So is the "I have a boyfriend excuse, but that's a different 
story.  I also suggest CLOSING everyone just for the education.  You 
don't actually have to CALL the girls of course.  You simply get to 
practice CLOSING too.  Getting a girls number is merely an OPTION.  You 
don't have to follow up on ALL of them you know.

Keen: Heh.

Wakeboarder: Cool, judging the girls only after you have attracted 
them.  Kind of makes you approach too!  You can't say the bull shit line, 
"She's not my type, I can tell", to get you out of approaching.

Alpha: Do you have a web page?

Mystery: No, not currently.  I'm writing a book though called The 
Mystery Method.  Most of my ramblings can be found on the layguide. 

Ascence: Hey, is it true that the older we get the more money/social 
status becomes and issue?

Mystery: No matter what social status you have (or THINK you have), 
it's still something you must convey in the first 25 minutes of meeting 
her.  We ALL start equal BEFORE meeting her; all men.  The issue is, can 
we congruently convey our social status (real or not) in our 
performance?  That's OUR responsibility.  The best way is not to TELL them about 
it but rather to DEMONSTRATE it.  How?  Well, if you talk about having 
girls always falling for you for instance, it's not NEARLY as good as 
actually having a couple hot girls with you saying what a hottie you are 
infront of the target.  This is called PAWNING.

Keen: I'm going to try doing the story-telling that you talked about.  
It's really hard though. I'm a real bad storyteller.  I've been working 
on it today. that's my lesson today.

Wakeboarder: Tell them about that time you saw a fallen over manequin 
in the department store and you tripped over it.  The security guard 
thought you were trying to make it with the manequin and called you a 
little freak.

Gamer: LOL (Laughing Out Loud).

Wakeboarder: One more question for you Mystery.  What's the meaning of 
life?

Mystery: To fuck. :)

Statement of Intent (SOI)

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Rio introduces a key part of PU: the 'Statement of Intent' (SOI)!

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2000 09:00:50 GMT
Subject: Find Stun Drag Fuck

G'day,

Jonathan Ashton  wrote in message
news:90eati$gpt@nnrp1.deja.com...
> As I've read the twelve-odd messages in this thread, I've been looking
> for something to take home with me, but I'm not finding it.
>
> Rio, how do you do things differently now, based on what you've said?

First thing would be to think about the close. Mystery knows his group work
perfect from how I read it, and I have been using his methods to great
success social-proof wise.

The BIG thing that clocked in my head was the need to STATE YOUR INTENTIONS
to the chick within the first minute of meeting her. I will make that my
rule from now on - as with the 3 second rule.
By this I DON'T mean "Let's fuck" or "Come to Papa baby" or any throw-away
shit like that. It has to be an honest assessment of what YOU feel capable
of doing to the chick after the "Hi" and the first round of fluff/routine
(routine preferred - something humourous). GM does this part BEAUTIFULLY,
because he does it with a sense of fun and humour - and HE KNOWS he is going
to do what he says and so does SHE!
I notice Mr. Sex states this a lot in his past posts - where AFC or shit
PUAs do approaches and talk to the chick, but never get to the point AND the
bitch can tell that the guys want to fuck but are too pussy to go for it.
Ross says something to the tune of "And maybe we could really get to like
each other" when he closes in HTGTWYDIB. I also recall that TokyoPUA did a
statement of intentions on that chick he PUed at night once who was
initially scared of him. Johnny Shack does it by when he just springs dates
on women he just met.
So there's some cross references.

The proper methodological way to get to a statement of intentions part is by
pace and lead. But the point of the matter is, you have to structure the
conversation to show interest and intent VERY soon or you will stall, chick
will get bored, feel teased, and then it's C&B time. Believe me, a LOT of
C&B experience with a LOT of HOT chicks has so far has taught me this
painful lesson.
The best way to put it is in the most honest way possible. I cannot give you
a specific example. But the idea is to get her thinking romantically about
you VERY soon. THEN you HAVE TO DO WHAT YOU SAID you would do to the chick
after DDB. (E.g. If you want to start things off gently by holding her hand,
tell her a scene where want to be holding her hand - and then do it in the
next routine after she is comfortable with this.) If you do NOT DO what you
say you will, eventually your congruence will fuck up when the chick loses
patience. Then the chick will be confused, get scared, and bolt. If this
ever happens and the guy tries to do heavy kino or try for a fuck while the
chick is in this state - It's gonna be RAPE.

In fact, on the matter of Rape. I read in Cosmo (Hey, My chick gets fucked
often and STILL reads this!) that psychologists WARN women against guys that
say "Come to my place to see my pictures" etc. when the idea is to fuck the
chick whilst your intentions aren't known to her - because it is DATE RAPE.
Thus as Maniac found out ages ago, that GROUNDWORK is the key element to
getting the chick over to fuck. That can be done through STATEMENT OF
INTENTIONS - and may not necessarily happen through Kiss closes.
You must remember this - a kiss is just a kiss........

IF that works, THEN we can reward her with more conversation and more
Mystery style routines or whatever (because she is OK with our intentions
then - thus the rewards), and THEN up the ante some more with our STATEMENT
OF INTENTIONS, building on what we established before - to get her more hot
and horny than before. So you may have started on holding her hands, now you
may progress on to hugging, kissing, fucking etc. whatever seems to be the
most logical progression from her actions towards you.

Patterns, routines, psych tests, will help greatly during the chat routines
in-between statements of intentions. Those are what set us apart from the
other PUAs out there.

Eventually we get to a point where the chick is DDB, then we can get to the
Drag (you must take the woman to fuck location, or have her so into you that
she will come to you) and Fuck part (in our world of course). The Our World
routine would then be the ULTIMATE in the STATEMENT OF INTENTIONS series
which would then lead to the deal fuck closed. It is in this one that you
state your relationship expectations and put it in "Our World"

Now the method is Find, Stun, Drag, Fuck.

The point is - FUCK all this bullshit about the woman needs to be done in
the "right way" to match her values. Something tells me now that a woman
made this comment as an attempt to rationalize her unreasonable emotions.
The values she wants ALL ALONG is #1 SEX, and to a lesser extent #2 to be
taken care of after SEX. That goes for ANY woman (thus the universality of
the whole principle). When the guy comes along as does her, she will
rationalise that the guy understood exactly what she felt. That's what some
religious women mean when they beautifully say "God knew when it was the
right time for me". In reality, they KNOW DEEP DOWN they are at the mercy of
guys and what they want to do with her. To her, that is "destiny" and no
wonder so many women are suckers for fortune-telling and the like.

Eliciting is when you want to # close or coffee close and check the girl out
for relationship potential. If it's ONS - hey! ya don't need it! If you
cannot attempt a kiss to fuck close in the given situation - you will have
to # close, but not forget to state that your intentions could well get
beyond just coffee!

The other thing - "Make no excuses for desires as a man" is THE SINGLE MOST
IMPORTANT THING (As Ross Jeffries has already said) but I had to experience
it myself to believe it. ALL of what I explained above IS USELESS in
practical application if you are trying to follow it like a script. The idea
is to GRAB that girl and NOT let her get away! ;) So guys, HOW MUCH DO YOU
WANT THAT GIRL? WHAT ARE YOU PREPARED TO DO?

Also on that note. BE A FUCKING MAN. Act like a guy, and don't think that
mirroring a girl completely is going to make you attractive to her. I know
from experience that the more caveman I go with chicks who KNOW my
intentions, the more they respond sexually.
Talk to chicks as if you were telling your kid brother how to play football
properly, cause your kid brother happens to be shit at football. I
especially like the way Mr. Sex talks to us on ASF - giving pointers and
what-not. I'm sure he talks to chicks exactly the same way IRL - showing
congruence all along.

You can even get around the language barrier! I just about dragged a sexy
Jgirl in a bikini off the beach while babbling to them in English! A
language they didn't even understand! I did that enough and with a smile,
that the chick went DDB and ready to GO when I took her hand. Had it not
been for the cockblock!
Somebody must have taught the "Iranian from hell" this shit!

The way I think about it is much like caveman sex. You see the hot chick,
you bang her on the head with your club, you take her to your cave, you root
her. Thus :- Find Stun Drag Fuck.
Just a bit more aggressive than Find Meet Attract Close, but that's the best
way I could describe what this ugly-as-fuck PUA was doing.

These were the attitudes that I had when I was only just starting to pull
women at incredible speeds while on holiday.

The other point is on Objection handling in regards to the STATEMENT OF
INTENTIONS. What I learned from the PUA I met, is that you fight chick
bullshit with your own bullshit - with a slightly authoritive tone (no need
to REALLY get pissed).
For example :- The chicks said "We have to get to our car" and were ready to
leave
The Playboy said "You can't leave anyway because the gates are closed" even
though the gates aren't closed.
Thus this covers handling chick bullshit - on the phone as well as in real
life.
And one chick on another seduction board I read often typed something to the
tune that she wants to be with a guy that can bullshit his way into her
pants.

So there you go. Find Stun Drag Fuck.
Stun is the hardest.

> There are reasons why most of us step through seduction so gingerly.
> We know that saying or doing one wrong thing can blow up the seduction.
> As far as I can tell, letting her know you intend to fuck her before
> you fuck her is one of those things.  Another reason is that women
> won't tell you when they're ready to fuck.

But DDB does tell all!
That single most common fuckup is what is called LACK OF CONGRUENCE
(definition courtesy of Mr. Sex). Just like when I called that chick I met
yesterday "my friend" in front of her. Doing that is a sign of weakness.
Chicks can get away with having words out of congruence with their actions,
but guys CANNOT.

> You say that when you "lead girls on" and tease them too much, you look
> easy and they hate you.  But this insight doesn't make it any easier to
> recognize when you're "leading them on".  The window between when a
> woman is receptive to a close and when you've stalled her is short, and
> spotting it seems to be harder than superstring theory.  The answer
> seems to be to make hundreds of approaches, and very slowly improve
> through experience.

Well you have body language and other subtle pointers. Plus we are adding
all the time to our STATEMENT OF INTENTIONS in order to find a barrier and
cut off point. I don't doubt that noticing DDB when you have the intuition
becomes easier.

  The one concrete thing I get out of your post is
> that next time two HBs want a foursome with you and your LTR, you'll be
> more likely to recognize it.  Or maybe the situation will be different
> enough that you won't.

I fucked that up because I KNOW those chicks wanted me to go with them, and
I over-teased them and didn't capitulate and then state my intentions to
have a foursome. They would have been up for it!
That's when the Playboy showed up to show me the shit, and then beat me
hands-down in a round of THE GAME. ;)

> You also said, "Now I realise more than fucking EVER what a chick
> wants. She wants a guy to go and GET her, make her feel wanted, and
> then have the shit fucked out of her!"  But you agreed with another
> poster that you can't just walk up to a woman and say "Let's fuck."
> So what's your new insight here?

It's a no-brainer. Is sex ALL you bringing to the table? That's why he
coupled GM styled intention pointers further into the seduction (after the
earlier G-rated ones), and then when they succeeded in not objecting, he
went to Mystery routines as a reward OR to the Drag phase if they were DDB.
You cannot start the seduction with a statement of intention that skips the
buildup - unless the chick is THAT FUCKING HORNY and shameless.
Chicks want to know that you care about them as human beings and not just
sex objects. Thus neutral conversation gets smattered in between, and the
final statement of intentions clearly shows what his intentions are so SHE
KNOWS that you care about her feelings - in that way.

The Playboy I met even went to see a chick he had a threesome with the next
day (cause she was feeling a bit alone). This guy was no cheap "Player"
(which he pointed out in his great Our world styled close routine on this
9). You could tell he cared enough too.

> Have you figure out a better way to know when a woman is ready to
> be closed?  Or a faster way to get her to want to fuck?  Or a way to
> let her know your intentions without scaring her off?  What's the
> difference between your approach now and your approach before you went
> to Guam?  It sounds like you feel you understand things better than
> you did before, but I can't figure out what the new understanding is.

Well, now you have your answer.
Mind you, I'm only getting the framework now that I sit down and try and
explain what I am now doing. This shit became automatic when I had the whole
experience of witnessing this guy and learning from him.

Any questions or comments? Fire away....

Rio
-------

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
References:  <90eati$gpt@nnrp1.deja.com> <63JW5.205t1.56373@nnrp.gol.com> <90i82p$iao@nnrp1.deja.com>
Subject: Re: Find Stun Drag Fuck

Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2000 10:04:46 GMT

Jonathan Ashton  wrote in message
news:90i82p$iao@nnrp1.deja.com...
> In article <63JW5.205t1.56373@nnrp.gol.com>,
>   "Rio"  wrote:
> > Well, now you have your answer.
>
> Yeah, I understand much better now.  Thanks for writing it down.
>
> > Any questions or comments? Fire away....
>
> So I get the abstract idea now:  Make some sort of Statement Of
> Intentions (SOI) to a woman relatively early, and then act congruently
> with it.

More or less, that's it.
The thing is, after dropping routines - get to it or the chick gets confused
and drops out.
Mystery had the right idea with his routines and intros. BUT if you fail to
State your intentions - you can stall things and stale her out. Then it will
be your fault when it appears that the routines don't work! They may have
worked, but she has given up on you as a partner already. You teased too
much.

> Like most people, though, I don't really understand any abstract idea
> until I've seen two or three concrete examples; i.e. HOW to make that
> SOI.

Ross Jeffries has already covered how to do this with his NLP pacing and
leading. I'm just giving a name to the end result of doing that (SOI -
Statement of Intention).

SOIs are SO important to women. They want to know where they stand. Women
you are with and haven't SOIed will think to themselves :- "What am I to
him"?
With my LTR which I sloppily SOIed, she annoyed me for ages if I was her
boyfriend or not. I hadn't said, and was therefore walking thin ice.
That drove her NUTS.

Now, I guess I could show you some fake examples of stuff that you could
launch into your PU - but the reason why I'm not going to do that is because
if ANYBODY creates a list of them - we're going to get the problem that AFC
men ALREADY have with PU Lines. That is, throwing meaningless words into a
conversation and then not being able to back them up.
Either that, or we will develop a single street pickup routine which men
will use the world over with great success before women cotton on to it.
When it comes to SOI, DIY (damn all these acronymns!).

An example of SOI is what I said to the chick I tried to PU on the weekend.
I paced it to the point where we are talking about where we lived, and I
found out that she lived close. Then I said "That's good, so we can get
together really easy and have some fun then."
If she had been far away - no problem "That's too bad. I'll have to travel
far to get together with you and have fun"
If she lives on Mars - no problem "Wow! You live out there! I'll have to
build a rocket to come and see you after you go back there!"

So there you go. Who needs to be excessively GM?

> You gave the example of GM style.  Yep, GM makes a pretty clear SOI.
> I don't think a "recovering nice guy" like me could do GM congruently,
> though.

I have done it once successfully and it Suuure works. But yes, it's hard to
work things up to that because you skip a lot of buildup steps. The flirting
has to take place in a sexual level rather than a much safer level. That is
risky.
That's what I mean when by saying "Let's Fuck" you run the risk of having to
flirt at such a high level where you can fuck up easily. Not that it's
impossible of course.
NEGs (which I forgot to mention before) help especially in the
objection,flirt phase. This phase is like the part where the dog chases
after the bitch to try and fuck her, and the bitch keeps running. The thrill
of the chase!

> You mention TokyoPUA and Johnny Shack references, but it would take
> a lot of searching/guessing to find the specific examples you have in
> mind.  And I don't understand your Ross example - "And maybe we could
> really get to like each other" sounds like a pretty vague SOI; maybe
> I'd understand what you mean if I knew the context?

Search for stuff on the archived layguide for stuff about Johnny Shack. He
also has an online book. Ross has his old free book around the place. Search
Formhandle for TokyoPUA's posts.
By the way, I even went as far as reading ALL of Mystery's decent posts as
well.

> The only example of an SOI I see in your posts is this one from Guam
> PUA:
>
> > As for going for the fuck close? Forget your sexual accelerators.
> > This guy said the whole shit in plain English - and I saw him say
> > this all to to a chick. He basically said that he was a playboy, but
> > not a pickup artist (to frame the idea that he won't fuck and dump),
> > and that when he had sex with the chick (Framing it as if it's going
> > to happen) that she should just enjoy it for fun and not worry about
> > it too much because it's just their private thing (our world style
> > routine), and that he was not an easy guy in reality - that he was
> > quite selective in who he chooses for sex (so he doesn't look like a
> > meat-market man).
> > He said all this straight faced to a chick, and while I was watching
> > the chick he did this on - she was trancing out and playing with her
> > hair. It was totally evil.
>
> So my questions...
>
> Have you ever done a SOI to kiss a girl and not had her object?  If so,
> what did you say?  Have you ever done a SOI to fuck a girl and not had
> her object?  If so, what did you say?  Hell, do you remember the exact
> words of any SOI you've ever said?

I gave you an example above of an SOI above (where I told the chick that we
would hang out in the future). No doubt we can refine the whole shit a lot
better in the future.
And yes. I think everyone at some stage has done an SOI, or the body
language has been good enough to get her into that zone where she KNOWS
maybe at 70% where your intentions are, with or without any routines to help
snag the chick, and the chick has put up some token resistance. The purpose
of the resistance of course, is to set the scene for the chase you know will
end in a fuck if you can just reel the bitch in. You will eventually do it
as long as you have remained congruent throughout.

> What other kinds of SOIs would you use in the buildup?  Tell her you're
> going to give her a neck massage?  (I'm sure that question sounds
> clueless; but I really think the meat is in the details.)

Well pace it:-
"Have you ever felt like having a neck massage? I think you need one, so
I'll give you one"
Sometimes the more direct your SOIs are, the harder she will force you to
keep pushing them.
So let's say the chick flirts and says "Why do you want to? I don't need
one!"
So we have to SOI her again in the second sentence in this example :- "Well
you haven't had one of my massages that can make you feel good all over. Now
relax....."

The idea is to trap the chick at all costs with your intentions that you can
carry out - until she can't get away.
Even "No I can't!" "Yes you can!" "No I can't!" "Yes you can!" fights - if
that's what it comes down to - can win you the day if you persist and not
let her win! Verbal arguments can always be solved with kino - cause you as
the guy are STRONGER. I don't mean hit her, but mauling is OK as long as she
is enjoying it! ;)

Persistance is VERY important. Of course, you may want to dump the chick
after the fuck if she doesn't drop the shit because she is too much work to
obtain sex from in the long run. Just give her an ultimatum "Cut the shit or
you will be lonely!"

At the same time, you can get trapped if you say an SOI that you can't
possibly keep. So watch what you promise to do!
Saying shit like "I'm going to buy you a Rolls Royce!" when she KNOWS you
can't afford it is an extreme example of a shit SOI. There goes your trust
and congruency with that one.

> And as for one other comment you made:
>
> > (E.g. If you want to start things off gently by holding her hand,
> > tell her a scene where want to be holding her hand - and then do it
> > in the next routine after she is comfortable with this.)
>
> You mean you tell her a story about some guy you know who held some
> girl's hand?  Or what?  Methinks I really don't understand here.

You can do that to get her thinking about holding someone's hand - and once
she is feeling it, you may be able to slip in the kino and get away with it.
At least, your chances will be better.

> > Is sex ALL you bringing to the table? That's why he
> > coupled GM styled intention pointers further into the seduction
> > (after the earlier G-rated ones), and then when they succeeded in
> > not objecting, he went to Mystery routines as a reward OR to the
> > Drag phase if they were DDB.
>
> I would LOVE to see these SOIs written down.

Done as above. But make your own!
I re-explained the "Let's Fuck" problem a bit better above as well.

> So here's my deal:  I want to see more examples of SOIs so I can take
> them apart, because I really suspect that the exact wording is crucial.
>
> For example:
>
> GM gets away with his SOIs because they're exaggerated to absurdity,
> and thus they're both funny and unlikely (at least as stated).
> This puts a little distance between the SOI and the girl, so she
> doesn't slap him.

I think it's more of a case of the GM SOIs that fail, he can write them off
as being jokes. That keeps him on track and congruent.
BUT the risk of failure is very high if he doesn't cover his tracks.

> Guam PUA gets away with his SOI (quoted above) because he's talking
> about chicks in general, and not overtly about the particular chick.
> This puts a little distance between the SOI and the girl, so she's
> not pressured to make a decision right then.

This is the all important point. With some SOIs (and especially with
ambiguities in NLP) the SOIs are not in your face, BUT they are vague enough
to get the point across and then judge for a positive reaction from her or
not. However, the vagueness is simply a shot from 50 metres as opposed to a
shot from point-blank. Just make sure you hit the target.
The danger with point-blank SOIs is they are risky in so far as if you say a
dumb one you can't,won't, or don't want to carry out like "I'm going to take
you on holiday!" as opposed to an NLP shot from 50 metres which describes a
holiday and builds on it. "Have you ever been on holiday with someone
special?....."

> Am I on the right track here?  Are there other ways to word SOIs that
> get around direct resistance?  More examples would be appreciated.

You should check out patterning, but remember, a shot from point-blank is
better than 50 metres. The shortest distance between 2 points is a straight
line. There are pros and cons of both styles of course.
You can take the short path across the dangerous ravine, or the long path
around it.

> I gotta say, this whole idea of SOIs is new to me.  Maybe other PUAs
> in this group have been using them without ever realizing/stating the
> importance of them?

I just gave a name to it. People have done this stuff before and I'm just
giving it a name to help explain what I'm doing.

And no, Ray can't trademark this either and claim it's his. We have
discussed why this is enough on ASF. He's filtered anyway and I can't see
his verbal shit.

> Thanks,
> Ash

Thanks for the questions. They help challenge me in trying to explain myself
better.

Rio

-------

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Clearing SOI's up
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 12:15:23 GMT

Maniac,

I came up with the SOI concept after studying what the Guam Playboy did to
chicks. I wish I could have spent longer down there to learn more off this
guy. Oh well, I just need to save up to go again.

SOI (Statements of intention/interest) were comments that the Guam Playboy
made a lot (I assume you read my report on that place - It's nanpa
paradise!). What he did then was control the flirting that followed after
baiting her with a show of interest. He did this by offering a challenge -
when he finished doing that once he went back to fun routines, talking about
parties on the island, jokes, sex personality tests, etc. before he did
another SOI - staring out as indirect and ambiguous, before being VERY
direct. ;)

Basically what I think I have come up with, through trying to explain to the
posters that asked me about him, is a flirting construction kit.

The Guam Playboy NEGged a LOT - and he got away with it every time. He could
even tell chicks AFC things like they were beautiful, and then turn it into
a NEG if he wanted. That's what over 20 years of daily PU did for this guy.

But the NEG is only one kind of flirting (used for dumping a girl's uptight
self image). There are other kinds, such as using ambiguities, physical
light-handed slapping and pushing kino, playing tricks on people, etc. The
Playboy used plenty of variations.

Flirting is this:- One drops the SOI, and then pulls it away out of reach of
the target. Then gives another SOI, and then pulls it away again. Like with
our words, we put images of sex and romance in their heads, then pull it out
again, then out it in, then take it out, then put it back in, then take it
out again........ Mindfucking!
Once the chick is confused and teased enough, she is DDB and safely
mindfucked.

I did a PU once on a chick using the SOIs. I found out where she lived and
then said "Oh that's not far from my place, so I can come down to see you.
It's a pity I am so busy it won't happen today"
(Note that there is a bit of future pacing and presuppositioning in this)
She lapped it up and took my kino from there - despite the BF being a matter
of metres away.

The structure for the Guam Playboy routine went like this:-

- Fun routine or opener (ala Mystery) - some basic fluff - all good things
about himself, what he could do for the women (he played the helpful tour
guide). Be "Disgustingly" Charming! as he put it. The guy wasn't big on
logically drawing out routines for what he did (which is a good thing), he
just went and DID this.... thus he couldn't really explain to me what he was
doing. I had to observe.
- SOI. He said something that hinted that he was interested in the chick
(paced and lead from his opener conversation). This got her emotions going
and her ideas racing. I have found this CRITICAL if the chick is going to
stay interested in you for too long. I bored many chicks out initially when
I wouldn't get to the point.
"What do you look for in guys?" would be sufficient enough as a question to
hint at what you are after (as you have found out yourself Maniac). Starting
off on a topic about guys and relationships usually brings chicks out, but
asking "Do you have a BF?" sucks.
This Ross Jeffries inspired SOI "The more you laugh, the more you'll be
attracted to interesting people......now with me" is an ambiguous SOI.
- Before she could knock him down for any comment, he would then be a
challenge and say something like "I'm not easy", "we don't know each other
well enough yet", "but what would I know, right? ;)","I need to feel passion
first", "Yeah, you know what I'm saying". These basically FORCE the chick to
continue the flirting (initiated by the SOI) along the lines that HE wanted
(and the lines that chicks SAY they want!).
By saying that he "needed time" and "not being easy", the chick already
attracted to him would then come onto him.

Most of the time the chicks would laugh becuase they'd get stuck for a smart
comeback. And he just kept this up, alternating back to party and fun
routines, until he got to the "sex-SOI-Our World-But I'm no sleaze"routine
which would then DDB the target to fuck - or get her ready for it next time
they met.
Negative commands also work great here to spark challenge. Just like I did
with my now LJBF ex-LTR "I'm not going to fuck you".

I've noted in my past failures (too many to count) that when I have dropped
SOI hints - the chicks have taken the flirting into areas which were
impossible for me to control - fucking me up and making me look stupid.
Especially in clubs where chicks do this like child's play to anyone who
"hits" on them. They use their irrational chick logic to fuck themselves
(and you) up. If that happens, your PU is history.
We can't give the women control, especially not in flirting, because they
aren't the ones that are trying to do PU. It's their job as "virtuous" women
to try and get away from PU, or try to fuck our PU up.

Svengali also said in his MLTR theory something which rings home on this. He
said (and I quote):-

"Seventh: If you don't give a woman something to be pissed about every
now and then, she'll find something on her own, and that will be harder
to get out of (because it will be of her making and criteria, not
yours)."

That is also the point of what we should be doing in flirting. To trap the
chick into going along with what your flirting and accepting your advances
(by means of non-objection) while getting her horny at the same time. That
way we avoid snappy comebacks because you've already "Handled her objections
before they came up" (That's something I learnt as a salesman)
This causes the chick to have her token resistance stall out - and puts us
in control.
GM does this with his sex jokes, but he slams any possible retort with "Just
Kidding" thus the chick can't say anything and the flirting goes by GMs
rules and not hers.

Take Mystery's "Nice nails" NEG for example.
He starts off with an SOI "Nice nails". This in and of itself is a
compliment. If he stopped here, the chick would come back (if she were a
bitch) with some smart ass comment to get rid of Mystery.

BUT, he then puts up the CHALLENGE before she gets a chance to reply (like
GM with "Just kidding"). Seemingly innocent too. "Are they real?"

Now the chick is stuck. What's going on? He's complimented me, and now he's
knocking me down! What is he doing? I must stick around for this! What can I
say? Maybe I'll just laugh it off...!? er..?
(Note, some REAL bitches when stalled will look angry at you and say "Huh?"
to which it's GM to the rescue! with "Hide your pleasure!")

So, couple this kind of flirting with lots of things to get her feeling
horny (patterns, sex talk, whatever), and add lots of personality conveying
things thrown in for good measure - and the chick is sufficiently stunned -
and ready for the drag and fuck stage.

Oh, and the Guam Playboy is an ugly fucker. Kipp's seen the pictures.
Looks don't matter for shit. I have great respect for all the older PUAs.

I must get up to Tokyo to see you guys real soon. The inaka sucks.
We can experiment with this some more then. I've been getting rusty since I
got back from Guam.
What I do know is that when this guy's method does work, it is KILLER. We
get Mr. Smooth status and KCs like crazy.

Rio
-------
Dictate the flirting

 wrote in message news:91f5e8$dpn@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Re: SOI's
>
> Rio..
>
> You are on to something big here..
> This is a discovery!
> I will incorporate this.
>
> Please give more specific examples though. I get
> what you are saying, but not yet really how you would
> apply it. .
>
>
> Fucking excellent thread!
>
>
> Maniac
> http://www.pickupguide.com
>
>
> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/

---

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: More on SOIs
Date: Fri, 22 Dec 2000 06:17:41 GMT

THIS IS RIO TYPING IN CAPS. I'M NOT YELLING!

Comments in text below.
After New years, I WILL be ready, and we will hit
the streets.

GREAT. I HAVEN'T BEEN DOING MUCH PU UNTIL YESTERDAY (1 SOLID # FROM A 9 AND
A KC FROM ANOTHER 9) - THUS THIS POST AS I TEST OUT MY THEORY. I HAVE A
FRIEND WHO WOULD LIKE TO COME ALONG. HE'S ALREADY BRIEFED AND VERY
EXPERIENCED IN SCREWING WOMEN IN JAPAN. HE'S READ THE PICKUP GUIDE ALREADY.
HE'S EVEN BEEN SO KIND TO INTRODUCE ME TO SOME WOMEN WHO WANT MERCY FUCKS.
HE ALSO KNOWS SOME GOOD "hole in the wall" PLACES AROUND RAPPONGI WITH LOTS
OF WOMEN (SO HE SAYS).

BTW, Rio; re: 'nomad' player.. mine was fucked up, returned
it for an exchange, new one works..

IT'S SURE BEATS A TAPE RECORDER, DOESN'T IT?

First, this is brilliant material, it is going on the
website, and is core to successful PU I think. It IS what
smooth was doing.. I couldnt identify it, but now it has
been named, and described, I recognize this.. and yes, it
will be TOTALLY lethal..

THANKS. EVERY SUCCESSFUL PUA HAS BEEN DOING SOMETHING LIKE THIS (OF ONE
STYLE OR ANOTHER) TO BED WOMEN. I WENT OUT AND USED THIS FRAME YESTERDAY
WITH INTERESTING AND POSITIVE RESULTS.....

HOWEVER, I MUST SAY IT'S HARD TO GIVE SPECIFIC EXAMPLES UNLESS THEY ARE
SITUATIONALLY BASED. FOLLOWING THE LOGIC HOWEVER, AND USING IT GIVEN THE
SITUATION STILL BRING RESULTS. I WILL DESCRIBE SOME OF WHAT I HAVE BEEN
DOING WITH IT, BUT I CAN'T REMEMBER FOR THE LIFE OF ME WHAT EXACTLY THE GUAM
GUY SAID. (I ONLY RECORDED A SMALL SAMPLE OF OUR CHAT WITH MY MP3 PLAYER.
NONE OF HIS NANPA HOWEVER) WHAT I DO KNOW, IS THAT HE FOLLOWED THIS
STRUCTURE WHICH I HAVE DESCRIBED TO VERY SOME GOOD EFFECTS.

I ASSUME YOU READ MY ORIGINAL STORY ON THE GUAM TRIP.
IF SO, MY REPLY WILL MAKE MORE SENSE.

In article ,
  "Rio"  wrote:
> He did this by offering a challenge -
> when he finished doing that once he went back to fun routines,
talking about

Examples? ?

OK, HE MADE SOME KIND OF COMPLIMENT OR SUGGESTED SOME KIND OF ACTIVITY
(OFTENTIMES WITH SEXUAL OR ROMANTIC UNDERTONES) THAT THEY COULD DO TOGETHER.
(LIKE HANG TIGHT TO EACH OTHER OF THE JET POWERED BANANA BOAT) AND THEN
FOLLOWED THAT WITH A REASON WHY HE WOULD HAVE TROUBLE DOING IT. KINDA LIKE
IN SALES, A SALESMAN WOULD SAY "FOR ONE DAY ONLY SALE", WELL HE WAS LIKE "SO
YOU SHOW UP AT SUCH AND SUCH A TIME, OTHERWISE I WON'T BE ABLE TO SHOW YOU A
GOOD TIME AND I'LL TAKE SOMEONE ELSE" (a takeaway)
SO IN ORDER TO CONTINUE THE FLIRTING, THE CHICK WOULD HAVE TO SHOW UP. HE
WOULD THEN (AFTER HAVING COMPLETED A SOI ROUTINE) SIT BACK AND WATCH THE
CHICK FOLLOW THROUGH. HE WOULD OFTENTIMES BE ABLE TO CONTINUE A CONVERSATION
WITHOUT STALLING - AND MIDWAY HE WOULD SOI HER AGAIN AND DO THE SAME ROUTINE
WITH SOMETHING ELSE. I NEVER SAW HIM GET IT ON WITHIN 20 MINUTES, BUT I SAW
WHAT HE DID TO THE CHICK WITH THIS ROUTINE AND I COULD TELL THAT HE COULD
HAVE IF HE WANTED TO. HE DIDN'T LOOK DESPERATE AT ALL.

> parties on the island, jokes, sex personality tests, etc. before he
did
> another SOI - staring out as indirect and ambiguous, before being VERY
> direct. ;)

Examples ? ?

THIS GUY HAD A STRONG ELEMENT OF GM. THE SEX PERSONALITY TEST IS DOCUMENTED
IN MY POST ON THIS GUY (IT'S ABOUT ICE CREAM) - BUT AFTERWARDS UNLIKE GM, NO
COMMENT OF "JUST KIDDING". HE WOULD THEN SAY SOMETHING ELSE TO DISTRACT
ATTENTION OR PLAY "PRETEND AFC" LIKE "BUT I'M NOT EASY" OR "BUT I DON'T KNOW
YOU THAT WELL"
ALL THE MEANWHILE, GETTING THE CHICK HORNY AND CREATING A CHALLENGE.

> Basically what I think I have come up with, through trying to explain
to the
> posters that asked me about him, is a flirting construction kit.

Examples ? ?

MANIAC, YOU'RE STARTING TO OVERUSE CUT AND PASTE LIKE NYC WHEN HE RIPS APART
AFCS WITH THESE "EXAMPLES??" COMMENTS.........

(QUOTE NYC)
"YOU ARE BEING USED. SHE DOESN'T GIVE A SHIT ABOUT YOU. SHE DOESN'T INTEND
TO FUCK YOU. SHE IS FUCKING OTHER MEN THAT SHE FINDS SEXUALLY ATTRACTIVE.
YOU ARE FOOTING THE BILL FOR HER INTERNATIONAL WHORING. STOP."

HA HA HA ;)

> The Guam Playboy NEGged a LOT - and he got away with it every time.

Such as ? ?

WISH I COULD REMEMBER NOW. BUT WHAT I DID SEE IS HIM COMPLIMENTING LOTS OF
JAP CHICKS AND NOT GETTING ANY NASTY REACTION BACK FROM THEM - BECAUSE THEY
WERE SO SHY AND INEXPERIENCED. SO THE CHICKS JUST LAUGHED BECAUSE THEY HAD
NO BITCH SHIELD OF ANY TYPE.
WHERE HE DID ENCOUNTER A SHIELD, HE WOULD ATTACK HER "NASTY" PERSONALITY -
AND HER LACK OF ABILITY TO BE GRACEFUL WITH COMPLIMENTS.

IN THAT SENSE, HE WOULD ALWAYS SIZE THE CHICK UP AS IF HE WAS LOOKING FOR
LTR POTENTIAL (but we know of course, that LTR was never the plan)

He could
> even tell chicks AFC things like they were beautiful, and then turn
it into
> a NEG if he wanted. That's what over 20 years of daily PU did for
this guy.

Examples ? ?

"YOU'RE REALLY CUTE....(pause to check response)... BUT I DON'T KNOW
ANYTHING ABOUT YOU. (SAID NEGATIVELY OR NOT DEPENDING ON HER RESPONSE). SO
WHO ARE YOU ANYWAY?"

> But the NEG is only one kind of flirting (used for dumping a girl's
uptight
> self image). There are other kinds, such as using ambiguities,
physical
> light-handed slapping and pushing kino, playing tricks on people,
etc.

Such as ? ?

I'VE STOPPED USING KINO IMMIDIATELY NOW, AND SAVING IT FOR WHEN I'VE LANDED
AN SOI ROUTINE AND CAUGHT THE CHICK OUT. WHEN SHE HAS LAUGHED, I SLAP HER
GENTLY.
IT'S ANCHORING.

AS FOR TRICKS ON PEOPLE.... STUPID ONES. I WILL HAVE TO SHOW YOU THEM IN
PERSON.

The
> Playboy used plenty of variations.

Like what ? ?

GIVEN THE SITUATION, HE WOULD TRY DIFFERENT WAYS TO GET HER THINKING
ROMANTICALLY ABOUT BOTH OF THEM TOGETHER. HE WOULD USE WHATEVER WAS IN HIS
SURROUNDINGS, OR THE TOPIC OF CONVERSATION, TO PACE AND LEAD THE CHICK INTO
IMAGINING SUCH A SCENARIO.
THEN HE WOULD YANK IT AWAY BY GIVING SOME KIND OF EXCUSE (LIKE HE WAS BUSY,
HE DIDN'T THINK SHE COULD DO IT) OR HE WOULD PLAY AFC (I DON'T KNOW YOU, I
NEED TO BE IN LOVE FIRST, I'M NOT EASY, I'M NOT A PLAYER, I NEED TIME, I AM
REALLY PICKY, I HAVE BEEN HURT BEFORE, I HAVE A GF)

> Flirting is this:- One drops the SOI, and then pulls it away out of
reach of
> the target.

For example ? ?

I REALLY FEEL VERY CLOSE TO YOU, BUT I NEED TIME.

THE MAGIC WORD IS but

 Then gives another SOI, and then pulls it away again. Like with
> our words, we put images of sex and romance in their heads, then pull
it out

Like ? ?

HIS BRAVEST SOI WAS THE ONE WHERE HE SAID STRAIGHT OUT THAT HE WAS GOING TO
FUCK A CHICK. I WITNESSED THE WHOLE THING. HE SAID THAT HE WAS GOING TO FUCK
HER but (AND THEN HE WENT PRETEND AFC) I'M VERY PICKY, I'M NOT A PUA
BECAUSE THOSE GUYS TEASE WOMEN WITH BULLSHIT, MAKE EMPTY PROMISES, FUCK
THEM, AND THEN DUMP THEM. I AM A PLAYBOY. I LOVE WOMEN AND I DON'T WANT YOU
TO GET TOO ATTACHED TO ME AFTER WE HAVE SEX.

> again, then out it in, then take it out, then put it back in, then
take it
> out again........ Mindfucking!

Example please . .

OK, ANOTHER ONE:-   I WANT TO KISS YOU, BUT SOMEHOW I DON'T THINK YOU LIKE
KISSING.
(btw - this would be an SOI fairly advanced in conversation)
NOTE ALSO THAT THERE'S AN EMBEDDED COMMAND IN THE 2ND PART OF THE ROUTINE.
THAT BEING "YOU LIKE KISSING"
EVIL ISN'T IT?

> Once the chick is confused and teased enough, she is DDB and safely
> mindfucked.

how? describe this. . what exactly did he do?

WELL, THE CHICK THAT HE SAID THE "I'M GOING TO FUCK YOU" SPEECH TO, JUST
STARTED DOING ALL THE TRADEMARK BODYLANGUAGE. SHE JUST SAT THERE STUNNED
AND PLAYED WITH HER HAIR. LIKE A RABBIT LOOKING INTO BRIGHT LIGHTS. THE GUAM
GUY SAID ALL OF IT WITH A SERIOUS FACE TOO, SO SHE COULDN'T LAUGH OFF WHAT
HE WAS SAYING.

THE WAY HE WORKED DIDN'T SEEM TO BE ONE OF "ATTRACTION" PER SE. HE WOULD
EVENTUALLY CORNER THE CHICK AND FLIRT WITH HER UNTIL SHE COULD TAKE NO MORE.
UNTIL SHE GOT STUNNED

> I did a PU once on a chick using the SOIs. I found out where she
lived and
> then said "Oh that's not far from my place, so I can come down to see
you.
> It's a pity I am so busy it won't happen today"

This is good. .

THAT'S A REAL LIFE EXAMPLE OF WHAT THE WHOLE THEORY IS ABOUT. MORE
IMPORTANTLY IS THAT IT WORKED.

> (Note that there is a bit of future pacing and presuppositioning in
this)
> She lapped it up and took my kino from there - despite the BF being a
matter
> of metres away.
>
> The structure for the Guam Playboy routine went like this:-
>
> - Fun routine or opener (ala Mystery) - some basic fluff - all good
things
> about himself, what he could do for the women (he played the helpful
tour

Examples ? ?

READ SOME OF MYSTERY'S OPENERS!
TYPICALLY OFF THE WALL STUFF. WELL, WHEN HE WAS TALKING ABOUT GUAM'S CULTURE
AND PARTIES AND STUFF - FOR ALL THE TOURISTS, ALL THIS NEW INFO TO THEM IS
PRETTY OFF THE WALL.
HE WOULD TELL THE CHICKS ABOUT SOME PARTY WHERE THEY WOULD DIG A HUGE PIT
AND THROW ANIMALS ON IT IN A BIG FEAST WITH A BONFIRE AND DANCING - AND THEN
BRANCHED OUT AND TALKED ABOUT DANCING AND OTHER EXOTIC/EROTIC STUFF.

> guide). Be "Disgustingly" Charming! as he put it. The guy wasn't big
on

Like ? ?

THOSE WERE HIS EXACT WORDS. HE RELIED ON GM A LOT IN THE LATTER PART OF HIS
SEDUCTIONS.

> logically drawing out routines for what he did (which is a good
thing), he
> just went and DID this.... thus he couldn't really explain to me what
he was
> doing. I had to observe.

Yep, he's got experience.. I rarely consciously follow ManiacPlan
anymore.. just it spews out naturally.. learning PU is like learning
a foreign language/lingo.. once you get it, its natural..

I'VE BEEN LEARNING TO PLAY AFC IN MY SEDUCTIONS, AND IT HAS BEEN WORKING
REALLY WELL!

> - SOI. He said something that hinted that he was interested in the
chick
> (paced and lead from his opener conversation). This got her emotions
going

Example?  How?

OK, ANOTHER ONE.

"WOULDN'T IT BE GREAT TO SPEND TIME TOGETHER OVER COFFEE? IT'S SUCH A PITY I
HAVE TO GO TO SOME MEETINGS LATER ON, SO WE WILL PROBABLY HAVE NO TIME TO
SEE EACH OTHER EVER AGAIN BEFORE YOU GO BACK."
(WAIT FOR RESPONSE)
"BUT LET ME KNOW YOUR NUMBER ANYWAY...WHO KNOWS I MAY HAVE TIME."
(might want to save this one after you have dropped several other
SOIs)

> and her ideas racing.

Like what? which ideas? be specific please. .

ROMATIC AND/OR SEXUAL ONES.
HE WOULD START OFF ON ROMANTIC ONES AND MAKE THEM INCREASINGLY SEXUAL UNTIL
HE HIT A SEXUAL FANTASY OF HERS THAT WOULD DDB HER.
LET'S SAY "HOLDING HANDS" OR "SPENDING QUALITY TIME TOGETHER" OR "BEING
CLOSE" AND EVENTUALLY LEADING THAT INTO "TOUCHING BODIES" AND "KISSING" TO
"FUCKING" OBVIOUSLY.
A LOT OF TIME DISTORTION SOIs.

> I have found this CRITICAL if the chick is going to
> stay interested in you for too long. I bored many chicks out
initially when
> I wouldn't get to the point.
[rest deleted]

Rio, this is great stuff. Somehow I understand it.. but I need
examples of it so I can put it together as something I can try
in the field. Do you remember any specifics from this guy?

WELL, WE CAN ALWAYS WAIT FOR THE OFF-SEASON AND GO TO GUAM WITH A VCR AND
MEET THIS GUY (YOU'LL ONLY NEED ABOUT 40,000 YEN FROM TOKYO FOR A 2 DAY
TRIP) OR NEXT TIME WE MEET IN TOKYO WE CAN DO MORE STREET STUFF AND I CAN
SHOW YOU WHAT I KNOW. (I HADN'T FULLY DEVELOPED THE THEORY UNTIL AFTER MY
NIGHT OUT WITH KIPP - I OQed TOO MUCH AND FAILED TO PLACE ANY CHALLENGES
AFTER MY SOIs THAT NIGHT)
THE GUAM PLAYBOY WAS A GRANDMASTER OF STREET PU - HIS WEAKNESS WAS THAT HE
WAS A GREEDY TEAMPLAYER WITH WINGMEN.

If so, please fill in the above spaces where I ask.. it is very
important if this is to work.

Rio
-------

Using SOI’s as a way to tease/attract chicks!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Using SOI's (statements of intent) as a tease to attract a chick!


From: Jonathan Ashton 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Clearing SOI's up
Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 07:04:08 GMT

In article ,
> For example, if we were to drop an SOI on the chick, and then
> IMMEDIATELY follow up with a negative command - WE control the
> flirting so that the chick then has to work for US.
>
> So we can say things like "I want to kiss you"
> And then control the flirting by pulling away again with some reverse
> commands :-
> "BUT I don't really know anything about you, and I haven't known you
> for very long, and I need to feel love first"
> Sounds like the stuff that chicks tell us, right? Well chicks say it
> to flirt, as opposed to meaning what they say!

Omigod!  Rio, this is an awesome post!  Brilliant!  Genius!

"I was thinking about kissing you, but you'd probably slobber too
  much."
"I'd love to take you home, but I know you'd get all clingy."
"I'm just trying to guess if you're any good in bed.  Too bad you're
  too young/weird/conservative for me."
"I bet you'd love the way I do neck massages.  You've been acting up
  too much to deserve one, though."

This is so EASY!  Anyone can think these up on the spot!  There's no
need to think up ambiguous sentences or come up with just the right
innuendo.  Just make a Statement of Intentions, then let her know what
SHE has to offer to make it happen - by telling her that you won't do
it because she's not up to par!  I love it!  I will try it out ASAP!

Howcome I've never seen this idea explained before?  In retrospect,
it's clear that MrSex4uNYC and Mystery do similar stuff, but I've
never seen the dynamic explained this way before.  Ross talks about
setting challenges, but it's always seemed like such a delicate art
to say just the right thing at just the right time.

But this is so easy!  Thank you, Rio.

Ash


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

Game: Color game

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Color Game that can be used in PU!
[Maniac note: got this other list below from the 'Secrets of the cube book'
Also very good, may be appropriate when doing this game:

Red: passion, hot energy, anger warmth
Green: hope, life, nature, money
Blue: spirituality, serenity, cool energy, sadness
Purple: royalty, deep passions, mourning
Yellow: cheerfulness, brightness, eccentricity
Pink: feminity, wamrth
Brown: earthyness, warmth, conventionality
Black: mystery
White: purity
Multicolored: of many interests or moods

END: Maniac note]

From: steviewonder 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: More personality tests
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 20:20:17 GMT

In article <904e0cjv@nnrp1.deja.com>,
  maniac_high@yahoo.com wrote:
> There is good stuff on that site.
>
> I am reworking it to be more appropriate in opener type
> PU's in bars/coffee shops, will present my results of this
> work in late January after it has all been designed and
> field tested.. It will be killer..

Hi guys,

Found this game at

http://www.geocities.com/Broadway/8546/colortest.html

a good one since all the answers are sexual:

QUESTION:

Pick the color that best describes your personality?

ANSWERS:

BLACK
Black color preferences point to black sex. These people are the
misfits of the sex world and seek each other in kinship. They tend to
prefer perverted sex, and are usually masochistic or sadistic in
nature. They are moody and often perform at their peak when under
stress or during unhappy times. Police psychologists claim that many
sex offenders prefer the color black. And it is no coincidence that
the uniform of mobsters and teenaged gangs is black.

BLUE
Lovers of blue are wonderful sex partners. They are sincere,
affectionate, and sensitive to their partner's needs. They consider
lovemaking a fine art, and their approach is elegant. Men who love
blue are like concert pianists; delicately ravaging their partner like
they would play a baby grand. Women in the blue category enjoy sex
to the fullest. They are exciting partners, but their passion might be
compared to tidal waves, rather than fiery aggresion. Both blue men
and women enjoy foreplay and the aftermath of lovemaking as much
as the act. In marriages, a blue person is a wonderful mate, never
failing to please the spouse and never seeking outside interests.

BROWN
For lovers of brown, sex is a 24-hour a day thing. They tend to say "I
love you" often enough. Snuggling by the fire, walking in the rain or
catching snowflakes on their tongue ins a turn-on to a lover of brown.
They need lots of time and privacy to make love. But their emotions
are such that one harsh word could end an affair.

GREEN
Those who prefer green are fresh and innocent in their approach to
sex. Women who love green will make love like virgins all their life.
And a man may also be a trifle clumsy and awkward, but in a charming
and endearing sort of way. Green lovers are gentle, but not
passionate. If chosen as a mate, one will never need to worry about
infidelity.

GREY
The color grey is preferred by people who are indecisive. They can't
get excited about anything - including colors - so they choose a
noncommittal shade. Men who prefer grey look at sex as a means of
relieving tension - nothing more nothing less. It's "wham, bam, thank
you ma'am". Women don't make love, they have intercourse. They
count the cracks in the bedroom plaster until the sex act is over with
and done. When a grey marries another grey, the marriage is not
exactly erotic.

ORANGE
Lovers of the color orange lean toward sexual fantasies. The sex act
is regarded as a dramatic role, a one act play in which they are the
star. Foreplay is as important as the act of love. They whisper sweet
nothings, meaningless dialogue they feel fits their image. Orange
people often do not experience orgasm - but they put on a damn good
act. Men tend to pull their partner's hair and women tend to leave
welts on their sex partner's back!

PINK
Persons who like pink show a reluctance to mature in sexual matters.
Women tend to tease; to promise more than they intend to deliver. In
some cases, they flaunt their femininity, but only because they
secretly hate men. A great percentage of prostitutes boast entire
wardrobes in pink. Men who like pink are the type who make 3 dates
for the same evening and not keep them, preferring to pick up a dish
in some bar instead.

PURPLE
Lovers of purple frequently consider themselves too regal for  fun
romp in the sack. Women sometimes are the type who hate to muss
their hair. Men are businesslike in their approach to lovemaking. In
both sexes, purple partners are more concerned with their
fulfillment then anyone else's gratification.

RED
People who like red tend to be tigers in the sack. They are easily
aroused and enjoy sex in every way imaginable. Once the sexual spark
is lit, it may take hours to extinguish. When two reds get together,
the ensuing erotica would make Lady Chatterly blush. Lovers of red
tend to be the aggressors and weaker colors should beware!

YELLOW
If you tend to favor yellow, your sexual drives are complex and lean
toward the adaptable. The favorite color of homosexuals is yellow!
But don't panic - not everyone who wears yellow is homosexual. In
most cases the person will accommodate to the stronger partner's
desires in a passive manner. You will never enjoy sex to the fullest,
but you will never turn down an invitation from someone you enjoy or
admire.

--
To email me remove the _obvious from this address:
steviewonder_ob@viousfastmail.ca

Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

Handling delusional chicks, karatebabe lives a nightmare!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Re: Mystery: delusional chicks & sympathy lies! 
Date: 11/12/2000 
Author: maniac_high  

 << previous in search  ?  next in search >>  

Re: Mystery: delusional chicks & sympathy lies!
001112
 
Mystery wrote in another post this week regarding lying
to chicks, about how not to underestimate how delusional
a chick is willing to become in order to keep her 'happy'
view of the world.
 
He is absolutely right. And this explains how seeming
'jerk' can get away with what seems like such ridiculous
shit.
 
Case in point, is where I recently did a fuckup, and then
recovered with Karatebabe (see lay report, my page). This
is the chick that would go around my place after sex
cleaning up her own hairs so that "the other chicks"
wouldnt find out about her.
 
Well, one day we are going for coffee, and she asks me
if I had been seeing another chick at the time I started
dating her. Figuring (incorrectly) from her behavior,
that this chick knew totally what the score already was,
I said I had been (wrong answer!).
 
She freaked out and went balistic at me. Shit about "how
I make her fool, go behind her back..and other shit".
In retrospect it was clear though.. she got upset, because
something she merely 'suspected' (even though it was fucking
obvious as shit, as other chicks stuff was all over the
fucking house), now became something 'confirmed', and that
shattered her entire world..
 
I then smartened up and realized what I had just done,
and recovered by saying that I dumped her after I first
started dating you (Karatebabe), a few weeks later.
 
After that, she settled down (even though every week
there was different chick stuff all over the house
after that!). She asked me about it, and I said no,
there are no chicks..
 
She said she accepted that, and that her 'nightmare'
now was over, and everything was fine again.
 
Later she found some makeup and chick stuff in the
bathroom cabinet (another chick must have slipped
it there for someone else to find it), so I had
to think fast on my feet for that one...
 
So I told her that I have a real dark secret and
she might be very disappointed in me (now she is
expecting to hear something about a chick)..
 
Then (remembering she likes gays and stuff) I tell
her that I like to make believe to dress like a girl
(lots of J-guys do it actually, so I know it is not
so far fetched here), and I have guy friends that do it
with me, and sorry I didnt tell you earlier.. (of
course this is TOTALLY false.. Maniac is not even
remotely gay, nor a crossdresser or any of that shit)...
however.. she ACCEPTED that story, and was relieved
(in spite of the fact that I was almost cracking up
when I said it, since I was SURE she would call me
on my bullshit... but she didnt)!
 
Fuck!, the totally ridiculous things you have to
tell a chick...  AND! they accept it (as they
try to internalize it and believe it at least at
some level so that their happy delusional world
doesn't come crashing to bits)..
 
Strange, isnt it..!
 
Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Using the laws of power in PU!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Toecutter, and using the laws of power!




From toecutter@mail.com Mon Oct 23 09:39:39 2000
From: "toecutter" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Lessons from Book: The 48 Laws of Power
Lines: 201


Just reading a book, The 48 Laws of Power by Robert Greene. Definitely
lessons everywhere in the book on what we do here.
The book is amoral, and open about the deception inherit in what he is
teaching. It is largely for life outside the arena of seduction, but
entrirely applicable and there are some seduction examples in it to
illustrate his points (only historical: For example the advice of Ninon de
Lenclos on seduction to the Marquis de Sevigne and what happened when the
Marquis did not follow her advice, etc.). The examples are all pulled from
the Sun Tzu (Chinese, the Art of War), European history, famous con men,
magicians and charlatans, Kings, Queens, Napoleon and other power brokers
such as Al Capone. Perfect for you guys who enjoy Machiavelli. At 450
reasonably large format pages it is fairly long.

It is going to take me several re-readings, but at the moment I see the
messages as really 3 fold: First, play your cards pretty close to your
chest. This creates mystery. The more you say, the more common you appear
and the less in control. Andy Wohol created enigma by not discussing his
work and answering questions by being intentionally vague giving people the
feeling that he was being more profound than he was.  If you do not reveal
all, people will never become bored with you or your presence because you
will continue to represent a challenge, and will be eternally interesting.
Your silence will make other people feel uncomfortable and humans are
machines of interpretation and explanation; they have to know what you are
thinking. When you carefully control what you reveal, they cannot pierce
your intentions and meaning. Your short answers will put them on the
defensive and they will jump in, nervously filling the silence with all
kinds of comments that will reveal valuable information about themselves and
their weaknesses.

This brings me to the second message. Learn everything you can about other
people. Their strengths and weaknesses, their crutches and trance words.
Their motivations. Use these to your advantage whilst revealing as little as
possible about yourself. Keep them the focus of the conversation, and be a
'Spy' on their minds by eliciting values.

The third lesson is to use smoke and mirrors to obscure your objectives and
motivations. Throw decoys out there, use gifts as Trojan horses, and be
circumspect in what is going on. Again, this throws them off your game,
gives you an upper hand.

None of this is to say that you need to be quiet or a bad conversationalist,
just the opposite, by spying and eliciting values, you are encouraging
people to talk about themselves, their own favourite subject. By being brief
about yourself you are creating mystery and interest. It is just that you
are collecting the information in order to use it against them at another
time, whilst manipulating your image and reputation in their minds and
obscuring your real motivations. In some ways it is a book on playing hard
to get while outmanoeuvring the girl. A perfect structure in which to drop
SS.

Some of the content is below. I can post more on it if you would like
further discussion; I am overflowing with ideas on it.

Toecutter.

---

To list some of the laws that are obviously applicable:

Law 3: Conceal your intentions (Keep people off balance and in the dark by
never revealing the purpose behind your actions. If they have no clue what
you are up to, they cannot prepare a defence. Guide them far enough down the
wrong path, envelop them in enough smoke, and by the time they realise your
intentions, it will be too late.)

Law 4: Always say less than is necessary

Law 6: Court attention at all costs

Law 8: Make other people come to you - use bait if necessary

Law 9: Win though your actions, never through argument. (Any momentary
triumph you win though argument is really a Pyrrhic victory: The resentment
and ill will you stir up is stronger and lasts longer than any momentary
change in opinion. It is much more powerful to get others to agree with you
though your actions, without saying a word. Demonstrate, do not explicate.)

Law 10: Infection: Avoid the unhappy and unlucky (it works the other way
also. This is an alternative take on social-proof, or pivots or whatever you
want to call them, as well as wingmen. Also advice on not getting involved
with the wrong girl.)

Law 11: Learn to keep people dependent on you.

Law 12: Use selective generosity to disarm your victim (One sincere and
honest move will cover over dozens of dishonest ones. Openhearted gestures
of honesty and generosity bring down the guard of even the most suspicious
people. Once your selective honesty opens a hole in their armour, you can
deceive and manipulate at will.)

Law 13: When asking for help, appeal to people's self interest, never to
their mercy or gratitude.

Law 14: Pose as a friend, work as a spy.

Law 16: Use absence to increase respect and honour. (Again through mystery
and not stuffing it up by staying too long and doing or saying something
wrong.)

Law 17: Keep others in suspended terror: Cultivate an air of
unpredictability

Law 18: Do not build fortresses to protect yourself - Isolation is
dangerous. (Get out there amongst them).

Law 19: Know who you are dealing with - do not offend the wrong person.

Law 20: Do not commit yourself to anyone.

Law 21: Play a sucker to catch a sucker - appear dumber than your mark. (Let
her think that she is in control and smart, less naive, don't let on you are
a player).

Law 25: Re-create yourself (Do not accept the roles that society foists on
you. Re-create yourself by forging a new identity, one that commands
attention and never bores the audience. Be the master of your own image
rather than letting others define it for you. Incorporate dynamic devices
into your public gestures and actions - your power will be enhanced and your
character will seem larger than life).

Law 26: Keep your hands clean. (You must seem a paragon of civility and
efficiency: Your hands are never soiled by mistakes and nasty deeds.
Maintain such a spotless appearance by using others as scapegoats and cat'
s-paws to disguise your involvement).

Law 27: Play on peoples need to believe to create a cult like following.
(advice in this chapter is on how to become a cult leader or maybe build a
harem. 5 strategies to your dogma! a) Keep it vague; Keep it simple b)
Emphasise the visual and sensual over the intellectual c) Borrow the forms
of organised religion to structure the group d) Disguise your income source
e) set up an us-vs.-them dynamic. I think Ross Jeffries read this one!)

Law 28: Enter action with Boldness. (If you are unsure of a course of
action, do not attempt it. Your doubts and hesitations will infect your
execution. Timidity is dangerous: Better to enter with boldness. Any
mistakes you make through audacity are easily corrected with more audacity.
Everyone admires the bold; no one honours the timid).

Law 29: Plan all the way to the end.

Law 30: Make your accomplishments seem effortless. (Your actions must seem
natural and executed with ease. All the toil and practice that goes into
them, also all the clever tricks, must be concealed. When you act, act
effortlessly, as if you could do much more. Avoid the temptation of
revealing how hard you work - it only raises questions. Teach no one your
tricks or they will be used against you .. I am breaking this rule right
here with this post, as is the Authour of the book.)

Law 31: Control the options: Get others to play with the cards you deal.
(The best deceptions are the ones that seem to give the other person a
choice: Your victims feel they are in control, but are actually your
puppets. Give people options that come out in your favour whichever one they
choose. Force them to make choices between the lesser of two evils, both of
which serve your purpose. Put them on the horns of the dilemma: they are
gored wherever they turn. Note: this is a different view on my idea of
re-framing questions. The questions are re-framed so well that the girl has
no option.)

Law 32: Play to people's fantasies.

Law 33: Discover each mans thumbscrew.

Law 34: Be royal in your own fashion: Act like a king to be treated like
one.

Law 35: Master the art of timing. (Never seem to be in a hurry - hurrying
betrays a lack of control over yourself, and over time. Always seem patient,
as if you know that everything will come to you eventually. Become a
detective of the right moment; sniff out the spirit of the times, the trends
that will carry you to power. Learn to stand back when the time is not yet
ripe, and to strike fiercely when it has reached fruition.)

Law 36: Disdain things you cannot have: Ignoring them is the best revenge.

Law 37: Create compelling spectacles. (Striking imagery and grand symbolic
gestures create the aura of power - everyone responds to them. Stage
spectacles for those around you, then, full of arresting visuals and radiant
symbols to heighten your presence. Dazzled by appearances, no one will
notice what you are really doing.)

Law 40: Despise the free Lunch.

Law 43: Work on the hearts and minds of others.

Law 44: Disarm and infuriate with the mirror effect. (The mirror reflects
reality, but is the perfect tool for deception: When you mirror your
enemies, doing exactly as they do, they cannot figure out your strategy. The
mirror Effect mocks and humiliates them, making them overreact. By holding
up a mirror to their psyches, you seduce them with the illusion that you
share their values; by holding up a mirror to their actions you teach them a
lesson. Few can resist the power of the mirror effect.)

Law 48: Assume formlessness. (By taking a shape, by having a visible plan,
you open yourself to attact. Instead of taking a form for the girl to grasp,
keep yourself adaptable and on the move. Accept the fact that nothing is
certain and no law is fixed. The best way to protect yourself is to be as
fluid and formless as water: never bet on stability or lasting order.
Everything changes.)

Disarming groups of guys around chicks!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

When lots of guys are around 1 girl, you must disarm guys!


From: "Stepleader" 
Subject: Re: She has nice/great body and/or face -- but what about her?
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2000 10:02:45 GMT

great pep talk and I love your posts ... but ...

the situ called for a disarming of the guys.  Here is how.  Approach the
group but pay NO attention to the girl.  Begin the chat with the guys and
make them interested in your story telling.  MALE BONDING comradery.  Turn
you back to HER so she feels out of place.  What you have done is removed
all the attention from her (stolen it).  You are now the center of
attention.  A couple NEGS her way challenges her.  All the other guys were
on her - all but one.  YOU.

Just so you know, this is mystery methods groupset theory and Ive done this
successfully a great # of times.

from this vantage point you may now take her  by the hand and say to the
others, "is it alright if I steal your friend away for a bit?"  they will
say yes and you take her out of earshot.  Id love you to see me work a set
like that.  its brilliant.  and PRACTICAL.

Svengali  wrote in article
<131220002147344283%Svengali_here@use.net>...
> Gentlemen, you're looking for the whole package, not just the
> packaging.  And if all you're focusing on is the packaging, she damn
> well knows it and is in control of you --period!
> 
> You must, repeat, you must be prepared to walk at all times, no matter
> how much you would like to be on/in that body and face.
> 
> Remember, you are screening her to see if she is good enough for
> you, not the other way around.  And the only way you're going to find
> out if she is good enough for you is to learn as much as you can
> about the person that is within that female form.
> 
> Am I saying you must be screening every beauty for a long term
> relationship?  Hell no!  It can be for however long you want.  But
> the moment she sees, and it won't take her long, that you are screening
> her to see whether or not she is good enough for you, is the moment
> the tables get turned and she understands that she has to make herself
> look good in your eyes.
> 
> Now contrast this with all the other guys who are trying to make
> themselves look good in her eyes, so they can get on/in her.
> 
> To illustrate what I am saying, picture this: we're in a manhattan bar,
> and there is this gorgeous looking woman, with the greatest face you've
> seen, talking to a few guys.  One happens to be our own great NYC with
> his magnificient weight-lifting body and his "I'm great" attitude; 
> another is Riker with his patterns, a third is Greg19 with his band of
> ways, and so on.  So basically what you would have is a bunch of guys
> trying to find and give this woman what she wants, so as to get on/in
> her.
> 
> Then there's Svengali, with his Carey Grant looks and ways, who sees
> the woman, walks right up into the group and says "excuse me guys, I
> just wanted to ask the lady where she got, and whose idea it was to get
> those earrings that seems to make her skin sparkle and her eyes glow,
> and then I'll leave." [Turning to her] "So please tell me, where did
> you get, and what made you decide [Svengali's hand goes out to the
> earrings, and in the process, lightly touches the lady's neck] to get
> these earrings that seems to make your skin sparkle and your eyes
> glow?"  {She tells me.}  "Thank you."  "Bye guys, I'm going back over
> there [pointing, so the lady knows where I will be]."
> 
> Look what just occurred: (1) I showed I wasn't afraid of a damn thing. 
> (2) I disarmed my opponents.  (3) I made her feel good.  (4) I showed
> her I wasn't about to hang around and try and get her.  {Of course to
> firmly establish that point, I would engage another woman in
> conversation, and have her positioned in a way that the first woman
> would see her with me, which would have her wondering what kind of nice
> things was I saying to her, that she wasn't getting.}.
> 
> Who do you think the woman is likely to be focused on and thinking
> about: all the guys who are there, still trying to get to her, or the
> guy who said what he wanted, made her feel good/great, left, and is now
> focused on someone else?  {I removed one of her feel good sources, so
> even though the others are there, with theirs, she like nearly everyone
> of us, is focused on the one that's been lost, not the ones that are
> present.}
> 
> Show your interest in her, but also show that you are walking the
> moment *she's* not exactly like you want.
> 
> Now I'll play devil's advocate and say that my little "walk away"
> didn't work.  Do you think I care?  Hell no, and I'll tell you why: the
> one who chases to gets, will always have to chase to have.  So whoever
> would win with the woman, would have to keep providing whatever they
> did to keep her interested.  I, on the other hand, only need to use a
> little charm and then walk away to have her wanting me.
> 
> I ask you, who do you think has an easier time of it?
> 
> -- 
> If you don't know in the first twenty minutes whether or not you're going
to
> have sex with the woman you just met, and whether or not you even want
to,
> you're not a seductionist.
> 
>   'o o'
> Svengali
>

Taking control when things go wrong

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Using SOI's (statements of intent) as a tease to attract a chick!


From: Jonathan Ashton 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Clearing SOI's up
Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 07:04:08 GMT

In article ,
> For example, if we were to drop an SOI on the chick, and then
> IMMEDIATELY follow up with a negative command - WE control the
> flirting so that the chick then has to work for US.
>
> So we can say things like "I want to kiss you"
> And then control the flirting by pulling away again with some reverse
> commands :-
> "BUT I don't really know anything about you, and I haven't known you
> for very long, and I need to feel love first"
> Sounds like the stuff that chicks tell us, right? Well chicks say it
> to flirt, as opposed to meaning what they say!

Omigod!  Rio, this is an awesome post!  Brilliant!  Genius!

"I was thinking about kissing you, but you'd probably slobber too
  much."
"I'd love to take you home, but I know you'd get all clingy."
"I'm just trying to guess if you're any good in bed.  Too bad you're
  too young/weird/conservative for me."
"I bet you'd love the way I do neck massages.  You've been acting up
  too much to deserve one, though."

This is so EASY!  Anyone can think these up on the spot!  There's no
need to think up ambiguous sentences or come up with just the right
innuendo.  Just make a Statement of Intentions, then let her know what
SHE has to offer to make it happen - by telling her that you won't do
it because she's not up to par!  I love it!  I will try it out ASAP!

Howcome I've never seen this idea explained before?  In retrospect,
it's clear that MrSex4uNYC and Mystery do similar stuff, but I've
never seen the dynamic explained this way before.  Ross talks about
setting challenges, but it's always seemed like such a delicate art
to say just the right thing at just the right time.

But this is so easy!  Thank you, Rio.

Ash


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

Maniac High's Pick Up Girls Guide and Seduction Website! » mystery

Maniac High — Thu, 20 May 2010 12:22:49 +0000

Buy Reductil No Prescription, From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Mystery and others write about successful openers.

Status: O

talk about esp and its impossibility

talk about how you met a bear while hiking

talk about how you were scared shitless rock climbing when your rope snapped

or talk about the famous person you met

does she believe in ghosts. why, Buy Reductil No Prescription.

or hotseat (like question game but more brutal)

talk about the time you bladed down a steep hill and survived. Buy Reductil No Prescription, talk about the time you were on stage

...

mystery

-----

From nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org Wed Apr 12 07:31:37 2000
From: nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org (Nathan SZILARD)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: After the # close

They find it very funny and show it to their friends, plus
they remember, Buy Reductil No Prescription.

| If you did any anchoring on your voice when you met, order Reductil, Buy Reductil without a prescription, now's the time to
| unleash them.

----

From slidewguy@remove-aol.com Wed Apr 12 07:47:28 2000
From: "whoisthis19"
Subject: Some closes
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast

Any of you guys got ways of getting chicks to leave with you outside
the club.

greg1

Did you sleep with yourself or... did you turn yourself down because
you was too easy.

Doing Successful Openers

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Mystery and others write about successful openers!



From: "Mystery" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast,Alt.psychology.nlp,alt.hypnosis
References: <37602334.55753831@bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Chat suggestions
Date: Wed, 16 Jun 1999 04:58:12 -0700
Lines: 63
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts7-36t-14.idirect.com
Message-ID: <37676655@nemo.idirect.com>
X-Trace: 16 Jun 1999 04:54:45 -0400, ts7-36t-14.idirect.com
Organization: via Internet Direct

Status: O

talk about esp and its impossibility

talk about how you met a bear while hiking

talk about how you were scared shitless rock climbing when your rope snapped

or the time you visited your friends friend with him and your buddy was
almost beaten to death when the friend he visited had a boyfriend who came
out and there was a 20 minute car chase through lights and you were looking
for the cops but lot the crazed boyfriend before you found cops.

or the time you were in the hospital and it changed the way food tastes.
the birds sound clearer now.

or the time you netbused (hacked) into a bank but chickened out and put the
money into a charity

or talk about the famous person you met

does she believe in ghosts?  why?

you like candles and incense.  what does SHE like?  the music game modified
for all types of objects.

play the question game with her

or hotseat (like question game but more brutal)

talk about the time you bladed down a steep hill and survived.

talk about the time you were on stage

...

mystery



-----


From nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org Wed Apr 12 07:31:37 2000
From: nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org (Nathan SZILARD)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: After the # close

On Mon, 03 Apr 2000 21:26:22 GMT, Rio  wrote:
| I was reading elsewhere on a post, that if you instruct her to sound
| cheerful on the phone when you call when you do a # close.

I tried that, it's not a magic bullet. But it's fun.

I now always write some shit along with my phone #:
something like "DO NOT FALL IN LOVE" or "NO STALKING PLEASE".

They find it very funny and show it to their friends, plus
they remember.

| If you did any anchoring on your voice when you met, now's the time to
| unleash them.



----

From slidewguy@remove-aol.com Wed Apr 12 07:47:28 2000
From: "whoisthis19" 
Subject: Some closes
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast

Hand her the slip of paper and pen and have her write down her number.
When she's hands it back, ask her to put it someplace so you will
remeber to call her.  Last time I did this she put it down my pants and
grabbed my cock.  

Ask a gal to trade shirts.  When she balks, keep pressing in a joking
manner then finally ask to her to go outside to trade shirts.  Nothing
better then getting her outside.

Another one is simply saying its too smokey, noisy, smelly in here. 
Lets go outsde for some air.

Any of you guys got ways of getting chicks to leave with you outside
the club?

greg1

Did you sleep with yourself or... did you turn yourself down because
 you was too easy.

A conversation with Mystery! Pickups

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


A conversation with Mystery!

Tips on fieldwork from a pick up artist! on IRC #PUA!


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A Conversation with Mystery, a Pick-up Artist (PUA)

Topics Include: 

The Kiss Close
Clubbing alone
Handling guys
Being a story-teller
Preparation and format
Quality vs. quantity

Lego: Hey Mystery, what's your favorite story to close with?  How 
exactly do you transition from the telling of a story to closing?

Mystery: "The Kiss Close" is my favorite routine.  Once you have three 
indicators of interest (she touches you, laughs consistantly at your 
jokes, leans in towards you, smiles a lot and keeps eye contact, resumes 
chat when you force silence, etc) you then phase shift.  You turn 180 
degrees on a dime.  Go from humorous and non-sexual to saying, "Stop.  
Would you like to kiss me?", right out of the blue.  She will say either 
say, "Uh - no",(which is unlikely as you don't bother performing "The 
Kiss Close" until enough indicators are present) or, "I donno" (they 
rarely say, "Yes"). "I donno" means she actually does want to but feels 
embarrassed on how to say "Yes".  So you reply, "Lets find out", then go 
in slowly and kiss her.  It's very simple and very effective.  If she 
says, "Why?", this is also a yes.  Simply reply, "It looked like you had 
something on your mind.  Would you like to kiss me?"  Wait again for 
her response.  If her response is "No" then reply, "Hey I didn't say you 
COULD.  You just had that look in your eye."

Lego: What do you do if you're interrupted? You're telling your target 
a story and she is all into it but some AFC cock-blocking idiot just 
runs up and starts screaming and yelling and you're like, "What the 
fuck?"

Mystery: Simply ask him if you can borrow his pen.  When he gives it to 
you, throw it away as you say, "Fetch."

Wakeboarder: Hahaha.  Nice!

Lego: What if he's bigger than you?

Mystery: I'd instead call him on his disruptive shit and remark, "Dude, 
what are you attempting here?"  Not good enough?  Then say, "Ladies?  
Shall we discover what adventure awaits us in another room?"

Wakeboarder: Man, none of my buds want to go to the club.

Gamer: Screw them then.

Mystery: Go alone.

Wakeboarder: I need to be made fun of for this comment but I feel like 
a weiner if I go to a club myself

Lego: Bro, your trippin'. I go solo many times. It's good actually.  
It's weird if it's a first night but if I've been there before it's cool.

Mystery: Yeah, I understand ... and yet, staying home alone will make 
you feel so much better?  Go out alone, meet some cool dudes when you 
get there (they will become your wingmen there) and then run around 
getting #'s.  Report to your fellow PUAs what happened.  Whatever happened 
to the concept, "The alphamale gets all the women?"  Shit dude, what are 
you, a mommas boy?  Do you need your hand held?  

Lego: How do you strike up conversations with guys?

Mystery: Walk up and say, "Hey dude, question for ya.  Do you know 
where a good place to score is in this city? 'Cause this place looks like a 
cock farm."

Lego: Good!  You should be able to relate to guys to disarm them.  You 
don't compete; you ELIMINATE COMPETETION.

Gamer: LOL.  Dude, the only results I've had were solo.  My friends 
psych me out too much because they never help.  Instead they just complain 
about my taking too much time.  They laugh at me or just generally piss 
me off.

Mystery: I have MUCH better results (and MUCH more fun) playing "The 
Game" alone.  It forces you to approach.  It's a great motivator.

Lego: Damn! I couldn't have put it better myself.

Gamer: Yep.

Mystery: You wont be alone for more than five minutes once you approach 
your first set anyways.  Gamer, I suggest you call them on their shit 
at some point.  Demonstrate your alphamale characteristics.

Lego: How do you continue talking?  I mean, group set dynamics are much 
different in a one one on one approach.

Mystery: Be a story-teller - THAT is the skill of the PUA.  It isn't 
SEDUCING; it's STORY-TELLING.  It is my personal belief that SS patterns 
arent as 'hypnotic' as they are 'entertaining' stories.

Wakeboarder: Sweet

Lego: Actually with the story stuff I SEE WHAT YOU MEAN.  They just 
follow that lead.

Wakeboarder: Well, I need to stop being a sackless wonder and grow some 
fuckin' balls then!  Hmm, story telling ...

Mystery: Here's an example.  "Ever been camping?  Well I was up in a 
forest up north and was hiking with some girlfriends of mine ... and we 
came along some trail and there was shit on the path.  My friends were 
like, "haaaa someone shit in the woods" and I said, "lets get the fuck 
out of here like NOW."  they thought I was just scared of shit and I 
said, "Girls, you dont get it.  This shit is still warm and its not human.  
Its bear shit.  This is a big fucking bear.  Look at the size of that 
turd."  Notice it's not sexual?  Most hot girls gets get "sex-talk" 
right away from AFCs.  NOT talking sex with them makes them question 
whether you are interested in them.  Leave them guessing until you get 
indicators of interest from them.  If they like your great personality 
(confident, humorous, etc) they will give you subtle but distinct clues.

Gamer: How do you flow from story to story?

Mystery: If there is ONE mental state you should force yourself into, 
its TALKATIVE.  Talk your fucking HEAD off.  Just go from one story 
straight into another one like a comedian does.  Ever find yourself excited 
about something and you talk and talk and talk?  THAT is what must 
happen to get a girl.  You have to ENTERTAIN them.  Look talkative yet not 
desperate.  

Gamer: Heh.

Lego: Dude, I had that going last night. You're so right.  That's an 
excellent example dude.  I was telling this story about getting harassed 
by cops or some shit.  It's a cool story but my delivery sucked and I 
was losing one of the two girls I was telling it to.  What if they fail 
to elaborate on your story?  Besides it being a bad story to begin 
with, how can you fix it on the fly?

Mystery: They don't have to interact with it.  Its a good thing to have 
flexible stories to allow for some comment but it's not nessessary.  
It's YOUR job to perform the material.  It's your audiences job to 
listen,laugh and generally be entertained.  That's it.  At the end of 10 
minutes you will see the girls digging you (positive indicators).  You then 
phase shift abruptly into the close.

Lego: HOW DO YOU PHASE SHIFT?  I've been wondering this. While I didn't 
come off as obvious in last nights case and just told her to kiss me (I 
knew she would anyway), this could have been smoother.

Alpha: Lego, you ad libbed the close?  So working on ad libbing is 
good?

Mystery: Ad libbed material is not as accurate in closing as is 
performing the well constructed and field-tested "Kiss Close" routine.  Ad 
libbing is BONUS material but don't COUNT on it.  Have your material, like 
a good comedian, prepared before performing.  This isn't "A Night at 
the Improv" fellas.

Gamer: Heh.

Mystery: All PUs have a format; a beginning, a middle and an end.  If 
you don't know what the next routine is going to be then you may end up 
with an unfortunate pregnant pause which fucks up your pacing.  You may 
end up filling the silence with the deadly, "So ... um ... what do you 
do?"  Preparation saves face.  Afterall, with your particular close, 
she could have pulled away from your trying to kiss her.  Then what?!!  
Instead, consider engaging her in enthusiastic conversation, then go 
directly into the close.  In other words, stop her in mid-sentence and 
with a curious tone, kiss close.

Wakeboarder: cool.  Lego, what indicators clued you in that she wanted 
the kiss?

Alpha: In what way can you be prepared?  If we're talking about 
story-telling in front of a random girl we just met seconds ago in a random 
place ...

Mystery: Like a good comedian, have your material prepared yet when 
onstage be prepared to dynamically omit certain routines and to add others 
on the fly.  Sometimes certain routines fit the situation better than 
others.  Have 3 to 5 alternative openers (as a comedian would) and enjoy 
performing the one you think best fits the situation will get the best 
reaction for the group you are in front of

Alpha: Gotcha now.  Can you give me a brief example of how you go about 
preparing?

Mystery: Sure.  First, find 3 openers and memorize them.  Write down a 
list of openers (just the headings of each opener to remind you).  
Next, write down some routines (the question game, the music game, the 
photo routine, the bear in the woods story, etc - all on dejanews) and then 
also memorize the kiss close and the # close.  Memorize 3 NEGs too and 
you are good to go.  With the material in your mind, you are prepared 
to work it in the field until you have the timing of the material down 
(again, just like a comedian.)

Alpha: Man, you provide some really eye-opening ideas... (just when I'm 
about to think there's nothing more to learn.

Wakeboarder: So what you're saying is have a routine set up and modify 
it to each situation? Kind of like having a PU template?

Mystery: It's ALL about format.  Know the format and stick to it.  If 
you now what the next step is in the PU, you wont feel scared.  It gets 
fun and you begin to appreciate the strategy behind it all.

Wakeboarder: Yeah like FMAC? That's a simple format.

Mystery: Yes, FMAC.  Each letter in FMAC is an abrupt phase shift.  
"FIND" means having to abruptly disturb your complacency by getting out of 
the house.  It takes effort for many people to do bother getting THIS 
FAR.  "MEET" is a HUGE abrupt change.  "There she is!  3, 2, 1, GO!"  In 
the "ATTRACT" phase, you need to go from the walk up to the TALKATIVE 
performer entertaining story-teller.  You will need A LOT of energy for 
this (enthusiasm is contagious afterall) and for many to go from 
slumping around to being in performer mode is ABRUPT.  Finally you must then 
"CLOSE"; to phase shift from humour to serious is also abrupt.  Each 
phase may FEEL awkward but it looks normal.  When a comedian finishes one 
topic and just goes into an entirely new unrelated topic, the audience 
doesn't care as long as the next topic is entertaining.

Wakeboarder: Very true.

Gamer: Cool.  I'm collecting openers and other routines off the 
layguide right now.

Alpha: Do you believe in the 80/20 'rule'?  Meaning, 80% of the quality 
women are found in 20% of the right places or connections or 
situations.

Mystery: The quality of a woman is SO subjective. Quality is difficult 
to QUANTIFY.  80% of QUALITY?  It's pointless trying to mix and match 
these concepts. INSTEAD consider that there are HOTTIES and UGs (YOU get 
to decide based on your personal criteria) and of the HOTTIES, some 
have pleasant personalities and others do not.  You cannot possibly judge 
her personality until she LIKES you.  So go out ... FIND her, MEET her, 
ATTRACT her and THEN decide if you want to CLOSE her AFTER judging her 
personality.  Judging her by the way she treats you on your approach is 
lame because particularly beautiful women all have their bitch shields 
up and running.  They have to.  They aren't planning on fucking every 
guy that says Hi to them.  The only way to get rid of the guys is to 
oftentimes offend them quickly.  It's not personal.  It's merely a learned 
strategy.  So is the "I have a boyfriend excuse, but that's a different 
story.  I also suggest CLOSING everyone just for the education.  You 
don't actually have to CALL the girls of course.  You simply get to 
practice CLOSING too.  Getting a girls number is merely an OPTION.  You 
don't have to follow up on ALL of them you know.

Keen: Heh.

Wakeboarder: Cool, judging the girls only after you have attracted 
them.  Kind of makes you approach too!  You can't say the bull shit line, 
"She's not my type, I can tell", to get you out of approaching.

Alpha: Do you have a web page?

Mystery: No, not currently.  I'm writing a book though called The 
Mystery Method.  Most of my ramblings can be found on the layguide. 

Ascence: Hey, is it true that the older we get the more money/social 
status becomes and issue?

Mystery: No matter what social status you have (or THINK you have), 
it's still something you must convey in the first 25 minutes of meeting 
her.  We ALL start equal BEFORE meeting her; all men.  The issue is, can 
we congruently convey our social status (real or not) in our 
performance?  That's OUR responsibility.  The best way is not to TELL them about 
it but rather to DEMONSTRATE it.  How?  Well, if you talk about having 
girls always falling for you for instance, it's not NEARLY as good as 
actually having a couple hot girls with you saying what a hottie you are 
infront of the target.  This is called PAWNING.

Keen: I'm going to try doing the story-telling that you talked about.  
It's really hard though. I'm a real bad storyteller.  I've been working 
on it today. that's my lesson today.

Wakeboarder: Tell them about that time you saw a fallen over manequin 
in the department store and you tripped over it.  The security guard 
thought you were trying to make it with the manequin and called you a 
little freak.

Gamer: LOL (Laughing Out Loud).

Wakeboarder: One more question for you Mystery.  What's the meaning of 
life?

Mystery: To fuck. :)

Statement of Intent (SOI)

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Rio introduces a key part of PU: the 'Statement of Intent' (SOI)!

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2000 09:00:50 GMT
Subject: Find Stun Drag Fuck

G'day,

Jonathan Ashton  wrote in message
news:90eati$gpt@nnrp1.deja.com...
> As I've read the twelve-odd messages in this thread, I've been looking
> for something to take home with me, but I'm not finding it.
>
> Rio, how do you do things differently now, based on what you've said?

First thing would be to think about the close. Mystery knows his group work
perfect from how I read it, and I have been using his methods to great
success social-proof wise.

The BIG thing that clocked in my head was the need to STATE YOUR INTENTIONS
to the chick within the first minute of meeting her. I will make that my
rule from now on - as with the 3 second rule.
By this I DON'T mean "Let's fuck" or "Come to Papa baby" or any throw-away
shit like that. It has to be an honest assessment of what YOU feel capable
of doing to the chick after the "Hi" and the first round of fluff/routine
(routine preferred - something humourous). GM does this part BEAUTIFULLY,
because he does it with a sense of fun and humour - and HE KNOWS he is going
to do what he says and so does SHE!
I notice Mr. Sex states this a lot in his past posts - where AFC or shit
PUAs do approaches and talk to the chick, but never get to the point AND the
bitch can tell that the guys want to fuck but are too pussy to go for it.
Ross says something to the tune of "And maybe we could really get to like
each other" when he closes in HTGTWYDIB. I also recall that TokyoPUA did a
statement of intentions on that chick he PUed at night once who was
initially scared of him. Johnny Shack does it by when he just springs dates
on women he just met.
So there's some cross references.

The proper methodological way to get to a statement of intentions part is by
pace and lead. But the point of the matter is, you have to structure the
conversation to show interest and intent VERY soon or you will stall, chick
will get bored, feel teased, and then it's C&B time. Believe me, a LOT of
C&B experience with a LOT of HOT chicks has so far has taught me this
painful lesson.
The best way to put it is in the most honest way possible. I cannot give you
a specific example. But the idea is to get her thinking romantically about
you VERY soon. THEN you HAVE TO DO WHAT YOU SAID you would do to the chick
after DDB. (E.g. If you want to start things off gently by holding her hand,
tell her a scene where want to be holding her hand - and then do it in the
next routine after she is comfortable with this.) If you do NOT DO what you
say you will, eventually your congruence will fuck up when the chick loses
patience. Then the chick will be confused, get scared, and bolt. If this
ever happens and the guy tries to do heavy kino or try for a fuck while the
chick is in this state - It's gonna be RAPE.

In fact, on the matter of Rape. I read in Cosmo (Hey, My chick gets fucked
often and STILL reads this!) that psychologists WARN women against guys that
say "Come to my place to see my pictures" etc. when the idea is to fuck the
chick whilst your intentions aren't known to her - because it is DATE RAPE.
Thus as Maniac found out ages ago, that GROUNDWORK is the key element to
getting the chick over to fuck. That can be done through STATEMENT OF
INTENTIONS - and may not necessarily happen through Kiss closes.
You must remember this - a kiss is just a kiss........

IF that works, THEN we can reward her with more conversation and more
Mystery style routines or whatever (because she is OK with our intentions
then - thus the rewards), and THEN up the ante some more with our STATEMENT
OF INTENTIONS, building on what we established before - to get her more hot
and horny than before. So you may have started on holding her hands, now you
may progress on to hugging, kissing, fucking etc. whatever seems to be the
most logical progression from her actions towards you.

Patterns, routines, psych tests, will help greatly during the chat routines
in-between statements of intentions. Those are what set us apart from the
other PUAs out there.

Eventually we get to a point where the chick is DDB, then we can get to the
Drag (you must take the woman to fuck location, or have her so into you that
she will come to you) and Fuck part (in our world of course). The Our World
routine would then be the ULTIMATE in the STATEMENT OF INTENTIONS series
which would then lead to the deal fuck closed. It is in this one that you
state your relationship expectations and put it in "Our World"

Now the method is Find, Stun, Drag, Fuck.

The point is - FUCK all this bullshit about the woman needs to be done in
the "right way" to match her values. Something tells me now that a woman
made this comment as an attempt to rationalize her unreasonable emotions.
The values she wants ALL ALONG is #1 SEX, and to a lesser extent #2 to be
taken care of after SEX. That goes for ANY woman (thus the universality of
the whole principle). When the guy comes along as does her, she will
rationalise that the guy understood exactly what she felt. That's what some
religious women mean when they beautifully say "God knew when it was the
right time for me". In reality, they KNOW DEEP DOWN they are at the mercy of
guys and what they want to do with her. To her, that is "destiny" and no
wonder so many women are suckers for fortune-telling and the like.

Eliciting is when you want to # close or coffee close and check the girl out
for relationship potential. If it's ONS - hey! ya don't need it! If you
cannot attempt a kiss to fuck close in the given situation - you will have
to # close, but not forget to state that your intentions could well get
beyond just coffee!

The other thing - "Make no excuses for desires as a man" is THE SINGLE MOST
IMPORTANT THING (As Ross Jeffries has already said) but I had to experience
it myself to believe it. ALL of what I explained above IS USELESS in
practical application if you are trying to follow it like a script. The idea
is to GRAB that girl and NOT let her get away! ;) So guys, HOW MUCH DO YOU
WANT THAT GIRL? WHAT ARE YOU PREPARED TO DO?

Also on that note. BE A FUCKING MAN. Act like a guy, and don't think that
mirroring a girl completely is going to make you attractive to her. I know
from experience that the more caveman I go with chicks who KNOW my
intentions, the more they respond sexually.
Talk to chicks as if you were telling your kid brother how to play football
properly, cause your kid brother happens to be shit at football. I
especially like the way Mr. Sex talks to us on ASF - giving pointers and
what-not. I'm sure he talks to chicks exactly the same way IRL - showing
congruence all along.

You can even get around the language barrier! I just about dragged a sexy
Jgirl in a bikini off the beach while babbling to them in English! A
language they didn't even understand! I did that enough and with a smile,
that the chick went DDB and ready to GO when I took her hand. Had it not
been for the cockblock!
Somebody must have taught the "Iranian from hell" this shit!

The way I think about it is much like caveman sex. You see the hot chick,
you bang her on the head with your club, you take her to your cave, you root
her. Thus :- Find Stun Drag Fuck.
Just a bit more aggressive than Find Meet Attract Close, but that's the best
way I could describe what this ugly-as-fuck PUA was doing.

These were the attitudes that I had when I was only just starting to pull
women at incredible speeds while on holiday.

The other point is on Objection handling in regards to the STATEMENT OF
INTENTIONS. What I learned from the PUA I met, is that you fight chick
bullshit with your own bullshit - with a slightly authoritive tone (no need
to REALLY get pissed).
For example :- The chicks said "We have to get to our car" and were ready to
leave
The Playboy said "You can't leave anyway because the gates are closed" even
though the gates aren't closed.
Thus this covers handling chick bullshit - on the phone as well as in real
life.
And one chick on another seduction board I read often typed something to the
tune that she wants to be with a guy that can bullshit his way into her
pants.

So there you go. Find Stun Drag Fuck.
Stun is the hardest.

> There are reasons why most of us step through seduction so gingerly.
> We know that saying or doing one wrong thing can blow up the seduction.
> As far as I can tell, letting her know you intend to fuck her before
> you fuck her is one of those things.  Another reason is that women
> won't tell you when they're ready to fuck.

But DDB does tell all!
That single most common fuckup is what is called LACK OF CONGRUENCE
(definition courtesy of Mr. Sex). Just like when I called that chick I met
yesterday "my friend" in front of her. Doing that is a sign of weakness.
Chicks can get away with having words out of congruence with their actions,
but guys CANNOT.

> You say that when you "lead girls on" and tease them too much, you look
> easy and they hate you.  But this insight doesn't make it any easier to
> recognize when you're "leading them on".  The window between when a
> woman is receptive to a close and when you've stalled her is short, and
> spotting it seems to be harder than superstring theory.  The answer
> seems to be to make hundreds of approaches, and very slowly improve
> through experience.

Well you have body language and other subtle pointers. Plus we are adding
all the time to our STATEMENT OF INTENTIONS in order to find a barrier and
cut off point. I don't doubt that noticing DDB when you have the intuition
becomes easier.

  The one concrete thing I get out of your post is
> that next time two HBs want a foursome with you and your LTR, you'll be
> more likely to recognize it.  Or maybe the situation will be different
> enough that you won't.

I fucked that up because I KNOW those chicks wanted me to go with them, and
I over-teased them and didn't capitulate and then state my intentions to
have a foursome. They would have been up for it!
That's when the Playboy showed up to show me the shit, and then beat me
hands-down in a round of THE GAME. ;)

> You also said, "Now I realise more than fucking EVER what a chick
> wants. She wants a guy to go and GET her, make her feel wanted, and
> then have the shit fucked out of her!"  But you agreed with another
> poster that you can't just walk up to a woman and say "Let's fuck."
> So what's your new insight here?

It's a no-brainer. Is sex ALL you bringing to the table? That's why he
coupled GM styled intention pointers further into the seduction (after the
earlier G-rated ones), and then when they succeeded in not objecting, he
went to Mystery routines as a reward OR to the Drag phase if they were DDB.
You cannot start the seduction with a statement of intention that skips the
buildup - unless the chick is THAT FUCKING HORNY and shameless.
Chicks want to know that you care about them as human beings and not just
sex objects. Thus neutral conversation gets smattered in between, and the
final statement of intentions clearly shows what his intentions are so SHE
KNOWS that you care about her feelings - in that way.

The Playboy I met even went to see a chick he had a threesome with the next
day (cause she was feeling a bit alone). This guy was no cheap "Player"
(which he pointed out in his great Our world styled close routine on this
9). You could tell he cared enough too.

> Have you figure out a better way to know when a woman is ready to
> be closed?  Or a faster way to get her to want to fuck?  Or a way to
> let her know your intentions without scaring her off?  What's the
> difference between your approach now and your approach before you went
> to Guam?  It sounds like you feel you understand things better than
> you did before, but I can't figure out what the new understanding is.

Well, now you have your answer.
Mind you, I'm only getting the framework now that I sit down and try and
explain what I am now doing. This shit became automatic when I had the whole
experience of witnessing this guy and learning from him.

Any questions or comments? Fire away....

Rio
-------

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
References:  <90eati$gpt@nnrp1.deja.com> <63JW5.205t1.56373@nnrp.gol.com> <90i82p$iao@nnrp1.deja.com>
Subject: Re: Find Stun Drag Fuck

Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2000 10:04:46 GMT

Jonathan Ashton  wrote in message
news:90i82p$iao@nnrp1.deja.com...
> In article <63JW5.205t1.56373@nnrp.gol.com>,
>   "Rio"  wrote:
> > Well, now you have your answer.
>
> Yeah, I understand much better now.  Thanks for writing it down.
>
> > Any questions or comments? Fire away....
>
> So I get the abstract idea now:  Make some sort of Statement Of
> Intentions (SOI) to a woman relatively early, and then act congruently
> with it.

More or less, that's it.
The thing is, after dropping routines - get to it or the chick gets confused
and drops out.
Mystery had the right idea with his routines and intros. BUT if you fail to
State your intentions - you can stall things and stale her out. Then it will
be your fault when it appears that the routines don't work! They may have
worked, but she has given up on you as a partner already. You teased too
much.

> Like most people, though, I don't really understand any abstract idea
> until I've seen two or three concrete examples; i.e. HOW to make that
> SOI.

Ross Jeffries has already covered how to do this with his NLP pacing and
leading. I'm just giving a name to the end result of doing that (SOI -
Statement of Intention).

SOIs are SO important to women. They want to know where they stand. Women
you are with and haven't SOIed will think to themselves :- "What am I to
him"?
With my LTR which I sloppily SOIed, she annoyed me for ages if I was her
boyfriend or not. I hadn't said, and was therefore walking thin ice.
That drove her NUTS.

Now, I guess I could show you some fake examples of stuff that you could
launch into your PU - but the reason why I'm not going to do that is because
if ANYBODY creates a list of them - we're going to get the problem that AFC
men ALREADY have with PU Lines. That is, throwing meaningless words into a
conversation and then not being able to back them up.
Either that, or we will develop a single street pickup routine which men
will use the world over with great success before women cotton on to it.
When it comes to SOI, DIY (damn all these acronymns!).

An example of SOI is what I said to the chick I tried to PU on the weekend.
I paced it to the point where we are talking about where we lived, and I
found out that she lived close. Then I said "That's good, so we can get
together really easy and have some fun then."
If she had been far away - no problem "That's too bad. I'll have to travel
far to get together with you and have fun"
If she lives on Mars - no problem "Wow! You live out there! I'll have to
build a rocket to come and see you after you go back there!"

So there you go. Who needs to be excessively GM?

> You gave the example of GM style.  Yep, GM makes a pretty clear SOI.
> I don't think a "recovering nice guy" like me could do GM congruently,
> though.

I have done it once successfully and it Suuure works. But yes, it's hard to
work things up to that because you skip a lot of buildup steps. The flirting
has to take place in a sexual level rather than a much safer level. That is
risky.
That's what I mean when by saying "Let's Fuck" you run the risk of having to
flirt at such a high level where you can fuck up easily. Not that it's
impossible of course.
NEGs (which I forgot to mention before) help especially in the
objection,flirt phase. This phase is like the part where the dog chases
after the bitch to try and fuck her, and the bitch keeps running. The thrill
of the chase!

> You mention TokyoPUA and Johnny Shack references, but it would take
> a lot of searching/guessing to find the specific examples you have in
> mind.  And I don't understand your Ross example - "And maybe we could
> really get to like each other" sounds like a pretty vague SOI; maybe
> I'd understand what you mean if I knew the context?

Search for stuff on the archived layguide for stuff about Johnny Shack. He
also has an online book. Ross has his old free book around the place. Search
Formhandle for TokyoPUA's posts.
By the way, I even went as far as reading ALL of Mystery's decent posts as
well.

> The only example of an SOI I see in your posts is this one from Guam
> PUA:
>
> > As for going for the fuck close? Forget your sexual accelerators.
> > This guy said the whole shit in plain English - and I saw him say
> > this all to to a chick. He basically said that he was a playboy, but
> > not a pickup artist (to frame the idea that he won't fuck and dump),
> > and that when he had sex with the chick (Framing it as if it's going
> > to happen) that she should just enjoy it for fun and not worry about
> > it too much because it's just their private thing (our world style
> > routine), and that he was not an easy guy in reality - that he was
> > quite selective in who he chooses for sex (so he doesn't look like a
> > meat-market man).
> > He said all this straight faced to a chick, and while I was watching
> > the chick he did this on - she was trancing out and playing with her
> > hair. It was totally evil.
>
> So my questions...
>
> Have you ever done a SOI to kiss a girl and not had her object?  If so,
> what did you say?  Have you ever done a SOI to fuck a girl and not had
> her object?  If so, what did you say?  Hell, do you remember the exact
> words of any SOI you've ever said?

I gave you an example above of an SOI above (where I told the chick that we
would hang out in the future). No doubt we can refine the whole shit a lot
better in the future.
And yes. I think everyone at some stage has done an SOI, or the body
language has been good enough to get her into that zone where she KNOWS
maybe at 70% where your intentions are, with or without any routines to help
snag the chick, and the chick has put up some token resistance. The purpose
of the resistance of course, is to set the scene for the chase you know will
end in a fuck if you can just reel the bitch in. You will eventually do it
as long as you have remained congruent throughout.

> What other kinds of SOIs would you use in the buildup?  Tell her you're
> going to give her a neck massage?  (I'm sure that question sounds
> clueless; but I really think the meat is in the details.)

Well pace it:-
"Have you ever felt like having a neck massage? I think you need one, so
I'll give you one"
Sometimes the more direct your SOIs are, the harder she will force you to
keep pushing them.
So let's say the chick flirts and says "Why do you want to? I don't need
one!"
So we have to SOI her again in the second sentence in this example :- "Well
you haven't had one of my massages that can make you feel good all over. Now
relax....."

The idea is to trap the chick at all costs with your intentions that you can
carry out - until she can't get away.
Even "No I can't!" "Yes you can!" "No I can't!" "Yes you can!" fights - if
that's what it comes down to - can win you the day if you persist and not
let her win! Verbal arguments can always be solved with kino - cause you as
the guy are STRONGER. I don't mean hit her, but mauling is OK as long as she
is enjoying it! ;)

Persistance is VERY important. Of course, you may want to dump the chick
after the fuck if she doesn't drop the shit because she is too much work to
obtain sex from in the long run. Just give her an ultimatum "Cut the shit or
you will be lonely!"

At the same time, you can get trapped if you say an SOI that you can't
possibly keep. So watch what you promise to do!
Saying shit like "I'm going to buy you a Rolls Royce!" when she KNOWS you
can't afford it is an extreme example of a shit SOI. There goes your trust
and congruency with that one.

> And as for one other comment you made:
>
> > (E.g. If you want to start things off gently by holding her hand,
> > tell her a scene where want to be holding her hand - and then do it
> > in the next routine after she is comfortable with this.)
>
> You mean you tell her a story about some guy you know who held some
> girl's hand?  Or what?  Methinks I really don't understand here.

You can do that to get her thinking about holding someone's hand - and once
she is feeling it, you may be able to slip in the kino and get away with it.
At least, your chances will be better.

> > Is sex ALL you bringing to the table? That's why he
> > coupled GM styled intention pointers further into the seduction
> > (after the earlier G-rated ones), and then when they succeeded in
> > not objecting, he went to Mystery routines as a reward OR to the
> > Drag phase if they were DDB.
>
> I would LOVE to see these SOIs written down.

Done as above. But make your own!
I re-explained the "Let's Fuck" problem a bit better above as well.

> So here's my deal:  I want to see more examples of SOIs so I can take
> them apart, because I really suspect that the exact wording is crucial.
>
> For example:
>
> GM gets away with his SOIs because they're exaggerated to absurdity,
> and thus they're both funny and unlikely (at least as stated).
> This puts a little distance between the SOI and the girl, so she
> doesn't slap him.

I think it's more of a case of the GM SOIs that fail, he can write them off
as being jokes. That keeps him on track and congruent.
BUT the risk of failure is very high if he doesn't cover his tracks.

> Guam PUA gets away with his SOI (quoted above) because he's talking
> about chicks in general, and not overtly about the particular chick.
> This puts a little distance between the SOI and the girl, so she's
> not pressured to make a decision right then.

This is the all important point. With some SOIs (and especially with
ambiguities in NLP) the SOIs are not in your face, BUT they are vague enough
to get the point across and then judge for a positive reaction from her or
not. However, the vagueness is simply a shot from 50 metres as opposed to a
shot from point-blank. Just make sure you hit the target.
The danger with point-blank SOIs is they are risky in so far as if you say a
dumb one you can't,won't, or don't want to carry out like "I'm going to take
you on holiday!" as opposed to an NLP shot from 50 metres which describes a
holiday and builds on it. "Have you ever been on holiday with someone
special?....."

> Am I on the right track here?  Are there other ways to word SOIs that
> get around direct resistance?  More examples would be appreciated.

You should check out patterning, but remember, a shot from point-blank is
better than 50 metres. The shortest distance between 2 points is a straight
line. There are pros and cons of both styles of course.
You can take the short path across the dangerous ravine, or the long path
around it.

> I gotta say, this whole idea of SOIs is new to me.  Maybe other PUAs
> in this group have been using them without ever realizing/stating the
> importance of them?

I just gave a name to it. People have done this stuff before and I'm just
giving it a name to help explain what I'm doing.

And no, Ray can't trademark this either and claim it's his. We have
discussed why this is enough on ASF. He's filtered anyway and I can't see
his verbal shit.

> Thanks,
> Ash

Thanks for the questions. They help challenge me in trying to explain myself
better.

Rio

-------

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Clearing SOI's up
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 12:15:23 GMT

Maniac,

I came up with the SOI concept after studying what the Guam Playboy did to
chicks. I wish I could have spent longer down there to learn more off this
guy. Oh well, I just need to save up to go again.

SOI (Statements of intention/interest) were comments that the Guam Playboy
made a lot (I assume you read my report on that place - It's nanpa
paradise!). What he did then was control the flirting that followed after
baiting her with a show of interest. He did this by offering a challenge -
when he finished doing that once he went back to fun routines, talking about
parties on the island, jokes, sex personality tests, etc. before he did
another SOI - staring out as indirect and ambiguous, before being VERY
direct. ;)

Basically what I think I have come up with, through trying to explain to the
posters that asked me about him, is a flirting construction kit.

The Guam Playboy NEGged a LOT - and he got away with it every time. He could
even tell chicks AFC things like they were beautiful, and then turn it into
a NEG if he wanted. That's what over 20 years of daily PU did for this guy.

But the NEG is only one kind of flirting (used for dumping a girl's uptight
self image). There are other kinds, such as using ambiguities, physical
light-handed slapping and pushing kino, playing tricks on people, etc. The
Playboy used plenty of variations.

Flirting is this:- One drops the SOI, and then pulls it away out of reach of
the target. Then gives another SOI, and then pulls it away again. Like with
our words, we put images of sex and romance in their heads, then pull it out
again, then out it in, then take it out, then put it back in, then take it
out again........ Mindfucking!
Once the chick is confused and teased enough, she is DDB and safely
mindfucked.

I did a PU once on a chick using the SOIs. I found out where she lived and
then said "Oh that's not far from my place, so I can come down to see you.
It's a pity I am so busy it won't happen today"
(Note that there is a bit of future pacing and presuppositioning in this)
She lapped it up and took my kino from there - despite the BF being a matter
of metres away.

The structure for the Guam Playboy routine went like this:-

- Fun routine or opener (ala Mystery) - some basic fluff - all good things
about himself, what he could do for the women (he played the helpful tour
guide). Be "Disgustingly" Charming! as he put it. The guy wasn't big on
logically drawing out routines for what he did (which is a good thing), he
just went and DID this.... thus he couldn't really explain to me what he was
doing. I had to observe.
- SOI. He said something that hinted that he was interested in the chick
(paced and lead from his opener conversation). This got her emotions going
and her ideas racing. I have found this CRITICAL if the chick is going to
stay interested in you for too long. I bored many chicks out initially when
I wouldn't get to the point.
"What do you look for in guys?" would be sufficient enough as a question to
hint at what you are after (as you have found out yourself Maniac). Starting
off on a topic about guys and relationships usually brings chicks out, but
asking "Do you have a BF?" sucks.
This Ross Jeffries inspired SOI "The more you laugh, the more you'll be
attracted to interesting people......now with me" is an ambiguous SOI.
- Before she could knock him down for any comment, he would then be a
challenge and say something like "I'm not easy", "we don't know each other
well enough yet", "but what would I know, right? ;)","I need to feel passion
first", "Yeah, you know what I'm saying". These basically FORCE the chick to
continue the flirting (initiated by the SOI) along the lines that HE wanted
(and the lines that chicks SAY they want!).
By saying that he "needed time" and "not being easy", the chick already
attracted to him would then come onto him.

Most of the time the chicks would laugh becuase they'd get stuck for a smart
comeback. And he just kept this up, alternating back to party and fun
routines, until he got to the "sex-SOI-Our World-But I'm no sleaze"routine
which would then DDB the target to fuck - or get her ready for it next time
they met.
Negative commands also work great here to spark challenge. Just like I did
with my now LJBF ex-LTR "I'm not going to fuck you".

I've noted in my past failures (too many to count) that when I have dropped
SOI hints - the chicks have taken the flirting into areas which were
impossible for me to control - fucking me up and making me look stupid.
Especially in clubs where chicks do this like child's play to anyone who
"hits" on them. They use their irrational chick logic to fuck themselves
(and you) up. If that happens, your PU is history.
We can't give the women control, especially not in flirting, because they
aren't the ones that are trying to do PU. It's their job as "virtuous" women
to try and get away from PU, or try to fuck our PU up.

Svengali also said in his MLTR theory something which rings home on this. He
said (and I quote):-

"Seventh: If you don't give a woman something to be pissed about every
now and then, she'll find something on her own, and that will be harder
to get out of (because it will be of her making and criteria, not
yours)."

That is also the point of what we should be doing in flirting. To trap the
chick into going along with what your flirting and accepting your advances
(by means of non-objection) while getting her horny at the same time. That
way we avoid snappy comebacks because you've already "Handled her objections
before they came up" (That's something I learnt as a salesman)
This causes the chick to have her token resistance stall out - and puts us
in control.
GM does this with his sex jokes, but he slams any possible retort with "Just
Kidding" thus the chick can't say anything and the flirting goes by GMs
rules and not hers.

Take Mystery's "Nice nails" NEG for example.
He starts off with an SOI "Nice nails". This in and of itself is a
compliment. If he stopped here, the chick would come back (if she were a
bitch) with some smart ass comment to get rid of Mystery.

BUT, he then puts up the CHALLENGE before she gets a chance to reply (like
GM with "Just kidding"). Seemingly innocent too. "Are they real?"

Now the chick is stuck. What's going on? He's complimented me, and now he's
knocking me down! What is he doing? I must stick around for this! What can I
say? Maybe I'll just laugh it off...!? er..?
(Note, some REAL bitches when stalled will look angry at you and say "Huh?"
to which it's GM to the rescue! with "Hide your pleasure!")

So, couple this kind of flirting with lots of things to get her feeling
horny (patterns, sex talk, whatever), and add lots of personality conveying
things thrown in for good measure - and the chick is sufficiently stunned -
and ready for the drag and fuck stage.

Oh, and the Guam Playboy is an ugly fucker. Kipp's seen the pictures.
Looks don't matter for shit. I have great respect for all the older PUAs.

I must get up to Tokyo to see you guys real soon. The inaka sucks.
We can experiment with this some more then. I've been getting rusty since I
got back from Guam.
What I do know is that when this guy's method does work, it is KILLER. We
get Mr. Smooth status and KCs like crazy.

Rio
-------
Dictate the flirting

 wrote in message news:91f5e8$dpn@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Re: SOI's
>
> Rio..
>
> You are on to something big here..
> This is a discovery!
> I will incorporate this.
>
> Please give more specific examples though. I get
> what you are saying, but not yet really how you would
> apply it. .
>
>
> Fucking excellent thread!
>
>
> Maniac
> http://www.pickupguide.com
>
>
> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/

---

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: More on SOIs
Date: Fri, 22 Dec 2000 06:17:41 GMT

THIS IS RIO TYPING IN CAPS. I'M NOT YELLING!

Comments in text below.
After New years, I WILL be ready, and we will hit
the streets.

GREAT. I HAVEN'T BEEN DOING MUCH PU UNTIL YESTERDAY (1 SOLID # FROM A 9 AND
A KC FROM ANOTHER 9) - THUS THIS POST AS I TEST OUT MY THEORY. I HAVE A
FRIEND WHO WOULD LIKE TO COME ALONG. HE'S ALREADY BRIEFED AND VERY
EXPERIENCED IN SCREWING WOMEN IN JAPAN. HE'S READ THE PICKUP GUIDE ALREADY.
HE'S EVEN BEEN SO KIND TO INTRODUCE ME TO SOME WOMEN WHO WANT MERCY FUCKS.
HE ALSO KNOWS SOME GOOD "hole in the wall" PLACES AROUND RAPPONGI WITH LOTS
OF WOMEN (SO HE SAYS).

BTW, Rio; re: 'nomad' player.. mine was fucked up, returned
it for an exchange, new one works..

IT'S SURE BEATS A TAPE RECORDER, DOESN'T IT?

First, this is brilliant material, it is going on the
website, and is core to successful PU I think. It IS what
smooth was doing.. I couldnt identify it, but now it has
been named, and described, I recognize this.. and yes, it
will be TOTALLY lethal..

THANKS. EVERY SUCCESSFUL PUA HAS BEEN DOING SOMETHING LIKE THIS (OF ONE
STYLE OR ANOTHER) TO BED WOMEN. I WENT OUT AND USED THIS FRAME YESTERDAY
WITH INTERESTING AND POSITIVE RESULTS.....

HOWEVER, I MUST SAY IT'S HARD TO GIVE SPECIFIC EXAMPLES UNLESS THEY ARE
SITUATIONALLY BASED. FOLLOWING THE LOGIC HOWEVER, AND USING IT GIVEN THE
SITUATION STILL BRING RESULTS. I WILL DESCRIBE SOME OF WHAT I HAVE BEEN
DOING WITH IT, BUT I CAN'T REMEMBER FOR THE LIFE OF ME WHAT EXACTLY THE GUAM
GUY SAID. (I ONLY RECORDED A SMALL SAMPLE OF OUR CHAT WITH MY MP3 PLAYER.
NONE OF HIS NANPA HOWEVER) WHAT I DO KNOW, IS THAT HE FOLLOWED THIS
STRUCTURE WHICH I HAVE DESCRIBED TO VERY SOME GOOD EFFECTS.

I ASSUME YOU READ MY ORIGINAL STORY ON THE GUAM TRIP.
IF SO, MY REPLY WILL MAKE MORE SENSE.

In article ,
  "Rio"  wrote:
> He did this by offering a challenge -
> when he finished doing that once he went back to fun routines,
talking about

Examples? ?

OK, HE MADE SOME KIND OF COMPLIMENT OR SUGGESTED SOME KIND OF ACTIVITY
(OFTENTIMES WITH SEXUAL OR ROMANTIC UNDERTONES) THAT THEY COULD DO TOGETHER.
(LIKE HANG TIGHT TO EACH OTHER OF THE JET POWERED BANANA BOAT) AND THEN
FOLLOWED THAT WITH A REASON WHY HE WOULD HAVE TROUBLE DOING IT. KINDA LIKE
IN SALES, A SALESMAN WOULD SAY "FOR ONE DAY ONLY SALE", WELL HE WAS LIKE "SO
YOU SHOW UP AT SUCH AND SUCH A TIME, OTHERWISE I WON'T BE ABLE TO SHOW YOU A
GOOD TIME AND I'LL TAKE SOMEONE ELSE" (a takeaway)
SO IN ORDER TO CONTINUE THE FLIRTING, THE CHICK WOULD HAVE TO SHOW UP. HE
WOULD THEN (AFTER HAVING COMPLETED A SOI ROUTINE) SIT BACK AND WATCH THE
CHICK FOLLOW THROUGH. HE WOULD OFTENTIMES BE ABLE TO CONTINUE A CONVERSATION
WITHOUT STALLING - AND MIDWAY HE WOULD SOI HER AGAIN AND DO THE SAME ROUTINE
WITH SOMETHING ELSE. I NEVER SAW HIM GET IT ON WITHIN 20 MINUTES, BUT I SAW
WHAT HE DID TO THE CHICK WITH THIS ROUTINE AND I COULD TELL THAT HE COULD
HAVE IF HE WANTED TO. HE DIDN'T LOOK DESPERATE AT ALL.

> parties on the island, jokes, sex personality tests, etc. before he
did
> another SOI - staring out as indirect and ambiguous, before being VERY
> direct. ;)

Examples ? ?

THIS GUY HAD A STRONG ELEMENT OF GM. THE SEX PERSONALITY TEST IS DOCUMENTED
IN MY POST ON THIS GUY (IT'S ABOUT ICE CREAM) - BUT AFTERWARDS UNLIKE GM, NO
COMMENT OF "JUST KIDDING". HE WOULD THEN SAY SOMETHING ELSE TO DISTRACT
ATTENTION OR PLAY "PRETEND AFC" LIKE "BUT I'M NOT EASY" OR "BUT I DON'T KNOW
YOU THAT WELL"
ALL THE MEANWHILE, GETTING THE CHICK HORNY AND CREATING A CHALLENGE.

> Basically what I think I have come up with, through trying to explain
to the
> posters that asked me about him, is a flirting construction kit.

Examples ? ?

MANIAC, YOU'RE STARTING TO OVERUSE CUT AND PASTE LIKE NYC WHEN HE RIPS APART
AFCS WITH THESE "EXAMPLES??" COMMENTS.........

(QUOTE NYC)
"YOU ARE BEING USED. SHE DOESN'T GIVE A SHIT ABOUT YOU. SHE DOESN'T INTEND
TO FUCK YOU. SHE IS FUCKING OTHER MEN THAT SHE FINDS SEXUALLY ATTRACTIVE.
YOU ARE FOOTING THE BILL FOR HER INTERNATIONAL WHORING. STOP."

HA HA HA ;)

> The Guam Playboy NEGged a LOT - and he got away with it every time.

Such as ? ?

WISH I COULD REMEMBER NOW. BUT WHAT I DID SEE IS HIM COMPLIMENTING LOTS OF
JAP CHICKS AND NOT GETTING ANY NASTY REACTION BACK FROM THEM - BECAUSE THEY
WERE SO SHY AND INEXPERIENCED. SO THE CHICKS JUST LAUGHED BECAUSE THEY HAD
NO BITCH SHIELD OF ANY TYPE.
WHERE HE DID ENCOUNTER A SHIELD, HE WOULD ATTACK HER "NASTY" PERSONALITY -
AND HER LACK OF ABILITY TO BE GRACEFUL WITH COMPLIMENTS.

IN THAT SENSE, HE WOULD ALWAYS SIZE THE CHICK UP AS IF HE WAS LOOKING FOR
LTR POTENTIAL (but we know of course, that LTR was never the plan)

He could
> even tell chicks AFC things like they were beautiful, and then turn
it into
> a NEG if he wanted. That's what over 20 years of daily PU did for
this guy.

Examples ? ?

"YOU'RE REALLY CUTE....(pause to check response)... BUT I DON'T KNOW
ANYTHING ABOUT YOU. (SAID NEGATIVELY OR NOT DEPENDING ON HER RESPONSE). SO
WHO ARE YOU ANYWAY?"

> But the NEG is only one kind of flirting (used for dumping a girl's
uptight
> self image). There are other kinds, such as using ambiguities,
physical
> light-handed slapping and pushing kino, playing tricks on people,
etc.

Such as ? ?

I'VE STOPPED USING KINO IMMIDIATELY NOW, AND SAVING IT FOR WHEN I'VE LANDED
AN SOI ROUTINE AND CAUGHT THE CHICK OUT. WHEN SHE HAS LAUGHED, I SLAP HER
GENTLY.
IT'S ANCHORING.

AS FOR TRICKS ON PEOPLE.... STUPID ONES. I WILL HAVE TO SHOW YOU THEM IN
PERSON.

The
> Playboy used plenty of variations.

Like what ? ?

GIVEN THE SITUATION, HE WOULD TRY DIFFERENT WAYS TO GET HER THINKING
ROMANTICALLY ABOUT BOTH OF THEM TOGETHER. HE WOULD USE WHATEVER WAS IN HIS
SURROUNDINGS, OR THE TOPIC OF CONVERSATION, TO PACE AND LEAD THE CHICK INTO
IMAGINING SUCH A SCENARIO.
THEN HE WOULD YANK IT AWAY BY GIVING SOME KIND OF EXCUSE (LIKE HE WAS BUSY,
HE DIDN'T THINK SHE COULD DO IT) OR HE WOULD PLAY AFC (I DON'T KNOW YOU, I
NEED TO BE IN LOVE FIRST, I'M NOT EASY, I'M NOT A PLAYER, I NEED TIME, I AM
REALLY PICKY, I HAVE BEEN HURT BEFORE, I HAVE A GF)

> Flirting is this:- One drops the SOI, and then pulls it away out of
reach of
> the target.

For example ? ?

I REALLY FEEL VERY CLOSE TO YOU, BUT I NEED TIME.

THE MAGIC WORD IS but

 Then gives another SOI, and then pulls it away again. Like with
> our words, we put images of sex and romance in their heads, then pull
it out

Like ? ?

HIS BRAVEST SOI WAS THE ONE WHERE HE SAID STRAIGHT OUT THAT HE WAS GOING TO
FUCK A CHICK. I WITNESSED THE WHOLE THING. HE SAID THAT HE WAS GOING TO FUCK
HER but (AND THEN HE WENT PRETEND AFC) I'M VERY PICKY, I'M NOT A PUA
BECAUSE THOSE GUYS TEASE WOMEN WITH BULLSHIT, MAKE EMPTY PROMISES, FUCK
THEM, AND THEN DUMP THEM. I AM A PLAYBOY. I LOVE WOMEN AND I DON'T WANT YOU
TO GET TOO ATTACHED TO ME AFTER WE HAVE SEX.

> again, then out it in, then take it out, then put it back in, then
take it
> out again........ Mindfucking!

Example please . .

OK, ANOTHER ONE:-   I WANT TO KISS YOU, BUT SOMEHOW I DON'T THINK YOU LIKE
KISSING.
(btw - this would be an SOI fairly advanced in conversation)
NOTE ALSO THAT THERE'S AN EMBEDDED COMMAND IN THE 2ND PART OF THE ROUTINE.
THAT BEING "YOU LIKE KISSING"
EVIL ISN'T IT?

> Once the chick is confused and teased enough, she is DDB and safely
> mindfucked.

how? describe this. . what exactly did he do?

WELL, THE CHICK THAT HE SAID THE "I'M GOING TO FUCK YOU" SPEECH TO, JUST
STARTED DOING ALL THE TRADEMARK BODYLANGUAGE. SHE JUST SAT THERE STUNNED
AND PLAYED WITH HER HAIR. LIKE A RABBIT LOOKING INTO BRIGHT LIGHTS. THE GUAM
GUY SAID ALL OF IT WITH A SERIOUS FACE TOO, SO SHE COULDN'T LAUGH OFF WHAT
HE WAS SAYING.

THE WAY HE WORKED DIDN'T SEEM TO BE ONE OF "ATTRACTION" PER SE. HE WOULD
EVENTUALLY CORNER THE CHICK AND FLIRT WITH HER UNTIL SHE COULD TAKE NO MORE.
UNTIL SHE GOT STUNNED

> I did a PU once on a chick using the SOIs. I found out where she
lived and
> then said "Oh that's not far from my place, so I can come down to see
you.
> It's a pity I am so busy it won't happen today"

This is good. .

THAT'S A REAL LIFE EXAMPLE OF WHAT THE WHOLE THEORY IS ABOUT. MORE
IMPORTANTLY IS THAT IT WORKED.

> (Note that there is a bit of future pacing and presuppositioning in
this)
> She lapped it up and took my kino from there - despite the BF being a
matter
> of metres away.
>
> The structure for the Guam Playboy routine went like this:-
>
> - Fun routine or opener (ala Mystery) - some basic fluff - all good
things
> about himself, what he could do for the women (he played the helpful
tour

Examples ? ?

READ SOME OF MYSTERY'S OPENERS!
TYPICALLY OFF THE WALL STUFF. WELL, WHEN HE WAS TALKING ABOUT GUAM'S CULTURE
AND PARTIES AND STUFF - FOR ALL THE TOURISTS, ALL THIS NEW INFO TO THEM IS
PRETTY OFF THE WALL.
HE WOULD TELL THE CHICKS ABOUT SOME PARTY WHERE THEY WOULD DIG A HUGE PIT
AND THROW ANIMALS ON IT IN A BIG FEAST WITH A BONFIRE AND DANCING - AND THEN
BRANCHED OUT AND TALKED ABOUT DANCING AND OTHER EXOTIC/EROTIC STUFF.

> guide). Be "Disgustingly" Charming! as he put it. The guy wasn't big
on

Like ? ?

THOSE WERE HIS EXACT WORDS. HE RELIED ON GM A LOT IN THE LATTER PART OF HIS
SEDUCTIONS.

> logically drawing out routines for what he did (which is a good
thing), he
> just went and DID this.... thus he couldn't really explain to me what
he was
> doing. I had to observe.

Yep, he's got experience.. I rarely consciously follow ManiacPlan
anymore.. just it spews out naturally.. learning PU is like learning
a foreign language/lingo.. once you get it, its natural..

I'VE BEEN LEARNING TO PLAY AFC IN MY SEDUCTIONS, AND IT HAS BEEN WORKING
REALLY WELL!

> - SOI. He said something that hinted that he was interested in the
chick
> (paced and lead from his opener conversation). This got her emotions
going

Example?  How?

OK, ANOTHER ONE.

"WOULDN'T IT BE GREAT TO SPEND TIME TOGETHER OVER COFFEE? IT'S SUCH A PITY I
HAVE TO GO TO SOME MEETINGS LATER ON, SO WE WILL PROBABLY HAVE NO TIME TO
SEE EACH OTHER EVER AGAIN BEFORE YOU GO BACK."
(WAIT FOR RESPONSE)
"BUT LET ME KNOW YOUR NUMBER ANYWAY...WHO KNOWS I MAY HAVE TIME."
(might want to save this one after you have dropped several other
SOIs)

> and her ideas racing.

Like what? which ideas? be specific please. .

ROMATIC AND/OR SEXUAL ONES.
HE WOULD START OFF ON ROMANTIC ONES AND MAKE THEM INCREASINGLY SEXUAL UNTIL
HE HIT A SEXUAL FANTASY OF HERS THAT WOULD DDB HER.
LET'S SAY "HOLDING HANDS" OR "SPENDING QUALITY TIME TOGETHER" OR "BEING
CLOSE" AND EVENTUALLY LEADING THAT INTO "TOUCHING BODIES" AND "KISSING" TO
"FUCKING" OBVIOUSLY.
A LOT OF TIME DISTORTION SOIs.

> I have found this CRITICAL if the chick is going to
> stay interested in you for too long. I bored many chicks out
initially when
> I wouldn't get to the point.
[rest deleted]

Rio, this is great stuff. Somehow I understand it.. but I need
examples of it so I can put it together as something I can try
in the field. Do you remember any specifics from this guy?

WELL, WE CAN ALWAYS WAIT FOR THE OFF-SEASON AND GO TO GUAM WITH A VCR AND
MEET THIS GUY (YOU'LL ONLY NEED ABOUT 40,000 YEN FROM TOKYO FOR A 2 DAY
TRIP) OR NEXT TIME WE MEET IN TOKYO WE CAN DO MORE STREET STUFF AND I CAN
SHOW YOU WHAT I KNOW. (I HADN'T FULLY DEVELOPED THE THEORY UNTIL AFTER MY
NIGHT OUT WITH KIPP - I OQed TOO MUCH AND FAILED TO PLACE ANY CHALLENGES
AFTER MY SOIs THAT NIGHT)
THE GUAM PLAYBOY WAS A GRANDMASTER OF STREET PU - HIS WEAKNESS WAS THAT HE
WAS A GREEDY TEAMPLAYER WITH WINGMEN.

If so, please fill in the above spaces where I ask.. it is very
important if this is to work.

Rio
-------

Using SOI’s as a way to tease/attract chicks!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Using SOI's (statements of intent) as a tease to attract a chick!


From: Jonathan Ashton 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Clearing SOI's up
Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 07:04:08 GMT

In article ,
> For example, if we were to drop an SOI on the chick, and then
> IMMEDIATELY follow up with a negative command - WE control the
> flirting so that the chick then has to work for US.
>
> So we can say things like "I want to kiss you"
> And then control the flirting by pulling away again with some reverse
> commands :-
> "BUT I don't really know anything about you, and I haven't known you
> for very long, and I need to feel love first"
> Sounds like the stuff that chicks tell us, right? Well chicks say it
> to flirt, as opposed to meaning what they say!

Omigod!  Rio, this is an awesome post!  Brilliant!  Genius!

"I was thinking about kissing you, but you'd probably slobber too
  much."
"I'd love to take you home, but I know you'd get all clingy."
"I'm just trying to guess if you're any good in bed.  Too bad you're
  too young/weird/conservative for me."
"I bet you'd love the way I do neck massages.  You've been acting up
  too much to deserve one, though."

This is so EASY!  Anyone can think these up on the spot!  There's no
need to think up ambiguous sentences or come up with just the right
innuendo.  Just make a Statement of Intentions, then let her know what
SHE has to offer to make it happen - by telling her that you won't do
it because she's not up to par!  I love it!  I will try it out ASAP!

Howcome I've never seen this idea explained before?  In retrospect,
it's clear that MrSex4uNYC and Mystery do similar stuff, but I've
never seen the dynamic explained this way before.  Ross talks about
setting challenges, but it's always seemed like such a delicate art
to say just the right thing at just the right time.

But this is so easy!  Thank you, Rio.

Ash


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

Game: Color game

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Color Game that can be used in PU!
[Maniac note: got this other list below from the 'Secrets of the cube book'
Also very good, may be appropriate when doing this game:

Red: passion, hot energy, anger warmth
Green: hope, life, nature, money
Blue: spirituality, serenity, cool energy, sadness
Purple: royalty, deep passions, mourning
Yellow: cheerfulness, brightness, eccentricity
Pink: feminity, wamrth
Brown: earthyness, warmth, conventionality
Black: mystery
White: purity
Multicolored: of many interests or moods

END: Maniac note]

From: steviewonder 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: More personality tests
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 20:20:17 GMT

In article <904e0cjv@nnrp1.deja.com>,
  maniac_high@yahoo.com wrote:
> There is good stuff on that site.
>
> I am reworking it to be more appropriate in opener type
> PU's in bars/coffee shops, will present my results of this
> work in late January after it has all been designed and
> field tested.. It will be killer..

Hi guys,

Found this game at

http://www.geocities.com/Broadway/8546/colortest.html

a good one since all the answers are sexual:

QUESTION:

Pick the color that best describes your personality?

ANSWERS:

BLACK
Black color preferences point to black sex. These people are the
misfits of the sex world and seek each other in kinship. They tend to
prefer perverted sex, and are usually masochistic or sadistic in
nature. They are moody and often perform at their peak when under
stress or during unhappy times. Police psychologists claim that many
sex offenders prefer the color black. And it is no coincidence that
the uniform of mobsters and teenaged gangs is black.

BLUE
Lovers of blue are wonderful sex partners. They are sincere,
affectionate, and sensitive to their partner's needs. They consider
lovemaking a fine art, and their approach is elegant. Men who love
blue are like concert pianists; delicately ravaging their partner like
they would play a baby grand. Women in the blue category enjoy sex
to the fullest. They are exciting partners, but their passion might be
compared to tidal waves, rather than fiery aggresion. Both blue men
and women enjoy foreplay and the aftermath of lovemaking as much
as the act. In marriages, a blue person is a wonderful mate, never
failing to please the spouse and never seeking outside interests.

BROWN
For lovers of brown, sex is a 24-hour a day thing. They tend to say "I
love you" often enough. Snuggling by the fire, walking in the rain or
catching snowflakes on their tongue ins a turn-on to a lover of brown.
They need lots of time and privacy to make love. But their emotions
are such that one harsh word could end an affair.

GREEN
Those who prefer green are fresh and innocent in their approach to
sex. Women who love green will make love like virgins all their life.
And a man may also be a trifle clumsy and awkward, but in a charming
and endearing sort of way. Green lovers are gentle, but not
passionate. If chosen as a mate, one will never need to worry about
infidelity.

GREY
The color grey is preferred by people who are indecisive. They can't
get excited about anything - including colors - so they choose a
noncommittal shade. Men who prefer grey look at sex as a means of
relieving tension - nothing more nothing less. It's "wham, bam, thank
you ma'am". Women don't make love, they have intercourse. They
count the cracks in the bedroom plaster until the sex act is over with
and done. When a grey marries another grey, the marriage is not
exactly erotic.

ORANGE
Lovers of the color orange lean toward sexual fantasies. The sex act
is regarded as a dramatic role, a one act play in which they are the
star. Foreplay is as important as the act of love. They whisper sweet
nothings, meaningless dialogue they feel fits their image. Orange
people often do not experience orgasm - but they put on a damn good
act. Men tend to pull their partner's hair and women tend to leave
welts on their sex partner's back!

PINK
Persons who like pink show a reluctance to mature in sexual matters.
Women tend to tease; to promise more than they intend to deliver. In
some cases, they flaunt their femininity, but only because they
secretly hate men. A great percentage of prostitutes boast entire
wardrobes in pink. Men who like pink are the type who make 3 dates
for the same evening and not keep them, preferring to pick up a dish
in some bar instead.

PURPLE
Lovers of purple frequently consider themselves too regal for  fun
romp in the sack. Women sometimes are the type who hate to muss
their hair. Men are businesslike in their approach to lovemaking. In
both sexes, purple partners are more concerned with their
fulfillment then anyone else's gratification.

RED
People who like red tend to be tigers in the sack. They are easily
aroused and enjoy sex in every way imaginable. Once the sexual spark
is lit, it may take hours to extinguish. When two reds get together,
the ensuing erotica would make Lady Chatterly blush. Lovers of red
tend to be the aggressors and weaker colors should beware!

YELLOW
If you tend to favor yellow, your sexual drives are complex and lean
toward the adaptable. The favorite color of homosexuals is yellow!
But don't panic - not everyone who wears yellow is homosexual. In
most cases the person will accommodate to the stronger partner's
desires in a passive manner. You will never enjoy sex to the fullest,
but you will never turn down an invitation from someone you enjoy or
admire.

--
To email me remove the _obvious from this address:
steviewonder_ob@viousfastmail.ca

Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

Handling delusional chicks, karatebabe lives a nightmare!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Re: Mystery: delusional chicks & sympathy lies! 
Date: 11/12/2000 
Author: maniac_high  

 << previous in search  ?  next in search >>  

Re: Mystery: delusional chicks & sympathy lies!
001112
 
Mystery wrote in another post this week regarding lying
to chicks, about how not to underestimate how delusional
a chick is willing to become in order to keep her 'happy'
view of the world.
 
He is absolutely right. And this explains how seeming
'jerk' can get away with what seems like such ridiculous
shit.
 
Case in point, is where I recently did a fuckup, and then
recovered with Karatebabe (see lay report, my page). This
is the chick that would go around my place after sex
cleaning up her own hairs so that "the other chicks"
wouldnt find out about her.
 
Well, one day we are going for coffee, and she asks me
if I had been seeing another chick at the time I started
dating her. Figuring (incorrectly) from her behavior,
that this chick knew totally what the score already was,
I said I had been (wrong answer!).
 
She freaked out and went balistic at me. Shit about "how
I make her fool, go behind her back..and other shit".
In retrospect it was clear though.. she got upset, because
something she merely 'suspected' (even though it was fucking
obvious as shit, as other chicks stuff was all over the
fucking house), now became something 'confirmed', and that
shattered her entire world..
 
I then smartened up and realized what I had just done,
and recovered by saying that I dumped her after I first
started dating you (Karatebabe), a few weeks later.
 
After that, she settled down (even though every week
there was different chick stuff all over the house
after that!). She asked me about it, and I said no,
there are no chicks..
 
She said she accepted that, and that her 'nightmare'
now was over, and everything was fine again.
 
Later she found some makeup and chick stuff in the
bathroom cabinet (another chick must have slipped
it there for someone else to find it), so I had
to think fast on my feet for that one...
 
So I told her that I have a real dark secret and
she might be very disappointed in me (now she is
expecting to hear something about a chick)..
 
Then (remembering she likes gays and stuff) I tell
her that I like to make believe to dress like a girl
(lots of J-guys do it actually, so I know it is not
so far fetched here), and I have guy friends that do it
with me, and sorry I didnt tell you earlier.. (of
course this is TOTALLY false.. Maniac is not even
remotely gay, nor a crossdresser or any of that shit)...
however.. she ACCEPTED that story, and was relieved
(in spite of the fact that I was almost cracking up
when I said it, since I was SURE she would call me
on my bullshit... but she didnt)!
 
Fuck!, the totally ridiculous things you have to
tell a chick...  AND! they accept it (as they
try to internalize it and believe it at least at
some level so that their happy delusional world
doesn't come crashing to bits)..
 
Strange, isnt it..!
 
Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Using the laws of power in PU!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Toecutter, and using the laws of power!




From toecutter@mail.com Mon Oct 23 09:39:39 2000
From: "toecutter" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Lessons from Book: The 48 Laws of Power
Lines: 201


Just reading a book, The 48 Laws of Power by Robert Greene. Definitely
lessons everywhere in the book on what we do here.
The book is amoral, and open about the deception inherit in what he is
teaching. It is largely for life outside the arena of seduction, but
entrirely applicable and there are some seduction examples in it to
illustrate his points (only historical: For example the advice of Ninon de
Lenclos on seduction to the Marquis de Sevigne and what happened when the
Marquis did not follow her advice, etc.). The examples are all pulled from
the Sun Tzu (Chinese, the Art of War), European history, famous con men,
magicians and charlatans, Kings, Queens, Napoleon and other power brokers
such as Al Capone. Perfect for you guys who enjoy Machiavelli. At 450
reasonably large format pages it is fairly long.

It is going to take me several re-readings, but at the moment I see the
messages as really 3 fold: First, play your cards pretty close to your
chest. This creates mystery. The more you say, the more common you appear
and the less in control. Andy Wohol created enigma by not discussing his
work and answering questions by being intentionally vague giving people the
feeling that he was being more profound than he was.  If you do not reveal
all, people will never become bored with you or your presence because you
will continue to represent a challenge, and will be eternally interesting.
Your silence will make other people feel uncomfortable and humans are
machines of interpretation and explanation; they have to know what you are
thinking. When you carefully control what you reveal, they cannot pierce
your intentions and meaning. Your short answers will put them on the
defensive and they will jump in, nervously filling the silence with all
kinds of comments that will reveal valuable information about themselves and
their weaknesses.

This brings me to the second message. Learn everything you can about other
people. Their strengths and weaknesses, their crutches and trance words.
Their motivations. Use these to your advantage whilst revealing as little as
possible about yourself. Keep them the focus of the conversation, and be a
'Spy' on their minds by eliciting values.

The third lesson is to use smoke and mirrors to obscure your objectives and
motivations. Throw decoys out there, use gifts as Trojan horses, and be
circumspect in what is going on. Again, this throws them off your game,
gives you an upper hand.

None of this is to say that you need to be quiet or a bad conversationalist,
just the opposite, by spying and eliciting values, you are encouraging
people to talk about themselves, their own favourite subject. By being brief
about yourself you are creating mystery and interest. It is just that you
are collecting the information in order to use it against them at another
time, whilst manipulating your image and reputation in their minds and
obscuring your real motivations. In some ways it is a book on playing hard
to get while outmanoeuvring the girl. A perfect structure in which to drop
SS.

Some of the content is below. I can post more on it if you would like
further discussion; I am overflowing with ideas on it.

Toecutter.

---

To list some of the laws that are obviously applicable:

Law 3: Conceal your intentions (Keep people off balance and in the dark by
never revealing the purpose behind your actions. If they have no clue what
you are up to, they cannot prepare a defence. Guide them far enough down the
wrong path, envelop them in enough smoke, and by the time they realise your
intentions, it will be too late.)

Law 4: Always say less than is necessary

Law 6: Court attention at all costs

Law 8: Make other people come to you - use bait if necessary

Law 9: Win though your actions, never through argument. (Any momentary
triumph you win though argument is really a Pyrrhic victory: The resentment
and ill will you stir up is stronger and lasts longer than any momentary
change in opinion. It is much more powerful to get others to agree with you
though your actions, without saying a word. Demonstrate, do not explicate.)

Law 10: Infection: Avoid the unhappy and unlucky (it works the other way
also. This is an alternative take on social-proof, or pivots or whatever you
want to call them, as well as wingmen. Also advice on not getting involved
with the wrong girl.)

Law 11: Learn to keep people dependent on you.

Law 12: Use selective generosity to disarm your victim (One sincere and
honest move will cover over dozens of dishonest ones. Openhearted gestures
of honesty and generosity bring down the guard of even the most suspicious
people. Once your selective honesty opens a hole in their armour, you can
deceive and manipulate at will.)

Law 13: When asking for help, appeal to people's self interest, never to
their mercy or gratitude.

Law 14: Pose as a friend, work as a spy.

Law 16: Use absence to increase respect and honour. (Again through mystery
and not stuffing it up by staying too long and doing or saying something
wrong.)

Law 17: Keep others in suspended terror: Cultivate an air of
unpredictability

Law 18: Do not build fortresses to protect yourself - Isolation is
dangerous. (Get out there amongst them).

Law 19: Know who you are dealing with - do not offend the wrong person.

Law 20: Do not commit yourself to anyone.

Law 21: Play a sucker to catch a sucker - appear dumber than your mark. (Let
her think that she is in control and smart, less naive, don't let on you are
a player).

Law 25: Re-create yourself (Do not accept the roles that society foists on
you. Re-create yourself by forging a new identity, one that commands
attention and never bores the audience. Be the master of your own image
rather than letting others define it for you. Incorporate dynamic devices
into your public gestures and actions - your power will be enhanced and your
character will seem larger than life).

Law 26: Keep your hands clean. (You must seem a paragon of civility and
efficiency: Your hands are never soiled by mistakes and nasty deeds.
Maintain such a spotless appearance by using others as scapegoats and cat'
s-paws to disguise your involvement).

Law 27: Play on peoples need to believe to create a cult like following.
(advice in this chapter is on how to become a cult leader or maybe build a
harem. 5 strategies to your dogma! a) Keep it vague; Keep it simple b)
Emphasise the visual and sensual over the intellectual c) Borrow the forms
of organised religion to structure the group d) Disguise your income source
e) set up an us-vs.-them dynamic. I think Ross Jeffries read this one!)

Law 28: Enter action with Boldness. (If you are unsure of a course of
action, do not attempt it. Your doubts and hesitations will infect your
execution. Timidity is dangerous: Better to enter with boldness. Any
mistakes you make through audacity are easily corrected with more audacity.
Everyone admires the bold; no one honours the timid).

Law 29: Plan all the way to the end.

Law 30: Make your accomplishments seem effortless. (Your actions must seem
natural and executed with ease. All the toil and practice that goes into
them, also all the clever tricks, must be concealed. When you act, act
effortlessly, as if you could do much more. Avoid the temptation of
revealing how hard you work - it only raises questions. Teach no one your
tricks or they will be used against you .. I am breaking this rule right
here with this post, as is the Authour of the book.)

Law 31: Control the options: Get others to play with the cards you deal.
(The best deceptions are the ones that seem to give the other person a
choice: Your victims feel they are in control, but are actually your
puppets. Give people options that come out in your favour whichever one they
choose. Force them to make choices between the lesser of two evils, both of
which serve your purpose. Put them on the horns of the dilemma: they are
gored wherever they turn. Note: this is a different view on my idea of
re-framing questions. The questions are re-framed so well that the girl has
no option.)

Law 32: Play to people's fantasies.

Law 33: Discover each mans thumbscrew.

Law 34: Be royal in your own fashion: Act like a king to be treated like
one.

Law 35: Master the art of timing. (Never seem to be in a hurry - hurrying
betrays a lack of control over yourself, and over time. Always seem patient,
as if you know that everything will come to you eventually. Become a
detective of the right moment; sniff out the spirit of the times, the trends
that will carry you to power. Learn to stand back when the time is not yet
ripe, and to strike fiercely when it has reached fruition.)

Law 36: Disdain things you cannot have: Ignoring them is the best revenge.

Law 37: Create compelling spectacles. (Striking imagery and grand symbolic
gestures create the aura of power - everyone responds to them. Stage
spectacles for those around you, then, full of arresting visuals and radiant
symbols to heighten your presence. Dazzled by appearances, no one will
notice what you are really doing.)

Law 40: Despise the free Lunch.

Law 43: Work on the hearts and minds of others.

Law 44: Disarm and infuriate with the mirror effect. (The mirror reflects
reality, but is the perfect tool for deception: When you mirror your
enemies, doing exactly as they do, they cannot figure out your strategy. The
mirror Effect mocks and humiliates them, making them overreact. By holding
up a mirror to their psyches, you seduce them with the illusion that you
share their values; by holding up a mirror to their actions you teach them a
lesson. Few can resist the power of the mirror effect.)

Law 48: Assume formlessness. (By taking a shape, by having a visible plan,
you open yourself to attact. Instead of taking a form for the girl to grasp,
keep yourself adaptable and on the move. Accept the fact that nothing is
certain and no law is fixed. The best way to protect yourself is to be as
fluid and formless as water: never bet on stability or lasting order.
Everything changes.)

Disarming groups of guys around chicks!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

When lots of guys are around 1 girl, you must disarm guys!


From: "Stepleader" 
Subject: Re: She has nice/great body and/or face -- but what about her?
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2000 10:02:45 GMT

great pep talk and I love your posts ... but ...

the situ called for a disarming of the guys.  Here is how.  Approach the
group but pay NO attention to the girl.  Begin the chat with the guys and
make them interested in your story telling.  MALE BONDING comradery.  Turn
you back to HER so she feels out of place.  What you have done is removed
all the attention from her (stolen it).  You are now the center of
attention.  A couple NEGS her way challenges her.  All the other guys were
on her - all but one.  YOU.

Just so you know, this is mystery methods groupset theory and Ive done this
successfully a great # of times.

from this vantage point you may now take her  by the hand and say to the
others, "is it alright if I steal your friend away for a bit?"  they will
say yes and you take her out of earshot.  Id love you to see me work a set
like that.  its brilliant.  and PRACTICAL.

Svengali  wrote in article
<131220002147344283%Svengali_here@use.net>...
> Gentlemen, you're looking for the whole package, not just the
> packaging.  And if all you're focusing on is the packaging, she damn
> well knows it and is in control of you --period!
> 
> You must, repeat, you must be prepared to walk at all times, no matter
> how much you would like to be on/in that body and face.
> 
> Remember, you are screening her to see if she is good enough for
> you, not the other way around.  And the only way you're going to find
> out if she is good enough for you is to learn as much as you can
> about the person that is within that female form.
> 
> Am I saying you must be screening every beauty for a long term
> relationship?  Hell no!  It can be for however long you want.  But
> the moment she sees, and it won't take her long, that you are screening
> her to see whether or not she is good enough for you, is the moment
> the tables get turned and she understands that she has to make herself
> look good in your eyes.
> 
> Now contrast this with all the other guys who are trying to make
> themselves look good in her eyes, so they can get on/in her.
> 
> To illustrate what I am saying, picture this: we're in a manhattan bar,
> and there is this gorgeous looking woman, with the greatest face you've
> seen, talking to a few guys.  One happens to be our own great NYC with
> his magnificient weight-lifting body and his "I'm great" attitude; 
> another is Riker with his patterns, a third is Greg19 with his band of
> ways, and so on.  So basically what you would have is a bunch of guys
> trying to find and give this woman what she wants, so as to get on/in
> her.
> 
> Then there's Svengali, with his Carey Grant looks and ways, who sees
> the woman, walks right up into the group and says "excuse me guys, I
> just wanted to ask the lady where she got, and whose idea it was to get
> those earrings that seems to make her skin sparkle and her eyes glow,
> and then I'll leave." [Turning to her] "So please tell me, where did
> you get, and what made you decide [Svengali's hand goes out to the
> earrings, and in the process, lightly touches the lady's neck] to get
> these earrings that seems to make your skin sparkle and your eyes
> glow?"  {She tells me.}  "Thank you."  "Bye guys, I'm going back over
> there [pointing, so the lady knows where I will be]."
> 
> Look what just occurred: (1) I showed I wasn't afraid of a damn thing. 
> (2) I disarmed my opponents.  (3) I made her feel good.  (4) I showed
> her I wasn't about to hang around and try and get her.  {Of course to
> firmly establish that point, I would engage another woman in
> conversation, and have her positioned in a way that the first woman
> would see her with me, which would have her wondering what kind of nice
> things was I saying to her, that she wasn't getting.}.
> 
> Who do you think the woman is likely to be focused on and thinking
> about: all the guys who are there, still trying to get to her, or the
> guy who said what he wanted, made her feel good/great, left, and is now
> focused on someone else?  {I removed one of her feel good sources, so
> even though the others are there, with theirs, she like nearly everyone
> of us, is focused on the one that's been lost, not the ones that are
> present.}
> 
> Show your interest in her, but also show that you are walking the
> moment *she's* not exactly like you want.
> 
> Now I'll play devil's advocate and say that my little "walk away"
> didn't work.  Do you think I care?  Hell no, and I'll tell you why: the
> one who chases to gets, will always have to chase to have.  So whoever
> would win with the woman, would have to keep providing whatever they
> did to keep her interested.  I, on the other hand, only need to use a
> little charm and then walk away to have her wanting me.
> 
> I ask you, who do you think has an easier time of it?
> 
> -- 
> If you don't know in the first twenty minutes whether or not you're going
to
> have sex with the woman you just met, and whether or not you even want
to,
> you're not a seductionist.
> 
>   'o o'
> Svengali
>

Taking control when things go wrong

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Color Game that can be used in PU!
[Maniac note: got this other list below from the 'Secrets of the cube book'
Also very good, may be appropriate when doing this game:

Red: passion, hot energy, anger warmth
Green: hope, life, nature, money
Blue: spirituality, serenity, cool energy, sadness
Purple: royalty, deep passions, mourning
Yellow: cheerfulness, brightness, eccentricity
Pink: feminity, wamrth
Brown: earthyness, warmth, conventionality
Black: mystery
White: purity
Multicolored: of many interests or moods

END: Maniac note]

From: steviewonder 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: More personality tests
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 20:20:17 GMT

In article <904e0c$2jv$1@nnrp1.deja.com>,
  maniac_high@yahoo.com wrote:
> There is good stuff on that site.
>
> I am reworking it to be more appropriate in opener type
> PU's in bars/coffee shops, will present my results of this
> work in late January after it has all been designed and
> field tested.. It will be killer..

Hi guys,

Found this game at

http://www.geocities.com/Broadway/8546/colortest.html

a good one since all the answers are sexual:

QUESTION:

Pick the color that best describes your personality?

ANSWERS:

BLACK
Black color preferences point to black sex. These people are the
misfits of the sex world and seek each other in kinship. They tend to
prefer perverted sex, and are usually masochistic or sadistic in
nature. They are moody and often perform at their peak when under
stress or during unhappy times. Police psychologists claim that many
sex offenders prefer the color black. And it is no coincidence that
the uniform of mobsters and teenaged gangs is black.

BLUE
Lovers of blue are wonderful sex partners. They are sincere,
affectionate, and sensitive to their partner's needs. They consider
lovemaking a fine art, and their approach is elegant. Men who love
blue are like concert pianists; delicately ravaging their partner like
they would play a baby grand. Women in the blue category enjoy sex
to the fullest. They are exciting partners, but their passion might be
compared to tidal waves, rather than fiery aggresion. Both blue men
and women enjoy foreplay and the aftermath of lovemaking as much
as the act. In marriages, a blue person is a wonderful mate, never
failing to please the spouse and never seeking outside interests.

BROWN
For lovers of brown, sex is a 24-hour a day thing. They tend to say "I
love you" often enough. Snuggling by the fire, walking in the rain or
catching snowflakes on their tongue ins a turn-on to a lover of brown.
They need lots of time and privacy to make love. But their emotions
are such that one harsh word could end an affair.

GREEN
Those who prefer green are fresh and innocent in their approach to
sex. Women who love green will make love like virgins all their life.
And a man may also be a trifle clumsy and awkward, but in a charming
and endearing sort of way. Green lovers are gentle, but not
passionate. If chosen as a mate, one will never need to worry about
infidelity.

GREY
The color grey is preferred by people who are indecisive. They can't
get excited about anything - including colors - so they choose a
noncommittal shade. Men who prefer grey look at sex as a means of
relieving tension - nothing more nothing less. It's "wham, bam, thank
you ma'am". Women don't make love, they have intercourse. They
count the cracks in the bedroom plaster until the sex act is over with
and done. When a grey marries another grey, the marriage is not
exactly erotic.

ORANGE
Lovers of the color orange lean toward sexual fantasies. The sex act
is regarded as a dramatic role, a one act play in which they are the
star. Foreplay is as important as the act of love. They whisper sweet
nothings, meaningless dialogue they feel fits their image. Orange
people often do not experience orgasm - but they put on a damn good
act. Men tend to pull their partner's hair and women tend to leave
welts on their sex partner's back!

PINK
Persons who like pink show a reluctance to mature in sexual matters.
Women tend to tease; to promise more than they intend to deliver. In
some cases, they flaunt their femininity, but only because they
secretly hate men. A great percentage of prostitutes boast entire
wardrobes in pink. Men who like pink are the type who make 3 dates
for the same evening and not keep them, preferring to pick up a dish
in some bar instead.

PURPLE
Lovers of purple frequently consider themselves too regal for  fun
romp in the sack. Women sometimes are the type who hate to muss
their hair. Men are businesslike in their approach to lovemaking. In
both sexes, purple partners are more concerned with their
fulfillment then anyone else's gratification.

RED
People who like red tend to be tigers in the sack. They are easily
aroused and enjoy sex in every way imaginable. Once the sexual spark
is lit, it may take hours to extinguish. When two reds get together,
the ensuing erotica would make Lady Chatterly blush. Lovers of red
tend to be the aggressors and weaker colors should beware!

YELLOW
If you tend to favor yellow, your sexual drives are complex and lean
toward the adaptable. The favorite color of homosexuals is yellow!
But don't panic - not everyone who wears yellow is homosexual. In
most cases the person will accommodate to the stronger partner's
desires in a passive manner. You will never enjoy sex to the fullest,
but you will never turn down an invitation from someone you enjoy or
admire.

--
To email me remove the _obvious from this address:
steviewonder_ob@viousfastmail.ca

Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

Maniac High's Pick Up Girls Guide and Seduction Website! » mystery

Maniac High — Thu, 20 May 2010 12:22:49 +0000

Buy Reductil No Prescription, From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Mystery and others write about successful openers.

Status: O

talk about esp and its impossibility

talk about how you met a bear while hiking

talk about how you were scared shitless rock climbing when your rope snapped

or talk about the famous person you met

does she believe in ghosts. why, Buy Reductil No Prescription.

or hotseat (like question game but more brutal)

talk about the time you bladed down a steep hill and survived. Buy Reductil No Prescription, talk about the time you were on stage

...

mystery

-----

From nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org Wed Apr 12 07:31:37 2000
From: nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org (Nathan SZILARD)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: After the # close

They find it very funny and show it to their friends, plus
they remember, Buy Reductil No Prescription.

| If you did any anchoring on your voice when you met, order Reductil, Buy Reductil without a prescription, now's the time to
| unleash them.

----

From slidewguy@remove-aol.com Wed Apr 12 07:47:28 2000
From: "whoisthis19"
Subject: Some closes
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast

Any of you guys got ways of getting chicks to leave with you outside
the club.

greg1

Did you sleep with yourself or... did you turn yourself down because
you was too easy.

Doing Successful Openers

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Mystery and others write about successful openers!



From: "Mystery" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast,Alt.psychology.nlp,alt.hypnosis
References: <37602334.55753831@bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Chat suggestions
Date: Wed, 16 Jun 1999 04:58:12 -0700
Lines: 63
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts7-36t-14.idirect.com
Message-ID: <37676655@nemo.idirect.com>
X-Trace: 16 Jun 1999 04:54:45 -0400, ts7-36t-14.idirect.com
Organization: via Internet Direct

Status: O

talk about esp and its impossibility

talk about how you met a bear while hiking

talk about how you were scared shitless rock climbing when your rope snapped

or the time you visited your friends friend with him and your buddy was
almost beaten to death when the friend he visited had a boyfriend who came
out and there was a 20 minute car chase through lights and you were looking
for the cops but lot the crazed boyfriend before you found cops.

or the time you were in the hospital and it changed the way food tastes.
the birds sound clearer now.

or the time you netbused (hacked) into a bank but chickened out and put the
money into a charity

or talk about the famous person you met

does she believe in ghosts?  why?

you like candles and incense.  what does SHE like?  the music game modified
for all types of objects.

play the question game with her

or hotseat (like question game but more brutal)

talk about the time you bladed down a steep hill and survived.

talk about the time you were on stage

...

mystery



-----


From nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org Wed Apr 12 07:31:37 2000
From: nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org (Nathan SZILARD)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: After the # close

On Mon, 03 Apr 2000 21:26:22 GMT, Rio  wrote:
| I was reading elsewhere on a post, that if you instruct her to sound
| cheerful on the phone when you call when you do a # close.

I tried that, it's not a magic bullet. But it's fun.

I now always write some shit along with my phone #:
something like "DO NOT FALL IN LOVE" or "NO STALKING PLEASE".

They find it very funny and show it to their friends, plus
they remember.

| If you did any anchoring on your voice when you met, now's the time to
| unleash them.



----

From slidewguy@remove-aol.com Wed Apr 12 07:47:28 2000
From: "whoisthis19" 
Subject: Some closes
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast

Hand her the slip of paper and pen and have her write down her number.
When she's hands it back, ask her to put it someplace so you will
remeber to call her.  Last time I did this she put it down my pants and
grabbed my cock.  

Ask a gal to trade shirts.  When she balks, keep pressing in a joking
manner then finally ask to her to go outside to trade shirts.  Nothing
better then getting her outside.

Another one is simply saying its too smokey, noisy, smelly in here. 
Lets go outsde for some air.

Any of you guys got ways of getting chicks to leave with you outside
the club?

greg1

Did you sleep with yourself or... did you turn yourself down because
 you was too easy.

A conversation with Mystery! Pickups

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


A conversation with Mystery!

Tips on fieldwork from a pick up artist! on IRC #PUA!


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A Conversation with Mystery, a Pick-up Artist (PUA)

Topics Include: 

The Kiss Close
Clubbing alone
Handling guys
Being a story-teller
Preparation and format
Quality vs. quantity

Lego: Hey Mystery, what's your favorite story to close with?  How 
exactly do you transition from the telling of a story to closing?

Mystery: "The Kiss Close" is my favorite routine.  Once you have three 
indicators of interest (she touches you, laughs consistantly at your 
jokes, leans in towards you, smiles a lot and keeps eye contact, resumes 
chat when you force silence, etc) you then phase shift.  You turn 180 
degrees on a dime.  Go from humorous and non-sexual to saying, "Stop.  
Would you like to kiss me?", right out of the blue.  She will say either 
say, "Uh - no",(which is unlikely as you don't bother performing "The 
Kiss Close" until enough indicators are present) or, "I donno" (they 
rarely say, "Yes"). "I donno" means she actually does want to but feels 
embarrassed on how to say "Yes".  So you reply, "Lets find out", then go 
in slowly and kiss her.  It's very simple and very effective.  If she 
says, "Why?", this is also a yes.  Simply reply, "It looked like you had 
something on your mind.  Would you like to kiss me?"  Wait again for 
her response.  If her response is "No" then reply, "Hey I didn't say you 
COULD.  You just had that look in your eye."

Lego: What do you do if you're interrupted? You're telling your target 
a story and she is all into it but some AFC cock-blocking idiot just 
runs up and starts screaming and yelling and you're like, "What the 
fuck?"

Mystery: Simply ask him if you can borrow his pen.  When he gives it to 
you, throw it away as you say, "Fetch."

Wakeboarder: Hahaha.  Nice!

Lego: What if he's bigger than you?

Mystery: I'd instead call him on his disruptive shit and remark, "Dude, 
what are you attempting here?"  Not good enough?  Then say, "Ladies?  
Shall we discover what adventure awaits us in another room?"

Wakeboarder: Man, none of my buds want to go to the club.

Gamer: Screw them then.

Mystery: Go alone.

Wakeboarder: I need to be made fun of for this comment but I feel like 
a weiner if I go to a club myself

Lego: Bro, your trippin'. I go solo many times. It's good actually.  
It's weird if it's a first night but if I've been there before it's cool.

Mystery: Yeah, I understand ... and yet, staying home alone will make 
you feel so much better?  Go out alone, meet some cool dudes when you 
get there (they will become your wingmen there) and then run around 
getting #'s.  Report to your fellow PUAs what happened.  Whatever happened 
to the concept, "The alphamale gets all the women?"  Shit dude, what are 
you, a mommas boy?  Do you need your hand held?  

Lego: How do you strike up conversations with guys?

Mystery: Walk up and say, "Hey dude, question for ya.  Do you know 
where a good place to score is in this city? 'Cause this place looks like a 
cock farm."

Lego: Good!  You should be able to relate to guys to disarm them.  You 
don't compete; you ELIMINATE COMPETETION.

Gamer: LOL.  Dude, the only results I've had were solo.  My friends 
psych me out too much because they never help.  Instead they just complain 
about my taking too much time.  They laugh at me or just generally piss 
me off.

Mystery: I have MUCH better results (and MUCH more fun) playing "The 
Game" alone.  It forces you to approach.  It's a great motivator.

Lego: Damn! I couldn't have put it better myself.

Gamer: Yep.

Mystery: You wont be alone for more than five minutes once you approach 
your first set anyways.  Gamer, I suggest you call them on their shit 
at some point.  Demonstrate your alphamale characteristics.

Lego: How do you continue talking?  I mean, group set dynamics are much 
different in a one one on one approach.

Mystery: Be a story-teller - THAT is the skill of the PUA.  It isn't 
SEDUCING; it's STORY-TELLING.  It is my personal belief that SS patterns 
arent as 'hypnotic' as they are 'entertaining' stories.

Wakeboarder: Sweet

Lego: Actually with the story stuff I SEE WHAT YOU MEAN.  They just 
follow that lead.

Wakeboarder: Well, I need to stop being a sackless wonder and grow some 
fuckin' balls then!  Hmm, story telling ...

Mystery: Here's an example.  "Ever been camping?  Well I was up in a 
forest up north and was hiking with some girlfriends of mine ... and we 
came along some trail and there was shit on the path.  My friends were 
like, "haaaa someone shit in the woods" and I said, "lets get the fuck 
out of here like NOW."  they thought I was just scared of shit and I 
said, "Girls, you dont get it.  This shit is still warm and its not human.  
Its bear shit.  This is a big fucking bear.  Look at the size of that 
turd."  Notice it's not sexual?  Most hot girls gets get "sex-talk" 
right away from AFCs.  NOT talking sex with them makes them question 
whether you are interested in them.  Leave them guessing until you get 
indicators of interest from them.  If they like your great personality 
(confident, humorous, etc) they will give you subtle but distinct clues.

Gamer: How do you flow from story to story?

Mystery: If there is ONE mental state you should force yourself into, 
its TALKATIVE.  Talk your fucking HEAD off.  Just go from one story 
straight into another one like a comedian does.  Ever find yourself excited 
about something and you talk and talk and talk?  THAT is what must 
happen to get a girl.  You have to ENTERTAIN them.  Look talkative yet not 
desperate.  

Gamer: Heh.

Lego: Dude, I had that going last night. You're so right.  That's an 
excellent example dude.  I was telling this story about getting harassed 
by cops or some shit.  It's a cool story but my delivery sucked and I 
was losing one of the two girls I was telling it to.  What if they fail 
to elaborate on your story?  Besides it being a bad story to begin 
with, how can you fix it on the fly?

Mystery: They don't have to interact with it.  Its a good thing to have 
flexible stories to allow for some comment but it's not nessessary.  
It's YOUR job to perform the material.  It's your audiences job to 
listen,laugh and generally be entertained.  That's it.  At the end of 10 
minutes you will see the girls digging you (positive indicators).  You then 
phase shift abruptly into the close.

Lego: HOW DO YOU PHASE SHIFT?  I've been wondering this. While I didn't 
come off as obvious in last nights case and just told her to kiss me (I 
knew she would anyway), this could have been smoother.

Alpha: Lego, you ad libbed the close?  So working on ad libbing is 
good?

Mystery: Ad libbed material is not as accurate in closing as is 
performing the well constructed and field-tested "Kiss Close" routine.  Ad 
libbing is BONUS material but don't COUNT on it.  Have your material, like 
a good comedian, prepared before performing.  This isn't "A Night at 
the Improv" fellas.

Gamer: Heh.

Mystery: All PUs have a format; a beginning, a middle and an end.  If 
you don't know what the next routine is going to be then you may end up 
with an unfortunate pregnant pause which fucks up your pacing.  You may 
end up filling the silence with the deadly, "So ... um ... what do you 
do?"  Preparation saves face.  Afterall, with your particular close, 
she could have pulled away from your trying to kiss her.  Then what?!!  
Instead, consider engaging her in enthusiastic conversation, then go 
directly into the close.  In other words, stop her in mid-sentence and 
with a curious tone, kiss close.

Wakeboarder: cool.  Lego, what indicators clued you in that she wanted 
the kiss?

Alpha: In what way can you be prepared?  If we're talking about 
story-telling in front of a random girl we just met seconds ago in a random 
place ...

Mystery: Like a good comedian, have your material prepared yet when 
onstage be prepared to dynamically omit certain routines and to add others 
on the fly.  Sometimes certain routines fit the situation better than 
others.  Have 3 to 5 alternative openers (as a comedian would) and enjoy 
performing the one you think best fits the situation will get the best 
reaction for the group you are in front of

Alpha: Gotcha now.  Can you give me a brief example of how you go about 
preparing?

Mystery: Sure.  First, find 3 openers and memorize them.  Write down a 
list of openers (just the headings of each opener to remind you).  
Next, write down some routines (the question game, the music game, the 
photo routine, the bear in the woods story, etc - all on dejanews) and then 
also memorize the kiss close and the # close.  Memorize 3 NEGs too and 
you are good to go.  With the material in your mind, you are prepared 
to work it in the field until you have the timing of the material down 
(again, just like a comedian.)

Alpha: Man, you provide some really eye-opening ideas... (just when I'm 
about to think there's nothing more to learn.

Wakeboarder: So what you're saying is have a routine set up and modify 
it to each situation? Kind of like having a PU template?

Mystery: It's ALL about format.  Know the format and stick to it.  If 
you now what the next step is in the PU, you wont feel scared.  It gets 
fun and you begin to appreciate the strategy behind it all.

Wakeboarder: Yeah like FMAC? That's a simple format.

Mystery: Yes, FMAC.  Each letter in FMAC is an abrupt phase shift.  
"FIND" means having to abruptly disturb your complacency by getting out of 
the house.  It takes effort for many people to do bother getting THIS 
FAR.  "MEET" is a HUGE abrupt change.  "There she is!  3, 2, 1, GO!"  In 
the "ATTRACT" phase, you need to go from the walk up to the TALKATIVE 
performer entertaining story-teller.  You will need A LOT of energy for 
this (enthusiasm is contagious afterall) and for many to go from 
slumping around to being in performer mode is ABRUPT.  Finally you must then 
"CLOSE"; to phase shift from humour to serious is also abrupt.  Each 
phase may FEEL awkward but it looks normal.  When a comedian finishes one 
topic and just goes into an entirely new unrelated topic, the audience 
doesn't care as long as the next topic is entertaining.

Wakeboarder: Very true.

Gamer: Cool.  I'm collecting openers and other routines off the 
layguide right now.

Alpha: Do you believe in the 80/20 'rule'?  Meaning, 80% of the quality 
women are found in 20% of the right places or connections or 
situations.

Mystery: The quality of a woman is SO subjective. Quality is difficult 
to QUANTIFY.  80% of QUALITY?  It's pointless trying to mix and match 
these concepts. INSTEAD consider that there are HOTTIES and UGs (YOU get 
to decide based on your personal criteria) and of the HOTTIES, some 
have pleasant personalities and others do not.  You cannot possibly judge 
her personality until she LIKES you.  So go out ... FIND her, MEET her, 
ATTRACT her and THEN decide if you want to CLOSE her AFTER judging her 
personality.  Judging her by the way she treats you on your approach is 
lame because particularly beautiful women all have their bitch shields 
up and running.  They have to.  They aren't planning on fucking every 
guy that says Hi to them.  The only way to get rid of the guys is to 
oftentimes offend them quickly.  It's not personal.  It's merely a learned 
strategy.  So is the "I have a boyfriend excuse, but that's a different 
story.  I also suggest CLOSING everyone just for the education.  You 
don't actually have to CALL the girls of course.  You simply get to 
practice CLOSING too.  Getting a girls number is merely an OPTION.  You 
don't have to follow up on ALL of them you know.

Keen: Heh.

Wakeboarder: Cool, judging the girls only after you have attracted 
them.  Kind of makes you approach too!  You can't say the bull shit line, 
"She's not my type, I can tell", to get you out of approaching.

Alpha: Do you have a web page?

Mystery: No, not currently.  I'm writing a book though called The 
Mystery Method.  Most of my ramblings can be found on the layguide. 

Ascence: Hey, is it true that the older we get the more money/social 
status becomes and issue?

Mystery: No matter what social status you have (or THINK you have), 
it's still something you must convey in the first 25 minutes of meeting 
her.  We ALL start equal BEFORE meeting her; all men.  The issue is, can 
we congruently convey our social status (real or not) in our 
performance?  That's OUR responsibility.  The best way is not to TELL them about 
it but rather to DEMONSTRATE it.  How?  Well, if you talk about having 
girls always falling for you for instance, it's not NEARLY as good as 
actually having a couple hot girls with you saying what a hottie you are 
infront of the target.  This is called PAWNING.

Keen: I'm going to try doing the story-telling that you talked about.  
It's really hard though. I'm a real bad storyteller.  I've been working 
on it today. that's my lesson today.

Wakeboarder: Tell them about that time you saw a fallen over manequin 
in the department store and you tripped over it.  The security guard 
thought you were trying to make it with the manequin and called you a 
little freak.

Gamer: LOL (Laughing Out Loud).

Wakeboarder: One more question for you Mystery.  What's the meaning of 
life?

Mystery: To fuck. :)

Statement of Intent (SOI)

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Rio introduces a key part of PU: the 'Statement of Intent' (SOI)!

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2000 09:00:50 GMT
Subject: Find Stun Drag Fuck

G'day,

Jonathan Ashton  wrote in message
news:90eati$gpt@nnrp1.deja.com...
> As I've read the twelve-odd messages in this thread, I've been looking
> for something to take home with me, but I'm not finding it.
>
> Rio, how do you do things differently now, based on what you've said?

First thing would be to think about the close. Mystery knows his group work
perfect from how I read it, and I have been using his methods to great
success social-proof wise.

The BIG thing that clocked in my head was the need to STATE YOUR INTENTIONS
to the chick within the first minute of meeting her. I will make that my
rule from now on - as with the 3 second rule.
By this I DON'T mean "Let's fuck" or "Come to Papa baby" or any throw-away
shit like that. It has to be an honest assessment of what YOU feel capable
of doing to the chick after the "Hi" and the first round of fluff/routine
(routine preferred - something humourous). GM does this part BEAUTIFULLY,
because he does it with a sense of fun and humour - and HE KNOWS he is going
to do what he says and so does SHE!
I notice Mr. Sex states this a lot in his past posts - where AFC or shit
PUAs do approaches and talk to the chick, but never get to the point AND the
bitch can tell that the guys want to fuck but are too pussy to go for it.
Ross says something to the tune of "And maybe we could really get to like
each other" when he closes in HTGTWYDIB. I also recall that TokyoPUA did a
statement of intentions on that chick he PUed at night once who was
initially scared of him. Johnny Shack does it by when he just springs dates
on women he just met.
So there's some cross references.

The proper methodological way to get to a statement of intentions part is by
pace and lead. But the point of the matter is, you have to structure the
conversation to show interest and intent VERY soon or you will stall, chick
will get bored, feel teased, and then it's C&B time. Believe me, a LOT of
C&B experience with a LOT of HOT chicks has so far has taught me this
painful lesson.
The best way to put it is in the most honest way possible. I cannot give you
a specific example. But the idea is to get her thinking romantically about
you VERY soon. THEN you HAVE TO DO WHAT YOU SAID you would do to the chick
after DDB. (E.g. If you want to start things off gently by holding her hand,
tell her a scene where want to be holding her hand - and then do it in the
next routine after she is comfortable with this.) If you do NOT DO what you
say you will, eventually your congruence will fuck up when the chick loses
patience. Then the chick will be confused, get scared, and bolt. If this
ever happens and the guy tries to do heavy kino or try for a fuck while the
chick is in this state - It's gonna be RAPE.

In fact, on the matter of Rape. I read in Cosmo (Hey, My chick gets fucked
often and STILL reads this!) that psychologists WARN women against guys that
say "Come to my place to see my pictures" etc. when the idea is to fuck the
chick whilst your intentions aren't known to her - because it is DATE RAPE.
Thus as Maniac found out ages ago, that GROUNDWORK is the key element to
getting the chick over to fuck. That can be done through STATEMENT OF
INTENTIONS - and may not necessarily happen through Kiss closes.
You must remember this - a kiss is just a kiss........

IF that works, THEN we can reward her with more conversation and more
Mystery style routines or whatever (because she is OK with our intentions
then - thus the rewards), and THEN up the ante some more with our STATEMENT
OF INTENTIONS, building on what we established before - to get her more hot
and horny than before. So you may have started on holding her hands, now you
may progress on to hugging, kissing, fucking etc. whatever seems to be the
most logical progression from her actions towards you.

Patterns, routines, psych tests, will help greatly during the chat routines
in-between statements of intentions. Those are what set us apart from the
other PUAs out there.

Eventually we get to a point where the chick is DDB, then we can get to the
Drag (you must take the woman to fuck location, or have her so into you that
she will come to you) and Fuck part (in our world of course). The Our World
routine would then be the ULTIMATE in the STATEMENT OF INTENTIONS series
which would then lead to the deal fuck closed. It is in this one that you
state your relationship expectations and put it in "Our World"

Now the method is Find, Stun, Drag, Fuck.

The point is - FUCK all this bullshit about the woman needs to be done in
the "right way" to match her values. Something tells me now that a woman
made this comment as an attempt to rationalize her unreasonable emotions.
The values she wants ALL ALONG is #1 SEX, and to a lesser extent #2 to be
taken care of after SEX. That goes for ANY woman (thus the universality of
the whole principle). When the guy comes along as does her, she will
rationalise that the guy understood exactly what she felt. That's what some
religious women mean when they beautifully say "God knew when it was the
right time for me". In reality, they KNOW DEEP DOWN they are at the mercy of
guys and what they want to do with her. To her, that is "destiny" and no
wonder so many women are suckers for fortune-telling and the like.

Eliciting is when you want to # close or coffee close and check the girl out
for relationship potential. If it's ONS - hey! ya don't need it! If you
cannot attempt a kiss to fuck close in the given situation - you will have
to # close, but not forget to state that your intentions could well get
beyond just coffee!

The other thing - "Make no excuses for desires as a man" is THE SINGLE MOST
IMPORTANT THING (As Ross Jeffries has already said) but I had to experience
it myself to believe it. ALL of what I explained above IS USELESS in
practical application if you are trying to follow it like a script. The idea
is to GRAB that girl and NOT let her get away! ;) So guys, HOW MUCH DO YOU
WANT THAT GIRL? WHAT ARE YOU PREPARED TO DO?

Also on that note. BE A FUCKING MAN. Act like a guy, and don't think that
mirroring a girl completely is going to make you attractive to her. I know
from experience that the more caveman I go with chicks who KNOW my
intentions, the more they respond sexually.
Talk to chicks as if you were telling your kid brother how to play football
properly, cause your kid brother happens to be shit at football. I
especially like the way Mr. Sex talks to us on ASF - giving pointers and
what-not. I'm sure he talks to chicks exactly the same way IRL - showing
congruence all along.

You can even get around the language barrier! I just about dragged a sexy
Jgirl in a bikini off the beach while babbling to them in English! A
language they didn't even understand! I did that enough and with a smile,
that the chick went DDB and ready to GO when I took her hand. Had it not
been for the cockblock!
Somebody must have taught the "Iranian from hell" this shit!

The way I think about it is much like caveman sex. You see the hot chick,
you bang her on the head with your club, you take her to your cave, you root
her. Thus :- Find Stun Drag Fuck.
Just a bit more aggressive than Find Meet Attract Close, but that's the best
way I could describe what this ugly-as-fuck PUA was doing.

These were the attitudes that I had when I was only just starting to pull
women at incredible speeds while on holiday.

The other point is on Objection handling in regards to the STATEMENT OF
INTENTIONS. What I learned from the PUA I met, is that you fight chick
bullshit with your own bullshit - with a slightly authoritive tone (no need
to REALLY get pissed).
For example :- The chicks said "We have to get to our car" and were ready to
leave
The Playboy said "You can't leave anyway because the gates are closed" even
though the gates aren't closed.
Thus this covers handling chick bullshit - on the phone as well as in real
life.
And one chick on another seduction board I read often typed something to the
tune that she wants to be with a guy that can bullshit his way into her
pants.

So there you go. Find Stun Drag Fuck.
Stun is the hardest.

> There are reasons why most of us step through seduction so gingerly.
> We know that saying or doing one wrong thing can blow up the seduction.
> As far as I can tell, letting her know you intend to fuck her before
> you fuck her is one of those things.  Another reason is that women
> won't tell you when they're ready to fuck.

But DDB does tell all!
That single most common fuckup is what is called LACK OF CONGRUENCE
(definition courtesy of Mr. Sex). Just like when I called that chick I met
yesterday "my friend" in front of her. Doing that is a sign of weakness.
Chicks can get away with having words out of congruence with their actions,
but guys CANNOT.

> You say that when you "lead girls on" and tease them too much, you look
> easy and they hate you.  But this insight doesn't make it any easier to
> recognize when you're "leading them on".  The window between when a
> woman is receptive to a close and when you've stalled her is short, and
> spotting it seems to be harder than superstring theory.  The answer
> seems to be to make hundreds of approaches, and very slowly improve
> through experience.

Well you have body language and other subtle pointers. Plus we are adding
all the time to our STATEMENT OF INTENTIONS in order to find a barrier and
cut off point. I don't doubt that noticing DDB when you have the intuition
becomes easier.

  The one concrete thing I get out of your post is
> that next time two HBs want a foursome with you and your LTR, you'll be
> more likely to recognize it.  Or maybe the situation will be different
> enough that you won't.

I fucked that up because I KNOW those chicks wanted me to go with them, and
I over-teased them and didn't capitulate and then state my intentions to
have a foursome. They would have been up for it!
That's when the Playboy showed up to show me the shit, and then beat me
hands-down in a round of THE GAME. ;)

> You also said, "Now I realise more than fucking EVER what a chick
> wants. She wants a guy to go and GET her, make her feel wanted, and
> then have the shit fucked out of her!"  But you agreed with another
> poster that you can't just walk up to a woman and say "Let's fuck."
> So what's your new insight here?

It's a no-brainer. Is sex ALL you bringing to the table? That's why he
coupled GM styled intention pointers further into the seduction (after the
earlier G-rated ones), and then when they succeeded in not objecting, he
went to Mystery routines as a reward OR to the Drag phase if they were DDB.
You cannot start the seduction with a statement of intention that skips the
buildup - unless the chick is THAT FUCKING HORNY and shameless.
Chicks want to know that you care about them as human beings and not just
sex objects. Thus neutral conversation gets smattered in between, and the
final statement of intentions clearly shows what his intentions are so SHE
KNOWS that you care about her feelings - in that way.

The Playboy I met even went to see a chick he had a threesome with the next
day (cause she was feeling a bit alone). This guy was no cheap "Player"
(which he pointed out in his great Our world styled close routine on this
9). You could tell he cared enough too.

> Have you figure out a better way to know when a woman is ready to
> be closed?  Or a faster way to get her to want to fuck?  Or a way to
> let her know your intentions without scaring her off?  What's the
> difference between your approach now and your approach before you went
> to Guam?  It sounds like you feel you understand things better than
> you did before, but I can't figure out what the new understanding is.

Well, now you have your answer.
Mind you, I'm only getting the framework now that I sit down and try and
explain what I am now doing. This shit became automatic when I had the whole
experience of witnessing this guy and learning from him.

Any questions or comments? Fire away....

Rio
-------

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
References:  <90eati$gpt@nnrp1.deja.com> <63JW5.205t1.56373@nnrp.gol.com> <90i82p$iao@nnrp1.deja.com>
Subject: Re: Find Stun Drag Fuck

Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2000 10:04:46 GMT

Jonathan Ashton  wrote in message
news:90i82p$iao@nnrp1.deja.com...
> In article <63JW5.205t1.56373@nnrp.gol.com>,
>   "Rio"  wrote:
> > Well, now you have your answer.
>
> Yeah, I understand much better now.  Thanks for writing it down.
>
> > Any questions or comments? Fire away....
>
> So I get the abstract idea now:  Make some sort of Statement Of
> Intentions (SOI) to a woman relatively early, and then act congruently
> with it.

More or less, that's it.
The thing is, after dropping routines - get to it or the chick gets confused
and drops out.
Mystery had the right idea with his routines and intros. BUT if you fail to
State your intentions - you can stall things and stale her out. Then it will
be your fault when it appears that the routines don't work! They may have
worked, but she has given up on you as a partner already. You teased too
much.

> Like most people, though, I don't really understand any abstract idea
> until I've seen two or three concrete examples; i.e. HOW to make that
> SOI.

Ross Jeffries has already covered how to do this with his NLP pacing and
leading. I'm just giving a name to the end result of doing that (SOI -
Statement of Intention).

SOIs are SO important to women. They want to know where they stand. Women
you are with and haven't SOIed will think to themselves :- "What am I to
him"?
With my LTR which I sloppily SOIed, she annoyed me for ages if I was her
boyfriend or not. I hadn't said, and was therefore walking thin ice.
That drove her NUTS.

Now, I guess I could show you some fake examples of stuff that you could
launch into your PU - but the reason why I'm not going to do that is because
if ANYBODY creates a list of them - we're going to get the problem that AFC
men ALREADY have with PU Lines. That is, throwing meaningless words into a
conversation and then not being able to back them up.
Either that, or we will develop a single street pickup routine which men
will use the world over with great success before women cotton on to it.
When it comes to SOI, DIY (damn all these acronymns!).

An example of SOI is what I said to the chick I tried to PU on the weekend.
I paced it to the point where we are talking about where we lived, and I
found out that she lived close. Then I said "That's good, so we can get
together really easy and have some fun then."
If she had been far away - no problem "That's too bad. I'll have to travel
far to get together with you and have fun"
If she lives on Mars - no problem "Wow! You live out there! I'll have to
build a rocket to come and see you after you go back there!"

So there you go. Who needs to be excessively GM?

> You gave the example of GM style.  Yep, GM makes a pretty clear SOI.
> I don't think a "recovering nice guy" like me could do GM congruently,
> though.

I have done it once successfully and it Suuure works. But yes, it's hard to
work things up to that because you skip a lot of buildup steps. The flirting
has to take place in a sexual level rather than a much safer level. That is
risky.
That's what I mean when by saying "Let's Fuck" you run the risk of having to
flirt at such a high level where you can fuck up easily. Not that it's
impossible of course.
NEGs (which I forgot to mention before) help especially in the
objection,flirt phase. This phase is like the part where the dog chases
after the bitch to try and fuck her, and the bitch keeps running. The thrill
of the chase!

> You mention TokyoPUA and Johnny Shack references, but it would take
> a lot of searching/guessing to find the specific examples you have in
> mind.  And I don't understand your Ross example - "And maybe we could
> really get to like each other" sounds like a pretty vague SOI; maybe
> I'd understand what you mean if I knew the context?

Search for stuff on the archived layguide for stuff about Johnny Shack. He
also has an online book. Ross has his old free book around the place. Search
Formhandle for TokyoPUA's posts.
By the way, I even went as far as reading ALL of Mystery's decent posts as
well.

> The only example of an SOI I see in your posts is this one from Guam
> PUA:
>
> > As for going for the fuck close? Forget your sexual accelerators.
> > This guy said the whole shit in plain English - and I saw him say
> > this all to to a chick. He basically said that he was a playboy, but
> > not a pickup artist (to frame the idea that he won't fuck and dump),
> > and that when he had sex with the chick (Framing it as if it's going
> > to happen) that she should just enjoy it for fun and not worry about
> > it too much because it's just their private thing (our world style
> > routine), and that he was not an easy guy in reality - that he was
> > quite selective in who he chooses for sex (so he doesn't look like a
> > meat-market man).
> > He said all this straight faced to a chick, and while I was watching
> > the chick he did this on - she was trancing out and playing with her
> > hair. It was totally evil.
>
> So my questions...
>
> Have you ever done a SOI to kiss a girl and not had her object?  If so,
> what did you say?  Have you ever done a SOI to fuck a girl and not had
> her object?  If so, what did you say?  Hell, do you remember the exact
> words of any SOI you've ever said?

I gave you an example above of an SOI above (where I told the chick that we
would hang out in the future). No doubt we can refine the whole shit a lot
better in the future.
And yes. I think everyone at some stage has done an SOI, or the body
language has been good enough to get her into that zone where she KNOWS
maybe at 70% where your intentions are, with or without any routines to help
snag the chick, and the chick has put up some token resistance. The purpose
of the resistance of course, is to set the scene for the chase you know will
end in a fuck if you can just reel the bitch in. You will eventually do it
as long as you have remained congruent throughout.

> What other kinds of SOIs would you use in the buildup?  Tell her you're
> going to give her a neck massage?  (I'm sure that question sounds
> clueless; but I really think the meat is in the details.)

Well pace it:-
"Have you ever felt like having a neck massage? I think you need one, so
I'll give you one"
Sometimes the more direct your SOIs are, the harder she will force you to
keep pushing them.
So let's say the chick flirts and says "Why do you want to? I don't need
one!"
So we have to SOI her again in the second sentence in this example :- "Well
you haven't had one of my massages that can make you feel good all over. Now
relax....."

The idea is to trap the chick at all costs with your intentions that you can
carry out - until she can't get away.
Even "No I can't!" "Yes you can!" "No I can't!" "Yes you can!" fights - if
that's what it comes down to - can win you the day if you persist and not
let her win! Verbal arguments can always be solved with kino - cause you as
the guy are STRONGER. I don't mean hit her, but mauling is OK as long as she
is enjoying it! ;)

Persistance is VERY important. Of course, you may want to dump the chick
after the fuck if she doesn't drop the shit because she is too much work to
obtain sex from in the long run. Just give her an ultimatum "Cut the shit or
you will be lonely!"

At the same time, you can get trapped if you say an SOI that you can't
possibly keep. So watch what you promise to do!
Saying shit like "I'm going to buy you a Rolls Royce!" when she KNOWS you
can't afford it is an extreme example of a shit SOI. There goes your trust
and congruency with that one.

> And as for one other comment you made:
>
> > (E.g. If you want to start things off gently by holding her hand,
> > tell her a scene where want to be holding her hand - and then do it
> > in the next routine after she is comfortable with this.)
>
> You mean you tell her a story about some guy you know who held some
> girl's hand?  Or what?  Methinks I really don't understand here.

You can do that to get her thinking about holding someone's hand - and once
she is feeling it, you may be able to slip in the kino and get away with it.
At least, your chances will be better.

> > Is sex ALL you bringing to the table? That's why he
> > coupled GM styled intention pointers further into the seduction
> > (after the earlier G-rated ones), and then when they succeeded in
> > not objecting, he went to Mystery routines as a reward OR to the
> > Drag phase if they were DDB.
>
> I would LOVE to see these SOIs written down.

Done as above. But make your own!
I re-explained the "Let's Fuck" problem a bit better above as well.

> So here's my deal:  I want to see more examples of SOIs so I can take
> them apart, because I really suspect that the exact wording is crucial.
>
> For example:
>
> GM gets away with his SOIs because they're exaggerated to absurdity,
> and thus they're both funny and unlikely (at least as stated).
> This puts a little distance between the SOI and the girl, so she
> doesn't slap him.

I think it's more of a case of the GM SOIs that fail, he can write them off
as being jokes. That keeps him on track and congruent.
BUT the risk of failure is very high if he doesn't cover his tracks.

> Guam PUA gets away with his SOI (quoted above) because he's talking
> about chicks in general, and not overtly about the particular chick.
> This puts a little distance between the SOI and the girl, so she's
> not pressured to make a decision right then.

This is the all important point. With some SOIs (and especially with
ambiguities in NLP) the SOIs are not in your face, BUT they are vague enough
to get the point across and then judge for a positive reaction from her or
not. However, the vagueness is simply a shot from 50 metres as opposed to a
shot from point-blank. Just make sure you hit the target.
The danger with point-blank SOIs is they are risky in so far as if you say a
dumb one you can't,won't, or don't want to carry out like "I'm going to take
you on holiday!" as opposed to an NLP shot from 50 metres which describes a
holiday and builds on it. "Have you ever been on holiday with someone
special?....."

> Am I on the right track here?  Are there other ways to word SOIs that
> get around direct resistance?  More examples would be appreciated.

You should check out patterning, but remember, a shot from point-blank is
better than 50 metres. The shortest distance between 2 points is a straight
line. There are pros and cons of both styles of course.
You can take the short path across the dangerous ravine, or the long path
around it.

> I gotta say, this whole idea of SOIs is new to me.  Maybe other PUAs
> in this group have been using them without ever realizing/stating the
> importance of them?

I just gave a name to it. People have done this stuff before and I'm just
giving it a name to help explain what I'm doing.

And no, Ray can't trademark this either and claim it's his. We have
discussed why this is enough on ASF. He's filtered anyway and I can't see
his verbal shit.

> Thanks,
> Ash

Thanks for the questions. They help challenge me in trying to explain myself
better.

Rio

-------

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Clearing SOI's up
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 12:15:23 GMT

Maniac,

I came up with the SOI concept after studying what the Guam Playboy did to
chicks. I wish I could have spent longer down there to learn more off this
guy. Oh well, I just need to save up to go again.

SOI (Statements of intention/interest) were comments that the Guam Playboy
made a lot (I assume you read my report on that place - It's nanpa
paradise!). What he did then was control the flirting that followed after
baiting her with a show of interest. He did this by offering a challenge -
when he finished doing that once he went back to fun routines, talking about
parties on the island, jokes, sex personality tests, etc. before he did
another SOI - staring out as indirect and ambiguous, before being VERY
direct. ;)

Basically what I think I have come up with, through trying to explain to the
posters that asked me about him, is a flirting construction kit.

The Guam Playboy NEGged a LOT - and he got away with it every time. He could
even tell chicks AFC things like they were beautiful, and then turn it into
a NEG if he wanted. That's what over 20 years of daily PU did for this guy.

But the NEG is only one kind of flirting (used for dumping a girl's uptight
self image). There are other kinds, such as using ambiguities, physical
light-handed slapping and pushing kino, playing tricks on people, etc. The
Playboy used plenty of variations.

Flirting is this:- One drops the SOI, and then pulls it away out of reach of
the target. Then gives another SOI, and then pulls it away again. Like with
our words, we put images of sex and romance in their heads, then pull it out
again, then out it in, then take it out, then put it back in, then take it
out again........ Mindfucking!
Once the chick is confused and teased enough, she is DDB and safely
mindfucked.

I did a PU once on a chick using the SOIs. I found out where she lived and
then said "Oh that's not far from my place, so I can come down to see you.
It's a pity I am so busy it won't happen today"
(Note that there is a bit of future pacing and presuppositioning in this)
She lapped it up and took my kino from there - despite the BF being a matter
of metres away.

The structure for the Guam Playboy routine went like this:-

- Fun routine or opener (ala Mystery) - some basic fluff - all good things
about himself, what he could do for the women (he played the helpful tour
guide). Be "Disgustingly" Charming! as he put it. The guy wasn't big on
logically drawing out routines for what he did (which is a good thing), he
just went and DID this.... thus he couldn't really explain to me what he was
doing. I had to observe.
- SOI. He said something that hinted that he was interested in the chick
(paced and lead from his opener conversation). This got her emotions going
and her ideas racing. I have found this CRITICAL if the chick is going to
stay interested in you for too long. I bored many chicks out initially when
I wouldn't get to the point.
"What do you look for in guys?" would be sufficient enough as a question to
hint at what you are after (as you have found out yourself Maniac). Starting
off on a topic about guys and relationships usually brings chicks out, but
asking "Do you have a BF?" sucks.
This Ross Jeffries inspired SOI "The more you laugh, the more you'll be
attracted to interesting people......now with me" is an ambiguous SOI.
- Before she could knock him down for any comment, he would then be a
challenge and say something like "I'm not easy", "we don't know each other
well enough yet", "but what would I know, right? ;)","I need to feel passion
first", "Yeah, you know what I'm saying". These basically FORCE the chick to
continue the flirting (initiated by the SOI) along the lines that HE wanted
(and the lines that chicks SAY they want!).
By saying that he "needed time" and "not being easy", the chick already
attracted to him would then come onto him.

Most of the time the chicks would laugh becuase they'd get stuck for a smart
comeback. And he just kept this up, alternating back to party and fun
routines, until he got to the "sex-SOI-Our World-But I'm no sleaze"routine
which would then DDB the target to fuck - or get her ready for it next time
they met.
Negative commands also work great here to spark challenge. Just like I did
with my now LJBF ex-LTR "I'm not going to fuck you".

I've noted in my past failures (too many to count) that when I have dropped
SOI hints - the chicks have taken the flirting into areas which were
impossible for me to control - fucking me up and making me look stupid.
Especially in clubs where chicks do this like child's play to anyone who
"hits" on them. They use their irrational chick logic to fuck themselves
(and you) up. If that happens, your PU is history.
We can't give the women control, especially not in flirting, because they
aren't the ones that are trying to do PU. It's their job as "virtuous" women
to try and get away from PU, or try to fuck our PU up.

Svengali also said in his MLTR theory something which rings home on this. He
said (and I quote):-

"Seventh: If you don't give a woman something to be pissed about every
now and then, she'll find something on her own, and that will be harder
to get out of (because it will be of her making and criteria, not
yours)."

That is also the point of what we should be doing in flirting. To trap the
chick into going along with what your flirting and accepting your advances
(by means of non-objection) while getting her horny at the same time. That
way we avoid snappy comebacks because you've already "Handled her objections
before they came up" (That's something I learnt as a salesman)
This causes the chick to have her token resistance stall out - and puts us
in control.
GM does this with his sex jokes, but he slams any possible retort with "Just
Kidding" thus the chick can't say anything and the flirting goes by GMs
rules and not hers.

Take Mystery's "Nice nails" NEG for example.
He starts off with an SOI "Nice nails". This in and of itself is a
compliment. If he stopped here, the chick would come back (if she were a
bitch) with some smart ass comment to get rid of Mystery.

BUT, he then puts up the CHALLENGE before she gets a chance to reply (like
GM with "Just kidding"). Seemingly innocent too. "Are they real?"

Now the chick is stuck. What's going on? He's complimented me, and now he's
knocking me down! What is he doing? I must stick around for this! What can I
say? Maybe I'll just laugh it off...!? er..?
(Note, some REAL bitches when stalled will look angry at you and say "Huh?"
to which it's GM to the rescue! with "Hide your pleasure!")

So, couple this kind of flirting with lots of things to get her feeling
horny (patterns, sex talk, whatever), and add lots of personality conveying
things thrown in for good measure - and the chick is sufficiently stunned -
and ready for the drag and fuck stage.

Oh, and the Guam Playboy is an ugly fucker. Kipp's seen the pictures.
Looks don't matter for shit. I have great respect for all the older PUAs.

I must get up to Tokyo to see you guys real soon. The inaka sucks.
We can experiment with this some more then. I've been getting rusty since I
got back from Guam.
What I do know is that when this guy's method does work, it is KILLER. We
get Mr. Smooth status and KCs like crazy.

Rio
-------
Dictate the flirting

 wrote in message news:91f5e8$dpn@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Re: SOI's
>
> Rio..
>
> You are on to something big here..
> This is a discovery!
> I will incorporate this.
>
> Please give more specific examples though. I get
> what you are saying, but not yet really how you would
> apply it. .
>
>
> Fucking excellent thread!
>
>
> Maniac
> http://www.pickupguide.com
>
>
> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/

---

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: More on SOIs
Date: Fri, 22 Dec 2000 06:17:41 GMT

THIS IS RIO TYPING IN CAPS. I'M NOT YELLING!

Comments in text below.
After New years, I WILL be ready, and we will hit
the streets.

GREAT. I HAVEN'T BEEN DOING MUCH PU UNTIL YESTERDAY (1 SOLID # FROM A 9 AND
A KC FROM ANOTHER 9) - THUS THIS POST AS I TEST OUT MY THEORY. I HAVE A
FRIEND WHO WOULD LIKE TO COME ALONG. HE'S ALREADY BRIEFED AND VERY
EXPERIENCED IN SCREWING WOMEN IN JAPAN. HE'S READ THE PICKUP GUIDE ALREADY.
HE'S EVEN BEEN SO KIND TO INTRODUCE ME TO SOME WOMEN WHO WANT MERCY FUCKS.
HE ALSO KNOWS SOME GOOD "hole in the wall" PLACES AROUND RAPPONGI WITH LOTS
OF WOMEN (SO HE SAYS).

BTW, Rio; re: 'nomad' player.. mine was fucked up, returned
it for an exchange, new one works..

IT'S SURE BEATS A TAPE RECORDER, DOESN'T IT?

First, this is brilliant material, it is going on the
website, and is core to successful PU I think. It IS what
smooth was doing.. I couldnt identify it, but now it has
been named, and described, I recognize this.. and yes, it
will be TOTALLY lethal..

THANKS. EVERY SUCCESSFUL PUA HAS BEEN DOING SOMETHING LIKE THIS (OF ONE
STYLE OR ANOTHER) TO BED WOMEN. I WENT OUT AND USED THIS FRAME YESTERDAY
WITH INTERESTING AND POSITIVE RESULTS.....

HOWEVER, I MUST SAY IT'S HARD TO GIVE SPECIFIC EXAMPLES UNLESS THEY ARE
SITUATIONALLY BASED. FOLLOWING THE LOGIC HOWEVER, AND USING IT GIVEN THE
SITUATION STILL BRING RESULTS. I WILL DESCRIBE SOME OF WHAT I HAVE BEEN
DOING WITH IT, BUT I CAN'T REMEMBER FOR THE LIFE OF ME WHAT EXACTLY THE GUAM
GUY SAID. (I ONLY RECORDED A SMALL SAMPLE OF OUR CHAT WITH MY MP3 PLAYER.
NONE OF HIS NANPA HOWEVER) WHAT I DO KNOW, IS THAT HE FOLLOWED THIS
STRUCTURE WHICH I HAVE DESCRIBED TO VERY SOME GOOD EFFECTS.

I ASSUME YOU READ MY ORIGINAL STORY ON THE GUAM TRIP.
IF SO, MY REPLY WILL MAKE MORE SENSE.

In article ,
  "Rio"  wrote:
> He did this by offering a challenge -
> when he finished doing that once he went back to fun routines,
talking about

Examples? ?

OK, HE MADE SOME KIND OF COMPLIMENT OR SUGGESTED SOME KIND OF ACTIVITY
(OFTENTIMES WITH SEXUAL OR ROMANTIC UNDERTONES) THAT THEY COULD DO TOGETHER.
(LIKE HANG TIGHT TO EACH OTHER OF THE JET POWERED BANANA BOAT) AND THEN
FOLLOWED THAT WITH A REASON WHY HE WOULD HAVE TROUBLE DOING IT. KINDA LIKE
IN SALES, A SALESMAN WOULD SAY "FOR ONE DAY ONLY SALE", WELL HE WAS LIKE "SO
YOU SHOW UP AT SUCH AND SUCH A TIME, OTHERWISE I WON'T BE ABLE TO SHOW YOU A
GOOD TIME AND I'LL TAKE SOMEONE ELSE" (a takeaway)
SO IN ORDER TO CONTINUE THE FLIRTING, THE CHICK WOULD HAVE TO SHOW UP. HE
WOULD THEN (AFTER HAVING COMPLETED A SOI ROUTINE) SIT BACK AND WATCH THE
CHICK FOLLOW THROUGH. HE WOULD OFTENTIMES BE ABLE TO CONTINUE A CONVERSATION
WITHOUT STALLING - AND MIDWAY HE WOULD SOI HER AGAIN AND DO THE SAME ROUTINE
WITH SOMETHING ELSE. I NEVER SAW HIM GET IT ON WITHIN 20 MINUTES, BUT I SAW
WHAT HE DID TO THE CHICK WITH THIS ROUTINE AND I COULD TELL THAT HE COULD
HAVE IF HE WANTED TO. HE DIDN'T LOOK DESPERATE AT ALL.

> parties on the island, jokes, sex personality tests, etc. before he
did
> another SOI - staring out as indirect and ambiguous, before being VERY
> direct. ;)

Examples ? ?

THIS GUY HAD A STRONG ELEMENT OF GM. THE SEX PERSONALITY TEST IS DOCUMENTED
IN MY POST ON THIS GUY (IT'S ABOUT ICE CREAM) - BUT AFTERWARDS UNLIKE GM, NO
COMMENT OF "JUST KIDDING". HE WOULD THEN SAY SOMETHING ELSE TO DISTRACT
ATTENTION OR PLAY "PRETEND AFC" LIKE "BUT I'M NOT EASY" OR "BUT I DON'T KNOW
YOU THAT WELL"
ALL THE MEANWHILE, GETTING THE CHICK HORNY AND CREATING A CHALLENGE.

> Basically what I think I have come up with, through trying to explain
to the
> posters that asked me about him, is a flirting construction kit.

Examples ? ?

MANIAC, YOU'RE STARTING TO OVERUSE CUT AND PASTE LIKE NYC WHEN HE RIPS APART
AFCS WITH THESE "EXAMPLES??" COMMENTS.........

(QUOTE NYC)
"YOU ARE BEING USED. SHE DOESN'T GIVE A SHIT ABOUT YOU. SHE DOESN'T INTEND
TO FUCK YOU. SHE IS FUCKING OTHER MEN THAT SHE FINDS SEXUALLY ATTRACTIVE.
YOU ARE FOOTING THE BILL FOR HER INTERNATIONAL WHORING. STOP."

HA HA HA ;)

> The Guam Playboy NEGged a LOT - and he got away with it every time.

Such as ? ?

WISH I COULD REMEMBER NOW. BUT WHAT I DID SEE IS HIM COMPLIMENTING LOTS OF
JAP CHICKS AND NOT GETTING ANY NASTY REACTION BACK FROM THEM - BECAUSE THEY
WERE SO SHY AND INEXPERIENCED. SO THE CHICKS JUST LAUGHED BECAUSE THEY HAD
NO BITCH SHIELD OF ANY TYPE.
WHERE HE DID ENCOUNTER A SHIELD, HE WOULD ATTACK HER "NASTY" PERSONALITY -
AND HER LACK OF ABILITY TO BE GRACEFUL WITH COMPLIMENTS.

IN THAT SENSE, HE WOULD ALWAYS SIZE THE CHICK UP AS IF HE WAS LOOKING FOR
LTR POTENTIAL (but we know of course, that LTR was never the plan)

He could
> even tell chicks AFC things like they were beautiful, and then turn
it into
> a NEG if he wanted. That's what over 20 years of daily PU did for
this guy.

Examples ? ?

"YOU'RE REALLY CUTE....(pause to check response)... BUT I DON'T KNOW
ANYTHING ABOUT YOU. (SAID NEGATIVELY OR NOT DEPENDING ON HER RESPONSE). SO
WHO ARE YOU ANYWAY?"

> But the NEG is only one kind of flirting (used for dumping a girl's
uptight
> self image). There are other kinds, such as using ambiguities,
physical
> light-handed slapping and pushing kino, playing tricks on people,
etc.

Such as ? ?

I'VE STOPPED USING KINO IMMIDIATELY NOW, AND SAVING IT FOR WHEN I'VE LANDED
AN SOI ROUTINE AND CAUGHT THE CHICK OUT. WHEN SHE HAS LAUGHED, I SLAP HER
GENTLY.
IT'S ANCHORING.

AS FOR TRICKS ON PEOPLE.... STUPID ONES. I WILL HAVE TO SHOW YOU THEM IN
PERSON.

The
> Playboy used plenty of variations.

Like what ? ?

GIVEN THE SITUATION, HE WOULD TRY DIFFERENT WAYS TO GET HER THINKING
ROMANTICALLY ABOUT BOTH OF THEM TOGETHER. HE WOULD USE WHATEVER WAS IN HIS
SURROUNDINGS, OR THE TOPIC OF CONVERSATION, TO PACE AND LEAD THE CHICK INTO
IMAGINING SUCH A SCENARIO.
THEN HE WOULD YANK IT AWAY BY GIVING SOME KIND OF EXCUSE (LIKE HE WAS BUSY,
HE DIDN'T THINK SHE COULD DO IT) OR HE WOULD PLAY AFC (I DON'T KNOW YOU, I
NEED TO BE IN LOVE FIRST, I'M NOT EASY, I'M NOT A PLAYER, I NEED TIME, I AM
REALLY PICKY, I HAVE BEEN HURT BEFORE, I HAVE A GF)

> Flirting is this:- One drops the SOI, and then pulls it away out of
reach of
> the target.

For example ? ?

I REALLY FEEL VERY CLOSE TO YOU, BUT I NEED TIME.

THE MAGIC WORD IS but

 Then gives another SOI, and then pulls it away again. Like with
> our words, we put images of sex and romance in their heads, then pull
it out

Like ? ?

HIS BRAVEST SOI WAS THE ONE WHERE HE SAID STRAIGHT OUT THAT HE WAS GOING TO
FUCK A CHICK. I WITNESSED THE WHOLE THING. HE SAID THAT HE WAS GOING TO FUCK
HER but (AND THEN HE WENT PRETEND AFC) I'M VERY PICKY, I'M NOT A PUA
BECAUSE THOSE GUYS TEASE WOMEN WITH BULLSHIT, MAKE EMPTY PROMISES, FUCK
THEM, AND THEN DUMP THEM. I AM A PLAYBOY. I LOVE WOMEN AND I DON'T WANT YOU
TO GET TOO ATTACHED TO ME AFTER WE HAVE SEX.

> again, then out it in, then take it out, then put it back in, then
take it
> out again........ Mindfucking!

Example please . .

OK, ANOTHER ONE:-   I WANT TO KISS YOU, BUT SOMEHOW I DON'T THINK YOU LIKE
KISSING.
(btw - this would be an SOI fairly advanced in conversation)
NOTE ALSO THAT THERE'S AN EMBEDDED COMMAND IN THE 2ND PART OF THE ROUTINE.
THAT BEING "YOU LIKE KISSING"
EVIL ISN'T IT?

> Once the chick is confused and teased enough, she is DDB and safely
> mindfucked.

how? describe this. . what exactly did he do?

WELL, THE CHICK THAT HE SAID THE "I'M GOING TO FUCK YOU" SPEECH TO, JUST
STARTED DOING ALL THE TRADEMARK BODYLANGUAGE. SHE JUST SAT THERE STUNNED
AND PLAYED WITH HER HAIR. LIKE A RABBIT LOOKING INTO BRIGHT LIGHTS. THE GUAM
GUY SAID ALL OF IT WITH A SERIOUS FACE TOO, SO SHE COULDN'T LAUGH OFF WHAT
HE WAS SAYING.

THE WAY HE WORKED DIDN'T SEEM TO BE ONE OF "ATTRACTION" PER SE. HE WOULD
EVENTUALLY CORNER THE CHICK AND FLIRT WITH HER UNTIL SHE COULD TAKE NO MORE.
UNTIL SHE GOT STUNNED

> I did a PU once on a chick using the SOIs. I found out where she
lived and
> then said "Oh that's not far from my place, so I can come down to see
you.
> It's a pity I am so busy it won't happen today"

This is good. .

THAT'S A REAL LIFE EXAMPLE OF WHAT THE WHOLE THEORY IS ABOUT. MORE
IMPORTANTLY IS THAT IT WORKED.

> (Note that there is a bit of future pacing and presuppositioning in
this)
> She lapped it up and took my kino from there - despite the BF being a
matter
> of metres away.
>
> The structure for the Guam Playboy routine went like this:-
>
> - Fun routine or opener (ala Mystery) - some basic fluff - all good
things
> about himself, what he could do for the women (he played the helpful
tour

Examples ? ?

READ SOME OF MYSTERY'S OPENERS!
TYPICALLY OFF THE WALL STUFF. WELL, WHEN HE WAS TALKING ABOUT GUAM'S CULTURE
AND PARTIES AND STUFF - FOR ALL THE TOURISTS, ALL THIS NEW INFO TO THEM IS
PRETTY OFF THE WALL.
HE WOULD TELL THE CHICKS ABOUT SOME PARTY WHERE THEY WOULD DIG A HUGE PIT
AND THROW ANIMALS ON IT IN A BIG FEAST WITH A BONFIRE AND DANCING - AND THEN
BRANCHED OUT AND TALKED ABOUT DANCING AND OTHER EXOTIC/EROTIC STUFF.

> guide). Be "Disgustingly" Charming! as he put it. The guy wasn't big
on

Like ? ?

THOSE WERE HIS EXACT WORDS. HE RELIED ON GM A LOT IN THE LATTER PART OF HIS
SEDUCTIONS.

> logically drawing out routines for what he did (which is a good
thing), he
> just went and DID this.... thus he couldn't really explain to me what
he was
> doing. I had to observe.

Yep, he's got experience.. I rarely consciously follow ManiacPlan
anymore.. just it spews out naturally.. learning PU is like learning
a foreign language/lingo.. once you get it, its natural..

I'VE BEEN LEARNING TO PLAY AFC IN MY SEDUCTIONS, AND IT HAS BEEN WORKING
REALLY WELL!

> - SOI. He said something that hinted that he was interested in the
chick
> (paced and lead from his opener conversation). This got her emotions
going

Example?  How?

OK, ANOTHER ONE.

"WOULDN'T IT BE GREAT TO SPEND TIME TOGETHER OVER COFFEE? IT'S SUCH A PITY I
HAVE TO GO TO SOME MEETINGS LATER ON, SO WE WILL PROBABLY HAVE NO TIME TO
SEE EACH OTHER EVER AGAIN BEFORE YOU GO BACK."
(WAIT FOR RESPONSE)
"BUT LET ME KNOW YOUR NUMBER ANYWAY...WHO KNOWS I MAY HAVE TIME."
(might want to save this one after you have dropped several other
SOIs)

> and her ideas racing.

Like what? which ideas? be specific please. .

ROMATIC AND/OR SEXUAL ONES.
HE WOULD START OFF ON ROMANTIC ONES AND MAKE THEM INCREASINGLY SEXUAL UNTIL
HE HIT A SEXUAL FANTASY OF HERS THAT WOULD DDB HER.
LET'S SAY "HOLDING HANDS" OR "SPENDING QUALITY TIME TOGETHER" OR "BEING
CLOSE" AND EVENTUALLY LEADING THAT INTO "TOUCHING BODIES" AND "KISSING" TO
"FUCKING" OBVIOUSLY.
A LOT OF TIME DISTORTION SOIs.

> I have found this CRITICAL if the chick is going to
> stay interested in you for too long. I bored many chicks out
initially when
> I wouldn't get to the point.
[rest deleted]

Rio, this is great stuff. Somehow I understand it.. but I need
examples of it so I can put it together as something I can try
in the field. Do you remember any specifics from this guy?

WELL, WE CAN ALWAYS WAIT FOR THE OFF-SEASON AND GO TO GUAM WITH A VCR AND
MEET THIS GUY (YOU'LL ONLY NEED ABOUT 40,000 YEN FROM TOKYO FOR A 2 DAY
TRIP) OR NEXT TIME WE MEET IN TOKYO WE CAN DO MORE STREET STUFF AND I CAN
SHOW YOU WHAT I KNOW. (I HADN'T FULLY DEVELOPED THE THEORY UNTIL AFTER MY
NIGHT OUT WITH KIPP - I OQed TOO MUCH AND FAILED TO PLACE ANY CHALLENGES
AFTER MY SOIs THAT NIGHT)
THE GUAM PLAYBOY WAS A GRANDMASTER OF STREET PU - HIS WEAKNESS WAS THAT HE
WAS A GREEDY TEAMPLAYER WITH WINGMEN.

If so, please fill in the above spaces where I ask.. it is very
important if this is to work.

Rio
-------

Using SOI’s as a way to tease/attract chicks!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Using SOI's (statements of intent) as a tease to attract a chick!


From: Jonathan Ashton 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Clearing SOI's up
Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 07:04:08 GMT

In article ,
> For example, if we were to drop an SOI on the chick, and then
> IMMEDIATELY follow up with a negative command - WE control the
> flirting so that the chick then has to work for US.
>
> So we can say things like "I want to kiss you"
> And then control the flirting by pulling away again with some reverse
> commands :-
> "BUT I don't really know anything about you, and I haven't known you
> for very long, and I need to feel love first"
> Sounds like the stuff that chicks tell us, right? Well chicks say it
> to flirt, as opposed to meaning what they say!

Omigod!  Rio, this is an awesome post!  Brilliant!  Genius!

"I was thinking about kissing you, but you'd probably slobber too
  much."
"I'd love to take you home, but I know you'd get all clingy."
"I'm just trying to guess if you're any good in bed.  Too bad you're
  too young/weird/conservative for me."
"I bet you'd love the way I do neck massages.  You've been acting up
  too much to deserve one, though."

This is so EASY!  Anyone can think these up on the spot!  There's no
need to think up ambiguous sentences or come up with just the right
innuendo.  Just make a Statement of Intentions, then let her know what
SHE has to offer to make it happen - by telling her that you won't do
it because she's not up to par!  I love it!  I will try it out ASAP!

Howcome I've never seen this idea explained before?  In retrospect,
it's clear that MrSex4uNYC and Mystery do similar stuff, but I've
never seen the dynamic explained this way before.  Ross talks about
setting challenges, but it's always seemed like such a delicate art
to say just the right thing at just the right time.

But this is so easy!  Thank you, Rio.

Ash


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

Game: Color game

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Color Game that can be used in PU!
[Maniac note: got this other list below from the 'Secrets of the cube book'
Also very good, may be appropriate when doing this game:

Red: passion, hot energy, anger warmth
Green: hope, life, nature, money
Blue: spirituality, serenity, cool energy, sadness
Purple: royalty, deep passions, mourning
Yellow: cheerfulness, brightness, eccentricity
Pink: feminity, wamrth
Brown: earthyness, warmth, conventionality
Black: mystery
White: purity
Multicolored: of many interests or moods

END: Maniac note]

From: steviewonder 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: More personality tests
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 20:20:17 GMT

In article <904e0cjv@nnrp1.deja.com>,
  maniac_high@yahoo.com wrote:
> There is good stuff on that site.
>
> I am reworking it to be more appropriate in opener type
> PU's in bars/coffee shops, will present my results of this
> work in late January after it has all been designed and
> field tested.. It will be killer..

Hi guys,

Found this game at

http://www.geocities.com/Broadway/8546/colortest.html

a good one since all the answers are sexual:

QUESTION:

Pick the color that best describes your personality?

ANSWERS:

BLACK
Black color preferences point to black sex. These people are the
misfits of the sex world and seek each other in kinship. They tend to
prefer perverted sex, and are usually masochistic or sadistic in
nature. They are moody and often perform at their peak when under
stress or during unhappy times. Police psychologists claim that many
sex offenders prefer the color black. And it is no coincidence that
the uniform of mobsters and teenaged gangs is black.

BLUE
Lovers of blue are wonderful sex partners. They are sincere,
affectionate, and sensitive to their partner's needs. They consider
lovemaking a fine art, and their approach is elegant. Men who love
blue are like concert pianists; delicately ravaging their partner like
they would play a baby grand. Women in the blue category enjoy sex
to the fullest. They are exciting partners, but their passion might be
compared to tidal waves, rather than fiery aggresion. Both blue men
and women enjoy foreplay and the aftermath of lovemaking as much
as the act. In marriages, a blue person is a wonderful mate, never
failing to please the spouse and never seeking outside interests.

BROWN
For lovers of brown, sex is a 24-hour a day thing. They tend to say "I
love you" often enough. Snuggling by the fire, walking in the rain or
catching snowflakes on their tongue ins a turn-on to a lover of brown.
They need lots of time and privacy to make love. But their emotions
are such that one harsh word could end an affair.

GREEN
Those who prefer green are fresh and innocent in their approach to
sex. Women who love green will make love like virgins all their life.
And a man may also be a trifle clumsy and awkward, but in a charming
and endearing sort of way. Green lovers are gentle, but not
passionate. If chosen as a mate, one will never need to worry about
infidelity.

GREY
The color grey is preferred by people who are indecisive. They can't
get excited about anything - including colors - so they choose a
noncommittal shade. Men who prefer grey look at sex as a means of
relieving tension - nothing more nothing less. It's "wham, bam, thank
you ma'am". Women don't make love, they have intercourse. They
count the cracks in the bedroom plaster until the sex act is over with
and done. When a grey marries another grey, the marriage is not
exactly erotic.

ORANGE
Lovers of the color orange lean toward sexual fantasies. The sex act
is regarded as a dramatic role, a one act play in which they are the
star. Foreplay is as important as the act of love. They whisper sweet
nothings, meaningless dialogue they feel fits their image. Orange
people often do not experience orgasm - but they put on a damn good
act. Men tend to pull their partner's hair and women tend to leave
welts on their sex partner's back!

PINK
Persons who like pink show a reluctance to mature in sexual matters.
Women tend to tease; to promise more than they intend to deliver. In
some cases, they flaunt their femininity, but only because they
secretly hate men. A great percentage of prostitutes boast entire
wardrobes in pink. Men who like pink are the type who make 3 dates
for the same evening and not keep them, preferring to pick up a dish
in some bar instead.

PURPLE
Lovers of purple frequently consider themselves too regal for  fun
romp in the sack. Women sometimes are the type who hate to muss
their hair. Men are businesslike in their approach to lovemaking. In
both sexes, purple partners are more concerned with their
fulfillment then anyone else's gratification.

RED
People who like red tend to be tigers in the sack. They are easily
aroused and enjoy sex in every way imaginable. Once the sexual spark
is lit, it may take hours to extinguish. When two reds get together,
the ensuing erotica would make Lady Chatterly blush. Lovers of red
tend to be the aggressors and weaker colors should beware!

YELLOW
If you tend to favor yellow, your sexual drives are complex and lean
toward the adaptable. The favorite color of homosexuals is yellow!
But don't panic - not everyone who wears yellow is homosexual. In
most cases the person will accommodate to the stronger partner's
desires in a passive manner. You will never enjoy sex to the fullest,
but you will never turn down an invitation from someone you enjoy or
admire.

--
To email me remove the _obvious from this address:
steviewonder_ob@viousfastmail.ca

Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

Handling delusional chicks, karatebabe lives a nightmare!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Re: Mystery: delusional chicks & sympathy lies! 
Date: 11/12/2000 
Author: maniac_high  

 << previous in search  ?  next in search >>  

Re: Mystery: delusional chicks & sympathy lies!
001112
 
Mystery wrote in another post this week regarding lying
to chicks, about how not to underestimate how delusional
a chick is willing to become in order to keep her 'happy'
view of the world.
 
He is absolutely right. And this explains how seeming
'jerk' can get away with what seems like such ridiculous
shit.
 
Case in point, is where I recently did a fuckup, and then
recovered with Karatebabe (see lay report, my page). This
is the chick that would go around my place after sex
cleaning up her own hairs so that "the other chicks"
wouldnt find out about her.
 
Well, one day we are going for coffee, and she asks me
if I had been seeing another chick at the time I started
dating her. Figuring (incorrectly) from her behavior,
that this chick knew totally what the score already was,
I said I had been (wrong answer!).
 
She freaked out and went balistic at me. Shit about "how
I make her fool, go behind her back..and other shit".
In retrospect it was clear though.. she got upset, because
something she merely 'suspected' (even though it was fucking
obvious as shit, as other chicks stuff was all over the
fucking house), now became something 'confirmed', and that
shattered her entire world..
 
I then smartened up and realized what I had just done,
and recovered by saying that I dumped her after I first
started dating you (Karatebabe), a few weeks later.
 
After that, she settled down (even though every week
there was different chick stuff all over the house
after that!). She asked me about it, and I said no,
there are no chicks..
 
She said she accepted that, and that her 'nightmare'
now was over, and everything was fine again.
 
Later she found some makeup and chick stuff in the
bathroom cabinet (another chick must have slipped
it there for someone else to find it), so I had
to think fast on my feet for that one...
 
So I told her that I have a real dark secret and
she might be very disappointed in me (now she is
expecting to hear something about a chick)..
 
Then (remembering she likes gays and stuff) I tell
her that I like to make believe to dress like a girl
(lots of J-guys do it actually, so I know it is not
so far fetched here), and I have guy friends that do it
with me, and sorry I didnt tell you earlier.. (of
course this is TOTALLY false.. Maniac is not even
remotely gay, nor a crossdresser or any of that shit)...
however.. she ACCEPTED that story, and was relieved
(in spite of the fact that I was almost cracking up
when I said it, since I was SURE she would call me
on my bullshit... but she didnt)!
 
Fuck!, the totally ridiculous things you have to
tell a chick...  AND! they accept it (as they
try to internalize it and believe it at least at
some level so that their happy delusional world
doesn't come crashing to bits)..
 
Strange, isnt it..!
 
Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Using the laws of power in PU!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Toecutter, and using the laws of power!




From toecutter@mail.com Mon Oct 23 09:39:39 2000
From: "toecutter" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Lessons from Book: The 48 Laws of Power
Lines: 201


Just reading a book, The 48 Laws of Power by Robert Greene. Definitely
lessons everywhere in the book on what we do here.
The book is amoral, and open about the deception inherit in what he is
teaching. It is largely for life outside the arena of seduction, but
entrirely applicable and there are some seduction examples in it to
illustrate his points (only historical: For example the advice of Ninon de
Lenclos on seduction to the Marquis de Sevigne and what happened when the
Marquis did not follow her advice, etc.). The examples are all pulled from
the Sun Tzu (Chinese, the Art of War), European history, famous con men,
magicians and charlatans, Kings, Queens, Napoleon and other power brokers
such as Al Capone. Perfect for you guys who enjoy Machiavelli. At 450
reasonably large format pages it is fairly long.

It is going to take me several re-readings, but at the moment I see the
messages as really 3 fold: First, play your cards pretty close to your
chest. This creates mystery. The more you say, the more common you appear
and the less in control. Andy Wohol created enigma by not discussing his
work and answering questions by being intentionally vague giving people the
feeling that he was being more profound than he was.  If you do not reveal
all, people will never become bored with you or your presence because you
will continue to represent a challenge, and will be eternally interesting.
Your silence will make other people feel uncomfortable and humans are
machines of interpretation and explanation; they have to know what you are
thinking. When you carefully control what you reveal, they cannot pierce
your intentions and meaning. Your short answers will put them on the
defensive and they will jump in, nervously filling the silence with all
kinds of comments that will reveal valuable information about themselves and
their weaknesses.

This brings me to the second message. Learn everything you can about other
people. Their strengths and weaknesses, their crutches and trance words.
Their motivations. Use these to your advantage whilst revealing as little as
possible about yourself. Keep them the focus of the conversation, and be a
'Spy' on their minds by eliciting values.

The third lesson is to use smoke and mirrors to obscure your objectives and
motivations. Throw decoys out there, use gifts as Trojan horses, and be
circumspect in what is going on. Again, this throws them off your game,
gives you an upper hand.

None of this is to say that you need to be quiet or a bad conversationalist,
just the opposite, by spying and eliciting values, you are encouraging
people to talk about themselves, their own favourite subject. By being brief
about yourself you are creating mystery and interest. It is just that you
are collecting the information in order to use it against them at another
time, whilst manipulating your image and reputation in their minds and
obscuring your real motivations. In some ways it is a book on playing hard
to get while outmanoeuvring the girl. A perfect structure in which to drop
SS.

Some of the content is below. I can post more on it if you would like
further discussion; I am overflowing with ideas on it.

Toecutter.

---

To list some of the laws that are obviously applicable:

Law 3: Conceal your intentions (Keep people off balance and in the dark by
never revealing the purpose behind your actions. If they have no clue what
you are up to, they cannot prepare a defence. Guide them far enough down the
wrong path, envelop them in enough smoke, and by the time they realise your
intentions, it will be too late.)

Law 4: Always say less than is necessary

Law 6: Court attention at all costs

Law 8: Make other people come to you - use bait if necessary

Law 9: Win though your actions, never through argument. (Any momentary
triumph you win though argument is really a Pyrrhic victory: The resentment
and ill will you stir up is stronger and lasts longer than any momentary
change in opinion. It is much more powerful to get others to agree with you
though your actions, without saying a word. Demonstrate, do not explicate.)

Law 10: Infection: Avoid the unhappy and unlucky (it works the other way
also. This is an alternative take on social-proof, or pivots or whatever you
want to call them, as well as wingmen. Also advice on not getting involved
with the wrong girl.)

Law 11: Learn to keep people dependent on you.

Law 12: Use selective generosity to disarm your victim (One sincere and
honest move will cover over dozens of dishonest ones. Openhearted gestures
of honesty and generosity bring down the guard of even the most suspicious
people. Once your selective honesty opens a hole in their armour, you can
deceive and manipulate at will.)

Law 13: When asking for help, appeal to people's self interest, never to
their mercy or gratitude.

Law 14: Pose as a friend, work as a spy.

Law 16: Use absence to increase respect and honour. (Again through mystery
and not stuffing it up by staying too long and doing or saying something
wrong.)

Law 17: Keep others in suspended terror: Cultivate an air of
unpredictability

Law 18: Do not build fortresses to protect yourself - Isolation is
dangerous. (Get out there amongst them).

Law 19: Know who you are dealing with - do not offend the wrong person.

Law 20: Do not commit yourself to anyone.

Law 21: Play a sucker to catch a sucker - appear dumber than your mark. (Let
her think that she is in control and smart, less naive, don't let on you are
a player).

Law 25: Re-create yourself (Do not accept the roles that society foists on
you. Re-create yourself by forging a new identity, one that commands
attention and never bores the audience. Be the master of your own image
rather than letting others define it for you. Incorporate dynamic devices
into your public gestures and actions - your power will be enhanced and your
character will seem larger than life).

Law 26: Keep your hands clean. (You must seem a paragon of civility and
efficiency: Your hands are never soiled by mistakes and nasty deeds.
Maintain such a spotless appearance by using others as scapegoats and cat'
s-paws to disguise your involvement).

Law 27: Play on peoples need to believe to create a cult like following.
(advice in this chapter is on how to become a cult leader or maybe build a
harem. 5 strategies to your dogma! a) Keep it vague; Keep it simple b)
Emphasise the visual and sensual over the intellectual c) Borrow the forms
of organised religion to structure the group d) Disguise your income source
e) set up an us-vs.-them dynamic. I think Ross Jeffries read this one!)

Law 28: Enter action with Boldness. (If you are unsure of a course of
action, do not attempt it. Your doubts and hesitations will infect your
execution. Timidity is dangerous: Better to enter with boldness. Any
mistakes you make through audacity are easily corrected with more audacity.
Everyone admires the bold; no one honours the timid).

Law 29: Plan all the way to the end.

Law 30: Make your accomplishments seem effortless. (Your actions must seem
natural and executed with ease. All the toil and practice that goes into
them, also all the clever tricks, must be concealed. When you act, act
effortlessly, as if you could do much more. Avoid the temptation of
revealing how hard you work - it only raises questions. Teach no one your
tricks or they will be used against you .. I am breaking this rule right
here with this post, as is the Authour of the book.)

Law 31: Control the options: Get others to play with the cards you deal.
(The best deceptions are the ones that seem to give the other person a
choice: Your victims feel they are in control, but are actually your
puppets. Give people options that come out in your favour whichever one they
choose. Force them to make choices between the lesser of two evils, both of
which serve your purpose. Put them on the horns of the dilemma: they are
gored wherever they turn. Note: this is a different view on my idea of
re-framing questions. The questions are re-framed so well that the girl has
no option.)

Law 32: Play to people's fantasies.

Law 33: Discover each mans thumbscrew.

Law 34: Be royal in your own fashion: Act like a king to be treated like
one.

Law 35: Master the art of timing. (Never seem to be in a hurry - hurrying
betrays a lack of control over yourself, and over time. Always seem patient,
as if you know that everything will come to you eventually. Become a
detective of the right moment; sniff out the spirit of the times, the trends
that will carry you to power. Learn to stand back when the time is not yet
ripe, and to strike fiercely when it has reached fruition.)

Law 36: Disdain things you cannot have: Ignoring them is the best revenge.

Law 37: Create compelling spectacles. (Striking imagery and grand symbolic
gestures create the aura of power - everyone responds to them. Stage
spectacles for those around you, then, full of arresting visuals and radiant
symbols to heighten your presence. Dazzled by appearances, no one will
notice what you are really doing.)

Law 40: Despise the free Lunch.

Law 43: Work on the hearts and minds of others.

Law 44: Disarm and infuriate with the mirror effect. (The mirror reflects
reality, but is the perfect tool for deception: When you mirror your
enemies, doing exactly as they do, they cannot figure out your strategy. The
mirror Effect mocks and humiliates them, making them overreact. By holding
up a mirror to their psyches, you seduce them with the illusion that you
share their values; by holding up a mirror to their actions you teach them a
lesson. Few can resist the power of the mirror effect.)

Law 48: Assume formlessness. (By taking a shape, by having a visible plan,
you open yourself to attact. Instead of taking a form for the girl to grasp,
keep yourself adaptable and on the move. Accept the fact that nothing is
certain and no law is fixed. The best way to protect yourself is to be as
fluid and formless as water: never bet on stability or lasting order.
Everything changes.)

Disarming groups of guys around chicks!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

When lots of guys are around 1 girl, you must disarm guys!


From: "Stepleader" 
Subject: Re: She has nice/great body and/or face -- but what about her?
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2000 10:02:45 GMT

great pep talk and I love your posts ... but ...

the situ called for a disarming of the guys.  Here is how.  Approach the
group but pay NO attention to the girl.  Begin the chat with the guys and
make them interested in your story telling.  MALE BONDING comradery.  Turn
you back to HER so she feels out of place.  What you have done is removed
all the attention from her (stolen it).  You are now the center of
attention.  A couple NEGS her way challenges her.  All the other guys were
on her - all but one.  YOU.

Just so you know, this is mystery methods groupset theory and Ive done this
successfully a great # of times.

from this vantage point you may now take her  by the hand and say to the
others, "is it alright if I steal your friend away for a bit?"  they will
say yes and you take her out of earshot.  Id love you to see me work a set
like that.  its brilliant.  and PRACTICAL.

Svengali  wrote in article
<131220002147344283%Svengali_here@use.net>...
> Gentlemen, you're looking for the whole package, not just the
> packaging.  And if all you're focusing on is the packaging, she damn
> well knows it and is in control of you --period!
> 
> You must, repeat, you must be prepared to walk at all times, no matter
> how much you would like to be on/in that body and face.
> 
> Remember, you are screening her to see if she is good enough for
> you, not the other way around.  And the only way you're going to find
> out if she is good enough for you is to learn as much as you can
> about the person that is within that female form.
> 
> Am I saying you must be screening every beauty for a long term
> relationship?  Hell no!  It can be for however long you want.  But
> the moment she sees, and it won't take her long, that you are screening
> her to see whether or not she is good enough for you, is the moment
> the tables get turned and she understands that she has to make herself
> look good in your eyes.
> 
> Now contrast this with all the other guys who are trying to make
> themselves look good in her eyes, so they can get on/in her.
> 
> To illustrate what I am saying, picture this: we're in a manhattan bar,
> and there is this gorgeous looking woman, with the greatest face you've
> seen, talking to a few guys.  One happens to be our own great NYC with
> his magnificient weight-lifting body and his "I'm great" attitude; 
> another is Riker with his patterns, a third is Greg19 with his band of
> ways, and so on.  So basically what you would have is a bunch of guys
> trying to find and give this woman what she wants, so as to get on/in
> her.
> 
> Then there's Svengali, with his Carey Grant looks and ways, who sees
> the woman, walks right up into the group and says "excuse me guys, I
> just wanted to ask the lady where she got, and whose idea it was to get
> those earrings that seems to make her skin sparkle and her eyes glow,
> and then I'll leave." [Turning to her] "So please tell me, where did
> you get, and what made you decide [Svengali's hand goes out to the
> earrings, and in the process, lightly touches the lady's neck] to get
> these earrings that seems to make your skin sparkle and your eyes
> glow?"  {She tells me.}  "Thank you."  "Bye guys, I'm going back over
> there [pointing, so the lady knows where I will be]."
> 
> Look what just occurred: (1) I showed I wasn't afraid of a damn thing. 
> (2) I disarmed my opponents.  (3) I made her feel good.  (4) I showed
> her I wasn't about to hang around and try and get her.  {Of course to
> firmly establish that point, I would engage another woman in
> conversation, and have her positioned in a way that the first woman
> would see her with me, which would have her wondering what kind of nice
> things was I saying to her, that she wasn't getting.}.
> 
> Who do you think the woman is likely to be focused on and thinking
> about: all the guys who are there, still trying to get to her, or the
> guy who said what he wanted, made her feel good/great, left, and is now
> focused on someone else?  {I removed one of her feel good sources, so
> even though the others are there, with theirs, she like nearly everyone
> of us, is focused on the one that's been lost, not the ones that are
> present.}
> 
> Show your interest in her, but also show that you are walking the
> moment *she's* not exactly like you want.
> 
> Now I'll play devil's advocate and say that my little "walk away"
> didn't work.  Do you think I care?  Hell no, and I'll tell you why: the
> one who chases to gets, will always have to chase to have.  So whoever
> would win with the woman, would have to keep providing whatever they
> did to keep her interested.  I, on the other hand, only need to use a
> little charm and then walk away to have her wanting me.
> 
> I ask you, who do you think has an easier time of it?
> 
> -- 
> If you don't know in the first twenty minutes whether or not you're going
to
> have sex with the woman you just met, and whether or not you even want
to,
> you're not a seductionist.
> 
>   'o o'
> Svengali
>

Taking control when things go wrong

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Re: Mystery: delusional chicks & sympathy lies! 
Date: 11/12/2000 
Author: maniac_high  

 << previous in search  ?  next in search >>  

Re: Mystery: delusional chicks & sympathy lies!
001112
 
Mystery wrote in another post this week regarding lying
to chicks, about how not to underestimate how delusional
a chick is willing to become in order to keep her 'happy'
view of the world.
 
He is absolutely right. And this explains how seeming
'jerk' can get away with what seems like such ridiculous
shit.
 
Case in point, is where I recently did a fuckup, and then
recovered with Karatebabe (see lay report, my page). This
is the chick that would go around my place after sex
cleaning up her own hairs so that "the other chicks"
wouldnt find out about her.
 
Well, one day we are going for coffee, and she asks me
if I had been seeing another chick at the time I started
dating her. Figuring (incorrectly) from her behavior,
that this chick knew totally what the score already was,
I said I had been (wrong answer!).
 
She freaked out and went balistic at me. Shit about "how
I make her fool, go behind her back..and other shit".
In retrospect it was clear though.. she got upset, because
something she merely 'suspected' (even though it was fucking
obvious as shit, as other chicks stuff was all over the
fucking house), now became something 'confirmed', and that
shattered her entire world..
 
I then smartened up and realized what I had just done,
and recovered by saying that I dumped her after I first
started dating you (Karatebabe), a few weeks later.
 
After that, she settled down (even though every week
there was different chick stuff all over the house
after that!). She asked me about it, and I said no,
there are no chicks..
 
She said she accepted that, and that her 'nightmare'
now was over, and everything was fine again.
 
Later she found some makeup and chick stuff in the
bathroom cabinet (another chick must have slipped
it there for someone else to find it), so I had
to think fast on my feet for that one...
 
So I told her that I have a real dark secret and
she might be very disappointed in me (now she is
expecting to hear something about a chick)..
 
Then (remembering she likes gays and stuff) I tell
her that I like to make believe to dress like a girl
(lots of J-guys do it actually, so I know it is not
so far fetched here), and I have guy friends that do it
with me, and sorry I didnt tell you earlier.. (of
course this is TOTALLY false.. Maniac is not even
remotely gay, nor a crossdresser or any of that shit)...
however.. she ACCEPTED that story, and was relieved
(in spite of the fact that I was almost cracking up
when I said it, since I was SURE she would call me
on my bullshit... but she didnt)!
 
Fuck!, the totally ridiculous things you have to
tell a chick...  AND! they accept it (as they
try to internalize it and believe it at least at
some level so that their happy delusional world
doesn't come crashing to bits)..
 
Strange, isnt it..!
 
Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Maniac High's Pick Up Girls Guide and Seduction Website! » mystery

Maniac High — Thu, 20 May 2010 12:22:49 +0000

Buy Reductil No Prescription, From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Mystery and others write about successful openers.

Status: O

talk about esp and its impossibility

talk about how you met a bear while hiking

talk about how you were scared shitless rock climbing when your rope snapped

or talk about the famous person you met

does she believe in ghosts. why, Buy Reductil No Prescription.

or hotseat (like question game but more brutal)

talk about the time you bladed down a steep hill and survived. Buy Reductil No Prescription, talk about the time you were on stage

...

mystery

-----

From nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org Wed Apr 12 07:31:37 2000
From: nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org (Nathan SZILARD)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: After the # close

They find it very funny and show it to their friends, plus
they remember, Buy Reductil No Prescription.

| If you did any anchoring on your voice when you met, order Reductil, Buy Reductil without a prescription, now's the time to
| unleash them.

----

From slidewguy@remove-aol.com Wed Apr 12 07:47:28 2000
From: "whoisthis19"
Subject: Some closes
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast

Any of you guys got ways of getting chicks to leave with you outside
the club.

greg1

Did you sleep with yourself or... did you turn yourself down because
you was too easy.

Doing Successful Openers

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Mystery and others write about successful openers!



From: "Mystery" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast,Alt.psychology.nlp,alt.hypnosis
References: <37602334.55753831@bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Chat suggestions
Date: Wed, 16 Jun 1999 04:58:12 -0700
Lines: 63
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts7-36t-14.idirect.com
Message-ID: <37676655@nemo.idirect.com>
X-Trace: 16 Jun 1999 04:54:45 -0400, ts7-36t-14.idirect.com
Organization: via Internet Direct

Status: O

talk about esp and its impossibility

talk about how you met a bear while hiking

talk about how you were scared shitless rock climbing when your rope snapped

or the time you visited your friends friend with him and your buddy was
almost beaten to death when the friend he visited had a boyfriend who came
out and there was a 20 minute car chase through lights and you were looking
for the cops but lot the crazed boyfriend before you found cops.

or the time you were in the hospital and it changed the way food tastes.
the birds sound clearer now.

or the time you netbused (hacked) into a bank but chickened out and put the
money into a charity

or talk about the famous person you met

does she believe in ghosts?  why?

you like candles and incense.  what does SHE like?  the music game modified
for all types of objects.

play the question game with her

or hotseat (like question game but more brutal)

talk about the time you bladed down a steep hill and survived.

talk about the time you were on stage

...

mystery



-----


From nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org Wed Apr 12 07:31:37 2000
From: nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org (Nathan SZILARD)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: After the # close

On Mon, 03 Apr 2000 21:26:22 GMT, Rio  wrote:
| I was reading elsewhere on a post, that if you instruct her to sound
| cheerful on the phone when you call when you do a # close.

I tried that, it's not a magic bullet. But it's fun.

I now always write some shit along with my phone #:
something like "DO NOT FALL IN LOVE" or "NO STALKING PLEASE".

They find it very funny and show it to their friends, plus
they remember.

| If you did any anchoring on your voice when you met, now's the time to
| unleash them.



----

From slidewguy@remove-aol.com Wed Apr 12 07:47:28 2000
From: "whoisthis19" 
Subject: Some closes
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast

Hand her the slip of paper and pen and have her write down her number.
When she's hands it back, ask her to put it someplace so you will
remeber to call her.  Last time I did this she put it down my pants and
grabbed my cock.  

Ask a gal to trade shirts.  When she balks, keep pressing in a joking
manner then finally ask to her to go outside to trade shirts.  Nothing
better then getting her outside.

Another one is simply saying its too smokey, noisy, smelly in here. 
Lets go outsde for some air.

Any of you guys got ways of getting chicks to leave with you outside
the club?

greg1

Did you sleep with yourself or... did you turn yourself down because
 you was too easy.

A conversation with Mystery! Pickups

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


A conversation with Mystery!

Tips on fieldwork from a pick up artist! on IRC #PUA!


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A Conversation with Mystery, a Pick-up Artist (PUA)

Topics Include: 

The Kiss Close
Clubbing alone
Handling guys
Being a story-teller
Preparation and format
Quality vs. quantity

Lego: Hey Mystery, what's your favorite story to close with?  How 
exactly do you transition from the telling of a story to closing?

Mystery: "The Kiss Close" is my favorite routine.  Once you have three 
indicators of interest (she touches you, laughs consistantly at your 
jokes, leans in towards you, smiles a lot and keeps eye contact, resumes 
chat when you force silence, etc) you then phase shift.  You turn 180 
degrees on a dime.  Go from humorous and non-sexual to saying, "Stop.  
Would you like to kiss me?", right out of the blue.  She will say either 
say, "Uh - no",(which is unlikely as you don't bother performing "The 
Kiss Close" until enough indicators are present) or, "I donno" (they 
rarely say, "Yes"). "I donno" means she actually does want to but feels 
embarrassed on how to say "Yes".  So you reply, "Lets find out", then go 
in slowly and kiss her.  It's very simple and very effective.  If she 
says, "Why?", this is also a yes.  Simply reply, "It looked like you had 
something on your mind.  Would you like to kiss me?"  Wait again for 
her response.  If her response is "No" then reply, "Hey I didn't say you 
COULD.  You just had that look in your eye."

Lego: What do you do if you're interrupted? You're telling your target 
a story and she is all into it but some AFC cock-blocking idiot just 
runs up and starts screaming and yelling and you're like, "What the 
fuck?"

Mystery: Simply ask him if you can borrow his pen.  When he gives it to 
you, throw it away as you say, "Fetch."

Wakeboarder: Hahaha.  Nice!

Lego: What if he's bigger than you?

Mystery: I'd instead call him on his disruptive shit and remark, "Dude, 
what are you attempting here?"  Not good enough?  Then say, "Ladies?  
Shall we discover what adventure awaits us in another room?"

Wakeboarder: Man, none of my buds want to go to the club.

Gamer: Screw them then.

Mystery: Go alone.

Wakeboarder: I need to be made fun of for this comment but I feel like 
a weiner if I go to a club myself

Lego: Bro, your trippin'. I go solo many times. It's good actually.  
It's weird if it's a first night but if I've been there before it's cool.

Mystery: Yeah, I understand ... and yet, staying home alone will make 
you feel so much better?  Go out alone, meet some cool dudes when you 
get there (they will become your wingmen there) and then run around 
getting #'s.  Report to your fellow PUAs what happened.  Whatever happened 
to the concept, "The alphamale gets all the women?"  Shit dude, what are 
you, a mommas boy?  Do you need your hand held?  

Lego: How do you strike up conversations with guys?

Mystery: Walk up and say, "Hey dude, question for ya.  Do you know 
where a good place to score is in this city? 'Cause this place looks like a 
cock farm."

Lego: Good!  You should be able to relate to guys to disarm them.  You 
don't compete; you ELIMINATE COMPETETION.

Gamer: LOL.  Dude, the only results I've had were solo.  My friends 
psych me out too much because they never help.  Instead they just complain 
about my taking too much time.  They laugh at me or just generally piss 
me off.

Mystery: I have MUCH better results (and MUCH more fun) playing "The 
Game" alone.  It forces you to approach.  It's a great motivator.

Lego: Damn! I couldn't have put it better myself.

Gamer: Yep.

Mystery: You wont be alone for more than five minutes once you approach 
your first set anyways.  Gamer, I suggest you call them on their shit 
at some point.  Demonstrate your alphamale characteristics.

Lego: How do you continue talking?  I mean, group set dynamics are much 
different in a one one on one approach.

Mystery: Be a story-teller - THAT is the skill of the PUA.  It isn't 
SEDUCING; it's STORY-TELLING.  It is my personal belief that SS patterns 
arent as 'hypnotic' as they are 'entertaining' stories.

Wakeboarder: Sweet

Lego: Actually with the story stuff I SEE WHAT YOU MEAN.  They just 
follow that lead.

Wakeboarder: Well, I need to stop being a sackless wonder and grow some 
fuckin' balls then!  Hmm, story telling ...

Mystery: Here's an example.  "Ever been camping?  Well I was up in a 
forest up north and was hiking with some girlfriends of mine ... and we 
came along some trail and there was shit on the path.  My friends were 
like, "haaaa someone shit in the woods" and I said, "lets get the fuck 
out of here like NOW."  they thought I was just scared of shit and I 
said, "Girls, you dont get it.  This shit is still warm and its not human.  
Its bear shit.  This is a big fucking bear.  Look at the size of that 
turd."  Notice it's not sexual?  Most hot girls gets get "sex-talk" 
right away from AFCs.  NOT talking sex with them makes them question 
whether you are interested in them.  Leave them guessing until you get 
indicators of interest from them.  If they like your great personality 
(confident, humorous, etc) they will give you subtle but distinct clues.

Gamer: How do you flow from story to story?

Mystery: If there is ONE mental state you should force yourself into, 
its TALKATIVE.  Talk your fucking HEAD off.  Just go from one story 
straight into another one like a comedian does.  Ever find yourself excited 
about something and you talk and talk and talk?  THAT is what must 
happen to get a girl.  You have to ENTERTAIN them.  Look talkative yet not 
desperate.  

Gamer: Heh.

Lego: Dude, I had that going last night. You're so right.  That's an 
excellent example dude.  I was telling this story about getting harassed 
by cops or some shit.  It's a cool story but my delivery sucked and I 
was losing one of the two girls I was telling it to.  What if they fail 
to elaborate on your story?  Besides it being a bad story to begin 
with, how can you fix it on the fly?

Mystery: They don't have to interact with it.  Its a good thing to have 
flexible stories to allow for some comment but it's not nessessary.  
It's YOUR job to perform the material.  It's your audiences job to 
listen,laugh and generally be entertained.  That's it.  At the end of 10 
minutes you will see the girls digging you (positive indicators).  You then 
phase shift abruptly into the close.

Lego: HOW DO YOU PHASE SHIFT?  I've been wondering this. While I didn't 
come off as obvious in last nights case and just told her to kiss me (I 
knew she would anyway), this could have been smoother.

Alpha: Lego, you ad libbed the close?  So working on ad libbing is 
good?

Mystery: Ad libbed material is not as accurate in closing as is 
performing the well constructed and field-tested "Kiss Close" routine.  Ad 
libbing is BONUS material but don't COUNT on it.  Have your material, like 
a good comedian, prepared before performing.  This isn't "A Night at 
the Improv" fellas.

Gamer: Heh.

Mystery: All PUs have a format; a beginning, a middle and an end.  If 
you don't know what the next routine is going to be then you may end up 
with an unfortunate pregnant pause which fucks up your pacing.  You may 
end up filling the silence with the deadly, "So ... um ... what do you 
do?"  Preparation saves face.  Afterall, with your particular close, 
she could have pulled away from your trying to kiss her.  Then what?!!  
Instead, consider engaging her in enthusiastic conversation, then go 
directly into the close.  In other words, stop her in mid-sentence and 
with a curious tone, kiss close.

Wakeboarder: cool.  Lego, what indicators clued you in that she wanted 
the kiss?

Alpha: In what way can you be prepared?  If we're talking about 
story-telling in front of a random girl we just met seconds ago in a random 
place ...

Mystery: Like a good comedian, have your material prepared yet when 
onstage be prepared to dynamically omit certain routines and to add others 
on the fly.  Sometimes certain routines fit the situation better than 
others.  Have 3 to 5 alternative openers (as a comedian would) and enjoy 
performing the one you think best fits the situation will get the best 
reaction for the group you are in front of

Alpha: Gotcha now.  Can you give me a brief example of how you go about 
preparing?

Mystery: Sure.  First, find 3 openers and memorize them.  Write down a 
list of openers (just the headings of each opener to remind you).  
Next, write down some routines (the question game, the music game, the 
photo routine, the bear in the woods story, etc - all on dejanews) and then 
also memorize the kiss close and the # close.  Memorize 3 NEGs too and 
you are good to go.  With the material in your mind, you are prepared 
to work it in the field until you have the timing of the material down 
(again, just like a comedian.)

Alpha: Man, you provide some really eye-opening ideas... (just when I'm 
about to think there's nothing more to learn.

Wakeboarder: So what you're saying is have a routine set up and modify 
it to each situation? Kind of like having a PU template?

Mystery: It's ALL about format.  Know the format and stick to it.  If 
you now what the next step is in the PU, you wont feel scared.  It gets 
fun and you begin to appreciate the strategy behind it all.

Wakeboarder: Yeah like FMAC? That's a simple format.

Mystery: Yes, FMAC.  Each letter in FMAC is an abrupt phase shift.  
"FIND" means having to abruptly disturb your complacency by getting out of 
the house.  It takes effort for many people to do bother getting THIS 
FAR.  "MEET" is a HUGE abrupt change.  "There she is!  3, 2, 1, GO!"  In 
the "ATTRACT" phase, you need to go from the walk up to the TALKATIVE 
performer entertaining story-teller.  You will need A LOT of energy for 
this (enthusiasm is contagious afterall) and for many to go from 
slumping around to being in performer mode is ABRUPT.  Finally you must then 
"CLOSE"; to phase shift from humour to serious is also abrupt.  Each 
phase may FEEL awkward but it looks normal.  When a comedian finishes one 
topic and just goes into an entirely new unrelated topic, the audience 
doesn't care as long as the next topic is entertaining.

Wakeboarder: Very true.

Gamer: Cool.  I'm collecting openers and other routines off the 
layguide right now.

Alpha: Do you believe in the 80/20 'rule'?  Meaning, 80% of the quality 
women are found in 20% of the right places or connections or 
situations.

Mystery: The quality of a woman is SO subjective. Quality is difficult 
to QUANTIFY.  80% of QUALITY?  It's pointless trying to mix and match 
these concepts. INSTEAD consider that there are HOTTIES and UGs (YOU get 
to decide based on your personal criteria) and of the HOTTIES, some 
have pleasant personalities and others do not.  You cannot possibly judge 
her personality until she LIKES you.  So go out ... FIND her, MEET her, 
ATTRACT her and THEN decide if you want to CLOSE her AFTER judging her 
personality.  Judging her by the way she treats you on your approach is 
lame because particularly beautiful women all have their bitch shields 
up and running.  They have to.  They aren't planning on fucking every 
guy that says Hi to them.  The only way to get rid of the guys is to 
oftentimes offend them quickly.  It's not personal.  It's merely a learned 
strategy.  So is the "I have a boyfriend excuse, but that's a different 
story.  I also suggest CLOSING everyone just for the education.  You 
don't actually have to CALL the girls of course.  You simply get to 
practice CLOSING too.  Getting a girls number is merely an OPTION.  You 
don't have to follow up on ALL of them you know.

Keen: Heh.

Wakeboarder: Cool, judging the girls only after you have attracted 
them.  Kind of makes you approach too!  You can't say the bull shit line, 
"She's not my type, I can tell", to get you out of approaching.

Alpha: Do you have a web page?

Mystery: No, not currently.  I'm writing a book though called The 
Mystery Method.  Most of my ramblings can be found on the layguide. 

Ascence: Hey, is it true that the older we get the more money/social 
status becomes and issue?

Mystery: No matter what social status you have (or THINK you have), 
it's still something you must convey in the first 25 minutes of meeting 
her.  We ALL start equal BEFORE meeting her; all men.  The issue is, can 
we congruently convey our social status (real or not) in our 
performance?  That's OUR responsibility.  The best way is not to TELL them about 
it but rather to DEMONSTRATE it.  How?  Well, if you talk about having 
girls always falling for you for instance, it's not NEARLY as good as 
actually having a couple hot girls with you saying what a hottie you are 
infront of the target.  This is called PAWNING.

Keen: I'm going to try doing the story-telling that you talked about.  
It's really hard though. I'm a real bad storyteller.  I've been working 
on it today. that's my lesson today.

Wakeboarder: Tell them about that time you saw a fallen over manequin 
in the department store and you tripped over it.  The security guard 
thought you were trying to make it with the manequin and called you a 
little freak.

Gamer: LOL (Laughing Out Loud).

Wakeboarder: One more question for you Mystery.  What's the meaning of 
life?

Mystery: To fuck. :)

Statement of Intent (SOI)

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Rio introduces a key part of PU: the 'Statement of Intent' (SOI)!

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2000 09:00:50 GMT
Subject: Find Stun Drag Fuck

G'day,

Jonathan Ashton  wrote in message
news:90eati$gpt@nnrp1.deja.com...
> As I've read the twelve-odd messages in this thread, I've been looking
> for something to take home with me, but I'm not finding it.
>
> Rio, how do you do things differently now, based on what you've said?

First thing would be to think about the close. Mystery knows his group work
perfect from how I read it, and I have been using his methods to great
success social-proof wise.

The BIG thing that clocked in my head was the need to STATE YOUR INTENTIONS
to the chick within the first minute of meeting her. I will make that my
rule from now on - as with the 3 second rule.
By this I DON'T mean "Let's fuck" or "Come to Papa baby" or any throw-away
shit like that. It has to be an honest assessment of what YOU feel capable
of doing to the chick after the "Hi" and the first round of fluff/routine
(routine preferred - something humourous). GM does this part BEAUTIFULLY,
because he does it with a sense of fun and humour - and HE KNOWS he is going
to do what he says and so does SHE!
I notice Mr. Sex states this a lot in his past posts - where AFC or shit
PUAs do approaches and talk to the chick, but never get to the point AND the
bitch can tell that the guys want to fuck but are too pussy to go for it.
Ross says something to the tune of "And maybe we could really get to like
each other" when he closes in HTGTWYDIB. I also recall that TokyoPUA did a
statement of intentions on that chick he PUed at night once who was
initially scared of him. Johnny Shack does it by when he just springs dates
on women he just met.
So there's some cross references.

The proper methodological way to get to a statement of intentions part is by
pace and lead. But the point of the matter is, you have to structure the
conversation to show interest and intent VERY soon or you will stall, chick
will get bored, feel teased, and then it's C&B time. Believe me, a LOT of
C&B experience with a LOT of HOT chicks has so far has taught me this
painful lesson.
The best way to put it is in the most honest way possible. I cannot give you
a specific example. But the idea is to get her thinking romantically about
you VERY soon. THEN you HAVE TO DO WHAT YOU SAID you would do to the chick
after DDB. (E.g. If you want to start things off gently by holding her hand,
tell her a scene where want to be holding her hand - and then do it in the
next routine after she is comfortable with this.) If you do NOT DO what you
say you will, eventually your congruence will fuck up when the chick loses
patience. Then the chick will be confused, get scared, and bolt. If this
ever happens and the guy tries to do heavy kino or try for a fuck while the
chick is in this state - It's gonna be RAPE.

In fact, on the matter of Rape. I read in Cosmo (Hey, My chick gets fucked
often and STILL reads this!) that psychologists WARN women against guys that
say "Come to my place to see my pictures" etc. when the idea is to fuck the
chick whilst your intentions aren't known to her - because it is DATE RAPE.
Thus as Maniac found out ages ago, that GROUNDWORK is the key element to
getting the chick over to fuck. That can be done through STATEMENT OF
INTENTIONS - and may not necessarily happen through Kiss closes.
You must remember this - a kiss is just a kiss........

IF that works, THEN we can reward her with more conversation and more
Mystery style routines or whatever (because she is OK with our intentions
then - thus the rewards), and THEN up the ante some more with our STATEMENT
OF INTENTIONS, building on what we established before - to get her more hot
and horny than before. So you may have started on holding her hands, now you
may progress on to hugging, kissing, fucking etc. whatever seems to be the
most logical progression from her actions towards you.

Patterns, routines, psych tests, will help greatly during the chat routines
in-between statements of intentions. Those are what set us apart from the
other PUAs out there.

Eventually we get to a point where the chick is DDB, then we can get to the
Drag (you must take the woman to fuck location, or have her so into you that
she will come to you) and Fuck part (in our world of course). The Our World
routine would then be the ULTIMATE in the STATEMENT OF INTENTIONS series
which would then lead to the deal fuck closed. It is in this one that you
state your relationship expectations and put it in "Our World"

Now the method is Find, Stun, Drag, Fuck.

The point is - FUCK all this bullshit about the woman needs to be done in
the "right way" to match her values. Something tells me now that a woman
made this comment as an attempt to rationalize her unreasonable emotions.
The values she wants ALL ALONG is #1 SEX, and to a lesser extent #2 to be
taken care of after SEX. That goes for ANY woman (thus the universality of
the whole principle). When the guy comes along as does her, she will
rationalise that the guy understood exactly what she felt. That's what some
religious women mean when they beautifully say "God knew when it was the
right time for me". In reality, they KNOW DEEP DOWN they are at the mercy of
guys and what they want to do with her. To her, that is "destiny" and no
wonder so many women are suckers for fortune-telling and the like.

Eliciting is when you want to # close or coffee close and check the girl out
for relationship potential. If it's ONS - hey! ya don't need it! If you
cannot attempt a kiss to fuck close in the given situation - you will have
to # close, but not forget to state that your intentions could well get
beyond just coffee!

The other thing - "Make no excuses for desires as a man" is THE SINGLE MOST
IMPORTANT THING (As Ross Jeffries has already said) but I had to experience
it myself to believe it. ALL of what I explained above IS USELESS in
practical application if you are trying to follow it like a script. The idea
is to GRAB that girl and NOT let her get away! ;) So guys, HOW MUCH DO YOU
WANT THAT GIRL? WHAT ARE YOU PREPARED TO DO?

Also on that note. BE A FUCKING MAN. Act like a guy, and don't think that
mirroring a girl completely is going to make you attractive to her. I know
from experience that the more caveman I go with chicks who KNOW my
intentions, the more they respond sexually.
Talk to chicks as if you were telling your kid brother how to play football
properly, cause your kid brother happens to be shit at football. I
especially like the way Mr. Sex talks to us on ASF - giving pointers and
what-not. I'm sure he talks to chicks exactly the same way IRL - showing
congruence all along.

You can even get around the language barrier! I just about dragged a sexy
Jgirl in a bikini off the beach while babbling to them in English! A
language they didn't even understand! I did that enough and with a smile,
that the chick went DDB and ready to GO when I took her hand. Had it not
been for the cockblock!
Somebody must have taught the "Iranian from hell" this shit!

The way I think about it is much like caveman sex. You see the hot chick,
you bang her on the head with your club, you take her to your cave, you root
her. Thus :- Find Stun Drag Fuck.
Just a bit more aggressive than Find Meet Attract Close, but that's the best
way I could describe what this ugly-as-fuck PUA was doing.

These were the attitudes that I had when I was only just starting to pull
women at incredible speeds while on holiday.

The other point is on Objection handling in regards to the STATEMENT OF
INTENTIONS. What I learned from the PUA I met, is that you fight chick
bullshit with your own bullshit - with a slightly authoritive tone (no need
to REALLY get pissed).
For example :- The chicks said "We have to get to our car" and were ready to
leave
The Playboy said "You can't leave anyway because the gates are closed" even
though the gates aren't closed.
Thus this covers handling chick bullshit - on the phone as well as in real
life.
And one chick on another seduction board I read often typed something to the
tune that she wants to be with a guy that can bullshit his way into her
pants.

So there you go. Find Stun Drag Fuck.
Stun is the hardest.

> There are reasons why most of us step through seduction so gingerly.
> We know that saying or doing one wrong thing can blow up the seduction.
> As far as I can tell, letting her know you intend to fuck her before
> you fuck her is one of those things.  Another reason is that women
> won't tell you when they're ready to fuck.

But DDB does tell all!
That single most common fuckup is what is called LACK OF CONGRUENCE
(definition courtesy of Mr. Sex). Just like when I called that chick I met
yesterday "my friend" in front of her. Doing that is a sign of weakness.
Chicks can get away with having words out of congruence with their actions,
but guys CANNOT.

> You say that when you "lead girls on" and tease them too much, you look
> easy and they hate you.  But this insight doesn't make it any easier to
> recognize when you're "leading them on".  The window between when a
> woman is receptive to a close and when you've stalled her is short, and
> spotting it seems to be harder than superstring theory.  The answer
> seems to be to make hundreds of approaches, and very slowly improve
> through experience.

Well you have body language and other subtle pointers. Plus we are adding
all the time to our STATEMENT OF INTENTIONS in order to find a barrier and
cut off point. I don't doubt that noticing DDB when you have the intuition
becomes easier.

  The one concrete thing I get out of your post is
> that next time two HBs want a foursome with you and your LTR, you'll be
> more likely to recognize it.  Or maybe the situation will be different
> enough that you won't.

I fucked that up because I KNOW those chicks wanted me to go with them, and
I over-teased them and didn't capitulate and then state my intentions to
have a foursome. They would have been up for it!
That's when the Playboy showed up to show me the shit, and then beat me
hands-down in a round of THE GAME. ;)

> You also said, "Now I realise more than fucking EVER what a chick
> wants. She wants a guy to go and GET her, make her feel wanted, and
> then have the shit fucked out of her!"  But you agreed with another
> poster that you can't just walk up to a woman and say "Let's fuck."
> So what's your new insight here?

It's a no-brainer. Is sex ALL you bringing to the table? That's why he
coupled GM styled intention pointers further into the seduction (after the
earlier G-rated ones), and then when they succeeded in not objecting, he
went to Mystery routines as a reward OR to the Drag phase if they were DDB.
You cannot start the seduction with a statement of intention that skips the
buildup - unless the chick is THAT FUCKING HORNY and shameless.
Chicks want to know that you care about them as human beings and not just
sex objects. Thus neutral conversation gets smattered in between, and the
final statement of intentions clearly shows what his intentions are so SHE
KNOWS that you care about her feelings - in that way.

The Playboy I met even went to see a chick he had a threesome with the next
day (cause she was feeling a bit alone). This guy was no cheap "Player"
(which he pointed out in his great Our world styled close routine on this
9). You could tell he cared enough too.

> Have you figure out a better way to know when a woman is ready to
> be closed?  Or a faster way to get her to want to fuck?  Or a way to
> let her know your intentions without scaring her off?  What's the
> difference between your approach now and your approach before you went
> to Guam?  It sounds like you feel you understand things better than
> you did before, but I can't figure out what the new understanding is.

Well, now you have your answer.
Mind you, I'm only getting the framework now that I sit down and try and
explain what I am now doing. This shit became automatic when I had the whole
experience of witnessing this guy and learning from him.

Any questions or comments? Fire away....

Rio
-------

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
References:  <90eati$gpt@nnrp1.deja.com> <63JW5.205t1.56373@nnrp.gol.com> <90i82p$iao@nnrp1.deja.com>
Subject: Re: Find Stun Drag Fuck

Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2000 10:04:46 GMT

Jonathan Ashton  wrote in message
news:90i82p$iao@nnrp1.deja.com...
> In article <63JW5.205t1.56373@nnrp.gol.com>,
>   "Rio"  wrote:
> > Well, now you have your answer.
>
> Yeah, I understand much better now.  Thanks for writing it down.
>
> > Any questions or comments? Fire away....
>
> So I get the abstract idea now:  Make some sort of Statement Of
> Intentions (SOI) to a woman relatively early, and then act congruently
> with it.

More or less, that's it.
The thing is, after dropping routines - get to it or the chick gets confused
and drops out.
Mystery had the right idea with his routines and intros. BUT if you fail to
State your intentions - you can stall things and stale her out. Then it will
be your fault when it appears that the routines don't work! They may have
worked, but she has given up on you as a partner already. You teased too
much.

> Like most people, though, I don't really understand any abstract idea
> until I've seen two or three concrete examples; i.e. HOW to make that
> SOI.

Ross Jeffries has already covered how to do this with his NLP pacing and
leading. I'm just giving a name to the end result of doing that (SOI -
Statement of Intention).

SOIs are SO important to women. They want to know where they stand. Women
you are with and haven't SOIed will think to themselves :- "What am I to
him"?
With my LTR which I sloppily SOIed, she annoyed me for ages if I was her
boyfriend or not. I hadn't said, and was therefore walking thin ice.
That drove her NUTS.

Now, I guess I could show you some fake examples of stuff that you could
launch into your PU - but the reason why I'm not going to do that is because
if ANYBODY creates a list of them - we're going to get the problem that AFC
men ALREADY have with PU Lines. That is, throwing meaningless words into a
conversation and then not being able to back them up.
Either that, or we will develop a single street pickup routine which men
will use the world over with great success before women cotton on to it.
When it comes to SOI, DIY (damn all these acronymns!).

An example of SOI is what I said to the chick I tried to PU on the weekend.
I paced it to the point where we are talking about where we lived, and I
found out that she lived close. Then I said "That's good, so we can get
together really easy and have some fun then."
If she had been far away - no problem "That's too bad. I'll have to travel
far to get together with you and have fun"
If she lives on Mars - no problem "Wow! You live out there! I'll have to
build a rocket to come and see you after you go back there!"

So there you go. Who needs to be excessively GM?

> You gave the example of GM style.  Yep, GM makes a pretty clear SOI.
> I don't think a "recovering nice guy" like me could do GM congruently,
> though.

I have done it once successfully and it Suuure works. But yes, it's hard to
work things up to that because you skip a lot of buildup steps. The flirting
has to take place in a sexual level rather than a much safer level. That is
risky.
That's what I mean when by saying "Let's Fuck" you run the risk of having to
flirt at such a high level where you can fuck up easily. Not that it's
impossible of course.
NEGs (which I forgot to mention before) help especially in the
objection,flirt phase. This phase is like the part where the dog chases
after the bitch to try and fuck her, and the bitch keeps running. The thrill
of the chase!

> You mention TokyoPUA and Johnny Shack references, but it would take
> a lot of searching/guessing to find the specific examples you have in
> mind.  And I don't understand your Ross example - "And maybe we could
> really get to like each other" sounds like a pretty vague SOI; maybe
> I'd understand what you mean if I knew the context?

Search for stuff on the archived layguide for stuff about Johnny Shack. He
also has an online book. Ross has his old free book around the place. Search
Formhandle for TokyoPUA's posts.
By the way, I even went as far as reading ALL of Mystery's decent posts as
well.

> The only example of an SOI I see in your posts is this one from Guam
> PUA:
>
> > As for going for the fuck close? Forget your sexual accelerators.
> > This guy said the whole shit in plain English - and I saw him say
> > this all to to a chick. He basically said that he was a playboy, but
> > not a pickup artist (to frame the idea that he won't fuck and dump),
> > and that when he had sex with the chick (Framing it as if it's going
> > to happen) that she should just enjoy it for fun and not worry about
> > it too much because it's just their private thing (our world style
> > routine), and that he was not an easy guy in reality - that he was
> > quite selective in who he chooses for sex (so he doesn't look like a
> > meat-market man).
> > He said all this straight faced to a chick, and while I was watching
> > the chick he did this on - she was trancing out and playing with her
> > hair. It was totally evil.
>
> So my questions...
>
> Have you ever done a SOI to kiss a girl and not had her object?  If so,
> what did you say?  Have you ever done a SOI to fuck a girl and not had
> her object?  If so, what did you say?  Hell, do you remember the exact
> words of any SOI you've ever said?

I gave you an example above of an SOI above (where I told the chick that we
would hang out in the future). No doubt we can refine the whole shit a lot
better in the future.
And yes. I think everyone at some stage has done an SOI, or the body
language has been good enough to get her into that zone where she KNOWS
maybe at 70% where your intentions are, with or without any routines to help
snag the chick, and the chick has put up some token resistance. The purpose
of the resistance of course, is to set the scene for the chase you know will
end in a fuck if you can just reel the bitch in. You will eventually do it
as long as you have remained congruent throughout.

> What other kinds of SOIs would you use in the buildup?  Tell her you're
> going to give her a neck massage?  (I'm sure that question sounds
> clueless; but I really think the meat is in the details.)

Well pace it:-
"Have you ever felt like having a neck massage? I think you need one, so
I'll give you one"
Sometimes the more direct your SOIs are, the harder she will force you to
keep pushing them.
So let's say the chick flirts and says "Why do you want to? I don't need
one!"
So we have to SOI her again in the second sentence in this example :- "Well
you haven't had one of my massages that can make you feel good all over. Now
relax....."

The idea is to trap the chick at all costs with your intentions that you can
carry out - until she can't get away.
Even "No I can't!" "Yes you can!" "No I can't!" "Yes you can!" fights - if
that's what it comes down to - can win you the day if you persist and not
let her win! Verbal arguments can always be solved with kino - cause you as
the guy are STRONGER. I don't mean hit her, but mauling is OK as long as she
is enjoying it! ;)

Persistance is VERY important. Of course, you may want to dump the chick
after the fuck if she doesn't drop the shit because she is too much work to
obtain sex from in the long run. Just give her an ultimatum "Cut the shit or
you will be lonely!"

At the same time, you can get trapped if you say an SOI that you can't
possibly keep. So watch what you promise to do!
Saying shit like "I'm going to buy you a Rolls Royce!" when she KNOWS you
can't afford it is an extreme example of a shit SOI. There goes your trust
and congruency with that one.

> And as for one other comment you made:
>
> > (E.g. If you want to start things off gently by holding her hand,
> > tell her a scene where want to be holding her hand - and then do it
> > in the next routine after she is comfortable with this.)
>
> You mean you tell her a story about some guy you know who held some
> girl's hand?  Or what?  Methinks I really don't understand here.

You can do that to get her thinking about holding someone's hand - and once
she is feeling it, you may be able to slip in the kino and get away with it.
At least, your chances will be better.

> > Is sex ALL you bringing to the table? That's why he
> > coupled GM styled intention pointers further into the seduction
> > (after the earlier G-rated ones), and then when they succeeded in
> > not objecting, he went to Mystery routines as a reward OR to the
> > Drag phase if they were DDB.
>
> I would LOVE to see these SOIs written down.

Done as above. But make your own!
I re-explained the "Let's Fuck" problem a bit better above as well.

> So here's my deal:  I want to see more examples of SOIs so I can take
> them apart, because I really suspect that the exact wording is crucial.
>
> For example:
>
> GM gets away with his SOIs because they're exaggerated to absurdity,
> and thus they're both funny and unlikely (at least as stated).
> This puts a little distance between the SOI and the girl, so she
> doesn't slap him.

I think it's more of a case of the GM SOIs that fail, he can write them off
as being jokes. That keeps him on track and congruent.
BUT the risk of failure is very high if he doesn't cover his tracks.

> Guam PUA gets away with his SOI (quoted above) because he's talking
> about chicks in general, and not overtly about the particular chick.
> This puts a little distance between the SOI and the girl, so she's
> not pressured to make a decision right then.

This is the all important point. With some SOIs (and especially with
ambiguities in NLP) the SOIs are not in your face, BUT they are vague enough
to get the point across and then judge for a positive reaction from her or
not. However, the vagueness is simply a shot from 50 metres as opposed to a
shot from point-blank. Just make sure you hit the target.
The danger with point-blank SOIs is they are risky in so far as if you say a
dumb one you can't,won't, or don't want to carry out like "I'm going to take
you on holiday!" as opposed to an NLP shot from 50 metres which describes a
holiday and builds on it. "Have you ever been on holiday with someone
special?....."

> Am I on the right track here?  Are there other ways to word SOIs that
> get around direct resistance?  More examples would be appreciated.

You should check out patterning, but remember, a shot from point-blank is
better than 50 metres. The shortest distance between 2 points is a straight
line. There are pros and cons of both styles of course.
You can take the short path across the dangerous ravine, or the long path
around it.

> I gotta say, this whole idea of SOIs is new to me.  Maybe other PUAs
> in this group have been using them without ever realizing/stating the
> importance of them?

I just gave a name to it. People have done this stuff before and I'm just
giving it a name to help explain what I'm doing.

And no, Ray can't trademark this either and claim it's his. We have
discussed why this is enough on ASF. He's filtered anyway and I can't see
his verbal shit.

> Thanks,
> Ash

Thanks for the questions. They help challenge me in trying to explain myself
better.

Rio

-------

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Clearing SOI's up
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 12:15:23 GMT

Maniac,

I came up with the SOI concept after studying what the Guam Playboy did to
chicks. I wish I could have spent longer down there to learn more off this
guy. Oh well, I just need to save up to go again.

SOI (Statements of intention/interest) were comments that the Guam Playboy
made a lot (I assume you read my report on that place - It's nanpa
paradise!). What he did then was control the flirting that followed after
baiting her with a show of interest. He did this by offering a challenge -
when he finished doing that once he went back to fun routines, talking about
parties on the island, jokes, sex personality tests, etc. before he did
another SOI - staring out as indirect and ambiguous, before being VERY
direct. ;)

Basically what I think I have come up with, through trying to explain to the
posters that asked me about him, is a flirting construction kit.

The Guam Playboy NEGged a LOT - and he got away with it every time. He could
even tell chicks AFC things like they were beautiful, and then turn it into
a NEG if he wanted. That's what over 20 years of daily PU did for this guy.

But the NEG is only one kind of flirting (used for dumping a girl's uptight
self image). There are other kinds, such as using ambiguities, physical
light-handed slapping and pushing kino, playing tricks on people, etc. The
Playboy used plenty of variations.

Flirting is this:- One drops the SOI, and then pulls it away out of reach of
the target. Then gives another SOI, and then pulls it away again. Like with
our words, we put images of sex and romance in their heads, then pull it out
again, then out it in, then take it out, then put it back in, then take it
out again........ Mindfucking!
Once the chick is confused and teased enough, she is DDB and safely
mindfucked.

I did a PU once on a chick using the SOIs. I found out where she lived and
then said "Oh that's not far from my place, so I can come down to see you.
It's a pity I am so busy it won't happen today"
(Note that there is a bit of future pacing and presuppositioning in this)
She lapped it up and took my kino from there - despite the BF being a matter
of metres away.

The structure for the Guam Playboy routine went like this:-

- Fun routine or opener (ala Mystery) - some basic fluff - all good things
about himself, what he could do for the women (he played the helpful tour
guide). Be "Disgustingly" Charming! as he put it. The guy wasn't big on
logically drawing out routines for what he did (which is a good thing), he
just went and DID this.... thus he couldn't really explain to me what he was
doing. I had to observe.
- SOI. He said something that hinted that he was interested in the chick
(paced and lead from his opener conversation). This got her emotions going
and her ideas racing. I have found this CRITICAL if the chick is going to
stay interested in you for too long. I bored many chicks out initially when
I wouldn't get to the point.
"What do you look for in guys?" would be sufficient enough as a question to
hint at what you are after (as you have found out yourself Maniac). Starting
off on a topic about guys and relationships usually brings chicks out, but
asking "Do you have a BF?" sucks.
This Ross Jeffries inspired SOI "The more you laugh, the more you'll be
attracted to interesting people......now with me" is an ambiguous SOI.
- Before she could knock him down for any comment, he would then be a
challenge and say something like "I'm not easy", "we don't know each other
well enough yet", "but what would I know, right? ;)","I need to feel passion
first", "Yeah, you know what I'm saying". These basically FORCE the chick to
continue the flirting (initiated by the SOI) along the lines that HE wanted
(and the lines that chicks SAY they want!).
By saying that he "needed time" and "not being easy", the chick already
attracted to him would then come onto him.

Most of the time the chicks would laugh becuase they'd get stuck for a smart
comeback. And he just kept this up, alternating back to party and fun
routines, until he got to the "sex-SOI-Our World-But I'm no sleaze"routine
which would then DDB the target to fuck - or get her ready for it next time
they met.
Negative commands also work great here to spark challenge. Just like I did
with my now LJBF ex-LTR "I'm not going to fuck you".

I've noted in my past failures (too many to count) that when I have dropped
SOI hints - the chicks have taken the flirting into areas which were
impossible for me to control - fucking me up and making me look stupid.
Especially in clubs where chicks do this like child's play to anyone who
"hits" on them. They use their irrational chick logic to fuck themselves
(and you) up. If that happens, your PU is history.
We can't give the women control, especially not in flirting, because they
aren't the ones that are trying to do PU. It's their job as "virtuous" women
to try and get away from PU, or try to fuck our PU up.

Svengali also said in his MLTR theory something which rings home on this. He
said (and I quote):-

"Seventh: If you don't give a woman something to be pissed about every
now and then, she'll find something on her own, and that will be harder
to get out of (because it will be of her making and criteria, not
yours)."

That is also the point of what we should be doing in flirting. To trap the
chick into going along with what your flirting and accepting your advances
(by means of non-objection) while getting her horny at the same time. That
way we avoid snappy comebacks because you've already "Handled her objections
before they came up" (That's something I learnt as a salesman)
This causes the chick to have her token resistance stall out - and puts us
in control.
GM does this with his sex jokes, but he slams any possible retort with "Just
Kidding" thus the chick can't say anything and the flirting goes by GMs
rules and not hers.

Take Mystery's "Nice nails" NEG for example.
He starts off with an SOI "Nice nails". This in and of itself is a
compliment. If he stopped here, the chick would come back (if she were a
bitch) with some smart ass comment to get rid of Mystery.

BUT, he then puts up the CHALLENGE before she gets a chance to reply (like
GM with "Just kidding"). Seemingly innocent too. "Are they real?"

Now the chick is stuck. What's going on? He's complimented me, and now he's
knocking me down! What is he doing? I must stick around for this! What can I
say? Maybe I'll just laugh it off...!? er..?
(Note, some REAL bitches when stalled will look angry at you and say "Huh?"
to which it's GM to the rescue! with "Hide your pleasure!")

So, couple this kind of flirting with lots of things to get her feeling
horny (patterns, sex talk, whatever), and add lots of personality conveying
things thrown in for good measure - and the chick is sufficiently stunned -
and ready for the drag and fuck stage.

Oh, and the Guam Playboy is an ugly fucker. Kipp's seen the pictures.
Looks don't matter for shit. I have great respect for all the older PUAs.

I must get up to Tokyo to see you guys real soon. The inaka sucks.
We can experiment with this some more then. I've been getting rusty since I
got back from Guam.
What I do know is that when this guy's method does work, it is KILLER. We
get Mr. Smooth status and KCs like crazy.

Rio
-------
Dictate the flirting

 wrote in message news:91f5e8$dpn@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Re: SOI's
>
> Rio..
>
> You are on to something big here..
> This is a discovery!
> I will incorporate this.
>
> Please give more specific examples though. I get
> what you are saying, but not yet really how you would
> apply it. .
>
>
> Fucking excellent thread!
>
>
> Maniac
> http://www.pickupguide.com
>
>
> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/

---

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: More on SOIs
Date: Fri, 22 Dec 2000 06:17:41 GMT

THIS IS RIO TYPING IN CAPS. I'M NOT YELLING!

Comments in text below.
After New years, I WILL be ready, and we will hit
the streets.

GREAT. I HAVEN'T BEEN DOING MUCH PU UNTIL YESTERDAY (1 SOLID # FROM A 9 AND
A KC FROM ANOTHER 9) - THUS THIS POST AS I TEST OUT MY THEORY. I HAVE A
FRIEND WHO WOULD LIKE TO COME ALONG. HE'S ALREADY BRIEFED AND VERY
EXPERIENCED IN SCREWING WOMEN IN JAPAN. HE'S READ THE PICKUP GUIDE ALREADY.
HE'S EVEN BEEN SO KIND TO INTRODUCE ME TO SOME WOMEN WHO WANT MERCY FUCKS.
HE ALSO KNOWS SOME GOOD "hole in the wall" PLACES AROUND RAPPONGI WITH LOTS
OF WOMEN (SO HE SAYS).

BTW, Rio; re: 'nomad' player.. mine was fucked up, returned
it for an exchange, new one works..

IT'S SURE BEATS A TAPE RECORDER, DOESN'T IT?

First, this is brilliant material, it is going on the
website, and is core to successful PU I think. It IS what
smooth was doing.. I couldnt identify it, but now it has
been named, and described, I recognize this.. and yes, it
will be TOTALLY lethal..

THANKS. EVERY SUCCESSFUL PUA HAS BEEN DOING SOMETHING LIKE THIS (OF ONE
STYLE OR ANOTHER) TO BED WOMEN. I WENT OUT AND USED THIS FRAME YESTERDAY
WITH INTERESTING AND POSITIVE RESULTS.....

HOWEVER, I MUST SAY IT'S HARD TO GIVE SPECIFIC EXAMPLES UNLESS THEY ARE
SITUATIONALLY BASED. FOLLOWING THE LOGIC HOWEVER, AND USING IT GIVEN THE
SITUATION STILL BRING RESULTS. I WILL DESCRIBE SOME OF WHAT I HAVE BEEN
DOING WITH IT, BUT I CAN'T REMEMBER FOR THE LIFE OF ME WHAT EXACTLY THE GUAM
GUY SAID. (I ONLY RECORDED A SMALL SAMPLE OF OUR CHAT WITH MY MP3 PLAYER.
NONE OF HIS NANPA HOWEVER) WHAT I DO KNOW, IS THAT HE FOLLOWED THIS
STRUCTURE WHICH I HAVE DESCRIBED TO VERY SOME GOOD EFFECTS.

I ASSUME YOU READ MY ORIGINAL STORY ON THE GUAM TRIP.
IF SO, MY REPLY WILL MAKE MORE SENSE.

In article ,
  "Rio"  wrote:
> He did this by offering a challenge -
> when he finished doing that once he went back to fun routines,
talking about

Examples? ?

OK, HE MADE SOME KIND OF COMPLIMENT OR SUGGESTED SOME KIND OF ACTIVITY
(OFTENTIMES WITH SEXUAL OR ROMANTIC UNDERTONES) THAT THEY COULD DO TOGETHER.
(LIKE HANG TIGHT TO EACH OTHER OF THE JET POWERED BANANA BOAT) AND THEN
FOLLOWED THAT WITH A REASON WHY HE WOULD HAVE TROUBLE DOING IT. KINDA LIKE
IN SALES, A SALESMAN WOULD SAY "FOR ONE DAY ONLY SALE", WELL HE WAS LIKE "SO
YOU SHOW UP AT SUCH AND SUCH A TIME, OTHERWISE I WON'T BE ABLE TO SHOW YOU A
GOOD TIME AND I'LL TAKE SOMEONE ELSE" (a takeaway)
SO IN ORDER TO CONTINUE THE FLIRTING, THE CHICK WOULD HAVE TO SHOW UP. HE
WOULD THEN (AFTER HAVING COMPLETED A SOI ROUTINE) SIT BACK AND WATCH THE
CHICK FOLLOW THROUGH. HE WOULD OFTENTIMES BE ABLE TO CONTINUE A CONVERSATION
WITHOUT STALLING - AND MIDWAY HE WOULD SOI HER AGAIN AND DO THE SAME ROUTINE
WITH SOMETHING ELSE. I NEVER SAW HIM GET IT ON WITHIN 20 MINUTES, BUT I SAW
WHAT HE DID TO THE CHICK WITH THIS ROUTINE AND I COULD TELL THAT HE COULD
HAVE IF HE WANTED TO. HE DIDN'T LOOK DESPERATE AT ALL.

> parties on the island, jokes, sex personality tests, etc. before he
did
> another SOI - staring out as indirect and ambiguous, before being VERY
> direct. ;)

Examples ? ?

THIS GUY HAD A STRONG ELEMENT OF GM. THE SEX PERSONALITY TEST IS DOCUMENTED
IN MY POST ON THIS GUY (IT'S ABOUT ICE CREAM) - BUT AFTERWARDS UNLIKE GM, NO
COMMENT OF "JUST KIDDING". HE WOULD THEN SAY SOMETHING ELSE TO DISTRACT
ATTENTION OR PLAY "PRETEND AFC" LIKE "BUT I'M NOT EASY" OR "BUT I DON'T KNOW
YOU THAT WELL"
ALL THE MEANWHILE, GETTING THE CHICK HORNY AND CREATING A CHALLENGE.

> Basically what I think I have come up with, through trying to explain
to the
> posters that asked me about him, is a flirting construction kit.

Examples ? ?

MANIAC, YOU'RE STARTING TO OVERUSE CUT AND PASTE LIKE NYC WHEN HE RIPS APART
AFCS WITH THESE "EXAMPLES??" COMMENTS.........

(QUOTE NYC)
"YOU ARE BEING USED. SHE DOESN'T GIVE A SHIT ABOUT YOU. SHE DOESN'T INTEND
TO FUCK YOU. SHE IS FUCKING OTHER MEN THAT SHE FINDS SEXUALLY ATTRACTIVE.
YOU ARE FOOTING THE BILL FOR HER INTERNATIONAL WHORING. STOP."

HA HA HA ;)

> The Guam Playboy NEGged a LOT - and he got away with it every time.

Such as ? ?

WISH I COULD REMEMBER NOW. BUT WHAT I DID SEE IS HIM COMPLIMENTING LOTS OF
JAP CHICKS AND NOT GETTING ANY NASTY REACTION BACK FROM THEM - BECAUSE THEY
WERE SO SHY AND INEXPERIENCED. SO THE CHICKS JUST LAUGHED BECAUSE THEY HAD
NO BITCH SHIELD OF ANY TYPE.
WHERE HE DID ENCOUNTER A SHIELD, HE WOULD ATTACK HER "NASTY" PERSONALITY -
AND HER LACK OF ABILITY TO BE GRACEFUL WITH COMPLIMENTS.

IN THAT SENSE, HE WOULD ALWAYS SIZE THE CHICK UP AS IF HE WAS LOOKING FOR
LTR POTENTIAL (but we know of course, that LTR was never the plan)

He could
> even tell chicks AFC things like they were beautiful, and then turn
it into
> a NEG if he wanted. That's what over 20 years of daily PU did for
this guy.

Examples ? ?

"YOU'RE REALLY CUTE....(pause to check response)... BUT I DON'T KNOW
ANYTHING ABOUT YOU. (SAID NEGATIVELY OR NOT DEPENDING ON HER RESPONSE). SO
WHO ARE YOU ANYWAY?"

> But the NEG is only one kind of flirting (used for dumping a girl's
uptight
> self image). There are other kinds, such as using ambiguities,
physical
> light-handed slapping and pushing kino, playing tricks on people,
etc.

Such as ? ?

I'VE STOPPED USING KINO IMMIDIATELY NOW, AND SAVING IT FOR WHEN I'VE LANDED
AN SOI ROUTINE AND CAUGHT THE CHICK OUT. WHEN SHE HAS LAUGHED, I SLAP HER
GENTLY.
IT'S ANCHORING.

AS FOR TRICKS ON PEOPLE.... STUPID ONES. I WILL HAVE TO SHOW YOU THEM IN
PERSON.

The
> Playboy used plenty of variations.

Like what ? ?

GIVEN THE SITUATION, HE WOULD TRY DIFFERENT WAYS TO GET HER THINKING
ROMANTICALLY ABOUT BOTH OF THEM TOGETHER. HE WOULD USE WHATEVER WAS IN HIS
SURROUNDINGS, OR THE TOPIC OF CONVERSATION, TO PACE AND LEAD THE CHICK INTO
IMAGINING SUCH A SCENARIO.
THEN HE WOULD YANK IT AWAY BY GIVING SOME KIND OF EXCUSE (LIKE HE WAS BUSY,
HE DIDN'T THINK SHE COULD DO IT) OR HE WOULD PLAY AFC (I DON'T KNOW YOU, I
NEED TO BE IN LOVE FIRST, I'M NOT EASY, I'M NOT A PLAYER, I NEED TIME, I AM
REALLY PICKY, I HAVE BEEN HURT BEFORE, I HAVE A GF)

> Flirting is this:- One drops the SOI, and then pulls it away out of
reach of
> the target.

For example ? ?

I REALLY FEEL VERY CLOSE TO YOU, BUT I NEED TIME.

THE MAGIC WORD IS but

 Then gives another SOI, and then pulls it away again. Like with
> our words, we put images of sex and romance in their heads, then pull
it out

Like ? ?

HIS BRAVEST SOI WAS THE ONE WHERE HE SAID STRAIGHT OUT THAT HE WAS GOING TO
FUCK A CHICK. I WITNESSED THE WHOLE THING. HE SAID THAT HE WAS GOING TO FUCK
HER but (AND THEN HE WENT PRETEND AFC) I'M VERY PICKY, I'M NOT A PUA
BECAUSE THOSE GUYS TEASE WOMEN WITH BULLSHIT, MAKE EMPTY PROMISES, FUCK
THEM, AND THEN DUMP THEM. I AM A PLAYBOY. I LOVE WOMEN AND I DON'T WANT YOU
TO GET TOO ATTACHED TO ME AFTER WE HAVE SEX.

> again, then out it in, then take it out, then put it back in, then
take it
> out again........ Mindfucking!

Example please . .

OK, ANOTHER ONE:-   I WANT TO KISS YOU, BUT SOMEHOW I DON'T THINK YOU LIKE
KISSING.
(btw - this would be an SOI fairly advanced in conversation)
NOTE ALSO THAT THERE'S AN EMBEDDED COMMAND IN THE 2ND PART OF THE ROUTINE.
THAT BEING "YOU LIKE KISSING"
EVIL ISN'T IT?

> Once the chick is confused and teased enough, she is DDB and safely
> mindfucked.

how? describe this. . what exactly did he do?

WELL, THE CHICK THAT HE SAID THE "I'M GOING TO FUCK YOU" SPEECH TO, JUST
STARTED DOING ALL THE TRADEMARK BODYLANGUAGE. SHE JUST SAT THERE STUNNED
AND PLAYED WITH HER HAIR. LIKE A RABBIT LOOKING INTO BRIGHT LIGHTS. THE GUAM
GUY SAID ALL OF IT WITH A SERIOUS FACE TOO, SO SHE COULDN'T LAUGH OFF WHAT
HE WAS SAYING.

THE WAY HE WORKED DIDN'T SEEM TO BE ONE OF "ATTRACTION" PER SE. HE WOULD
EVENTUALLY CORNER THE CHICK AND FLIRT WITH HER UNTIL SHE COULD TAKE NO MORE.
UNTIL SHE GOT STUNNED

> I did a PU once on a chick using the SOIs. I found out where she
lived and
> then said "Oh that's not far from my place, so I can come down to see
you.
> It's a pity I am so busy it won't happen today"

This is good. .

THAT'S A REAL LIFE EXAMPLE OF WHAT THE WHOLE THEORY IS ABOUT. MORE
IMPORTANTLY IS THAT IT WORKED.

> (Note that there is a bit of future pacing and presuppositioning in
this)
> She lapped it up and took my kino from there - despite the BF being a
matter
> of metres away.
>
> The structure for the Guam Playboy routine went like this:-
>
> - Fun routine or opener (ala Mystery) - some basic fluff - all good
things
> about himself, what he could do for the women (he played the helpful
tour

Examples ? ?

READ SOME OF MYSTERY'S OPENERS!
TYPICALLY OFF THE WALL STUFF. WELL, WHEN HE WAS TALKING ABOUT GUAM'S CULTURE
AND PARTIES AND STUFF - FOR ALL THE TOURISTS, ALL THIS NEW INFO TO THEM IS
PRETTY OFF THE WALL.
HE WOULD TELL THE CHICKS ABOUT SOME PARTY WHERE THEY WOULD DIG A HUGE PIT
AND THROW ANIMALS ON IT IN A BIG FEAST WITH A BONFIRE AND DANCING - AND THEN
BRANCHED OUT AND TALKED ABOUT DANCING AND OTHER EXOTIC/EROTIC STUFF.

> guide). Be "Disgustingly" Charming! as he put it. The guy wasn't big
on

Like ? ?

THOSE WERE HIS EXACT WORDS. HE RELIED ON GM A LOT IN THE LATTER PART OF HIS
SEDUCTIONS.

> logically drawing out routines for what he did (which is a good
thing), he
> just went and DID this.... thus he couldn't really explain to me what
he was
> doing. I had to observe.

Yep, he's got experience.. I rarely consciously follow ManiacPlan
anymore.. just it spews out naturally.. learning PU is like learning
a foreign language/lingo.. once you get it, its natural..

I'VE BEEN LEARNING TO PLAY AFC IN MY SEDUCTIONS, AND IT HAS BEEN WORKING
REALLY WELL!

> - SOI. He said something that hinted that he was interested in the
chick
> (paced and lead from his opener conversation). This got her emotions
going

Example?  How?

OK, ANOTHER ONE.

"WOULDN'T IT BE GREAT TO SPEND TIME TOGETHER OVER COFFEE? IT'S SUCH A PITY I
HAVE TO GO TO SOME MEETINGS LATER ON, SO WE WILL PROBABLY HAVE NO TIME TO
SEE EACH OTHER EVER AGAIN BEFORE YOU GO BACK."
(WAIT FOR RESPONSE)
"BUT LET ME KNOW YOUR NUMBER ANYWAY...WHO KNOWS I MAY HAVE TIME."
(might want to save this one after you have dropped several other
SOIs)

> and her ideas racing.

Like what? which ideas? be specific please. .

ROMATIC AND/OR SEXUAL ONES.
HE WOULD START OFF ON ROMANTIC ONES AND MAKE THEM INCREASINGLY SEXUAL UNTIL
HE HIT A SEXUAL FANTASY OF HERS THAT WOULD DDB HER.
LET'S SAY "HOLDING HANDS" OR "SPENDING QUALITY TIME TOGETHER" OR "BEING
CLOSE" AND EVENTUALLY LEADING THAT INTO "TOUCHING BODIES" AND "KISSING" TO
"FUCKING" OBVIOUSLY.
A LOT OF TIME DISTORTION SOIs.

> I have found this CRITICAL if the chick is going to
> stay interested in you for too long. I bored many chicks out
initially when
> I wouldn't get to the point.
[rest deleted]

Rio, this is great stuff. Somehow I understand it.. but I need
examples of it so I can put it together as something I can try
in the field. Do you remember any specifics from this guy?

WELL, WE CAN ALWAYS WAIT FOR THE OFF-SEASON AND GO TO GUAM WITH A VCR AND
MEET THIS GUY (YOU'LL ONLY NEED ABOUT 40,000 YEN FROM TOKYO FOR A 2 DAY
TRIP) OR NEXT TIME WE MEET IN TOKYO WE CAN DO MORE STREET STUFF AND I CAN
SHOW YOU WHAT I KNOW. (I HADN'T FULLY DEVELOPED THE THEORY UNTIL AFTER MY
NIGHT OUT WITH KIPP - I OQed TOO MUCH AND FAILED TO PLACE ANY CHALLENGES
AFTER MY SOIs THAT NIGHT)
THE GUAM PLAYBOY WAS A GRANDMASTER OF STREET PU - HIS WEAKNESS WAS THAT HE
WAS A GREEDY TEAMPLAYER WITH WINGMEN.

If so, please fill in the above spaces where I ask.. it is very
important if this is to work.

Rio
-------

Using SOI’s as a way to tease/attract chicks!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Using SOI's (statements of intent) as a tease to attract a chick!


From: Jonathan Ashton 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Clearing SOI's up
Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 07:04:08 GMT

In article ,
> For example, if we were to drop an SOI on the chick, and then
> IMMEDIATELY follow up with a negative command - WE control the
> flirting so that the chick then has to work for US.
>
> So we can say things like "I want to kiss you"
> And then control the flirting by pulling away again with some reverse
> commands :-
> "BUT I don't really know anything about you, and I haven't known you
> for very long, and I need to feel love first"
> Sounds like the stuff that chicks tell us, right? Well chicks say it
> to flirt, as opposed to meaning what they say!

Omigod!  Rio, this is an awesome post!  Brilliant!  Genius!

"I was thinking about kissing you, but you'd probably slobber too
  much."
"I'd love to take you home, but I know you'd get all clingy."
"I'm just trying to guess if you're any good in bed.  Too bad you're
  too young/weird/conservative for me."
"I bet you'd love the way I do neck massages.  You've been acting up
  too much to deserve one, though."

This is so EASY!  Anyone can think these up on the spot!  There's no
need to think up ambiguous sentences or come up with just the right
innuendo.  Just make a Statement of Intentions, then let her know what
SHE has to offer to make it happen - by telling her that you won't do
it because she's not up to par!  I love it!  I will try it out ASAP!

Howcome I've never seen this idea explained before?  In retrospect,
it's clear that MrSex4uNYC and Mystery do similar stuff, but I've
never seen the dynamic explained this way before.  Ross talks about
setting challenges, but it's always seemed like such a delicate art
to say just the right thing at just the right time.

But this is so easy!  Thank you, Rio.

Ash


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

Game: Color game

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Color Game that can be used in PU!
[Maniac note: got this other list below from the 'Secrets of the cube book'
Also very good, may be appropriate when doing this game:

Red: passion, hot energy, anger warmth
Green: hope, life, nature, money
Blue: spirituality, serenity, cool energy, sadness
Purple: royalty, deep passions, mourning
Yellow: cheerfulness, brightness, eccentricity
Pink: feminity, wamrth
Brown: earthyness, warmth, conventionality
Black: mystery
White: purity
Multicolored: of many interests or moods

END: Maniac note]

From: steviewonder 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: More personality tests
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 20:20:17 GMT

In article <904e0cjv@nnrp1.deja.com>,
  maniac_high@yahoo.com wrote:
> There is good stuff on that site.
>
> I am reworking it to be more appropriate in opener type
> PU's in bars/coffee shops, will present my results of this
> work in late January after it has all been designed and
> field tested.. It will be killer..

Hi guys,

Found this game at

http://www.geocities.com/Broadway/8546/colortest.html

a good one since all the answers are sexual:

QUESTION:

Pick the color that best describes your personality?

ANSWERS:

BLACK
Black color preferences point to black sex. These people are the
misfits of the sex world and seek each other in kinship. They tend to
prefer perverted sex, and are usually masochistic or sadistic in
nature. They are moody and often perform at their peak when under
stress or during unhappy times. Police psychologists claim that many
sex offenders prefer the color black. And it is no coincidence that
the uniform of mobsters and teenaged gangs is black.

BLUE
Lovers of blue are wonderful sex partners. They are sincere,
affectionate, and sensitive to their partner's needs. They consider
lovemaking a fine art, and their approach is elegant. Men who love
blue are like concert pianists; delicately ravaging their partner like
they would play a baby grand. Women in the blue category enjoy sex
to the fullest. They are exciting partners, but their passion might be
compared to tidal waves, rather than fiery aggresion. Both blue men
and women enjoy foreplay and the aftermath of lovemaking as much
as the act. In marriages, a blue person is a wonderful mate, never
failing to please the spouse and never seeking outside interests.

BROWN
For lovers of brown, sex is a 24-hour a day thing. They tend to say "I
love you" often enough. Snuggling by the fire, walking in the rain or
catching snowflakes on their tongue ins a turn-on to a lover of brown.
They need lots of time and privacy to make love. But their emotions
are such that one harsh word could end an affair.

GREEN
Those who prefer green are fresh and innocent in their approach to
sex. Women who love green will make love like virgins all their life.
And a man may also be a trifle clumsy and awkward, but in a charming
and endearing sort of way. Green lovers are gentle, but not
passionate. If chosen as a mate, one will never need to worry about
infidelity.

GREY
The color grey is preferred by people who are indecisive. They can't
get excited about anything - including colors - so they choose a
noncommittal shade. Men who prefer grey look at sex as a means of
relieving tension - nothing more nothing less. It's "wham, bam, thank
you ma'am". Women don't make love, they have intercourse. They
count the cracks in the bedroom plaster until the sex act is over with
and done. When a grey marries another grey, the marriage is not
exactly erotic.

ORANGE
Lovers of the color orange lean toward sexual fantasies. The sex act
is regarded as a dramatic role, a one act play in which they are the
star. Foreplay is as important as the act of love. They whisper sweet
nothings, meaningless dialogue they feel fits their image. Orange
people often do not experience orgasm - but they put on a damn good
act. Men tend to pull their partner's hair and women tend to leave
welts on their sex partner's back!

PINK
Persons who like pink show a reluctance to mature in sexual matters.
Women tend to tease; to promise more than they intend to deliver. In
some cases, they flaunt their femininity, but only because they
secretly hate men. A great percentage of prostitutes boast entire
wardrobes in pink. Men who like pink are the type who make 3 dates
for the same evening and not keep them, preferring to pick up a dish
in some bar instead.

PURPLE
Lovers of purple frequently consider themselves too regal for  fun
romp in the sack. Women sometimes are the type who hate to muss
their hair. Men are businesslike in their approach to lovemaking. In
both sexes, purple partners are more concerned with their
fulfillment then anyone else's gratification.

RED
People who like red tend to be tigers in the sack. They are easily
aroused and enjoy sex in every way imaginable. Once the sexual spark
is lit, it may take hours to extinguish. When two reds get together,
the ensuing erotica would make Lady Chatterly blush. Lovers of red
tend to be the aggressors and weaker colors should beware!

YELLOW
If you tend to favor yellow, your sexual drives are complex and lean
toward the adaptable. The favorite color of homosexuals is yellow!
But don't panic - not everyone who wears yellow is homosexual. In
most cases the person will accommodate to the stronger partner's
desires in a passive manner. You will never enjoy sex to the fullest,
but you will never turn down an invitation from someone you enjoy or
admire.

--
To email me remove the _obvious from this address:
steviewonder_ob@viousfastmail.ca

Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

Handling delusional chicks, karatebabe lives a nightmare!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Re: Mystery: delusional chicks & sympathy lies! 
Date: 11/12/2000 
Author: maniac_high  

 << previous in search  ?  next in search >>  

Re: Mystery: delusional chicks & sympathy lies!
001112
 
Mystery wrote in another post this week regarding lying
to chicks, about how not to underestimate how delusional
a chick is willing to become in order to keep her 'happy'
view of the world.
 
He is absolutely right. And this explains how seeming
'jerk' can get away with what seems like such ridiculous
shit.
 
Case in point, is where I recently did a fuckup, and then
recovered with Karatebabe (see lay report, my page). This
is the chick that would go around my place after sex
cleaning up her own hairs so that "the other chicks"
wouldnt find out about her.
 
Well, one day we are going for coffee, and she asks me
if I had been seeing another chick at the time I started
dating her. Figuring (incorrectly) from her behavior,
that this chick knew totally what the score already was,
I said I had been (wrong answer!).
 
She freaked out and went balistic at me. Shit about "how
I make her fool, go behind her back..and other shit".
In retrospect it was clear though.. she got upset, because
something she merely 'suspected' (even though it was fucking
obvious as shit, as other chicks stuff was all over the
fucking house), now became something 'confirmed', and that
shattered her entire world..
 
I then smartened up and realized what I had just done,
and recovered by saying that I dumped her after I first
started dating you (Karatebabe), a few weeks later.
 
After that, she settled down (even though every week
there was different chick stuff all over the house
after that!). She asked me about it, and I said no,
there are no chicks..
 
She said she accepted that, and that her 'nightmare'
now was over, and everything was fine again.
 
Later she found some makeup and chick stuff in the
bathroom cabinet (another chick must have slipped
it there for someone else to find it), so I had
to think fast on my feet for that one...
 
So I told her that I have a real dark secret and
she might be very disappointed in me (now she is
expecting to hear something about a chick)..
 
Then (remembering she likes gays and stuff) I tell
her that I like to make believe to dress like a girl
(lots of J-guys do it actually, so I know it is not
so far fetched here), and I have guy friends that do it
with me, and sorry I didnt tell you earlier.. (of
course this is TOTALLY false.. Maniac is not even
remotely gay, nor a crossdresser or any of that shit)...
however.. she ACCEPTED that story, and was relieved
(in spite of the fact that I was almost cracking up
when I said it, since I was SURE she would call me
on my bullshit... but she didnt)!
 
Fuck!, the totally ridiculous things you have to
tell a chick...  AND! they accept it (as they
try to internalize it and believe it at least at
some level so that their happy delusional world
doesn't come crashing to bits)..
 
Strange, isnt it..!
 
Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Using the laws of power in PU!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Toecutter, and using the laws of power!




From toecutter@mail.com Mon Oct 23 09:39:39 2000
From: "toecutter" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Lessons from Book: The 48 Laws of Power
Lines: 201


Just reading a book, The 48 Laws of Power by Robert Greene. Definitely
lessons everywhere in the book on what we do here.
The book is amoral, and open about the deception inherit in what he is
teaching. It is largely for life outside the arena of seduction, but
entrirely applicable and there are some seduction examples in it to
illustrate his points (only historical: For example the advice of Ninon de
Lenclos on seduction to the Marquis de Sevigne and what happened when the
Marquis did not follow her advice, etc.). The examples are all pulled from
the Sun Tzu (Chinese, the Art of War), European history, famous con men,
magicians and charlatans, Kings, Queens, Napoleon and other power brokers
such as Al Capone. Perfect for you guys who enjoy Machiavelli. At 450
reasonably large format pages it is fairly long.

It is going to take me several re-readings, but at the moment I see the
messages as really 3 fold: First, play your cards pretty close to your
chest. This creates mystery. The more you say, the more common you appear
and the less in control. Andy Wohol created enigma by not discussing his
work and answering questions by being intentionally vague giving people the
feeling that he was being more profound than he was.  If you do not reveal
all, people will never become bored with you or your presence because you
will continue to represent a challenge, and will be eternally interesting.
Your silence will make other people feel uncomfortable and humans are
machines of interpretation and explanation; they have to know what you are
thinking. When you carefully control what you reveal, they cannot pierce
your intentions and meaning. Your short answers will put them on the
defensive and they will jump in, nervously filling the silence with all
kinds of comments that will reveal valuable information about themselves and
their weaknesses.

This brings me to the second message. Learn everything you can about other
people. Their strengths and weaknesses, their crutches and trance words.
Their motivations. Use these to your advantage whilst revealing as little as
possible about yourself. Keep them the focus of the conversation, and be a
'Spy' on their minds by eliciting values.

The third lesson is to use smoke and mirrors to obscure your objectives and
motivations. Throw decoys out there, use gifts as Trojan horses, and be
circumspect in what is going on. Again, this throws them off your game,
gives you an upper hand.

None of this is to say that you need to be quiet or a bad conversationalist,
just the opposite, by spying and eliciting values, you are encouraging
people to talk about themselves, their own favourite subject. By being brief
about yourself you are creating mystery and interest. It is just that you
are collecting the information in order to use it against them at another
time, whilst manipulating your image and reputation in their minds and
obscuring your real motivations. In some ways it is a book on playing hard
to get while outmanoeuvring the girl. A perfect structure in which to drop
SS.

Some of the content is below. I can post more on it if you would like
further discussion; I am overflowing with ideas on it.

Toecutter.

---

To list some of the laws that are obviously applicable:

Law 3: Conceal your intentions (Keep people off balance and in the dark by
never revealing the purpose behind your actions. If they have no clue what
you are up to, they cannot prepare a defence. Guide them far enough down the
wrong path, envelop them in enough smoke, and by the time they realise your
intentions, it will be too late.)

Law 4: Always say less than is necessary

Law 6: Court attention at all costs

Law 8: Make other people come to you - use bait if necessary

Law 9: Win though your actions, never through argument. (Any momentary
triumph you win though argument is really a Pyrrhic victory: The resentment
and ill will you stir up is stronger and lasts longer than any momentary
change in opinion. It is much more powerful to get others to agree with you
though your actions, without saying a word. Demonstrate, do not explicate.)

Law 10: Infection: Avoid the unhappy and unlucky (it works the other way
also. This is an alternative take on social-proof, or pivots or whatever you
want to call them, as well as wingmen. Also advice on not getting involved
with the wrong girl.)

Law 11: Learn to keep people dependent on you.

Law 12: Use selective generosity to disarm your victim (One sincere and
honest move will cover over dozens of dishonest ones. Openhearted gestures
of honesty and generosity bring down the guard of even the most suspicious
people. Once your selective honesty opens a hole in their armour, you can
deceive and manipulate at will.)

Law 13: When asking for help, appeal to people's self interest, never to
their mercy or gratitude.

Law 14: Pose as a friend, work as a spy.

Law 16: Use absence to increase respect and honour. (Again through mystery
and not stuffing it up by staying too long and doing or saying something
wrong.)

Law 17: Keep others in suspended terror: Cultivate an air of
unpredictability

Law 18: Do not build fortresses to protect yourself - Isolation is
dangerous. (Get out there amongst them).

Law 19: Know who you are dealing with - do not offend the wrong person.

Law 20: Do not commit yourself to anyone.

Law 21: Play a sucker to catch a sucker - appear dumber than your mark. (Let
her think that she is in control and smart, less naive, don't let on you are
a player).

Law 25: Re-create yourself (Do not accept the roles that society foists on
you. Re-create yourself by forging a new identity, one that commands
attention and never bores the audience. Be the master of your own image
rather than letting others define it for you. Incorporate dynamic devices
into your public gestures and actions - your power will be enhanced and your
character will seem larger than life).

Law 26: Keep your hands clean. (You must seem a paragon of civility and
efficiency: Your hands are never soiled by mistakes and nasty deeds.
Maintain such a spotless appearance by using others as scapegoats and cat'
s-paws to disguise your involvement).

Law 27: Play on peoples need to believe to create a cult like following.
(advice in this chapter is on how to become a cult leader or maybe build a
harem. 5 strategies to your dogma! a) Keep it vague; Keep it simple b)
Emphasise the visual and sensual over the intellectual c) Borrow the forms
of organised religion to structure the group d) Disguise your income source
e) set up an us-vs.-them dynamic. I think Ross Jeffries read this one!)

Law 28: Enter action with Boldness. (If you are unsure of a course of
action, do not attempt it. Your doubts and hesitations will infect your
execution. Timidity is dangerous: Better to enter with boldness. Any
mistakes you make through audacity are easily corrected with more audacity.
Everyone admires the bold; no one honours the timid).

Law 29: Plan all the way to the end.

Law 30: Make your accomplishments seem effortless. (Your actions must seem
natural and executed with ease. All the toil and practice that goes into
them, also all the clever tricks, must be concealed. When you act, act
effortlessly, as if you could do much more. Avoid the temptation of
revealing how hard you work - it only raises questions. Teach no one your
tricks or they will be used against you .. I am breaking this rule right
here with this post, as is the Authour of the book.)

Law 31: Control the options: Get others to play with the cards you deal.
(The best deceptions are the ones that seem to give the other person a
choice: Your victims feel they are in control, but are actually your
puppets. Give people options that come out in your favour whichever one they
choose. Force them to make choices between the lesser of two evils, both of
which serve your purpose. Put them on the horns of the dilemma: they are
gored wherever they turn. Note: this is a different view on my idea of
re-framing questions. The questions are re-framed so well that the girl has
no option.)

Law 32: Play to people's fantasies.

Law 33: Discover each mans thumbscrew.

Law 34: Be royal in your own fashion: Act like a king to be treated like
one.

Law 35: Master the art of timing. (Never seem to be in a hurry - hurrying
betrays a lack of control over yourself, and over time. Always seem patient,
as if you know that everything will come to you eventually. Become a
detective of the right moment; sniff out the spirit of the times, the trends
that will carry you to power. Learn to stand back when the time is not yet
ripe, and to strike fiercely when it has reached fruition.)

Law 36: Disdain things you cannot have: Ignoring them is the best revenge.

Law 37: Create compelling spectacles. (Striking imagery and grand symbolic
gestures create the aura of power - everyone responds to them. Stage
spectacles for those around you, then, full of arresting visuals and radiant
symbols to heighten your presence. Dazzled by appearances, no one will
notice what you are really doing.)

Law 40: Despise the free Lunch.

Law 43: Work on the hearts and minds of others.

Law 44: Disarm and infuriate with the mirror effect. (The mirror reflects
reality, but is the perfect tool for deception: When you mirror your
enemies, doing exactly as they do, they cannot figure out your strategy. The
mirror Effect mocks and humiliates them, making them overreact. By holding
up a mirror to their psyches, you seduce them with the illusion that you
share their values; by holding up a mirror to their actions you teach them a
lesson. Few can resist the power of the mirror effect.)

Law 48: Assume formlessness. (By taking a shape, by having a visible plan,
you open yourself to attact. Instead of taking a form for the girl to grasp,
keep yourself adaptable and on the move. Accept the fact that nothing is
certain and no law is fixed. The best way to protect yourself is to be as
fluid and formless as water: never bet on stability or lasting order.
Everything changes.)

Disarming groups of guys around chicks!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

When lots of guys are around 1 girl, you must disarm guys!


From: "Stepleader" 
Subject: Re: She has nice/great body and/or face -- but what about her?
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2000 10:02:45 GMT

great pep talk and I love your posts ... but ...

the situ called for a disarming of the guys.  Here is how.  Approach the
group but pay NO attention to the girl.  Begin the chat with the guys and
make them interested in your story telling.  MALE BONDING comradery.  Turn
you back to HER so she feels out of place.  What you have done is removed
all the attention from her (stolen it).  You are now the center of
attention.  A couple NEGS her way challenges her.  All the other guys were
on her - all but one.  YOU.

Just so you know, this is mystery methods groupset theory and Ive done this
successfully a great # of times.

from this vantage point you may now take her  by the hand and say to the
others, "is it alright if I steal your friend away for a bit?"  they will
say yes and you take her out of earshot.  Id love you to see me work a set
like that.  its brilliant.  and PRACTICAL.

Svengali  wrote in article
<131220002147344283%Svengali_here@use.net>...
> Gentlemen, you're looking for the whole package, not just the
> packaging.  And if all you're focusing on is the packaging, she damn
> well knows it and is in control of you --period!
> 
> You must, repeat, you must be prepared to walk at all times, no matter
> how much you would like to be on/in that body and face.
> 
> Remember, you are screening her to see if she is good enough for
> you, not the other way around.  And the only way you're going to find
> out if she is good enough for you is to learn as much as you can
> about the person that is within that female form.
> 
> Am I saying you must be screening every beauty for a long term
> relationship?  Hell no!  It can be for however long you want.  But
> the moment she sees, and it won't take her long, that you are screening
> her to see whether or not she is good enough for you, is the moment
> the tables get turned and she understands that she has to make herself
> look good in your eyes.
> 
> Now contrast this with all the other guys who are trying to make
> themselves look good in her eyes, so they can get on/in her.
> 
> To illustrate what I am saying, picture this: we're in a manhattan bar,
> and there is this gorgeous looking woman, with the greatest face you've
> seen, talking to a few guys.  One happens to be our own great NYC with
> his magnificient weight-lifting body and his "I'm great" attitude; 
> another is Riker with his patterns, a third is Greg19 with his band of
> ways, and so on.  So basically what you would have is a bunch of guys
> trying to find and give this woman what she wants, so as to get on/in
> her.
> 
> Then there's Svengali, with his Carey Grant looks and ways, who sees
> the woman, walks right up into the group and says "excuse me guys, I
> just wanted to ask the lady where she got, and whose idea it was to get
> those earrings that seems to make her skin sparkle and her eyes glow,
> and then I'll leave." [Turning to her] "So please tell me, where did
> you get, and what made you decide [Svengali's hand goes out to the
> earrings, and in the process, lightly touches the lady's neck] to get
> these earrings that seems to make your skin sparkle and your eyes
> glow?"  {She tells me.}  "Thank you."  "Bye guys, I'm going back over
> there [pointing, so the lady knows where I will be]."
> 
> Look what just occurred: (1) I showed I wasn't afraid of a damn thing. 
> (2) I disarmed my opponents.  (3) I made her feel good.  (4) I showed
> her I wasn't about to hang around and try and get her.  {Of course to
> firmly establish that point, I would engage another woman in
> conversation, and have her positioned in a way that the first woman
> would see her with me, which would have her wondering what kind of nice
> things was I saying to her, that she wasn't getting.}.
> 
> Who do you think the woman is likely to be focused on and thinking
> about: all the guys who are there, still trying to get to her, or the
> guy who said what he wanted, made her feel good/great, left, and is now
> focused on someone else?  {I removed one of her feel good sources, so
> even though the others are there, with theirs, she like nearly everyone
> of us, is focused on the one that's been lost, not the ones that are
> present.}
> 
> Show your interest in her, but also show that you are walking the
> moment *she's* not exactly like you want.
> 
> Now I'll play devil's advocate and say that my little "walk away"
> didn't work.  Do you think I care?  Hell no, and I'll tell you why: the
> one who chases to gets, will always have to chase to have.  So whoever
> would win with the woman, would have to keep providing whatever they
> did to keep her interested.  I, on the other hand, only need to use a
> little charm and then walk away to have her wanting me.
> 
> I ask you, who do you think has an easier time of it?
> 
> -- 
> If you don't know in the first twenty minutes whether or not you're going
to
> have sex with the woman you just met, and whether or not you even want
to,
> you're not a seductionist.
> 
>   'o o'
> Svengali
>

Taking control when things go wrong

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Toecutter, and using the laws of power!




From toecutter@mail.com Mon Oct 23 09:39:39 2000
From: "toecutter" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Lessons from Book: The 48 Laws of Power
Lines: 201


Just reading a book, The 48 Laws of Power by Robert Greene. Definitely
lessons everywhere in the book on what we do here.
The book is amoral, and open about the deception inherit in what he is
teaching. It is largely for life outside the arena of seduction, but
entrirely applicable and there are some seduction examples in it to
illustrate his points (only historical: For example the advice of Ninon de
Lenclos on seduction to the Marquis de Sevigne and what happened when the
Marquis did not follow her advice, etc.). The examples are all pulled from
the Sun Tzu (Chinese, the Art of War), European history, famous con men,
magicians and charlatans, Kings, Queens, Napoleon and other power brokers
such as Al Capone. Perfect for you guys who enjoy Machiavelli. At 450
reasonably large format pages it is fairly long.

It is going to take me several re-readings, but at the moment I see the
messages as really 3 fold: First, play your cards pretty close to your
chest. This creates mystery. The more you say, the more common you appear
and the less in control. Andy Wohol created enigma by not discussing his
work and answering questions by being intentionally vague giving people the
feeling that he was being more profound than he was.  If you do not reveal
all, people will never become bored with you or your presence because you
will continue to represent a challenge, and will be eternally interesting.
Your silence will make other people feel uncomfortable and humans are
machines of interpretation and explanation; they have to know what you are
thinking. When you carefully control what you reveal, they cannot pierce
your intentions and meaning. Your short answers will put them on the
defensive and they will jump in, nervously filling the silence with all
kinds of comments that will reveal valuable information about themselves and
their weaknesses.

This brings me to the second message. Learn everything you can about other
people. Their strengths and weaknesses, their crutches and trance words.
Their motivations. Use these to your advantage whilst revealing as little as
possible about yourself. Keep them the focus of the conversation, and be a
'Spy' on their minds by eliciting values.

The third lesson is to use smoke and mirrors to obscure your objectives and
motivations. Throw decoys out there, use gifts as Trojan horses, and be
circumspect in what is going on. Again, this throws them off your game,
gives you an upper hand.

None of this is to say that you need to be quiet or a bad conversationalist,
just the opposite, by spying and eliciting values, you are encouraging
people to talk about themselves, their own favourite subject. By being brief
about yourself you are creating mystery and interest. It is just that you
are collecting the information in order to use it against them at another
time, whilst manipulating your image and reputation in their minds and
obscuring your real motivations. In some ways it is a book on playing hard
to get while outmanoeuvring the girl. A perfect structure in which to drop
SS.

Some of the content is below. I can post more on it if you would like
further discussion; I am overflowing with ideas on it.

Toecutter.

---

To list some of the laws that are obviously applicable:

Law 3: Conceal your intentions (Keep people off balance and in the dark by
never revealing the purpose behind your actions. If they have no clue what
you are up to, they cannot prepare a defence. Guide them far enough down the
wrong path, envelop them in enough smoke, and by the time they realise your
intentions, it will be too late.)

Law 4: Always say less than is necessary

Law 6: Court attention at all costs

Law 8: Make other people come to you - use bait if necessary

Law 9: Win though your actions, never through argument. (Any momentary
triumph you win though argument is really a Pyrrhic victory: The resentment
and ill will you stir up is stronger and lasts longer than any momentary
change in opinion. It is much more powerful to get others to agree with you
though your actions, without saying a word. Demonstrate, do not explicate.)

Law 10: Infection: Avoid the unhappy and unlucky (it works the other way
also. This is an alternative take on social-proof, or pivots or whatever you
want to call them, as well as wingmen. Also advice on not getting involved
with the wrong girl.)

Law 11: Learn to keep people dependent on you.

Law 12: Use selective generosity to disarm your victim (One sincere and
honest move will cover over dozens of dishonest ones. Openhearted gestures
of honesty and generosity bring down the guard of even the most suspicious
people. Once your selective honesty opens a hole in their armour, you can
deceive and manipulate at will.)

Law 13: When asking for help, appeal to people's self interest, never to
their mercy or gratitude.

Law 14: Pose as a friend, work as a spy.

Law 16: Use absence to increase respect and honour. (Again through mystery
and not stuffing it up by staying too long and doing or saying something
wrong.)

Law 17: Keep others in suspended terror: Cultivate an air of
unpredictability

Law 18: Do not build fortresses to protect yourself - Isolation is
dangerous. (Get out there amongst them).

Law 19: Know who you are dealing with - do not offend the wrong person.

Law 20: Do not commit yourself to anyone.

Law 21: Play a sucker to catch a sucker - appear dumber than your mark. (Let
her think that she is in control and smart, less naive, don't let on you are
a player).

Law 25: Re-create yourself (Do not accept the roles that society foists on
you. Re-create yourself by forging a new identity, one that commands
attention and never bores the audience. Be the master of your own image
rather than letting others define it for you. Incorporate dynamic devices
into your public gestures and actions - your power will be enhanced and your
character will seem larger than life).

Law 26: Keep your hands clean. (You must seem a paragon of civility and
efficiency: Your hands are never soiled by mistakes and nasty deeds.
Maintain such a spotless appearance by using others as scapegoats and cat'
s-paws to disguise your involvement).

Law 27: Play on peoples need to believe to create a cult like following.
(advice in this chapter is on how to become a cult leader or maybe build a
harem. 5 strategies to your dogma! a) Keep it vague; Keep it simple b)
Emphasise the visual and sensual over the intellectual c) Borrow the forms
of organised religion to structure the group d) Disguise your income source
e) set up an us-vs.-them dynamic. I think Ross Jeffries read this one!)

Law 28: Enter action with Boldness. (If you are unsure of a course of
action, do not attempt it. Your doubts and hesitations will infect your
execution. Timidity is dangerous: Better to enter with boldness. Any
mistakes you make through audacity are easily corrected with more audacity.
Everyone admires the bold; no one honours the timid).

Law 29: Plan all the way to the end.

Law 30: Make your accomplishments seem effortless. (Your actions must seem
natural and executed with ease. All the toil and practice that goes into
them, also all the clever tricks, must be concealed. When you act, act
effortlessly, as if you could do much more. Avoid the temptation of
revealing how hard you work - it only raises questions. Teach no one your
tricks or they will be used against you .. I am breaking this rule right
here with this post, as is the Authour of the book.)

Law 31: Control the options: Get others to play with the cards you deal.
(The best deceptions are the ones that seem to give the other person a
choice: Your victims feel they are in control, but are actually your
puppets. Give people options that come out in your favour whichever one they
choose. Force them to make choices between the lesser of two evils, both of
which serve your purpose. Put them on the horns of the dilemma: they are
gored wherever they turn. Note: this is a different view on my idea of
re-framing questions. The questions are re-framed so well that the girl has
no option.)

Law 32: Play to people's fantasies.

Law 33: Discover each mans thumbscrew.

Law 34: Be royal in your own fashion: Act like a king to be treated like
one.

Law 35: Master the art of timing. (Never seem to be in a hurry - hurrying
betrays a lack of control over yourself, and over time. Always seem patient,
as if you know that everything will come to you eventually. Become a
detective of the right moment; sniff out the spirit of the times, the trends
that will carry you to power. Learn to stand back when the time is not yet
ripe, and to strike fiercely when it has reached fruition.)

Law 36: Disdain things you cannot have: Ignoring them is the best revenge.

Law 37: Create compelling spectacles. (Striking imagery and grand symbolic
gestures create the aura of power - everyone responds to them. Stage
spectacles for those around you, then, full of arresting visuals and radiant
symbols to heighten your presence. Dazzled by appearances, no one will
notice what you are really doing.)

Law 40: Despise the free Lunch.

Law 43: Work on the hearts and minds of others.

Law 44: Disarm and infuriate with the mirror effect. (The mirror reflects
reality, but is the perfect tool for deception: When you mirror your
enemies, doing exactly as they do, they cannot figure out your strategy. The
mirror Effect mocks and humiliates them, making them overreact. By holding
up a mirror to their psyches, you seduce them with the illusion that you
share their values; by holding up a mirror to their actions you teach them a
lesson. Few can resist the power of the mirror effect.)

Law 48: Assume formlessness. (By taking a shape, by having a visible plan,
you open yourself to attact. Instead of taking a form for the girl to grasp,
keep yourself adaptable and on the move. Accept the fact that nothing is
certain and no law is fixed. The best way to protect yourself is to be as
fluid and formless as water: never bet on stability or lasting order.
Everything changes.)

Maniac High's Pick Up Girls Guide and Seduction Website! » mystery

Maniac High — Thu, 20 May 2010 12:22:49 +0000

Buy Reductil No Prescription, From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Mystery and others write about successful openers.

Status: O

talk about esp and its impossibility

talk about how you met a bear while hiking

talk about how you were scared shitless rock climbing when your rope snapped

or talk about the famous person you met

does she believe in ghosts. why, Buy Reductil No Prescription.

or hotseat (like question game but more brutal)

talk about the time you bladed down a steep hill and survived. Buy Reductil No Prescription, talk about the time you were on stage

...

mystery

-----

From nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org Wed Apr 12 07:31:37 2000
From: nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org (Nathan SZILARD)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: After the # close

They find it very funny and show it to their friends, plus
they remember, Buy Reductil No Prescription.

| If you did any anchoring on your voice when you met, order Reductil, Buy Reductil without a prescription, now's the time to
| unleash them.

----

From slidewguy@remove-aol.com Wed Apr 12 07:47:28 2000
From: "whoisthis19"
Subject: Some closes
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast

Any of you guys got ways of getting chicks to leave with you outside
the club.

greg1

Did you sleep with yourself or... did you turn yourself down because
you was too easy.

Doing Successful Openers

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Mystery and others write about successful openers!



From: "Mystery" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast,Alt.psychology.nlp,alt.hypnosis
References: <37602334.55753831@bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Chat suggestions
Date: Wed, 16 Jun 1999 04:58:12 -0700
Lines: 63
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts7-36t-14.idirect.com
Message-ID: <37676655@nemo.idirect.com>
X-Trace: 16 Jun 1999 04:54:45 -0400, ts7-36t-14.idirect.com
Organization: via Internet Direct

Status: O

talk about esp and its impossibility

talk about how you met a bear while hiking

talk about how you were scared shitless rock climbing when your rope snapped

or the time you visited your friends friend with him and your buddy was
almost beaten to death when the friend he visited had a boyfriend who came
out and there was a 20 minute car chase through lights and you were looking
for the cops but lot the crazed boyfriend before you found cops.

or the time you were in the hospital and it changed the way food tastes.
the birds sound clearer now.

or the time you netbused (hacked) into a bank but chickened out and put the
money into a charity

or talk about the famous person you met

does she believe in ghosts?  why?

you like candles and incense.  what does SHE like?  the music game modified
for all types of objects.

play the question game with her

or hotseat (like question game but more brutal)

talk about the time you bladed down a steep hill and survived.

talk about the time you were on stage

...

mystery



-----


From nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org Wed Apr 12 07:31:37 2000
From: nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org (Nathan SZILARD)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: After the # close

On Mon, 03 Apr 2000 21:26:22 GMT, Rio  wrote:
| I was reading elsewhere on a post, that if you instruct her to sound
| cheerful on the phone when you call when you do a # close.

I tried that, it's not a magic bullet. But it's fun.

I now always write some shit along with my phone #:
something like "DO NOT FALL IN LOVE" or "NO STALKING PLEASE".

They find it very funny and show it to their friends, plus
they remember.

| If you did any anchoring on your voice when you met, now's the time to
| unleash them.



----

From slidewguy@remove-aol.com Wed Apr 12 07:47:28 2000
From: "whoisthis19" 
Subject: Some closes
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast

Hand her the slip of paper and pen and have her write down her number.
When she's hands it back, ask her to put it someplace so you will
remeber to call her.  Last time I did this she put it down my pants and
grabbed my cock.  

Ask a gal to trade shirts.  When she balks, keep pressing in a joking
manner then finally ask to her to go outside to trade shirts.  Nothing
better then getting her outside.

Another one is simply saying its too smokey, noisy, smelly in here. 
Lets go outsde for some air.

Any of you guys got ways of getting chicks to leave with you outside
the club?

greg1

Did you sleep with yourself or... did you turn yourself down because
 you was too easy.

A conversation with Mystery! Pickups

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


A conversation with Mystery!

Tips on fieldwork from a pick up artist! on IRC #PUA!


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A Conversation with Mystery, a Pick-up Artist (PUA)

Topics Include: 

The Kiss Close
Clubbing alone
Handling guys
Being a story-teller
Preparation and format
Quality vs. quantity

Lego: Hey Mystery, what's your favorite story to close with?  How 
exactly do you transition from the telling of a story to closing?

Mystery: "The Kiss Close" is my favorite routine.  Once you have three 
indicators of interest (she touches you, laughs consistantly at your 
jokes, leans in towards you, smiles a lot and keeps eye contact, resumes 
chat when you force silence, etc) you then phase shift.  You turn 180 
degrees on a dime.  Go from humorous and non-sexual to saying, "Stop.  
Would you like to kiss me?", right out of the blue.  She will say either 
say, "Uh - no",(which is unlikely as you don't bother performing "The 
Kiss Close" until enough indicators are present) or, "I donno" (they 
rarely say, "Yes"). "I donno" means she actually does want to but feels 
embarrassed on how to say "Yes".  So you reply, "Lets find out", then go 
in slowly and kiss her.  It's very simple and very effective.  If she 
says, "Why?", this is also a yes.  Simply reply, "It looked like you had 
something on your mind.  Would you like to kiss me?"  Wait again for 
her response.  If her response is "No" then reply, "Hey I didn't say you 
COULD.  You just had that look in your eye."

Lego: What do you do if you're interrupted? You're telling your target 
a story and she is all into it but some AFC cock-blocking idiot just 
runs up and starts screaming and yelling and you're like, "What the 
fuck?"

Mystery: Simply ask him if you can borrow his pen.  When he gives it to 
you, throw it away as you say, "Fetch."

Wakeboarder: Hahaha.  Nice!

Lego: What if he's bigger than you?

Mystery: I'd instead call him on his disruptive shit and remark, "Dude, 
what are you attempting here?"  Not good enough?  Then say, "Ladies?  
Shall we discover what adventure awaits us in another room?"

Wakeboarder: Man, none of my buds want to go to the club.

Gamer: Screw them then.

Mystery: Go alone.

Wakeboarder: I need to be made fun of for this comment but I feel like 
a weiner if I go to a club myself

Lego: Bro, your trippin'. I go solo many times. It's good actually.  
It's weird if it's a first night but if I've been there before it's cool.

Mystery: Yeah, I understand ... and yet, staying home alone will make 
you feel so much better?  Go out alone, meet some cool dudes when you 
get there (they will become your wingmen there) and then run around 
getting #'s.  Report to your fellow PUAs what happened.  Whatever happened 
to the concept, "The alphamale gets all the women?"  Shit dude, what are 
you, a mommas boy?  Do you need your hand held?  

Lego: How do you strike up conversations with guys?

Mystery: Walk up and say, "Hey dude, question for ya.  Do you know 
where a good place to score is in this city? 'Cause this place looks like a 
cock farm."

Lego: Good!  You should be able to relate to guys to disarm them.  You 
don't compete; you ELIMINATE COMPETETION.

Gamer: LOL.  Dude, the only results I've had were solo.  My friends 
psych me out too much because they never help.  Instead they just complain 
about my taking too much time.  They laugh at me or just generally piss 
me off.

Mystery: I have MUCH better results (and MUCH more fun) playing "The 
Game" alone.  It forces you to approach.  It's a great motivator.

Lego: Damn! I couldn't have put it better myself.

Gamer: Yep.

Mystery: You wont be alone for more than five minutes once you approach 
your first set anyways.  Gamer, I suggest you call them on their shit 
at some point.  Demonstrate your alphamale characteristics.

Lego: How do you continue talking?  I mean, group set dynamics are much 
different in a one one on one approach.

Mystery: Be a story-teller - THAT is the skill of the PUA.  It isn't 
SEDUCING; it's STORY-TELLING.  It is my personal belief that SS patterns 
arent as 'hypnotic' as they are 'entertaining' stories.

Wakeboarder: Sweet

Lego: Actually with the story stuff I SEE WHAT YOU MEAN.  They just 
follow that lead.

Wakeboarder: Well, I need to stop being a sackless wonder and grow some 
fuckin' balls then!  Hmm, story telling ...

Mystery: Here's an example.  "Ever been camping?  Well I was up in a 
forest up north and was hiking with some girlfriends of mine ... and we 
came along some trail and there was shit on the path.  My friends were 
like, "haaaa someone shit in the woods" and I said, "lets get the fuck 
out of here like NOW."  they thought I was just scared of shit and I 
said, "Girls, you dont get it.  This shit is still warm and its not human.  
Its bear shit.  This is a big fucking bear.  Look at the size of that 
turd."  Notice it's not sexual?  Most hot girls gets get "sex-talk" 
right away from AFCs.  NOT talking sex with them makes them question 
whether you are interested in them.  Leave them guessing until you get 
indicators of interest from them.  If they like your great personality 
(confident, humorous, etc) they will give you subtle but distinct clues.

Gamer: How do you flow from story to story?

Mystery: If there is ONE mental state you should force yourself into, 
its TALKATIVE.  Talk your fucking HEAD off.  Just go from one story 
straight into another one like a comedian does.  Ever find yourself excited 
about something and you talk and talk and talk?  THAT is what must 
happen to get a girl.  You have to ENTERTAIN them.  Look talkative yet not 
desperate.  

Gamer: Heh.

Lego: Dude, I had that going last night. You're so right.  That's an 
excellent example dude.  I was telling this story about getting harassed 
by cops or some shit.  It's a cool story but my delivery sucked and I 
was losing one of the two girls I was telling it to.  What if they fail 
to elaborate on your story?  Besides it being a bad story to begin 
with, how can you fix it on the fly?

Mystery: They don't have to interact with it.  Its a good thing to have 
flexible stories to allow for some comment but it's not nessessary.  
It's YOUR job to perform the material.  It's your audiences job to 
listen,laugh and generally be entertained.  That's it.  At the end of 10 
minutes you will see the girls digging you (positive indicators).  You then 
phase shift abruptly into the close.

Lego: HOW DO YOU PHASE SHIFT?  I've been wondering this. While I didn't 
come off as obvious in last nights case and just told her to kiss me (I 
knew she would anyway), this could have been smoother.

Alpha: Lego, you ad libbed the close?  So working on ad libbing is 
good?

Mystery: Ad libbed material is not as accurate in closing as is 
performing the well constructed and field-tested "Kiss Close" routine.  Ad 
libbing is BONUS material but don't COUNT on it.  Have your material, like 
a good comedian, prepared before performing.  This isn't "A Night at 
the Improv" fellas.

Gamer: Heh.

Mystery: All PUs have a format; a beginning, a middle and an end.  If 
you don't know what the next routine is going to be then you may end up 
with an unfortunate pregnant pause which fucks up your pacing.  You may 
end up filling the silence with the deadly, "So ... um ... what do you 
do?"  Preparation saves face.  Afterall, with your particular close, 
she could have pulled away from your trying to kiss her.  Then what?!!  
Instead, consider engaging her in enthusiastic conversation, then go 
directly into the close.  In other words, stop her in mid-sentence and 
with a curious tone, kiss close.

Wakeboarder: cool.  Lego, what indicators clued you in that she wanted 
the kiss?

Alpha: In what way can you be prepared?  If we're talking about 
story-telling in front of a random girl we just met seconds ago in a random 
place ...

Mystery: Like a good comedian, have your material prepared yet when 
onstage be prepared to dynamically omit certain routines and to add others 
on the fly.  Sometimes certain routines fit the situation better than 
others.  Have 3 to 5 alternative openers (as a comedian would) and enjoy 
performing the one you think best fits the situation will get the best 
reaction for the group you are in front of

Alpha: Gotcha now.  Can you give me a brief example of how you go about 
preparing?

Mystery: Sure.  First, find 3 openers and memorize them.  Write down a 
list of openers (just the headings of each opener to remind you).  
Next, write down some routines (the question game, the music game, the 
photo routine, the bear in the woods story, etc - all on dejanews) and then 
also memorize the kiss close and the # close.  Memorize 3 NEGs too and 
you are good to go.  With the material in your mind, you are prepared 
to work it in the field until you have the timing of the material down 
(again, just like a comedian.)

Alpha: Man, you provide some really eye-opening ideas... (just when I'm 
about to think there's nothing more to learn.

Wakeboarder: So what you're saying is have a routine set up and modify 
it to each situation? Kind of like having a PU template?

Mystery: It's ALL about format.  Know the format and stick to it.  If 
you now what the next step is in the PU, you wont feel scared.  It gets 
fun and you begin to appreciate the strategy behind it all.

Wakeboarder: Yeah like FMAC? That's a simple format.

Mystery: Yes, FMAC.  Each letter in FMAC is an abrupt phase shift.  
"FIND" means having to abruptly disturb your complacency by getting out of 
the house.  It takes effort for many people to do bother getting THIS 
FAR.  "MEET" is a HUGE abrupt change.  "There she is!  3, 2, 1, GO!"  In 
the "ATTRACT" phase, you need to go from the walk up to the TALKATIVE 
performer entertaining story-teller.  You will need A LOT of energy for 
this (enthusiasm is contagious afterall) and for many to go from 
slumping around to being in performer mode is ABRUPT.  Finally you must then 
"CLOSE"; to phase shift from humour to serious is also abrupt.  Each 
phase may FEEL awkward but it looks normal.  When a comedian finishes one 
topic and just goes into an entirely new unrelated topic, the audience 
doesn't care as long as the next topic is entertaining.

Wakeboarder: Very true.

Gamer: Cool.  I'm collecting openers and other routines off the 
layguide right now.

Alpha: Do you believe in the 80/20 'rule'?  Meaning, 80% of the quality 
women are found in 20% of the right places or connections or 
situations.

Mystery: The quality of a woman is SO subjective. Quality is difficult 
to QUANTIFY.  80% of QUALITY?  It's pointless trying to mix and match 
these concepts. INSTEAD consider that there are HOTTIES and UGs (YOU get 
to decide based on your personal criteria) and of the HOTTIES, some 
have pleasant personalities and others do not.  You cannot possibly judge 
her personality until she LIKES you.  So go out ... FIND her, MEET her, 
ATTRACT her and THEN decide if you want to CLOSE her AFTER judging her 
personality.  Judging her by the way she treats you on your approach is 
lame because particularly beautiful women all have their bitch shields 
up and running.  They have to.  They aren't planning on fucking every 
guy that says Hi to them.  The only way to get rid of the guys is to 
oftentimes offend them quickly.  It's not personal.  It's merely a learned 
strategy.  So is the "I have a boyfriend excuse, but that's a different 
story.  I also suggest CLOSING everyone just for the education.  You 
don't actually have to CALL the girls of course.  You simply get to 
practice CLOSING too.  Getting a girls number is merely an OPTION.  You 
don't have to follow up on ALL of them you know.

Keen: Heh.

Wakeboarder: Cool, judging the girls only after you have attracted 
them.  Kind of makes you approach too!  You can't say the bull shit line, 
"She's not my type, I can tell", to get you out of approaching.

Alpha: Do you have a web page?

Mystery: No, not currently.  I'm writing a book though called The 
Mystery Method.  Most of my ramblings can be found on the layguide. 

Ascence: Hey, is it true that the older we get the more money/social 
status becomes and issue?

Mystery: No matter what social status you have (or THINK you have), 
it's still something you must convey in the first 25 minutes of meeting 
her.  We ALL start equal BEFORE meeting her; all men.  The issue is, can 
we congruently convey our social status (real or not) in our 
performance?  That's OUR responsibility.  The best way is not to TELL them about 
it but rather to DEMONSTRATE it.  How?  Well, if you talk about having 
girls always falling for you for instance, it's not NEARLY as good as 
actually having a couple hot girls with you saying what a hottie you are 
infront of the target.  This is called PAWNING.

Keen: I'm going to try doing the story-telling that you talked about.  
It's really hard though. I'm a real bad storyteller.  I've been working 
on it today. that's my lesson today.

Wakeboarder: Tell them about that time you saw a fallen over manequin 
in the department store and you tripped over it.  The security guard 
thought you were trying to make it with the manequin and called you a 
little freak.

Gamer: LOL (Laughing Out Loud).

Wakeboarder: One more question for you Mystery.  What's the meaning of 
life?

Mystery: To fuck. :)

Statement of Intent (SOI)

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Rio introduces a key part of PU: the 'Statement of Intent' (SOI)!

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2000 09:00:50 GMT
Subject: Find Stun Drag Fuck

G'day,

Jonathan Ashton  wrote in message
news:90eati$gpt@nnrp1.deja.com...
> As I've read the twelve-odd messages in this thread, I've been looking
> for something to take home with me, but I'm not finding it.
>
> Rio, how do you do things differently now, based on what you've said?

First thing would be to think about the close. Mystery knows his group work
perfect from how I read it, and I have been using his methods to great
success social-proof wise.

The BIG thing that clocked in my head was the need to STATE YOUR INTENTIONS
to the chick within the first minute of meeting her. I will make that my
rule from now on - as with the 3 second rule.
By this I DON'T mean "Let's fuck" or "Come to Papa baby" or any throw-away
shit like that. It has to be an honest assessment of what YOU feel capable
of doing to the chick after the "Hi" and the first round of fluff/routine
(routine preferred - something humourous). GM does this part BEAUTIFULLY,
because he does it with a sense of fun and humour - and HE KNOWS he is going
to do what he says and so does SHE!
I notice Mr. Sex states this a lot in his past posts - where AFC or shit
PUAs do approaches and talk to the chick, but never get to the point AND the
bitch can tell that the guys want to fuck but are too pussy to go for it.
Ross says something to the tune of "And maybe we could really get to like
each other" when he closes in HTGTWYDIB. I also recall that TokyoPUA did a
statement of intentions on that chick he PUed at night once who was
initially scared of him. Johnny Shack does it by when he just springs dates
on women he just met.
So there's some cross references.

The proper methodological way to get to a statement of intentions part is by
pace and lead. But the point of the matter is, you have to structure the
conversation to show interest and intent VERY soon or you will stall, chick
will get bored, feel teased, and then it's C&B time. Believe me, a LOT of
C&B experience with a LOT of HOT chicks has so far has taught me this
painful lesson.
The best way to put it is in the most honest way possible. I cannot give you
a specific example. But the idea is to get her thinking romantically about
you VERY soon. THEN you HAVE TO DO WHAT YOU SAID you would do to the chick
after DDB. (E.g. If you want to start things off gently by holding her hand,
tell her a scene where want to be holding her hand - and then do it in the
next routine after she is comfortable with this.) If you do NOT DO what you
say you will, eventually your congruence will fuck up when the chick loses
patience. Then the chick will be confused, get scared, and bolt. If this
ever happens and the guy tries to do heavy kino or try for a fuck while the
chick is in this state - It's gonna be RAPE.

In fact, on the matter of Rape. I read in Cosmo (Hey, My chick gets fucked
often and STILL reads this!) that psychologists WARN women against guys that
say "Come to my place to see my pictures" etc. when the idea is to fuck the
chick whilst your intentions aren't known to her - because it is DATE RAPE.
Thus as Maniac found out ages ago, that GROUNDWORK is the key element to
getting the chick over to fuck. That can be done through STATEMENT OF
INTENTIONS - and may not necessarily happen through Kiss closes.
You must remember this - a kiss is just a kiss........

IF that works, THEN we can reward her with more conversation and more
Mystery style routines or whatever (because she is OK with our intentions
then - thus the rewards), and THEN up the ante some more with our STATEMENT
OF INTENTIONS, building on what we established before - to get her more hot
and horny than before. So you may have started on holding her hands, now you
may progress on to hugging, kissing, fucking etc. whatever seems to be the
most logical progression from her actions towards you.

Patterns, routines, psych tests, will help greatly during the chat routines
in-between statements of intentions. Those are what set us apart from the
other PUAs out there.

Eventually we get to a point where the chick is DDB, then we can get to the
Drag (you must take the woman to fuck location, or have her so into you that
she will come to you) and Fuck part (in our world of course). The Our World
routine would then be the ULTIMATE in the STATEMENT OF INTENTIONS series
which would then lead to the deal fuck closed. It is in this one that you
state your relationship expectations and put it in "Our World"

Now the method is Find, Stun, Drag, Fuck.

The point is - FUCK all this bullshit about the woman needs to be done in
the "right way" to match her values. Something tells me now that a woman
made this comment as an attempt to rationalize her unreasonable emotions.
The values she wants ALL ALONG is #1 SEX, and to a lesser extent #2 to be
taken care of after SEX. That goes for ANY woman (thus the universality of
the whole principle). When the guy comes along as does her, she will
rationalise that the guy understood exactly what she felt. That's what some
religious women mean when they beautifully say "God knew when it was the
right time for me". In reality, they KNOW DEEP DOWN they are at the mercy of
guys and what they want to do with her. To her, that is "destiny" and no
wonder so many women are suckers for fortune-telling and the like.

Eliciting is when you want to # close or coffee close and check the girl out
for relationship potential. If it's ONS - hey! ya don't need it! If you
cannot attempt a kiss to fuck close in the given situation - you will have
to # close, but not forget to state that your intentions could well get
beyond just coffee!

The other thing - "Make no excuses for desires as a man" is THE SINGLE MOST
IMPORTANT THING (As Ross Jeffries has already said) but I had to experience
it myself to believe it. ALL of what I explained above IS USELESS in
practical application if you are trying to follow it like a script. The idea
is to GRAB that girl and NOT let her get away! ;) So guys, HOW MUCH DO YOU
WANT THAT GIRL? WHAT ARE YOU PREPARED TO DO?

Also on that note. BE A FUCKING MAN. Act like a guy, and don't think that
mirroring a girl completely is going to make you attractive to her. I know
from experience that the more caveman I go with chicks who KNOW my
intentions, the more they respond sexually.
Talk to chicks as if you were telling your kid brother how to play football
properly, cause your kid brother happens to be shit at football. I
especially like the way Mr. Sex talks to us on ASF - giving pointers and
what-not. I'm sure he talks to chicks exactly the same way IRL - showing
congruence all along.

You can even get around the language barrier! I just about dragged a sexy
Jgirl in a bikini off the beach while babbling to them in English! A
language they didn't even understand! I did that enough and with a smile,
that the chick went DDB and ready to GO when I took her hand. Had it not
been for the cockblock!
Somebody must have taught the "Iranian from hell" this shit!

The way I think about it is much like caveman sex. You see the hot chick,
you bang her on the head with your club, you take her to your cave, you root
her. Thus :- Find Stun Drag Fuck.
Just a bit more aggressive than Find Meet Attract Close, but that's the best
way I could describe what this ugly-as-fuck PUA was doing.

These were the attitudes that I had when I was only just starting to pull
women at incredible speeds while on holiday.

The other point is on Objection handling in regards to the STATEMENT OF
INTENTIONS. What I learned from the PUA I met, is that you fight chick
bullshit with your own bullshit - with a slightly authoritive tone (no need
to REALLY get pissed).
For example :- The chicks said "We have to get to our car" and were ready to
leave
The Playboy said "You can't leave anyway because the gates are closed" even
though the gates aren't closed.
Thus this covers handling chick bullshit - on the phone as well as in real
life.
And one chick on another seduction board I read often typed something to the
tune that she wants to be with a guy that can bullshit his way into her
pants.

So there you go. Find Stun Drag Fuck.
Stun is the hardest.

> There are reasons why most of us step through seduction so gingerly.
> We know that saying or doing one wrong thing can blow up the seduction.
> As far as I can tell, letting her know you intend to fuck her before
> you fuck her is one of those things.  Another reason is that women
> won't tell you when they're ready to fuck.

But DDB does tell all!
That single most common fuckup is what is called LACK OF CONGRUENCE
(definition courtesy of Mr. Sex). Just like when I called that chick I met
yesterday "my friend" in front of her. Doing that is a sign of weakness.
Chicks can get away with having words out of congruence with their actions,
but guys CANNOT.

> You say that when you "lead girls on" and tease them too much, you look
> easy and they hate you.  But this insight doesn't make it any easier to
> recognize when you're "leading them on".  The window between when a
> woman is receptive to a close and when you've stalled her is short, and
> spotting it seems to be harder than superstring theory.  The answer
> seems to be to make hundreds of approaches, and very slowly improve
> through experience.

Well you have body language and other subtle pointers. Plus we are adding
all the time to our STATEMENT OF INTENTIONS in order to find a barrier and
cut off point. I don't doubt that noticing DDB when you have the intuition
becomes easier.

  The one concrete thing I get out of your post is
> that next time two HBs want a foursome with you and your LTR, you'll be
> more likely to recognize it.  Or maybe the situation will be different
> enough that you won't.

I fucked that up because I KNOW those chicks wanted me to go with them, and
I over-teased them and didn't capitulate and then state my intentions to
have a foursome. They would have been up for it!
That's when the Playboy showed up to show me the shit, and then beat me
hands-down in a round of THE GAME. ;)

> You also said, "Now I realise more than fucking EVER what a chick
> wants. She wants a guy to go and GET her, make her feel wanted, and
> then have the shit fucked out of her!"  But you agreed with another
> poster that you can't just walk up to a woman and say "Let's fuck."
> So what's your new insight here?

It's a no-brainer. Is sex ALL you bringing to the table? That's why he
coupled GM styled intention pointers further into the seduction (after the
earlier G-rated ones), and then when they succeeded in not objecting, he
went to Mystery routines as a reward OR to the Drag phase if they were DDB.
You cannot start the seduction with a statement of intention that skips the
buildup - unless the chick is THAT FUCKING HORNY and shameless.
Chicks want to know that you care about them as human beings and not just
sex objects. Thus neutral conversation gets smattered in between, and the
final statement of intentions clearly shows what his intentions are so SHE
KNOWS that you care about her feelings - in that way.

The Playboy I met even went to see a chick he had a threesome with the next
day (cause she was feeling a bit alone). This guy was no cheap "Player"
(which he pointed out in his great Our world styled close routine on this
9). You could tell he cared enough too.

> Have you figure out a better way to know when a woman is ready to
> be closed?  Or a faster way to get her to want to fuck?  Or a way to
> let her know your intentions without scaring her off?  What's the
> difference between your approach now and your approach before you went
> to Guam?  It sounds like you feel you understand things better than
> you did before, but I can't figure out what the new understanding is.

Well, now you have your answer.
Mind you, I'm only getting the framework now that I sit down and try and
explain what I am now doing. This shit became automatic when I had the whole
experience of witnessing this guy and learning from him.

Any questions or comments? Fire away....

Rio
-------

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
References:  <90eati$gpt@nnrp1.deja.com> <63JW5.205t1.56373@nnrp.gol.com> <90i82p$iao@nnrp1.deja.com>
Subject: Re: Find Stun Drag Fuck

Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2000 10:04:46 GMT

Jonathan Ashton  wrote in message
news:90i82p$iao@nnrp1.deja.com...
> In article <63JW5.205t1.56373@nnrp.gol.com>,
>   "Rio"  wrote:
> > Well, now you have your answer.
>
> Yeah, I understand much better now.  Thanks for writing it down.
>
> > Any questions or comments? Fire away....
>
> So I get the abstract idea now:  Make some sort of Statement Of
> Intentions (SOI) to a woman relatively early, and then act congruently
> with it.

More or less, that's it.
The thing is, after dropping routines - get to it or the chick gets confused
and drops out.
Mystery had the right idea with his routines and intros. BUT if you fail to
State your intentions - you can stall things and stale her out. Then it will
be your fault when it appears that the routines don't work! They may have
worked, but she has given up on you as a partner already. You teased too
much.

> Like most people, though, I don't really understand any abstract idea
> until I've seen two or three concrete examples; i.e. HOW to make that
> SOI.

Ross Jeffries has already covered how to do this with his NLP pacing and
leading. I'm just giving a name to the end result of doing that (SOI -
Statement of Intention).

SOIs are SO important to women. They want to know where they stand. Women
you are with and haven't SOIed will think to themselves :- "What am I to
him"?
With my LTR which I sloppily SOIed, she annoyed me for ages if I was her
boyfriend or not. I hadn't said, and was therefore walking thin ice.
That drove her NUTS.

Now, I guess I could show you some fake examples of stuff that you could
launch into your PU - but the reason why I'm not going to do that is because
if ANYBODY creates a list of them - we're going to get the problem that AFC
men ALREADY have with PU Lines. That is, throwing meaningless words into a
conversation and then not being able to back them up.
Either that, or we will develop a single street pickup routine which men
will use the world over with great success before women cotton on to it.
When it comes to SOI, DIY (damn all these acronymns!).

An example of SOI is what I said to the chick I tried to PU on the weekend.
I paced it to the point where we are talking about where we lived, and I
found out that she lived close. Then I said "That's good, so we can get
together really easy and have some fun then."
If she had been far away - no problem "That's too bad. I'll have to travel
far to get together with you and have fun"
If she lives on Mars - no problem "Wow! You live out there! I'll have to
build a rocket to come and see you after you go back there!"

So there you go. Who needs to be excessively GM?

> You gave the example of GM style.  Yep, GM makes a pretty clear SOI.
> I don't think a "recovering nice guy" like me could do GM congruently,
> though.

I have done it once successfully and it Suuure works. But yes, it's hard to
work things up to that because you skip a lot of buildup steps. The flirting
has to take place in a sexual level rather than a much safer level. That is
risky.
That's what I mean when by saying "Let's Fuck" you run the risk of having to
flirt at such a high level where you can fuck up easily. Not that it's
impossible of course.
NEGs (which I forgot to mention before) help especially in the
objection,flirt phase. This phase is like the part where the dog chases
after the bitch to try and fuck her, and the bitch keeps running. The thrill
of the chase!

> You mention TokyoPUA and Johnny Shack references, but it would take
> a lot of searching/guessing to find the specific examples you have in
> mind.  And I don't understand your Ross example - "And maybe we could
> really get to like each other" sounds like a pretty vague SOI; maybe
> I'd understand what you mean if I knew the context?

Search for stuff on the archived layguide for stuff about Johnny Shack. He
also has an online book. Ross has his old free book around the place. Search
Formhandle for TokyoPUA's posts.
By the way, I even went as far as reading ALL of Mystery's decent posts as
well.

> The only example of an SOI I see in your posts is this one from Guam
> PUA:
>
> > As for going for the fuck close? Forget your sexual accelerators.
> > This guy said the whole shit in plain English - and I saw him say
> > this all to to a chick. He basically said that he was a playboy, but
> > not a pickup artist (to frame the idea that he won't fuck and dump),
> > and that when he had sex with the chick (Framing it as if it's going
> > to happen) that she should just enjoy it for fun and not worry about
> > it too much because it's just their private thing (our world style
> > routine), and that he was not an easy guy in reality - that he was
> > quite selective in who he chooses for sex (so he doesn't look like a
> > meat-market man).
> > He said all this straight faced to a chick, and while I was watching
> > the chick he did this on - she was trancing out and playing with her
> > hair. It was totally evil.
>
> So my questions...
>
> Have you ever done a SOI to kiss a girl and not had her object?  If so,
> what did you say?  Have you ever done a SOI to fuck a girl and not had
> her object?  If so, what did you say?  Hell, do you remember the exact
> words of any SOI you've ever said?

I gave you an example above of an SOI above (where I told the chick that we
would hang out in the future). No doubt we can refine the whole shit a lot
better in the future.
And yes. I think everyone at some stage has done an SOI, or the body
language has been good enough to get her into that zone where she KNOWS
maybe at 70% where your intentions are, with or without any routines to help
snag the chick, and the chick has put up some token resistance. The purpose
of the resistance of course, is to set the scene for the chase you know will
end in a fuck if you can just reel the bitch in. You will eventually do it
as long as you have remained congruent throughout.

> What other kinds of SOIs would you use in the buildup?  Tell her you're
> going to give her a neck massage?  (I'm sure that question sounds
> clueless; but I really think the meat is in the details.)

Well pace it:-
"Have you ever felt like having a neck massage? I think you need one, so
I'll give you one"
Sometimes the more direct your SOIs are, the harder she will force you to
keep pushing them.
So let's say the chick flirts and says "Why do you want to? I don't need
one!"
So we have to SOI her again in the second sentence in this example :- "Well
you haven't had one of my massages that can make you feel good all over. Now
relax....."

The idea is to trap the chick at all costs with your intentions that you can
carry out - until she can't get away.
Even "No I can't!" "Yes you can!" "No I can't!" "Yes you can!" fights - if
that's what it comes down to - can win you the day if you persist and not
let her win! Verbal arguments can always be solved with kino - cause you as
the guy are STRONGER. I don't mean hit her, but mauling is OK as long as she
is enjoying it! ;)

Persistance is VERY important. Of course, you may want to dump the chick
after the fuck if she doesn't drop the shit because she is too much work to
obtain sex from in the long run. Just give her an ultimatum "Cut the shit or
you will be lonely!"

At the same time, you can get trapped if you say an SOI that you can't
possibly keep. So watch what you promise to do!
Saying shit like "I'm going to buy you a Rolls Royce!" when she KNOWS you
can't afford it is an extreme example of a shit SOI. There goes your trust
and congruency with that one.

> And as for one other comment you made:
>
> > (E.g. If you want to start things off gently by holding her hand,
> > tell her a scene where want to be holding her hand - and then do it
> > in the next routine after she is comfortable with this.)
>
> You mean you tell her a story about some guy you know who held some
> girl's hand?  Or what?  Methinks I really don't understand here.

You can do that to get her thinking about holding someone's hand - and once
she is feeling it, you may be able to slip in the kino and get away with it.
At least, your chances will be better.

> > Is sex ALL you bringing to the table? That's why he
> > coupled GM styled intention pointers further into the seduction
> > (after the earlier G-rated ones), and then when they succeeded in
> > not objecting, he went to Mystery routines as a reward OR to the
> > Drag phase if they were DDB.
>
> I would LOVE to see these SOIs written down.

Done as above. But make your own!
I re-explained the "Let's Fuck" problem a bit better above as well.

> So here's my deal:  I want to see more examples of SOIs so I can take
> them apart, because I really suspect that the exact wording is crucial.
>
> For example:
>
> GM gets away with his SOIs because they're exaggerated to absurdity,
> and thus they're both funny and unlikely (at least as stated).
> This puts a little distance between the SOI and the girl, so she
> doesn't slap him.

I think it's more of a case of the GM SOIs that fail, he can write them off
as being jokes. That keeps him on track and congruent.
BUT the risk of failure is very high if he doesn't cover his tracks.

> Guam PUA gets away with his SOI (quoted above) because he's talking
> about chicks in general, and not overtly about the particular chick.
> This puts a little distance between the SOI and the girl, so she's
> not pressured to make a decision right then.

This is the all important point. With some SOIs (and especially with
ambiguities in NLP) the SOIs are not in your face, BUT they are vague enough
to get the point across and then judge for a positive reaction from her or
not. However, the vagueness is simply a shot from 50 metres as opposed to a
shot from point-blank. Just make sure you hit the target.
The danger with point-blank SOIs is they are risky in so far as if you say a
dumb one you can't,won't, or don't want to carry out like "I'm going to take
you on holiday!" as opposed to an NLP shot from 50 metres which describes a
holiday and builds on it. "Have you ever been on holiday with someone
special?....."

> Am I on the right track here?  Are there other ways to word SOIs that
> get around direct resistance?  More examples would be appreciated.

You should check out patterning, but remember, a shot from point-blank is
better than 50 metres. The shortest distance between 2 points is a straight
line. There are pros and cons of both styles of course.
You can take the short path across the dangerous ravine, or the long path
around it.

> I gotta say, this whole idea of SOIs is new to me.  Maybe other PUAs
> in this group have been using them without ever realizing/stating the
> importance of them?

I just gave a name to it. People have done this stuff before and I'm just
giving it a name to help explain what I'm doing.

And no, Ray can't trademark this either and claim it's his. We have
discussed why this is enough on ASF. He's filtered anyway and I can't see
his verbal shit.

> Thanks,
> Ash

Thanks for the questions. They help challenge me in trying to explain myself
better.

Rio

-------

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Clearing SOI's up
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 12:15:23 GMT

Maniac,

I came up with the SOI concept after studying what the Guam Playboy did to
chicks. I wish I could have spent longer down there to learn more off this
guy. Oh well, I just need to save up to go again.

SOI (Statements of intention/interest) were comments that the Guam Playboy
made a lot (I assume you read my report on that place - It's nanpa
paradise!). What he did then was control the flirting that followed after
baiting her with a show of interest. He did this by offering a challenge -
when he finished doing that once he went back to fun routines, talking about
parties on the island, jokes, sex personality tests, etc. before he did
another SOI - staring out as indirect and ambiguous, before being VERY
direct. ;)

Basically what I think I have come up with, through trying to explain to the
posters that asked me about him, is a flirting construction kit.

The Guam Playboy NEGged a LOT - and he got away with it every time. He could
even tell chicks AFC things like they were beautiful, and then turn it into
a NEG if he wanted. That's what over 20 years of daily PU did for this guy.

But the NEG is only one kind of flirting (used for dumping a girl's uptight
self image). There are other kinds, such as using ambiguities, physical
light-handed slapping and pushing kino, playing tricks on people, etc. The
Playboy used plenty of variations.

Flirting is this:- One drops the SOI, and then pulls it away out of reach of
the target. Then gives another SOI, and then pulls it away again. Like with
our words, we put images of sex and romance in their heads, then pull it out
again, then out it in, then take it out, then put it back in, then take it
out again........ Mindfucking!
Once the chick is confused and teased enough, she is DDB and safely
mindfucked.

I did a PU once on a chick using the SOIs. I found out where she lived and
then said "Oh that's not far from my place, so I can come down to see you.
It's a pity I am so busy it won't happen today"
(Note that there is a bit of future pacing and presuppositioning in this)
She lapped it up and took my kino from there - despite the BF being a matter
of metres away.

The structure for the Guam Playboy routine went like this:-

- Fun routine or opener (ala Mystery) - some basic fluff - all good things
about himself, what he could do for the women (he played the helpful tour
guide). Be "Disgustingly" Charming! as he put it. The guy wasn't big on
logically drawing out routines for what he did (which is a good thing), he
just went and DID this.... thus he couldn't really explain to me what he was
doing. I had to observe.
- SOI. He said something that hinted that he was interested in the chick
(paced and lead from his opener conversation). This got her emotions going
and her ideas racing. I have found this CRITICAL if the chick is going to
stay interested in you for too long. I bored many chicks out initially when
I wouldn't get to the point.
"What do you look for in guys?" would be sufficient enough as a question to
hint at what you are after (as you have found out yourself Maniac). Starting
off on a topic about guys and relationships usually brings chicks out, but
asking "Do you have a BF?" sucks.
This Ross Jeffries inspired SOI "The more you laugh, the more you'll be
attracted to interesting people......now with me" is an ambiguous SOI.
- Before she could knock him down for any comment, he would then be a
challenge and say something like "I'm not easy", "we don't know each other
well enough yet", "but what would I know, right? ;)","I need to feel passion
first", "Yeah, you know what I'm saying". These basically FORCE the chick to
continue the flirting (initiated by the SOI) along the lines that HE wanted
(and the lines that chicks SAY they want!).
By saying that he "needed time" and "not being easy", the chick already
attracted to him would then come onto him.

Most of the time the chicks would laugh becuase they'd get stuck for a smart
comeback. And he just kept this up, alternating back to party and fun
routines, until he got to the "sex-SOI-Our World-But I'm no sleaze"routine
which would then DDB the target to fuck - or get her ready for it next time
they met.
Negative commands also work great here to spark challenge. Just like I did
with my now LJBF ex-LTR "I'm not going to fuck you".

I've noted in my past failures (too many to count) that when I have dropped
SOI hints - the chicks have taken the flirting into areas which were
impossible for me to control - fucking me up and making me look stupid.
Especially in clubs where chicks do this like child's play to anyone who
"hits" on them. They use their irrational chick logic to fuck themselves
(and you) up. If that happens, your PU is history.
We can't give the women control, especially not in flirting, because they
aren't the ones that are trying to do PU. It's their job as "virtuous" women
to try and get away from PU, or try to fuck our PU up.

Svengali also said in his MLTR theory something which rings home on this. He
said (and I quote):-

"Seventh: If you don't give a woman something to be pissed about every
now and then, she'll find something on her own, and that will be harder
to get out of (because it will be of her making and criteria, not
yours)."

That is also the point of what we should be doing in flirting. To trap the
chick into going along with what your flirting and accepting your advances
(by means of non-objection) while getting her horny at the same time. That
way we avoid snappy comebacks because you've already "Handled her objections
before they came up" (That's something I learnt as a salesman)
This causes the chick to have her token resistance stall out - and puts us
in control.
GM does this with his sex jokes, but he slams any possible retort with "Just
Kidding" thus the chick can't say anything and the flirting goes by GMs
rules and not hers.

Take Mystery's "Nice nails" NEG for example.
He starts off with an SOI "Nice nails". This in and of itself is a
compliment. If he stopped here, the chick would come back (if she were a
bitch) with some smart ass comment to get rid of Mystery.

BUT, he then puts up the CHALLENGE before she gets a chance to reply (like
GM with "Just kidding"). Seemingly innocent too. "Are they real?"

Now the chick is stuck. What's going on? He's complimented me, and now he's
knocking me down! What is he doing? I must stick around for this! What can I
say? Maybe I'll just laugh it off...!? er..?
(Note, some REAL bitches when stalled will look angry at you and say "Huh?"
to which it's GM to the rescue! with "Hide your pleasure!")

So, couple this kind of flirting with lots of things to get her feeling
horny (patterns, sex talk, whatever), and add lots of personality conveying
things thrown in for good measure - and the chick is sufficiently stunned -
and ready for the drag and fuck stage.

Oh, and the Guam Playboy is an ugly fucker. Kipp's seen the pictures.
Looks don't matter for shit. I have great respect for all the older PUAs.

I must get up to Tokyo to see you guys real soon. The inaka sucks.
We can experiment with this some more then. I've been getting rusty since I
got back from Guam.
What I do know is that when this guy's method does work, it is KILLER. We
get Mr. Smooth status and KCs like crazy.

Rio
-------
Dictate the flirting

 wrote in message news:91f5e8$dpn@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Re: SOI's
>
> Rio..
>
> You are on to something big here..
> This is a discovery!
> I will incorporate this.
>
> Please give more specific examples though. I get
> what you are saying, but not yet really how you would
> apply it. .
>
>
> Fucking excellent thread!
>
>
> Maniac
> http://www.pickupguide.com
>
>
> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/

---

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: More on SOIs
Date: Fri, 22 Dec 2000 06:17:41 GMT

THIS IS RIO TYPING IN CAPS. I'M NOT YELLING!

Comments in text below.
After New years, I WILL be ready, and we will hit
the streets.

GREAT. I HAVEN'T BEEN DOING MUCH PU UNTIL YESTERDAY (1 SOLID # FROM A 9 AND
A KC FROM ANOTHER 9) - THUS THIS POST AS I TEST OUT MY THEORY. I HAVE A
FRIEND WHO WOULD LIKE TO COME ALONG. HE'S ALREADY BRIEFED AND VERY
EXPERIENCED IN SCREWING WOMEN IN JAPAN. HE'S READ THE PICKUP GUIDE ALREADY.
HE'S EVEN BEEN SO KIND TO INTRODUCE ME TO SOME WOMEN WHO WANT MERCY FUCKS.
HE ALSO KNOWS SOME GOOD "hole in the wall" PLACES AROUND RAPPONGI WITH LOTS
OF WOMEN (SO HE SAYS).

BTW, Rio; re: 'nomad' player.. mine was fucked up, returned
it for an exchange, new one works..

IT'S SURE BEATS A TAPE RECORDER, DOESN'T IT?

First, this is brilliant material, it is going on the
website, and is core to successful PU I think. It IS what
smooth was doing.. I couldnt identify it, but now it has
been named, and described, I recognize this.. and yes, it
will be TOTALLY lethal..

THANKS. EVERY SUCCESSFUL PUA HAS BEEN DOING SOMETHING LIKE THIS (OF ONE
STYLE OR ANOTHER) TO BED WOMEN. I WENT OUT AND USED THIS FRAME YESTERDAY
WITH INTERESTING AND POSITIVE RESULTS.....

HOWEVER, I MUST SAY IT'S HARD TO GIVE SPECIFIC EXAMPLES UNLESS THEY ARE
SITUATIONALLY BASED. FOLLOWING THE LOGIC HOWEVER, AND USING IT GIVEN THE
SITUATION STILL BRING RESULTS. I WILL DESCRIBE SOME OF WHAT I HAVE BEEN
DOING WITH IT, BUT I CAN'T REMEMBER FOR THE LIFE OF ME WHAT EXACTLY THE GUAM
GUY SAID. (I ONLY RECORDED A SMALL SAMPLE OF OUR CHAT WITH MY MP3 PLAYER.
NONE OF HIS NANPA HOWEVER) WHAT I DO KNOW, IS THAT HE FOLLOWED THIS
STRUCTURE WHICH I HAVE DESCRIBED TO VERY SOME GOOD EFFECTS.

I ASSUME YOU READ MY ORIGINAL STORY ON THE GUAM TRIP.
IF SO, MY REPLY WILL MAKE MORE SENSE.

In article ,
  "Rio"  wrote:
> He did this by offering a challenge -
> when he finished doing that once he went back to fun routines,
talking about

Examples? ?

OK, HE MADE SOME KIND OF COMPLIMENT OR SUGGESTED SOME KIND OF ACTIVITY
(OFTENTIMES WITH SEXUAL OR ROMANTIC UNDERTONES) THAT THEY COULD DO TOGETHER.
(LIKE HANG TIGHT TO EACH OTHER OF THE JET POWERED BANANA BOAT) AND THEN
FOLLOWED THAT WITH A REASON WHY HE WOULD HAVE TROUBLE DOING IT. KINDA LIKE
IN SALES, A SALESMAN WOULD SAY "FOR ONE DAY ONLY SALE", WELL HE WAS LIKE "SO
YOU SHOW UP AT SUCH AND SUCH A TIME, OTHERWISE I WON'T BE ABLE TO SHOW YOU A
GOOD TIME AND I'LL TAKE SOMEONE ELSE" (a takeaway)
SO IN ORDER TO CONTINUE THE FLIRTING, THE CHICK WOULD HAVE TO SHOW UP. HE
WOULD THEN (AFTER HAVING COMPLETED A SOI ROUTINE) SIT BACK AND WATCH THE
CHICK FOLLOW THROUGH. HE WOULD OFTENTIMES BE ABLE TO CONTINUE A CONVERSATION
WITHOUT STALLING - AND MIDWAY HE WOULD SOI HER AGAIN AND DO THE SAME ROUTINE
WITH SOMETHING ELSE. I NEVER SAW HIM GET IT ON WITHIN 20 MINUTES, BUT I SAW
WHAT HE DID TO THE CHICK WITH THIS ROUTINE AND I COULD TELL THAT HE COULD
HAVE IF HE WANTED TO. HE DIDN'T LOOK DESPERATE AT ALL.

> parties on the island, jokes, sex personality tests, etc. before he
did
> another SOI - staring out as indirect and ambiguous, before being VERY
> direct. ;)

Examples ? ?

THIS GUY HAD A STRONG ELEMENT OF GM. THE SEX PERSONALITY TEST IS DOCUMENTED
IN MY POST ON THIS GUY (IT'S ABOUT ICE CREAM) - BUT AFTERWARDS UNLIKE GM, NO
COMMENT OF "JUST KIDDING". HE WOULD THEN SAY SOMETHING ELSE TO DISTRACT
ATTENTION OR PLAY "PRETEND AFC" LIKE "BUT I'M NOT EASY" OR "BUT I DON'T KNOW
YOU THAT WELL"
ALL THE MEANWHILE, GETTING THE CHICK HORNY AND CREATING A CHALLENGE.

> Basically what I think I have come up with, through trying to explain
to the
> posters that asked me about him, is a flirting construction kit.

Examples ? ?

MANIAC, YOU'RE STARTING TO OVERUSE CUT AND PASTE LIKE NYC WHEN HE RIPS APART
AFCS WITH THESE "EXAMPLES??" COMMENTS.........

(QUOTE NYC)
"YOU ARE BEING USED. SHE DOESN'T GIVE A SHIT ABOUT YOU. SHE DOESN'T INTEND
TO FUCK YOU. SHE IS FUCKING OTHER MEN THAT SHE FINDS SEXUALLY ATTRACTIVE.
YOU ARE FOOTING THE BILL FOR HER INTERNATIONAL WHORING. STOP."

HA HA HA ;)

> The Guam Playboy NEGged a LOT - and he got away with it every time.

Such as ? ?

WISH I COULD REMEMBER NOW. BUT WHAT I DID SEE IS HIM COMPLIMENTING LOTS OF
JAP CHICKS AND NOT GETTING ANY NASTY REACTION BACK FROM THEM - BECAUSE THEY
WERE SO SHY AND INEXPERIENCED. SO THE CHICKS JUST LAUGHED BECAUSE THEY HAD
NO BITCH SHIELD OF ANY TYPE.
WHERE HE DID ENCOUNTER A SHIELD, HE WOULD ATTACK HER "NASTY" PERSONALITY -
AND HER LACK OF ABILITY TO BE GRACEFUL WITH COMPLIMENTS.

IN THAT SENSE, HE WOULD ALWAYS SIZE THE CHICK UP AS IF HE WAS LOOKING FOR
LTR POTENTIAL (but we know of course, that LTR was never the plan)

He could
> even tell chicks AFC things like they were beautiful, and then turn
it into
> a NEG if he wanted. That's what over 20 years of daily PU did for
this guy.

Examples ? ?

"YOU'RE REALLY CUTE....(pause to check response)... BUT I DON'T KNOW
ANYTHING ABOUT YOU. (SAID NEGATIVELY OR NOT DEPENDING ON HER RESPONSE). SO
WHO ARE YOU ANYWAY?"

> But the NEG is only one kind of flirting (used for dumping a girl's
uptight
> self image). There are other kinds, such as using ambiguities,
physical
> light-handed slapping and pushing kino, playing tricks on people,
etc.

Such as ? ?

I'VE STOPPED USING KINO IMMIDIATELY NOW, AND SAVING IT FOR WHEN I'VE LANDED
AN SOI ROUTINE AND CAUGHT THE CHICK OUT. WHEN SHE HAS LAUGHED, I SLAP HER
GENTLY.
IT'S ANCHORING.

AS FOR TRICKS ON PEOPLE.... STUPID ONES. I WILL HAVE TO SHOW YOU THEM IN
PERSON.

The
> Playboy used plenty of variations.

Like what ? ?

GIVEN THE SITUATION, HE WOULD TRY DIFFERENT WAYS TO GET HER THINKING
ROMANTICALLY ABOUT BOTH OF THEM TOGETHER. HE WOULD USE WHATEVER WAS IN HIS
SURROUNDINGS, OR THE TOPIC OF CONVERSATION, TO PACE AND LEAD THE CHICK INTO
IMAGINING SUCH A SCENARIO.
THEN HE WOULD YANK IT AWAY BY GIVING SOME KIND OF EXCUSE (LIKE HE WAS BUSY,
HE DIDN'T THINK SHE COULD DO IT) OR HE WOULD PLAY AFC (I DON'T KNOW YOU, I
NEED TO BE IN LOVE FIRST, I'M NOT EASY, I'M NOT A PLAYER, I NEED TIME, I AM
REALLY PICKY, I HAVE BEEN HURT BEFORE, I HAVE A GF)

> Flirting is this:- One drops the SOI, and then pulls it away out of
reach of
> the target.

For example ? ?

I REALLY FEEL VERY CLOSE TO YOU, BUT I NEED TIME.

THE MAGIC WORD IS but

 Then gives another SOI, and then pulls it away again. Like with
> our words, we put images of sex and romance in their heads, then pull
it out

Like ? ?

HIS BRAVEST SOI WAS THE ONE WHERE HE SAID STRAIGHT OUT THAT HE WAS GOING TO
FUCK A CHICK. I WITNESSED THE WHOLE THING. HE SAID THAT HE WAS GOING TO FUCK
HER but (AND THEN HE WENT PRETEND AFC) I'M VERY PICKY, I'M NOT A PUA
BECAUSE THOSE GUYS TEASE WOMEN WITH BULLSHIT, MAKE EMPTY PROMISES, FUCK
THEM, AND THEN DUMP THEM. I AM A PLAYBOY. I LOVE WOMEN AND I DON'T WANT YOU
TO GET TOO ATTACHED TO ME AFTER WE HAVE SEX.

> again, then out it in, then take it out, then put it back in, then
take it
> out again........ Mindfucking!

Example please . .

OK, ANOTHER ONE:-   I WANT TO KISS YOU, BUT SOMEHOW I DON'T THINK YOU LIKE
KISSING.
(btw - this would be an SOI fairly advanced in conversation)
NOTE ALSO THAT THERE'S AN EMBEDDED COMMAND IN THE 2ND PART OF THE ROUTINE.
THAT BEING "YOU LIKE KISSING"
EVIL ISN'T IT?

> Once the chick is confused and teased enough, she is DDB and safely
> mindfucked.

how? describe this. . what exactly did he do?

WELL, THE CHICK THAT HE SAID THE "I'M GOING TO FUCK YOU" SPEECH TO, JUST
STARTED DOING ALL THE TRADEMARK BODYLANGUAGE. SHE JUST SAT THERE STUNNED
AND PLAYED WITH HER HAIR. LIKE A RABBIT LOOKING INTO BRIGHT LIGHTS. THE GUAM
GUY SAID ALL OF IT WITH A SERIOUS FACE TOO, SO SHE COULDN'T LAUGH OFF WHAT
HE WAS SAYING.

THE WAY HE WORKED DIDN'T SEEM TO BE ONE OF "ATTRACTION" PER SE. HE WOULD
EVENTUALLY CORNER THE CHICK AND FLIRT WITH HER UNTIL SHE COULD TAKE NO MORE.
UNTIL SHE GOT STUNNED

> I did a PU once on a chick using the SOIs. I found out where she
lived and
> then said "Oh that's not far from my place, so I can come down to see
you.
> It's a pity I am so busy it won't happen today"

This is good. .

THAT'S A REAL LIFE EXAMPLE OF WHAT THE WHOLE THEORY IS ABOUT. MORE
IMPORTANTLY IS THAT IT WORKED.

> (Note that there is a bit of future pacing and presuppositioning in
this)
> She lapped it up and took my kino from there - despite the BF being a
matter
> of metres away.
>
> The structure for the Guam Playboy routine went like this:-
>
> - Fun routine or opener (ala Mystery) - some basic fluff - all good
things
> about himself, what he could do for the women (he played the helpful
tour

Examples ? ?

READ SOME OF MYSTERY'S OPENERS!
TYPICALLY OFF THE WALL STUFF. WELL, WHEN HE WAS TALKING ABOUT GUAM'S CULTURE
AND PARTIES AND STUFF - FOR ALL THE TOURISTS, ALL THIS NEW INFO TO THEM IS
PRETTY OFF THE WALL.
HE WOULD TELL THE CHICKS ABOUT SOME PARTY WHERE THEY WOULD DIG A HUGE PIT
AND THROW ANIMALS ON IT IN A BIG FEAST WITH A BONFIRE AND DANCING - AND THEN
BRANCHED OUT AND TALKED ABOUT DANCING AND OTHER EXOTIC/EROTIC STUFF.

> guide). Be "Disgustingly" Charming! as he put it. The guy wasn't big
on

Like ? ?

THOSE WERE HIS EXACT WORDS. HE RELIED ON GM A LOT IN THE LATTER PART OF HIS
SEDUCTIONS.

> logically drawing out routines for what he did (which is a good
thing), he
> just went and DID this.... thus he couldn't really explain to me what
he was
> doing. I had to observe.

Yep, he's got experience.. I rarely consciously follow ManiacPlan
anymore.. just it spews out naturally.. learning PU is like learning
a foreign language/lingo.. once you get it, its natural..

I'VE BEEN LEARNING TO PLAY AFC IN MY SEDUCTIONS, AND IT HAS BEEN WORKING
REALLY WELL!

> - SOI. He said something that hinted that he was interested in the
chick
> (paced and lead from his opener conversation). This got her emotions
going

Example?  How?

OK, ANOTHER ONE.

"WOULDN'T IT BE GREAT TO SPEND TIME TOGETHER OVER COFFEE? IT'S SUCH A PITY I
HAVE TO GO TO SOME MEETINGS LATER ON, SO WE WILL PROBABLY HAVE NO TIME TO
SEE EACH OTHER EVER AGAIN BEFORE YOU GO BACK."
(WAIT FOR RESPONSE)
"BUT LET ME KNOW YOUR NUMBER ANYWAY...WHO KNOWS I MAY HAVE TIME."
(might want to save this one after you have dropped several other
SOIs)

> and her ideas racing.

Like what? which ideas? be specific please. .

ROMATIC AND/OR SEXUAL ONES.
HE WOULD START OFF ON ROMANTIC ONES AND MAKE THEM INCREASINGLY SEXUAL UNTIL
HE HIT A SEXUAL FANTASY OF HERS THAT WOULD DDB HER.
LET'S SAY "HOLDING HANDS" OR "SPENDING QUALITY TIME TOGETHER" OR "BEING
CLOSE" AND EVENTUALLY LEADING THAT INTO "TOUCHING BODIES" AND "KISSING" TO
"FUCKING" OBVIOUSLY.
A LOT OF TIME DISTORTION SOIs.

> I have found this CRITICAL if the chick is going to
> stay interested in you for too long. I bored many chicks out
initially when
> I wouldn't get to the point.
[rest deleted]

Rio, this is great stuff. Somehow I understand it.. but I need
examples of it so I can put it together as something I can try
in the field. Do you remember any specifics from this guy?

WELL, WE CAN ALWAYS WAIT FOR THE OFF-SEASON AND GO TO GUAM WITH A VCR AND
MEET THIS GUY (YOU'LL ONLY NEED ABOUT 40,000 YEN FROM TOKYO FOR A 2 DAY
TRIP) OR NEXT TIME WE MEET IN TOKYO WE CAN DO MORE STREET STUFF AND I CAN
SHOW YOU WHAT I KNOW. (I HADN'T FULLY DEVELOPED THE THEORY UNTIL AFTER MY
NIGHT OUT WITH KIPP - I OQed TOO MUCH AND FAILED TO PLACE ANY CHALLENGES
AFTER MY SOIs THAT NIGHT)
THE GUAM PLAYBOY WAS A GRANDMASTER OF STREET PU - HIS WEAKNESS WAS THAT HE
WAS A GREEDY TEAMPLAYER WITH WINGMEN.

If so, please fill in the above spaces where I ask.. it is very
important if this is to work.

Rio
-------

Using SOI’s as a way to tease/attract chicks!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Using SOI's (statements of intent) as a tease to attract a chick!


From: Jonathan Ashton 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Clearing SOI's up
Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 07:04:08 GMT

In article ,
> For example, if we were to drop an SOI on the chick, and then
> IMMEDIATELY follow up with a negative command - WE control the
> flirting so that the chick then has to work for US.
>
> So we can say things like "I want to kiss you"
> And then control the flirting by pulling away again with some reverse
> commands :-
> "BUT I don't really know anything about you, and I haven't known you
> for very long, and I need to feel love first"
> Sounds like the stuff that chicks tell us, right? Well chicks say it
> to flirt, as opposed to meaning what they say!

Omigod!  Rio, this is an awesome post!  Brilliant!  Genius!

"I was thinking about kissing you, but you'd probably slobber too
  much."
"I'd love to take you home, but I know you'd get all clingy."
"I'm just trying to guess if you're any good in bed.  Too bad you're
  too young/weird/conservative for me."
"I bet you'd love the way I do neck massages.  You've been acting up
  too much to deserve one, though."

This is so EASY!  Anyone can think these up on the spot!  There's no
need to think up ambiguous sentences or come up with just the right
innuendo.  Just make a Statement of Intentions, then let her know what
SHE has to offer to make it happen - by telling her that you won't do
it because she's not up to par!  I love it!  I will try it out ASAP!

Howcome I've never seen this idea explained before?  In retrospect,
it's clear that MrSex4uNYC and Mystery do similar stuff, but I've
never seen the dynamic explained this way before.  Ross talks about
setting challenges, but it's always seemed like such a delicate art
to say just the right thing at just the right time.

But this is so easy!  Thank you, Rio.

Ash


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

Game: Color game

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Color Game that can be used in PU!
[Maniac note: got this other list below from the 'Secrets of the cube book'
Also very good, may be appropriate when doing this game:

Red: passion, hot energy, anger warmth
Green: hope, life, nature, money
Blue: spirituality, serenity, cool energy, sadness
Purple: royalty, deep passions, mourning
Yellow: cheerfulness, brightness, eccentricity
Pink: feminity, wamrth
Brown: earthyness, warmth, conventionality
Black: mystery
White: purity
Multicolored: of many interests or moods

END: Maniac note]

From: steviewonder 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: More personality tests
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 20:20:17 GMT

In article <904e0cjv@nnrp1.deja.com>,
  maniac_high@yahoo.com wrote:
> There is good stuff on that site.
>
> I am reworking it to be more appropriate in opener type
> PU's in bars/coffee shops, will present my results of this
> work in late January after it has all been designed and
> field tested.. It will be killer..

Hi guys,

Found this game at

http://www.geocities.com/Broadway/8546/colortest.html

a good one since all the answers are sexual:

QUESTION:

Pick the color that best describes your personality?

ANSWERS:

BLACK
Black color preferences point to black sex. These people are the
misfits of the sex world and seek each other in kinship. They tend to
prefer perverted sex, and are usually masochistic or sadistic in
nature. They are moody and often perform at their peak when under
stress or during unhappy times. Police psychologists claim that many
sex offenders prefer the color black. And it is no coincidence that
the uniform of mobsters and teenaged gangs is black.

BLUE
Lovers of blue are wonderful sex partners. They are sincere,
affectionate, and sensitive to their partner's needs. They consider
lovemaking a fine art, and their approach is elegant. Men who love
blue are like concert pianists; delicately ravaging their partner like
they would play a baby grand. Women in the blue category enjoy sex
to the fullest. They are exciting partners, but their passion might be
compared to tidal waves, rather than fiery aggresion. Both blue men
and women enjoy foreplay and the aftermath of lovemaking as much
as the act. In marriages, a blue person is a wonderful mate, never
failing to please the spouse and never seeking outside interests.

BROWN
For lovers of brown, sex is a 24-hour a day thing. They tend to say "I
love you" often enough. Snuggling by the fire, walking in the rain or
catching snowflakes on their tongue ins a turn-on to a lover of brown.
They need lots of time and privacy to make love. But their emotions
are such that one harsh word could end an affair.

GREEN
Those who prefer green are fresh and innocent in their approach to
sex. Women who love green will make love like virgins all their life.
And a man may also be a trifle clumsy and awkward, but in a charming
and endearing sort of way. Green lovers are gentle, but not
passionate. If chosen as a mate, one will never need to worry about
infidelity.

GREY
The color grey is preferred by people who are indecisive. They can't
get excited about anything - including colors - so they choose a
noncommittal shade. Men who prefer grey look at sex as a means of
relieving tension - nothing more nothing less. It's "wham, bam, thank
you ma'am". Women don't make love, they have intercourse. They
count the cracks in the bedroom plaster until the sex act is over with
and done. When a grey marries another grey, the marriage is not
exactly erotic.

ORANGE
Lovers of the color orange lean toward sexual fantasies. The sex act
is regarded as a dramatic role, a one act play in which they are the
star. Foreplay is as important as the act of love. They whisper sweet
nothings, meaningless dialogue they feel fits their image. Orange
people often do not experience orgasm - but they put on a damn good
act. Men tend to pull their partner's hair and women tend to leave
welts on their sex partner's back!

PINK
Persons who like pink show a reluctance to mature in sexual matters.
Women tend to tease; to promise more than they intend to deliver. In
some cases, they flaunt their femininity, but only because they
secretly hate men. A great percentage of prostitutes boast entire
wardrobes in pink. Men who like pink are the type who make 3 dates
for the same evening and not keep them, preferring to pick up a dish
in some bar instead.

PURPLE
Lovers of purple frequently consider themselves too regal for  fun
romp in the sack. Women sometimes are the type who hate to muss
their hair. Men are businesslike in their approach to lovemaking. In
both sexes, purple partners are more concerned with their
fulfillment then anyone else's gratification.

RED
People who like red tend to be tigers in the sack. They are easily
aroused and enjoy sex in every way imaginable. Once the sexual spark
is lit, it may take hours to extinguish. When two reds get together,
the ensuing erotica would make Lady Chatterly blush. Lovers of red
tend to be the aggressors and weaker colors should beware!

YELLOW
If you tend to favor yellow, your sexual drives are complex and lean
toward the adaptable. The favorite color of homosexuals is yellow!
But don't panic - not everyone who wears yellow is homosexual. In
most cases the person will accommodate to the stronger partner's
desires in a passive manner. You will never enjoy sex to the fullest,
but you will never turn down an invitation from someone you enjoy or
admire.

--
To email me remove the _obvious from this address:
steviewonder_ob@viousfastmail.ca

Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

Handling delusional chicks, karatebabe lives a nightmare!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Re: Mystery: delusional chicks & sympathy lies! 
Date: 11/12/2000 
Author: maniac_high  

 << previous in search  ?  next in search >>  

Re: Mystery: delusional chicks & sympathy lies!
001112
 
Mystery wrote in another post this week regarding lying
to chicks, about how not to underestimate how delusional
a chick is willing to become in order to keep her 'happy'
view of the world.
 
He is absolutely right. And this explains how seeming
'jerk' can get away with what seems like such ridiculous
shit.
 
Case in point, is where I recently did a fuckup, and then
recovered with Karatebabe (see lay report, my page). This
is the chick that would go around my place after sex
cleaning up her own hairs so that "the other chicks"
wouldnt find out about her.
 
Well, one day we are going for coffee, and she asks me
if I had been seeing another chick at the time I started
dating her. Figuring (incorrectly) from her behavior,
that this chick knew totally what the score already was,
I said I had been (wrong answer!).
 
She freaked out and went balistic at me. Shit about "how
I make her fool, go behind her back..and other shit".
In retrospect it was clear though.. she got upset, because
something she merely 'suspected' (even though it was fucking
obvious as shit, as other chicks stuff was all over the
fucking house), now became something 'confirmed', and that
shattered her entire world..
 
I then smartened up and realized what I had just done,
and recovered by saying that I dumped her after I first
started dating you (Karatebabe), a few weeks later.
 
After that, she settled down (even though every week
there was different chick stuff all over the house
after that!). She asked me about it, and I said no,
there are no chicks..
 
She said she accepted that, and that her 'nightmare'
now was over, and everything was fine again.
 
Later she found some makeup and chick stuff in the
bathroom cabinet (another chick must have slipped
it there for someone else to find it), so I had
to think fast on my feet for that one...
 
So I told her that I have a real dark secret and
she might be very disappointed in me (now she is
expecting to hear something about a chick)..
 
Then (remembering she likes gays and stuff) I tell
her that I like to make believe to dress like a girl
(lots of J-guys do it actually, so I know it is not
so far fetched here), and I have guy friends that do it
with me, and sorry I didnt tell you earlier.. (of
course this is TOTALLY false.. Maniac is not even
remotely gay, nor a crossdresser or any of that shit)...
however.. she ACCEPTED that story, and was relieved
(in spite of the fact that I was almost cracking up
when I said it, since I was SURE she would call me
on my bullshit... but she didnt)!
 
Fuck!, the totally ridiculous things you have to
tell a chick...  AND! they accept it (as they
try to internalize it and believe it at least at
some level so that their happy delusional world
doesn't come crashing to bits)..
 
Strange, isnt it..!
 
Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Using the laws of power in PU!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Toecutter, and using the laws of power!




From toecutter@mail.com Mon Oct 23 09:39:39 2000
From: "toecutter" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Lessons from Book: The 48 Laws of Power
Lines: 201


Just reading a book, The 48 Laws of Power by Robert Greene. Definitely
lessons everywhere in the book on what we do here.
The book is amoral, and open about the deception inherit in what he is
teaching. It is largely for life outside the arena of seduction, but
entrirely applicable and there are some seduction examples in it to
illustrate his points (only historical: For example the advice of Ninon de
Lenclos on seduction to the Marquis de Sevigne and what happened when the
Marquis did not follow her advice, etc.). The examples are all pulled from
the Sun Tzu (Chinese, the Art of War), European history, famous con men,
magicians and charlatans, Kings, Queens, Napoleon and other power brokers
such as Al Capone. Perfect for you guys who enjoy Machiavelli. At 450
reasonably large format pages it is fairly long.

It is going to take me several re-readings, but at the moment I see the
messages as really 3 fold: First, play your cards pretty close to your
chest. This creates mystery. The more you say, the more common you appear
and the less in control. Andy Wohol created enigma by not discussing his
work and answering questions by being intentionally vague giving people the
feeling that he was being more profound than he was.  If you do not reveal
all, people will never become bored with you or your presence because you
will continue to represent a challenge, and will be eternally interesting.
Your silence will make other people feel uncomfortable and humans are
machines of interpretation and explanation; they have to know what you are
thinking. When you carefully control what you reveal, they cannot pierce
your intentions and meaning. Your short answers will put them on the
defensive and they will jump in, nervously filling the silence with all
kinds of comments that will reveal valuable information about themselves and
their weaknesses.

This brings me to the second message. Learn everything you can about other
people. Their strengths and weaknesses, their crutches and trance words.
Their motivations. Use these to your advantage whilst revealing as little as
possible about yourself. Keep them the focus of the conversation, and be a
'Spy' on their minds by eliciting values.

The third lesson is to use smoke and mirrors to obscure your objectives and
motivations. Throw decoys out there, use gifts as Trojan horses, and be
circumspect in what is going on. Again, this throws them off your game,
gives you an upper hand.

None of this is to say that you need to be quiet or a bad conversationalist,
just the opposite, by spying and eliciting values, you are encouraging
people to talk about themselves, their own favourite subject. By being brief
about yourself you are creating mystery and interest. It is just that you
are collecting the information in order to use it against them at another
time, whilst manipulating your image and reputation in their minds and
obscuring your real motivations. In some ways it is a book on playing hard
to get while outmanoeuvring the girl. A perfect structure in which to drop
SS.

Some of the content is below. I can post more on it if you would like
further discussion; I am overflowing with ideas on it.

Toecutter.

---

To list some of the laws that are obviously applicable:

Law 3: Conceal your intentions (Keep people off balance and in the dark by
never revealing the purpose behind your actions. If they have no clue what
you are up to, they cannot prepare a defence. Guide them far enough down the
wrong path, envelop them in enough smoke, and by the time they realise your
intentions, it will be too late.)

Law 4: Always say less than is necessary

Law 6: Court attention at all costs

Law 8: Make other people come to you - use bait if necessary

Law 9: Win though your actions, never through argument. (Any momentary
triumph you win though argument is really a Pyrrhic victory: The resentment
and ill will you stir up is stronger and lasts longer than any momentary
change in opinion. It is much more powerful to get others to agree with you
though your actions, without saying a word. Demonstrate, do not explicate.)

Law 10: Infection: Avoid the unhappy and unlucky (it works the other way
also. This is an alternative take on social-proof, or pivots or whatever you
want to call them, as well as wingmen. Also advice on not getting involved
with the wrong girl.)

Law 11: Learn to keep people dependent on you.

Law 12: Use selective generosity to disarm your victim (One sincere and
honest move will cover over dozens of dishonest ones. Openhearted gestures
of honesty and generosity bring down the guard of even the most suspicious
people. Once your selective honesty opens a hole in their armour, you can
deceive and manipulate at will.)

Law 13: When asking for help, appeal to people's self interest, never to
their mercy or gratitude.

Law 14: Pose as a friend, work as a spy.

Law 16: Use absence to increase respect and honour. (Again through mystery
and not stuffing it up by staying too long and doing or saying something
wrong.)

Law 17: Keep others in suspended terror: Cultivate an air of
unpredictability

Law 18: Do not build fortresses to protect yourself - Isolation is
dangerous. (Get out there amongst them).

Law 19: Know who you are dealing with - do not offend the wrong person.

Law 20: Do not commit yourself to anyone.

Law 21: Play a sucker to catch a sucker - appear dumber than your mark. (Let
her think that she is in control and smart, less naive, don't let on you are
a player).

Law 25: Re-create yourself (Do not accept the roles that society foists on
you. Re-create yourself by forging a new identity, one that commands
attention and never bores the audience. Be the master of your own image
rather than letting others define it for you. Incorporate dynamic devices
into your public gestures and actions - your power will be enhanced and your
character will seem larger than life).

Law 26: Keep your hands clean. (You must seem a paragon of civility and
efficiency: Your hands are never soiled by mistakes and nasty deeds.
Maintain such a spotless appearance by using others as scapegoats and cat'
s-paws to disguise your involvement).

Law 27: Play on peoples need to believe to create a cult like following.
(advice in this chapter is on how to become a cult leader or maybe build a
harem. 5 strategies to your dogma! a) Keep it vague; Keep it simple b)
Emphasise the visual and sensual over the intellectual c) Borrow the forms
of organised religion to structure the group d) Disguise your income source
e) set up an us-vs.-them dynamic. I think Ross Jeffries read this one!)

Law 28: Enter action with Boldness. (If you are unsure of a course of
action, do not attempt it. Your doubts and hesitations will infect your
execution. Timidity is dangerous: Better to enter with boldness. Any
mistakes you make through audacity are easily corrected with more audacity.
Everyone admires the bold; no one honours the timid).

Law 29: Plan all the way to the end.

Law 30: Make your accomplishments seem effortless. (Your actions must seem
natural and executed with ease. All the toil and practice that goes into
them, also all the clever tricks, must be concealed. When you act, act
effortlessly, as if you could do much more. Avoid the temptation of
revealing how hard you work - it only raises questions. Teach no one your
tricks or they will be used against you .. I am breaking this rule right
here with this post, as is the Authour of the book.)

Law 31: Control the options: Get others to play with the cards you deal.
(The best deceptions are the ones that seem to give the other person a
choice: Your victims feel they are in control, but are actually your
puppets. Give people options that come out in your favour whichever one they
choose. Force them to make choices between the lesser of two evils, both of
which serve your purpose. Put them on the horns of the dilemma: they are
gored wherever they turn. Note: this is a different view on my idea of
re-framing questions. The questions are re-framed so well that the girl has
no option.)

Law 32: Play to people's fantasies.

Law 33: Discover each mans thumbscrew.

Law 34: Be royal in your own fashion: Act like a king to be treated like
one.

Law 35: Master the art of timing. (Never seem to be in a hurry - hurrying
betrays a lack of control over yourself, and over time. Always seem patient,
as if you know that everything will come to you eventually. Become a
detective of the right moment; sniff out the spirit of the times, the trends
that will carry you to power. Learn to stand back when the time is not yet
ripe, and to strike fiercely when it has reached fruition.)

Law 36: Disdain things you cannot have: Ignoring them is the best revenge.

Law 37: Create compelling spectacles. (Striking imagery and grand symbolic
gestures create the aura of power - everyone responds to them. Stage
spectacles for those around you, then, full of arresting visuals and radiant
symbols to heighten your presence. Dazzled by appearances, no one will
notice what you are really doing.)

Law 40: Despise the free Lunch.

Law 43: Work on the hearts and minds of others.

Law 44: Disarm and infuriate with the mirror effect. (The mirror reflects
reality, but is the perfect tool for deception: When you mirror your
enemies, doing exactly as they do, they cannot figure out your strategy. The
mirror Effect mocks and humiliates them, making them overreact. By holding
up a mirror to their psyches, you seduce them with the illusion that you
share their values; by holding up a mirror to their actions you teach them a
lesson. Few can resist the power of the mirror effect.)

Law 48: Assume formlessness. (By taking a shape, by having a visible plan,
you open yourself to attact. Instead of taking a form for the girl to grasp,
keep yourself adaptable and on the move. Accept the fact that nothing is
certain and no law is fixed. The best way to protect yourself is to be as
fluid and formless as water: never bet on stability or lasting order.
Everything changes.)

Disarming groups of guys around chicks!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

When lots of guys are around 1 girl, you must disarm guys!


From: "Stepleader" 
Subject: Re: She has nice/great body and/or face -- but what about her?
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2000 10:02:45 GMT

great pep talk and I love your posts ... but ...

the situ called for a disarming of the guys.  Here is how.  Approach the
group but pay NO attention to the girl.  Begin the chat with the guys and
make them interested in your story telling.  MALE BONDING comradery.  Turn
you back to HER so she feels out of place.  What you have done is removed
all the attention from her (stolen it).  You are now the center of
attention.  A couple NEGS her way challenges her.  All the other guys were
on her - all but one.  YOU.

Just so you know, this is mystery methods groupset theory and Ive done this
successfully a great # of times.

from this vantage point you may now take her  by the hand and say to the
others, "is it alright if I steal your friend away for a bit?"  they will
say yes and you take her out of earshot.  Id love you to see me work a set
like that.  its brilliant.  and PRACTICAL.

Svengali  wrote in article
<131220002147344283%Svengali_here@use.net>...
> Gentlemen, you're looking for the whole package, not just the
> packaging.  And if all you're focusing on is the packaging, she damn
> well knows it and is in control of you --period!
> 
> You must, repeat, you must be prepared to walk at all times, no matter
> how much you would like to be on/in that body and face.
> 
> Remember, you are screening her to see if she is good enough for
> you, not the other way around.  And the only way you're going to find
> out if she is good enough for you is to learn as much as you can
> about the person that is within that female form.
> 
> Am I saying you must be screening every beauty for a long term
> relationship?  Hell no!  It can be for however long you want.  But
> the moment she sees, and it won't take her long, that you are screening
> her to see whether or not she is good enough for you, is the moment
> the tables get turned and she understands that she has to make herself
> look good in your eyes.
> 
> Now contrast this with all the other guys who are trying to make
> themselves look good in her eyes, so they can get on/in her.
> 
> To illustrate what I am saying, picture this: we're in a manhattan bar,
> and there is this gorgeous looking woman, with the greatest face you've
> seen, talking to a few guys.  One happens to be our own great NYC with
> his magnificient weight-lifting body and his "I'm great" attitude; 
> another is Riker with his patterns, a third is Greg19 with his band of
> ways, and so on.  So basically what you would have is a bunch of guys
> trying to find and give this woman what she wants, so as to get on/in
> her.
> 
> Then there's Svengali, with his Carey Grant looks and ways, who sees
> the woman, walks right up into the group and says "excuse me guys, I
> just wanted to ask the lady where she got, and whose idea it was to get
> those earrings that seems to make her skin sparkle and her eyes glow,
> and then I'll leave." [Turning to her] "So please tell me, where did
> you get, and what made you decide [Svengali's hand goes out to the
> earrings, and in the process, lightly touches the lady's neck] to get
> these earrings that seems to make your skin sparkle and your eyes
> glow?"  {She tells me.}  "Thank you."  "Bye guys, I'm going back over
> there [pointing, so the lady knows where I will be]."
> 
> Look what just occurred: (1) I showed I wasn't afraid of a damn thing. 
> (2) I disarmed my opponents.  (3) I made her feel good.  (4) I showed
> her I wasn't about to hang around and try and get her.  {Of course to
> firmly establish that point, I would engage another woman in
> conversation, and have her positioned in a way that the first woman
> would see her with me, which would have her wondering what kind of nice
> things was I saying to her, that she wasn't getting.}.
> 
> Who do you think the woman is likely to be focused on and thinking
> about: all the guys who are there, still trying to get to her, or the
> guy who said what he wanted, made her feel good/great, left, and is now
> focused on someone else?  {I removed one of her feel good sources, so
> even though the others are there, with theirs, she like nearly everyone
> of us, is focused on the one that's been lost, not the ones that are
> present.}
> 
> Show your interest in her, but also show that you are walking the
> moment *she's* not exactly like you want.
> 
> Now I'll play devil's advocate and say that my little "walk away"
> didn't work.  Do you think I care?  Hell no, and I'll tell you why: the
> one who chases to gets, will always have to chase to have.  So whoever
> would win with the woman, would have to keep providing whatever they
> did to keep her interested.  I, on the other hand, only need to use a
> little charm and then walk away to have her wanting me.
> 
> I ask you, who do you think has an easier time of it?
> 
> -- 
> If you don't know in the first twenty minutes whether or not you're going
to
> have sex with the woman you just met, and whether or not you even want
to,
> you're not a seductionist.
> 
>   'o o'
> Svengali
>

Taking control when things go wrong

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

When lots of guys are around 1 girl, you must disarm guys!


From: "Stepleader" 
Subject: Re: She has nice/great body and/or face -- but what about her?
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2000 10:02:45 GMT

great pep talk and I love your posts ... but ...

the situ called for a disarming of the guys.  Here is how.  Approach the
group but pay NO attention to the girl.  Begin the chat with the guys and
make them interested in your story telling.  MALE BONDING comradery.  Turn
you back to HER so she feels out of place.  What you have done is removed
all the attention from her (stolen it).  You are now the center of
attention.  A couple NEGS her way challenges her.  All the other guys were
on her - all but one.  YOU.

Just so you know, this is mystery methods groupset theory and Ive done this
successfully a great # of times.

from this vantage point you may now take her  by the hand and say to the
others, "is it alright if I steal your friend away for a bit?"  they will
say yes and you take her out of earshot.  Id love you to see me work a set
like that.  its brilliant.  and PRACTICAL.

Svengali  wrote in article
<131220002147344283%Svengali_here@use.net>...
> Gentlemen, you're looking for the whole package, not just the
> packaging.  And if all you're focusing on is the packaging, she damn
> well knows it and is in control of you --period!
> 
> You must, repeat, you must be prepared to walk at all times, no matter
> how much you would like to be on/in that body and face.
> 
> Remember, you are screening her to see if she is good enough for
> you, not the other way around.  And the only way you're going to find
> out if she is good enough for you is to learn as much as you can
> about the person that is within that female form.
> 
> Am I saying you must be screening every beauty for a long term
> relationship?  Hell no!  It can be for however long you want.  But
> the moment she sees, and it won't take her long, that you are screening
> her to see whether or not she is good enough for you, is the moment
> the tables get turned and she understands that she has to make herself
> look good in your eyes.
> 
> Now contrast this with all the other guys who are trying to make
> themselves look good in her eyes, so they can get on/in her.
> 
> To illustrate what I am saying, picture this: we're in a manhattan bar,
> and there is this gorgeous looking woman, with the greatest face you've
> seen, talking to a few guys.  One happens to be our own great NYC with
> his magnificient weight-lifting body and his "I'm great" attitude; 
> another is Riker with his patterns, a third is Greg19 with his band of
> ways, and so on.  So basically what you would have is a bunch of guys
> trying to find and give this woman what she wants, so as to get on/in
> her.
> 
> Then there's Svengali, with his Carey Grant looks and ways, who sees
> the woman, walks right up into the group and says "excuse me guys, I
> just wanted to ask the lady where she got, and whose idea it was to get
> those earrings that seems to make her skin sparkle and her eyes glow,
> and then I'll leave." [Turning to her] "So please tell me, where did
> you get, and what made you decide [Svengali's hand goes out to the
> earrings, and in the process, lightly touches the lady's neck] to get
> these earrings that seems to make your skin sparkle and your eyes
> glow?"  {She tells me.}  "Thank you."  "Bye guys, I'm going back over
> there [pointing, so the lady knows where I will be]."
> 
> Look what just occurred: (1) I showed I wasn't afraid of a damn thing. 
> (2) I disarmed my opponents.  (3) I made her feel good.  (4) I showed
> her I wasn't about to hang around and try and get her.  {Of course to
> firmly establish that point, I would engage another woman in
> conversation, and have her positioned in a way that the first woman
> would see her with me, which would have her wondering what kind of nice
> things was I saying to her, that she wasn't getting.}.
> 
> Who do you think the woman is likely to be focused on and thinking
> about: all the guys who are there, still trying to get to her, or the
> guy who said what he wanted, made her feel good/great, left, and is now
> focused on someone else?  {I removed one of her feel good sources, so
> even though the others are there, with theirs, she like nearly everyone
> of us, is focused on the one that's been lost, not the ones that are
> present.}
> 
> Show your interest in her, but also show that you are walking the
> moment *she's* not exactly like you want.
> 
> Now I'll play devil's advocate and say that my little "walk away"
> didn't work.  Do you think I care?  Hell no, and I'll tell you why: the
> one who chases to gets, will always have to chase to have.  So whoever
> would win with the woman, would have to keep providing whatever they
> did to keep her interested.  I, on the other hand, only need to use a
> little charm and then walk away to have her wanting me.
> 
> I ask you, who do you think has an easier time of it?
> 
> -- 
> If you don't know in the first twenty minutes whether or not you're going
to
> have sex with the woman you just met, and whether or not you even want
to,
> you're not a seductionist.
> 
>   'o o'
> Svengali
>

Maniac High's Pick Up Girls Guide and Seduction Website! » mystery

Maniac High — Thu, 20 May 2010 12:22:49 +0000

Buy Reductil No Prescription, From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Mystery and others write about successful openers.

Status: O

talk about esp and its impossibility

talk about how you met a bear while hiking

talk about how you were scared shitless rock climbing when your rope snapped

or talk about the famous person you met

does she believe in ghosts. why, Buy Reductil No Prescription.

or hotseat (like question game but more brutal)

talk about the time you bladed down a steep hill and survived. Buy Reductil No Prescription, talk about the time you were on stage

...

mystery

-----

From nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org Wed Apr 12 07:31:37 2000
From: nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org (Nathan SZILARD)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: After the # close

They find it very funny and show it to their friends, plus
they remember, Buy Reductil No Prescription.

| If you did any anchoring on your voice when you met, order Reductil, Buy Reductil without a prescription, now's the time to
| unleash them.

----

From slidewguy@remove-aol.com Wed Apr 12 07:47:28 2000
From: "whoisthis19"
Subject: Some closes
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast

Any of you guys got ways of getting chicks to leave with you outside
the club.

greg1

Did you sleep with yourself or... did you turn yourself down because
you was too easy.

Doing Successful Openers

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Mystery and others write about successful openers!



From: "Mystery" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast,Alt.psychology.nlp,alt.hypnosis
References: <37602334.55753831@bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Chat suggestions
Date: Wed, 16 Jun 1999 04:58:12 -0700
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Status: O

talk about esp and its impossibility

talk about how you met a bear while hiking

talk about how you were scared shitless rock climbing when your rope snapped

or the time you visited your friends friend with him and your buddy was
almost beaten to death when the friend he visited had a boyfriend who came
out and there was a 20 minute car chase through lights and you were looking
for the cops but lot the crazed boyfriend before you found cops.

or the time you were in the hospital and it changed the way food tastes.
the birds sound clearer now.

or the time you netbused (hacked) into a bank but chickened out and put the
money into a charity

or talk about the famous person you met

does she believe in ghosts?  why?

you like candles and incense.  what does SHE like?  the music game modified
for all types of objects.

play the question game with her

or hotseat (like question game but more brutal)

talk about the time you bladed down a steep hill and survived.

talk about the time you were on stage

...

mystery



-----


From nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org Wed Apr 12 07:31:37 2000
From: nathan@metabork.fr.eu.org (Nathan SZILARD)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: After the # close

On Mon, 03 Apr 2000 21:26:22 GMT, Rio  wrote:
| I was reading elsewhere on a post, that if you instruct her to sound
| cheerful on the phone when you call when you do a # close.

I tried that, it's not a magic bullet. But it's fun.

I now always write some shit along with my phone #:
something like "DO NOT FALL IN LOVE" or "NO STALKING PLEASE".

They find it very funny and show it to their friends, plus
they remember.

| If you did any anchoring on your voice when you met, now's the time to
| unleash them.



----

From slidewguy@remove-aol.com Wed Apr 12 07:47:28 2000
From: "whoisthis19" 
Subject: Some closes
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast

Hand her the slip of paper and pen and have her write down her number.
When she's hands it back, ask her to put it someplace so you will
remeber to call her.  Last time I did this she put it down my pants and
grabbed my cock.  

Ask a gal to trade shirts.  When she balks, keep pressing in a joking
manner then finally ask to her to go outside to trade shirts.  Nothing
better then getting her outside.

Another one is simply saying its too smokey, noisy, smelly in here. 
Lets go outsde for some air.

Any of you guys got ways of getting chicks to leave with you outside
the club?

greg1

Did you sleep with yourself or... did you turn yourself down because
 you was too easy.

A conversation with Mystery! Pickups

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


A conversation with Mystery!

Tips on fieldwork from a pick up artist! on IRC #PUA!


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A Conversation with Mystery, a Pick-up Artist (PUA)

Topics Include: 

The Kiss Close
Clubbing alone
Handling guys
Being a story-teller
Preparation and format
Quality vs. quantity

Lego: Hey Mystery, what's your favorite story to close with?  How 
exactly do you transition from the telling of a story to closing?

Mystery: "The Kiss Close" is my favorite routine.  Once you have three 
indicators of interest (she touches you, laughs consistantly at your 
jokes, leans in towards you, smiles a lot and keeps eye contact, resumes 
chat when you force silence, etc) you then phase shift.  You turn 180 
degrees on a dime.  Go from humorous and non-sexual to saying, "Stop.  
Would you like to kiss me?", right out of the blue.  She will say either 
say, "Uh - no",(which is unlikely as you don't bother performing "The 
Kiss Close" until enough indicators are present) or, "I donno" (they 
rarely say, "Yes"). "I donno" means she actually does want to but feels 
embarrassed on how to say "Yes".  So you reply, "Lets find out", then go 
in slowly and kiss her.  It's very simple and very effective.  If she 
says, "Why?", this is also a yes.  Simply reply, "It looked like you had 
something on your mind.  Would you like to kiss me?"  Wait again for 
her response.  If her response is "No" then reply, "Hey I didn't say you 
COULD.  You just had that look in your eye."

Lego: What do you do if you're interrupted? You're telling your target 
a story and she is all into it but some AFC cock-blocking idiot just 
runs up and starts screaming and yelling and you're like, "What the 
fuck?"

Mystery: Simply ask him if you can borrow his pen.  When he gives it to 
you, throw it away as you say, "Fetch."

Wakeboarder: Hahaha.  Nice!

Lego: What if he's bigger than you?

Mystery: I'd instead call him on his disruptive shit and remark, "Dude, 
what are you attempting here?"  Not good enough?  Then say, "Ladies?  
Shall we discover what adventure awaits us in another room?"

Wakeboarder: Man, none of my buds want to go to the club.

Gamer: Screw them then.

Mystery: Go alone.

Wakeboarder: I need to be made fun of for this comment but I feel like 
a weiner if I go to a club myself

Lego: Bro, your trippin'. I go solo many times. It's good actually.  
It's weird if it's a first night but if I've been there before it's cool.

Mystery: Yeah, I understand ... and yet, staying home alone will make 
you feel so much better?  Go out alone, meet some cool dudes when you 
get there (they will become your wingmen there) and then run around 
getting #'s.  Report to your fellow PUAs what happened.  Whatever happened 
to the concept, "The alphamale gets all the women?"  Shit dude, what are 
you, a mommas boy?  Do you need your hand held?  

Lego: How do you strike up conversations with guys?

Mystery: Walk up and say, "Hey dude, question for ya.  Do you know 
where a good place to score is in this city? 'Cause this place looks like a 
cock farm."

Lego: Good!  You should be able to relate to guys to disarm them.  You 
don't compete; you ELIMINATE COMPETETION.

Gamer: LOL.  Dude, the only results I've had were solo.  My friends 
psych me out too much because they never help.  Instead they just complain 
about my taking too much time.  They laugh at me or just generally piss 
me off.

Mystery: I have MUCH better results (and MUCH more fun) playing "The 
Game" alone.  It forces you to approach.  It's a great motivator.

Lego: Damn! I couldn't have put it better myself.

Gamer: Yep.

Mystery: You wont be alone for more than five minutes once you approach 
your first set anyways.  Gamer, I suggest you call them on their shit 
at some point.  Demonstrate your alphamale characteristics.

Lego: How do you continue talking?  I mean, group set dynamics are much 
different in a one one on one approach.

Mystery: Be a story-teller - THAT is the skill of the PUA.  It isn't 
SEDUCING; it's STORY-TELLING.  It is my personal belief that SS patterns 
arent as 'hypnotic' as they are 'entertaining' stories.

Wakeboarder: Sweet

Lego: Actually with the story stuff I SEE WHAT YOU MEAN.  They just 
follow that lead.

Wakeboarder: Well, I need to stop being a sackless wonder and grow some 
fuckin' balls then!  Hmm, story telling ...

Mystery: Here's an example.  "Ever been camping?  Well I was up in a 
forest up north and was hiking with some girlfriends of mine ... and we 
came along some trail and there was shit on the path.  My friends were 
like, "haaaa someone shit in the woods" and I said, "lets get the fuck 
out of here like NOW."  they thought I was just scared of shit and I 
said, "Girls, you dont get it.  This shit is still warm and its not human.  
Its bear shit.  This is a big fucking bear.  Look at the size of that 
turd."  Notice it's not sexual?  Most hot girls gets get "sex-talk" 
right away from AFCs.  NOT talking sex with them makes them question 
whether you are interested in them.  Leave them guessing until you get 
indicators of interest from them.  If they like your great personality 
(confident, humorous, etc) they will give you subtle but distinct clues.

Gamer: How do you flow from story to story?

Mystery: If there is ONE mental state you should force yourself into, 
its TALKATIVE.  Talk your fucking HEAD off.  Just go from one story 
straight into another one like a comedian does.  Ever find yourself excited 
about something and you talk and talk and talk?  THAT is what must 
happen to get a girl.  You have to ENTERTAIN them.  Look talkative yet not 
desperate.  

Gamer: Heh.

Lego: Dude, I had that going last night. You're so right.  That's an 
excellent example dude.  I was telling this story about getting harassed 
by cops or some shit.  It's a cool story but my delivery sucked and I 
was losing one of the two girls I was telling it to.  What if they fail 
to elaborate on your story?  Besides it being a bad story to begin 
with, how can you fix it on the fly?

Mystery: They don't have to interact with it.  Its a good thing to have 
flexible stories to allow for some comment but it's not nessessary.  
It's YOUR job to perform the material.  It's your audiences job to 
listen,laugh and generally be entertained.  That's it.  At the end of 10 
minutes you will see the girls digging you (positive indicators).  You then 
phase shift abruptly into the close.

Lego: HOW DO YOU PHASE SHIFT?  I've been wondering this. While I didn't 
come off as obvious in last nights case and just told her to kiss me (I 
knew she would anyway), this could have been smoother.

Alpha: Lego, you ad libbed the close?  So working on ad libbing is 
good?

Mystery: Ad libbed material is not as accurate in closing as is 
performing the well constructed and field-tested "Kiss Close" routine.  Ad 
libbing is BONUS material but don't COUNT on it.  Have your material, like 
a good comedian, prepared before performing.  This isn't "A Night at 
the Improv" fellas.

Gamer: Heh.

Mystery: All PUs have a format; a beginning, a middle and an end.  If 
you don't know what the next routine is going to be then you may end up 
with an unfortunate pregnant pause which fucks up your pacing.  You may 
end up filling the silence with the deadly, "So ... um ... what do you 
do?"  Preparation saves face.  Afterall, with your particular close, 
she could have pulled away from your trying to kiss her.  Then what?!!  
Instead, consider engaging her in enthusiastic conversation, then go 
directly into the close.  In other words, stop her in mid-sentence and 
with a curious tone, kiss close.

Wakeboarder: cool.  Lego, what indicators clued you in that she wanted 
the kiss?

Alpha: In what way can you be prepared?  If we're talking about 
story-telling in front of a random girl we just met seconds ago in a random 
place ...

Mystery: Like a good comedian, have your material prepared yet when 
onstage be prepared to dynamically omit certain routines and to add others 
on the fly.  Sometimes certain routines fit the situation better than 
others.  Have 3 to 5 alternative openers (as a comedian would) and enjoy 
performing the one you think best fits the situation will get the best 
reaction for the group you are in front of

Alpha: Gotcha now.  Can you give me a brief example of how you go about 
preparing?

Mystery: Sure.  First, find 3 openers and memorize them.  Write down a 
list of openers (just the headings of each opener to remind you).  
Next, write down some routines (the question game, the music game, the 
photo routine, the bear in the woods story, etc - all on dejanews) and then 
also memorize the kiss close and the # close.  Memorize 3 NEGs too and 
you are good to go.  With the material in your mind, you are prepared 
to work it in the field until you have the timing of the material down 
(again, just like a comedian.)

Alpha: Man, you provide some really eye-opening ideas... (just when I'm 
about to think there's nothing more to learn.

Wakeboarder: So what you're saying is have a routine set up and modify 
it to each situation? Kind of like having a PU template?

Mystery: It's ALL about format.  Know the format and stick to it.  If 
you now what the next step is in the PU, you wont feel scared.  It gets 
fun and you begin to appreciate the strategy behind it all.

Wakeboarder: Yeah like FMAC? That's a simple format.

Mystery: Yes, FMAC.  Each letter in FMAC is an abrupt phase shift.  
"FIND" means having to abruptly disturb your complacency by getting out of 
the house.  It takes effort for many people to do bother getting THIS 
FAR.  "MEET" is a HUGE abrupt change.  "There she is!  3, 2, 1, GO!"  In 
the "ATTRACT" phase, you need to go from the walk up to the TALKATIVE 
performer entertaining story-teller.  You will need A LOT of energy for 
this (enthusiasm is contagious afterall) and for many to go from 
slumping around to being in performer mode is ABRUPT.  Finally you must then 
"CLOSE"; to phase shift from humour to serious is also abrupt.  Each 
phase may FEEL awkward but it looks normal.  When a comedian finishes one 
topic and just goes into an entirely new unrelated topic, the audience 
doesn't care as long as the next topic is entertaining.

Wakeboarder: Very true.

Gamer: Cool.  I'm collecting openers and other routines off the 
layguide right now.

Alpha: Do you believe in the 80/20 'rule'?  Meaning, 80% of the quality 
women are found in 20% of the right places or connections or 
situations.

Mystery: The quality of a woman is SO subjective. Quality is difficult 
to QUANTIFY.  80% of QUALITY?  It's pointless trying to mix and match 
these concepts. INSTEAD consider that there are HOTTIES and UGs (YOU get 
to decide based on your personal criteria) and of the HOTTIES, some 
have pleasant personalities and others do not.  You cannot possibly judge 
her personality until she LIKES you.  So go out ... FIND her, MEET her, 
ATTRACT her and THEN decide if you want to CLOSE her AFTER judging her 
personality.  Judging her by the way she treats you on your approach is 
lame because particularly beautiful women all have their bitch shields 
up and running.  They have to.  They aren't planning on fucking every 
guy that says Hi to them.  The only way to get rid of the guys is to 
oftentimes offend them quickly.  It's not personal.  It's merely a learned 
strategy.  So is the "I have a boyfriend excuse, but that's a different 
story.  I also suggest CLOSING everyone just for the education.  You 
don't actually have to CALL the girls of course.  You simply get to 
practice CLOSING too.  Getting a girls number is merely an OPTION.  You 
don't have to follow up on ALL of them you know.

Keen: Heh.

Wakeboarder: Cool, judging the girls only after you have attracted 
them.  Kind of makes you approach too!  You can't say the bull shit line, 
"She's not my type, I can tell", to get you out of approaching.

Alpha: Do you have a web page?

Mystery: No, not currently.  I'm writing a book though called The 
Mystery Method.  Most of my ramblings can be found on the layguide. 

Ascence: Hey, is it true that the older we get the more money/social 
status becomes and issue?

Mystery: No matter what social status you have (or THINK you have), 
it's still something you must convey in the first 25 minutes of meeting 
her.  We ALL start equal BEFORE meeting her; all men.  The issue is, can 
we congruently convey our social status (real or not) in our 
performance?  That's OUR responsibility.  The best way is not to TELL them about 
it but rather to DEMONSTRATE it.  How?  Well, if you talk about having 
girls always falling for you for instance, it's not NEARLY as good as 
actually having a couple hot girls with you saying what a hottie you are 
infront of the target.  This is called PAWNING.

Keen: I'm going to try doing the story-telling that you talked about.  
It's really hard though. I'm a real bad storyteller.  I've been working 
on it today. that's my lesson today.

Wakeboarder: Tell them about that time you saw a fallen over manequin 
in the department store and you tripped over it.  The security guard 
thought you were trying to make it with the manequin and called you a 
little freak.

Gamer: LOL (Laughing Out Loud).

Wakeboarder: One more question for you Mystery.  What's the meaning of 
life?

Mystery: To fuck. :)

Statement of Intent (SOI)

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Rio introduces a key part of PU: the 'Statement of Intent' (SOI)!

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2000 09:00:50 GMT
Subject: Find Stun Drag Fuck

G'day,

Jonathan Ashton  wrote in message
news:90eati$gpt@nnrp1.deja.com...
> As I've read the twelve-odd messages in this thread, I've been looking
> for something to take home with me, but I'm not finding it.
>
> Rio, how do you do things differently now, based on what you've said?

First thing would be to think about the close. Mystery knows his group work
perfect from how I read it, and I have been using his methods to great
success social-proof wise.

The BIG thing that clocked in my head was the need to STATE YOUR INTENTIONS
to the chick within the first minute of meeting her. I will make that my
rule from now on - as with the 3 second rule.
By this I DON'T mean "Let's fuck" or "Come to Papa baby" or any throw-away
shit like that. It has to be an honest assessment of what YOU feel capable
of doing to the chick after the "Hi" and the first round of fluff/routine
(routine preferred - something humourous). GM does this part BEAUTIFULLY,
because he does it with a sense of fun and humour - and HE KNOWS he is going
to do what he says and so does SHE!
I notice Mr. Sex states this a lot in his past posts - where AFC or shit
PUAs do approaches and talk to the chick, but never get to the point AND the
bitch can tell that the guys want to fuck but are too pussy to go for it.
Ross says something to the tune of "And maybe we could really get to like
each other" when he closes in HTGTWYDIB. I also recall that TokyoPUA did a
statement of intentions on that chick he PUed at night once who was
initially scared of him. Johnny Shack does it by when he just springs dates
on women he just met.
So there's some cross references.

The proper methodological way to get to a statement of intentions part is by
pace and lead. But the point of the matter is, you have to structure the
conversation to show interest and intent VERY soon or you will stall, chick
will get bored, feel teased, and then it's C&B time. Believe me, a LOT of
C&B experience with a LOT of HOT chicks has so far has taught me this
painful lesson.
The best way to put it is in the most honest way possible. I cannot give you
a specific example. But the idea is to get her thinking romantically about
you VERY soon. THEN you HAVE TO DO WHAT YOU SAID you would do to the chick
after DDB. (E.g. If you want to start things off gently by holding her hand,
tell her a scene where want to be holding her hand - and then do it in the
next routine after she is comfortable with this.) If you do NOT DO what you
say you will, eventually your congruence will fuck up when the chick loses
patience. Then the chick will be confused, get scared, and bolt. If this
ever happens and the guy tries to do heavy kino or try for a fuck while the
chick is in this state - It's gonna be RAPE.

In fact, on the matter of Rape. I read in Cosmo (Hey, My chick gets fucked
often and STILL reads this!) that psychologists WARN women against guys that
say "Come to my place to see my pictures" etc. when the idea is to fuck the
chick whilst your intentions aren't known to her - because it is DATE RAPE.
Thus as Maniac found out ages ago, that GROUNDWORK is the key element to
getting the chick over to fuck. That can be done through STATEMENT OF
INTENTIONS - and may not necessarily happen through Kiss closes.
You must remember this - a kiss is just a kiss........

IF that works, THEN we can reward her with more conversation and more
Mystery style routines or whatever (because she is OK with our intentions
then - thus the rewards), and THEN up the ante some more with our STATEMENT
OF INTENTIONS, building on what we established before - to get her more hot
and horny than before. So you may have started on holding her hands, now you
may progress on to hugging, kissing, fucking etc. whatever seems to be the
most logical progression from her actions towards you.

Patterns, routines, psych tests, will help greatly during the chat routines
in-between statements of intentions. Those are what set us apart from the
other PUAs out there.

Eventually we get to a point where the chick is DDB, then we can get to the
Drag (you must take the woman to fuck location, or have her so into you that
she will come to you) and Fuck part (in our world of course). The Our World
routine would then be the ULTIMATE in the STATEMENT OF INTENTIONS series
which would then lead to the deal fuck closed. It is in this one that you
state your relationship expectations and put it in "Our World"

Now the method is Find, Stun, Drag, Fuck.

The point is - FUCK all this bullshit about the woman needs to be done in
the "right way" to match her values. Something tells me now that a woman
made this comment as an attempt to rationalize her unreasonable emotions.
The values she wants ALL ALONG is #1 SEX, and to a lesser extent #2 to be
taken care of after SEX. That goes for ANY woman (thus the universality of
the whole principle). When the guy comes along as does her, she will
rationalise that the guy understood exactly what she felt. That's what some
religious women mean when they beautifully say "God knew when it was the
right time for me". In reality, they KNOW DEEP DOWN they are at the mercy of
guys and what they want to do with her. To her, that is "destiny" and no
wonder so many women are suckers for fortune-telling and the like.

Eliciting is when you want to # close or coffee close and check the girl out
for relationship potential. If it's ONS - hey! ya don't need it! If you
cannot attempt a kiss to fuck close in the given situation - you will have
to # close, but not forget to state that your intentions could well get
beyond just coffee!

The other thing - "Make no excuses for desires as a man" is THE SINGLE MOST
IMPORTANT THING (As Ross Jeffries has already said) but I had to experience
it myself to believe it. ALL of what I explained above IS USELESS in
practical application if you are trying to follow it like a script. The idea
is to GRAB that girl and NOT let her get away! ;) So guys, HOW MUCH DO YOU
WANT THAT GIRL? WHAT ARE YOU PREPARED TO DO?

Also on that note. BE A FUCKING MAN. Act like a guy, and don't think that
mirroring a girl completely is going to make you attractive to her. I know
from experience that the more caveman I go with chicks who KNOW my
intentions, the more they respond sexually.
Talk to chicks as if you were telling your kid brother how to play football
properly, cause your kid brother happens to be shit at football. I
especially like the way Mr. Sex talks to us on ASF - giving pointers and
what-not. I'm sure he talks to chicks exactly the same way IRL - showing
congruence all along.

You can even get around the language barrier! I just about dragged a sexy
Jgirl in a bikini off the beach while babbling to them in English! A
language they didn't even understand! I did that enough and with a smile,
that the chick went DDB and ready to GO when I took her hand. Had it not
been for the cockblock!
Somebody must have taught the "Iranian from hell" this shit!

The way I think about it is much like caveman sex. You see the hot chick,
you bang her on the head with your club, you take her to your cave, you root
her. Thus :- Find Stun Drag Fuck.
Just a bit more aggressive than Find Meet Attract Close, but that's the best
way I could describe what this ugly-as-fuck PUA was doing.

These were the attitudes that I had when I was only just starting to pull
women at incredible speeds while on holiday.

The other point is on Objection handling in regards to the STATEMENT OF
INTENTIONS. What I learned from the PUA I met, is that you fight chick
bullshit with your own bullshit - with a slightly authoritive tone (no need
to REALLY get pissed).
For example :- The chicks said "We have to get to our car" and were ready to
leave
The Playboy said "You can't leave anyway because the gates are closed" even
though the gates aren't closed.
Thus this covers handling chick bullshit - on the phone as well as in real
life.
And one chick on another seduction board I read often typed something to the
tune that she wants to be with a guy that can bullshit his way into her
pants.

So there you go. Find Stun Drag Fuck.
Stun is the hardest.

> There are reasons why most of us step through seduction so gingerly.
> We know that saying or doing one wrong thing can blow up the seduction.
> As far as I can tell, letting her know you intend to fuck her before
> you fuck her is one of those things.  Another reason is that women
> won't tell you when they're ready to fuck.

But DDB does tell all!
That single most common fuckup is what is called LACK OF CONGRUENCE
(definition courtesy of Mr. Sex). Just like when I called that chick I met
yesterday "my friend" in front of her. Doing that is a sign of weakness.
Chicks can get away with having words out of congruence with their actions,
but guys CANNOT.

> You say that when you "lead girls on" and tease them too much, you look
> easy and they hate you.  But this insight doesn't make it any easier to
> recognize when you're "leading them on".  The window between when a
> woman is receptive to a close and when you've stalled her is short, and
> spotting it seems to be harder than superstring theory.  The answer
> seems to be to make hundreds of approaches, and very slowly improve
> through experience.

Well you have body language and other subtle pointers. Plus we are adding
all the time to our STATEMENT OF INTENTIONS in order to find a barrier and
cut off point. I don't doubt that noticing DDB when you have the intuition
becomes easier.

  The one concrete thing I get out of your post is
> that next time two HBs want a foursome with you and your LTR, you'll be
> more likely to recognize it.  Or maybe the situation will be different
> enough that you won't.

I fucked that up because I KNOW those chicks wanted me to go with them, and
I over-teased them and didn't capitulate and then state my intentions to
have a foursome. They would have been up for it!
That's when the Playboy showed up to show me the shit, and then beat me
hands-down in a round of THE GAME. ;)

> You also said, "Now I realise more than fucking EVER what a chick
> wants. She wants a guy to go and GET her, make her feel wanted, and
> then have the shit fucked out of her!"  But you agreed with another
> poster that you can't just walk up to a woman and say "Let's fuck."
> So what's your new insight here?

It's a no-brainer. Is sex ALL you bringing to the table? That's why he
coupled GM styled intention pointers further into the seduction (after the
earlier G-rated ones), and then when they succeeded in not objecting, he
went to Mystery routines as a reward OR to the Drag phase if they were DDB.
You cannot start the seduction with a statement of intention that skips the
buildup - unless the chick is THAT FUCKING HORNY and shameless.
Chicks want to know that you care about them as human beings and not just
sex objects. Thus neutral conversation gets smattered in between, and the
final statement of intentions clearly shows what his intentions are so SHE
KNOWS that you care about her feelings - in that way.

The Playboy I met even went to see a chick he had a threesome with the next
day (cause she was feeling a bit alone). This guy was no cheap "Player"
(which he pointed out in his great Our world styled close routine on this
9). You could tell he cared enough too.

> Have you figure out a better way to know when a woman is ready to
> be closed?  Or a faster way to get her to want to fuck?  Or a way to
> let her know your intentions without scaring her off?  What's the
> difference between your approach now and your approach before you went
> to Guam?  It sounds like you feel you understand things better than
> you did before, but I can't figure out what the new understanding is.

Well, now you have your answer.
Mind you, I'm only getting the framework now that I sit down and try and
explain what I am now doing. This shit became automatic when I had the whole
experience of witnessing this guy and learning from him.

Any questions or comments? Fire away....

Rio
-------

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
References:  <90eati$gpt@nnrp1.deja.com> <63JW5.205t1.56373@nnrp.gol.com> <90i82p$iao@nnrp1.deja.com>
Subject: Re: Find Stun Drag Fuck

Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2000 10:04:46 GMT

Jonathan Ashton  wrote in message
news:90i82p$iao@nnrp1.deja.com...
> In article <63JW5.205t1.56373@nnrp.gol.com>,
>   "Rio"  wrote:
> > Well, now you have your answer.
>
> Yeah, I understand much better now.  Thanks for writing it down.
>
> > Any questions or comments? Fire away....
>
> So I get the abstract idea now:  Make some sort of Statement Of
> Intentions (SOI) to a woman relatively early, and then act congruently
> with it.

More or less, that's it.
The thing is, after dropping routines - get to it or the chick gets confused
and drops out.
Mystery had the right idea with his routines and intros. BUT if you fail to
State your intentions - you can stall things and stale her out. Then it will
be your fault when it appears that the routines don't work! They may have
worked, but she has given up on you as a partner already. You teased too
much.

> Like most people, though, I don't really understand any abstract idea
> until I've seen two or three concrete examples; i.e. HOW to make that
> SOI.

Ross Jeffries has already covered how to do this with his NLP pacing and
leading. I'm just giving a name to the end result of doing that (SOI -
Statement of Intention).

SOIs are SO important to women. They want to know where they stand. Women
you are with and haven't SOIed will think to themselves :- "What am I to
him"?
With my LTR which I sloppily SOIed, she annoyed me for ages if I was her
boyfriend or not. I hadn't said, and was therefore walking thin ice.
That drove her NUTS.

Now, I guess I could show you some fake examples of stuff that you could
launch into your PU - but the reason why I'm not going to do that is because
if ANYBODY creates a list of them - we're going to get the problem that AFC
men ALREADY have with PU Lines. That is, throwing meaningless words into a
conversation and then not being able to back them up.
Either that, or we will develop a single street pickup routine which men
will use the world over with great success before women cotton on to it.
When it comes to SOI, DIY (damn all these acronymns!).

An example of SOI is what I said to the chick I tried to PU on the weekend.
I paced it to the point where we are talking about where we lived, and I
found out that she lived close. Then I said "That's good, so we can get
together really easy and have some fun then."
If she had been far away - no problem "That's too bad. I'll have to travel
far to get together with you and have fun"
If she lives on Mars - no problem "Wow! You live out there! I'll have to
build a rocket to come and see you after you go back there!"

So there you go. Who needs to be excessively GM?

> You gave the example of GM style.  Yep, GM makes a pretty clear SOI.
> I don't think a "recovering nice guy" like me could do GM congruently,
> though.

I have done it once successfully and it Suuure works. But yes, it's hard to
work things up to that because you skip a lot of buildup steps. The flirting
has to take place in a sexual level rather than a much safer level. That is
risky.
That's what I mean when by saying "Let's Fuck" you run the risk of having to
flirt at such a high level where you can fuck up easily. Not that it's
impossible of course.
NEGs (which I forgot to mention before) help especially in the
objection,flirt phase. This phase is like the part where the dog chases
after the bitch to try and fuck her, and the bitch keeps running. The thrill
of the chase!

> You mention TokyoPUA and Johnny Shack references, but it would take
> a lot of searching/guessing to find the specific examples you have in
> mind.  And I don't understand your Ross example - "And maybe we could
> really get to like each other" sounds like a pretty vague SOI; maybe
> I'd understand what you mean if I knew the context?

Search for stuff on the archived layguide for stuff about Johnny Shack. He
also has an online book. Ross has his old free book around the place. Search
Formhandle for TokyoPUA's posts.
By the way, I even went as far as reading ALL of Mystery's decent posts as
well.

> The only example of an SOI I see in your posts is this one from Guam
> PUA:
>
> > As for going for the fuck close? Forget your sexual accelerators.
> > This guy said the whole shit in plain English - and I saw him say
> > this all to to a chick. He basically said that he was a playboy, but
> > not a pickup artist (to frame the idea that he won't fuck and dump),
> > and that when he had sex with the chick (Framing it as if it's going
> > to happen) that she should just enjoy it for fun and not worry about
> > it too much because it's just their private thing (our world style
> > routine), and that he was not an easy guy in reality - that he was
> > quite selective in who he chooses for sex (so he doesn't look like a
> > meat-market man).
> > He said all this straight faced to a chick, and while I was watching
> > the chick he did this on - she was trancing out and playing with her
> > hair. It was totally evil.
>
> So my questions...
>
> Have you ever done a SOI to kiss a girl and not had her object?  If so,
> what did you say?  Have you ever done a SOI to fuck a girl and not had
> her object?  If so, what did you say?  Hell, do you remember the exact
> words of any SOI you've ever said?

I gave you an example above of an SOI above (where I told the chick that we
would hang out in the future). No doubt we can refine the whole shit a lot
better in the future.
And yes. I think everyone at some stage has done an SOI, or the body
language has been good enough to get her into that zone where she KNOWS
maybe at 70% where your intentions are, with or without any routines to help
snag the chick, and the chick has put up some token resistance. The purpose
of the resistance of course, is to set the scene for the chase you know will
end in a fuck if you can just reel the bitch in. You will eventually do it
as long as you have remained congruent throughout.

> What other kinds of SOIs would you use in the buildup?  Tell her you're
> going to give her a neck massage?  (I'm sure that question sounds
> clueless; but I really think the meat is in the details.)

Well pace it:-
"Have you ever felt like having a neck massage? I think you need one, so
I'll give you one"
Sometimes the more direct your SOIs are, the harder she will force you to
keep pushing them.
So let's say the chick flirts and says "Why do you want to? I don't need
one!"
So we have to SOI her again in the second sentence in this example :- "Well
you haven't had one of my massages that can make you feel good all over. Now
relax....."

The idea is to trap the chick at all costs with your intentions that you can
carry out - until she can't get away.
Even "No I can't!" "Yes you can!" "No I can't!" "Yes you can!" fights - if
that's what it comes down to - can win you the day if you persist and not
let her win! Verbal arguments can always be solved with kino - cause you as
the guy are STRONGER. I don't mean hit her, but mauling is OK as long as she
is enjoying it! ;)

Persistance is VERY important. Of course, you may want to dump the chick
after the fuck if she doesn't drop the shit because she is too much work to
obtain sex from in the long run. Just give her an ultimatum "Cut the shit or
you will be lonely!"

At the same time, you can get trapped if you say an SOI that you can't
possibly keep. So watch what you promise to do!
Saying shit like "I'm going to buy you a Rolls Royce!" when she KNOWS you
can't afford it is an extreme example of a shit SOI. There goes your trust
and congruency with that one.

> And as for one other comment you made:
>
> > (E.g. If you want to start things off gently by holding her hand,
> > tell her a scene where want to be holding her hand - and then do it
> > in the next routine after she is comfortable with this.)
>
> You mean you tell her a story about some guy you know who held some
> girl's hand?  Or what?  Methinks I really don't understand here.

You can do that to get her thinking about holding someone's hand - and once
she is feeling it, you may be able to slip in the kino and get away with it.
At least, your chances will be better.

> > Is sex ALL you bringing to the table? That's why he
> > coupled GM styled intention pointers further into the seduction
> > (after the earlier G-rated ones), and then when they succeeded in
> > not objecting, he went to Mystery routines as a reward OR to the
> > Drag phase if they were DDB.
>
> I would LOVE to see these SOIs written down.

Done as above. But make your own!
I re-explained the "Let's Fuck" problem a bit better above as well.

> So here's my deal:  I want to see more examples of SOIs so I can take
> them apart, because I really suspect that the exact wording is crucial.
>
> For example:
>
> GM gets away with his SOIs because they're exaggerated to absurdity,
> and thus they're both funny and unlikely (at least as stated).
> This puts a little distance between the SOI and the girl, so she
> doesn't slap him.

I think it's more of a case of the GM SOIs that fail, he can write them off
as being jokes. That keeps him on track and congruent.
BUT the risk of failure is very high if he doesn't cover his tracks.

> Guam PUA gets away with his SOI (quoted above) because he's talking
> about chicks in general, and not overtly about the particular chick.
> This puts a little distance between the SOI and the girl, so she's
> not pressured to make a decision right then.

This is the all important point. With some SOIs (and especially with
ambiguities in NLP) the SOIs are not in your face, BUT they are vague enough
to get the point across and then judge for a positive reaction from her or
not. However, the vagueness is simply a shot from 50 metres as opposed to a
shot from point-blank. Just make sure you hit the target.
The danger with point-blank SOIs is they are risky in so far as if you say a
dumb one you can't,won't, or don't want to carry out like "I'm going to take
you on holiday!" as opposed to an NLP shot from 50 metres which describes a
holiday and builds on it. "Have you ever been on holiday with someone
special?....."

> Am I on the right track here?  Are there other ways to word SOIs that
> get around direct resistance?  More examples would be appreciated.

You should check out patterning, but remember, a shot from point-blank is
better than 50 metres. The shortest distance between 2 points is a straight
line. There are pros and cons of both styles of course.
You can take the short path across the dangerous ravine, or the long path
around it.

> I gotta say, this whole idea of SOIs is new to me.  Maybe other PUAs
> in this group have been using them without ever realizing/stating the
> importance of them?

I just gave a name to it. People have done this stuff before and I'm just
giving it a name to help explain what I'm doing.

And no, Ray can't trademark this either and claim it's his. We have
discussed why this is enough on ASF. He's filtered anyway and I can't see
his verbal shit.

> Thanks,
> Ash

Thanks for the questions. They help challenge me in trying to explain myself
better.

Rio

-------

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Clearing SOI's up
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 12:15:23 GMT

Maniac,

I came up with the SOI concept after studying what the Guam Playboy did to
chicks. I wish I could have spent longer down there to learn more off this
guy. Oh well, I just need to save up to go again.

SOI (Statements of intention/interest) were comments that the Guam Playboy
made a lot (I assume you read my report on that place - It's nanpa
paradise!). What he did then was control the flirting that followed after
baiting her with a show of interest. He did this by offering a challenge -
when he finished doing that once he went back to fun routines, talking about
parties on the island, jokes, sex personality tests, etc. before he did
another SOI - staring out as indirect and ambiguous, before being VERY
direct. ;)

Basically what I think I have come up with, through trying to explain to the
posters that asked me about him, is a flirting construction kit.

The Guam Playboy NEGged a LOT - and he got away with it every time. He could
even tell chicks AFC things like they were beautiful, and then turn it into
a NEG if he wanted. That's what over 20 years of daily PU did for this guy.

But the NEG is only one kind of flirting (used for dumping a girl's uptight
self image). There are other kinds, such as using ambiguities, physical
light-handed slapping and pushing kino, playing tricks on people, etc. The
Playboy used plenty of variations.

Flirting is this:- One drops the SOI, and then pulls it away out of reach of
the target. Then gives another SOI, and then pulls it away again. Like with
our words, we put images of sex and romance in their heads, then pull it out
again, then out it in, then take it out, then put it back in, then take it
out again........ Mindfucking!
Once the chick is confused and teased enough, she is DDB and safely
mindfucked.

I did a PU once on a chick using the SOIs. I found out where she lived and
then said "Oh that's not far from my place, so I can come down to see you.
It's a pity I am so busy it won't happen today"
(Note that there is a bit of future pacing and presuppositioning in this)
She lapped it up and took my kino from there - despite the BF being a matter
of metres away.

The structure for the Guam Playboy routine went like this:-

- Fun routine or opener (ala Mystery) - some basic fluff - all good things
about himself, what he could do for the women (he played the helpful tour
guide). Be "Disgustingly" Charming! as he put it. The guy wasn't big on
logically drawing out routines for what he did (which is a good thing), he
just went and DID this.... thus he couldn't really explain to me what he was
doing. I had to observe.
- SOI. He said something that hinted that he was interested in the chick
(paced and lead from his opener conversation). This got her emotions going
and her ideas racing. I have found this CRITICAL if the chick is going to
stay interested in you for too long. I bored many chicks out initially when
I wouldn't get to the point.
"What do you look for in guys?" would be sufficient enough as a question to
hint at what you are after (as you have found out yourself Maniac). Starting
off on a topic about guys and relationships usually brings chicks out, but
asking "Do you have a BF?" sucks.
This Ross Jeffries inspired SOI "The more you laugh, the more you'll be
attracted to interesting people......now with me" is an ambiguous SOI.
- Before she could knock him down for any comment, he would then be a
challenge and say something like "I'm not easy", "we don't know each other
well enough yet", "but what would I know, right? ;)","I need to feel passion
first", "Yeah, you know what I'm saying". These basically FORCE the chick to
continue the flirting (initiated by the SOI) along the lines that HE wanted
(and the lines that chicks SAY they want!).
By saying that he "needed time" and "not being easy", the chick already
attracted to him would then come onto him.

Most of the time the chicks would laugh becuase they'd get stuck for a smart
comeback. And he just kept this up, alternating back to party and fun
routines, until he got to the "sex-SOI-Our World-But I'm no sleaze"routine
which would then DDB the target to fuck - or get her ready for it next time
they met.
Negative commands also work great here to spark challenge. Just like I did
with my now LJBF ex-LTR "I'm not going to fuck you".

I've noted in my past failures (too many to count) that when I have dropped
SOI hints - the chicks have taken the flirting into areas which were
impossible for me to control - fucking me up and making me look stupid.
Especially in clubs where chicks do this like child's play to anyone who
"hits" on them. They use their irrational chick logic to fuck themselves
(and you) up. If that happens, your PU is history.
We can't give the women control, especially not in flirting, because they
aren't the ones that are trying to do PU. It's their job as "virtuous" women
to try and get away from PU, or try to fuck our PU up.

Svengali also said in his MLTR theory something which rings home on this. He
said (and I quote):-

"Seventh: If you don't give a woman something to be pissed about every
now and then, she'll find something on her own, and that will be harder
to get out of (because it will be of her making and criteria, not
yours)."

That is also the point of what we should be doing in flirting. To trap the
chick into going along with what your flirting and accepting your advances
(by means of non-objection) while getting her horny at the same time. That
way we avoid snappy comebacks because you've already "Handled her objections
before they came up" (That's something I learnt as a salesman)
This causes the chick to have her token resistance stall out - and puts us
in control.
GM does this with his sex jokes, but he slams any possible retort with "Just
Kidding" thus the chick can't say anything and the flirting goes by GMs
rules and not hers.

Take Mystery's "Nice nails" NEG for example.
He starts off with an SOI "Nice nails". This in and of itself is a
compliment. If he stopped here, the chick would come back (if she were a
bitch) with some smart ass comment to get rid of Mystery.

BUT, he then puts up the CHALLENGE before she gets a chance to reply (like
GM with "Just kidding"). Seemingly innocent too. "Are they real?"

Now the chick is stuck. What's going on? He's complimented me, and now he's
knocking me down! What is he doing? I must stick around for this! What can I
say? Maybe I'll just laugh it off...!? er..?
(Note, some REAL bitches when stalled will look angry at you and say "Huh?"
to which it's GM to the rescue! with "Hide your pleasure!")

So, couple this kind of flirting with lots of things to get her feeling
horny (patterns, sex talk, whatever), and add lots of personality conveying
things thrown in for good measure - and the chick is sufficiently stunned -
and ready for the drag and fuck stage.

Oh, and the Guam Playboy is an ugly fucker. Kipp's seen the pictures.
Looks don't matter for shit. I have great respect for all the older PUAs.

I must get up to Tokyo to see you guys real soon. The inaka sucks.
We can experiment with this some more then. I've been getting rusty since I
got back from Guam.
What I do know is that when this guy's method does work, it is KILLER. We
get Mr. Smooth status and KCs like crazy.

Rio
-------
Dictate the flirting

 wrote in message news:91f5e8$dpn@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Re: SOI's
>
> Rio..
>
> You are on to something big here..
> This is a discovery!
> I will incorporate this.
>
> Please give more specific examples though. I get
> what you are saying, but not yet really how you would
> apply it. .
>
>
> Fucking excellent thread!
>
>
> Maniac
> http://www.pickupguide.com
>
>
> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/

---

From: "Rio" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: More on SOIs
Date: Fri, 22 Dec 2000 06:17:41 GMT

THIS IS RIO TYPING IN CAPS. I'M NOT YELLING!

Comments in text below.
After New years, I WILL be ready, and we will hit
the streets.

GREAT. I HAVEN'T BEEN DOING MUCH PU UNTIL YESTERDAY (1 SOLID # FROM A 9 AND
A KC FROM ANOTHER 9) - THUS THIS POST AS I TEST OUT MY THEORY. I HAVE A
FRIEND WHO WOULD LIKE TO COME ALONG. HE'S ALREADY BRIEFED AND VERY
EXPERIENCED IN SCREWING WOMEN IN JAPAN. HE'S READ THE PICKUP GUIDE ALREADY.
HE'S EVEN BEEN SO KIND TO INTRODUCE ME TO SOME WOMEN WHO WANT MERCY FUCKS.
HE ALSO KNOWS SOME GOOD "hole in the wall" PLACES AROUND RAPPONGI WITH LOTS
OF WOMEN (SO HE SAYS).

BTW, Rio; re: 'nomad' player.. mine was fucked up, returned
it for an exchange, new one works..

IT'S SURE BEATS A TAPE RECORDER, DOESN'T IT?

First, this is brilliant material, it is going on the
website, and is core to successful PU I think. It IS what
smooth was doing.. I couldnt identify it, but now it has
been named, and described, I recognize this.. and yes, it
will be TOTALLY lethal..

THANKS. EVERY SUCCESSFUL PUA HAS BEEN DOING SOMETHING LIKE THIS (OF ONE
STYLE OR ANOTHER) TO BED WOMEN. I WENT OUT AND USED THIS FRAME YESTERDAY
WITH INTERESTING AND POSITIVE RESULTS.....

HOWEVER, I MUST SAY IT'S HARD TO GIVE SPECIFIC EXAMPLES UNLESS THEY ARE
SITUATIONALLY BASED. FOLLOWING THE LOGIC HOWEVER, AND USING IT GIVEN THE
SITUATION STILL BRING RESULTS. I WILL DESCRIBE SOME OF WHAT I HAVE BEEN
DOING WITH IT, BUT I CAN'T REMEMBER FOR THE LIFE OF ME WHAT EXACTLY THE GUAM
GUY SAID. (I ONLY RECORDED A SMALL SAMPLE OF OUR CHAT WITH MY MP3 PLAYER.
NONE OF HIS NANPA HOWEVER) WHAT I DO KNOW, IS THAT HE FOLLOWED THIS
STRUCTURE WHICH I HAVE DESCRIBED TO VERY SOME GOOD EFFECTS.

I ASSUME YOU READ MY ORIGINAL STORY ON THE GUAM TRIP.
IF SO, MY REPLY WILL MAKE MORE SENSE.

In article ,
  "Rio"  wrote:
> He did this by offering a challenge -
> when he finished doing that once he went back to fun routines,
talking about

Examples? ?

OK, HE MADE SOME KIND OF COMPLIMENT OR SUGGESTED SOME KIND OF ACTIVITY
(OFTENTIMES WITH SEXUAL OR ROMANTIC UNDERTONES) THAT THEY COULD DO TOGETHER.
(LIKE HANG TIGHT TO EACH OTHER OF THE JET POWERED BANANA BOAT) AND THEN
FOLLOWED THAT WITH A REASON WHY HE WOULD HAVE TROUBLE DOING IT. KINDA LIKE
IN SALES, A SALESMAN WOULD SAY "FOR ONE DAY ONLY SALE", WELL HE WAS LIKE "SO
YOU SHOW UP AT SUCH AND SUCH A TIME, OTHERWISE I WON'T BE ABLE TO SHOW YOU A
GOOD TIME AND I'LL TAKE SOMEONE ELSE" (a takeaway)
SO IN ORDER TO CONTINUE THE FLIRTING, THE CHICK WOULD HAVE TO SHOW UP. HE
WOULD THEN (AFTER HAVING COMPLETED A SOI ROUTINE) SIT BACK AND WATCH THE
CHICK FOLLOW THROUGH. HE WOULD OFTENTIMES BE ABLE TO CONTINUE A CONVERSATION
WITHOUT STALLING - AND MIDWAY HE WOULD SOI HER AGAIN AND DO THE SAME ROUTINE
WITH SOMETHING ELSE. I NEVER SAW HIM GET IT ON WITHIN 20 MINUTES, BUT I SAW
WHAT HE DID TO THE CHICK WITH THIS ROUTINE AND I COULD TELL THAT HE COULD
HAVE IF HE WANTED TO. HE DIDN'T LOOK DESPERATE AT ALL.

> parties on the island, jokes, sex personality tests, etc. before he
did
> another SOI - staring out as indirect and ambiguous, before being VERY
> direct. ;)

Examples ? ?

THIS GUY HAD A STRONG ELEMENT OF GM. THE SEX PERSONALITY TEST IS DOCUMENTED
IN MY POST ON THIS GUY (IT'S ABOUT ICE CREAM) - BUT AFTERWARDS UNLIKE GM, NO
COMMENT OF "JUST KIDDING". HE WOULD THEN SAY SOMETHING ELSE TO DISTRACT
ATTENTION OR PLAY "PRETEND AFC" LIKE "BUT I'M NOT EASY" OR "BUT I DON'T KNOW
YOU THAT WELL"
ALL THE MEANWHILE, GETTING THE CHICK HORNY AND CREATING A CHALLENGE.

> Basically what I think I have come up with, through trying to explain
to the
> posters that asked me about him, is a flirting construction kit.

Examples ? ?

MANIAC, YOU'RE STARTING TO OVERUSE CUT AND PASTE LIKE NYC WHEN HE RIPS APART
AFCS WITH THESE "EXAMPLES??" COMMENTS.........

(QUOTE NYC)
"YOU ARE BEING USED. SHE DOESN'T GIVE A SHIT ABOUT YOU. SHE DOESN'T INTEND
TO FUCK YOU. SHE IS FUCKING OTHER MEN THAT SHE FINDS SEXUALLY ATTRACTIVE.
YOU ARE FOOTING THE BILL FOR HER INTERNATIONAL WHORING. STOP."

HA HA HA ;)

> The Guam Playboy NEGged a LOT - and he got away with it every time.

Such as ? ?

WISH I COULD REMEMBER NOW. BUT WHAT I DID SEE IS HIM COMPLIMENTING LOTS OF
JAP CHICKS AND NOT GETTING ANY NASTY REACTION BACK FROM THEM - BECAUSE THEY
WERE SO SHY AND INEXPERIENCED. SO THE CHICKS JUST LAUGHED BECAUSE THEY HAD
NO BITCH SHIELD OF ANY TYPE.
WHERE HE DID ENCOUNTER A SHIELD, HE WOULD ATTACK HER "NASTY" PERSONALITY -
AND HER LACK OF ABILITY TO BE GRACEFUL WITH COMPLIMENTS.

IN THAT SENSE, HE WOULD ALWAYS SIZE THE CHICK UP AS IF HE WAS LOOKING FOR
LTR POTENTIAL (but we know of course, that LTR was never the plan)

He could
> even tell chicks AFC things like they were beautiful, and then turn
it into
> a NEG if he wanted. That's what over 20 years of daily PU did for
this guy.

Examples ? ?

"YOU'RE REALLY CUTE....(pause to check response)... BUT I DON'T KNOW
ANYTHING ABOUT YOU. (SAID NEGATIVELY OR NOT DEPENDING ON HER RESPONSE). SO
WHO ARE YOU ANYWAY?"

> But the NEG is only one kind of flirting (used for dumping a girl's
uptight
> self image). There are other kinds, such as using ambiguities,
physical
> light-handed slapping and pushing kino, playing tricks on people,
etc.

Such as ? ?

I'VE STOPPED USING KINO IMMIDIATELY NOW, AND SAVING IT FOR WHEN I'VE LANDED
AN SOI ROUTINE AND CAUGHT THE CHICK OUT. WHEN SHE HAS LAUGHED, I SLAP HER
GENTLY.
IT'S ANCHORING.

AS FOR TRICKS ON PEOPLE.... STUPID ONES. I WILL HAVE TO SHOW YOU THEM IN
PERSON.

The
> Playboy used plenty of variations.

Like what ? ?

GIVEN THE SITUATION, HE WOULD TRY DIFFERENT WAYS TO GET HER THINKING
ROMANTICALLY ABOUT BOTH OF THEM TOGETHER. HE WOULD USE WHATEVER WAS IN HIS
SURROUNDINGS, OR THE TOPIC OF CONVERSATION, TO PACE AND LEAD THE CHICK INTO
IMAGINING SUCH A SCENARIO.
THEN HE WOULD YANK IT AWAY BY GIVING SOME KIND OF EXCUSE (LIKE HE WAS BUSY,
HE DIDN'T THINK SHE COULD DO IT) OR HE WOULD PLAY AFC (I DON'T KNOW YOU, I
NEED TO BE IN LOVE FIRST, I'M NOT EASY, I'M NOT A PLAYER, I NEED TIME, I AM
REALLY PICKY, I HAVE BEEN HURT BEFORE, I HAVE A GF)

> Flirting is this:- One drops the SOI, and then pulls it away out of
reach of
> the target.

For example ? ?

I REALLY FEEL VERY CLOSE TO YOU, BUT I NEED TIME.

THE MAGIC WORD IS but

 Then gives another SOI, and then pulls it away again. Like with
> our words, we put images of sex and romance in their heads, then pull
it out

Like ? ?

HIS BRAVEST SOI WAS THE ONE WHERE HE SAID STRAIGHT OUT THAT HE WAS GOING TO
FUCK A CHICK. I WITNESSED THE WHOLE THING. HE SAID THAT HE WAS GOING TO FUCK
HER but (AND THEN HE WENT PRETEND AFC) I'M VERY PICKY, I'M NOT A PUA
BECAUSE THOSE GUYS TEASE WOMEN WITH BULLSHIT, MAKE EMPTY PROMISES, FUCK
THEM, AND THEN DUMP THEM. I AM A PLAYBOY. I LOVE WOMEN AND I DON'T WANT YOU
TO GET TOO ATTACHED TO ME AFTER WE HAVE SEX.

> again, then out it in, then take it out, then put it back in, then
take it
> out again........ Mindfucking!

Example please . .

OK, ANOTHER ONE:-   I WANT TO KISS YOU, BUT SOMEHOW I DON'T THINK YOU LIKE
KISSING.
(btw - this would be an SOI fairly advanced in conversation)
NOTE ALSO THAT THERE'S AN EMBEDDED COMMAND IN THE 2ND PART OF THE ROUTINE.
THAT BEING "YOU LIKE KISSING"
EVIL ISN'T IT?

> Once the chick is confused and teased enough, she is DDB and safely
> mindfucked.

how? describe this. . what exactly did he do?

WELL, THE CHICK THAT HE SAID THE "I'M GOING TO FUCK YOU" SPEECH TO, JUST
STARTED DOING ALL THE TRADEMARK BODYLANGUAGE. SHE JUST SAT THERE STUNNED
AND PLAYED WITH HER HAIR. LIKE A RABBIT LOOKING INTO BRIGHT LIGHTS. THE GUAM
GUY SAID ALL OF IT WITH A SERIOUS FACE TOO, SO SHE COULDN'T LAUGH OFF WHAT
HE WAS SAYING.

THE WAY HE WORKED DIDN'T SEEM TO BE ONE OF "ATTRACTION" PER SE. HE WOULD
EVENTUALLY CORNER THE CHICK AND FLIRT WITH HER UNTIL SHE COULD TAKE NO MORE.
UNTIL SHE GOT STUNNED

> I did a PU once on a chick using the SOIs. I found out where she
lived and
> then said "Oh that's not far from my place, so I can come down to see
you.
> It's a pity I am so busy it won't happen today"

This is good. .

THAT'S A REAL LIFE EXAMPLE OF WHAT THE WHOLE THEORY IS ABOUT. MORE
IMPORTANTLY IS THAT IT WORKED.

> (Note that there is a bit of future pacing and presuppositioning in
this)
> She lapped it up and took my kino from there - despite the BF being a
matter
> of metres away.
>
> The structure for the Guam Playboy routine went like this:-
>
> - Fun routine or opener (ala Mystery) - some basic fluff - all good
things
> about himself, what he could do for the women (he played the helpful
tour

Examples ? ?

READ SOME OF MYSTERY'S OPENERS!
TYPICALLY OFF THE WALL STUFF. WELL, WHEN HE WAS TALKING ABOUT GUAM'S CULTURE
AND PARTIES AND STUFF - FOR ALL THE TOURISTS, ALL THIS NEW INFO TO THEM IS
PRETTY OFF THE WALL.
HE WOULD TELL THE CHICKS ABOUT SOME PARTY WHERE THEY WOULD DIG A HUGE PIT
AND THROW ANIMALS ON IT IN A BIG FEAST WITH A BONFIRE AND DANCING - AND THEN
BRANCHED OUT AND TALKED ABOUT DANCING AND OTHER EXOTIC/EROTIC STUFF.

> guide). Be "Disgustingly" Charming! as he put it. The guy wasn't big
on

Like ? ?

THOSE WERE HIS EXACT WORDS. HE RELIED ON GM A LOT IN THE LATTER PART OF HIS
SEDUCTIONS.

> logically drawing out routines for what he did (which is a good
thing), he
> just went and DID this.... thus he couldn't really explain to me what
he was
> doing. I had to observe.

Yep, he's got experience.. I rarely consciously follow ManiacPlan
anymore.. just it spews out naturally.. learning PU is like learning
a foreign language/lingo.. once you get it, its natural..

I'VE BEEN LEARNING TO PLAY AFC IN MY SEDUCTIONS, AND IT HAS BEEN WORKING
REALLY WELL!

> - SOI. He said something that hinted that he was interested in the
chick
> (paced and lead from his opener conversation). This got her emotions
going

Example?  How?

OK, ANOTHER ONE.

"WOULDN'T IT BE GREAT TO SPEND TIME TOGETHER OVER COFFEE? IT'S SUCH A PITY I
HAVE TO GO TO SOME MEETINGS LATER ON, SO WE WILL PROBABLY HAVE NO TIME TO
SEE EACH OTHER EVER AGAIN BEFORE YOU GO BACK."
(WAIT FOR RESPONSE)
"BUT LET ME KNOW YOUR NUMBER ANYWAY...WHO KNOWS I MAY HAVE TIME."
(might want to save this one after you have dropped several other
SOIs)

> and her ideas racing.

Like what? which ideas? be specific please. .

ROMATIC AND/OR SEXUAL ONES.
HE WOULD START OFF ON ROMANTIC ONES AND MAKE THEM INCREASINGLY SEXUAL UNTIL
HE HIT A SEXUAL FANTASY OF HERS THAT WOULD DDB HER.
LET'S SAY "HOLDING HANDS" OR "SPENDING QUALITY TIME TOGETHER" OR "BEING
CLOSE" AND EVENTUALLY LEADING THAT INTO "TOUCHING BODIES" AND "KISSING" TO
"FUCKING" OBVIOUSLY.
A LOT OF TIME DISTORTION SOIs.

> I have found this CRITICAL if the chick is going to
> stay interested in you for too long. I bored many chicks out
initially when
> I wouldn't get to the point.
[rest deleted]

Rio, this is great stuff. Somehow I understand it.. but I need
examples of it so I can put it together as something I can try
in the field. Do you remember any specifics from this guy?

WELL, WE CAN ALWAYS WAIT FOR THE OFF-SEASON AND GO TO GUAM WITH A VCR AND
MEET THIS GUY (YOU'LL ONLY NEED ABOUT 40,000 YEN FROM TOKYO FOR A 2 DAY
TRIP) OR NEXT TIME WE MEET IN TOKYO WE CAN DO MORE STREET STUFF AND I CAN
SHOW YOU WHAT I KNOW. (I HADN'T FULLY DEVELOPED THE THEORY UNTIL AFTER MY
NIGHT OUT WITH KIPP - I OQed TOO MUCH AND FAILED TO PLACE ANY CHALLENGES
AFTER MY SOIs THAT NIGHT)
THE GUAM PLAYBOY WAS A GRANDMASTER OF STREET PU - HIS WEAKNESS WAS THAT HE
WAS A GREEDY TEAMPLAYER WITH WINGMEN.

If so, please fill in the above spaces where I ask.. it is very
important if this is to work.

Rio
-------

Using SOI’s as a way to tease/attract chicks!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Using SOI's (statements of intent) as a tease to attract a chick!


From: Jonathan Ashton 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Clearing SOI's up
Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 07:04:08 GMT

In article ,
> For example, if we were to drop an SOI on the chick, and then
> IMMEDIATELY follow up with a negative command - WE control the
> flirting so that the chick then has to work for US.
>
> So we can say things like "I want to kiss you"
> And then control the flirting by pulling away again with some reverse
> commands :-
> "BUT I don't really know anything about you, and I haven't known you
> for very long, and I need to feel love first"
> Sounds like the stuff that chicks tell us, right? Well chicks say it
> to flirt, as opposed to meaning what they say!

Omigod!  Rio, this is an awesome post!  Brilliant!  Genius!

"I was thinking about kissing you, but you'd probably slobber too
  much."
"I'd love to take you home, but I know you'd get all clingy."
"I'm just trying to guess if you're any good in bed.  Too bad you're
  too young/weird/conservative for me."
"I bet you'd love the way I do neck massages.  You've been acting up
  too much to deserve one, though."

This is so EASY!  Anyone can think these up on the spot!  There's no
need to think up ambiguous sentences or come up with just the right
innuendo.  Just make a Statement of Intentions, then let her know what
SHE has to offer to make it happen - by telling her that you won't do
it because she's not up to par!  I love it!  I will try it out ASAP!

Howcome I've never seen this idea explained before?  In retrospect,
it's clear that MrSex4uNYC and Mystery do similar stuff, but I've
never seen the dynamic explained this way before.  Ross talks about
setting challenges, but it's always seemed like such a delicate art
to say just the right thing at just the right time.

But this is so easy!  Thank you, Rio.

Ash


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

Game: Color game

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

Color Game that can be used in PU!
[Maniac note: got this other list below from the 'Secrets of the cube book'
Also very good, may be appropriate when doing this game:

Red: passion, hot energy, anger warmth
Green: hope, life, nature, money
Blue: spirituality, serenity, cool energy, sadness
Purple: royalty, deep passions, mourning
Yellow: cheerfulness, brightness, eccentricity
Pink: feminity, wamrth
Brown: earthyness, warmth, conventionality
Black: mystery
White: purity
Multicolored: of many interests or moods

END: Maniac note]

From: steviewonder 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: More personality tests
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 20:20:17 GMT

In article <904e0cjv@nnrp1.deja.com>,
  maniac_high@yahoo.com wrote:
> There is good stuff on that site.
>
> I am reworking it to be more appropriate in opener type
> PU's in bars/coffee shops, will present my results of this
> work in late January after it has all been designed and
> field tested.. It will be killer..

Hi guys,

Found this game at

http://www.geocities.com/Broadway/8546/colortest.html

a good one since all the answers are sexual:

QUESTION:

Pick the color that best describes your personality?

ANSWERS:

BLACK
Black color preferences point to black sex. These people are the
misfits of the sex world and seek each other in kinship. They tend to
prefer perverted sex, and are usually masochistic or sadistic in
nature. They are moody and often perform at their peak when under
stress or during unhappy times. Police psychologists claim that many
sex offenders prefer the color black. And it is no coincidence that
the uniform of mobsters and teenaged gangs is black.

BLUE
Lovers of blue are wonderful sex partners. They are sincere,
affectionate, and sensitive to their partner's needs. They consider
lovemaking a fine art, and their approach is elegant. Men who love
blue are like concert pianists; delicately ravaging their partner like
they would play a baby grand. Women in the blue category enjoy sex
to the fullest. They are exciting partners, but their passion might be
compared to tidal waves, rather than fiery aggresion. Both blue men
and women enjoy foreplay and the aftermath of lovemaking as much
as the act. In marriages, a blue person is a wonderful mate, never
failing to please the spouse and never seeking outside interests.

BROWN
For lovers of brown, sex is a 24-hour a day thing. They tend to say "I
love you" often enough. Snuggling by the fire, walking in the rain or
catching snowflakes on their tongue ins a turn-on to a lover of brown.
They need lots of time and privacy to make love. But their emotions
are such that one harsh word could end an affair.

GREEN
Those who prefer green are fresh and innocent in their approach to
sex. Women who love green will make love like virgins all their life.
And a man may also be a trifle clumsy and awkward, but in a charming
and endearing sort of way. Green lovers are gentle, but not
passionate. If chosen as a mate, one will never need to worry about
infidelity.

GREY
The color grey is preferred by people who are indecisive. They can't
get excited about anything - including colors - so they choose a
noncommittal shade. Men who prefer grey look at sex as a means of
relieving tension - nothing more nothing less. It's "wham, bam, thank
you ma'am". Women don't make love, they have intercourse. They
count the cracks in the bedroom plaster until the sex act is over with
and done. When a grey marries another grey, the marriage is not
exactly erotic.

ORANGE
Lovers of the color orange lean toward sexual fantasies. The sex act
is regarded as a dramatic role, a one act play in which they are the
star. Foreplay is as important as the act of love. They whisper sweet
nothings, meaningless dialogue they feel fits their image. Orange
people often do not experience orgasm - but they put on a damn good
act. Men tend to pull their partner's hair and women tend to leave
welts on their sex partner's back!

PINK
Persons who like pink show a reluctance to mature in sexual matters.
Women tend to tease; to promise more than they intend to deliver. In
some cases, they flaunt their femininity, but only because they
secretly hate men. A great percentage of prostitutes boast entire
wardrobes in pink. Men who like pink are the type who make 3 dates
for the same evening and not keep them, preferring to pick up a dish
in some bar instead.

PURPLE
Lovers of purple frequently consider themselves too regal for  fun
romp in the sack. Women sometimes are the type who hate to muss
their hair. Men are businesslike in their approach to lovemaking. In
both sexes, purple partners are more concerned with their
fulfillment then anyone else's gratification.

RED
People who like red tend to be tigers in the sack. They are easily
aroused and enjoy sex in every way imaginable. Once the sexual spark
is lit, it may take hours to extinguish. When two reds get together,
the ensuing erotica would make Lady Chatterly blush. Lovers of red
tend to be the aggressors and weaker colors should beware!

YELLOW
If you tend to favor yellow, your sexual drives are complex and lean
toward the adaptable. The favorite color of homosexuals is yellow!
But don't panic - not everyone who wears yellow is homosexual. In
most cases the person will accommodate to the stronger partner's
desires in a passive manner. You will never enjoy sex to the fullest,
but you will never turn down an invitation from someone you enjoy or
admire.

--
To email me remove the _obvious from this address:
steviewonder_ob@viousfastmail.ca

Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

Handling delusional chicks, karatebabe lives a nightmare!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Re: Mystery: delusional chicks & sympathy lies! 
Date: 11/12/2000 
Author: maniac_high  

 << previous in search  ?  next in search >>  

Re: Mystery: delusional chicks & sympathy lies!
001112
 
Mystery wrote in another post this week regarding lying
to chicks, about how not to underestimate how delusional
a chick is willing to become in order to keep her 'happy'
view of the world.
 
He is absolutely right. And this explains how seeming
'jerk' can get away with what seems like such ridiculous
shit.
 
Case in point, is where I recently did a fuckup, and then
recovered with Karatebabe (see lay report, my page). This
is the chick that would go around my place after sex
cleaning up her own hairs so that "the other chicks"
wouldnt find out about her.
 
Well, one day we are going for coffee, and she asks me
if I had been seeing another chick at the time I started
dating her. Figuring (incorrectly) from her behavior,
that this chick knew totally what the score already was,
I said I had been (wrong answer!).
 
She freaked out and went balistic at me. Shit about "how
I make her fool, go behind her back..and other shit".
In retrospect it was clear though.. she got upset, because
something she merely 'suspected' (even though it was fucking
obvious as shit, as other chicks stuff was all over the
fucking house), now became something 'confirmed', and that
shattered her entire world..
 
I then smartened up and realized what I had just done,
and recovered by saying that I dumped her after I first
started dating you (Karatebabe), a few weeks later.
 
After that, she settled down (even though every week
there was different chick stuff all over the house
after that!). She asked me about it, and I said no,
there are no chicks..
 
She said she accepted that, and that her 'nightmare'
now was over, and everything was fine again.
 
Later she found some makeup and chick stuff in the
bathroom cabinet (another chick must have slipped
it there for someone else to find it), so I had
to think fast on my feet for that one...
 
So I told her that I have a real dark secret and
she might be very disappointed in me (now she is
expecting to hear something about a chick)..
 
Then (remembering she likes gays and stuff) I tell
her that I like to make believe to dress like a girl
(lots of J-guys do it actually, so I know it is not
so far fetched here), and I have guy friends that do it
with me, and sorry I didnt tell you earlier.. (of
course this is TOTALLY false.. Maniac is not even
remotely gay, nor a crossdresser or any of that shit)...
however.. she ACCEPTED that story, and was relieved
(in spite of the fact that I was almost cracking up
when I said it, since I was SURE she would call me
on my bullshit... but she didnt)!
 
Fuck!, the totally ridiculous things you have to
tell a chick...  AND! they accept it (as they
try to internalize it and believe it at least at
some level so that their happy delusional world
doesn't come crashing to bits)..
 
Strange, isnt it..!
 
Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Using the laws of power in PU!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Toecutter, and using the laws of power!




From toecutter@mail.com Mon Oct 23 09:39:39 2000
From: "toecutter" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Lessons from Book: The 48 Laws of Power
Lines: 201


Just reading a book, The 48 Laws of Power by Robert Greene. Definitely
lessons everywhere in the book on what we do here.
The book is amoral, and open about the deception inherit in what he is
teaching. It is largely for life outside the arena of seduction, but
entrirely applicable and there are some seduction examples in it to
illustrate his points (only historical: For example the advice of Ninon de
Lenclos on seduction to the Marquis de Sevigne and what happened when the
Marquis did not follow her advice, etc.). The examples are all pulled from
the Sun Tzu (Chinese, the Art of War), European history, famous con men,
magicians and charlatans, Kings, Queens, Napoleon and other power brokers
such as Al Capone. Perfect for you guys who enjoy Machiavelli. At 450
reasonably large format pages it is fairly long.

It is going to take me several re-readings, but at the moment I see the
messages as really 3 fold: First, play your cards pretty close to your
chest. This creates mystery. The more you say, the more common you appear
and the less in control. Andy Wohol created enigma by not discussing his
work and answering questions by being intentionally vague giving people the
feeling that he was being more profound than he was.  If you do not reveal
all, people will never become bored with you or your presence because you
will continue to represent a challenge, and will be eternally interesting.
Your silence will make other people feel uncomfortable and humans are
machines of interpretation and explanation; they have to know what you are
thinking. When you carefully control what you reveal, they cannot pierce
your intentions and meaning. Your short answers will put them on the
defensive and they will jump in, nervously filling the silence with all
kinds of comments that will reveal valuable information about themselves and
their weaknesses.

This brings me to the second message. Learn everything you can about other
people. Their strengths and weaknesses, their crutches and trance words.
Their motivations. Use these to your advantage whilst revealing as little as
possible about yourself. Keep them the focus of the conversation, and be a
'Spy' on their minds by eliciting values.

The third lesson is to use smoke and mirrors to obscure your objectives and
motivations. Throw decoys out there, use gifts as Trojan horses, and be
circumspect in what is going on. Again, this throws them off your game,
gives you an upper hand.

None of this is to say that you need to be quiet or a bad conversationalist,
just the opposite, by spying and eliciting values, you are encouraging
people to talk about themselves, their own favourite subject. By being brief
about yourself you are creating mystery and interest. It is just that you
are collecting the information in order to use it against them at another
time, whilst manipulating your image and reputation in their minds and
obscuring your real motivations. In some ways it is a book on playing hard
to get while outmanoeuvring the girl. A perfect structure in which to drop
SS.

Some of the content is below. I can post more on it if you would like
further discussion; I am overflowing with ideas on it.

Toecutter.

---

To list some of the laws that are obviously applicable:

Law 3: Conceal your intentions (Keep people off balance and in the dark by
never revealing the purpose behind your actions. If they have no clue what
you are up to, they cannot prepare a defence. Guide them far enough down the
wrong path, envelop them in enough smoke, and by the time they realise your
intentions, it will be too late.)

Law 4: Always say less than is necessary

Law 6: Court attention at all costs

Law 8: Make other people come to you - use bait if necessary

Law 9: Win though your actions, never through argument. (Any momentary
triumph you win though argument is really a Pyrrhic victory: The resentment
and ill will you stir up is stronger and lasts longer than any momentary
change in opinion. It is much more powerful to get others to agree with you
though your actions, without saying a word. Demonstrate, do not explicate.)

Law 10: Infection: Avoid the unhappy and unlucky (it works the other way
also. This is an alternative take on social-proof, or pivots or whatever you
want to call them, as well as wingmen. Also advice on not getting involved
with the wrong girl.)

Law 11: Learn to keep people dependent on you.

Law 12: Use selective generosity to disarm your victim (One sincere and
honest move will cover over dozens of dishonest ones. Openhearted gestures
of honesty and generosity bring down the guard of even the most suspicious
people. Once your selective honesty opens a hole in their armour, you can
deceive and manipulate at will.)

Law 13: When asking for help, appeal to people's self interest, never to
their mercy or gratitude.

Law 14: Pose as a friend, work as a spy.

Law 16: Use absence to increase respect and honour. (Again through mystery
and not stuffing it up by staying too long and doing or saying something
wrong.)

Law 17: Keep others in suspended terror: Cultivate an air of
unpredictability

Law 18: Do not build fortresses to protect yourself - Isolation is
dangerous. (Get out there amongst them).

Law 19: Know who you are dealing with - do not offend the wrong person.

Law 20: Do not commit yourself to anyone.

Law 21: Play a sucker to catch a sucker - appear dumber than your mark. (Let
her think that she is in control and smart, less naive, don't let on you are
a player).

Law 25: Re-create yourself (Do not accept the roles that society foists on
you. Re-create yourself by forging a new identity, one that commands
attention and never bores the audience. Be the master of your own image
rather than letting others define it for you. Incorporate dynamic devices
into your public gestures and actions - your power will be enhanced and your
character will seem larger than life).

Law 26: Keep your hands clean. (You must seem a paragon of civility and
efficiency: Your hands are never soiled by mistakes and nasty deeds.
Maintain such a spotless appearance by using others as scapegoats and cat'
s-paws to disguise your involvement).

Law 27: Play on peoples need to believe to create a cult like following.
(advice in this chapter is on how to become a cult leader or maybe build a
harem. 5 strategies to your dogma! a) Keep it vague; Keep it simple b)
Emphasise the visual and sensual over the intellectual c) Borrow the forms
of organised religion to structure the group d) Disguise your income source
e) set up an us-vs.-them dynamic. I think Ross Jeffries read this one!)

Law 28: Enter action with Boldness. (If you are unsure of a course of
action, do not attempt it. Your doubts and hesitations will infect your
execution. Timidity is dangerous: Better to enter with boldness. Any
mistakes you make through audacity are easily corrected with more audacity.
Everyone admires the bold; no one honours the timid).

Law 29: Plan all the way to the end.

Law 30: Make your accomplishments seem effortless. (Your actions must seem
natural and executed with ease. All the toil and practice that goes into
them, also all the clever tricks, must be concealed. When you act, act
effortlessly, as if you could do much more. Avoid the temptation of
revealing how hard you work - it only raises questions. Teach no one your
tricks or they will be used against you .. I am breaking this rule right
here with this post, as is the Authour of the book.)

Law 31: Control the options: Get others to play with the cards you deal.
(The best deceptions are the ones that seem to give the other person a
choice: Your victims feel they are in control, but are actually your
puppets. Give people options that come out in your favour whichever one they
choose. Force them to make choices between the lesser of two evils, both of
which serve your purpose. Put them on the horns of the dilemma: they are
gored wherever they turn. Note: this is a different view on my idea of
re-framing questions. The questions are re-framed so well that the girl has
no option.)

Law 32: Play to people's fantasies.

Law 33: Discover each mans thumbscrew.

Law 34: Be royal in your own fashion: Act like a king to be treated like
one.

Law 35: Master the art of timing. (Never seem to be in a hurry - hurrying
betrays a lack of control over yourself, and over time. Always seem patient,
as if you know that everything will come to you eventually. Become a
detective of the right moment; sniff out the spirit of the times, the trends
that will carry you to power. Learn to stand back when the time is not yet
ripe, and to strike fiercely when it has reached fruition.)

Law 36: Disdain things you cannot have: Ignoring them is the best revenge.

Law 37: Create compelling spectacles. (Striking imagery and grand symbolic
gestures create the aura of power - everyone responds to them. Stage
spectacles for those around you, then, full of arresting visuals and radiant
symbols to heighten your presence. Dazzled by appearances, no one will
notice what you are really doing.)

Law 40: Despise the free Lunch.

Law 43: Work on the hearts and minds of others.

Law 44: Disarm and infuriate with the mirror effect. (The mirror reflects
reality, but is the perfect tool for deception: When you mirror your
enemies, doing exactly as they do, they cannot figure out your strategy. The
mirror Effect mocks and humiliates them, making them overreact. By holding
up a mirror to their psyches, you seduce them with the illusion that you
share their values; by holding up a mirror to their actions you teach them a
lesson. Few can resist the power of the mirror effect.)

Law 48: Assume formlessness. (By taking a shape, by having a visible plan,
you open yourself to attact. Instead of taking a form for the girl to grasp,
keep yourself adaptable and on the move. Accept the fact that nothing is
certain and no law is fixed. The best way to protect yourself is to be as
fluid and formless as water: never bet on stability or lasting order.
Everything changes.)

Disarming groups of guys around chicks!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

When lots of guys are around 1 girl, you must disarm guys!


From: "Stepleader" 
Subject: Re: She has nice/great body and/or face -- but what about her?
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2000 10:02:45 GMT

great pep talk and I love your posts ... but ...

the situ called for a disarming of the guys.  Here is how.  Approach the
group but pay NO attention to the girl.  Begin the chat with the guys and
make them interested in your story telling.  MALE BONDING comradery.  Turn
you back to HER so she feels out of place.  What you have done is removed
all the attention from her (stolen it).  You are now the center of
attention.  A couple NEGS her way challenges her.  All the other guys were
on her - all but one.  YOU.

Just so you know, this is mystery methods groupset theory and Ive done this
successfully a great # of times.

from this vantage point you may now take her  by the hand and say to the
others, "is it alright if I steal your friend away for a bit?"  they will
say yes and you take her out of earshot.  Id love you to see me work a set
like that.  its brilliant.  and PRACTICAL.

Svengali  wrote in article
<131220002147344283%Svengali_here@use.net>...
> Gentlemen, you're looking for the whole package, not just the
> packaging.  And if all you're focusing on is the packaging, she damn
> well knows it and is in control of you --period!
> 
> You must, repeat, you must be prepared to walk at all times, no matter
> how much you would like to be on/in that body and face.
> 
> Remember, you are screening her to see if she is good enough for
> you, not the other way around.  And the only way you're going to find
> out if she is good enough for you is to learn as much as you can
> about the person that is within that female form.
> 
> Am I saying you must be screening every beauty for a long term
> relationship?  Hell no!  It can be for however long you want.  But
> the moment she sees, and it won't take her long, that you are screening
> her to see whether or not she is good enough for you, is the moment
> the tables get turned and she understands that she has to make herself
> look good in your eyes.
> 
> Now contrast this with all the other guys who are trying to make
> themselves look good in her eyes, so they can get on/in her.
> 
> To illustrate what I am saying, picture this: we're in a manhattan bar,
> and there is this gorgeous looking woman, with the greatest face you've
> seen, talking to a few guys.  One happens to be our own great NYC with
> his magnificient weight-lifting body and his "I'm great" attitude; 
> another is Riker with his patterns, a third is Greg19 with his band of
> ways, and so on.  So basically what you would have is a bunch of guys
> trying to find and give this woman what she wants, so as to get on/in
> her.
> 
> Then there's Svengali, with his Carey Grant looks and ways, who sees
> the woman, walks right up into the group and says "excuse me guys, I
> just wanted to ask the lady where she got, and whose idea it was to get
> those earrings that seems to make her skin sparkle and her eyes glow,
> and then I'll leave." [Turning to her] "So please tell me, where did
> you get, and what made you decide [Svengali's hand goes out to the
> earrings, and in the process, lightly touches the lady's neck] to get
> these earrings that seems to make your skin sparkle and your eyes
> glow?"  {She tells me.}  "Thank you."  "Bye guys, I'm going back over
> there [pointing, so the lady knows where I will be]."
> 
> Look what just occurred: (1) I showed I wasn't afraid of a damn thing. 
> (2) I disarmed my opponents.  (3) I made her feel good.  (4) I showed
> her I wasn't about to hang around and try and get her.  {Of course to
> firmly establish that point, I would engage another woman in
> conversation, and have her positioned in a way that the first woman
> would see her with me, which would have her wondering what kind of nice
> things was I saying to her, that she wasn't getting.}.
> 
> Who do you think the woman is likely to be focused on and thinking
> about: all the guys who are there, still trying to get to her, or the
> guy who said what he wanted, made her feel good/great, left, and is now
> focused on someone else?  {I removed one of her feel good sources, so
> even though the others are there, with theirs, she like nearly everyone
> of us, is focused on the one that's been lost, not the ones that are
> present.}
> 
> Show your interest in her, but also show that you are walking the
> moment *she's* not exactly like you want.
> 
> Now I'll play devil's advocate and say that my little "walk away"
> didn't work.  Do you think I care?  Hell no, and I'll tell you why: the
> one who chases to gets, will always have to chase to have.  So whoever
> would win with the woman, would have to keep providing whatever they
> did to keep her interested.  I, on the other hand, only need to use a
> little charm and then walk away to have her wanting me.
> 
> I ask you, who do you think has an easier time of it?
> 
> -- 
> If you don't know in the first twenty minutes whether or not you're going
to
> have sex with the woman you just met, and whether or not you even want
to,
> you're not a seductionist.
> 
>   'o o'
> Svengali
>

Taking control when things go wrong

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



[Mystery talks about taking control in a PU when the
chick isn't reacting the way you want!]




From mystery28man@webtv.net Sat Jan  8 10:24:05 2000
From: mystery28man@webtv.net (Mystery)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: trouble with hb
Date: Wed, 5 Jan 2000 01:28:35 -0500 (EST)

dont listen to mike.  dont eject.  it IS time to lay it on the line
though.  Simply tell her you are interested in another girl.  Then kiss
her when she is feeling that rejection feeling.  take CONTROL.  girls
like that.

MAKE her yours.  if not ... THEN eject.  you at least tried your best.


Mystery

Embrace the Unknown!


From mystery28man@webtv.net Sat Jan  8 10:45:35 2000
From: mystery28man@webtv.net (Mystery)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Going sexual?
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 17:37:17 -0500 (EST)
Organization: WebTV Subscriber
Lines: 19

interesting predicament.  Hmm, looks like you arent going KINO all that
much.  As you are talking close you say, "I want to bite you" and bite
her neck and shoulder.  Then SHUT THE FUCK UP.

I noticed that ONCE I got IN with a woman it was an entire PHASE SHIFT.
It takes alot of talk to get the girl but once you notice she likes the
touching, you have to shut up.  you have to tell her to shut up too.

I can tell you realize that its a different phase.  I just wanted to
confirm that YES the line is distinct between GETTING and HAVING.  You
will find that once you have kiss closed you can behave entirely
different from then on and its not unusual (although you may be thinking
it is)


Mystery

Embrace the Unknown!