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Maniac uses a power opener to intro/tongue down

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Maniac uses a power opener to meet and tongue down a chick!


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Maniac meets HBOrderMe! Bar PU
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 05:00:36 GMT

Maniac meets HBOrderMe! Bar PU
001215

This is an interesting bar PU. .
used it to not lay the chick, but to get higher rapport
with the other guys around.

It is bo-nen-kai (end of year party) season in Japan.
After the party (boring, in a big hotel ballroom)
we go to the ni-ji-kai (after party) in a bar/disco
in Roppongi with a bunch of my coworkers (mostly guys,
and some ladies).

One AFC guy is really into this HB. He is making every
AFC mistake in the book (saying she is pretty, sucking
up to her..blah). Progress is really slow.

Me and all the guys are watching. He gets frustrated and
leaves for a bit. I move in on the chick (she is wearing
a high cut black dress, and fishnet stockings... very cute).

My opener is the strawberry game.. I just go up to her,
and say 'imagine you are in a field, and you see a strawberry
field ahead of you, with a fence around.. how high is the
fence'. She goes right into it.

Then I do the interpretation (see strawberry game post
for the game and interpretation) for her. I ask her what
she thinks (she said 1m high fence, 50 strawberries, sorry
to the farmer). She disagrees the interpretation. Then I
ask her what is your idea guy like (brad pitt). Then I say
besides his looks why you like him. Reply: he is really
guy.

Then I ask, what do you want most in a guy's character.
She says, 'I want him to lead, to decide for me what to do.'
Good.. Maniac keeps that in mind for what comes next. .

AFC guy comes back, and I let him have his chick back for
a while. He is doing more regular AFC stuff, though he
has at least initiated kino.. very good. He does this for
like 20 minutes, but isn't really breaking through.

He gets frustrated, goes. I tell the guys 'watch this',
and go up to the chick, and say I am going now, give me a
kiss. I get a cheek kiss.

I look straight into her eyes, and tell her 'thats not
good enough, look into my eyes.. what do you see.. now
give me a real kiss..' a long tonguedown with sexual kino
ensues.. Everyone else sees what I just did, after spending
not even a total of 5 minutes talking with this chick
from before.

I leave the chick, and go back to the guys.. 'that is how
it is supposed to be done'. Respect of me from my guy co-workers
now goes up 10x from whatever it was before, and was visibly
different in the office the next day.

AFC co-worker comes back and tells me how so much he is
in love with this girl (I guess he knew her from before as
a friend or co-worker or something..not sure.. I had never
met her before though). As a result, I defer to him, and let
him get AFC'd out.

I go back to the other guys, and just say, I could take her
(she lives really close actually, so I could just say I
live far and can I crash at her place.. I am sure the answer
would have been yes) whenever I want. They say 'why dont you'?

I reply, well, AFC guy is really into her, and he is a coworker
of mine who I respect, so I dont want to take his chick away
from him. There are lots of chicks to fuck, and this one means
nothing to me at all, but she is important to him, so best to
leave it at that.

I go on to say that all I wanted to know is that I COULD take her
home if I want (and I might next week or something, I got her
number) and now I know that, so it is enough for me, I dont
need more.

Respect from co-workers now goes up another 10x for this, because
I and they KNOW that this is true after what they just saw. .

He continues to AFC for a long while, and I get tired and go
home. Next day I hear that she blew him out almost as soon as I
left.

Now this was cool, because the goal wasn't really to lay the
chick (which I still might if I decide to see her again), but to
increase stature with co-workers, which can help in other ways
in my regular life.

Now one thing to note, is that I cannot do this every time (heck
not even close.. this is like the 3rd or 4th time it has ever happened
so directly like this). I was
really lucky, because of what she said to my 'what you like in
guy question', it was just so EASY to know what this chick
expected me to do, and it was really easy to stage it to happen
in front of all the other guys once I clued in on this.

I WISH I could do it everytime, but life isnt really like that ;-)
Mr. SMooth can do it though!

Constructive comments and opinions welcome!
Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Using the ‘color’ game to PU!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Using the 'color game' to do a PU!


From: tonymcneill@my-deja.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Colours Game - opinions?
Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 00:43:35 GMT

 Hi Guys,

I've just field tested this pattern / game for creating an erotic and
horny state - worked a dream:) I'd be interested to know what you think
of this and how it might be improved.....

I suppose it might work best with the more visually thinking babes.

This is not a 'word for word' pattern by any means, by the way - I just
kind of found myself going into it on the fly.....  here we go..

The PUA "notices" the colour (UK spelling by the way for those who might
feel the urge to correct me) of an object, item of clothing etc.

PUA - "I find these yellow walls (or whatever) quite uplifting;
especially in the winter. Isn't it nice to have some bright colours
around when it's so grey and dark outside?" "Do you think that colours
have an big effect on peoples' moods?".

HB - "Oh, yes, definitely."

PUA - "Hmmm. I was just wondering......I mean....... I was in one of
those New Age shops recently and they were selling lots of different
coloured sunglasses.... with the idea that, if you wanted to feel more
of a certain mood, or to look at the world in a certain way, you would
slip on a pair of sunglasses which would colour everything you looked at
in the desired tone" "Do you think that could work in any way?"

HB - "Well, maybe. I don't know really"

PUA - "Well, for example, my bedroom is a very pale blue colour and I
find this particular blue very restful" "I mean, can you imagine
sleeping very well in a pale blue room?" "Imagine you are really tired,
you know when your eyelids are heavy and you curl up with that fantastic
feeling of at last ... just letting go.... and .....giving
yourself...to....(sp perhaps?).. sleep'" "Do you have a sense of a
particular colour when you imagine that feeling?" (Make sure she's
imagining being sleepy).

HB - "Oh, maybe blue, or green" (or whatever). (If she doesn't come up
with one then maybe she could be asked to imagine the perfect colour for
a bedroom, but both of the HB subjects I tried got right into it.)

PUA "How about when you feel....really full of great ideas...... like
you have all sorts of inspiration flowing through you.?"

PUA then procedes to get HB to imagine a few other states (feeling very
inspired and spiritual (commenting on her choice of colour in a playful
way)...... bursting with energy ...... feeling very sensual,
relaxed and open (we're getting closer, gentlemen)......and eventually,
 being full of passion and horny), and slowly visualising a colour with
each one.

You get the picture - guiding her into these states,
comparing colours etc etc. I have tried this on two chicks, both of whom
LOVED the game and got right into imagining the states. One of them was
an ex who is of great value as a pivot / social proof (and a friend) so
I was testing the game with her rather than going for the lay and the
other HB, in spite of being pretty shy, blushed madly and was VISIBLY
remembering the joy of being fucked until she screamed with pleasure ;)
(At this point Tony is feeling a bit fucking pleased with himself).
I think this would have definitely resulted in a fuck had I not been
meeting her at lunchtime before going off to work :( (at this point Tony
is disgusted as well as pleased!!)

What do you 'real' PUAs think of this little game? As I said I somehow
went into it on the fly after having the idea while practicing
improvising patterns while driving, using things I saw on the road as
starting points for pattern-talk. So it's pretty new and I, as yet,
claim only to be a humble RAFC. Going to test it some more and post the
results....



Any suggestions or comments?

Tony

--
'Action' is the magic word

Setting up the Kiss Close

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

A way to set up the kiss close

From: erosla77@aol.com (ErosLA77) Ross Jeffries
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 26 Dec 2000 19:23:44 GMT
Subject: Re: What if...

>Subject: Re: What if...
>From: eclipse19@my-deja.com
>Date: Tue, Dec 26, 2000 12:04 AM
>Message-id: <929jdt$u6t@nnrp1.deja.com>
>
>In article <9299s4$o03@nnrp1.deja.com>,
>  charnel1278@my-deja.com wrote:
>> Hey all,
>>
>> I've checked out a Maniac's, and some others websites and most say
>that
>> when you ask "Do you wanna kiss me?", you're guaranteed a kiss, unless
>> you get a flat out NO.  None, from what I saw, said what to do when
>you
>> get that NO.  Do you continue on the conversation like nothing
>> happened? Do you come back with a similar question later in the
>> evening?  If so, won't she kinda feel that you're badgering her?
>> Granted, this won't happen often, but what if?....
>>
>> Laters.
>
> the standard (canned) reply to a "no" answer is "YOU really know how
>to ruin a moment....your old boyfriends must have hated that about you"
>I think i got this off tony or maniac's site, forget which one. I
>havent ran into a direct "no" answer myself so i havent field tested
>this, but im sure others have. From what i read(or remember anyhow)
>this will leave them stunned and they will show less resistance against
>another kiss.
>
>

 Hmmm......well, I like this "you really know how to ruin a moment" response
WITHOUT asking for the kiss first. "Asking" for anything, outside of the
presence of fun(as in, on the spur of the moment saying, "Hey...wouldn't it be
fun to go to a strip club? Let's go!))  seems pretty pathetic to me.  

    A good one is to notice her giving you that look and then say(and I got
this from a student, it is NOT mine).  "If ? were to ask you on a scale of one
to ten, how good a kisser are you, what would you say?"

 Listen for her answer, then say, "If you were to kiss me right now, how do you
think I'd rate you?"

  You do this ONLY when you see "the look".......

  "let's find out" you say and kiss her.  

IF she backs away from that, then the "you really know how to ruin a moment"
comment works great.  Come to think of it, this could really work for a
cancellation as well. 

---

From: "General Snafu" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: What if...
Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2000 22:57:08 GMT

If she says no to a kiss, ask for a BJ.  If she says no to the BJ, you are
SOL for the night.

 wrote in message
news:9299s4$o03@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Hey all,
>
> I've checked out a Maniac's, and some others websites and most say that
> when you ask "Do you wanna kiss me?", you're guaranteed a kiss, unless
> you get a flat out NO.  None, from what I saw, said what to do when you
> get that NO.  Do you continue on the conversation like nothing
> happened? Do you come back with a similar question later in the
> evening?  If so, won't she kinda feel that you're badgering her?
> Granted, this won't happen often, but what if?....
>
> Laters.
>
>
> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/

Game: The Wall and the Forest

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Maniac introduces "The Wall and the Forest", a PU game.



From maniac_high@yahoo.com 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Game: The wall and the forest
Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 16:18:24 GMT

Another one of those mindfuck games like 4 questions or the cube:

"The Wall and the Forest"

-You are walking in a field, you see a wall, how high is it, and
how do you get by it? [wall = pride, and also how you get past
obstacles]

-you continue walking, and you see a house [kind of house you dream
to have later in life]

-you see a key on the ground, you go to the house, does the key
open the door? [if yes, means you can get married]

-you go in the house (if you were able to open with the key), and
 on the first floor you see a table and chairs, how many chairs are
 there? [means how many people in your future family]

-now you go outside, and see to one direction a dense dark forest, and
 the other way, a less dense/brighter wooded area. Which way do you
 go? (dark forest=expect something, but unknown, take a chance)
     (bright wooded area=easygoing style/way)

-as you walk you then see a lake nearby. How big is it, and how deep
 is it? (big=size of your heart, depth=depth of your heart)

THE END


This game could be lethal for chicks who want to get married or
something like that. Make sure you answer the right answers when
you tell her "what your answers were" after you finish her turn!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Game: Forest

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Nightlight introduces 'forest game'!



From: nightlight9@hotmail.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: More like "4 questions" game?
Date: Thu, 02 Nov 2000 19:50:10 GMT

You mention all these, but most of them are not very useful in the
initial meeting because they are too cerebral and too random.  Try ones
that are more viceral.  You are walking in a dark forest.  How do you
feel.  (how she approaches life).  You could to a wall with a door.
What do you do? (how she approaches obsticalls).  You look down and see
a cup on the ground what is it made out of? (how she views wealth).
You come to some water, describe it. (how she views sexuality).
Always end with sexuality because it is  a good topic for PU and
demonstrates you are comfortable with women and people a sexual context.

BookGuy, my comments are based on experience and field testing.  Please
do the same if you reply.

--
NightLight9
Just be yourself... smooth with interesting questions and interesting
answers.

Game: Strawberry Fields

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Maniac introduces a PU game: Strawberry Fields!
[Note, this originally comes from the book 'Kokology']


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Game!: Strawberry fields
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 08:02:40 GMT

Game!: Strawberry fields
001117

This is a game to find out some things about how chicks
see sex. It is very popular in Japan & is a good state
transitioner

--

Intro: Hey, lets play a game!

Imagine you are alone in a field, and see a straberry field
in front of you with tasty strawberries.

There is a fence/gate around the field. How high is it?
(= how easy is this girl/guy to take sex)

Now you are in the straberry field, how many straberries
do you take?
(=how many BFs/GFs that person wants)

Ok, after you have finished enjoying the strawberries,
how do you feel about the farmer, who's field you took them
from?
(=how you feel to that person after fucking them)


The end

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

TPUA night PU’s HB Smallmouth and converts to a lay!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

[TPUA PU's a chick at night, and converts it into a lay!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com
]


Date Posted: 2000/09/25 05:21:37 AM EDT
Author: Tokyopua 
Subject: Re: HB Small Mouth PU  (Was Re: Calling all Tokyo PUA's)

Hey Maniac,

I didnt really intend that last post of mine as a field report, since it
wasnt too detailed.  But yeah, things have been going well on the PU despite
my severely limited time. So I will attempt a bit of a field report on the
initial PU here.  My PU efficiency factor has been really high recently,
maybe because I am only trying to PU when I feel really confident and often
times when I wasnt planning on it, so was really relaxed. I did a PU on a 19
year old HB college student in the train the other night and got her home
phone number.  It was easy cause she was reading Tokyo Classified, and I
asked her about it. I was really confident, and in only 2 stops got her to
really dig me.  In fact, when I asked her why she had studied English, she
said "So I could meet a guy like you!"  The only problem is finding time to
meet her again before I leave.

The PU I did on HB Small Mouth was not planned either, I just saw her
walking back home around my place at midnight, and somehow knew that despite
my frazled appearance after 2 hours of Jujitsu practice and carrying 40
pounds of luggage, I could do the PU on her.  My opening line was "I like
your hair" which I knew was lame and she must have heard often, but hey,
thats the price of using the 3 second rule sometimes.  I immediately
followed with asking her if she was a student, what kind of work she did,
etc.  Oddly, I didnt use my standard opener "Do you speak english" in the
whole conversation.  I will post my personal notes on the rest of the PU at
the end of this post just for reference, but they arent too coherent.  They
were the basis though for the plans I laid for the successful next date that
got me laid 3 days later.  (If I have time someday I will write up full
notes on that too.) Total time to lay in terms of time invested was
approximately 3.5 hours, about the same as HB Physics, my other recent
street PU who I did that same day.  This efficiency is possible if the
progression is done just right, I think.

 wrote in message news:8qfler$o1r@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Tokyo PUA,
>
> This is an excellent report.. You really rock!
>
> Where / how did you originally
> PU this chick though? Also, taking the chick over to see your
> weight training stuff is a clever idea.. liked that..!
> BTW, I thought you left already to the USA, how long are you still
> there for?

Right near my house in a dark alley at midnight on her way home!  She told
me later (post lay) that she was scared at first, but I had a really relaxed
attitude so she got comfortable with me afterwards.  As for the weight
training stuff later, it was great kino as I had her bend over slightly and
got right behind her to "help her with her form" while simultaneously
letting her slightly feel the form of my stiff wood pressed against her, and
other such intimate situations.

Still here till Oct 14 or so, with a trip to Taiwan and maybe Hawaii too
thrown in.

>
> ALso, do you usually go out alone, or with a wing. I noticed that
> you knew quite a few people in Roppongi, I guess you get out there
> quite a bit?

Been out there a lot since last February, maybe 10 times or so.  I guess
predominantly I go with a wing, but sometimes felt it screwed up my game.
Of course, my wings didnt know anything about seduction a la ASF, thats
probably why.  Of course, neither did I till June... I know Im much better
at street PU when alone though, thats for sure!  OTOH, when I went out to
clubs with you and Rio, I think my game was really improved and I was
learning all the time.
BTW, I have heard that someplace called club Earth near hamamatucho has
really hot babes, (bitch shield too, but who cares, right;-), so you guys
might want to check that out.  3000 Yen cover charge.  May be the new
alternative to Fura?

>
> > I managed to lay that HB Small Mouth
>
> EXCELLENT!
>
> >Ganbatte!  Im seeting HB Bi this weekend again (tonight), and HB
> >small the next day, and my ex-GF the next.  Im starting to feel like
> >Maniac juggling girls, but nothing will happen w/ my ex, so its not
> >so bad.
>
> Yes, I did that ALOT last year, and fucked a shitload of chicks that
> I cant even count now..
>
> but its really tiring and you do get sick of it after a while..
> so finally I just MLTR'd a few that I really liked, who also accepted
> that I fuck other chicks, and left it at that.. guess I got to get out
> more ;-)
> not sure if its the right way yet, but been doing it that way
> the last few months now.. We'll see ;-)

I think it goes in cycles.  Eventually you get tired of the MLTR's and have
to replace them.  To do that you will have to PU lotsa new chicks, lay them,
see if they dont eject when you break the news that there are others.  That
takes a lot of time, so then you want to go back to the easy life of having
a bunch of girls on call.  Then the cycle starts over.  Im just beginning to
get these girls into MLTR status, but now I have to leave.  But theres
always business trips ack here!

>
> If you are planning on hanging around TOkyo though, you should
> bring HB Bi and her friend to one of our fuck parties the next time..
> sounds like they'd be a good time.. maybe introduce them to Kipp or
> something since I am not there right now, before you leave.. or
> give me your departure date and see if they are interested and we
> can setup something with all the ladies, if this is your sort of thing..

Id consider it, but it will take more effort, and probably wont be anything
I can do until after Im gone and come back for business trips.  You see, I
worked it too good with HB Bi.  She is signing her letters with "Love" at
the end and is all into me now.  Made me the most awesome meal any woman has
ever made me, washed my clothes, gave me an amazing massage, etc.  When I
confronted her about our last threesome, she said that she felt jealous when
she saw me doing her friend, and claimed that was the only time she had ever
done something like that, that she isnt really Bi.
So right now I think she somehow sees a relationship in this, despite my
leaving?  I figure once Im gone I can get past that as reality sinks in and
maybe set up more stuff for any business trips I make back.

>
> Good post!
>
> Maniac
> http://www.pickupguide.com

Here are those notes I was talking about, for what they are worth:

-------------------------------------------
PU of HB Small:  happened in a dark alley shortcut to my house at midnight,
I approached carrying a 30 pound backpack on one shoulder and a 10 pound
bucket of protein powder in the other, and said,  $B!H (BExcuse me, your hair is
really beautiful. $B!I (B  She reacted favorably and said thanks, but kept
walking, slightly faster.  She seemed young, so I asked if she was a
student.  She said no, I asked what she does.  She said she works for a
cable company, I fluff talked about watching TV.  She asked what I do.  I
said I know its late but you should have coffee or tea with me at Jonathans
restaurant nearby.  She said no, so I said, OK, how do we meet again.  She
said give me your number and I said,  $B!H (BAh, but I know women, if I give you
my number you will get nervous and never call. $B!I (B  She said  $B!H (BNo, 
that wont
happen I promise. $B!I (B  I knew I didn $B!G (Bt have enough rapport or 
anything to
believe that, so really what I was just doing was stalling till I could set
up a firm date.

I got a pen and wrote my number and at this point we are standing on the
corner near my place.  I play on Japanese cuteness and write my name with
hearts by it.  (None of this is stuff I would be able to do in the US.)
Then I say, OK, when are we going to meet.  Its sort of a way to pace the
ongoing reality now that she has my number,its a logical extension.  The
number is just a formality to me, I want to set up the date.  After some
negotiation, I get a date set up for 6 PM Tuesday, her day off.  I had given
her alternatives between my place and eating in Tachikawa nearby (but both
already had the presuppostion that we are meeting for a date, so I don $B!G (Bt
care which she chooses).  She chose Italian in Tachikawa which is perfect
cause eating carbs increases seratonin (=relaxation), so I will lay on the
patterning after a while, maybe even order a glass of wine (more seratonin
and romance) for us both.  Then its a 5 minute taxi ride back to my place!

Anyway, we keep talking.  I get that she never has met a foreigner, that she
likes Richard Gere, cause he is  $B!H (BShibui $B!I (B. $B!! (B(=quiet, simple, 
sober,
tasteful, austere, parsimonious, etc.)  I asked her about her ideal man
while doing the (SP) thing.  She really accessed a lot and I was awakening
her creative centers.  I touched her a lot on the arm to anchor the good
feelings.   She said she really was too ideal, but that her ideal guy was
like her father, sweet and nice.  I asked if she wanted a guy who made her
feel safe, and she said yes.  I compared our hand sizes and got kino,
remarked at how small her hands were, that my big hands could protect her.
Complemented her smile and said that it seems like her eyes smile too and
she said that she is often told that.  She said I was skillful at
complementing and I said that I really meant it.

I mirrored her body positions a lot and this seemed to have a good effect.
She seemed really into it and wasn $B!G (Bt trying too hard to get away despite 
it
being after midnight and having to work the next day, only bringing up the
time when I did.  She was rubbing her earlobe, and later playing with her
ponytail in a really sexy way, all with the doggy dinner bowl look.
I also showed kanji ability and had her write her name, and demonstrated how
we could study English together, all using the Zaurus.  (BTW, Did you buy
one yet, Maniac? A useful tool in many ways.  You can turn it into a
portable digital photo album too, albeit poor quality...) She liked that.
At one point she asked what was in the bucket, I said protein powder and she
said  $B!H (Bnomitai! $B!I (B and I said  $B!H (B5 fun dake areba, nomeru 
yo. $B!I (B
(If you have 5
minutes I can give you a taste).  But she refused to go to my apartment and
I didn $B!G (Bt press the issue, I just reconfirmed our fun date on Tuesday, and
gave her a kiss goodnight, then took off.
----------------------------------

-T

ASF reader comments on above story

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website: 

http://www.pickupguide.com 

Many excellent followups to the Psychicbabe re-lay report!
Mrsex4unyc, RJ..etc..etc.

From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:05 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

In article <92jvre$obh@nnrp1.deja.com>, maniac_high@yahoo.com writes:

>The immediate gold to take care of this, is to now make the
>relationship very high stakes for her. I can do this because
>I know that she is into me (from what she said at the dinner),
>so the idea is to play it that if she doesnt do her job as a
>chick.. she will lose EVERYTHING as far as I am concern.
>Ok, that is the plan, here we go:

plan or no plan, essentially, you are telling her the truth.  on a long-enough
timeline, the survival rate for EVERYONE is ZERO.  sooner or later, everyone
you love will either leave you or die.  chicks don't seem to believe in this,
though it is the absolute truth.  they think that they can relate to you
FOREVER, REGARDLESS of what they do or how they act.  you are telling her HOW
she can REMAIN with you and what is going to get her EJECTED.  even though it
takes a long time, so it doesn't SEEM like this... this is what has happened to
EVERY chick's relationship that has gone away.  EVENTUALLY, she was not
fulfilling her womanly duties and her man left her for a   chick (younger,
sexier, richer, swallower...)  EVEN if she IS fulfilling her duties, if her man
like it from another chick MORE, she loses out either in a PERCENTAGE of her
benefits or she gets DUMPED and loses ALL of her benefits.  you are merely
explaining this to her and telling her what she needs to do IF she wants to be
with you... which you have already determined.  you are SELLING, and now you
are screening her to see if she is QUALIFIED and ABLE to buy.

>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations
>in relationship. 

I am getting to the point where I am going to do this.  I never do this with
chicks because I morph into whatever THEY are looking for and hook them that
way.  the thing for me is that being 10 months in with MLTR, she has REALLY
learned how to please me and the time I spend TEACHING her has become minimal
and the time I spend ENJOYING her is increasing :)  it is getting tougher and
tougher for other chicks to get my attention, because anything LESS than what I
have already is BULLSHIT to me.  the time I am spending talking to chicks is
mostly eliciting values and breaking their perceptions... just for fun :)  I
know IMMEDIATELY if I want sex from a chick, and if I don't, she is IMMEDIATELY
LJBF and I use her for practice and NEXT her at the end of the conversation.

I am seriously going to consider moving to a "demonstration of value -> SOI"
model, just because I have lost my patience with LISTENING to these bitches
talking about shit that really doesn't mean anything.  I know I am going to
NEXT them ANYWAY as soon as I realize they can't compete with MLTR, so why
listen to their shit FIRST?  I may as well let them know how great I am and
let them know what kind of woman I am willing to accept, and let them continue
from there.  there is also the cognitive dissonance issue of them KNOWING that
I am going to dump them if they are not sexy and CONTINUING to talk to me and
get to know me.  the more they talk to me, the more I hook them into
interacting with me.  the more they get hooked, the greater the PAIN OF
SEPERATION (credit: RJ) when they eventually get EJECTED.  since they KNOW
ahead of time what will get them ejected and they are still talking, they are
either planning to get in line OR setting themselves up for pain.  either way,
after SOI and their acceptance of the terms, there will have to be some sort of
TEST of their compliance.  even listening to what they have to say after SOI
counts as a REWARD for their entering into a "relationship" with me.  hmm... I
will consider this more.

>I go on to tell her that other girls I know also
>like me, ask me out alot, (doesn't matter if it is true or not,
>but chick 'competition logic' will kick in, and it will scare
>your mark to act). 

the reason I don't use this is that MLTR is an integral part of my life.  if I
were to play this "chicks dig me" card, it would belittle the actual
relationship I have with MLTR.  the only problem with THAT is that I am
screening for MORE MLTRs :)  I don't give a fuck about ONS because I can get
laid ANY NIGHT within an hour of talking to the chick I am talking to... in the
WAY I want to with a chick that I WANT TO FUCK :)  a chick offering me ONS is
like a chick offering me a dollar bill.  I already HAVE dollar bills... what do
I want hers for?  of course, there are some chicks that are just so HOT that
you want to try them out, but barring that scenario, ONS can bring you much
more ANGUISH than the satisfaction that accompanies it... PLUS it is the SAME
SATISFACTION that I already get on a regular basis from MLTR. 

besides... it is OBVIOUS that chicks dig me because here SHE is, liking me
within 20 minutes of meeting me... what about the chicks that have experienced
me for days?  months?  years?  OH, she could only HOPE to be one of those! :)

for you, it is a good tactic though.

>Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>her last week, apparently).

I lost a rap to a low-self-esteem bitch that had a couple of relationships like
this as well.  I mean, I fucked her, but I didn't get to MLTR like I wanted
because she was SCARED that she wouldn't match up to the next bitch and that I
would NEXT her for no reason, like her exes did.  I tried to tell her I wanted
her for more than that, but she wasn't emotionally healthy enough to understand
or believe me.

>Ok, now Maniac has reached her head, and I take this deeper..
>I go on to tell her that I dont want just sex, I want rocks and gold
>I can get any girl in roppongi on a Saturday night and fuck her
>(not exactly true, but she doesnt know this.. goal is just to

she KNOWS that it happened to her VERY QUICKLY.  she ASSUMES she was not the
ONLY bitch to fall for you that quickly.  it is like reverse-social-proof. 
fucking a bitch FAST makes them think you can fuck other bitches FAST.

>'confirm' her worst fears so that she acts), but its not enough for
>me. I want connection, good sex, and romance, with an intelligent
>woman, and that is why I want to date you (psychicbabe).

nice line.  this is another thing I will consider.  talking-up MLTR to them.  
I never considered this either, MAINLY because if you tell a chick what you
want her to do then you never know if she is manipulating you by being that
way, or if she arrived there NATURALLY... on her own.  interesting, LOTS of
style-change material happening right around the new year :)

>Then all of the sudden, she asks me about HBass (the chick staying
>at my place over the holidays), and freaks out about it. I tell
>her that she already knows all this, and exactly what is her point
>here?

although I am a GREAT fan of "quoting", I find that there need to be times to
engage in it and times to NOT engage in it.  this will depend on what you want
with the chick.  it is the same way you can't go from being a CHUMP to a MAN in
a chick's eyes... but you CAN go from being a MAN into a CHUMP :)  if you start
out telling a chick that you have a girlfriend AND that you fuck her, you leave
yourself open for these pot-shots whenever chicks trip the fuck out and go into
their irrational rants from out of left-field.  all a bitch needs to know is
that you are "taken" so that you manage her relationship expectations.  any
more information and she feels like you will give her ALL the information. 
where does it stop?  are you going to tell her that you are fucking her?  that
you fucked her last night?  that you fucked her an hour before coming on this
date?  that you fucked YOUR WOMAN in her ass?  that she LIKES sucking dick? 
WHERE DOES IT STOP?

I ran into this problem with a chick where my relationship to her was BASED ON
trading current sex-stories.  when I got to the point where I didn't want to
tell her any more shit, she was EXPECTING me to tell her, and I realized that
if I wasn't telling her, and she wasn't telling me, then our "relationship" was
OVER.  before that, I had not realized how much I had compromised my position
by telling her CURRENT sex-shit.  think about it, and decide on your own LIMITS
to what you are willing to tell a chick about other chicks... besides, think
about the fact that she is going to KNOW that she will end up as STORIES to
other bitches right after you fuck her.  it will make her VERY self-conscious
about whatever she does with you and that could hinder her emotional states
tremendously.

>Then she stops again, and asks me if I am fucking her (maybe I
>should have said no..., but I had already said yes to her about this
>the first time I saw her)., she asks me why.. (I tell her because
>I am seeing her! like I told you the first time! I mean what do
>you expect?!?).
>
>She then puts on her bitch face, and talks in a stern voice,
>"then call me when you break her up, that is my decision, I am
>going home.".

THIS is retarded because she ALREADY knew that you were fucking her AND she
fucked you herself.  this is another problem with bitches having information
about other bitches.  they use it against themselves.  IMO, the purpose of her
knowing you have another girl or SEVERAL other girls is so she knows where she
stands in the RACE to be your MAIN BITCH.  if you are single, she has a good
chance at being that to you.  if you are "taken" she has NO CHANCE of being
that to you.  if you are SEEING bitches, then she has to COMPETE to be your #1.
 other than THAT, I think giving information about your other bitches is a
mistake...  I have made the SAME mistake up to this point, so I am not
crisicizing :)  however, I am changing that ASAP and I think you should
consider giving out information on a N2K basis (need to know).

besides, SHE is the one that NEEDS a fuck.  if it is not coming from YOU, a guy
she has fucked ALREADY and she LIKES how you did it or she wouldn't have come
back... she has to get it from a STRANGER whose sexual skills are in question
that might tie her up, fuck her in the ass or sell her to the highest bidder. 
bitches like to FRONT a lot about having ALL these sexual choices, but with all
the 8s, 9s, and 10s I have spoken to on an honest "one of the chicks" level,
they are ALL looking to have an EXCITING time, but not REALLY be in DANGER! 
you, OTOH have pussy AT HOME IN BED WAITING FOR YOU!  the only one to lose out
if she bails... is HER!  knowing that, I would have not even entertained her
bullshit OR called her on it, letting her know that I was getting laid tonight
REGARDLESS of whether SHE fucks or not.  that would take the fucking WIND out
of her sails :)

>I tell her I am planning to break her up (which is true) later, so
>it is nothing you should worry about. 

this, my friend :)  is a COP-OUT!  it is used VERY EFFECTIVELY by married men
to keep fucking their side-bitches, but WE are way above bullshit tactics like
this.  I commend you for thinking of this "on the fly", but PLEASE, PLEASE! 
hehe  I have MUCH more respect for you as a PUA than to hear some CRAP like
this from you :)  PLEASE think of something better for the next instance of a
chick trying to BLACKMAIL you into trading in a R-E-L-A-T-I-O-N-S-H-I-P where
you are getting EVERYTHING you want from a chick... for a ONS with HER! 
HAHAHAHAHAHA  >:)

I haven't run into a chick STUPID enough to try to disrespect my MLTR for being
with me... chicks have STARTED to say she is dumb for "letting" (as if she has
ANY say in the matter) her man fuck other chicks, and I have BROKEN THEIR
FUCKING ASSES listing the benefits that SHE is getting that they will most
likely NEVER have with a man... EVER!  and CERTAINLY don't have right now, or
they would not be talking to me in a bar... they would be with THEIR OWN MAN
conducting this FANTASY RELATIONSHIP that they are professing that my MLTR
should have :)  I have NEVER run into a chick that has even TRIED to break into
my relationship with MLTR because they KNOW I mean business.  all they can do
is become ANOTHER MLTR... and after they hear the QUALIFICATIONS, they KNOW
they can't even achieve THAT... only ONS and LJBF with me.  if some bitch EVER
suggested that I break up with MLTR in order to ONS her, I would  A) laugh in
her face and  B) immediately demand an EXPLANATION of the reasons why she
thinks she can knock MLTR out of the box AND make her perform ANY AND ALL
SKILLS that she CLAIMS to be better than MLTR at IMMEDIATELY!  put up or SHUT
THE FUCK UP!  the result would be the ONS ANYWAY, and she would still be LJBF
or NEXT because MLTR is NOT about sex... it is about compatability and I
PERSONALLY could not be with some bitch that needs to knock other chicks off in
order to gain status.  I gain status by BEING MYSELF and letting bitches make
INTELLIGENT, EDUCATED decisions to be with me.  any chick that wants to be with
me had better do the same.

>she gets upset, and starts
>screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
>just like her ex-bf, getting other girls while dating her, and how
>all guys just want sex..etc..

I would have told her "you wanna calm the fuck down?"  throwing tantrums and
making scenes are expressions of her ability to do ANYTHING in your presence. 
I personally don't tolerate that.

>Then she says.. ok, if you let me meet your GF at your house
>tonight, then I will let you have sex with me. [ha! I got her!]

ok.  thank God I happened to read the next line before I started typing this. 
I was JUST going to ask you WHY you are STILL letting her blackmail you into
fucking her... ESPECIALLY when she is the one that needs it and you don't :)

>I bounce back, and say, "what exactly makes you think I am
>desperate to have sex with you tonight?! Do you think I am
>just some stupid guy and you can manipulate me like that?
>No, you will not meet my GF, it is disrespectful to her to do
>that. You know the situation, it was clear to you from the
>beginning, and you accepted it. There is no more to talk about.
>I am not here only for sex, I can get that anywhere. Sex only
>of itself is of little value to me, I want more than that.

SWEET!  :)  break her fucking ASS maniac :)

>I then bring out the nuclear weapons! My tonality is very firm,
>and I eye fuck her, while telling her the following. First, I tell
>her that I already told her about my GF, she was clear about it
>right from the start, and she has NO excuse. Then I go on to tell
>her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
>that did NOT happen. So do NOT compare me to your ex. I am a
>different person, and EXCEPT better treatment than that if you
>ever want to see me again. She starts crying more, and hugging
>again.

ugh :/   fucking IDIOTS!   man, the shit some bitches put you through!  does
everyone SEE why we have to study this shit?

>I put her against wall, and tell her not to complain about me like
>I am her ex, I a am different person than he is.
>
>I tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>alone!

this is a good point.  I like to play it the other way:

ok... so now, you have told me that you want everything to be a 'perfect'
situation with a guy before making a move.  You want him to be ideal with
women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady... WHAT MAKES YOU THINK
HE WILL WANT YOU?   WHAT ARE YOU BRINGING TO THE TABLE THAT IS GOING TO MAKE A
MAN LIKE THAT CHOOSE YOU OVER ANY OTHER CHICK?

you wanna see some confusion?  you wanna see a bitch get BROKEN?  HAHAHAHA  >:)
 of course, I use this on chicks that I am just practicing on, because it
normally induces DEPRESSION, not horniness.  when they have to GO DEEP INSIDE
and dive BELOW THE SURFACE of their programming, they realize that they CAN NOT
TELL ME WHY A MAN WOULD WANT THEM!  they stall the fuck out dude :)  it's
amazing.  matter of fact, it's documented already.  look at my recent thread
with "telembe".  I let her say all this bullshit about what she wanted from a
guy in order to give up her virginity, then when she was finished talking about
what she WANTED, I asked her what she was OFFERING to a guy that was going to
give her all this committment and "love" and other bullshit and she said a
whole bunch of shit that ANY bitch can and WILL give to a man she likes.  she
might have THOUGHT she had something to offer a guy that was going to seperate
her from the pack, but she doesn't.  even GOOD PUSSY can't get a bitch any
credit because there are LOTS of bitches that can fuck and suck like pros...
elites AND sub-elites.  telembe NEVER told us what seperates her from the rest
of the bitches that might make a MAN like the one she wants even LOOK HER WAY! 
the reason is that there is NO reason! :)  bitches are programmed that MEN want
them... but they are NEVER told WHY.  the reason is that men like to FUCK and
get their dicks sucked.  they also like companionship and cooking and cleaning
and for a girl to look good on their arm so they can feel accomplished around
their buddies.  chicks THINK they are ENTITLED to a good man... but the GOOD
MEN... are picking GOOD WOMEN!  if they were SHINING like they think they are,
they would have been scooped up already and married or whatever they were
looking for because some guy would have spotted her and said "I'm not going to
let her go for ANYTHING" and she would be happy... at least according to her
programming.  OH, how I LOVE to see a bitch's face while she TRIES AND TRIES to
dig up ANY reason why a guy as great as the one she claims to want would EVER
choose her over any other bitch :)  the JOY the JOY that I feel as this POMPOUS
BITCH breaks the fuck down RIGHT IN FRONT OF MY FACE! :)  of course since I
broke her, I keep talking to her and ease her back to a decent state of being
and let her know that she can take steps to make herself into the woman that a
man would want, but she has to really KNOW HERSELF and KNOW MEN in order to
make an intelligent decision.  I am not into depressing chicks... unless they
TRULY DESERVE IT for all the depression they have caused men throughout their
tenure as FINE bitches :)  also, I have no desire to BREAK bitches and leave
them like that.  that just makes it WORSE for ALL OF US looking for FINE, yet
DECENT chicks.

>she cries, and says that is so true, that is her problem, she never
>takes the chance and loses out because she doesn't make the
>move on taken guys. Then I run my 'take chances routine' (if you take
>a chance, in the end, the result is usually good, but if you don't,
>just you get left behind, by yourself).. 

nice.  I like that one... emphasizing loss and loneliness.

>she cries more, says she
>needs to take the chance, and doesnt want to be alone.

she's done :)  nice work.  land her!

>She says she has to be careful, that all guys want just sex, and
>bitches about this for about 30 seconds.

as opposed to what?  what does she WANT guys to want?

>Now I start the 'you need me, I dont need you..you think I just want
>only sex, then you dont understand me at all.. if you think that is
>what I am only, then you do NOT deserve me.. I do no need you to go out
>with me if that is what you think I am.. I want connection, sex,
>passion, and closeness.. and if you haven't figured that out about
>me yet, then get another guy, because you dont understand me at all..

OK OK OK... you've CONVINCED me maniac :)  that's some good shit right there :)
 starting NOW, I am pitching for MLTR ONLY.  bitches that want ONS or LJBF will
get what they deserve from me... which isn't much.  I LOVE this idea of dissing
her for claiming that you are looking for ONS... or even just a "bootie-call"
type relationship :)  I love it.  I would feel so PROUD getting on her like
this.  sweet!  EXTREMELY congruent!  nice play!  this is going into my style,
starting RIGHT NOW!  :)

>I am doing this, because I know the left (logic) and right (emotions,
>passion) are fighting each other..they have been all night. Because the
>left doesn't accept the logic of the situation, but I know the right side
>dying for a shag,..she is trying to rationaize going out with a taken guy,
>but I have gotten her so excited tonight, that she needs that fuck.

THIS is the reason I never learned any of this shit until recently.  my
caveman-kino style before this involved ZERO talking.  totally kino and kissing
and PHYSICAL seduction with domineering EYE-CONTACT.  there was NO INFORMATION
for the left side to process at all.  EVERYTHING went STRAIGHT to the chick's
right side, and her left had to try to process the EMOTIONS and turn them into
a story that she could understand... in the meantime, she is PHYSICALLY falling
for the kino and wanting MORE AND MORE until we are fucking.  I never HAD to
talk to chicks before OR after fucking them because my PHYSICAL ATTACK is so
DEVASTATING!  I would just take them over PHYSICALLY and their right brains
would do ALL the work and the left would struggle to understand, but eventually
succumb to the onslaught!  ARG ARG! :)

thanks for explaining that to me :)

>As I touch her side of face, she goes doggy look, I kiss her, and she
>gets like screambabe, panting. I put leg between her, she widens, goes nuts
>totally. I ask her she likes me (in a tell her sort of way' you like me..'),
>she replies 'yes'. I say (stare her down) .. she asks "what should I do?"
>I say in a very strn fatherly voice while staring her down 4 inches from
>her head.. you will follow me..that is what you will do.. and you will do
>what I say. 'she says, 'I will'. I tongue her down more, run her crotch,
>she almost cums right there, then I take her to a love hotel (her first
>time!), no resistance what so ever.

interesting.  what just happened here?  did you somewhere dictate to her that
the terms of her being "your bitch" is that she has to sumbit to you fully? 
are you getting a verbal confirmation of that from her?  or is something else
going on... like she just plain UNDERSTANDS that you can move her to passions
that make her WANT to cum and that you are going to take her there and over the
edge?

another point... what do you guys think of foreplay on a chick.  he mentions
that she almost came right there... do you think it is good to get her to the
EDGE and leave her there so she is so horny, she will do ANYTHING for you to
make her cum, OR to give her an orgasm right there in her clothes to
demonstrate your sexual mastery over her?  personally, I am into the sexual
mastery thing because I notice a newfound RESPECT from a chick that has had
guys on top of her NAKED, fucking her for all they were worth and she never
came from it, and then I am just doing kino on her and fingering her and she
cums from just that.  do you think that making the chick cum on herself makes
her want sex MORE or want it LESS since she just got off?  take into account
that chicks are multi-orgasmic and that they feel sexier after cumming, not
DRAINED like guys.

>As I am fucking her, I am putting things in her head, like D.Shades reports.
>I tell her as she is screaming it feels deeper and deeper, closer and
>closer. She is going nuts will I am fucking her.

I need to reasearch this.  is this more right-brain, left-brain shit where her
left-brain is shut down because of the FIREWORKS that are going off in her mind
because of the sex, leaving her wide open to suggestion?  if you have any links
for this, please post.

>I stare her down, and I tell her you need me (during sex), she says yes.
>I tell her from now on you will follow me, and do what I say. She says
>'yes, I will'. I continue doing her, she says "it feels SO good, I really
>need that, I really want it, i love you inside me!".. she is fucking like a
>wild animal, loud voice, shouting and screaming, oh, I want it, give it
>to me, I want to come!

more of the same?

>Then she tells me anything is ok as long as I dont hate her..she doesnt
>want me to hate her. She wants me to hold/hug her, she cries a bit, then is
>ok again (seems to be thinking of her old bf she says). I touch her
>more, face goes totally doggy look, and finger her, she goes nuts, we start
>fucking again.

the "I don't want you to hate me" thing is very important in the D/s
relationship... not that you set this up like that, but that is the MAIN
incentive for her to follow your lead... that she does NOT want you to hate her
and CERTAINLY not to banish her.  when that is TRULY first and foremost in her
brain, she will regulate HERSELF and place herself in-line with your thinking
and what YOU want her to be.  she also won't try to blackmail you anymore
because she KNOWS it gets on your nerves and all THAT will do is get her
EJECTED sooner rather than later :)

>Her back is on the bed, and I am fucking her missionary, her legs are
>spread and wide in the air, which I am holding. I tell her "see, I control
>you, 

hehe ok... this is a little FAR-FETCHED for me at this point, but I have not
researched it yet :)  I DO like the next line though.

>I go deep in your body because it is the one way to reach you totally
>deep in your mind which no one else can do. 

interesting

>By conquering your body, I can
>conquer your mind (then I drill her a bit more after I finish the sentence so
>she goes more crazy). I play with your body because it lets me control
>your mind (then drill her some more..ha, it is like the ultimate form of
>reward hypnosis).

IS there such a thing as reward hypnosis?  links please? :)

>I ask her, so why you like me. She says she says, you are decisive and
>sometimes I am indecisive, so you make it easy for me. I want the guy
>to make it easy for me to decide what to do (important clue here Maniac!
>maybe most chicks are like this! Maybe this too is where I fucked up
>with HB Geek!)

I have heard this a lot too... only thing is that there is a lot of
RESPONSIBILITY that comes with telling a chick what to do, and if the VALUE of
owning her is not sufficient for me, I don't give a fuck WHAT she does enough
to want to lead her to a good time.

>Moral of the story.. keep your ground.. call all chick bullshit DIRECTLY.
>Make the chick risk fear losing the relationship if she doesn't capitulate
>and chances are she will back down, in spite of how it looks (and I could
>do this BECAUSE I had other choices.. another reason to be fucking
>several chicks at once). As well, it seemed that she was giving me all the
>bullshit in part because she WANTED me to call her on it, and then fuck her
good
>at the end of the night, which I obliged.

chicks give you shit-tests to find out if you are stronger than them and see
HOW you are going to control them.  chicks like the way I control them because
I NARROW their choices for them, but STILL make them choose.  they can choose
the path of ULTIMATE SATISFACTION, or they can choose the path of EJECTION and
being back on the dating scene meeting the SAME LAME GUYS every night :)

you had told her you had a girlfriend, but she seems to have NEEDED to know
that she really COULDN'T have you all to herself and that you really DIDN'T
NEED to fuck her that night or EVER.  you stuck to your guns (after letting her
get to you for a while :-) and she eventually ran out of logic and got
overridden with kino and gave up the fucking pussy like she came there to do :)

>Constructive comments/opinions welcome!
>
>Maniac High
>http://www.pickupguide.com

EXCELLENT!  keep up the GOOD WORK dude!  :)

---
From: erosla77@aol.com (ErosLA77)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 30 Dec 2000 20:12:47 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

>Subject: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit
special!]
>From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
>Date: Fri, Dec 29, 2000 10:37 PM
>Message-id: <92jvre$obh@nnrp1.deja.com>

>)this chick is a very highly educated, driven, professional
> career woman and earns likely a big 6 figure salary
>b)she is very mature, focused and spends all day in her office
> surrounded by sharks and other pirrhana type scumbag characters

 She's got to be in control ALL DAY LONG at work. Small wonder then, with a
man, she wants to fully SURRENDER control and be made to submit.  It's like all
those super-powerful Congressmen and Judges and the like who LOVE going to get
pissed-on and whipped by some Madame Dominatrix. 

>I regroup my thoughts.

 I admire your ability to do this in the field, Maniac. As you think about it,
what do you do internally to re-set yourself and keep yourself in a good frame
of mind when all this shit throws your way?

>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations

   Metahpor is a POWERFUL tool to move folks from a fixed perception to a new
one. Please, share your story!

> Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>her last week, apparently).

Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with fucking; it feels
good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the vulnerabilities.  So
when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which overcomes the
potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. She's worried about pain,
so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not only losing
out on the pleasure of screwing, BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out that if
she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even WORSE
crack-up.

  Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.

>he gets upset, and starts
>screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
>just like her ex-bf,

See? The fear of the pain of being hurt just like her ex-BF hurt her is now
rearing its ugly head.  She doesn't seem like a very emotionally stable person
in ANY event, let alone having just been dumped by a guy.  

>Then I go on to tell
>her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
>that did NOT happen

 Sharp thinking. Again, what do you do internally to keep your state solid and
your thinking sharp? THAT process internally is of great value, even more than
the specifics you share.  The specifics are like handing guys fish; good for a
nice meal and of value. But  how you get to the mind-set is TEACHING someone
HOW to fish so they can eat for life. 

>I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>alone!

 Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to her her
"ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she can then
accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!  

   Excellent...Maniac, I don't give a damn WHAT my orthodox SS followers say,
this is BRILLIANT stuff and I'd be proud to be your wing or have you as mine,
ANY FUCKIN' DAY of the week! Sir, I salute you!

>Now what I am doing with all the above, is not arguing the logic (too
>much)
>of this, because, of course she is right, and I know this.

 Actually, you ARE not arguing the logic, but you are USING the logic...HER
logic..HER way of viewing things.....pointing out WHY and HOW she loses and
what will happen if she doesn't stop it.   It's all centered around losing and
WHY she loses, based on what she has told you.  It IS logical, FROM her point
of view.  

 Great, Great stuff...sir, I salute you!

-----

From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]
Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2000 12:03:54 GMT

Replies to various people about psychicbabe:

Answers to various questions:

Was psychicbabe british, or Japanese?
She was a brit of Japanese ancestry (ie. she
looked 'j', but thought, acted and had an
english accent like a brit). This in my
opinion made it harder, because brit women
are so fucking F A T, and she was so
slender, sexy and attractive (and she dressed
to kill) compared to all of them. Lots of guys were
hitting on her (and she said she always got hit
on, and hated it.. trick was to not make it look
like a 'hit').

Why not a white chick? Well, I had the chance...
but.. at the conference where I met her, EVERY
brit. white chick there was in serious blimp bulge
territory.. very scary. Why is it so many caucasian
women are so FAT?

It was funny though, because something like 8 guys
(I counted) tried to hit on psychicbabe the night
I PU'd her. One guy was pretty good, the rest were
total AFC's..it was rather funny.

Re: Rocks -vs- gold.. how I use it (yes, it is
Jake's metephor. For RJ, search the original post
on fastseduction.com. It is also on pickupguide.com
someplace (if not it will be there in about 2 weeks,
I am revising the page this week). Basically, I intro
it as follows:
After chick says bullshit about wanting to go to
dinner and be friends or shit for 6 months before
becoming a GF, I say: Actually, I dont go to dinner
or stuff like that with ladies who are not my GF
CHick:  gasps!
Maniac: see, going to dinner, is an important step
in a relationship for me. I only share it with someone
special
chick: Huh?
Maniac: Well, let me put it this way, do you ever
sleep with a guy who is just your friend, or dont
care about?
chick: of course not!
Maniac: well, why do you think a guy should do any
different then?
Maniac: See, let me tell you a story. You ever hear
about 'rocks & gold'?
chick: no? what is it?
Maniac: Well, Relationships are valuable things.
And each partner is looking for something. It is like
diamonds (rocks) and gold. Both are valuable.

But women prefer diamonds to gold (usually), and
men prefer gold to diamonds (usually). Of course,
both are important, especially in a long term
relationship, but if a woman could choose, she would
prefer the diamonds  first, and the man would
prefer the gold  first. right?

chick: yeah, probably

Maniac: And (generally), a man can accept gold
without the diamonds, and a woman can accept
diamonds without any gold.

So in a relationship, a woman is mining for
diamonds, while the man is mining for gold.
While they are in the mine together, the
guy gives diamonds he finds to the woman, and
the woman gives the gold she finds, to the man.

But if you give a woman gold only, or a man
diamonds only.. neither is likely to be
very happy, and the relationship will soon
fall apart. In short, an exchange of sorts
takes place in a successful relationship.

And also, if a man expects just gold (sex),
but doesnt want to give her diamonds
(relationship & the mushy stuff), then she
will dump him fairly soon, because he is
playing/using her just for sex..

And if a woman expects just diamonds (walks,
attention, nice dinners, movies..etc) without
giving some gold (sex), then he (if he has any
clue about how to deal with women, though many
men do not, especially in North America) will
dump her because she is using/playing him just
for his personality.

A guy taking a chick to dinners, buying shit
and giving nice walks without sex is THE SAME
as a guy sleeping with a girl, and then kicking her
out right after the fuck is over. (chick says:
'yelch!'. Yes, thats right, and for the guy,
just dinners and buying shit is 'yelch', with
no sex, and no attention is exactly the same.

Because a woman will go to free dinner with
almost any guy, it has no value to me. But
I am like you, I want attention, and I want
to be made to feel special.

And although a girl will go to nice free dinners
with almost anyone, I also know that a girl will
not sleep with anyone. So I know if she does with me,
then it means she thinks I am important. And if
she wont, then it means she doesnt care about me
at all, so I really dont need to see her again,
I will just go find another girl.

Maybe you might think it is unusual for a guy
to think this way, but it is just my way.

See, I dont want to be played. Guys are always
getting played by girls for nice dinners, long
talks on the phone, and for their personalities.
It is the SAME as a girl being used for sex.
So I am happy to give plenty her diamonds, but at
the same time, I dont want to be played, so
I also expect her to want to give me gold.
And if she doesn't, it means she doesnt care about
me, is using me, or it means I am being played,
or I am stupid.

As well, experience has also showed me that
'friends first' almost NEVER results in a
relationship. I mean how many of your BFs were
your friend first (chick usually replies..uh,
zero).

Exactly, so that is why I never play 'friends
first'. Friends first means diamonds for the
lady, and no gold for the guy. That is like
the guy saying (ok, lets fuck for 6 months,
and if its good, we can go to dinner, and go
out, and you can be my GF). Would you like
that (chick: yelch!!).

Exactly.. so that is why it is far better,
that the lady meet me, get to know me, and
then I expect her to be smart enough to know
to take that chance THEN (or reject it, and I will
go get another lady) when it is offered to her.

So that is why I expect things that way in a
relationship with a lady.

After this, a chick is (usually) quite impressed,
or surprised and doesnt know what to say..

[When I recited this to psychicbabe, she actually told me
she was very impressed, that I understood relationships
so well ;-) ]

Had I been smart, I would have used it on HB
geek, and laid her, but after that failure I
thought about it, and then when the same situation
came up with Psychicbabe this week, I knew what
to do..

Ok, now on to other comments..

RJ writes
>Maniac writes:
> >I regroup my thoughts.
>
>  I admire your ability to do this in the field, Maniac. As you think
about it,
> what do you do internally to re-set yourself and keep yourself in a
good frame
> of mind when all this shit throws your way?

A couple things.. first, this PARTICULAR chick is of no importance
to me, because I am (likely) seeing 3 others this week. So it is
not as risky to me to be firm, and keep my ground.

Another important fact, is the way chick's brains are usually
wired. For a
chick, once she likes a given guy, it is hard for her to immediately
switch to another guy. it is far MORE risky, because a chick (unlike
men), usually cannot switch to another guy, once she ALREADY
likes a given guy (story is different BEFORE you got her to
like you..then SHE has more power than you).

So I play on this, and as a result I dont feel nervous/scared at all,
because there is far more to risk to her, than to risk to me. Because
she is stuck to me, but I am not stuck to her. (this also is why
'jerks' can get away with so much shit on any given chick, and why
she will tolerate it.. because her brain has now got her focussed
on THAT guy, and it is now a choice (in her mind), between him (and
his bullshit... or being alone (sure she can get another guy in 10
minutes, but she cannot build those nice feelings of 'attachment'
in 10 minutes.. that gives us men power, once we realize this).

Two, I am generally a very balanced level
headed person, and dont take any of this personally (as you already
know, RJ). Three (in this case), I had
already laid this chick, so I didnt care really if I laid her again
or not.. I already conquered her, and she (and I) already knew that.

If it is a new chick, sometimes, I get more nervous/fucked up (see
HB Geek). I am trying to keep my senses more when this happens

> > Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
> >problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
> >her last week, apparently).
>
> Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with
fucking; it feels

Not sure about this, I think she just simply wanted the fuck, but
wanted to feel she was important to me, and she didnt want to just
get played..

> good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the
vulnerabilities.  So
> when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which
overcomes the
> potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. She's worried
about pain

yes, thats right.

> so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not
only losing
> out on the pleasure of screwing,

Not really. I actually made it clear to her that I didnt care if
she bang me or not. The point was that she had to give her mind
to me, and respect me, and follow me (whether that is bang me,
make her take off her clothes in the window for me, or do my
dishes..whatever.. its not the banging that is important, it is
the submission to me that counts, and what she needs to give me
if she wants my attention at all).

> BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
> believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out
that if
> she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even
WORSE
> crack-up.

Yes

>   Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.
>
> >he gets upset, and starts
> >screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
> >just like her ex-bf,
>
> See? The fear of the pain of being hurt just like her ex-BF hurt her
is now
> rearing its ugly head.  She doesn't seem like a very emotionally
stable person
> in ANY event, let alone having just been dumped by a guy.

No, she is not stable at all. I think though, it is because she
bottles it up all day, to be the 'office bitch' that she has to
be in the daytime. This chick lives for her work. She has no other
life.

>
> >Then I go on to tell
> >her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
> >that did NOT happen
>
>  Sharp thinking. Again, what do you do internally to keep your state
solid and
> your thinking sharp? THAT process internally is of great value, even
more than
> the specifics you share.  The specifics are like handing guys fish;
good for a
> nice meal and of value. But  how you get to the mind-set is TEACHING
someone
> HOW to fish so they can eat for life.

Actually, the specifics are important I think. This is why lay/field
reports with details are so important. I think really shitty on my
feet. I really suck.. bad.

But if I have had that same experience before (with another chick),
or been in that same situation before, and
either succeeded (or failed, and then thought about how to handle it
right the next time), then I will handle it correctly this time.

I really believe in field experience. I have alot... really alot.
so I have seen many of these situations before. It is like chess,
or a foreign language. If you've been there before, and worked out
a solution, then you know what to do. You MUST get field experience.
It is CRUCIAL. And each time you fail, you go home, and see what
you did right/wrong, and what you would do if the same situation
happened again. This is why I also post the fuckup as well as
the lay reports.. they are very valuable to me in gathering my
thoughts and forcing me to think about what I did right/wrong,
as well as listening to the other's comments about them on this
NG.

I also look at the other's reports as well, and learn about
situations, and ask myself for each one, if it happened to me,
what would I do/how would I handle it. Eventually, after doing it
for a couple years (I have been at this in ernest for about 2
years now), you get better at it. Learning situations in PU, is
like learning the words of a foreign language, and how to connect
them all together.. how to move from a bad situation..to a good
one to get the chick in a horny state..

Also, I keep in mind alot about what MrSex4uNYC says about attitude,
and when I get stuck, I ask myself, what would NYC tell me right
now about this situation. He is very congruent, and if you think
things this way, it is easy to be clear what is the right way or
wrong way.

> >I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
> >with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
> >with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
> >and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
> >unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
> >alone!
>
>  Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to
her her
> "ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she
can then
> accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!

Yes, basically that is the idea. I am not sure that it means I am
an authority, but its more, to convey that she is clueless, she
is wrong, so to listen to herself will make her fuck up even more..
..so maybe she had better listen to me instead, and then she wont
fuckup as much.. basically that is the idea..

>    Excellent...Maniac, I don't give a damn WHAT my orthodox SS
followers say,

I didn't get this.. What are orthodox SS followers, and I had no
idea they were saying anything about this.. I really dont understand
what you mean here..

> >Now what I am doing with all the above, is not arguing the logic (too
> >much)
> >of this, because, of course she is right, and I know this.
>
>  Actually, you ARE not arguing the logic, but you are USING the
logic...HER
> logic..HER way of viewing things.....pointing out WHY and HOW she
loses and
> what will happen if she doesn't stop it.   It's all centered around
losing and
> WHY she loses, based on what she has told you.  It IS logical, FROM
her point
> of view.

Yes, basically that is the idea. What I meant was, is that her main
point is that she wants a monogamous BF, and doesn't want to be played.
But, I am playing her, and she (at some level) realizes that, so
in essense, her gut feel about this is totally correct.

But I am playing her desire for the fuck, and her fear of losing
out, which lets me bypassing her gut feel that she is being
played, and then I can get her to fuck anyways.

Good followups everyone!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

-----

From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]
Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2001 12:10:23 GMT

  "Dohn Joe"  wrote:
>  wrote in message news:92n7b96
@nnrp1.deja.com...
> [snip]
>
> The more I think of it, the more this seems to be a great PU.
> I think the PU in England is the gist of your piece of work.
>o I'd be glad to see more
> details on how you picked her up in England, that's the hardest work. How
> did you stand up the crowd? How did you make it not look like a PU?

I was using psychological 'jujitsu' (use the strength of your
opponant, against themself). There is a field report from 2 months
ago, that outlines the PU (check fastseduction.com archives).
Basically, I met her at a conference. I didnt talk to her much.
Then I followed her onto a bus that was taking us to the next
meeting place. A guy was hitting on her, and he sat with her.
I sat on the seat in front bymyself.

She (like most british bitches), started complaining about how
she hates men, and other bullshit. The guy on the bus with her
is taking this/agreeing with it (if I remember right).

I just turned around (and tonality and eye contact here is crucial),
and just tell her in a VERY authoritative voice, slowly.. "perhaps
you have just not met the right man yet, one you understands you,
deeply, and completely. But.. you never know the future.. now do you..
I used killed eye contact, spoke slowly, and continued "perhaps
if you open your mind more, you might find him.. by surprise, without
even expecting it, because often, that is the way it usually is..see"

Psychicbabe went "maybe", and then started more manhating bitching.

I then described the kind of man she wanted "one you could rely on,
but at the same time, be mysterious, and exciting in some unexpected
ways, because he just knew how to reach you deep inside you, and
your mind.. that is what your looking for..isnt' it?"

Psychicbabe: yes,

{continue PU, bunches of stuff from the ManiacPlan, if I remember
right}

The key here was the tonality and Eye-Fuck contact. That is what
did it more than the words I used. I just totally crushed her
with it..

> How did
> you get past her "bitch office" shield? I'm asking especially because, as I
> picture this woman, it would seem pretty intimidating for me to approach
> her.

I had the attitude that she obviously had never met a man that
knew how to give it to her right, which means that she obviously
needed ME far more than I needed her. That mindset made it easy.

> I admire your ability to take her from there into total submission.
> existing relationship than guys. That's why many (even HOT ones) find
> themselves in a dead end - boring or abusive - relationship, love to
> complain about it to whoever they find to listen, yet are unable to step out

EXACTLY!!

> of it. That's why the first fuck is hard - after that she is bound
> emotionally to you. You see,

>Women's sexuality is DISSOLVED in them.

Yes! you understand it!! (true for most, but not all chicks though,
some just like sport fucking, like we do)

> GREAT words to remember for all us RAFCs when we feel like beating the walls
> after a fuckup... I myself am so darn depressed when coming back after an
> unsuccessful encounter with a chick. Yes, each field experience is one more
> lesson

Yes, do NOT underestimately field experience. It is SO important.
I fucked up TONS (see all the fuckup reports I used to post a couple
years ago on ASF), and I still fuckup alot (see HBGeek, or HockeyBabe).
Over on cliff's list they say it takes 2..4 years to get good
at something, and 10 years to be a master. I TOTALLY agree.
I have only been at this for 2.. 2 1/2 years. And the more I learn,
the more I realize I still need to learn.. There is still TONS that
I dont know yet.

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

----
From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:08 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

I, for one, am really GLAD to see a post from RJ that has helped me move
forward in MY game :)  not that I am an ingrate hehe... his contribution to all
this is UNDENIABLE to begin with and if I hadn't stumbeled onto his site, I
would have still been using my caveman tactics and my MENTAL seduction game
would still be lacking.  as much as I appreciate his contribution to the
seduction game in general, I had been disappointed with all the flaming and
nonsense that he and others had/have been involved with because I thought that
this NG was BASED on USEFUL interaction between him and the rest of us, but I
found that not to be the case :(  not that ANYONE gives a fuck what I have to
say about this, but I wanted to back up into the PAST to make it clear that I
appreciate RJ's PERSONAL contribution to the NG TODAY.

In article <20001230151247.26801.00001467@ng-fi1.aol.com>, erosla77@aol.com
(ErosLA77) writes:

>>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations
> 
>   Metahpor is a POWERFUL tool to move folks from a fixed perception to a new
>one. Please, share your story!

I have been doing this without identifying it:

A) find out her perception (marriage, monogamy, sucking dick VS kissing...)
B) "quote" her a story illustrating a chick that saw things a DIFFERENT way
(the way I want HER to see things) and benefitted GREATLY from it (she is still
with me, she got married to the guy she wanted, she gained inner peace and
self-love...)
C) watch her AGREE with something that she just minutes ago BELIEVED was
incorrect, or not for her.

the most fascinating part is (C) because I didn't realize my powers of
validation, pacing then LEADING had developed so strongly.  this is partially
because I am an empath and can FEEL when a chick moves into different emotional
states so I can relate to her from within her own state and effectively "vulcan
mind-meld" with her, turning the TWO of us into a SINGLE, functioning entity so
that I can dictate for US... to a degree.

a frequent situation is chicks asking me if I am single.  basically, I explain
to them that I am in an "open" relationship.  they practically INVARIABLY
disrespect my MLTR for being stupid. "how can she go for that?" "I would have
dumped you" "I would never let a man see other women"...  sooooo :)  I let them
go on and on and get it all out and completely ENTRENCH themselves in the DREAM
of them being with a man like me AND dumping me or CHANGING me or whatever
their BULLSHIT FANTASIES are at the time.  THEN I go into the BENEFITS of being
MY PRIMARY relationship... :)  when I stack up the LIST of BENEFITS and it
stacks HIGHER than those bitches have in their OWN RELATIONSHIPS RIGHT NOW,
they start thinking.  they think about what LITTLE they really have in their
relationships that MY MLTR is getting.  they think about the TRUST and
COMPANIONSHIP between us that they DON'T HAVE with their borefriends.  they
think about how she is SEXUALLY SATISFIED... DAILY if she wants it.  she has
someone to give her the REAL DEAL on how men are and what we want from
chicks... not someone that's going to keep playing her until he is finished
fucking her.  they ALSO see how the other bitches (like them in the near
future) come and go and MLTR CONSTANTLY receives the benefits of being with a
man that does EVERYTHING for her that she could want... for the MERE price of
NOT bailing because I fuck other chicks :)  once I break it down to them, ALLLL
I see on their faces is ENVY.  matter of fact, they tend to look EMBARRASSED
when I ask THEM about THEIR relationships.  oh, that reminds me... the bitches
that DON'T HAVE A MAN AT ALL fare the WORST in these situations.  my MLTR has
NEVER-ENDING SATISFACTION... they have STORIES of what they WOULD DO... IF
they could get a man AT ALL!  :)

chicks would rather have 20% of a WINNER than 100% of a LOSER!

>> Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>>her last week, apparently).
>
>Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with fucking; it
feels
>good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the vulnerabilities.  So
>when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which overcomes the
>potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. 

wow!  VERY powerful :)  I had really considered these to be apples and
oranges... pain of emotions after sex and pain of LOSS of the individual. 
however, discomfort is discomfort.  I quit giving UTILITY to this PIVOT I was
using because I realized she had ZERO self-esteem and not many other redeeming
qualities other than her looks.  she went from LJBF to NEXT overnight.  I had
been using her for a pivot because of her looks, but her lack of personality
started to wear on me and finally, she had to go.  no more hanging out, no more
phone calling, no more help with her love-life... nothing... cold turkey. 
completely FORGOT about her.  about a month or so later, the holiday season
comes around and she  A) calls me  B) tells me she bought me something for
christmas (I bought her NOTHING, not even a CARD and didn't bother to get one
when she told me she bought me something)  C) tells me she wants to bring it TO
my house, and  D) shows up with gift in hand, READY to socialize and spend time
with me.  

this is the SAME bitch that NEVER went in her purse to even OFFER to throw in
money when I used to use her for a pivot.  I didn't mind paying for her though
because the benefits I got from being out with an attractive chick that KNOWS I
am out to get OTHER bitches and facilitates that was well worth it :)  hehe... 
too bad for her, MLTR was over and I received her gift, talked to her for a
while (where she told me her recent "relationship" blew the fuck up in her face
:-) and then ejected her to keep having fun with MLTR.

I have been using outfoxer's style of letting bitches get involved in bullshit
relationships, TELLING THEM the relationships are bullshit then letting them
fall FLAT on their faces and come CRAWLING back to me :)  I just haven't added
the part yet where I get indignant that they are giving sex to CHUMPS that use
them like BITCHES and throw them away.  hehe it is fun enough at this point
just to hear about their FAILURES from the horses' mouths and see the sad looks
on their faces, while I am CONSTANTLY SMILING :)

what you described is BASICALLY what happened to her, except NOT in the sexual
content, but in the companionship content.  she THOUGHT she had a solid
position with me as my pivot, so she didn't feel like paying for anything
because she thought I NEEDED her, not WANTED her.  as soon as I didn't want her
anymore and dumped her from LJBF to NEXT, she was OK with it UNTIL her
relationship BACKFIRED... THEN she decides she wants to get back in good with
ME, which she can't do because I don't give a fuck about her and except for
looks, she can't compete with MLTR AT ALL!

the pain of loneliness overrides the emotional pain of sex without
committment... fascinating :)

>She's worried about
>pain, so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not only
>losing out on the pleasure of screwing, BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
>believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out that if
>she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even WORSE
>crack-up.
>
>  Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.

ok, this is interesting too.  "this is why you fucked up with your ex and I
feel the same way about that particular topic".  you are FORECASTING her
EJECTION unless she changes her ways.  she is still WITH YOU and has a chance
to do the right thing instead of getting ejected.  she already knows how it
feels to BE ejected by her EX and doesn't WANT to go through that pain AGAIN
with you.  you dictate to her HOW she could have avoided it with her EX and she
learns how to avoid it with you and gets in line.  this is another reason why
DICTATING what you REQUIRE from chicks is good, because they have the roadmap
to success or FAILURE with you.  as long as you have demonstrated personality
AND value BEFORE getting to this with her, she will be in a state of "how can I
get my hands on this guy... and KEEP him?" and then you will tell her what she
needs to do to be CONSIDERED amongst your TOP chicks and then is is up to her
to either fulfill her womanly duties or... as you predicted... get ejected and
feel the PAIN OF SEPERATION all over again with someone that she ALREADY knows
she WANTS to be with... WHATEVER the cost.

everyone has their price.  I find, most times, chicks are TALKING with no
EXPERIENCE.  a chick told me that she dumped her borefriend because he laughed
at her.  I told her that the sex must not have been good because otherwise she
would have had to use more than THAT to justify dumping an entire relationship.
 she CLAIMED that sex had nothing to do with her decision and that he didn't
RESPECT her was why she dumped him.  I told her that if the sex had been what
it is SUPPOSED to be... I GUARANTEE her that she would NOT have thrown THAT
away because of some laughing and disrespect.  I also proceeded to laugh at her
AND disrespect her IN HER FACE and told her I don't care because we are not
dating... she can't DUMP ME!   she never ADMITTED that I was right... BUT... by
the end of the conversation, she was asking me WHAT SHE SHOULD DO TO MAKE HER
LOVE LIFE BETTER!  :/  gotcha!

>>I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>>alone!
>
> Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to her her
>"ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she can then
>accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!  

yes.  I really have not been making the MOST of pacing and leading.  I have
been seeing where they ATTACH THEMSELVES to my way of thinking and see me as an
authority.  I have not used this to MAKE POLICY for them... merely to open
their minds and get them to think more efficiently.  you are right though. 
once you capture them... LEAD THEM!  make SOME efficient use of your new
followers... even if you were only practicing or passing time by capturing them
:)

excellent post :)

------

From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:10 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

In article <92n7b96@nnrp1.deja.com>, maniac_high@yahoo.com writes:

>After chick says bullshit about wanting to go to
>dinner and be friends or shit for 6 months before
>becoming a GF, I say: Actually, I dont go to dinner
>or stuff like that with ladies who are not my GF
>CHick:  gasps!
>Maniac: see, going to dinner, is an important step
>in a relationship for me. I only share it with someone
>special
>chick: Huh?
>Maniac: Well, let me put it this way, do you ever
>sleep with a guy who is just your friend, or dont
>care about?
>chick: of course not!

[lots of good use of Jake's shit snipped]

this is interesting, though I couldn't tell if this is something you are GOING
to do, or something you DID already.  either way, IF you are congruent, this
will serve you well as an alternate form of screening.  most of the time, I
screen by ASKING chicks shit and listening to their answers while watching
their faces and body-language.  another way to do it is to basically DICTATE to
them what I need to even CONSIDER being with a chick in any capacity
whatsoever.  most of the time I don't do this though because I can tell already
that the chick is worthless.  I usually get into DICTATION when she asks me
about myself.  am I attached?  what do I look for in a woman? etc.  THEN, since
she asked, I get into the reasons I have chosen women in the past and why I am
still with them in the present.  as I do that, I lay down my laws WITHOUT
telling the chick I am talking to that she needs to get in line with this shit
or get the fuck out of my face.  I have had a couple of chicks blow themselves
out after this.

I was talking to a chick that I know from YEARS ago that started calling me
again and talking about nothing.  I tolerated her for an hour or so on two
different days  A) because I was bored and  B) because through her speech
patterns and recurring ideas, I was learning if she was worth anything to me at
all, considering I get everything I want or need from MLTR in the first place,
she only had a VERY LIMITED use to me, as GOOD backup-pussy.  MLTR is smarter,
more interesting, more fun, less psychotic... basically TRUMPED her in all
areas, so this chick had NO CREDIT with me whatsoever.  I ended up getting into
PRECISELY what you did in your post.  the KICKER was when I told her "I don't
even TALK to girls that I don't want to fuck".  since I had not fucked her AND
had not suggested that we get together (she BELIEVES in monogamous
relationships for herself and even if she fucked me one time, it would be
merely to relieve her own personal stress and I am not going to be there for
her for that.  I am looking for MORE MLTRs... anything else can go fuck off.  I
laughed at her way of being AND broke it down to her why it was so stupid AND
let her know in NO UNCERTAIN TERMS that I was not going to be involved in
ANYTHING CLOSE to what she claims to want for herself... she can STAY HORNY for
all I care) she INTELLIGENTLY asked me WHY I was talking to her...  I let her
know that I found her amusing and her way of living ineffective.  I pointed out
to her that in the YEARS since I had spoken to her last, ALL she had to show
for it was a bungh of jibberish about WANTING a monogamous relationship that
she HAS NOT ATTAINED IN ALL THESE YEARS!  I let her know that I had predicted
that she would REMAIN dissatisfied for years to come and my talking to her
allowed me to follow her LACK of progress while, in the meantime, I get laid
EVERY DAY by MLTR :)   I have not heard from her SINCE that conversation...
good riddance.  she knew what she HAD to do if she wanted more of my time.  she
knew what she was going to have to do IF she wanted to socialize with me at
all.  she felt like her DEVOTION to the idea of a monogamous relationship with
a NON-EXISTANT man was more important than getting fucked by a guy that she
KNOWS and LIKES.  she is an idiot, and will remain horny UNTIL she fucks the
wrong guy, then has NO ONE to comfort her because I will not be there because
she had her chance and BLEW IT!

I have ZERO TOLERANCE for chicks that want things their way.  if they LIKE
doing things MY WAY, then they can be with me...maybe... for a while... as long
as they still LOOK HOT :)   when I approach chicks, I ASSUME they will fail the
screen because statistics show that I require A LOT from a chick and most of
them are either distracted by work or other relationships or just are not
QUALITY enough to be with me.  I find it amusing how ridiculous the SAME girls
are that I used to DESIRE to go out with and that I USED TO dislike being
rejected by.

now, I meet and REJECT girls daily.  not actively, just after I meet them, I
make NO EFFORT to remain in contact with them and go off to talk to other
chicks, leaving them wondering WHY I was interested enough to approach, but
BECAME DISINTERESTED and ejected for a SIMILARLY-GOOD-LOOKING bitch :)

Experiment Report! How kinky are your coworkers?!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



A practice session using the techniques of PU!


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: ]Experiment Report! How kinky are YOUR co-workers?!
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 08:03:45 GMT

]Experiment Report! How kinky are YOUR co-workers?!

This report is about finding the deep dark secrets of
your co-workers (not necessarily to fuck them, but as
a good experiment in state transitioning in groups
rather than one-on-one).

Note, for those readers living in repressed countries
still in the sexual dark ages like the Islamic
Republic of Iran, or the United Stated of America,
I do not advice attempting this..trouble with the
legal system, sex harrassment shit, or loss of
your job could result.. For the rest of you living
in countries that have both feet planted firmly in
the 20th century, no problem, lets rock on- here
is the report!


Recently, I have been doing alot of work practicing
state transitioning. Ie. the goal is to take a
chick (or in this case, group of chicks) from the
"idle state" (ie. thinking about office bullshit
and work they have to do), and transition them
to the kinky "lets get crazy and fuck state" as
quickly as possible, and in as few steps as possible
using a process that will be consistantly successful.

Last night, we had one of these (usually) boring
office departmental dinner parties at a stuffy
restaurant in town. BORING!!

So I decided what better place to liven things up
and see what I can get away with using psychological
warfare and a little bit of alcohol in an otherwise
formal group setting.

I get there, and sit at a table with 1 guy, and
5 chicks. For the first 30 minutes, it is boring,
I let everyone talk about boring office shit so
that everyone can arrive, and the food can start.

First I arrange the waiter to bring drinks to the
table (we need it later for one of the games I
am going to do), and get started on that right away.
One of the chicks only drinks tea, but that is OK,
later she really got into it anyways in spite of
being stark sober.

At the table is sitting:
ChinaGuy - he is from China
Mombabe - she is a mom, but wild & crazy, 40s (starts
          by sitting at another table)
HB CaptHook - she had a mild eye infection and is
              wearing an eyepatch this week (starts by
              sitting at another table)
HBStrict - she only drinks tea, but is more action
           than she looks
ScaredChick - she thinks we are all wierd
HBWhoMe? - she looks SO straight, but is the kinkiest
           at the table we find out!
Bichick - we find out she had enjoyed some bi games

Other assorted people sitting farther, who dont
play in the games really..

After that, I start. Here is how I did it. Refer
to the 'Maniac plan' post I made a couple weeks ago
(it is archived in fastseduction.com, I will also put
it on my site in Jan. when the next big update
happens) for some of the terminology below. I move
all the chicks (as a group), through all the states
as follows:

[Current State: Idle: chicks talking about office bullshit]
Maniac>Bichick: So what did you do this weekend?
Bichick: Nothing really.. how about you?
Maniac>I went to my dance circle, I like salsa dance
Bichick: oh really? {other chicks starting to listen}
Maniac: Yeah, I went to Brazil this year too, it was so
        much fun, wanna see my pictures?
Bichick & others: 'yes!' (take out my digi-PC, show pictures
        of carnival in Rio, tback bikini babes, the gay parade
        and debauchery in the streets)
Maniac: You know, the culture is SO different, brazilian people
        are SO passionate!
All chicks: oh really?
Maniac: yep, after I left Rio, I went to Sao Paolo, and
        went into this bar and all of the sudden this brazilian
        chick grabbed me and started french kissing me (perform
        SP chick story from ManiacPlan).

[Current State: (A)dmiration & (M)an now achieved from ManiacPlan]
Bichick: Oh, HB Capthook lived in brazil a few years!
Maniac: really? {I go to her table, ask if she wants to see
        some brazil carnival pictures with us.. she runs over
        to our table}
Maniac>all chicks: you know, I respected that SP chick though
       because she was not afraid to take what she wants..
       kind of like Madonna (perform the Madonna story from
       ManiacPlan).
Maniac: Perform 'how to communicate to lady at all levels
        and pay attention to her and what she wants' story
        from ManiacPlan, while doing lots of Kino on
        HBCapthook sitting next to me as a demonstration.
        Others are watching and getting jealous..

[Now try to introduce the (S)ex state from ManiacPlan..
the goal here is to do the "questions game, but in a
group setting.. so I decide to do it via a drinking game]
Maniac: {now I try to introduce a drinking game called 'I
       never'}, Hey, do they have any good drinking games in
       Japan.
Chicks: {they suggest some really lame boring shit like
         remembering names of subway stations..boring!!!}
Maniac: Well, I know two games, Chandelliers {I describe this
        game.. but we wont play it, not sexual}, and then
        "I never" {I describe "I never"}.
[Now here, I think I dont have enough rapport yet to start
"I never" (a drinking version of "questions") and get it to
work well (ie. sexually), so first I preform the "Strawberry
fields" game in a group (in next post, and included below)

<>>

We play the game: (mombabe hears us laughing, comes
over & kicks Chinaguy out of his chair so she can sit
next to us)

Among the answers to "strawberry fields"
Bichick: "uh, I dont see any fence around the field!"
HB Capthook & mombabe: "as many as I can eat!"
HBStrict: "to the farmer.. uh.. Thank you {and bow}"

We were all laughing and rolling on the floor to the
various chicks answers to this game, with lots of "I cant
believe you?! really?!" reactions among the ladies..

[Current state in ManiacPlan: (S)ex now achieved, now
lets intensify and see what these chicks will say/do.
I am putting LOTS of shoulder/back kino on all the
ladies as the game is playing]

Maniac: OK, time for another game, we will play that
 "I never" game we talked about before. {Maniac explains
 howto play "I never"} [easy.. each person takes a turn,
 say "I never xxx", whoever did "xxx" has to take a drink.
 start light, get game sexual ASAP..]

Maniac: here is the opening question: "I never kissed a
 member of the opposite sex before I was 15 y.o."
{3 girls drink}
Maniac: your turn HBCaptHook
HBCaptHook: uh, I dont understand the game yet, can you do
  the next question Maniac?
Maniac: OK, I never kissed a guy on the first date
{we all drink}
HBCaptHook: OK I get it, my turn "I never had sex with a
 guy on the first date" {notice because of the setup with
 straberry fields here, that the chicks ON THEIR OWN, turned
 the game sexual without me having to do anything! This was
 what I worried about if I were to start the "I never" game
 before straberry fields.. the mood was just not sexual
 enough yet, and the game would have fizzled.. but now..
 no problem!}
{all but 1 chick drinks (HB afraid.. who is looking a bit
 uncomfortable now)}
Mombabe: I never kissed a member of the same sex
{Bichick drinks!.. lots of "oh really?!? and discussion
 ensues, but bichick wont delve into it anymore ;-) }
Bichick: I never had sex with more than 4 people in the
 room.
{bichick, HBstrict and HBWhoMe all drink!}
HBAfraid: I never went to california
{we all look at her wierd.. skip to next girl}
HBWhoMe: I never did sex as part of a performance in front
of others
{Maniac, Bichick and HBWhoMe drink.. HBStrict looks envious,
others gasp and are laughing.. rest of our dept, is looking
at us, like why we are having so much fun, and a bit wierdly,
fortunately they cannot hear what we are saying ;-)}
Maniac: I never had sex with someone and didn't know their
 name till the next morning.
{We all drink except HB afraid}
MomBabe: I never used tool, or vibrator during sex
{we all drink}
HBCaptHook: I never had sex with a cat?!
{we all look at her wierd.. no one drinks}
HBCaptHook: but it can happen, I saw it on video once!
{we look at her more strange, and make her drink for watching
the video}
HBAfraid: I cant think of any question
{we skip her, next girl}
..
Maniac: I never was tied/tied up my partner during sex
{Maniac, HB strict, HBCapthook and HBWhome all drink}

Maniac: I see, so who is "S", and who is "M" {explain to
 a couple clueless chicks which was which}
HBWhoMe and HBStrict are serious S type, Bichick is both.
HBStrict makes a pass at me, and I reply only if you are
serious.. she stares at me long (maybe a future there ;-) )
I shake hands and hug HBWhoMe, who is really into this
thread of questioning.

Mombabe now makes ajoke about why I went to lunch today
with this other chick (not in the game), and not her. I
tell her because she didn't ask me.. girls have to take
what they want, like that SP chick. I ask her if she
likes me, she says yes, and I gesture (and get) a cheek
kiss. I am CERTAIN I could have done a KC, or even one
of those 3way KCs, but I remember that this is an
experiment, and I do have to see all these people on Monday
again at work, so I dont push it.

now adminbabe (the dept head's secy) comes by our table
and asks how many of us are going to the prescheduled
after-party karaoke. Mombabe replies "none of us, we are
all going to a hotel".. HBCapthook adds in "a love hotel..".

[Final state: Dying to fuck: achieved]

Adminbabe looks at us wierd (she missed the whole thing),
and leaves. Mombabe now asks why I have such a harem tonight,
and then Bichick remarks how all the ladies in the office
really really like you Maniac.

I ask 'why?'
bichick says.. you smile, and laugh alot.. but there is
something else.. we all see it, but cant really
describe what it is {maniac opinion.. it is the way
I stare at chicks with the 'fuck me' luck, and all the
shoulder kino..etc, I do, even in the office}.

Supper now is wrapping up, we all have to go, I remark
that this table is fun, and that another night, we should
all meet again for beer and fun.. everyone agrees.

As we are going back, HBCaptHook and mombabe are grabbing
all over me, it was funny.

Some go home, and I split off from the group, as I have
a date with karatebabe at midnight in another part of
town..

Experiment over..

I learned that state transitioning is a very predictable,
reproduceable process, once you learn the tools to do it.
This was just my office staff that is around me, so made
a good subject for the experiment. I also realized, that
in groups, there is a sort of feed back effect, so you
can really accelerate things. It wasnt the alcohol because
HBstrict had nothing to drink, but was well into the
game too.

Because it was a group, I could skip steps "BVG,D,O" in
the ManiacPlan, and reach the last state.. (dying to fuck)
so I likely could have taken any (or all)
of those ladies back for a wild time in the sack (which I
wont do, because I work with them.. but there was nothing
stopping it, thats for sure)..

Fascinating..

Constructive Opinions/comments anyone?

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Doing proper ‘closes’

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Maniac uses a power opener to meet and tongue down a chick!


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Maniac meets HBOrderMe! Bar PU
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 05:00:36 GMT

Maniac meets HBOrderMe! Bar PU
001215

This is an interesting bar PU. .
used it to not lay the chick, but to get higher rapport
with the other guys around.

It is bo-nen-kai (end of year party) season in Japan.
After the party (boring, in a big hotel ballroom)
we go to the ni-ji-kai (after party) in a bar/disco
in Roppongi with a bunch of my coworkers (mostly guys,
and some ladies).

One AFC guy is really into this HB. He is making every
AFC mistake in the book (saying she is pretty, sucking
up to her..blah). Progress is really slow.

Me and all the guys are watching. He gets frustrated and
leaves for a bit. I move in on the chick (she is wearing
a high cut black dress, and fishnet stockings... very cute).

My opener is the strawberry game.. I just go up to her,
and say 'imagine you are in a field, and you see a strawberry
field ahead of you, with a fence around.. how high is the
fence'. She goes right into it.

Then I do the interpretation (see strawberry game post
for the game and interpretation) for her. I ask her what
she thinks (she said 1m high fence, 50 strawberries, sorry
to the farmer). She disagrees the interpretation. Then I
ask her what is your idea guy like (brad pitt). Then I say
besides his looks why you like him. Reply: he is really
guy.

Then I ask, what do you want most in a guy's character.
She says, 'I want him to lead, to decide for me what to do.'
Good.. Maniac keeps that in mind for what comes next. .

AFC guy comes back, and I let him have his chick back for
a while. He is doing more regular AFC stuff, though he
has at least initiated kino.. very good. He does this for
like 20 minutes, but isn't really breaking through.

He gets frustrated, goes. I tell the guys 'watch this',
and go up to the chick, and say I am going now, give me a
kiss. I get a cheek kiss.

I look straight into her eyes, and tell her 'thats not
good enough, look into my eyes.. what do you see.. now
give me a real kiss..' a long tonguedown with sexual kino
ensues.. Everyone else sees what I just did, after spending
not even a total of 5 minutes talking with this chick
from before.

I leave the chick, and go back to the guys.. 'that is how
it is supposed to be done'. Respect of me from my guy co-workers
now goes up 10x from whatever it was before, and was visibly
different in the office the next day.

AFC co-worker comes back and tells me how so much he is
in love with this girl (I guess he knew her from before as
a friend or co-worker or something..not sure.. I had never
met her before though). As a result, I defer to him, and let
him get AFC'd out.

I go back to the other guys, and just say, I could take her
(she lives really close actually, so I could just say I
live far and can I crash at her place.. I am sure the answer
would have been yes) whenever I want. They say 'why dont you'?

I reply, well, AFC guy is really into her, and he is a coworker
of mine who I respect, so I dont want to take his chick away
from him. There are lots of chicks to fuck, and this one means
nothing to me at all, but she is important to him, so best to
leave it at that.

I go on to say that all I wanted to know is that I COULD take her
home if I want (and I might next week or something, I got her
number) and now I know that, so it is enough for me, I dont
need more.

Respect from co-workers now goes up another 10x for this, because
I and they KNOW that this is true after what they just saw. .

He continues to AFC for a long while, and I get tired and go
home. Next day I hear that she blew him out almost as soon as I
left.

Now this was cool, because the goal wasn't really to lay the
chick (which I still might if I decide to see her again), but to
increase stature with co-workers, which can help in other ways
in my regular life.

Now one thing to note, is that I cannot do this every time (heck
not even close.. this is like the 3rd or 4th time it has ever happened
so directly like this). I was
really lucky, because of what she said to my 'what you like in
guy question', it was just so EASY to know what this chick
expected me to do, and it was really easy to stage it to happen
in front of all the other guys once I clued in on this.

I WISH I could do it everytime, but life isnt really like that ;-)
Mr. SMooth can do it though!

Constructive comments and opinions welcome!
Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Using the ‘color’ game to PU!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Using the 'color game' to do a PU!


From: tonymcneill@my-deja.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Colours Game - opinions?
Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 00:43:35 GMT

 Hi Guys,

I've just field tested this pattern / game for creating an erotic and
horny state - worked a dream:) I'd be interested to know what you think
of this and how it might be improved.....

I suppose it might work best with the more visually thinking babes.

This is not a 'word for word' pattern by any means, by the way - I just
kind of found myself going into it on the fly.....  here we go..

The PUA "notices" the colour (UK spelling by the way for those who might
feel the urge to correct me) of an object, item of clothing etc.

PUA - "I find these yellow walls (or whatever) quite uplifting;
especially in the winter. Isn't it nice to have some bright colours
around when it's so grey and dark outside?" "Do you think that colours
have an big effect on peoples' moods?".

HB - "Oh, yes, definitely."

PUA - "Hmmm. I was just wondering......I mean....... I was in one of
those New Age shops recently and they were selling lots of different
coloured sunglasses.... with the idea that, if you wanted to feel more
of a certain mood, or to look at the world in a certain way, you would
slip on a pair of sunglasses which would colour everything you looked at
in the desired tone" "Do you think that could work in any way?"

HB - "Well, maybe. I don't know really"

PUA - "Well, for example, my bedroom is a very pale blue colour and I
find this particular blue very restful" "I mean, can you imagine
sleeping very well in a pale blue room?" "Imagine you are really tired,
you know when your eyelids are heavy and you curl up with that fantastic
feeling of at last ... just letting go.... and .....giving
yourself...to....(sp perhaps?).. sleep'" "Do you have a sense of a
particular colour when you imagine that feeling?" (Make sure she's
imagining being sleepy).

HB - "Oh, maybe blue, or green" (or whatever). (If she doesn't come up
with one then maybe she could be asked to imagine the perfect colour for
a bedroom, but both of the HB subjects I tried got right into it.)

PUA "How about when you feel....really full of great ideas...... like
you have all sorts of inspiration flowing through you.?"

PUA then procedes to get HB to imagine a few other states (feeling very
inspired and spiritual (commenting on her choice of colour in a playful
way)...... bursting with energy ...... feeling very sensual,
relaxed and open (we're getting closer, gentlemen)......and eventually,
 being full of passion and horny), and slowly visualising a colour with
each one.

You get the picture - guiding her into these states,
comparing colours etc etc. I have tried this on two chicks, both of whom
LOVED the game and got right into imagining the states. One of them was
an ex who is of great value as a pivot / social proof (and a friend) so
I was testing the game with her rather than going for the lay and the
other HB, in spite of being pretty shy, blushed madly and was VISIBLY
remembering the joy of being fucked until she screamed with pleasure ;)
(At this point Tony is feeling a bit fucking pleased with himself).
I think this would have definitely resulted in a fuck had I not been
meeting her at lunchtime before going off to work :( (at this point Tony
is disgusted as well as pleased!!)

What do you 'real' PUAs think of this little game? As I said I somehow
went into it on the fly after having the idea while practicing
improvising patterns while driving, using things I saw on the road as
starting points for pattern-talk. So it's pretty new and I, as yet,
claim only to be a humble RAFC. Going to test it some more and post the
results....



Any suggestions or comments?

Tony

--
'Action' is the magic word

Setting up the Kiss Close

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

A way to set up the kiss close

From: erosla77@aol.com (ErosLA77) Ross Jeffries
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 26 Dec 2000 19:23:44 GMT
Subject: Re: What if...

>Subject: Re: What if...
>From: eclipse19@my-deja.com
>Date: Tue, Dec 26, 2000 12:04 AM
>Message-id: <929jdt$u6t@nnrp1.deja.com>
>
>In article <9299s4$o03@nnrp1.deja.com>,
>  charnel1278@my-deja.com wrote:
>> Hey all,
>>
>> I've checked out a Maniac's, and some others websites and most say
>that
>> when you ask "Do you wanna kiss me?", you're guaranteed a kiss, unless
>> you get a flat out NO.  None, from what I saw, said what to do when
>you
>> get that NO.  Do you continue on the conversation like nothing
>> happened? Do you come back with a similar question later in the
>> evening?  If so, won't she kinda feel that you're badgering her?
>> Granted, this won't happen often, but what if?....
>>
>> Laters.
>
> the standard (canned) reply to a "no" answer is "YOU really know how
>to ruin a moment....your old boyfriends must have hated that about you"
>I think i got this off tony or maniac's site, forget which one. I
>havent ran into a direct "no" answer myself so i havent field tested
>this, but im sure others have. From what i read(or remember anyhow)
>this will leave them stunned and they will show less resistance against
>another kiss.
>
>

 Hmmm......well, I like this "you really know how to ruin a moment" response
WITHOUT asking for the kiss first. "Asking" for anything, outside of the
presence of fun(as in, on the spur of the moment saying, "Hey...wouldn't it be
fun to go to a strip club? Let's go!))  seems pretty pathetic to me.  

    A good one is to notice her giving you that look and then say(and I got
this from a student, it is NOT mine).  "If ? were to ask you on a scale of one
to ten, how good a kisser are you, what would you say?"

 Listen for her answer, then say, "If you were to kiss me right now, how do you
think I'd rate you?"

  You do this ONLY when you see "the look".......

  "let's find out" you say and kiss her.  

IF she backs away from that, then the "you really know how to ruin a moment"
comment works great.  Come to think of it, this could really work for a
cancellation as well. 

---

From: "General Snafu" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: What if...
Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2000 22:57:08 GMT

If she says no to a kiss, ask for a BJ.  If she says no to the BJ, you are
SOL for the night.

 wrote in message
news:9299s4$o03@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Hey all,
>
> I've checked out a Maniac's, and some others websites and most say that
> when you ask "Do you wanna kiss me?", you're guaranteed a kiss, unless
> you get a flat out NO.  None, from what I saw, said what to do when you
> get that NO.  Do you continue on the conversation like nothing
> happened? Do you come back with a similar question later in the
> evening?  If so, won't she kinda feel that you're badgering her?
> Granted, this won't happen often, but what if?....
>
> Laters.
>
>
> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/

Game: The Wall and the Forest

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Maniac introduces "The Wall and the Forest", a PU game.



From maniac_high@yahoo.com 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Game: The wall and the forest
Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 16:18:24 GMT

Another one of those mindfuck games like 4 questions or the cube:

"The Wall and the Forest"

-You are walking in a field, you see a wall, how high is it, and
how do you get by it? [wall = pride, and also how you get past
obstacles]

-you continue walking, and you see a house [kind of house you dream
to have later in life]

-you see a key on the ground, you go to the house, does the key
open the door? [if yes, means you can get married]

-you go in the house (if you were able to open with the key), and
 on the first floor you see a table and chairs, how many chairs are
 there? [means how many people in your future family]

-now you go outside, and see to one direction a dense dark forest, and
 the other way, a less dense/brighter wooded area. Which way do you
 go? (dark forest=expect something, but unknown, take a chance)
     (bright wooded area=easygoing style/way)

-as you walk you then see a lake nearby. How big is it, and how deep
 is it? (big=size of your heart, depth=depth of your heart)

THE END


This game could be lethal for chicks who want to get married or
something like that. Make sure you answer the right answers when
you tell her "what your answers were" after you finish her turn!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Game: Forest

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Nightlight introduces 'forest game'!



From: nightlight9@hotmail.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: More like "4 questions" game?
Date: Thu, 02 Nov 2000 19:50:10 GMT

You mention all these, but most of them are not very useful in the
initial meeting because they are too cerebral and too random.  Try ones
that are more viceral.  You are walking in a dark forest.  How do you
feel.  (how she approaches life).  You could to a wall with a door.
What do you do? (how she approaches obsticalls).  You look down and see
a cup on the ground what is it made out of? (how she views wealth).
You come to some water, describe it. (how she views sexuality).
Always end with sexuality because it is  a good topic for PU and
demonstrates you are comfortable with women and people a sexual context.

BookGuy, my comments are based on experience and field testing.  Please
do the same if you reply.

--
NightLight9
Just be yourself... smooth with interesting questions and interesting
answers.

Game: Strawberry Fields

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Maniac introduces a PU game: Strawberry Fields!
[Note, this originally comes from the book 'Kokology']


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Game!: Strawberry fields
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 08:02:40 GMT

Game!: Strawberry fields
001117

This is a game to find out some things about how chicks
see sex. It is very popular in Japan & is a good state
transitioner

--

Intro: Hey, lets play a game!

Imagine you are alone in a field, and see a straberry field
in front of you with tasty strawberries.

There is a fence/gate around the field. How high is it?
(= how easy is this girl/guy to take sex)

Now you are in the straberry field, how many straberries
do you take?
(=how many BFs/GFs that person wants)

Ok, after you have finished enjoying the strawberries,
how do you feel about the farmer, who's field you took them
from?
(=how you feel to that person after fucking them)


The end

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

TPUA night PU’s HB Smallmouth and converts to a lay!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

[TPUA PU's a chick at night, and converts it into a lay!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com
]


Date Posted: 2000/09/25 05:21:37 AM EDT
Author: Tokyopua 
Subject: Re: HB Small Mouth PU  (Was Re: Calling all Tokyo PUA's)

Hey Maniac,

I didnt really intend that last post of mine as a field report, since it
wasnt too detailed.  But yeah, things have been going well on the PU despite
my severely limited time. So I will attempt a bit of a field report on the
initial PU here.  My PU efficiency factor has been really high recently,
maybe because I am only trying to PU when I feel really confident and often
times when I wasnt planning on it, so was really relaxed. I did a PU on a 19
year old HB college student in the train the other night and got her home
phone number.  It was easy cause she was reading Tokyo Classified, and I
asked her about it. I was really confident, and in only 2 stops got her to
really dig me.  In fact, when I asked her why she had studied English, she
said "So I could meet a guy like you!"  The only problem is finding time to
meet her again before I leave.

The PU I did on HB Small Mouth was not planned either, I just saw her
walking back home around my place at midnight, and somehow knew that despite
my frazled appearance after 2 hours of Jujitsu practice and carrying 40
pounds of luggage, I could do the PU on her.  My opening line was "I like
your hair" which I knew was lame and she must have heard often, but hey,
thats the price of using the 3 second rule sometimes.  I immediately
followed with asking her if she was a student, what kind of work she did,
etc.  Oddly, I didnt use my standard opener "Do you speak english" in the
whole conversation.  I will post my personal notes on the rest of the PU at
the end of this post just for reference, but they arent too coherent.  They
were the basis though for the plans I laid for the successful next date that
got me laid 3 days later.  (If I have time someday I will write up full
notes on that too.) Total time to lay in terms of time invested was
approximately 3.5 hours, about the same as HB Physics, my other recent
street PU who I did that same day.  This efficiency is possible if the
progression is done just right, I think.

 wrote in message news:8qfler$o1r@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Tokyo PUA,
>
> This is an excellent report.. You really rock!
>
> Where / how did you originally
> PU this chick though? Also, taking the chick over to see your
> weight training stuff is a clever idea.. liked that..!
> BTW, I thought you left already to the USA, how long are you still
> there for?

Right near my house in a dark alley at midnight on her way home!  She told
me later (post lay) that she was scared at first, but I had a really relaxed
attitude so she got comfortable with me afterwards.  As for the weight
training stuff later, it was great kino as I had her bend over slightly and
got right behind her to "help her with her form" while simultaneously
letting her slightly feel the form of my stiff wood pressed against her, and
other such intimate situations.

Still here till Oct 14 or so, with a trip to Taiwan and maybe Hawaii too
thrown in.

>
> ALso, do you usually go out alone, or with a wing. I noticed that
> you knew quite a few people in Roppongi, I guess you get out there
> quite a bit?

Been out there a lot since last February, maybe 10 times or so.  I guess
predominantly I go with a wing, but sometimes felt it screwed up my game.
Of course, my wings didnt know anything about seduction a la ASF, thats
probably why.  Of course, neither did I till June... I know Im much better
at street PU when alone though, thats for sure!  OTOH, when I went out to
clubs with you and Rio, I think my game was really improved and I was
learning all the time.
BTW, I have heard that someplace called club Earth near hamamatucho has
really hot babes, (bitch shield too, but who cares, right;-), so you guys
might want to check that out.  3000 Yen cover charge.  May be the new
alternative to Fura?

>
> > I managed to lay that HB Small Mouth
>
> EXCELLENT!
>
> >Ganbatte!  Im seeting HB Bi this weekend again (tonight), and HB
> >small the next day, and my ex-GF the next.  Im starting to feel like
> >Maniac juggling girls, but nothing will happen w/ my ex, so its not
> >so bad.
>
> Yes, I did that ALOT last year, and fucked a shitload of chicks that
> I cant even count now..
>
> but its really tiring and you do get sick of it after a while..
> so finally I just MLTR'd a few that I really liked, who also accepted
> that I fuck other chicks, and left it at that.. guess I got to get out
> more ;-)
> not sure if its the right way yet, but been doing it that way
> the last few months now.. We'll see ;-)

I think it goes in cycles.  Eventually you get tired of the MLTR's and have
to replace them.  To do that you will have to PU lotsa new chicks, lay them,
see if they dont eject when you break the news that there are others.  That
takes a lot of time, so then you want to go back to the easy life of having
a bunch of girls on call.  Then the cycle starts over.  Im just beginning to
get these girls into MLTR status, but now I have to leave.  But theres
always business trips ack here!

>
> If you are planning on hanging around TOkyo though, you should
> bring HB Bi and her friend to one of our fuck parties the next time..
> sounds like they'd be a good time.. maybe introduce them to Kipp or
> something since I am not there right now, before you leave.. or
> give me your departure date and see if they are interested and we
> can setup something with all the ladies, if this is your sort of thing..

Id consider it, but it will take more effort, and probably wont be anything
I can do until after Im gone and come back for business trips.  You see, I
worked it too good with HB Bi.  She is signing her letters with "Love" at
the end and is all into me now.  Made me the most awesome meal any woman has
ever made me, washed my clothes, gave me an amazing massage, etc.  When I
confronted her about our last threesome, she said that she felt jealous when
she saw me doing her friend, and claimed that was the only time she had ever
done something like that, that she isnt really Bi.
So right now I think she somehow sees a relationship in this, despite my
leaving?  I figure once Im gone I can get past that as reality sinks in and
maybe set up more stuff for any business trips I make back.

>
> Good post!
>
> Maniac
> http://www.pickupguide.com

Here are those notes I was talking about, for what they are worth:

-------------------------------------------
PU of HB Small:  happened in a dark alley shortcut to my house at midnight,
I approached carrying a 30 pound backpack on one shoulder and a 10 pound
bucket of protein powder in the other, and said,  $B!H (BExcuse me, your hair is
really beautiful. $B!I (B  She reacted favorably and said thanks, but kept
walking, slightly faster.  She seemed young, so I asked if she was a
student.  She said no, I asked what she does.  She said she works for a
cable company, I fluff talked about watching TV.  She asked what I do.  I
said I know its late but you should have coffee or tea with me at Jonathans
restaurant nearby.  She said no, so I said, OK, how do we meet again.  She
said give me your number and I said,  $B!H (BAh, but I know women, if I give you
my number you will get nervous and never call. $B!I (B  She said  $B!H (BNo, 
that wont
happen I promise. $B!I (B  I knew I didn $B!G (Bt have enough rapport or 
anything to
believe that, so really what I was just doing was stalling till I could set
up a firm date.

I got a pen and wrote my number and at this point we are standing on the
corner near my place.  I play on Japanese cuteness and write my name with
hearts by it.  (None of this is stuff I would be able to do in the US.)
Then I say, OK, when are we going to meet.  Its sort of a way to pace the
ongoing reality now that she has my number,its a logical extension.  The
number is just a formality to me, I want to set up the date.  After some
negotiation, I get a date set up for 6 PM Tuesday, her day off.  I had given
her alternatives between my place and eating in Tachikawa nearby (but both
already had the presuppostion that we are meeting for a date, so I don $B!G (Bt
care which she chooses).  She chose Italian in Tachikawa which is perfect
cause eating carbs increases seratonin (=relaxation), so I will lay on the
patterning after a while, maybe even order a glass of wine (more seratonin
and romance) for us both.  Then its a 5 minute taxi ride back to my place!

Anyway, we keep talking.  I get that she never has met a foreigner, that she
likes Richard Gere, cause he is  $B!H (BShibui $B!I (B. $B!! (B(=quiet, simple, 
sober,
tasteful, austere, parsimonious, etc.)  I asked her about her ideal man
while doing the (SP) thing.  She really accessed a lot and I was awakening
her creative centers.  I touched her a lot on the arm to anchor the good
feelings.   She said she really was too ideal, but that her ideal guy was
like her father, sweet and nice.  I asked if she wanted a guy who made her
feel safe, and she said yes.  I compared our hand sizes and got kino,
remarked at how small her hands were, that my big hands could protect her.
Complemented her smile and said that it seems like her eyes smile too and
she said that she is often told that.  She said I was skillful at
complementing and I said that I really meant it.

I mirrored her body positions a lot and this seemed to have a good effect.
She seemed really into it and wasn $B!G (Bt trying too hard to get away despite 
it
being after midnight and having to work the next day, only bringing up the
time when I did.  She was rubbing her earlobe, and later playing with her
ponytail in a really sexy way, all with the doggy dinner bowl look.
I also showed kanji ability and had her write her name, and demonstrated how
we could study English together, all using the Zaurus.  (BTW, Did you buy
one yet, Maniac? A useful tool in many ways.  You can turn it into a
portable digital photo album too, albeit poor quality...) She liked that.
At one point she asked what was in the bucket, I said protein powder and she
said  $B!H (Bnomitai! $B!I (B and I said  $B!H (B5 fun dake areba, nomeru 
yo. $B!I (B
(If you have 5
minutes I can give you a taste).  But she refused to go to my apartment and
I didn $B!G (Bt press the issue, I just reconfirmed our fun date on Tuesday, and
gave her a kiss goodnight, then took off.
----------------------------------

-T

ASF reader comments on above story

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website: 

http://www.pickupguide.com 

Many excellent followups to the Psychicbabe re-lay report!
Mrsex4unyc, RJ..etc..etc.

From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:05 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

In article <92jvre$obh@nnrp1.deja.com>, maniac_high@yahoo.com writes:

>The immediate gold to take care of this, is to now make the
>relationship very high stakes for her. I can do this because
>I know that she is into me (from what she said at the dinner),
>so the idea is to play it that if she doesnt do her job as a
>chick.. she will lose EVERYTHING as far as I am concern.
>Ok, that is the plan, here we go:

plan or no plan, essentially, you are telling her the truth.  on a long-enough
timeline, the survival rate for EVERYONE is ZERO.  sooner or later, everyone
you love will either leave you or die.  chicks don't seem to believe in this,
though it is the absolute truth.  they think that they can relate to you
FOREVER, REGARDLESS of what they do or how they act.  you are telling her HOW
she can REMAIN with you and what is going to get her EJECTED.  even though it
takes a long time, so it doesn't SEEM like this... this is what has happened to
EVERY chick's relationship that has gone away.  EVENTUALLY, she was not
fulfilling her womanly duties and her man left her for a   chick (younger,
sexier, richer, swallower...)  EVEN if she IS fulfilling her duties, if her man
like it from another chick MORE, she loses out either in a PERCENTAGE of her
benefits or she gets DUMPED and loses ALL of her benefits.  you are merely
explaining this to her and telling her what she needs to do IF she wants to be
with you... which you have already determined.  you are SELLING, and now you
are screening her to see if she is QUALIFIED and ABLE to buy.

>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations
>in relationship. 

I am getting to the point where I am going to do this.  I never do this with
chicks because I morph into whatever THEY are looking for and hook them that
way.  the thing for me is that being 10 months in with MLTR, she has REALLY
learned how to please me and the time I spend TEACHING her has become minimal
and the time I spend ENJOYING her is increasing :)  it is getting tougher and
tougher for other chicks to get my attention, because anything LESS than what I
have already is BULLSHIT to me.  the time I am spending talking to chicks is
mostly eliciting values and breaking their perceptions... just for fun :)  I
know IMMEDIATELY if I want sex from a chick, and if I don't, she is IMMEDIATELY
LJBF and I use her for practice and NEXT her at the end of the conversation.

I am seriously going to consider moving to a "demonstration of value -> SOI"
model, just because I have lost my patience with LISTENING to these bitches
talking about shit that really doesn't mean anything.  I know I am going to
NEXT them ANYWAY as soon as I realize they can't compete with MLTR, so why
listen to their shit FIRST?  I may as well let them know how great I am and
let them know what kind of woman I am willing to accept, and let them continue
from there.  there is also the cognitive dissonance issue of them KNOWING that
I am going to dump them if they are not sexy and CONTINUING to talk to me and
get to know me.  the more they talk to me, the more I hook them into
interacting with me.  the more they get hooked, the greater the PAIN OF
SEPERATION (credit: RJ) when they eventually get EJECTED.  since they KNOW
ahead of time what will get them ejected and they are still talking, they are
either planning to get in line OR setting themselves up for pain.  either way,
after SOI and their acceptance of the terms, there will have to be some sort of
TEST of their compliance.  even listening to what they have to say after SOI
counts as a REWARD for their entering into a "relationship" with me.  hmm... I
will consider this more.

>I go on to tell her that other girls I know also
>like me, ask me out alot, (doesn't matter if it is true or not,
>but chick 'competition logic' will kick in, and it will scare
>your mark to act). 

the reason I don't use this is that MLTR is an integral part of my life.  if I
were to play this "chicks dig me" card, it would belittle the actual
relationship I have with MLTR.  the only problem with THAT is that I am
screening for MORE MLTRs :)  I don't give a fuck about ONS because I can get
laid ANY NIGHT within an hour of talking to the chick I am talking to... in the
WAY I want to with a chick that I WANT TO FUCK :)  a chick offering me ONS is
like a chick offering me a dollar bill.  I already HAVE dollar bills... what do
I want hers for?  of course, there are some chicks that are just so HOT that
you want to try them out, but barring that scenario, ONS can bring you much
more ANGUISH than the satisfaction that accompanies it... PLUS it is the SAME
SATISFACTION that I already get on a regular basis from MLTR. 

besides... it is OBVIOUS that chicks dig me because here SHE is, liking me
within 20 minutes of meeting me... what about the chicks that have experienced
me for days?  months?  years?  OH, she could only HOPE to be one of those! :)

for you, it is a good tactic though.

>Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>her last week, apparently).

I lost a rap to a low-self-esteem bitch that had a couple of relationships like
this as well.  I mean, I fucked her, but I didn't get to MLTR like I wanted
because she was SCARED that she wouldn't match up to the next bitch and that I
would NEXT her for no reason, like her exes did.  I tried to tell her I wanted
her for more than that, but she wasn't emotionally healthy enough to understand
or believe me.

>Ok, now Maniac has reached her head, and I take this deeper..
>I go on to tell her that I dont want just sex, I want rocks and gold
>I can get any girl in roppongi on a Saturday night and fuck her
>(not exactly true, but she doesnt know this.. goal is just to

she KNOWS that it happened to her VERY QUICKLY.  she ASSUMES she was not the
ONLY bitch to fall for you that quickly.  it is like reverse-social-proof. 
fucking a bitch FAST makes them think you can fuck other bitches FAST.

>'confirm' her worst fears so that she acts), but its not enough for
>me. I want connection, good sex, and romance, with an intelligent
>woman, and that is why I want to date you (psychicbabe).

nice line.  this is another thing I will consider.  talking-up MLTR to them.  
I never considered this either, MAINLY because if you tell a chick what you
want her to do then you never know if she is manipulating you by being that
way, or if she arrived there NATURALLY... on her own.  interesting, LOTS of
style-change material happening right around the new year :)

>Then all of the sudden, she asks me about HBass (the chick staying
>at my place over the holidays), and freaks out about it. I tell
>her that she already knows all this, and exactly what is her point
>here?

although I am a GREAT fan of "quoting", I find that there need to be times to
engage in it and times to NOT engage in it.  this will depend on what you want
with the chick.  it is the same way you can't go from being a CHUMP to a MAN in
a chick's eyes... but you CAN go from being a MAN into a CHUMP :)  if you start
out telling a chick that you have a girlfriend AND that you fuck her, you leave
yourself open for these pot-shots whenever chicks trip the fuck out and go into
their irrational rants from out of left-field.  all a bitch needs to know is
that you are "taken" so that you manage her relationship expectations.  any
more information and she feels like you will give her ALL the information. 
where does it stop?  are you going to tell her that you are fucking her?  that
you fucked her last night?  that you fucked her an hour before coming on this
date?  that you fucked YOUR WOMAN in her ass?  that she LIKES sucking dick? 
WHERE DOES IT STOP?

I ran into this problem with a chick where my relationship to her was BASED ON
trading current sex-stories.  when I got to the point where I didn't want to
tell her any more shit, she was EXPECTING me to tell her, and I realized that
if I wasn't telling her, and she wasn't telling me, then our "relationship" was
OVER.  before that, I had not realized how much I had compromised my position
by telling her CURRENT sex-shit.  think about it, and decide on your own LIMITS
to what you are willing to tell a chick about other chicks... besides, think
about the fact that she is going to KNOW that she will end up as STORIES to
other bitches right after you fuck her.  it will make her VERY self-conscious
about whatever she does with you and that could hinder her emotional states
tremendously.

>Then she stops again, and asks me if I am fucking her (maybe I
>should have said no..., but I had already said yes to her about this
>the first time I saw her)., she asks me why.. (I tell her because
>I am seeing her! like I told you the first time! I mean what do
>you expect?!?).
>
>She then puts on her bitch face, and talks in a stern voice,
>"then call me when you break her up, that is my decision, I am
>going home.".

THIS is retarded because she ALREADY knew that you were fucking her AND she
fucked you herself.  this is another problem with bitches having information
about other bitches.  they use it against themselves.  IMO, the purpose of her
knowing you have another girl or SEVERAL other girls is so she knows where she
stands in the RACE to be your MAIN BITCH.  if you are single, she has a good
chance at being that to you.  if you are "taken" she has NO CHANCE of being
that to you.  if you are SEEING bitches, then she has to COMPETE to be your #1.
 other than THAT, I think giving information about your other bitches is a
mistake...  I have made the SAME mistake up to this point, so I am not
crisicizing :)  however, I am changing that ASAP and I think you should
consider giving out information on a N2K basis (need to know).

besides, SHE is the one that NEEDS a fuck.  if it is not coming from YOU, a guy
she has fucked ALREADY and she LIKES how you did it or she wouldn't have come
back... she has to get it from a STRANGER whose sexual skills are in question
that might tie her up, fuck her in the ass or sell her to the highest bidder. 
bitches like to FRONT a lot about having ALL these sexual choices, but with all
the 8s, 9s, and 10s I have spoken to on an honest "one of the chicks" level,
they are ALL looking to have an EXCITING time, but not REALLY be in DANGER! 
you, OTOH have pussy AT HOME IN BED WAITING FOR YOU!  the only one to lose out
if she bails... is HER!  knowing that, I would have not even entertained her
bullshit OR called her on it, letting her know that I was getting laid tonight
REGARDLESS of whether SHE fucks or not.  that would take the fucking WIND out
of her sails :)

>I tell her I am planning to break her up (which is true) later, so
>it is nothing you should worry about. 

this, my friend :)  is a COP-OUT!  it is used VERY EFFECTIVELY by married men
to keep fucking their side-bitches, but WE are way above bullshit tactics like
this.  I commend you for thinking of this "on the fly", but PLEASE, PLEASE! 
hehe  I have MUCH more respect for you as a PUA than to hear some CRAP like
this from you :)  PLEASE think of something better for the next instance of a
chick trying to BLACKMAIL you into trading in a R-E-L-A-T-I-O-N-S-H-I-P where
you are getting EVERYTHING you want from a chick... for a ONS with HER! 
HAHAHAHAHAHA  >:)

I haven't run into a chick STUPID enough to try to disrespect my MLTR for being
with me... chicks have STARTED to say she is dumb for "letting" (as if she has
ANY say in the matter) her man fuck other chicks, and I have BROKEN THEIR
FUCKING ASSES listing the benefits that SHE is getting that they will most
likely NEVER have with a man... EVER!  and CERTAINLY don't have right now, or
they would not be talking to me in a bar... they would be with THEIR OWN MAN
conducting this FANTASY RELATIONSHIP that they are professing that my MLTR
should have :)  I have NEVER run into a chick that has even TRIED to break into
my relationship with MLTR because they KNOW I mean business.  all they can do
is become ANOTHER MLTR... and after they hear the QUALIFICATIONS, they KNOW
they can't even achieve THAT... only ONS and LJBF with me.  if some bitch EVER
suggested that I break up with MLTR in order to ONS her, I would  A) laugh in
her face and  B) immediately demand an EXPLANATION of the reasons why she
thinks she can knock MLTR out of the box AND make her perform ANY AND ALL
SKILLS that she CLAIMS to be better than MLTR at IMMEDIATELY!  put up or SHUT
THE FUCK UP!  the result would be the ONS ANYWAY, and she would still be LJBF
or NEXT because MLTR is NOT about sex... it is about compatability and I
PERSONALLY could not be with some bitch that needs to knock other chicks off in
order to gain status.  I gain status by BEING MYSELF and letting bitches make
INTELLIGENT, EDUCATED decisions to be with me.  any chick that wants to be with
me had better do the same.

>she gets upset, and starts
>screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
>just like her ex-bf, getting other girls while dating her, and how
>all guys just want sex..etc..

I would have told her "you wanna calm the fuck down?"  throwing tantrums and
making scenes are expressions of her ability to do ANYTHING in your presence. 
I personally don't tolerate that.

>Then she says.. ok, if you let me meet your GF at your house
>tonight, then I will let you have sex with me. [ha! I got her!]

ok.  thank God I happened to read the next line before I started typing this. 
I was JUST going to ask you WHY you are STILL letting her blackmail you into
fucking her... ESPECIALLY when she is the one that needs it and you don't :)

>I bounce back, and say, "what exactly makes you think I am
>desperate to have sex with you tonight?! Do you think I am
>just some stupid guy and you can manipulate me like that?
>No, you will not meet my GF, it is disrespectful to her to do
>that. You know the situation, it was clear to you from the
>beginning, and you accepted it. There is no more to talk about.
>I am not here only for sex, I can get that anywhere. Sex only
>of itself is of little value to me, I want more than that.

SWEET!  :)  break her fucking ASS maniac :)

>I then bring out the nuclear weapons! My tonality is very firm,
>and I eye fuck her, while telling her the following. First, I tell
>her that I already told her about my GF, she was clear about it
>right from the start, and she has NO excuse. Then I go on to tell
>her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
>that did NOT happen. So do NOT compare me to your ex. I am a
>different person, and EXCEPT better treatment than that if you
>ever want to see me again. She starts crying more, and hugging
>again.

ugh :/   fucking IDIOTS!   man, the shit some bitches put you through!  does
everyone SEE why we have to study this shit?

>I put her against wall, and tell her not to complain about me like
>I am her ex, I a am different person than he is.
>
>I tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>alone!

this is a good point.  I like to play it the other way:

ok... so now, you have told me that you want everything to be a 'perfect'
situation with a guy before making a move.  You want him to be ideal with
women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady... WHAT MAKES YOU THINK
HE WILL WANT YOU?   WHAT ARE YOU BRINGING TO THE TABLE THAT IS GOING TO MAKE A
MAN LIKE THAT CHOOSE YOU OVER ANY OTHER CHICK?

you wanna see some confusion?  you wanna see a bitch get BROKEN?  HAHAHAHA  >:)
 of course, I use this on chicks that I am just practicing on, because it
normally induces DEPRESSION, not horniness.  when they have to GO DEEP INSIDE
and dive BELOW THE SURFACE of their programming, they realize that they CAN NOT
TELL ME WHY A MAN WOULD WANT THEM!  they stall the fuck out dude :)  it's
amazing.  matter of fact, it's documented already.  look at my recent thread
with "telembe".  I let her say all this bullshit about what she wanted from a
guy in order to give up her virginity, then when she was finished talking about
what she WANTED, I asked her what she was OFFERING to a guy that was going to
give her all this committment and "love" and other bullshit and she said a
whole bunch of shit that ANY bitch can and WILL give to a man she likes.  she
might have THOUGHT she had something to offer a guy that was going to seperate
her from the pack, but she doesn't.  even GOOD PUSSY can't get a bitch any
credit because there are LOTS of bitches that can fuck and suck like pros...
elites AND sub-elites.  telembe NEVER told us what seperates her from the rest
of the bitches that might make a MAN like the one she wants even LOOK HER WAY! 
the reason is that there is NO reason! :)  bitches are programmed that MEN want
them... but they are NEVER told WHY.  the reason is that men like to FUCK and
get their dicks sucked.  they also like companionship and cooking and cleaning
and for a girl to look good on their arm so they can feel accomplished around
their buddies.  chicks THINK they are ENTITLED to a good man... but the GOOD
MEN... are picking GOOD WOMEN!  if they were SHINING like they think they are,
they would have been scooped up already and married or whatever they were
looking for because some guy would have spotted her and said "I'm not going to
let her go for ANYTHING" and she would be happy... at least according to her
programming.  OH, how I LOVE to see a bitch's face while she TRIES AND TRIES to
dig up ANY reason why a guy as great as the one she claims to want would EVER
choose her over any other bitch :)  the JOY the JOY that I feel as this POMPOUS
BITCH breaks the fuck down RIGHT IN FRONT OF MY FACE! :)  of course since I
broke her, I keep talking to her and ease her back to a decent state of being
and let her know that she can take steps to make herself into the woman that a
man would want, but she has to really KNOW HERSELF and KNOW MEN in order to
make an intelligent decision.  I am not into depressing chicks... unless they
TRULY DESERVE IT for all the depression they have caused men throughout their
tenure as FINE bitches :)  also, I have no desire to BREAK bitches and leave
them like that.  that just makes it WORSE for ALL OF US looking for FINE, yet
DECENT chicks.

>she cries, and says that is so true, that is her problem, she never
>takes the chance and loses out because she doesn't make the
>move on taken guys. Then I run my 'take chances routine' (if you take
>a chance, in the end, the result is usually good, but if you don't,
>just you get left behind, by yourself).. 

nice.  I like that one... emphasizing loss and loneliness.

>she cries more, says she
>needs to take the chance, and doesnt want to be alone.

she's done :)  nice work.  land her!

>She says she has to be careful, that all guys want just sex, and
>bitches about this for about 30 seconds.

as opposed to what?  what does she WANT guys to want?

>Now I start the 'you need me, I dont need you..you think I just want
>only sex, then you dont understand me at all.. if you think that is
>what I am only, then you do NOT deserve me.. I do no need you to go out
>with me if that is what you think I am.. I want connection, sex,
>passion, and closeness.. and if you haven't figured that out about
>me yet, then get another guy, because you dont understand me at all..

OK OK OK... you've CONVINCED me maniac :)  that's some good shit right there :)
 starting NOW, I am pitching for MLTR ONLY.  bitches that want ONS or LJBF will
get what they deserve from me... which isn't much.  I LOVE this idea of dissing
her for claiming that you are looking for ONS... or even just a "bootie-call"
type relationship :)  I love it.  I would feel so PROUD getting on her like
this.  sweet!  EXTREMELY congruent!  nice play!  this is going into my style,
starting RIGHT NOW!  :)

>I am doing this, because I know the left (logic) and right (emotions,
>passion) are fighting each other..they have been all night. Because the
>left doesn't accept the logic of the situation, but I know the right side
>dying for a shag,..she is trying to rationaize going out with a taken guy,
>but I have gotten her so excited tonight, that she needs that fuck.

THIS is the reason I never learned any of this shit until recently.  my
caveman-kino style before this involved ZERO talking.  totally kino and kissing
and PHYSICAL seduction with domineering EYE-CONTACT.  there was NO INFORMATION
for the left side to process at all.  EVERYTHING went STRAIGHT to the chick's
right side, and her left had to try to process the EMOTIONS and turn them into
a story that she could understand... in the meantime, she is PHYSICALLY falling
for the kino and wanting MORE AND MORE until we are fucking.  I never HAD to
talk to chicks before OR after fucking them because my PHYSICAL ATTACK is so
DEVASTATING!  I would just take them over PHYSICALLY and their right brains
would do ALL the work and the left would struggle to understand, but eventually
succumb to the onslaught!  ARG ARG! :)

thanks for explaining that to me :)

>As I touch her side of face, she goes doggy look, I kiss her, and she
>gets like screambabe, panting. I put leg between her, she widens, goes nuts
>totally. I ask her she likes me (in a tell her sort of way' you like me..'),
>she replies 'yes'. I say (stare her down) .. she asks "what should I do?"
>I say in a very strn fatherly voice while staring her down 4 inches from
>her head.. you will follow me..that is what you will do.. and you will do
>what I say. 'she says, 'I will'. I tongue her down more, run her crotch,
>she almost cums right there, then I take her to a love hotel (her first
>time!), no resistance what so ever.

interesting.  what just happened here?  did you somewhere dictate to her that
the terms of her being "your bitch" is that she has to sumbit to you fully? 
are you getting a verbal confirmation of that from her?  or is something else
going on... like she just plain UNDERSTANDS that you can move her to passions
that make her WANT to cum and that you are going to take her there and over the
edge?

another point... what do you guys think of foreplay on a chick.  he mentions
that she almost came right there... do you think it is good to get her to the
EDGE and leave her there so she is so horny, she will do ANYTHING for you to
make her cum, OR to give her an orgasm right there in her clothes to
demonstrate your sexual mastery over her?  personally, I am into the sexual
mastery thing because I notice a newfound RESPECT from a chick that has had
guys on top of her NAKED, fucking her for all they were worth and she never
came from it, and then I am just doing kino on her and fingering her and she
cums from just that.  do you think that making the chick cum on herself makes
her want sex MORE or want it LESS since she just got off?  take into account
that chicks are multi-orgasmic and that they feel sexier after cumming, not
DRAINED like guys.

>As I am fucking her, I am putting things in her head, like D.Shades reports.
>I tell her as she is screaming it feels deeper and deeper, closer and
>closer. She is going nuts will I am fucking her.

I need to reasearch this.  is this more right-brain, left-brain shit where her
left-brain is shut down because of the FIREWORKS that are going off in her mind
because of the sex, leaving her wide open to suggestion?  if you have any links
for this, please post.

>I stare her down, and I tell her you need me (during sex), she says yes.
>I tell her from now on you will follow me, and do what I say. She says
>'yes, I will'. I continue doing her, she says "it feels SO good, I really
>need that, I really want it, i love you inside me!".. she is fucking like a
>wild animal, loud voice, shouting and screaming, oh, I want it, give it
>to me, I want to come!

more of the same?

>Then she tells me anything is ok as long as I dont hate her..she doesnt
>want me to hate her. She wants me to hold/hug her, she cries a bit, then is
>ok again (seems to be thinking of her old bf she says). I touch her
>more, face goes totally doggy look, and finger her, she goes nuts, we start
>fucking again.

the "I don't want you to hate me" thing is very important in the D/s
relationship... not that you set this up like that, but that is the MAIN
incentive for her to follow your lead... that she does NOT want you to hate her
and CERTAINLY not to banish her.  when that is TRULY first and foremost in her
brain, she will regulate HERSELF and place herself in-line with your thinking
and what YOU want her to be.  she also won't try to blackmail you anymore
because she KNOWS it gets on your nerves and all THAT will do is get her
EJECTED sooner rather than later :)

>Her back is on the bed, and I am fucking her missionary, her legs are
>spread and wide in the air, which I am holding. I tell her "see, I control
>you, 

hehe ok... this is a little FAR-FETCHED for me at this point, but I have not
researched it yet :)  I DO like the next line though.

>I go deep in your body because it is the one way to reach you totally
>deep in your mind which no one else can do. 

interesting

>By conquering your body, I can
>conquer your mind (then I drill her a bit more after I finish the sentence so
>she goes more crazy). I play with your body because it lets me control
>your mind (then drill her some more..ha, it is like the ultimate form of
>reward hypnosis).

IS there such a thing as reward hypnosis?  links please? :)

>I ask her, so why you like me. She says she says, you are decisive and
>sometimes I am indecisive, so you make it easy for me. I want the guy
>to make it easy for me to decide what to do (important clue here Maniac!
>maybe most chicks are like this! Maybe this too is where I fucked up
>with HB Geek!)

I have heard this a lot too... only thing is that there is a lot of
RESPONSIBILITY that comes with telling a chick what to do, and if the VALUE of
owning her is not sufficient for me, I don't give a fuck WHAT she does enough
to want to lead her to a good time.

>Moral of the story.. keep your ground.. call all chick bullshit DIRECTLY.
>Make the chick risk fear losing the relationship if she doesn't capitulate
>and chances are she will back down, in spite of how it looks (and I could
>do this BECAUSE I had other choices.. another reason to be fucking
>several chicks at once). As well, it seemed that she was giving me all the
>bullshit in part because she WANTED me to call her on it, and then fuck her
good
>at the end of the night, which I obliged.

chicks give you shit-tests to find out if you are stronger than them and see
HOW you are going to control them.  chicks like the way I control them because
I NARROW their choices for them, but STILL make them choose.  they can choose
the path of ULTIMATE SATISFACTION, or they can choose the path of EJECTION and
being back on the dating scene meeting the SAME LAME GUYS every night :)

you had told her you had a girlfriend, but she seems to have NEEDED to know
that she really COULDN'T have you all to herself and that you really DIDN'T
NEED to fuck her that night or EVER.  you stuck to your guns (after letting her
get to you for a while :-) and she eventually ran out of logic and got
overridden with kino and gave up the fucking pussy like she came there to do :)

>Constructive comments/opinions welcome!
>
>Maniac High
>http://www.pickupguide.com

EXCELLENT!  keep up the GOOD WORK dude!  :)

---
From: erosla77@aol.com (ErosLA77)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 30 Dec 2000 20:12:47 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

>Subject: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit
special!]
>From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
>Date: Fri, Dec 29, 2000 10:37 PM
>Message-id: <92jvre$obh@nnrp1.deja.com>

>)this chick is a very highly educated, driven, professional
> career woman and earns likely a big 6 figure salary
>b)she is very mature, focused and spends all day in her office
> surrounded by sharks and other pirrhana type scumbag characters

 She's got to be in control ALL DAY LONG at work. Small wonder then, with a
man, she wants to fully SURRENDER control and be made to submit.  It's like all
those super-powerful Congressmen and Judges and the like who LOVE going to get
pissed-on and whipped by some Madame Dominatrix. 

>I regroup my thoughts.

 I admire your ability to do this in the field, Maniac. As you think about it,
what do you do internally to re-set yourself and keep yourself in a good frame
of mind when all this shit throws your way?

>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations

   Metahpor is a POWERFUL tool to move folks from a fixed perception to a new
one. Please, share your story!

> Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>her last week, apparently).

Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with fucking; it feels
good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the vulnerabilities.  So
when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which overcomes the
potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. She's worried about pain,
so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not only losing
out on the pleasure of screwing, BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out that if
she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even WORSE
crack-up.

  Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.

>he gets upset, and starts
>screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
>just like her ex-bf,

See? The fear of the pain of being hurt just like her ex-BF hurt her is now
rearing its ugly head.  She doesn't seem like a very emotionally stable person
in ANY event, let alone having just been dumped by a guy.  

>Then I go on to tell
>her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
>that did NOT happen

 Sharp thinking. Again, what do you do internally to keep your state solid and
your thinking sharp? THAT process internally is of great value, even more than
the specifics you share.  The specifics are like handing guys fish; good for a
nice meal and of value. But  how you get to the mind-set is TEACHING someone
HOW to fish so they can eat for life. 

>I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>alone!

 Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to her her
"ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she can then
accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!  

   Excellent...Maniac, I don't give a damn WHAT my orthodox SS followers say,
this is BRILLIANT stuff and I'd be proud to be your wing or have you as mine,
ANY FUCKIN' DAY of the week! Sir, I salute you!

>Now what I am doing with all the above, is not arguing the logic (too
>much)
>of this, because, of course she is right, and I know this.

 Actually, you ARE not arguing the logic, but you are USING the logic...HER
logic..HER way of viewing things.....pointing out WHY and HOW she loses and
what will happen if she doesn't stop it.   It's all centered around losing and
WHY she loses, based on what she has told you.  It IS logical, FROM her point
of view.  

 Great, Great stuff...sir, I salute you!

-----

From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]
Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2000 12:03:54 GMT

Replies to various people about psychicbabe:

Answers to various questions:

Was psychicbabe british, or Japanese?
She was a brit of Japanese ancestry (ie. she
looked 'j', but thought, acted and had an
english accent like a brit). This in my
opinion made it harder, because brit women
are so fucking F A T, and she was so
slender, sexy and attractive (and she dressed
to kill) compared to all of them. Lots of guys were
hitting on her (and she said she always got hit
on, and hated it.. trick was to not make it look
like a 'hit').

Why not a white chick? Well, I had the chance...
but.. at the conference where I met her, EVERY
brit. white chick there was in serious blimp bulge
territory.. very scary. Why is it so many caucasian
women are so FAT?

It was funny though, because something like 8 guys
(I counted) tried to hit on psychicbabe the night
I PU'd her. One guy was pretty good, the rest were
total AFC's..it was rather funny.

Re: Rocks -vs- gold.. how I use it (yes, it is
Jake's metephor. For RJ, search the original post
on fastseduction.com. It is also on pickupguide.com
someplace (if not it will be there in about 2 weeks,
I am revising the page this week). Basically, I intro
it as follows:
After chick says bullshit about wanting to go to
dinner and be friends or shit for 6 months before
becoming a GF, I say: Actually, I dont go to dinner
or stuff like that with ladies who are not my GF
CHick:  gasps!
Maniac: see, going to dinner, is an important step
in a relationship for me. I only share it with someone
special
chick: Huh?
Maniac: Well, let me put it this way, do you ever
sleep with a guy who is just your friend, or dont
care about?
chick: of course not!
Maniac: well, why do you think a guy should do any
different then?
Maniac: See, let me tell you a story. You ever hear
about 'rocks & gold'?
chick: no? what is it?
Maniac: Well, Relationships are valuable things.
And each partner is looking for something. It is like
diamonds (rocks) and gold. Both are valuable.

But women prefer diamonds to gold (usually), and
men prefer gold to diamonds (usually). Of course,
both are important, especially in a long term
relationship, but if a woman could choose, she would
prefer the diamonds  first, and the man would
prefer the gold  first. right?

chick: yeah, probably

Maniac: And (generally), a man can accept gold
without the diamonds, and a woman can accept
diamonds without any gold.

So in a relationship, a woman is mining for
diamonds, while the man is mining for gold.
While they are in the mine together, the
guy gives diamonds he finds to the woman, and
the woman gives the gold she finds, to the man.

But if you give a woman gold only, or a man
diamonds only.. neither is likely to be
very happy, and the relationship will soon
fall apart. In short, an exchange of sorts
takes place in a successful relationship.

And also, if a man expects just gold (sex),
but doesnt want to give her diamonds
(relationship & the mushy stuff), then she
will dump him fairly soon, because he is
playing/using her just for sex..

And if a woman expects just diamonds (walks,
attention, nice dinners, movies..etc) without
giving some gold (sex), then he (if he has any
clue about how to deal with women, though many
men do not, especially in North America) will
dump her because she is using/playing him just
for his personality.

A guy taking a chick to dinners, buying shit
and giving nice walks without sex is THE SAME
as a guy sleeping with a girl, and then kicking her
out right after the fuck is over. (chick says:
'yelch!'. Yes, thats right, and for the guy,
just dinners and buying shit is 'yelch', with
no sex, and no attention is exactly the same.

Because a woman will go to free dinner with
almost any guy, it has no value to me. But
I am like you, I want attention, and I want
to be made to feel special.

And although a girl will go to nice free dinners
with almost anyone, I also know that a girl will
not sleep with anyone. So I know if she does with me,
then it means she thinks I am important. And if
she wont, then it means she doesnt care about me
at all, so I really dont need to see her again,
I will just go find another girl.

Maybe you might think it is unusual for a guy
to think this way, but it is just my way.

See, I dont want to be played. Guys are always
getting played by girls for nice dinners, long
talks on the phone, and for their personalities.
It is the SAME as a girl being used for sex.
So I am happy to give plenty her diamonds, but at
the same time, I dont want to be played, so
I also expect her to want to give me gold.
And if she doesn't, it means she doesnt care about
me, is using me, or it means I am being played,
or I am stupid.

As well, experience has also showed me that
'friends first' almost NEVER results in a
relationship. I mean how many of your BFs were
your friend first (chick usually replies..uh,
zero).

Exactly, so that is why I never play 'friends
first'. Friends first means diamonds for the
lady, and no gold for the guy. That is like
the guy saying (ok, lets fuck for 6 months,
and if its good, we can go to dinner, and go
out, and you can be my GF). Would you like
that (chick: yelch!!).

Exactly.. so that is why it is far better,
that the lady meet me, get to know me, and
then I expect her to be smart enough to know
to take that chance THEN (or reject it, and I will
go get another lady) when it is offered to her.

So that is why I expect things that way in a
relationship with a lady.

After this, a chick is (usually) quite impressed,
or surprised and doesnt know what to say..

[When I recited this to psychicbabe, she actually told me
she was very impressed, that I understood relationships
so well ;-) ]

Had I been smart, I would have used it on HB
geek, and laid her, but after that failure I
thought about it, and then when the same situation
came up with Psychicbabe this week, I knew what
to do..

Ok, now on to other comments..

RJ writes
>Maniac writes:
> >I regroup my thoughts.
>
>  I admire your ability to do this in the field, Maniac. As you think
about it,
> what do you do internally to re-set yourself and keep yourself in a
good frame
> of mind when all this shit throws your way?

A couple things.. first, this PARTICULAR chick is of no importance
to me, because I am (likely) seeing 3 others this week. So it is
not as risky to me to be firm, and keep my ground.

Another important fact, is the way chick's brains are usually
wired. For a
chick, once she likes a given guy, it is hard for her to immediately
switch to another guy. it is far MORE risky, because a chick (unlike
men), usually cannot switch to another guy, once she ALREADY
likes a given guy (story is different BEFORE you got her to
like you..then SHE has more power than you).

So I play on this, and as a result I dont feel nervous/scared at all,
because there is far more to risk to her, than to risk to me. Because
she is stuck to me, but I am not stuck to her. (this also is why
'jerks' can get away with so much shit on any given chick, and why
she will tolerate it.. because her brain has now got her focussed
on THAT guy, and it is now a choice (in her mind), between him (and
his bullshit... or being alone (sure she can get another guy in 10
minutes, but she cannot build those nice feelings of 'attachment'
in 10 minutes.. that gives us men power, once we realize this).

Two, I am generally a very balanced level
headed person, and dont take any of this personally (as you already
know, RJ). Three (in this case), I had
already laid this chick, so I didnt care really if I laid her again
or not.. I already conquered her, and she (and I) already knew that.

If it is a new chick, sometimes, I get more nervous/fucked up (see
HB Geek). I am trying to keep my senses more when this happens

> > Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
> >problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
> >her last week, apparently).
>
> Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with
fucking; it feels

Not sure about this, I think she just simply wanted the fuck, but
wanted to feel she was important to me, and she didnt want to just
get played..

> good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the
vulnerabilities.  So
> when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which
overcomes the
> potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. She's worried
about pain

yes, thats right.

> so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not
only losing
> out on the pleasure of screwing,

Not really. I actually made it clear to her that I didnt care if
she bang me or not. The point was that she had to give her mind
to me, and respect me, and follow me (whether that is bang me,
make her take off her clothes in the window for me, or do my
dishes..whatever.. its not the banging that is important, it is
the submission to me that counts, and what she needs to give me
if she wants my attention at all).

> BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
> believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out
that if
> she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even
WORSE
> crack-up.

Yes

>   Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.
>
> >he gets upset, and starts
> >screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
> >just like her ex-bf,
>
> See? The fear of the pain of being hurt just like her ex-BF hurt her
is now
> rearing its ugly head.  She doesn't seem like a very emotionally
stable person
> in ANY event, let alone having just been dumped by a guy.

No, she is not stable at all. I think though, it is because she
bottles it up all day, to be the 'office bitch' that she has to
be in the daytime. This chick lives for her work. She has no other
life.

>
> >Then I go on to tell
> >her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
> >that did NOT happen
>
>  Sharp thinking. Again, what do you do internally to keep your state
solid and
> your thinking sharp? THAT process internally is of great value, even
more than
> the specifics you share.  The specifics are like handing guys fish;
good for a
> nice meal and of value. But  how you get to the mind-set is TEACHING
someone
> HOW to fish so they can eat for life.

Actually, the specifics are important I think. This is why lay/field
reports with details are so important. I think really shitty on my
feet. I really suck.. bad.

But if I have had that same experience before (with another chick),
or been in that same situation before, and
either succeeded (or failed, and then thought about how to handle it
right the next time), then I will handle it correctly this time.

I really believe in field experience. I have alot... really alot.
so I have seen many of these situations before. It is like chess,
or a foreign language. If you've been there before, and worked out
a solution, then you know what to do. You MUST get field experience.
It is CRUCIAL. And each time you fail, you go home, and see what
you did right/wrong, and what you would do if the same situation
happened again. This is why I also post the fuckup as well as
the lay reports.. they are very valuable to me in gathering my
thoughts and forcing me to think about what I did right/wrong,
as well as listening to the other's comments about them on this
NG.

I also look at the other's reports as well, and learn about
situations, and ask myself for each one, if it happened to me,
what would I do/how would I handle it. Eventually, after doing it
for a couple years (I have been at this in ernest for about 2
years now), you get better at it. Learning situations in PU, is
like learning the words of a foreign language, and how to connect
them all together.. how to move from a bad situation..to a good
one to get the chick in a horny state..

Also, I keep in mind alot about what MrSex4uNYC says about attitude,
and when I get stuck, I ask myself, what would NYC tell me right
now about this situation. He is very congruent, and if you think
things this way, it is easy to be clear what is the right way or
wrong way.

> >I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
> >with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
> >with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
> >and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
> >unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
> >alone!
>
>  Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to
her her
> "ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she
can then
> accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!

Yes, basically that is the idea. I am not sure that it means I am
an authority, but its more, to convey that she is clueless, she
is wrong, so to listen to herself will make her fuck up even more..
..so maybe she had better listen to me instead, and then she wont
fuckup as much.. basically that is the idea..

>    Excellent...Maniac, I don't give a damn WHAT my orthodox SS
followers say,

I didn't get this.. What are orthodox SS followers, and I had no
idea they were saying anything about this.. I really dont understand
what you mean here..

> >Now what I am doing with all the above, is not arguing the logic (too
> >much)
> >of this, because, of course she is right, and I know this.
>
>  Actually, you ARE not arguing the logic, but you are USING the
logic...HER
> logic..HER way of viewing things.....pointing out WHY and HOW she
loses and
> what will happen if she doesn't stop it.   It's all centered around
losing and
> WHY she loses, based on what she has told you.  It IS logical, FROM
her point
> of view.

Yes, basically that is the idea. What I meant was, is that her main
point is that she wants a monogamous BF, and doesn't want to be played.
But, I am playing her, and she (at some level) realizes that, so
in essense, her gut feel about this is totally correct.

But I am playing her desire for the fuck, and her fear of losing
out, which lets me bypassing her gut feel that she is being
played, and then I can get her to fuck anyways.

Good followups everyone!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

-----

From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]
Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2001 12:10:23 GMT

  "Dohn Joe"  wrote:
>  wrote in message news:92n7b96
@nnrp1.deja.com...
> [snip]
>
> The more I think of it, the more this seems to be a great PU.
> I think the PU in England is the gist of your piece of work.
>o I'd be glad to see more
> details on how you picked her up in England, that's the hardest work. How
> did you stand up the crowd? How did you make it not look like a PU?

I was using psychological 'jujitsu' (use the strength of your
opponant, against themself). There is a field report from 2 months
ago, that outlines the PU (check fastseduction.com archives).
Basically, I met her at a conference. I didnt talk to her much.
Then I followed her onto a bus that was taking us to the next
meeting place. A guy was hitting on her, and he sat with her.
I sat on the seat in front bymyself.

She (like most british bitches), started complaining about how
she hates men, and other bullshit. The guy on the bus with her
is taking this/agreeing with it (if I remember right).

I just turned around (and tonality and eye contact here is crucial),
and just tell her in a VERY authoritative voice, slowly.. "perhaps
you have just not met the right man yet, one you understands you,
deeply, and completely. But.. you never know the future.. now do you..
I used killed eye contact, spoke slowly, and continued "perhaps
if you open your mind more, you might find him.. by surprise, without
even expecting it, because often, that is the way it usually is..see"

Psychicbabe went "maybe", and then started more manhating bitching.

I then described the kind of man she wanted "one you could rely on,
but at the same time, be mysterious, and exciting in some unexpected
ways, because he just knew how to reach you deep inside you, and
your mind.. that is what your looking for..isnt' it?"

Psychicbabe: yes,

{continue PU, bunches of stuff from the ManiacPlan, if I remember
right}

The key here was the tonality and Eye-Fuck contact. That is what
did it more than the words I used. I just totally crushed her
with it..

> How did
> you get past her "bitch office" shield? I'm asking especially because, as I
> picture this woman, it would seem pretty intimidating for me to approach
> her.

I had the attitude that she obviously had never met a man that
knew how to give it to her right, which means that she obviously
needed ME far more than I needed her. That mindset made it easy.

> I admire your ability to take her from there into total submission.
> existing relationship than guys. That's why many (even HOT ones) find
> themselves in a dead end - boring or abusive - relationship, love to
> complain about it to whoever they find to listen, yet are unable to step out

EXACTLY!!

> of it. That's why the first fuck is hard - after that she is bound
> emotionally to you. You see,

>Women's sexuality is DISSOLVED in them.

Yes! you understand it!! (true for most, but not all chicks though,
some just like sport fucking, like we do)

> GREAT words to remember for all us RAFCs when we feel like beating the walls
> after a fuckup... I myself am so darn depressed when coming back after an
> unsuccessful encounter with a chick. Yes, each field experience is one more
> lesson

Yes, do NOT underestimately field experience. It is SO important.
I fucked up TONS (see all the fuckup reports I used to post a couple
years ago on ASF), and I still fuckup alot (see HBGeek, or HockeyBabe).
Over on cliff's list they say it takes 2..4 years to get good
at something, and 10 years to be a master. I TOTALLY agree.
I have only been at this for 2.. 2 1/2 years. And the more I learn,
the more I realize I still need to learn.. There is still TONS that
I dont know yet.

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

----
From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:08 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

I, for one, am really GLAD to see a post from RJ that has helped me move
forward in MY game :)  not that I am an ingrate hehe... his contribution to all
this is UNDENIABLE to begin with and if I hadn't stumbeled onto his site, I
would have still been using my caveman tactics and my MENTAL seduction game
would still be lacking.  as much as I appreciate his contribution to the
seduction game in general, I had been disappointed with all the flaming and
nonsense that he and others had/have been involved with because I thought that
this NG was BASED on USEFUL interaction between him and the rest of us, but I
found that not to be the case :(  not that ANYONE gives a fuck what I have to
say about this, but I wanted to back up into the PAST to make it clear that I
appreciate RJ's PERSONAL contribution to the NG TODAY.

In article <20001230151247.26801.00001467@ng-fi1.aol.com>, erosla77@aol.com
(ErosLA77) writes:

>>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations
> 
>   Metahpor is a POWERFUL tool to move folks from a fixed perception to a new
>one. Please, share your story!

I have been doing this without identifying it:

A) find out her perception (marriage, monogamy, sucking dick VS kissing...)
B) "quote" her a story illustrating a chick that saw things a DIFFERENT way
(the way I want HER to see things) and benefitted GREATLY from it (she is still
with me, she got married to the guy she wanted, she gained inner peace and
self-love...)
C) watch her AGREE with something that she just minutes ago BELIEVED was
incorrect, or not for her.

the most fascinating part is (C) because I didn't realize my powers of
validation, pacing then LEADING had developed so strongly.  this is partially
because I am an empath and can FEEL when a chick moves into different emotional
states so I can relate to her from within her own state and effectively "vulcan
mind-meld" with her, turning the TWO of us into a SINGLE, functioning entity so
that I can dictate for US... to a degree.

a frequent situation is chicks asking me if I am single.  basically, I explain
to them that I am in an "open" relationship.  they practically INVARIABLY
disrespect my MLTR for being stupid. "how can she go for that?" "I would have
dumped you" "I would never let a man see other women"...  sooooo :)  I let them
go on and on and get it all out and completely ENTRENCH themselves in the DREAM
of them being with a man like me AND dumping me or CHANGING me or whatever
their BULLSHIT FANTASIES are at the time.  THEN I go into the BENEFITS of being
MY PRIMARY relationship... :)  when I stack up the LIST of BENEFITS and it
stacks HIGHER than those bitches have in their OWN RELATIONSHIPS RIGHT NOW,
they start thinking.  they think about what LITTLE they really have in their
relationships that MY MLTR is getting.  they think about the TRUST and
COMPANIONSHIP between us that they DON'T HAVE with their borefriends.  they
think about how she is SEXUALLY SATISFIED... DAILY if she wants it.  she has
someone to give her the REAL DEAL on how men are and what we want from
chicks... not someone that's going to keep playing her until he is finished
fucking her.  they ALSO see how the other bitches (like them in the near
future) come and go and MLTR CONSTANTLY receives the benefits of being with a
man that does EVERYTHING for her that she could want... for the MERE price of
NOT bailing because I fuck other chicks :)  once I break it down to them, ALLLL
I see on their faces is ENVY.  matter of fact, they tend to look EMBARRASSED
when I ask THEM about THEIR relationships.  oh, that reminds me... the bitches
that DON'T HAVE A MAN AT ALL fare the WORST in these situations.  my MLTR has
NEVER-ENDING SATISFACTION... they have STORIES of what they WOULD DO... IF
they could get a man AT ALL!  :)

chicks would rather have 20% of a WINNER than 100% of a LOSER!

>> Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>>her last week, apparently).
>
>Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with fucking; it
feels
>good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the vulnerabilities.  So
>when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which overcomes the
>potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. 

wow!  VERY powerful :)  I had really considered these to be apples and
oranges... pain of emotions after sex and pain of LOSS of the individual. 
however, discomfort is discomfort.  I quit giving UTILITY to this PIVOT I was
using because I realized she had ZERO self-esteem and not many other redeeming
qualities other than her looks.  she went from LJBF to NEXT overnight.  I had
been using her for a pivot because of her looks, but her lack of personality
started to wear on me and finally, she had to go.  no more hanging out, no more
phone calling, no more help with her love-life... nothing... cold turkey. 
completely FORGOT about her.  about a month or so later, the holiday season
comes around and she  A) calls me  B) tells me she bought me something for
christmas (I bought her NOTHING, not even a CARD and didn't bother to get one
when she told me she bought me something)  C) tells me she wants to bring it TO
my house, and  D) shows up with gift in hand, READY to socialize and spend time
with me.  

this is the SAME bitch that NEVER went in her purse to even OFFER to throw in
money when I used to use her for a pivot.  I didn't mind paying for her though
because the benefits I got from being out with an attractive chick that KNOWS I
am out to get OTHER bitches and facilitates that was well worth it :)  hehe... 
too bad for her, MLTR was over and I received her gift, talked to her for a
while (where she told me her recent "relationship" blew the fuck up in her face
:-) and then ejected her to keep having fun with MLTR.

I have been using outfoxer's style of letting bitches get involved in bullshit
relationships, TELLING THEM the relationships are bullshit then letting them
fall FLAT on their faces and come CRAWLING back to me :)  I just haven't added
the part yet where I get indignant that they are giving sex to CHUMPS that use
them like BITCHES and throw them away.  hehe it is fun enough at this point
just to hear about their FAILURES from the horses' mouths and see the sad looks
on their faces, while I am CONSTANTLY SMILING :)

what you described is BASICALLY what happened to her, except NOT in the sexual
content, but in the companionship content.  she THOUGHT she had a solid
position with me as my pivot, so she didn't feel like paying for anything
because she thought I NEEDED her, not WANTED her.  as soon as I didn't want her
anymore and dumped her from LJBF to NEXT, she was OK with it UNTIL her
relationship BACKFIRED... THEN she decides she wants to get back in good with
ME, which she can't do because I don't give a fuck about her and except for
looks, she can't compete with MLTR AT ALL!

the pain of loneliness overrides the emotional pain of sex without
committment... fascinating :)

>She's worried about
>pain, so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not only
>losing out on the pleasure of screwing, BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
>believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out that if
>she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even WORSE
>crack-up.
>
>  Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.

ok, this is interesting too.  "this is why you fucked up with your ex and I
feel the same way about that particular topic".  you are FORECASTING her
EJECTION unless she changes her ways.  she is still WITH YOU and has a chance
to do the right thing instead of getting ejected.  she already knows how it
feels to BE ejected by her EX and doesn't WANT to go through that pain AGAIN
with you.  you dictate to her HOW she could have avoided it with her EX and she
learns how to avoid it with you and gets in line.  this is another reason why
DICTATING what you REQUIRE from chicks is good, because they have the roadmap
to success or FAILURE with you.  as long as you have demonstrated personality
AND value BEFORE getting to this with her, she will be in a state of "how can I
get my hands on this guy... and KEEP him?" and then you will tell her what she
needs to do to be CONSIDERED amongst your TOP chicks and then is is up to her
to either fulfill her womanly duties or... as you predicted... get ejected and
feel the PAIN OF SEPERATION all over again with someone that she ALREADY knows
she WANTS to be with... WHATEVER the cost.

everyone has their price.  I find, most times, chicks are TALKING with no
EXPERIENCE.  a chick told me that she dumped her borefriend because he laughed
at her.  I told her that the sex must not have been good because otherwise she
would have had to use more than THAT to justify dumping an entire relationship.
 she CLAIMED that sex had nothing to do with her decision and that he didn't
RESPECT her was why she dumped him.  I told her that if the sex had been what
it is SUPPOSED to be... I GUARANTEE her that she would NOT have thrown THAT
away because of some laughing and disrespect.  I also proceeded to laugh at her
AND disrespect her IN HER FACE and told her I don't care because we are not
dating... she can't DUMP ME!   she never ADMITTED that I was right... BUT... by
the end of the conversation, she was asking me WHAT SHE SHOULD DO TO MAKE HER
LOVE LIFE BETTER!  :/  gotcha!

>>I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>>alone!
>
> Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to her her
>"ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she can then
>accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!  

yes.  I really have not been making the MOST of pacing and leading.  I have
been seeing where they ATTACH THEMSELVES to my way of thinking and see me as an
authority.  I have not used this to MAKE POLICY for them... merely to open
their minds and get them to think more efficiently.  you are right though. 
once you capture them... LEAD THEM!  make SOME efficient use of your new
followers... even if you were only practicing or passing time by capturing them
:)

excellent post :)

------

From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:10 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

In article <92n7b96@nnrp1.deja.com>, maniac_high@yahoo.com writes:

>After chick says bullshit about wanting to go to
>dinner and be friends or shit for 6 months before
>becoming a GF, I say: Actually, I dont go to dinner
>or stuff like that with ladies who are not my GF
>CHick:  gasps!
>Maniac: see, going to dinner, is an important step
>in a relationship for me. I only share it with someone
>special
>chick: Huh?
>Maniac: Well, let me put it this way, do you ever
>sleep with a guy who is just your friend, or dont
>care about?
>chick: of course not!

[lots of good use of Jake's shit snipped]

this is interesting, though I couldn't tell if this is something you are GOING
to do, or something you DID already.  either way, IF you are congruent, this
will serve you well as an alternate form of screening.  most of the time, I
screen by ASKING chicks shit and listening to their answers while watching
their faces and body-language.  another way to do it is to basically DICTATE to
them what I need to even CONSIDER being with a chick in any capacity
whatsoever.  most of the time I don't do this though because I can tell already
that the chick is worthless.  I usually get into DICTATION when she asks me
about myself.  am I attached?  what do I look for in a woman? etc.  THEN, since
she asked, I get into the reasons I have chosen women in the past and why I am
still with them in the present.  as I do that, I lay down my laws WITHOUT
telling the chick I am talking to that she needs to get in line with this shit
or get the fuck out of my face.  I have had a couple of chicks blow themselves
out after this.

I was talking to a chick that I know from YEARS ago that started calling me
again and talking about nothing.  I tolerated her for an hour or so on two
different days  A) because I was bored and  B) because through her speech
patterns and recurring ideas, I was learning if she was worth anything to me at
all, considering I get everything I want or need from MLTR in the first place,
she only had a VERY LIMITED use to me, as GOOD backup-pussy.  MLTR is smarter,
more interesting, more fun, less psychotic... basically TRUMPED her in all
areas, so this chick had NO CREDIT with me whatsoever.  I ended up getting into
PRECISELY what you did in your post.  the KICKER was when I told her "I don't
even TALK to girls that I don't want to fuck".  since I had not fucked her AND
had not suggested that we get together (she BELIEVES in monogamous
relationships for herself and even if she fucked me one time, it would be
merely to relieve her own personal stress and I am not going to be there for
her for that.  I am looking for MORE MLTRs... anything else can go fuck off.  I
laughed at her way of being AND broke it down to her why it was so stupid AND
let her know in NO UNCERTAIN TERMS that I was not going to be involved in
ANYTHING CLOSE to what she claims to want for herself... she can STAY HORNY for
all I care) she INTELLIGENTLY asked me WHY I was talking to her...  I let her
know that I found her amusing and her way of living ineffective.  I pointed out
to her that in the YEARS since I had spoken to her last, ALL she had to show
for it was a bungh of jibberish about WANTING a monogamous relationship that
she HAS NOT ATTAINED IN ALL THESE YEARS!  I let her know that I had predicted
that she would REMAIN dissatisfied for years to come and my talking to her
allowed me to follow her LACK of progress while, in the meantime, I get laid
EVERY DAY by MLTR :)   I have not heard from her SINCE that conversation...
good riddance.  she knew what she HAD to do if she wanted more of my time.  she
knew what she was going to have to do IF she wanted to socialize with me at
all.  she felt like her DEVOTION to the idea of a monogamous relationship with
a NON-EXISTANT man was more important than getting fucked by a guy that she
KNOWS and LIKES.  she is an idiot, and will remain horny UNTIL she fucks the
wrong guy, then has NO ONE to comfort her because I will not be there because
she had her chance and BLEW IT!

I have ZERO TOLERANCE for chicks that want things their way.  if they LIKE
doing things MY WAY, then they can be with me...maybe... for a while... as long
as they still LOOK HOT :)   when I approach chicks, I ASSUME they will fail the
screen because statistics show that I require A LOT from a chick and most of
them are either distracted by work or other relationships or just are not
QUALITY enough to be with me.  I find it amusing how ridiculous the SAME girls
are that I used to DESIRE to go out with and that I USED TO dislike being
rejected by.

now, I meet and REJECT girls daily.  not actively, just after I meet them, I
make NO EFFORT to remain in contact with them and go off to talk to other
chicks, leaving them wondering WHY I was interested enough to approach, but
BECAME DISINTERESTED and ejected for a SIMILARLY-GOOD-LOOKING bitch :)

Experiment Report! How kinky are your coworkers?!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



A practice session using the techniques of PU!


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: ]Experiment Report! How kinky are YOUR co-workers?!
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 08:03:45 GMT

]Experiment Report! How kinky are YOUR co-workers?!

This report is about finding the deep dark secrets of
your co-workers (not necessarily to fuck them, but as
a good experiment in state transitioning in groups
rather than one-on-one).

Note, for those readers living in repressed countries
still in the sexual dark ages like the Islamic
Republic of Iran, or the United Stated of America,
I do not advice attempting this..trouble with the
legal system, sex harrassment shit, or loss of
your job could result.. For the rest of you living
in countries that have both feet planted firmly in
the 20th century, no problem, lets rock on- here
is the report!


Recently, I have been doing alot of work practicing
state transitioning. Ie. the goal is to take a
chick (or in this case, group of chicks) from the
"idle state" (ie. thinking about office bullshit
and work they have to do), and transition them
to the kinky "lets get crazy and fuck state" as
quickly as possible, and in as few steps as possible
using a process that will be consistantly successful.

Last night, we had one of these (usually) boring
office departmental dinner parties at a stuffy
restaurant in town. BORING!!

So I decided what better place to liven things up
and see what I can get away with using psychological
warfare and a little bit of alcohol in an otherwise
formal group setting.

I get there, and sit at a table with 1 guy, and
5 chicks. For the first 30 minutes, it is boring,
I let everyone talk about boring office shit so
that everyone can arrive, and the food can start.

First I arrange the waiter to bring drinks to the
table (we need it later for one of the games I
am going to do), and get started on that right away.
One of the chicks only drinks tea, but that is OK,
later she really got into it anyways in spite of
being stark sober.

At the table is sitting:
ChinaGuy - he is from China
Mombabe - she is a mom, but wild & crazy, 40s (starts
          by sitting at another table)
HB CaptHook - she had a mild eye infection and is
              wearing an eyepatch this week (starts by
              sitting at another table)
HBStrict - she only drinks tea, but is more action
           than she looks
ScaredChick - she thinks we are all wierd
HBWhoMe? - she looks SO straight, but is the kinkiest
           at the table we find out!
Bichick - we find out she had enjoyed some bi games

Other assorted people sitting farther, who dont
play in the games really..

After that, I start. Here is how I did it. Refer
to the 'Maniac plan' post I made a couple weeks ago
(it is archived in fastseduction.com, I will also put
it on my site in Jan. when the next big update
happens) for some of the terminology below. I move
all the chicks (as a group), through all the states
as follows:

[Current State: Idle: chicks talking about office bullshit]
Maniac>Bichick: So what did you do this weekend?
Bichick: Nothing really.. how about you?
Maniac>I went to my dance circle, I like salsa dance
Bichick: oh really? {other chicks starting to listen}
Maniac: Yeah, I went to Brazil this year too, it was so
        much fun, wanna see my pictures?
Bichick & others: 'yes!' (take out my digi-PC, show pictures
        of carnival in Rio, tback bikini babes, the gay parade
        and debauchery in the streets)
Maniac: You know, the culture is SO different, brazilian people
        are SO passionate!
All chicks: oh really?
Maniac: yep, after I left Rio, I went to Sao Paolo, and
        went into this bar and all of the sudden this brazilian
        chick grabbed me and started french kissing me (perform
        SP chick story from ManiacPlan).

[Current State: (A)dmiration & (M)an now achieved from ManiacPlan]
Bichick: Oh, HB Capthook lived in brazil a few years!
Maniac: really? {I go to her table, ask if she wants to see
        some brazil carnival pictures with us.. she runs over
        to our table}
Maniac>all chicks: you know, I respected that SP chick though
       because she was not afraid to take what she wants..
       kind of like Madonna (perform the Madonna story from
       ManiacPlan).
Maniac: Perform 'how to communicate to lady at all levels
        and pay attention to her and what she wants' story
        from ManiacPlan, while doing lots of Kino on
        HBCapthook sitting next to me as a demonstration.
        Others are watching and getting jealous..

[Now try to introduce the (S)ex state from ManiacPlan..
the goal here is to do the "questions game, but in a
group setting.. so I decide to do it via a drinking game]
Maniac: {now I try to introduce a drinking game called 'I
       never'}, Hey, do they have any good drinking games in
       Japan.
Chicks: {they suggest some really lame boring shit like
         remembering names of subway stations..boring!!!}
Maniac: Well, I know two games, Chandelliers {I describe this
        game.. but we wont play it, not sexual}, and then
        "I never" {I describe "I never"}.
[Now here, I think I dont have enough rapport yet to start
"I never" (a drinking version of "questions") and get it to
work well (ie. sexually), so first I preform the "Strawberry
fields" game in a group (in next post, and included below)

<>>

We play the game: (mombabe hears us laughing, comes
over & kicks Chinaguy out of his chair so she can sit
next to us)

Among the answers to "strawberry fields"
Bichick: "uh, I dont see any fence around the field!"
HB Capthook & mombabe: "as many as I can eat!"
HBStrict: "to the farmer.. uh.. Thank you {and bow}"

We were all laughing and rolling on the floor to the
various chicks answers to this game, with lots of "I cant
believe you?! really?!" reactions among the ladies..

[Current state in ManiacPlan: (S)ex now achieved, now
lets intensify and see what these chicks will say/do.
I am putting LOTS of shoulder/back kino on all the
ladies as the game is playing]

Maniac: OK, time for another game, we will play that
 "I never" game we talked about before. {Maniac explains
 howto play "I never"} [easy.. each person takes a turn,
 say "I never xxx", whoever did "xxx" has to take a drink.
 start light, get game sexual ASAP..]

Maniac: here is the opening question: "I never kissed a
 member of the opposite sex before I was 15 y.o."
{3 girls drink}
Maniac: your turn HBCaptHook
HBCaptHook: uh, I dont understand the game yet, can you do
  the next question Maniac?
Maniac: OK, I never kissed a guy on the first date
{we all drink}
HBCaptHook: OK I get it, my turn "I never had sex with a
 guy on the first date" {notice because of the setup with
 straberry fields here, that the chicks ON THEIR OWN, turned
 the game sexual without me having to do anything! This was
 what I worried about if I were to start the "I never" game
 before straberry fields.. the mood was just not sexual
 enough yet, and the game would have fizzled.. but now..
 no problem!}
{all but 1 chick drinks (HB afraid.. who is looking a bit
 uncomfortable now)}
Mombabe: I never kissed a member of the same sex
{Bichick drinks!.. lots of "oh really?!? and discussion
 ensues, but bichick wont delve into it anymore ;-) }
Bichick: I never had sex with more than 4 people in the
 room.
{bichick, HBstrict and HBWhoMe all drink!}
HBAfraid: I never went to california
{we all look at her wierd.. skip to next girl}
HBWhoMe: I never did sex as part of a performance in front
of others
{Maniac, Bichick and HBWhoMe drink.. HBStrict looks envious,
others gasp and are laughing.. rest of our dept, is looking
at us, like why we are having so much fun, and a bit wierdly,
fortunately they cannot hear what we are saying ;-)}
Maniac: I never had sex with someone and didn't know their
 name till the next morning.
{We all drink except HB afraid}
MomBabe: I never used tool, or vibrator during sex
{we all drink}
HBCaptHook: I never had sex with a cat?!
{we all look at her wierd.. no one drinks}
HBCaptHook: but it can happen, I saw it on video once!
{we look at her more strange, and make her drink for watching
the video}
HBAfraid: I cant think of any question
{we skip her, next girl}
..
Maniac: I never was tied/tied up my partner during sex
{Maniac, HB strict, HBCapthook and HBWhome all drink}

Maniac: I see, so who is "S", and who is "M" {explain to
 a couple clueless chicks which was which}
HBWhoMe and HBStrict are serious S type, Bichick is both.
HBStrict makes a pass at me, and I reply only if you are
serious.. she stares at me long (maybe a future there ;-) )
I shake hands and hug HBWhoMe, who is really into this
thread of questioning.

Mombabe now makes ajoke about why I went to lunch today
with this other chick (not in the game), and not her. I
tell her because she didn't ask me.. girls have to take
what they want, like that SP chick. I ask her if she
likes me, she says yes, and I gesture (and get) a cheek
kiss. I am CERTAIN I could have done a KC, or even one
of those 3way KCs, but I remember that this is an
experiment, and I do have to see all these people on Monday
again at work, so I dont push it.

now adminbabe (the dept head's secy) comes by our table
and asks how many of us are going to the prescheduled
after-party karaoke. Mombabe replies "none of us, we are
all going to a hotel".. HBCapthook adds in "a love hotel..".

[Final state: Dying to fuck: achieved]

Adminbabe looks at us wierd (she missed the whole thing),
and leaves. Mombabe now asks why I have such a harem tonight,
and then Bichick remarks how all the ladies in the office
really really like you Maniac.

I ask 'why?'
bichick says.. you smile, and laugh alot.. but there is
something else.. we all see it, but cant really
describe what it is {maniac opinion.. it is the way
I stare at chicks with the 'fuck me' luck, and all the
shoulder kino..etc, I do, even in the office}.

Supper now is wrapping up, we all have to go, I remark
that this table is fun, and that another night, we should
all meet again for beer and fun.. everyone agrees.

As we are going back, HBCaptHook and mombabe are grabbing
all over me, it was funny.

Some go home, and I split off from the group, as I have
a date with karatebabe at midnight in another part of
town..

Experiment over..

I learned that state transitioning is a very predictable,
reproduceable process, once you learn the tools to do it.
This was just my office staff that is around me, so made
a good subject for the experiment. I also realized, that
in groups, there is a sort of feed back effect, so you
can really accelerate things. It wasnt the alcohol because
HBstrict had nothing to drink, but was well into the
game too.

Because it was a group, I could skip steps "BVG,D,O" in
the ManiacPlan, and reach the last state.. (dying to fuck)
so I likely could have taken any (or all)
of those ladies back for a wild time in the sack (which I
wont do, because I work with them.. but there was nothing
stopping it, thats for sure)..

Fascinating..

Constructive Opinions/comments anyone?

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Doing proper ‘closes’

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Maniac uses a power opener to meet and tongue down a chick!


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Maniac meets HBOrderMe! Bar PU
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 05:00:36 GMT

Maniac meets HBOrderMe! Bar PU
001215

This is an interesting bar PU. .
used it to not lay the chick, but to get higher rapport
with the other guys around.

It is bo-nen-kai (end of year party) season in Japan.
After the party (boring, in a big hotel ballroom)
we go to the ni-ji-kai (after party) in a bar/disco
in Roppongi with a bunch of my coworkers (mostly guys,
and some ladies).

One AFC guy is really into this HB. He is making every
AFC mistake in the book (saying she is pretty, sucking
up to her..blah). Progress is really slow.

Me and all the guys are watching. He gets frustrated and
leaves for a bit. I move in on the chick (she is wearing
a high cut black dress, and fishnet stockings... very cute).

My opener is the strawberry game.. I just go up to her,
and say 'imagine you are in a field, and you see a strawberry
field ahead of you, with a fence around.. how high is the
fence'. She goes right into it.

Then I do the interpretation (see strawberry game post
for the game and interpretation) for her. I ask her what
she thinks (she said 1m high fence, 50 strawberries, sorry
to the farmer). She disagrees the interpretation. Then I
ask her what is your idea guy like (brad pitt). Then I say
besides his looks why you like him. Reply: he is really
guy.

Then I ask, what do you want most in a guy's character.
She says, 'I want him to lead, to decide for me what to do.'
Good.. Maniac keeps that in mind for what comes next. .

AFC guy comes back, and I let him have his chick back for
a while. He is doing more regular AFC stuff, though he
has at least initiated kino.. very good. He does this for
like 20 minutes, but isn't really breaking through.

He gets frustrated, goes. I tell the guys 'watch this',
and go up to the chick, and say I am going now, give me a
kiss. I get a cheek kiss.

I look straight into her eyes, and tell her 'thats not
good enough, look into my eyes.. what do you see.. now
give me a real kiss..' a long tonguedown with sexual kino
ensues.. Everyone else sees what I just did, after spending
not even a total of 5 minutes talking with this chick
from before.

I leave the chick, and go back to the guys.. 'that is how
it is supposed to be done'. Respect of me from my guy co-workers
now goes up 10x from whatever it was before, and was visibly
different in the office the next day.

AFC co-worker comes back and tells me how so much he is
in love with this girl (I guess he knew her from before as
a friend or co-worker or something..not sure.. I had never
met her before though). As a result, I defer to him, and let
him get AFC'd out.

I go back to the other guys, and just say, I could take her
(she lives really close actually, so I could just say I
live far and can I crash at her place.. I am sure the answer
would have been yes) whenever I want. They say 'why dont you'?

I reply, well, AFC guy is really into her, and he is a coworker
of mine who I respect, so I dont want to take his chick away
from him. There are lots of chicks to fuck, and this one means
nothing to me at all, but she is important to him, so best to
leave it at that.

I go on to say that all I wanted to know is that I COULD take her
home if I want (and I might next week or something, I got her
number) and now I know that, so it is enough for me, I dont
need more.

Respect from co-workers now goes up another 10x for this, because
I and they KNOW that this is true after what they just saw. .

He continues to AFC for a long while, and I get tired and go
home. Next day I hear that she blew him out almost as soon as I
left.

Now this was cool, because the goal wasn't really to lay the
chick (which I still might if I decide to see her again), but to
increase stature with co-workers, which can help in other ways
in my regular life.

Now one thing to note, is that I cannot do this every time (heck
not even close.. this is like the 3rd or 4th time it has ever happened
so directly like this). I was
really lucky, because of what she said to my 'what you like in
guy question', it was just so EASY to know what this chick
expected me to do, and it was really easy to stage it to happen
in front of all the other guys once I clued in on this.

I WISH I could do it everytime, but life isnt really like that ;-)
Mr. SMooth can do it though!

Constructive comments and opinions welcome!
Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Maniac High's Pick Up Girls Guide and Seduction Website! » field

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Maniac uses a power opener to meet and tongue down a chick!


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Maniac meets HBOrderMe! Bar PU
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 05:00:36 GMT

Maniac meets HBOrderMe! Bar PU
001215

This is an interesting bar PU. .
used it to not lay the chick, but to get higher rapport
with the other guys around.

It is bo-nen-kai (end of year party) season in Japan.
After the party (boring, in a big hotel ballroom)
we go to the ni-ji-kai (after party) in a bar/disco
in Roppongi with a bunch of my coworkers (mostly guys,
and some ladies).

One AFC guy is really into this HB. He is making every
AFC mistake in the book (saying she is pretty, sucking
up to her..blah). Progress is really slow.

Me and all the guys are watching. He gets frustrated and
leaves for a bit. I move in on the chick (she is wearing
a high cut black dress, and fishnet stockings... very cute).

My opener is the strawberry game.. I just go up to her,
and say 'imagine you are in a field, and you see a strawberry
field ahead of you, with a fence around.. how high is the
fence'. She goes right into it.

Then I do the interpretation (see strawberry game post
for the game and interpretation) for her. I ask her what
she thinks (she said 1m high fence, 50 strawberries, sorry
to the farmer). She disagrees the interpretation. Then I
ask her what is your idea guy like (brad pitt). Then I say
besides his looks why you like him. Reply: he is really
guy.

Then I ask, what do you want most in a guy's character.
She says, 'I want him to lead, to decide for me what to do.'
Good.. Maniac keeps that in mind for what comes next. .

AFC guy comes back, and I let him have his chick back for
a while. He is doing more regular AFC stuff, though he
has at least initiated kino.. very good. He does this for
like 20 minutes, but isn't really breaking through.

He gets frustrated, goes. I tell the guys 'watch this',
and go up to the chick, and say I am going now, give me a
kiss. I get a cheek kiss.

I look straight into her eyes, and tell her 'thats not
good enough, look into my eyes.. what do you see.. now
give me a real kiss..' a long tonguedown with sexual kino
ensues.. Everyone else sees what I just did, after spending
not even a total of 5 minutes talking with this chick
from before.

I leave the chick, and go back to the guys.. 'that is how
it is supposed to be done'. Respect of me from my guy co-workers
now goes up 10x from whatever it was before, and was visibly
different in the office the next day.

AFC co-worker comes back and tells me how so much he is
in love with this girl (I guess he knew her from before as
a friend or co-worker or something..not sure.. I had never
met her before though). As a result, I defer to him, and let
him get AFC'd out.

I go back to the other guys, and just say, I could take her
(she lives really close actually, so I could just say I
live far and can I crash at her place.. I am sure the answer
would have been yes) whenever I want. They say 'why dont you'?

I reply, well, AFC guy is really into her, and he is a coworker
of mine who I respect, so I dont want to take his chick away
from him. There are lots of chicks to fuck, and this one means
nothing to me at all, but she is important to him, so best to
leave it at that.

I go on to say that all I wanted to know is that I COULD take her
home if I want (and I might next week or something, I got her
number) and now I know that, so it is enough for me, I dont
need more.

Respect from co-workers now goes up another 10x for this, because
I and they KNOW that this is true after what they just saw. .

He continues to AFC for a long while, and I get tired and go
home. Next day I hear that she blew him out almost as soon as I
left.

Now this was cool, because the goal wasn't really to lay the
chick (which I still might if I decide to see her again), but to
increase stature with co-workers, which can help in other ways
in my regular life.

Now one thing to note, is that I cannot do this every time (heck
not even close.. this is like the 3rd or 4th time it has ever happened
so directly like this). I was
really lucky, because of what she said to my 'what you like in
guy question', it was just so EASY to know what this chick
expected me to do, and it was really easy to stage it to happen
in front of all the other guys once I clued in on this.

I WISH I could do it everytime, but life isnt really like that ;-)
Mr. SMooth can do it though!

Constructive comments and opinions welcome!
Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Using the ‘color’ game to PU!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Using the 'color game' to do a PU!


From: tonymcneill@my-deja.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Colours Game - opinions?
Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 00:43:35 GMT

 Hi Guys,

I've just field tested this pattern / game for creating an erotic and
horny state - worked a dream:) I'd be interested to know what you think
of this and how it might be improved.....

I suppose it might work best with the more visually thinking babes.

This is not a 'word for word' pattern by any means, by the way - I just
kind of found myself going into it on the fly.....  here we go..

The PUA "notices" the colour (UK spelling by the way for those who might
feel the urge to correct me) of an object, item of clothing etc.

PUA - "I find these yellow walls (or whatever) quite uplifting;
especially in the winter. Isn't it nice to have some bright colours
around when it's so grey and dark outside?" "Do you think that colours
have an big effect on peoples' moods?".

HB - "Oh, yes, definitely."

PUA - "Hmmm. I was just wondering......I mean....... I was in one of
those New Age shops recently and they were selling lots of different
coloured sunglasses.... with the idea that, if you wanted to feel more
of a certain mood, or to look at the world in a certain way, you would
slip on a pair of sunglasses which would colour everything you looked at
in the desired tone" "Do you think that could work in any way?"

HB - "Well, maybe. I don't know really"

PUA - "Well, for example, my bedroom is a very pale blue colour and I
find this particular blue very restful" "I mean, can you imagine
sleeping very well in a pale blue room?" "Imagine you are really tired,
you know when your eyelids are heavy and you curl up with that fantastic
feeling of at last ... just letting go.... and .....giving
yourself...to....(sp perhaps?).. sleep'" "Do you have a sense of a
particular colour when you imagine that feeling?" (Make sure she's
imagining being sleepy).

HB - "Oh, maybe blue, or green" (or whatever). (If she doesn't come up
with one then maybe she could be asked to imagine the perfect colour for
a bedroom, but both of the HB subjects I tried got right into it.)

PUA "How about when you feel....really full of great ideas...... like
you have all sorts of inspiration flowing through you.?"

PUA then procedes to get HB to imagine a few other states (feeling very
inspired and spiritual (commenting on her choice of colour in a playful
way)...... bursting with energy ...... feeling very sensual,
relaxed and open (we're getting closer, gentlemen)......and eventually,
 being full of passion and horny), and slowly visualising a colour with
each one.

You get the picture - guiding her into these states,
comparing colours etc etc. I have tried this on two chicks, both of whom
LOVED the game and got right into imagining the states. One of them was
an ex who is of great value as a pivot / social proof (and a friend) so
I was testing the game with her rather than going for the lay and the
other HB, in spite of being pretty shy, blushed madly and was VISIBLY
remembering the joy of being fucked until she screamed with pleasure ;)
(At this point Tony is feeling a bit fucking pleased with himself).
I think this would have definitely resulted in a fuck had I not been
meeting her at lunchtime before going off to work :( (at this point Tony
is disgusted as well as pleased!!)

What do you 'real' PUAs think of this little game? As I said I somehow
went into it on the fly after having the idea while practicing
improvising patterns while driving, using things I saw on the road as
starting points for pattern-talk. So it's pretty new and I, as yet,
claim only to be a humble RAFC. Going to test it some more and post the
results....



Any suggestions or comments?

Tony

--
'Action' is the magic word

Setting up the Kiss Close

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

A way to set up the kiss close

From: erosla77@aol.com (ErosLA77) Ross Jeffries
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 26 Dec 2000 19:23:44 GMT
Subject: Re: What if...

>Subject: Re: What if...
>From: eclipse19@my-deja.com
>Date: Tue, Dec 26, 2000 12:04 AM
>Message-id: <929jdt$u6t@nnrp1.deja.com>
>
>In article <9299s4$o03@nnrp1.deja.com>,
>  charnel1278@my-deja.com wrote:
>> Hey all,
>>
>> I've checked out a Maniac's, and some others websites and most say
>that
>> when you ask "Do you wanna kiss me?", you're guaranteed a kiss, unless
>> you get a flat out NO.  None, from what I saw, said what to do when
>you
>> get that NO.  Do you continue on the conversation like nothing
>> happened? Do you come back with a similar question later in the
>> evening?  If so, won't she kinda feel that you're badgering her?
>> Granted, this won't happen often, but what if?....
>>
>> Laters.
>
> the standard (canned) reply to a "no" answer is "YOU really know how
>to ruin a moment....your old boyfriends must have hated that about you"
>I think i got this off tony or maniac's site, forget which one. I
>havent ran into a direct "no" answer myself so i havent field tested
>this, but im sure others have. From what i read(or remember anyhow)
>this will leave them stunned and they will show less resistance against
>another kiss.
>
>

 Hmmm......well, I like this "you really know how to ruin a moment" response
WITHOUT asking for the kiss first. "Asking" for anything, outside of the
presence of fun(as in, on the spur of the moment saying, "Hey...wouldn't it be
fun to go to a strip club? Let's go!))  seems pretty pathetic to me.  

    A good one is to notice her giving you that look and then say(and I got
this from a student, it is NOT mine).  "If ? were to ask you on a scale of one
to ten, how good a kisser are you, what would you say?"

 Listen for her answer, then say, "If you were to kiss me right now, how do you
think I'd rate you?"

  You do this ONLY when you see "the look".......

  "let's find out" you say and kiss her.  

IF she backs away from that, then the "you really know how to ruin a moment"
comment works great.  Come to think of it, this could really work for a
cancellation as well. 

---

From: "General Snafu" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: What if...
Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2000 22:57:08 GMT

If she says no to a kiss, ask for a BJ.  If she says no to the BJ, you are
SOL for the night.

 wrote in message
news:9299s4$o03@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Hey all,
>
> I've checked out a Maniac's, and some others websites and most say that
> when you ask "Do you wanna kiss me?", you're guaranteed a kiss, unless
> you get a flat out NO.  None, from what I saw, said what to do when you
> get that NO.  Do you continue on the conversation like nothing
> happened? Do you come back with a similar question later in the
> evening?  If so, won't she kinda feel that you're badgering her?
> Granted, this won't happen often, but what if?....
>
> Laters.
>
>
> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/

Game: The Wall and the Forest

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Maniac introduces "The Wall and the Forest", a PU game.



From maniac_high@yahoo.com 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Game: The wall and the forest
Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 16:18:24 GMT

Another one of those mindfuck games like 4 questions or the cube:

"The Wall and the Forest"

-You are walking in a field, you see a wall, how high is it, and
how do you get by it? [wall = pride, and also how you get past
obstacles]

-you continue walking, and you see a house [kind of house you dream
to have later in life]

-you see a key on the ground, you go to the house, does the key
open the door? [if yes, means you can get married]

-you go in the house (if you were able to open with the key), and
 on the first floor you see a table and chairs, how many chairs are
 there? [means how many people in your future family]

-now you go outside, and see to one direction a dense dark forest, and
 the other way, a less dense/brighter wooded area. Which way do you
 go? (dark forest=expect something, but unknown, take a chance)
     (bright wooded area=easygoing style/way)

-as you walk you then see a lake nearby. How big is it, and how deep
 is it? (big=size of your heart, depth=depth of your heart)

THE END


This game could be lethal for chicks who want to get married or
something like that. Make sure you answer the right answers when
you tell her "what your answers were" after you finish her turn!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Game: Forest

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Nightlight introduces 'forest game'!



From: nightlight9@hotmail.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: More like "4 questions" game?
Date: Thu, 02 Nov 2000 19:50:10 GMT

You mention all these, but most of them are not very useful in the
initial meeting because they are too cerebral and too random.  Try ones
that are more viceral.  You are walking in a dark forest.  How do you
feel.  (how she approaches life).  You could to a wall with a door.
What do you do? (how she approaches obsticalls).  You look down and see
a cup on the ground what is it made out of? (how she views wealth).
You come to some water, describe it. (how she views sexuality).
Always end with sexuality because it is  a good topic for PU and
demonstrates you are comfortable with women and people a sexual context.

BookGuy, my comments are based on experience and field testing.  Please
do the same if you reply.

--
NightLight9
Just be yourself... smooth with interesting questions and interesting
answers.

Game: Strawberry Fields

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Maniac introduces a PU game: Strawberry Fields!
[Note, this originally comes from the book 'Kokology']


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Game!: Strawberry fields
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 08:02:40 GMT

Game!: Strawberry fields
001117

This is a game to find out some things about how chicks
see sex. It is very popular in Japan & is a good state
transitioner

--

Intro: Hey, lets play a game!

Imagine you are alone in a field, and see a straberry field
in front of you with tasty strawberries.

There is a fence/gate around the field. How high is it?
(= how easy is this girl/guy to take sex)

Now you are in the straberry field, how many straberries
do you take?
(=how many BFs/GFs that person wants)

Ok, after you have finished enjoying the strawberries,
how do you feel about the farmer, who's field you took them
from?
(=how you feel to that person after fucking them)


The end

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

TPUA night PU’s HB Smallmouth and converts to a lay!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

[TPUA PU's a chick at night, and converts it into a lay!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com
]


Date Posted: 2000/09/25 05:21:37 AM EDT
Author: Tokyopua 
Subject: Re: HB Small Mouth PU  (Was Re: Calling all Tokyo PUA's)

Hey Maniac,

I didnt really intend that last post of mine as a field report, since it
wasnt too detailed.  But yeah, things have been going well on the PU despite
my severely limited time. So I will attempt a bit of a field report on the
initial PU here.  My PU efficiency factor has been really high recently,
maybe because I am only trying to PU when I feel really confident and often
times when I wasnt planning on it, so was really relaxed. I did a PU on a 19
year old HB college student in the train the other night and got her home
phone number.  It was easy cause she was reading Tokyo Classified, and I
asked her about it. I was really confident, and in only 2 stops got her to
really dig me.  In fact, when I asked her why she had studied English, she
said "So I could meet a guy like you!"  The only problem is finding time to
meet her again before I leave.

The PU I did on HB Small Mouth was not planned either, I just saw her
walking back home around my place at midnight, and somehow knew that despite
my frazled appearance after 2 hours of Jujitsu practice and carrying 40
pounds of luggage, I could do the PU on her.  My opening line was "I like
your hair" which I knew was lame and she must have heard often, but hey,
thats the price of using the 3 second rule sometimes.  I immediately
followed with asking her if she was a student, what kind of work she did,
etc.  Oddly, I didnt use my standard opener "Do you speak english" in the
whole conversation.  I will post my personal notes on the rest of the PU at
the end of this post just for reference, but they arent too coherent.  They
were the basis though for the plans I laid for the successful next date that
got me laid 3 days later.  (If I have time someday I will write up full
notes on that too.) Total time to lay in terms of time invested was
approximately 3.5 hours, about the same as HB Physics, my other recent
street PU who I did that same day.  This efficiency is possible if the
progression is done just right, I think.

 wrote in message news:8qfler$o1r@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Tokyo PUA,
>
> This is an excellent report.. You really rock!
>
> Where / how did you originally
> PU this chick though? Also, taking the chick over to see your
> weight training stuff is a clever idea.. liked that..!
> BTW, I thought you left already to the USA, how long are you still
> there for?

Right near my house in a dark alley at midnight on her way home!  She told
me later (post lay) that she was scared at first, but I had a really relaxed
attitude so she got comfortable with me afterwards.  As for the weight
training stuff later, it was great kino as I had her bend over slightly and
got right behind her to "help her with her form" while simultaneously
letting her slightly feel the form of my stiff wood pressed against her, and
other such intimate situations.

Still here till Oct 14 or so, with a trip to Taiwan and maybe Hawaii too
thrown in.

>
> ALso, do you usually go out alone, or with a wing. I noticed that
> you knew quite a few people in Roppongi, I guess you get out there
> quite a bit?

Been out there a lot since last February, maybe 10 times or so.  I guess
predominantly I go with a wing, but sometimes felt it screwed up my game.
Of course, my wings didnt know anything about seduction a la ASF, thats
probably why.  Of course, neither did I till June... I know Im much better
at street PU when alone though, thats for sure!  OTOH, when I went out to
clubs with you and Rio, I think my game was really improved and I was
learning all the time.
BTW, I have heard that someplace called club Earth near hamamatucho has
really hot babes, (bitch shield too, but who cares, right;-), so you guys
might want to check that out.  3000 Yen cover charge.  May be the new
alternative to Fura?

>
> > I managed to lay that HB Small Mouth
>
> EXCELLENT!
>
> >Ganbatte!  Im seeting HB Bi this weekend again (tonight), and HB
> >small the next day, and my ex-GF the next.  Im starting to feel like
> >Maniac juggling girls, but nothing will happen w/ my ex, so its not
> >so bad.
>
> Yes, I did that ALOT last year, and fucked a shitload of chicks that
> I cant even count now..
>
> but its really tiring and you do get sick of it after a while..
> so finally I just MLTR'd a few that I really liked, who also accepted
> that I fuck other chicks, and left it at that.. guess I got to get out
> more ;-)
> not sure if its the right way yet, but been doing it that way
> the last few months now.. We'll see ;-)

I think it goes in cycles.  Eventually you get tired of the MLTR's and have
to replace them.  To do that you will have to PU lotsa new chicks, lay them,
see if they dont eject when you break the news that there are others.  That
takes a lot of time, so then you want to go back to the easy life of having
a bunch of girls on call.  Then the cycle starts over.  Im just beginning to
get these girls into MLTR status, but now I have to leave.  But theres
always business trips ack here!

>
> If you are planning on hanging around TOkyo though, you should
> bring HB Bi and her friend to one of our fuck parties the next time..
> sounds like they'd be a good time.. maybe introduce them to Kipp or
> something since I am not there right now, before you leave.. or
> give me your departure date and see if they are interested and we
> can setup something with all the ladies, if this is your sort of thing..

Id consider it, but it will take more effort, and probably wont be anything
I can do until after Im gone and come back for business trips.  You see, I
worked it too good with HB Bi.  She is signing her letters with "Love" at
the end and is all into me now.  Made me the most awesome meal any woman has
ever made me, washed my clothes, gave me an amazing massage, etc.  When I
confronted her about our last threesome, she said that she felt jealous when
she saw me doing her friend, and claimed that was the only time she had ever
done something like that, that she isnt really Bi.
So right now I think she somehow sees a relationship in this, despite my
leaving?  I figure once Im gone I can get past that as reality sinks in and
maybe set up more stuff for any business trips I make back.

>
> Good post!
>
> Maniac
> http://www.pickupguide.com

Here are those notes I was talking about, for what they are worth:

-------------------------------------------
PU of HB Small:  happened in a dark alley shortcut to my house at midnight,
I approached carrying a 30 pound backpack on one shoulder and a 10 pound
bucket of protein powder in the other, and said,  $B!H (BExcuse me, your hair is
really beautiful. $B!I (B  She reacted favorably and said thanks, but kept
walking, slightly faster.  She seemed young, so I asked if she was a
student.  She said no, I asked what she does.  She said she works for a
cable company, I fluff talked about watching TV.  She asked what I do.  I
said I know its late but you should have coffee or tea with me at Jonathans
restaurant nearby.  She said no, so I said, OK, how do we meet again.  She
said give me your number and I said,  $B!H (BAh, but I know women, if I give you
my number you will get nervous and never call. $B!I (B  She said  $B!H (BNo, 
that wont
happen I promise. $B!I (B  I knew I didn $B!G (Bt have enough rapport or 
anything to
believe that, so really what I was just doing was stalling till I could set
up a firm date.

I got a pen and wrote my number and at this point we are standing on the
corner near my place.  I play on Japanese cuteness and write my name with
hearts by it.  (None of this is stuff I would be able to do in the US.)
Then I say, OK, when are we going to meet.  Its sort of a way to pace the
ongoing reality now that she has my number,its a logical extension.  The
number is just a formality to me, I want to set up the date.  After some
negotiation, I get a date set up for 6 PM Tuesday, her day off.  I had given
her alternatives between my place and eating in Tachikawa nearby (but both
already had the presuppostion that we are meeting for a date, so I don $B!G (Bt
care which she chooses).  She chose Italian in Tachikawa which is perfect
cause eating carbs increases seratonin (=relaxation), so I will lay on the
patterning after a while, maybe even order a glass of wine (more seratonin
and romance) for us both.  Then its a 5 minute taxi ride back to my place!

Anyway, we keep talking.  I get that she never has met a foreigner, that she
likes Richard Gere, cause he is  $B!H (BShibui $B!I (B. $B!! (B(=quiet, simple, 
sober,
tasteful, austere, parsimonious, etc.)  I asked her about her ideal man
while doing the (SP) thing.  She really accessed a lot and I was awakening
her creative centers.  I touched her a lot on the arm to anchor the good
feelings.   She said she really was too ideal, but that her ideal guy was
like her father, sweet and nice.  I asked if she wanted a guy who made her
feel safe, and she said yes.  I compared our hand sizes and got kino,
remarked at how small her hands were, that my big hands could protect her.
Complemented her smile and said that it seems like her eyes smile too and
she said that she is often told that.  She said I was skillful at
complementing and I said that I really meant it.

I mirrored her body positions a lot and this seemed to have a good effect.
She seemed really into it and wasn $B!G (Bt trying too hard to get away despite 
it
being after midnight and having to work the next day, only bringing up the
time when I did.  She was rubbing her earlobe, and later playing with her
ponytail in a really sexy way, all with the doggy dinner bowl look.
I also showed kanji ability and had her write her name, and demonstrated how
we could study English together, all using the Zaurus.  (BTW, Did you buy
one yet, Maniac? A useful tool in many ways.  You can turn it into a
portable digital photo album too, albeit poor quality...) She liked that.
At one point she asked what was in the bucket, I said protein powder and she
said  $B!H (Bnomitai! $B!I (B and I said  $B!H (B5 fun dake areba, nomeru 
yo. $B!I (B
(If you have 5
minutes I can give you a taste).  But she refused to go to my apartment and
I didn $B!G (Bt press the issue, I just reconfirmed our fun date on Tuesday, and
gave her a kiss goodnight, then took off.
----------------------------------

-T

ASF reader comments on above story

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website: 

http://www.pickupguide.com 

Many excellent followups to the Psychicbabe re-lay report!
Mrsex4unyc, RJ..etc..etc.

From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:05 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

In article <92jvre$obh@nnrp1.deja.com>, maniac_high@yahoo.com writes:

>The immediate gold to take care of this, is to now make the
>relationship very high stakes for her. I can do this because
>I know that she is into me (from what she said at the dinner),
>so the idea is to play it that if she doesnt do her job as a
>chick.. she will lose EVERYTHING as far as I am concern.
>Ok, that is the plan, here we go:

plan or no plan, essentially, you are telling her the truth.  on a long-enough
timeline, the survival rate for EVERYONE is ZERO.  sooner or later, everyone
you love will either leave you or die.  chicks don't seem to believe in this,
though it is the absolute truth.  they think that they can relate to you
FOREVER, REGARDLESS of what they do or how they act.  you are telling her HOW
she can REMAIN with you and what is going to get her EJECTED.  even though it
takes a long time, so it doesn't SEEM like this... this is what has happened to
EVERY chick's relationship that has gone away.  EVENTUALLY, she was not
fulfilling her womanly duties and her man left her for a   chick (younger,
sexier, richer, swallower...)  EVEN if she IS fulfilling her duties, if her man
like it from another chick MORE, she loses out either in a PERCENTAGE of her
benefits or she gets DUMPED and loses ALL of her benefits.  you are merely
explaining this to her and telling her what she needs to do IF she wants to be
with you... which you have already determined.  you are SELLING, and now you
are screening her to see if she is QUALIFIED and ABLE to buy.

>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations
>in relationship. 

I am getting to the point where I am going to do this.  I never do this with
chicks because I morph into whatever THEY are looking for and hook them that
way.  the thing for me is that being 10 months in with MLTR, she has REALLY
learned how to please me and the time I spend TEACHING her has become minimal
and the time I spend ENJOYING her is increasing :)  it is getting tougher and
tougher for other chicks to get my attention, because anything LESS than what I
have already is BULLSHIT to me.  the time I am spending talking to chicks is
mostly eliciting values and breaking their perceptions... just for fun :)  I
know IMMEDIATELY if I want sex from a chick, and if I don't, she is IMMEDIATELY
LJBF and I use her for practice and NEXT her at the end of the conversation.

I am seriously going to consider moving to a "demonstration of value -> SOI"
model, just because I have lost my patience with LISTENING to these bitches
talking about shit that really doesn't mean anything.  I know I am going to
NEXT them ANYWAY as soon as I realize they can't compete with MLTR, so why
listen to their shit FIRST?  I may as well let them know how great I am and
let them know what kind of woman I am willing to accept, and let them continue
from there.  there is also the cognitive dissonance issue of them KNOWING that
I am going to dump them if they are not sexy and CONTINUING to talk to me and
get to know me.  the more they talk to me, the more I hook them into
interacting with me.  the more they get hooked, the greater the PAIN OF
SEPERATION (credit: RJ) when they eventually get EJECTED.  since they KNOW
ahead of time what will get them ejected and they are still talking, they are
either planning to get in line OR setting themselves up for pain.  either way,
after SOI and their acceptance of the terms, there will have to be some sort of
TEST of their compliance.  even listening to what they have to say after SOI
counts as a REWARD for their entering into a "relationship" with me.  hmm... I
will consider this more.

>I go on to tell her that other girls I know also
>like me, ask me out alot, (doesn't matter if it is true or not,
>but chick 'competition logic' will kick in, and it will scare
>your mark to act). 

the reason I don't use this is that MLTR is an integral part of my life.  if I
were to play this "chicks dig me" card, it would belittle the actual
relationship I have with MLTR.  the only problem with THAT is that I am
screening for MORE MLTRs :)  I don't give a fuck about ONS because I can get
laid ANY NIGHT within an hour of talking to the chick I am talking to... in the
WAY I want to with a chick that I WANT TO FUCK :)  a chick offering me ONS is
like a chick offering me a dollar bill.  I already HAVE dollar bills... what do
I want hers for?  of course, there are some chicks that are just so HOT that
you want to try them out, but barring that scenario, ONS can bring you much
more ANGUISH than the satisfaction that accompanies it... PLUS it is the SAME
SATISFACTION that I already get on a regular basis from MLTR. 

besides... it is OBVIOUS that chicks dig me because here SHE is, liking me
within 20 minutes of meeting me... what about the chicks that have experienced
me for days?  months?  years?  OH, she could only HOPE to be one of those! :)

for you, it is a good tactic though.

>Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>her last week, apparently).

I lost a rap to a low-self-esteem bitch that had a couple of relationships like
this as well.  I mean, I fucked her, but I didn't get to MLTR like I wanted
because she was SCARED that she wouldn't match up to the next bitch and that I
would NEXT her for no reason, like her exes did.  I tried to tell her I wanted
her for more than that, but she wasn't emotionally healthy enough to understand
or believe me.

>Ok, now Maniac has reached her head, and I take this deeper..
>I go on to tell her that I dont want just sex, I want rocks and gold
>I can get any girl in roppongi on a Saturday night and fuck her
>(not exactly true, but she doesnt know this.. goal is just to

she KNOWS that it happened to her VERY QUICKLY.  she ASSUMES she was not the
ONLY bitch to fall for you that quickly.  it is like reverse-social-proof. 
fucking a bitch FAST makes them think you can fuck other bitches FAST.

>'confirm' her worst fears so that she acts), but its not enough for
>me. I want connection, good sex, and romance, with an intelligent
>woman, and that is why I want to date you (psychicbabe).

nice line.  this is another thing I will consider.  talking-up MLTR to them.  
I never considered this either, MAINLY because if you tell a chick what you
want her to do then you never know if she is manipulating you by being that
way, or if she arrived there NATURALLY... on her own.  interesting, LOTS of
style-change material happening right around the new year :)

>Then all of the sudden, she asks me about HBass (the chick staying
>at my place over the holidays), and freaks out about it. I tell
>her that she already knows all this, and exactly what is her point
>here?

although I am a GREAT fan of "quoting", I find that there need to be times to
engage in it and times to NOT engage in it.  this will depend on what you want
with the chick.  it is the same way you can't go from being a CHUMP to a MAN in
a chick's eyes... but you CAN go from being a MAN into a CHUMP :)  if you start
out telling a chick that you have a girlfriend AND that you fuck her, you leave
yourself open for these pot-shots whenever chicks trip the fuck out and go into
their irrational rants from out of left-field.  all a bitch needs to know is
that you are "taken" so that you manage her relationship expectations.  any
more information and she feels like you will give her ALL the information. 
where does it stop?  are you going to tell her that you are fucking her?  that
you fucked her last night?  that you fucked her an hour before coming on this
date?  that you fucked YOUR WOMAN in her ass?  that she LIKES sucking dick? 
WHERE DOES IT STOP?

I ran into this problem with a chick where my relationship to her was BASED ON
trading current sex-stories.  when I got to the point where I didn't want to
tell her any more shit, she was EXPECTING me to tell her, and I realized that
if I wasn't telling her, and she wasn't telling me, then our "relationship" was
OVER.  before that, I had not realized how much I had compromised my position
by telling her CURRENT sex-shit.  think about it, and decide on your own LIMITS
to what you are willing to tell a chick about other chicks... besides, think
about the fact that she is going to KNOW that she will end up as STORIES to
other bitches right after you fuck her.  it will make her VERY self-conscious
about whatever she does with you and that could hinder her emotional states
tremendously.

>Then she stops again, and asks me if I am fucking her (maybe I
>should have said no..., but I had already said yes to her about this
>the first time I saw her)., she asks me why.. (I tell her because
>I am seeing her! like I told you the first time! I mean what do
>you expect?!?).
>
>She then puts on her bitch face, and talks in a stern voice,
>"then call me when you break her up, that is my decision, I am
>going home.".

THIS is retarded because she ALREADY knew that you were fucking her AND she
fucked you herself.  this is another problem with bitches having information
about other bitches.  they use it against themselves.  IMO, the purpose of her
knowing you have another girl or SEVERAL other girls is so she knows where she
stands in the RACE to be your MAIN BITCH.  if you are single, she has a good
chance at being that to you.  if you are "taken" she has NO CHANCE of being
that to you.  if you are SEEING bitches, then she has to COMPETE to be your #1.
 other than THAT, I think giving information about your other bitches is a
mistake...  I have made the SAME mistake up to this point, so I am not
crisicizing :)  however, I am changing that ASAP and I think you should
consider giving out information on a N2K basis (need to know).

besides, SHE is the one that NEEDS a fuck.  if it is not coming from YOU, a guy
she has fucked ALREADY and she LIKES how you did it or she wouldn't have come
back... she has to get it from a STRANGER whose sexual skills are in question
that might tie her up, fuck her in the ass or sell her to the highest bidder. 
bitches like to FRONT a lot about having ALL these sexual choices, but with all
the 8s, 9s, and 10s I have spoken to on an honest "one of the chicks" level,
they are ALL looking to have an EXCITING time, but not REALLY be in DANGER! 
you, OTOH have pussy AT HOME IN BED WAITING FOR YOU!  the only one to lose out
if she bails... is HER!  knowing that, I would have not even entertained her
bullshit OR called her on it, letting her know that I was getting laid tonight
REGARDLESS of whether SHE fucks or not.  that would take the fucking WIND out
of her sails :)

>I tell her I am planning to break her up (which is true) later, so
>it is nothing you should worry about. 

this, my friend :)  is a COP-OUT!  it is used VERY EFFECTIVELY by married men
to keep fucking their side-bitches, but WE are way above bullshit tactics like
this.  I commend you for thinking of this "on the fly", but PLEASE, PLEASE! 
hehe  I have MUCH more respect for you as a PUA than to hear some CRAP like
this from you :)  PLEASE think of something better for the next instance of a
chick trying to BLACKMAIL you into trading in a R-E-L-A-T-I-O-N-S-H-I-P where
you are getting EVERYTHING you want from a chick... for a ONS with HER! 
HAHAHAHAHAHA  >:)

I haven't run into a chick STUPID enough to try to disrespect my MLTR for being
with me... chicks have STARTED to say she is dumb for "letting" (as if she has
ANY say in the matter) her man fuck other chicks, and I have BROKEN THEIR
FUCKING ASSES listing the benefits that SHE is getting that they will most
likely NEVER have with a man... EVER!  and CERTAINLY don't have right now, or
they would not be talking to me in a bar... they would be with THEIR OWN MAN
conducting this FANTASY RELATIONSHIP that they are professing that my MLTR
should have :)  I have NEVER run into a chick that has even TRIED to break into
my relationship with MLTR because they KNOW I mean business.  all they can do
is become ANOTHER MLTR... and after they hear the QUALIFICATIONS, they KNOW
they can't even achieve THAT... only ONS and LJBF with me.  if some bitch EVER
suggested that I break up with MLTR in order to ONS her, I would  A) laugh in
her face and  B) immediately demand an EXPLANATION of the reasons why she
thinks she can knock MLTR out of the box AND make her perform ANY AND ALL
SKILLS that she CLAIMS to be better than MLTR at IMMEDIATELY!  put up or SHUT
THE FUCK UP!  the result would be the ONS ANYWAY, and she would still be LJBF
or NEXT because MLTR is NOT about sex... it is about compatability and I
PERSONALLY could not be with some bitch that needs to knock other chicks off in
order to gain status.  I gain status by BEING MYSELF and letting bitches make
INTELLIGENT, EDUCATED decisions to be with me.  any chick that wants to be with
me had better do the same.

>she gets upset, and starts
>screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
>just like her ex-bf, getting other girls while dating her, and how
>all guys just want sex..etc..

I would have told her "you wanna calm the fuck down?"  throwing tantrums and
making scenes are expressions of her ability to do ANYTHING in your presence. 
I personally don't tolerate that.

>Then she says.. ok, if you let me meet your GF at your house
>tonight, then I will let you have sex with me. [ha! I got her!]

ok.  thank God I happened to read the next line before I started typing this. 
I was JUST going to ask you WHY you are STILL letting her blackmail you into
fucking her... ESPECIALLY when she is the one that needs it and you don't :)

>I bounce back, and say, "what exactly makes you think I am
>desperate to have sex with you tonight?! Do you think I am
>just some stupid guy and you can manipulate me like that?
>No, you will not meet my GF, it is disrespectful to her to do
>that. You know the situation, it was clear to you from the
>beginning, and you accepted it. There is no more to talk about.
>I am not here only for sex, I can get that anywhere. Sex only
>of itself is of little value to me, I want more than that.

SWEET!  :)  break her fucking ASS maniac :)

>I then bring out the nuclear weapons! My tonality is very firm,
>and I eye fuck her, while telling her the following. First, I tell
>her that I already told her about my GF, she was clear about it
>right from the start, and she has NO excuse. Then I go on to tell
>her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
>that did NOT happen. So do NOT compare me to your ex. I am a
>different person, and EXCEPT better treatment than that if you
>ever want to see me again. She starts crying more, and hugging
>again.

ugh :/   fucking IDIOTS!   man, the shit some bitches put you through!  does
everyone SEE why we have to study this shit?

>I put her against wall, and tell her not to complain about me like
>I am her ex, I a am different person than he is.
>
>I tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>alone!

this is a good point.  I like to play it the other way:

ok... so now, you have told me that you want everything to be a 'perfect'
situation with a guy before making a move.  You want him to be ideal with
women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady... WHAT MAKES YOU THINK
HE WILL WANT YOU?   WHAT ARE YOU BRINGING TO THE TABLE THAT IS GOING TO MAKE A
MAN LIKE THAT CHOOSE YOU OVER ANY OTHER CHICK?

you wanna see some confusion?  you wanna see a bitch get BROKEN?  HAHAHAHA  >:)
 of course, I use this on chicks that I am just practicing on, because it
normally induces DEPRESSION, not horniness.  when they have to GO DEEP INSIDE
and dive BELOW THE SURFACE of their programming, they realize that they CAN NOT
TELL ME WHY A MAN WOULD WANT THEM!  they stall the fuck out dude :)  it's
amazing.  matter of fact, it's documented already.  look at my recent thread
with "telembe".  I let her say all this bullshit about what she wanted from a
guy in order to give up her virginity, then when she was finished talking about
what she WANTED, I asked her what she was OFFERING to a guy that was going to
give her all this committment and "love" and other bullshit and she said a
whole bunch of shit that ANY bitch can and WILL give to a man she likes.  she
might have THOUGHT she had something to offer a guy that was going to seperate
her from the pack, but she doesn't.  even GOOD PUSSY can't get a bitch any
credit because there are LOTS of bitches that can fuck and suck like pros...
elites AND sub-elites.  telembe NEVER told us what seperates her from the rest
of the bitches that might make a MAN like the one she wants even LOOK HER WAY! 
the reason is that there is NO reason! :)  bitches are programmed that MEN want
them... but they are NEVER told WHY.  the reason is that men like to FUCK and
get their dicks sucked.  they also like companionship and cooking and cleaning
and for a girl to look good on their arm so they can feel accomplished around
their buddies.  chicks THINK they are ENTITLED to a good man... but the GOOD
MEN... are picking GOOD WOMEN!  if they were SHINING like they think they are,
they would have been scooped up already and married or whatever they were
looking for because some guy would have spotted her and said "I'm not going to
let her go for ANYTHING" and she would be happy... at least according to her
programming.  OH, how I LOVE to see a bitch's face while she TRIES AND TRIES to
dig up ANY reason why a guy as great as the one she claims to want would EVER
choose her over any other bitch :)  the JOY the JOY that I feel as this POMPOUS
BITCH breaks the fuck down RIGHT IN FRONT OF MY FACE! :)  of course since I
broke her, I keep talking to her and ease her back to a decent state of being
and let her know that she can take steps to make herself into the woman that a
man would want, but she has to really KNOW HERSELF and KNOW MEN in order to
make an intelligent decision.  I am not into depressing chicks... unless they
TRULY DESERVE IT for all the depression they have caused men throughout their
tenure as FINE bitches :)  also, I have no desire to BREAK bitches and leave
them like that.  that just makes it WORSE for ALL OF US looking for FINE, yet
DECENT chicks.

>she cries, and says that is so true, that is her problem, she never
>takes the chance and loses out because she doesn't make the
>move on taken guys. Then I run my 'take chances routine' (if you take
>a chance, in the end, the result is usually good, but if you don't,
>just you get left behind, by yourself).. 

nice.  I like that one... emphasizing loss and loneliness.

>she cries more, says she
>needs to take the chance, and doesnt want to be alone.

she's done :)  nice work.  land her!

>She says she has to be careful, that all guys want just sex, and
>bitches about this for about 30 seconds.

as opposed to what?  what does she WANT guys to want?

>Now I start the 'you need me, I dont need you..you think I just want
>only sex, then you dont understand me at all.. if you think that is
>what I am only, then you do NOT deserve me.. I do no need you to go out
>with me if that is what you think I am.. I want connection, sex,
>passion, and closeness.. and if you haven't figured that out about
>me yet, then get another guy, because you dont understand me at all..

OK OK OK... you've CONVINCED me maniac :)  that's some good shit right there :)
 starting NOW, I am pitching for MLTR ONLY.  bitches that want ONS or LJBF will
get what they deserve from me... which isn't much.  I LOVE this idea of dissing
her for claiming that you are looking for ONS... or even just a "bootie-call"
type relationship :)  I love it.  I would feel so PROUD getting on her like
this.  sweet!  EXTREMELY congruent!  nice play!  this is going into my style,
starting RIGHT NOW!  :)

>I am doing this, because I know the left (logic) and right (emotions,
>passion) are fighting each other..they have been all night. Because the
>left doesn't accept the logic of the situation, but I know the right side
>dying for a shag,..she is trying to rationaize going out with a taken guy,
>but I have gotten her so excited tonight, that she needs that fuck.

THIS is the reason I never learned any of this shit until recently.  my
caveman-kino style before this involved ZERO talking.  totally kino and kissing
and PHYSICAL seduction with domineering EYE-CONTACT.  there was NO INFORMATION
for the left side to process at all.  EVERYTHING went STRAIGHT to the chick's
right side, and her left had to try to process the EMOTIONS and turn them into
a story that she could understand... in the meantime, she is PHYSICALLY falling
for the kino and wanting MORE AND MORE until we are fucking.  I never HAD to
talk to chicks before OR after fucking them because my PHYSICAL ATTACK is so
DEVASTATING!  I would just take them over PHYSICALLY and their right brains
would do ALL the work and the left would struggle to understand, but eventually
succumb to the onslaught!  ARG ARG! :)

thanks for explaining that to me :)

>As I touch her side of face, she goes doggy look, I kiss her, and she
>gets like screambabe, panting. I put leg between her, she widens, goes nuts
>totally. I ask her she likes me (in a tell her sort of way' you like me..'),
>she replies 'yes'. I say (stare her down) .. she asks "what should I do?"
>I say in a very strn fatherly voice while staring her down 4 inches from
>her head.. you will follow me..that is what you will do.. and you will do
>what I say. 'she says, 'I will'. I tongue her down more, run her crotch,
>she almost cums right there, then I take her to a love hotel (her first
>time!), no resistance what so ever.

interesting.  what just happened here?  did you somewhere dictate to her that
the terms of her being "your bitch" is that she has to sumbit to you fully? 
are you getting a verbal confirmation of that from her?  or is something else
going on... like she just plain UNDERSTANDS that you can move her to passions
that make her WANT to cum and that you are going to take her there and over the
edge?

another point... what do you guys think of foreplay on a chick.  he mentions
that she almost came right there... do you think it is good to get her to the
EDGE and leave her there so she is so horny, she will do ANYTHING for you to
make her cum, OR to give her an orgasm right there in her clothes to
demonstrate your sexual mastery over her?  personally, I am into the sexual
mastery thing because I notice a newfound RESPECT from a chick that has had
guys on top of her NAKED, fucking her for all they were worth and she never
came from it, and then I am just doing kino on her and fingering her and she
cums from just that.  do you think that making the chick cum on herself makes
her want sex MORE or want it LESS since she just got off?  take into account
that chicks are multi-orgasmic and that they feel sexier after cumming, not
DRAINED like guys.

>As I am fucking her, I am putting things in her head, like D.Shades reports.
>I tell her as she is screaming it feels deeper and deeper, closer and
>closer. She is going nuts will I am fucking her.

I need to reasearch this.  is this more right-brain, left-brain shit where her
left-brain is shut down because of the FIREWORKS that are going off in her mind
because of the sex, leaving her wide open to suggestion?  if you have any links
for this, please post.

>I stare her down, and I tell her you need me (during sex), she says yes.
>I tell her from now on you will follow me, and do what I say. She says
>'yes, I will'. I continue doing her, she says "it feels SO good, I really
>need that, I really want it, i love you inside me!".. she is fucking like a
>wild animal, loud voice, shouting and screaming, oh, I want it, give it
>to me, I want to come!

more of the same?

>Then she tells me anything is ok as long as I dont hate her..she doesnt
>want me to hate her. She wants me to hold/hug her, she cries a bit, then is
>ok again (seems to be thinking of her old bf she says). I touch her
>more, face goes totally doggy look, and finger her, she goes nuts, we start
>fucking again.

the "I don't want you to hate me" thing is very important in the D/s
relationship... not that you set this up like that, but that is the MAIN
incentive for her to follow your lead... that she does NOT want you to hate her
and CERTAINLY not to banish her.  when that is TRULY first and foremost in her
brain, she will regulate HERSELF and place herself in-line with your thinking
and what YOU want her to be.  she also won't try to blackmail you anymore
because she KNOWS it gets on your nerves and all THAT will do is get her
EJECTED sooner rather than later :)

>Her back is on the bed, and I am fucking her missionary, her legs are
>spread and wide in the air, which I am holding. I tell her "see, I control
>you, 

hehe ok... this is a little FAR-FETCHED for me at this point, but I have not
researched it yet :)  I DO like the next line though.

>I go deep in your body because it is the one way to reach you totally
>deep in your mind which no one else can do. 

interesting

>By conquering your body, I can
>conquer your mind (then I drill her a bit more after I finish the sentence so
>she goes more crazy). I play with your body because it lets me control
>your mind (then drill her some more..ha, it is like the ultimate form of
>reward hypnosis).

IS there such a thing as reward hypnosis?  links please? :)

>I ask her, so why you like me. She says she says, you are decisive and
>sometimes I am indecisive, so you make it easy for me. I want the guy
>to make it easy for me to decide what to do (important clue here Maniac!
>maybe most chicks are like this! Maybe this too is where I fucked up
>with HB Geek!)

I have heard this a lot too... only thing is that there is a lot of
RESPONSIBILITY that comes with telling a chick what to do, and if the VALUE of
owning her is not sufficient for me, I don't give a fuck WHAT she does enough
to want to lead her to a good time.

>Moral of the story.. keep your ground.. call all chick bullshit DIRECTLY.
>Make the chick risk fear losing the relationship if she doesn't capitulate
>and chances are she will back down, in spite of how it looks (and I could
>do this BECAUSE I had other choices.. another reason to be fucking
>several chicks at once). As well, it seemed that she was giving me all the
>bullshit in part because she WANTED me to call her on it, and then fuck her
good
>at the end of the night, which I obliged.

chicks give you shit-tests to find out if you are stronger than them and see
HOW you are going to control them.  chicks like the way I control them because
I NARROW their choices for them, but STILL make them choose.  they can choose
the path of ULTIMATE SATISFACTION, or they can choose the path of EJECTION and
being back on the dating scene meeting the SAME LAME GUYS every night :)

you had told her you had a girlfriend, but she seems to have NEEDED to know
that she really COULDN'T have you all to herself and that you really DIDN'T
NEED to fuck her that night or EVER.  you stuck to your guns (after letting her
get to you for a while :-) and she eventually ran out of logic and got
overridden with kino and gave up the fucking pussy like she came there to do :)

>Constructive comments/opinions welcome!
>
>Maniac High
>http://www.pickupguide.com

EXCELLENT!  keep up the GOOD WORK dude!  :)

---
From: erosla77@aol.com (ErosLA77)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 30 Dec 2000 20:12:47 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

>Subject: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit
special!]
>From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
>Date: Fri, Dec 29, 2000 10:37 PM
>Message-id: <92jvre$obh@nnrp1.deja.com>

>)this chick is a very highly educated, driven, professional
> career woman and earns likely a big 6 figure salary
>b)she is very mature, focused and spends all day in her office
> surrounded by sharks and other pirrhana type scumbag characters

 She's got to be in control ALL DAY LONG at work. Small wonder then, with a
man, she wants to fully SURRENDER control and be made to submit.  It's like all
those super-powerful Congressmen and Judges and the like who LOVE going to get
pissed-on and whipped by some Madame Dominatrix. 

>I regroup my thoughts.

 I admire your ability to do this in the field, Maniac. As you think about it,
what do you do internally to re-set yourself and keep yourself in a good frame
of mind when all this shit throws your way?

>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations

   Metahpor is a POWERFUL tool to move folks from a fixed perception to a new
one. Please, share your story!

> Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>her last week, apparently).

Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with fucking; it feels
good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the vulnerabilities.  So
when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which overcomes the
potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. She's worried about pain,
so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not only losing
out on the pleasure of screwing, BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out that if
she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even WORSE
crack-up.

  Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.

>he gets upset, and starts
>screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
>just like her ex-bf,

See? The fear of the pain of being hurt just like her ex-BF hurt her is now
rearing its ugly head.  She doesn't seem like a very emotionally stable person
in ANY event, let alone having just been dumped by a guy.  

>Then I go on to tell
>her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
>that did NOT happen

 Sharp thinking. Again, what do you do internally to keep your state solid and
your thinking sharp? THAT process internally is of great value, even more than
the specifics you share.  The specifics are like handing guys fish; good for a
nice meal and of value. But  how you get to the mind-set is TEACHING someone
HOW to fish so they can eat for life. 

>I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>alone!

 Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to her her
"ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she can then
accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!  

   Excellent...Maniac, I don't give a damn WHAT my orthodox SS followers say,
this is BRILLIANT stuff and I'd be proud to be your wing or have you as mine,
ANY FUCKIN' DAY of the week! Sir, I salute you!

>Now what I am doing with all the above, is not arguing the logic (too
>much)
>of this, because, of course she is right, and I know this.

 Actually, you ARE not arguing the logic, but you are USING the logic...HER
logic..HER way of viewing things.....pointing out WHY and HOW she loses and
what will happen if she doesn't stop it.   It's all centered around losing and
WHY she loses, based on what she has told you.  It IS logical, FROM her point
of view.  

 Great, Great stuff...sir, I salute you!

-----

From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]
Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2000 12:03:54 GMT

Replies to various people about psychicbabe:

Answers to various questions:

Was psychicbabe british, or Japanese?
She was a brit of Japanese ancestry (ie. she
looked 'j', but thought, acted and had an
english accent like a brit). This in my
opinion made it harder, because brit women
are so fucking F A T, and she was so
slender, sexy and attractive (and she dressed
to kill) compared to all of them. Lots of guys were
hitting on her (and she said she always got hit
on, and hated it.. trick was to not make it look
like a 'hit').

Why not a white chick? Well, I had the chance...
but.. at the conference where I met her, EVERY
brit. white chick there was in serious blimp bulge
territory.. very scary. Why is it so many caucasian
women are so FAT?

It was funny though, because something like 8 guys
(I counted) tried to hit on psychicbabe the night
I PU'd her. One guy was pretty good, the rest were
total AFC's..it was rather funny.

Re: Rocks -vs- gold.. how I use it (yes, it is
Jake's metephor. For RJ, search the original post
on fastseduction.com. It is also on pickupguide.com
someplace (if not it will be there in about 2 weeks,
I am revising the page this week). Basically, I intro
it as follows:
After chick says bullshit about wanting to go to
dinner and be friends or shit for 6 months before
becoming a GF, I say: Actually, I dont go to dinner
or stuff like that with ladies who are not my GF
CHick:  gasps!
Maniac: see, going to dinner, is an important step
in a relationship for me. I only share it with someone
special
chick: Huh?
Maniac: Well, let me put it this way, do you ever
sleep with a guy who is just your friend, or dont
care about?
chick: of course not!
Maniac: well, why do you think a guy should do any
different then?
Maniac: See, let me tell you a story. You ever hear
about 'rocks & gold'?
chick: no? what is it?
Maniac: Well, Relationships are valuable things.
And each partner is looking for something. It is like
diamonds (rocks) and gold. Both are valuable.

But women prefer diamonds to gold (usually), and
men prefer gold to diamonds (usually). Of course,
both are important, especially in a long term
relationship, but if a woman could choose, she would
prefer the diamonds  first, and the man would
prefer the gold  first. right?

chick: yeah, probably

Maniac: And (generally), a man can accept gold
without the diamonds, and a woman can accept
diamonds without any gold.

So in a relationship, a woman is mining for
diamonds, while the man is mining for gold.
While they are in the mine together, the
guy gives diamonds he finds to the woman, and
the woman gives the gold she finds, to the man.

But if you give a woman gold only, or a man
diamonds only.. neither is likely to be
very happy, and the relationship will soon
fall apart. In short, an exchange of sorts
takes place in a successful relationship.

And also, if a man expects just gold (sex),
but doesnt want to give her diamonds
(relationship & the mushy stuff), then she
will dump him fairly soon, because he is
playing/using her just for sex..

And if a woman expects just diamonds (walks,
attention, nice dinners, movies..etc) without
giving some gold (sex), then he (if he has any
clue about how to deal with women, though many
men do not, especially in North America) will
dump her because she is using/playing him just
for his personality.

A guy taking a chick to dinners, buying shit
and giving nice walks without sex is THE SAME
as a guy sleeping with a girl, and then kicking her
out right after the fuck is over. (chick says:
'yelch!'. Yes, thats right, and for the guy,
just dinners and buying shit is 'yelch', with
no sex, and no attention is exactly the same.

Because a woman will go to free dinner with
almost any guy, it has no value to me. But
I am like you, I want attention, and I want
to be made to feel special.

And although a girl will go to nice free dinners
with almost anyone, I also know that a girl will
not sleep with anyone. So I know if she does with me,
then it means she thinks I am important. And if
she wont, then it means she doesnt care about me
at all, so I really dont need to see her again,
I will just go find another girl.

Maybe you might think it is unusual for a guy
to think this way, but it is just my way.

See, I dont want to be played. Guys are always
getting played by girls for nice dinners, long
talks on the phone, and for their personalities.
It is the SAME as a girl being used for sex.
So I am happy to give plenty her diamonds, but at
the same time, I dont want to be played, so
I also expect her to want to give me gold.
And if she doesn't, it means she doesnt care about
me, is using me, or it means I am being played,
or I am stupid.

As well, experience has also showed me that
'friends first' almost NEVER results in a
relationship. I mean how many of your BFs were
your friend first (chick usually replies..uh,
zero).

Exactly, so that is why I never play 'friends
first'. Friends first means diamonds for the
lady, and no gold for the guy. That is like
the guy saying (ok, lets fuck for 6 months,
and if its good, we can go to dinner, and go
out, and you can be my GF). Would you like
that (chick: yelch!!).

Exactly.. so that is why it is far better,
that the lady meet me, get to know me, and
then I expect her to be smart enough to know
to take that chance THEN (or reject it, and I will
go get another lady) when it is offered to her.

So that is why I expect things that way in a
relationship with a lady.

After this, a chick is (usually) quite impressed,
or surprised and doesnt know what to say..

[When I recited this to psychicbabe, she actually told me
she was very impressed, that I understood relationships
so well ;-) ]

Had I been smart, I would have used it on HB
geek, and laid her, but after that failure I
thought about it, and then when the same situation
came up with Psychicbabe this week, I knew what
to do..

Ok, now on to other comments..

RJ writes
>Maniac writes:
> >I regroup my thoughts.
>
>  I admire your ability to do this in the field, Maniac. As you think
about it,
> what do you do internally to re-set yourself and keep yourself in a
good frame
> of mind when all this shit throws your way?

A couple things.. first, this PARTICULAR chick is of no importance
to me, because I am (likely) seeing 3 others this week. So it is
not as risky to me to be firm, and keep my ground.

Another important fact, is the way chick's brains are usually
wired. For a
chick, once she likes a given guy, it is hard for her to immediately
switch to another guy. it is far MORE risky, because a chick (unlike
men), usually cannot switch to another guy, once she ALREADY
likes a given guy (story is different BEFORE you got her to
like you..then SHE has more power than you).

So I play on this, and as a result I dont feel nervous/scared at all,
because there is far more to risk to her, than to risk to me. Because
she is stuck to me, but I am not stuck to her. (this also is why
'jerks' can get away with so much shit on any given chick, and why
she will tolerate it.. because her brain has now got her focussed
on THAT guy, and it is now a choice (in her mind), between him (and
his bullshit... or being alone (sure she can get another guy in 10
minutes, but she cannot build those nice feelings of 'attachment'
in 10 minutes.. that gives us men power, once we realize this).

Two, I am generally a very balanced level
headed person, and dont take any of this personally (as you already
know, RJ). Three (in this case), I had
already laid this chick, so I didnt care really if I laid her again
or not.. I already conquered her, and she (and I) already knew that.

If it is a new chick, sometimes, I get more nervous/fucked up (see
HB Geek). I am trying to keep my senses more when this happens

> > Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
> >problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
> >her last week, apparently).
>
> Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with
fucking; it feels

Not sure about this, I think she just simply wanted the fuck, but
wanted to feel she was important to me, and she didnt want to just
get played..

> good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the
vulnerabilities.  So
> when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which
overcomes the
> potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. She's worried
about pain

yes, thats right.

> so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not
only losing
> out on the pleasure of screwing,

Not really. I actually made it clear to her that I didnt care if
she bang me or not. The point was that she had to give her mind
to me, and respect me, and follow me (whether that is bang me,
make her take off her clothes in the window for me, or do my
dishes..whatever.. its not the banging that is important, it is
the submission to me that counts, and what she needs to give me
if she wants my attention at all).

> BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
> believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out
that if
> she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even
WORSE
> crack-up.

Yes

>   Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.
>
> >he gets upset, and starts
> >screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
> >just like her ex-bf,
>
> See? The fear of the pain of being hurt just like her ex-BF hurt her
is now
> rearing its ugly head.  She doesn't seem like a very emotionally
stable person
> in ANY event, let alone having just been dumped by a guy.

No, she is not stable at all. I think though, it is because she
bottles it up all day, to be the 'office bitch' that she has to
be in the daytime. This chick lives for her work. She has no other
life.

>
> >Then I go on to tell
> >her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
> >that did NOT happen
>
>  Sharp thinking. Again, what do you do internally to keep your state
solid and
> your thinking sharp? THAT process internally is of great value, even
more than
> the specifics you share.  The specifics are like handing guys fish;
good for a
> nice meal and of value. But  how you get to the mind-set is TEACHING
someone
> HOW to fish so they can eat for life.

Actually, the specifics are important I think. This is why lay/field
reports with details are so important. I think really shitty on my
feet. I really suck.. bad.

But if I have had that same experience before (with another chick),
or been in that same situation before, and
either succeeded (or failed, and then thought about how to handle it
right the next time), then I will handle it correctly this time.

I really believe in field experience. I have alot... really alot.
so I have seen many of these situations before. It is like chess,
or a foreign language. If you've been there before, and worked out
a solution, then you know what to do. You MUST get field experience.
It is CRUCIAL. And each time you fail, you go home, and see what
you did right/wrong, and what you would do if the same situation
happened again. This is why I also post the fuckup as well as
the lay reports.. they are very valuable to me in gathering my
thoughts and forcing me to think about what I did right/wrong,
as well as listening to the other's comments about them on this
NG.

I also look at the other's reports as well, and learn about
situations, and ask myself for each one, if it happened to me,
what would I do/how would I handle it. Eventually, after doing it
for a couple years (I have been at this in ernest for about 2
years now), you get better at it. Learning situations in PU, is
like learning the words of a foreign language, and how to connect
them all together.. how to move from a bad situation..to a good
one to get the chick in a horny state..

Also, I keep in mind alot about what MrSex4uNYC says about attitude,
and when I get stuck, I ask myself, what would NYC tell me right
now about this situation. He is very congruent, and if you think
things this way, it is easy to be clear what is the right way or
wrong way.

> >I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
> >with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
> >with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
> >and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
> >unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
> >alone!
>
>  Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to
her her
> "ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she
can then
> accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!

Yes, basically that is the idea. I am not sure that it means I am
an authority, but its more, to convey that she is clueless, she
is wrong, so to listen to herself will make her fuck up even more..
..so maybe she had better listen to me instead, and then she wont
fuckup as much.. basically that is the idea..

>    Excellent...Maniac, I don't give a damn WHAT my orthodox SS
followers say,

I didn't get this.. What are orthodox SS followers, and I had no
idea they were saying anything about this.. I really dont understand
what you mean here..

> >Now what I am doing with all the above, is not arguing the logic (too
> >much)
> >of this, because, of course she is right, and I know this.
>
>  Actually, you ARE not arguing the logic, but you are USING the
logic...HER
> logic..HER way of viewing things.....pointing out WHY and HOW she
loses and
> what will happen if she doesn't stop it.   It's all centered around
losing and
> WHY she loses, based on what she has told you.  It IS logical, FROM
her point
> of view.

Yes, basically that is the idea. What I meant was, is that her main
point is that she wants a monogamous BF, and doesn't want to be played.
But, I am playing her, and she (at some level) realizes that, so
in essense, her gut feel about this is totally correct.

But I am playing her desire for the fuck, and her fear of losing
out, which lets me bypassing her gut feel that she is being
played, and then I can get her to fuck anyways.

Good followups everyone!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

-----

From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]
Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2001 12:10:23 GMT

  "Dohn Joe"  wrote:
>  wrote in message news:92n7b96
@nnrp1.deja.com...
> [snip]
>
> The more I think of it, the more this seems to be a great PU.
> I think the PU in England is the gist of your piece of work.
>o I'd be glad to see more
> details on how you picked her up in England, that's the hardest work. How
> did you stand up the crowd? How did you make it not look like a PU?

I was using psychological 'jujitsu' (use the strength of your
opponant, against themself). There is a field report from 2 months
ago, that outlines the PU (check fastseduction.com archives).
Basically, I met her at a conference. I didnt talk to her much.
Then I followed her onto a bus that was taking us to the next
meeting place. A guy was hitting on her, and he sat with her.
I sat on the seat in front bymyself.

She (like most british bitches), started complaining about how
she hates men, and other bullshit. The guy on the bus with her
is taking this/agreeing with it (if I remember right).

I just turned around (and tonality and eye contact here is crucial),
and just tell her in a VERY authoritative voice, slowly.. "perhaps
you have just not met the right man yet, one you understands you,
deeply, and completely. But.. you never know the future.. now do you..
I used killed eye contact, spoke slowly, and continued "perhaps
if you open your mind more, you might find him.. by surprise, without
even expecting it, because often, that is the way it usually is..see"

Psychicbabe went "maybe", and then started more manhating bitching.

I then described the kind of man she wanted "one you could rely on,
but at the same time, be mysterious, and exciting in some unexpected
ways, because he just knew how to reach you deep inside you, and
your mind.. that is what your looking for..isnt' it?"

Psychicbabe: yes,

{continue PU, bunches of stuff from the ManiacPlan, if I remember
right}

The key here was the tonality and Eye-Fuck contact. That is what
did it more than the words I used. I just totally crushed her
with it..

> How did
> you get past her "bitch office" shield? I'm asking especially because, as I
> picture this woman, it would seem pretty intimidating for me to approach
> her.

I had the attitude that she obviously had never met a man that
knew how to give it to her right, which means that she obviously
needed ME far more than I needed her. That mindset made it easy.

> I admire your ability to take her from there into total submission.
> existing relationship than guys. That's why many (even HOT ones) find
> themselves in a dead end - boring or abusive - relationship, love to
> complain about it to whoever they find to listen, yet are unable to step out

EXACTLY!!

> of it. That's why the first fuck is hard - after that she is bound
> emotionally to you. You see,

>Women's sexuality is DISSOLVED in them.

Yes! you understand it!! (true for most, but not all chicks though,
some just like sport fucking, like we do)

> GREAT words to remember for all us RAFCs when we feel like beating the walls
> after a fuckup... I myself am so darn depressed when coming back after an
> unsuccessful encounter with a chick. Yes, each field experience is one more
> lesson

Yes, do NOT underestimately field experience. It is SO important.
I fucked up TONS (see all the fuckup reports I used to post a couple
years ago on ASF), and I still fuckup alot (see HBGeek, or HockeyBabe).
Over on cliff's list they say it takes 2..4 years to get good
at something, and 10 years to be a master. I TOTALLY agree.
I have only been at this for 2.. 2 1/2 years. And the more I learn,
the more I realize I still need to learn.. There is still TONS that
I dont know yet.

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

----
From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:08 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

I, for one, am really GLAD to see a post from RJ that has helped me move
forward in MY game :)  not that I am an ingrate hehe... his contribution to all
this is UNDENIABLE to begin with and if I hadn't stumbeled onto his site, I
would have still been using my caveman tactics and my MENTAL seduction game
would still be lacking.  as much as I appreciate his contribution to the
seduction game in general, I had been disappointed with all the flaming and
nonsense that he and others had/have been involved with because I thought that
this NG was BASED on USEFUL interaction between him and the rest of us, but I
found that not to be the case :(  not that ANYONE gives a fuck what I have to
say about this, but I wanted to back up into the PAST to make it clear that I
appreciate RJ's PERSONAL contribution to the NG TODAY.

In article <20001230151247.26801.00001467@ng-fi1.aol.com>, erosla77@aol.com
(ErosLA77) writes:

>>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations
> 
>   Metahpor is a POWERFUL tool to move folks from a fixed perception to a new
>one. Please, share your story!

I have been doing this without identifying it:

A) find out her perception (marriage, monogamy, sucking dick VS kissing...)
B) "quote" her a story illustrating a chick that saw things a DIFFERENT way
(the way I want HER to see things) and benefitted GREATLY from it (she is still
with me, she got married to the guy she wanted, she gained inner peace and
self-love...)
C) watch her AGREE with something that she just minutes ago BELIEVED was
incorrect, or not for her.

the most fascinating part is (C) because I didn't realize my powers of
validation, pacing then LEADING had developed so strongly.  this is partially
because I am an empath and can FEEL when a chick moves into different emotional
states so I can relate to her from within her own state and effectively "vulcan
mind-meld" with her, turning the TWO of us into a SINGLE, functioning entity so
that I can dictate for US... to a degree.

a frequent situation is chicks asking me if I am single.  basically, I explain
to them that I am in an "open" relationship.  they practically INVARIABLY
disrespect my MLTR for being stupid. "how can she go for that?" "I would have
dumped you" "I would never let a man see other women"...  sooooo :)  I let them
go on and on and get it all out and completely ENTRENCH themselves in the DREAM
of them being with a man like me AND dumping me or CHANGING me or whatever
their BULLSHIT FANTASIES are at the time.  THEN I go into the BENEFITS of being
MY PRIMARY relationship... :)  when I stack up the LIST of BENEFITS and it
stacks HIGHER than those bitches have in their OWN RELATIONSHIPS RIGHT NOW,
they start thinking.  they think about what LITTLE they really have in their
relationships that MY MLTR is getting.  they think about the TRUST and
COMPANIONSHIP between us that they DON'T HAVE with their borefriends.  they
think about how she is SEXUALLY SATISFIED... DAILY if she wants it.  she has
someone to give her the REAL DEAL on how men are and what we want from
chicks... not someone that's going to keep playing her until he is finished
fucking her.  they ALSO see how the other bitches (like them in the near
future) come and go and MLTR CONSTANTLY receives the benefits of being with a
man that does EVERYTHING for her that she could want... for the MERE price of
NOT bailing because I fuck other chicks :)  once I break it down to them, ALLLL
I see on their faces is ENVY.  matter of fact, they tend to look EMBARRASSED
when I ask THEM about THEIR relationships.  oh, that reminds me... the bitches
that DON'T HAVE A MAN AT ALL fare the WORST in these situations.  my MLTR has
NEVER-ENDING SATISFACTION... they have STORIES of what they WOULD DO... IF
they could get a man AT ALL!  :)

chicks would rather have 20% of a WINNER than 100% of a LOSER!

>> Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>>her last week, apparently).
>
>Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with fucking; it
feels
>good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the vulnerabilities.  So
>when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which overcomes the
>potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. 

wow!  VERY powerful :)  I had really considered these to be apples and
oranges... pain of emotions after sex and pain of LOSS of the individual. 
however, discomfort is discomfort.  I quit giving UTILITY to this PIVOT I was
using because I realized she had ZERO self-esteem and not many other redeeming
qualities other than her looks.  she went from LJBF to NEXT overnight.  I had
been using her for a pivot because of her looks, but her lack of personality
started to wear on me and finally, she had to go.  no more hanging out, no more
phone calling, no more help with her love-life... nothing... cold turkey. 
completely FORGOT about her.  about a month or so later, the holiday season
comes around and she  A) calls me  B) tells me she bought me something for
christmas (I bought her NOTHING, not even a CARD and didn't bother to get one
when she told me she bought me something)  C) tells me she wants to bring it TO
my house, and  D) shows up with gift in hand, READY to socialize and spend time
with me.  

this is the SAME bitch that NEVER went in her purse to even OFFER to throw in
money when I used to use her for a pivot.  I didn't mind paying for her though
because the benefits I got from being out with an attractive chick that KNOWS I
am out to get OTHER bitches and facilitates that was well worth it :)  hehe... 
too bad for her, MLTR was over and I received her gift, talked to her for a
while (where she told me her recent "relationship" blew the fuck up in her face
:-) and then ejected her to keep having fun with MLTR.

I have been using outfoxer's style of letting bitches get involved in bullshit
relationships, TELLING THEM the relationships are bullshit then letting them
fall FLAT on their faces and come CRAWLING back to me :)  I just haven't added
the part yet where I get indignant that they are giving sex to CHUMPS that use
them like BITCHES and throw them away.  hehe it is fun enough at this point
just to hear about their FAILURES from the horses' mouths and see the sad looks
on their faces, while I am CONSTANTLY SMILING :)

what you described is BASICALLY what happened to her, except NOT in the sexual
content, but in the companionship content.  she THOUGHT she had a solid
position with me as my pivot, so she didn't feel like paying for anything
because she thought I NEEDED her, not WANTED her.  as soon as I didn't want her
anymore and dumped her from LJBF to NEXT, she was OK with it UNTIL her
relationship BACKFIRED... THEN she decides she wants to get back in good with
ME, which she can't do because I don't give a fuck about her and except for
looks, she can't compete with MLTR AT ALL!

the pain of loneliness overrides the emotional pain of sex without
committment... fascinating :)

>She's worried about
>pain, so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not only
>losing out on the pleasure of screwing, BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
>believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out that if
>she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even WORSE
>crack-up.
>
>  Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.

ok, this is interesting too.  "this is why you fucked up with your ex and I
feel the same way about that particular topic".  you are FORECASTING her
EJECTION unless she changes her ways.  she is still WITH YOU and has a chance
to do the right thing instead of getting ejected.  she already knows how it
feels to BE ejected by her EX and doesn't WANT to go through that pain AGAIN
with you.  you dictate to her HOW she could have avoided it with her EX and she
learns how to avoid it with you and gets in line.  this is another reason why
DICTATING what you REQUIRE from chicks is good, because they have the roadmap
to success or FAILURE with you.  as long as you have demonstrated personality
AND value BEFORE getting to this with her, she will be in a state of "how can I
get my hands on this guy... and KEEP him?" and then you will tell her what she
needs to do to be CONSIDERED amongst your TOP chicks and then is is up to her
to either fulfill her womanly duties or... as you predicted... get ejected and
feel the PAIN OF SEPERATION all over again with someone that she ALREADY knows
she WANTS to be with... WHATEVER the cost.

everyone has their price.  I find, most times, chicks are TALKING with no
EXPERIENCE.  a chick told me that she dumped her borefriend because he laughed
at her.  I told her that the sex must not have been good because otherwise she
would have had to use more than THAT to justify dumping an entire relationship.
 she CLAIMED that sex had nothing to do with her decision and that he didn't
RESPECT her was why she dumped him.  I told her that if the sex had been what
it is SUPPOSED to be... I GUARANTEE her that she would NOT have thrown THAT
away because of some laughing and disrespect.  I also proceeded to laugh at her
AND disrespect her IN HER FACE and told her I don't care because we are not
dating... she can't DUMP ME!   she never ADMITTED that I was right... BUT... by
the end of the conversation, she was asking me WHAT SHE SHOULD DO TO MAKE HER
LOVE LIFE BETTER!  :/  gotcha!

>>I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>>alone!
>
> Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to her her
>"ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she can then
>accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!  

yes.  I really have not been making the MOST of pacing and leading.  I have
been seeing where they ATTACH THEMSELVES to my way of thinking and see me as an
authority.  I have not used this to MAKE POLICY for them... merely to open
their minds and get them to think more efficiently.  you are right though. 
once you capture them... LEAD THEM!  make SOME efficient use of your new
followers... even if you were only practicing or passing time by capturing them
:)

excellent post :)

------

From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:10 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

In article <92n7b96@nnrp1.deja.com>, maniac_high@yahoo.com writes:

>After chick says bullshit about wanting to go to
>dinner and be friends or shit for 6 months before
>becoming a GF, I say: Actually, I dont go to dinner
>or stuff like that with ladies who are not my GF
>CHick:  gasps!
>Maniac: see, going to dinner, is an important step
>in a relationship for me. I only share it with someone
>special
>chick: Huh?
>Maniac: Well, let me put it this way, do you ever
>sleep with a guy who is just your friend, or dont
>care about?
>chick: of course not!

[lots of good use of Jake's shit snipped]

this is interesting, though I couldn't tell if this is something you are GOING
to do, or something you DID already.  either way, IF you are congruent, this
will serve you well as an alternate form of screening.  most of the time, I
screen by ASKING chicks shit and listening to their answers while watching
their faces and body-language.  another way to do it is to basically DICTATE to
them what I need to even CONSIDER being with a chick in any capacity
whatsoever.  most of the time I don't do this though because I can tell already
that the chick is worthless.  I usually get into DICTATION when she asks me
about myself.  am I attached?  what do I look for in a woman? etc.  THEN, since
she asked, I get into the reasons I have chosen women in the past and why I am
still with them in the present.  as I do that, I lay down my laws WITHOUT
telling the chick I am talking to that she needs to get in line with this shit
or get the fuck out of my face.  I have had a couple of chicks blow themselves
out after this.

I was talking to a chick that I know from YEARS ago that started calling me
again and talking about nothing.  I tolerated her for an hour or so on two
different days  A) because I was bored and  B) because through her speech
patterns and recurring ideas, I was learning if she was worth anything to me at
all, considering I get everything I want or need from MLTR in the first place,
she only had a VERY LIMITED use to me, as GOOD backup-pussy.  MLTR is smarter,
more interesting, more fun, less psychotic... basically TRUMPED her in all
areas, so this chick had NO CREDIT with me whatsoever.  I ended up getting into
PRECISELY what you did in your post.  the KICKER was when I told her "I don't
even TALK to girls that I don't want to fuck".  since I had not fucked her AND
had not suggested that we get together (she BELIEVES in monogamous
relationships for herself and even if she fucked me one time, it would be
merely to relieve her own personal stress and I am not going to be there for
her for that.  I am looking for MORE MLTRs... anything else can go fuck off.  I
laughed at her way of being AND broke it down to her why it was so stupid AND
let her know in NO UNCERTAIN TERMS that I was not going to be involved in
ANYTHING CLOSE to what she claims to want for herself... she can STAY HORNY for
all I care) she INTELLIGENTLY asked me WHY I was talking to her...  I let her
know that I found her amusing and her way of living ineffective.  I pointed out
to her that in the YEARS since I had spoken to her last, ALL she had to show
for it was a bungh of jibberish about WANTING a monogamous relationship that
she HAS NOT ATTAINED IN ALL THESE YEARS!  I let her know that I had predicted
that she would REMAIN dissatisfied for years to come and my talking to her
allowed me to follow her LACK of progress while, in the meantime, I get laid
EVERY DAY by MLTR :)   I have not heard from her SINCE that conversation...
good riddance.  she knew what she HAD to do if she wanted more of my time.  she
knew what she was going to have to do IF she wanted to socialize with me at
all.  she felt like her DEVOTION to the idea of a monogamous relationship with
a NON-EXISTANT man was more important than getting fucked by a guy that she
KNOWS and LIKES.  she is an idiot, and will remain horny UNTIL she fucks the
wrong guy, then has NO ONE to comfort her because I will not be there because
she had her chance and BLEW IT!

I have ZERO TOLERANCE for chicks that want things their way.  if they LIKE
doing things MY WAY, then they can be with me...maybe... for a while... as long
as they still LOOK HOT :)   when I approach chicks, I ASSUME they will fail the
screen because statistics show that I require A LOT from a chick and most of
them are either distracted by work or other relationships or just are not
QUALITY enough to be with me.  I find it amusing how ridiculous the SAME girls
are that I used to DESIRE to go out with and that I USED TO dislike being
rejected by.

now, I meet and REJECT girls daily.  not actively, just after I meet them, I
make NO EFFORT to remain in contact with them and go off to talk to other
chicks, leaving them wondering WHY I was interested enough to approach, but
BECAME DISINTERESTED and ejected for a SIMILARLY-GOOD-LOOKING bitch :)

Experiment Report! How kinky are your coworkers?!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



A practice session using the techniques of PU!


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: ]Experiment Report! How kinky are YOUR co-workers?!
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 08:03:45 GMT

]Experiment Report! How kinky are YOUR co-workers?!

This report is about finding the deep dark secrets of
your co-workers (not necessarily to fuck them, but as
a good experiment in state transitioning in groups
rather than one-on-one).

Note, for those readers living in repressed countries
still in the sexual dark ages like the Islamic
Republic of Iran, or the United Stated of America,
I do not advice attempting this..trouble with the
legal system, sex harrassment shit, or loss of
your job could result.. For the rest of you living
in countries that have both feet planted firmly in
the 20th century, no problem, lets rock on- here
is the report!


Recently, I have been doing alot of work practicing
state transitioning. Ie. the goal is to take a
chick (or in this case, group of chicks) from the
"idle state" (ie. thinking about office bullshit
and work they have to do), and transition them
to the kinky "lets get crazy and fuck state" as
quickly as possible, and in as few steps as possible
using a process that will be consistantly successful.

Last night, we had one of these (usually) boring
office departmental dinner parties at a stuffy
restaurant in town. BORING!!

So I decided what better place to liven things up
and see what I can get away with using psychological
warfare and a little bit of alcohol in an otherwise
formal group setting.

I get there, and sit at a table with 1 guy, and
5 chicks. For the first 30 minutes, it is boring,
I let everyone talk about boring office shit so
that everyone can arrive, and the food can start.

First I arrange the waiter to bring drinks to the
table (we need it later for one of the games I
am going to do), and get started on that right away.
One of the chicks only drinks tea, but that is OK,
later she really got into it anyways in spite of
being stark sober.

At the table is sitting:
ChinaGuy - he is from China
Mombabe - she is a mom, but wild & crazy, 40s (starts
          by sitting at another table)
HB CaptHook - she had a mild eye infection and is
              wearing an eyepatch this week (starts by
              sitting at another table)
HBStrict - she only drinks tea, but is more action
           than she looks
ScaredChick - she thinks we are all wierd
HBWhoMe? - she looks SO straight, but is the kinkiest
           at the table we find out!
Bichick - we find out she had enjoyed some bi games

Other assorted people sitting farther, who dont
play in the games really..

After that, I start. Here is how I did it. Refer
to the 'Maniac plan' post I made a couple weeks ago
(it is archived in fastseduction.com, I will also put
it on my site in Jan. when the next big update
happens) for some of the terminology below. I move
all the chicks (as a group), through all the states
as follows:

[Current State: Idle: chicks talking about office bullshit]
Maniac>Bichick: So what did you do this weekend?
Bichick: Nothing really.. how about you?
Maniac>I went to my dance circle, I like salsa dance
Bichick: oh really? {other chicks starting to listen}
Maniac: Yeah, I went to Brazil this year too, it was so
        much fun, wanna see my pictures?
Bichick & others: 'yes!' (take out my digi-PC, show pictures
        of carnival in Rio, tback bikini babes, the gay parade
        and debauchery in the streets)
Maniac: You know, the culture is SO different, brazilian people
        are SO passionate!
All chicks: oh really?
Maniac: yep, after I left Rio, I went to Sao Paolo, and
        went into this bar and all of the sudden this brazilian
        chick grabbed me and started french kissing me (perform
        SP chick story from ManiacPlan).

[Current State: (A)dmiration & (M)an now achieved from ManiacPlan]
Bichick: Oh, HB Capthook lived in brazil a few years!
Maniac: really? {I go to her table, ask if she wants to see
        some brazil carnival pictures with us.. she runs over
        to our table}
Maniac>all chicks: you know, I respected that SP chick though
       because she was not afraid to take what she wants..
       kind of like Madonna (perform the Madonna story from
       ManiacPlan).
Maniac: Perform 'how to communicate to lady at all levels
        and pay attention to her and what she wants' story
        from ManiacPlan, while doing lots of Kino on
        HBCapthook sitting next to me as a demonstration.
        Others are watching and getting jealous..

[Now try to introduce the (S)ex state from ManiacPlan..
the goal here is to do the "questions game, but in a
group setting.. so I decide to do it via a drinking game]
Maniac: {now I try to introduce a drinking game called 'I
       never'}, Hey, do they have any good drinking games in
       Japan.
Chicks: {they suggest some really lame boring shit like
         remembering names of subway stations..boring!!!}
Maniac: Well, I know two games, Chandelliers {I describe this
        game.. but we wont play it, not sexual}, and then
        "I never" {I describe "I never"}.
[Now here, I think I dont have enough rapport yet to start
"I never" (a drinking version of "questions") and get it to
work well (ie. sexually), so first I preform the "Strawberry
fields" game in a group (in next post, and included below)

<>>

We play the game: (mombabe hears us laughing, comes
over & kicks Chinaguy out of his chair so she can sit
next to us)

Among the answers to "strawberry fields"
Bichick: "uh, I dont see any fence around the field!"
HB Capthook & mombabe: "as many as I can eat!"
HBStrict: "to the farmer.. uh.. Thank you {and bow}"

We were all laughing and rolling on the floor to the
various chicks answers to this game, with lots of "I cant
believe you?! really?!" reactions among the ladies..

[Current state in ManiacPlan: (S)ex now achieved, now
lets intensify and see what these chicks will say/do.
I am putting LOTS of shoulder/back kino on all the
ladies as the game is playing]

Maniac: OK, time for another game, we will play that
 "I never" game we talked about before. {Maniac explains
 howto play "I never"} [easy.. each person takes a turn,
 say "I never xxx", whoever did "xxx" has to take a drink.
 start light, get game sexual ASAP..]

Maniac: here is the opening question: "I never kissed a
 member of the opposite sex before I was 15 y.o."
{3 girls drink}
Maniac: your turn HBCaptHook
HBCaptHook: uh, I dont understand the game yet, can you do
  the next question Maniac?
Maniac: OK, I never kissed a guy on the first date
{we all drink}
HBCaptHook: OK I get it, my turn "I never had sex with a
 guy on the first date" {notice because of the setup with
 straberry fields here, that the chicks ON THEIR OWN, turned
 the game sexual without me having to do anything! This was
 what I worried about if I were to start the "I never" game
 before straberry fields.. the mood was just not sexual
 enough yet, and the game would have fizzled.. but now..
 no problem!}
{all but 1 chick drinks (HB afraid.. who is looking a bit
 uncomfortable now)}
Mombabe: I never kissed a member of the same sex
{Bichick drinks!.. lots of "oh really?!? and discussion
 ensues, but bichick wont delve into it anymore ;-) }
Bichick: I never had sex with more than 4 people in the
 room.
{bichick, HBstrict and HBWhoMe all drink!}
HBAfraid: I never went to california
{we all look at her wierd.. skip to next girl}
HBWhoMe: I never did sex as part of a performance in front
of others
{Maniac, Bichick and HBWhoMe drink.. HBStrict looks envious,
others gasp and are laughing.. rest of our dept, is looking
at us, like why we are having so much fun, and a bit wierdly,
fortunately they cannot hear what we are saying ;-)}
Maniac: I never had sex with someone and didn't know their
 name till the next morning.
{We all drink except HB afraid}
MomBabe: I never used tool, or vibrator during sex
{we all drink}
HBCaptHook: I never had sex with a cat?!
{we all look at her wierd.. no one drinks}
HBCaptHook: but it can happen, I saw it on video once!
{we look at her more strange, and make her drink for watching
the video}
HBAfraid: I cant think of any question
{we skip her, next girl}
..
Maniac: I never was tied/tied up my partner during sex
{Maniac, HB strict, HBCapthook and HBWhome all drink}

Maniac: I see, so who is "S", and who is "M" {explain to
 a couple clueless chicks which was which}
HBWhoMe and HBStrict are serious S type, Bichick is both.
HBStrict makes a pass at me, and I reply only if you are
serious.. she stares at me long (maybe a future there ;-) )
I shake hands and hug HBWhoMe, who is really into this
thread of questioning.

Mombabe now makes ajoke about why I went to lunch today
with this other chick (not in the game), and not her. I
tell her because she didn't ask me.. girls have to take
what they want, like that SP chick. I ask her if she
likes me, she says yes, and I gesture (and get) a cheek
kiss. I am CERTAIN I could have done a KC, or even one
of those 3way KCs, but I remember that this is an
experiment, and I do have to see all these people on Monday
again at work, so I dont push it.

now adminbabe (the dept head's secy) comes by our table
and asks how many of us are going to the prescheduled
after-party karaoke. Mombabe replies "none of us, we are
all going to a hotel".. HBCapthook adds in "a love hotel..".

[Final state: Dying to fuck: achieved]

Adminbabe looks at us wierd (she missed the whole thing),
and leaves. Mombabe now asks why I have such a harem tonight,
and then Bichick remarks how all the ladies in the office
really really like you Maniac.

I ask 'why?'
bichick says.. you smile, and laugh alot.. but there is
something else.. we all see it, but cant really
describe what it is {maniac opinion.. it is the way
I stare at chicks with the 'fuck me' luck, and all the
shoulder kino..etc, I do, even in the office}.

Supper now is wrapping up, we all have to go, I remark
that this table is fun, and that another night, we should
all meet again for beer and fun.. everyone agrees.

As we are going back, HBCaptHook and mombabe are grabbing
all over me, it was funny.

Some go home, and I split off from the group, as I have
a date with karatebabe at midnight in another part of
town..

Experiment over..

I learned that state transitioning is a very predictable,
reproduceable process, once you learn the tools to do it.
This was just my office staff that is around me, so made
a good subject for the experiment. I also realized, that
in groups, there is a sort of feed back effect, so you
can really accelerate things. It wasnt the alcohol because
HBstrict had nothing to drink, but was well into the
game too.

Because it was a group, I could skip steps "BVG,D,O" in
the ManiacPlan, and reach the last state.. (dying to fuck)
so I likely could have taken any (or all)
of those ladies back for a wild time in the sack (which I
wont do, because I work with them.. but there was nothing
stopping it, thats for sure)..

Fascinating..

Constructive Opinions/comments anyone?

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Doing proper ‘closes’

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Using the 'color game' to do a PU!


From: tonymcneill@my-deja.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Colours Game - opinions?
Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 00:43:35 GMT

 Hi Guys,

I've just field tested this pattern / game for creating an erotic and
horny state - worked a dream:) I'd be interested to know what you think
of this and how it might be improved.....

I suppose it might work best with the more visually thinking babes.

This is not a 'word for word' pattern by any means, by the way - I just
kind of found myself going into it on the fly.....  here we go..

The PUA "notices" the colour (UK spelling by the way for those who might
feel the urge to correct me) of an object, item of clothing etc.

PUA - "I find these yellow walls (or whatever) quite uplifting;
especially in the winter. Isn't it nice to have some bright colours
around when it's so grey and dark outside?" "Do you think that colours
have an big effect on peoples' moods?".

HB - "Oh, yes, definitely."

PUA - "Hmmm. I was just wondering......I mean....... I was in one of
those New Age shops recently and they were selling lots of different
coloured sunglasses.... with the idea that, if you wanted to feel more
of a certain mood, or to look at the world in a certain way, you would
slip on a pair of sunglasses which would colour everything you looked at
in the desired tone" "Do you think that could work in any way?"

HB - "Well, maybe. I don't know really"

PUA - "Well, for example, my bedroom is a very pale blue colour and I
find this particular blue very restful" "I mean, can you imagine
sleeping very well in a pale blue room?" "Imagine you are really tired,
you know when your eyelids are heavy and you curl up with that fantastic
feeling of at last ... just letting go.... and .....giving
yourself...to....(sp perhaps?).. sleep'" "Do you have a sense of a
particular colour when you imagine that feeling?" (Make sure she's
imagining being sleepy).

HB - "Oh, maybe blue, or green" (or whatever). (If she doesn't come up
with one then maybe she could be asked to imagine the perfect colour for
a bedroom, but both of the HB subjects I tried got right into it.)

PUA "How about when you feel....really full of great ideas...... like
you have all sorts of inspiration flowing through you.?"

PUA then procedes to get HB to imagine a few other states (feeling very
inspired and spiritual (commenting on her choice of colour in a playful
way)...... bursting with energy ...... feeling very sensual,
relaxed and open (we're getting closer, gentlemen)......and eventually,
 being full of passion and horny), and slowly visualising a colour with
each one.

You get the picture - guiding her into these states,
comparing colours etc etc. I have tried this on two chicks, both of whom
LOVED the game and got right into imagining the states. One of them was
an ex who is of great value as a pivot / social proof (and a friend) so
I was testing the game with her rather than going for the lay and the
other HB, in spite of being pretty shy, blushed madly and was VISIBLY
remembering the joy of being fucked until she screamed with pleasure ;)
(At this point Tony is feeling a bit fucking pleased with himself).
I think this would have definitely resulted in a fuck had I not been
meeting her at lunchtime before going off to work :( (at this point Tony
is disgusted as well as pleased!!)

What do you 'real' PUAs think of this little game? As I said I somehow
went into it on the fly after having the idea while practicing
improvising patterns while driving, using things I saw on the road as
starting points for pattern-talk. So it's pretty new and I, as yet,
claim only to be a humble RAFC. Going to test it some more and post the
results....



Any suggestions or comments?

Tony

--
'Action' is the magic word

Maniac High's Pick Up Girls Guide and Seduction Website! » field

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Maniac uses a power opener to meet and tongue down a chick!


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Maniac meets HBOrderMe! Bar PU
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 05:00:36 GMT

Maniac meets HBOrderMe! Bar PU
001215

This is an interesting bar PU. .
used it to not lay the chick, but to get higher rapport
with the other guys around.

It is bo-nen-kai (end of year party) season in Japan.
After the party (boring, in a big hotel ballroom)
we go to the ni-ji-kai (after party) in a bar/disco
in Roppongi with a bunch of my coworkers (mostly guys,
and some ladies).

One AFC guy is really into this HB. He is making every
AFC mistake in the book (saying she is pretty, sucking
up to her..blah). Progress is really slow.

Me and all the guys are watching. He gets frustrated and
leaves for a bit. I move in on the chick (she is wearing
a high cut black dress, and fishnet stockings... very cute).

My opener is the strawberry game.. I just go up to her,
and say 'imagine you are in a field, and you see a strawberry
field ahead of you, with a fence around.. how high is the
fence'. She goes right into it.

Then I do the interpretation (see strawberry game post
for the game and interpretation) for her. I ask her what
she thinks (she said 1m high fence, 50 strawberries, sorry
to the farmer). She disagrees the interpretation. Then I
ask her what is your idea guy like (brad pitt). Then I say
besides his looks why you like him. Reply: he is really
guy.

Then I ask, what do you want most in a guy's character.
She says, 'I want him to lead, to decide for me what to do.'
Good.. Maniac keeps that in mind for what comes next. .

AFC guy comes back, and I let him have his chick back for
a while. He is doing more regular AFC stuff, though he
has at least initiated kino.. very good. He does this for
like 20 minutes, but isn't really breaking through.

He gets frustrated, goes. I tell the guys 'watch this',
and go up to the chick, and say I am going now, give me a
kiss. I get a cheek kiss.

I look straight into her eyes, and tell her 'thats not
good enough, look into my eyes.. what do you see.. now
give me a real kiss..' a long tonguedown with sexual kino
ensues.. Everyone else sees what I just did, after spending
not even a total of 5 minutes talking with this chick
from before.

I leave the chick, and go back to the guys.. 'that is how
it is supposed to be done'. Respect of me from my guy co-workers
now goes up 10x from whatever it was before, and was visibly
different in the office the next day.

AFC co-worker comes back and tells me how so much he is
in love with this girl (I guess he knew her from before as
a friend or co-worker or something..not sure.. I had never
met her before though). As a result, I defer to him, and let
him get AFC'd out.

I go back to the other guys, and just say, I could take her
(she lives really close actually, so I could just say I
live far and can I crash at her place.. I am sure the answer
would have been yes) whenever I want. They say 'why dont you'?

I reply, well, AFC guy is really into her, and he is a coworker
of mine who I respect, so I dont want to take his chick away
from him. There are lots of chicks to fuck, and this one means
nothing to me at all, but she is important to him, so best to
leave it at that.

I go on to say that all I wanted to know is that I COULD take her
home if I want (and I might next week or something, I got her
number) and now I know that, so it is enough for me, I dont
need more.

Respect from co-workers now goes up another 10x for this, because
I and they KNOW that this is true after what they just saw. .

He continues to AFC for a long while, and I get tired and go
home. Next day I hear that she blew him out almost as soon as I
left.

Now this was cool, because the goal wasn't really to lay the
chick (which I still might if I decide to see her again), but to
increase stature with co-workers, which can help in other ways
in my regular life.

Now one thing to note, is that I cannot do this every time (heck
not even close.. this is like the 3rd or 4th time it has ever happened
so directly like this). I was
really lucky, because of what she said to my 'what you like in
guy question', it was just so EASY to know what this chick
expected me to do, and it was really easy to stage it to happen
in front of all the other guys once I clued in on this.

I WISH I could do it everytime, but life isnt really like that ;-)
Mr. SMooth can do it though!

Constructive comments and opinions welcome!
Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Using the ‘color’ game to PU!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Using the 'color game' to do a PU!


From: tonymcneill@my-deja.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Colours Game - opinions?
Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 00:43:35 GMT

 Hi Guys,

I've just field tested this pattern / game for creating an erotic and
horny state - worked a dream:) I'd be interested to know what you think
of this and how it might be improved.....

I suppose it might work best with the more visually thinking babes.

This is not a 'word for word' pattern by any means, by the way - I just
kind of found myself going into it on the fly.....  here we go..

The PUA "notices" the colour (UK spelling by the way for those who might
feel the urge to correct me) of an object, item of clothing etc.

PUA - "I find these yellow walls (or whatever) quite uplifting;
especially in the winter. Isn't it nice to have some bright colours
around when it's so grey and dark outside?" "Do you think that colours
have an big effect on peoples' moods?".

HB - "Oh, yes, definitely."

PUA - "Hmmm. I was just wondering......I mean....... I was in one of
those New Age shops recently and they were selling lots of different
coloured sunglasses.... with the idea that, if you wanted to feel more
of a certain mood, or to look at the world in a certain way, you would
slip on a pair of sunglasses which would colour everything you looked at
in the desired tone" "Do you think that could work in any way?"

HB - "Well, maybe. I don't know really"

PUA - "Well, for example, my bedroom is a very pale blue colour and I
find this particular blue very restful" "I mean, can you imagine
sleeping very well in a pale blue room?" "Imagine you are really tired,
you know when your eyelids are heavy and you curl up with that fantastic
feeling of at last ... just letting go.... and .....giving
yourself...to....(sp perhaps?).. sleep'" "Do you have a sense of a
particular colour when you imagine that feeling?" (Make sure she's
imagining being sleepy).

HB - "Oh, maybe blue, or green" (or whatever). (If she doesn't come up
with one then maybe she could be asked to imagine the perfect colour for
a bedroom, but both of the HB subjects I tried got right into it.)

PUA "How about when you feel....really full of great ideas...... like
you have all sorts of inspiration flowing through you.?"

PUA then procedes to get HB to imagine a few other states (feeling very
inspired and spiritual (commenting on her choice of colour in a playful
way)...... bursting with energy ...... feeling very sensual,
relaxed and open (we're getting closer, gentlemen)......and eventually,
 being full of passion and horny), and slowly visualising a colour with
each one.

You get the picture - guiding her into these states,
comparing colours etc etc. I have tried this on two chicks, both of whom
LOVED the game and got right into imagining the states. One of them was
an ex who is of great value as a pivot / social proof (and a friend) so
I was testing the game with her rather than going for the lay and the
other HB, in spite of being pretty shy, blushed madly and was VISIBLY
remembering the joy of being fucked until she screamed with pleasure ;)
(At this point Tony is feeling a bit fucking pleased with himself).
I think this would have definitely resulted in a fuck had I not been
meeting her at lunchtime before going off to work :( (at this point Tony
is disgusted as well as pleased!!)

What do you 'real' PUAs think of this little game? As I said I somehow
went into it on the fly after having the idea while practicing
improvising patterns while driving, using things I saw on the road as
starting points for pattern-talk. So it's pretty new and I, as yet,
claim only to be a humble RAFC. Going to test it some more and post the
results....



Any suggestions or comments?

Tony

--
'Action' is the magic word

Setting up the Kiss Close

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

A way to set up the kiss close

From: erosla77@aol.com (ErosLA77) Ross Jeffries
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 26 Dec 2000 19:23:44 GMT
Subject: Re: What if...

>Subject: Re: What if...
>From: eclipse19@my-deja.com
>Date: Tue, Dec 26, 2000 12:04 AM
>Message-id: <929jdt$u6t@nnrp1.deja.com>
>
>In article <9299s4$o03@nnrp1.deja.com>,
>  charnel1278@my-deja.com wrote:
>> Hey all,
>>
>> I've checked out a Maniac's, and some others websites and most say
>that
>> when you ask "Do you wanna kiss me?", you're guaranteed a kiss, unless
>> you get a flat out NO.  None, from what I saw, said what to do when
>you
>> get that NO.  Do you continue on the conversation like nothing
>> happened? Do you come back with a similar question later in the
>> evening?  If so, won't she kinda feel that you're badgering her?
>> Granted, this won't happen often, but what if?....
>>
>> Laters.
>
> the standard (canned) reply to a "no" answer is "YOU really know how
>to ruin a moment....your old boyfriends must have hated that about you"
>I think i got this off tony or maniac's site, forget which one. I
>havent ran into a direct "no" answer myself so i havent field tested
>this, but im sure others have. From what i read(or remember anyhow)
>this will leave them stunned and they will show less resistance against
>another kiss.
>
>

 Hmmm......well, I like this "you really know how to ruin a moment" response
WITHOUT asking for the kiss first. "Asking" for anything, outside of the
presence of fun(as in, on the spur of the moment saying, "Hey...wouldn't it be
fun to go to a strip club? Let's go!))  seems pretty pathetic to me.  

    A good one is to notice her giving you that look and then say(and I got
this from a student, it is NOT mine).  "If ? were to ask you on a scale of one
to ten, how good a kisser are you, what would you say?"

 Listen for her answer, then say, "If you were to kiss me right now, how do you
think I'd rate you?"

  You do this ONLY when you see "the look".......

  "let's find out" you say and kiss her.  

IF she backs away from that, then the "you really know how to ruin a moment"
comment works great.  Come to think of it, this could really work for a
cancellation as well. 

---

From: "General Snafu" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: What if...
Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2000 22:57:08 GMT

If she says no to a kiss, ask for a BJ.  If she says no to the BJ, you are
SOL for the night.

 wrote in message
news:9299s4$o03@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Hey all,
>
> I've checked out a Maniac's, and some others websites and most say that
> when you ask "Do you wanna kiss me?", you're guaranteed a kiss, unless
> you get a flat out NO.  None, from what I saw, said what to do when you
> get that NO.  Do you continue on the conversation like nothing
> happened? Do you come back with a similar question later in the
> evening?  If so, won't she kinda feel that you're badgering her?
> Granted, this won't happen often, but what if?....
>
> Laters.
>
>
> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/

Game: The Wall and the Forest

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Maniac introduces "The Wall and the Forest", a PU game.



From maniac_high@yahoo.com 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Game: The wall and the forest
Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 16:18:24 GMT

Another one of those mindfuck games like 4 questions or the cube:

"The Wall and the Forest"

-You are walking in a field, you see a wall, how high is it, and
how do you get by it? [wall = pride, and also how you get past
obstacles]

-you continue walking, and you see a house [kind of house you dream
to have later in life]

-you see a key on the ground, you go to the house, does the key
open the door? [if yes, means you can get married]

-you go in the house (if you were able to open with the key), and
 on the first floor you see a table and chairs, how many chairs are
 there? [means how many people in your future family]

-now you go outside, and see to one direction a dense dark forest, and
 the other way, a less dense/brighter wooded area. Which way do you
 go? (dark forest=expect something, but unknown, take a chance)
     (bright wooded area=easygoing style/way)

-as you walk you then see a lake nearby. How big is it, and how deep
 is it? (big=size of your heart, depth=depth of your heart)

THE END


This game could be lethal for chicks who want to get married or
something like that. Make sure you answer the right answers when
you tell her "what your answers were" after you finish her turn!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Game: Forest

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Nightlight introduces 'forest game'!



From: nightlight9@hotmail.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: More like "4 questions" game?
Date: Thu, 02 Nov 2000 19:50:10 GMT

You mention all these, but most of them are not very useful in the
initial meeting because they are too cerebral and too random.  Try ones
that are more viceral.  You are walking in a dark forest.  How do you
feel.  (how she approaches life).  You could to a wall with a door.
What do you do? (how she approaches obsticalls).  You look down and see
a cup on the ground what is it made out of? (how she views wealth).
You come to some water, describe it. (how she views sexuality).
Always end with sexuality because it is  a good topic for PU and
demonstrates you are comfortable with women and people a sexual context.

BookGuy, my comments are based on experience and field testing.  Please
do the same if you reply.

--
NightLight9
Just be yourself... smooth with interesting questions and interesting
answers.

Game: Strawberry Fields

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Maniac introduces a PU game: Strawberry Fields!
[Note, this originally comes from the book 'Kokology']


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Game!: Strawberry fields
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 08:02:40 GMT

Game!: Strawberry fields
001117

This is a game to find out some things about how chicks
see sex. It is very popular in Japan & is a good state
transitioner

--

Intro: Hey, lets play a game!

Imagine you are alone in a field, and see a straberry field
in front of you with tasty strawberries.

There is a fence/gate around the field. How high is it?
(= how easy is this girl/guy to take sex)

Now you are in the straberry field, how many straberries
do you take?
(=how many BFs/GFs that person wants)

Ok, after you have finished enjoying the strawberries,
how do you feel about the farmer, who's field you took them
from?
(=how you feel to that person after fucking them)


The end

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

TPUA night PU’s HB Smallmouth and converts to a lay!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

[TPUA PU's a chick at night, and converts it into a lay!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com
]


Date Posted: 2000/09/25 05:21:37 AM EDT
Author: Tokyopua 
Subject: Re: HB Small Mouth PU  (Was Re: Calling all Tokyo PUA's)

Hey Maniac,

I didnt really intend that last post of mine as a field report, since it
wasnt too detailed.  But yeah, things have been going well on the PU despite
my severely limited time. So I will attempt a bit of a field report on the
initial PU here.  My PU efficiency factor has been really high recently,
maybe because I am only trying to PU when I feel really confident and often
times when I wasnt planning on it, so was really relaxed. I did a PU on a 19
year old HB college student in the train the other night and got her home
phone number.  It was easy cause she was reading Tokyo Classified, and I
asked her about it. I was really confident, and in only 2 stops got her to
really dig me.  In fact, when I asked her why she had studied English, she
said "So I could meet a guy like you!"  The only problem is finding time to
meet her again before I leave.

The PU I did on HB Small Mouth was not planned either, I just saw her
walking back home around my place at midnight, and somehow knew that despite
my frazled appearance after 2 hours of Jujitsu practice and carrying 40
pounds of luggage, I could do the PU on her.  My opening line was "I like
your hair" which I knew was lame and she must have heard often, but hey,
thats the price of using the 3 second rule sometimes.  I immediately
followed with asking her if she was a student, what kind of work she did,
etc.  Oddly, I didnt use my standard opener "Do you speak english" in the
whole conversation.  I will post my personal notes on the rest of the PU at
the end of this post just for reference, but they arent too coherent.  They
were the basis though for the plans I laid for the successful next date that
got me laid 3 days later.  (If I have time someday I will write up full
notes on that too.) Total time to lay in terms of time invested was
approximately 3.5 hours, about the same as HB Physics, my other recent
street PU who I did that same day.  This efficiency is possible if the
progression is done just right, I think.

 wrote in message news:8qfler$o1r@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Tokyo PUA,
>
> This is an excellent report.. You really rock!
>
> Where / how did you originally
> PU this chick though? Also, taking the chick over to see your
> weight training stuff is a clever idea.. liked that..!
> BTW, I thought you left already to the USA, how long are you still
> there for?

Right near my house in a dark alley at midnight on her way home!  She told
me later (post lay) that she was scared at first, but I had a really relaxed
attitude so she got comfortable with me afterwards.  As for the weight
training stuff later, it was great kino as I had her bend over slightly and
got right behind her to "help her with her form" while simultaneously
letting her slightly feel the form of my stiff wood pressed against her, and
other such intimate situations.

Still here till Oct 14 or so, with a trip to Taiwan and maybe Hawaii too
thrown in.

>
> ALso, do you usually go out alone, or with a wing. I noticed that
> you knew quite a few people in Roppongi, I guess you get out there
> quite a bit?

Been out there a lot since last February, maybe 10 times or so.  I guess
predominantly I go with a wing, but sometimes felt it screwed up my game.
Of course, my wings didnt know anything about seduction a la ASF, thats
probably why.  Of course, neither did I till June... I know Im much better
at street PU when alone though, thats for sure!  OTOH, when I went out to
clubs with you and Rio, I think my game was really improved and I was
learning all the time.
BTW, I have heard that someplace called club Earth near hamamatucho has
really hot babes, (bitch shield too, but who cares, right;-), so you guys
might want to check that out.  3000 Yen cover charge.  May be the new
alternative to Fura?

>
> > I managed to lay that HB Small Mouth
>
> EXCELLENT!
>
> >Ganbatte!  Im seeting HB Bi this weekend again (tonight), and HB
> >small the next day, and my ex-GF the next.  Im starting to feel like
> >Maniac juggling girls, but nothing will happen w/ my ex, so its not
> >so bad.
>
> Yes, I did that ALOT last year, and fucked a shitload of chicks that
> I cant even count now..
>
> but its really tiring and you do get sick of it after a while..
> so finally I just MLTR'd a few that I really liked, who also accepted
> that I fuck other chicks, and left it at that.. guess I got to get out
> more ;-)
> not sure if its the right way yet, but been doing it that way
> the last few months now.. We'll see ;-)

I think it goes in cycles.  Eventually you get tired of the MLTR's and have
to replace them.  To do that you will have to PU lotsa new chicks, lay them,
see if they dont eject when you break the news that there are others.  That
takes a lot of time, so then you want to go back to the easy life of having
a bunch of girls on call.  Then the cycle starts over.  Im just beginning to
get these girls into MLTR status, but now I have to leave.  But theres
always business trips ack here!

>
> If you are planning on hanging around TOkyo though, you should
> bring HB Bi and her friend to one of our fuck parties the next time..
> sounds like they'd be a good time.. maybe introduce them to Kipp or
> something since I am not there right now, before you leave.. or
> give me your departure date and see if they are interested and we
> can setup something with all the ladies, if this is your sort of thing..

Id consider it, but it will take more effort, and probably wont be anything
I can do until after Im gone and come back for business trips.  You see, I
worked it too good with HB Bi.  She is signing her letters with "Love" at
the end and is all into me now.  Made me the most awesome meal any woman has
ever made me, washed my clothes, gave me an amazing massage, etc.  When I
confronted her about our last threesome, she said that she felt jealous when
she saw me doing her friend, and claimed that was the only time she had ever
done something like that, that she isnt really Bi.
So right now I think she somehow sees a relationship in this, despite my
leaving?  I figure once Im gone I can get past that as reality sinks in and
maybe set up more stuff for any business trips I make back.

>
> Good post!
>
> Maniac
> http://www.pickupguide.com

Here are those notes I was talking about, for what they are worth:

-------------------------------------------
PU of HB Small:  happened in a dark alley shortcut to my house at midnight,
I approached carrying a 30 pound backpack on one shoulder and a 10 pound
bucket of protein powder in the other, and said,  $B!H (BExcuse me, your hair is
really beautiful. $B!I (B  She reacted favorably and said thanks, but kept
walking, slightly faster.  She seemed young, so I asked if she was a
student.  She said no, I asked what she does.  She said she works for a
cable company, I fluff talked about watching TV.  She asked what I do.  I
said I know its late but you should have coffee or tea with me at Jonathans
restaurant nearby.  She said no, so I said, OK, how do we meet again.  She
said give me your number and I said,  $B!H (BAh, but I know women, if I give you
my number you will get nervous and never call. $B!I (B  She said  $B!H (BNo, 
that wont
happen I promise. $B!I (B  I knew I didn $B!G (Bt have enough rapport or 
anything to
believe that, so really what I was just doing was stalling till I could set
up a firm date.

I got a pen and wrote my number and at this point we are standing on the
corner near my place.  I play on Japanese cuteness and write my name with
hearts by it.  (None of this is stuff I would be able to do in the US.)
Then I say, OK, when are we going to meet.  Its sort of a way to pace the
ongoing reality now that she has my number,its a logical extension.  The
number is just a formality to me, I want to set up the date.  After some
negotiation, I get a date set up for 6 PM Tuesday, her day off.  I had given
her alternatives between my place and eating in Tachikawa nearby (but both
already had the presuppostion that we are meeting for a date, so I don $B!G (Bt
care which she chooses).  She chose Italian in Tachikawa which is perfect
cause eating carbs increases seratonin (=relaxation), so I will lay on the
patterning after a while, maybe even order a glass of wine (more seratonin
and romance) for us both.  Then its a 5 minute taxi ride back to my place!

Anyway, we keep talking.  I get that she never has met a foreigner, that she
likes Richard Gere, cause he is  $B!H (BShibui $B!I (B. $B!! (B(=quiet, simple, 
sober,
tasteful, austere, parsimonious, etc.)  I asked her about her ideal man
while doing the (SP) thing.  She really accessed a lot and I was awakening
her creative centers.  I touched her a lot on the arm to anchor the good
feelings.   She said she really was too ideal, but that her ideal guy was
like her father, sweet and nice.  I asked if she wanted a guy who made her
feel safe, and she said yes.  I compared our hand sizes and got kino,
remarked at how small her hands were, that my big hands could protect her.
Complemented her smile and said that it seems like her eyes smile too and
she said that she is often told that.  She said I was skillful at
complementing and I said that I really meant it.

I mirrored her body positions a lot and this seemed to have a good effect.
She seemed really into it and wasn $B!G (Bt trying too hard to get away despite 
it
being after midnight and having to work the next day, only bringing up the
time when I did.  She was rubbing her earlobe, and later playing with her
ponytail in a really sexy way, all with the doggy dinner bowl look.
I also showed kanji ability and had her write her name, and demonstrated how
we could study English together, all using the Zaurus.  (BTW, Did you buy
one yet, Maniac? A useful tool in many ways.  You can turn it into a
portable digital photo album too, albeit poor quality...) She liked that.
At one point she asked what was in the bucket, I said protein powder and she
said  $B!H (Bnomitai! $B!I (B and I said  $B!H (B5 fun dake areba, nomeru 
yo. $B!I (B
(If you have 5
minutes I can give you a taste).  But she refused to go to my apartment and
I didn $B!G (Bt press the issue, I just reconfirmed our fun date on Tuesday, and
gave her a kiss goodnight, then took off.
----------------------------------

-T

ASF reader comments on above story

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website: 

http://www.pickupguide.com 

Many excellent followups to the Psychicbabe re-lay report!
Mrsex4unyc, RJ..etc..etc.

From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:05 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

In article <92jvre$obh@nnrp1.deja.com>, maniac_high@yahoo.com writes:

>The immediate gold to take care of this, is to now make the
>relationship very high stakes for her. I can do this because
>I know that she is into me (from what she said at the dinner),
>so the idea is to play it that if she doesnt do her job as a
>chick.. she will lose EVERYTHING as far as I am concern.
>Ok, that is the plan, here we go:

plan or no plan, essentially, you are telling her the truth.  on a long-enough
timeline, the survival rate for EVERYONE is ZERO.  sooner or later, everyone
you love will either leave you or die.  chicks don't seem to believe in this,
though it is the absolute truth.  they think that they can relate to you
FOREVER, REGARDLESS of what they do or how they act.  you are telling her HOW
she can REMAIN with you and what is going to get her EJECTED.  even though it
takes a long time, so it doesn't SEEM like this... this is what has happened to
EVERY chick's relationship that has gone away.  EVENTUALLY, she was not
fulfilling her womanly duties and her man left her for a   chick (younger,
sexier, richer, swallower...)  EVEN if she IS fulfilling her duties, if her man
like it from another chick MORE, she loses out either in a PERCENTAGE of her
benefits or she gets DUMPED and loses ALL of her benefits.  you are merely
explaining this to her and telling her what she needs to do IF she wants to be
with you... which you have already determined.  you are SELLING, and now you
are screening her to see if she is QUALIFIED and ABLE to buy.

>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations
>in relationship. 

I am getting to the point where I am going to do this.  I never do this with
chicks because I morph into whatever THEY are looking for and hook them that
way.  the thing for me is that being 10 months in with MLTR, she has REALLY
learned how to please me and the time I spend TEACHING her has become minimal
and the time I spend ENJOYING her is increasing :)  it is getting tougher and
tougher for other chicks to get my attention, because anything LESS than what I
have already is BULLSHIT to me.  the time I am spending talking to chicks is
mostly eliciting values and breaking their perceptions... just for fun :)  I
know IMMEDIATELY if I want sex from a chick, and if I don't, she is IMMEDIATELY
LJBF and I use her for practice and NEXT her at the end of the conversation.

I am seriously going to consider moving to a "demonstration of value -> SOI"
model, just because I have lost my patience with LISTENING to these bitches
talking about shit that really doesn't mean anything.  I know I am going to
NEXT them ANYWAY as soon as I realize they can't compete with MLTR, so why
listen to their shit FIRST?  I may as well let them know how great I am and
let them know what kind of woman I am willing to accept, and let them continue
from there.  there is also the cognitive dissonance issue of them KNOWING that
I am going to dump them if they are not sexy and CONTINUING to talk to me and
get to know me.  the more they talk to me, the more I hook them into
interacting with me.  the more they get hooked, the greater the PAIN OF
SEPERATION (credit: RJ) when they eventually get EJECTED.  since they KNOW
ahead of time what will get them ejected and they are still talking, they are
either planning to get in line OR setting themselves up for pain.  either way,
after SOI and their acceptance of the terms, there will have to be some sort of
TEST of their compliance.  even listening to what they have to say after SOI
counts as a REWARD for their entering into a "relationship" with me.  hmm... I
will consider this more.

>I go on to tell her that other girls I know also
>like me, ask me out alot, (doesn't matter if it is true or not,
>but chick 'competition logic' will kick in, and it will scare
>your mark to act). 

the reason I don't use this is that MLTR is an integral part of my life.  if I
were to play this "chicks dig me" card, it would belittle the actual
relationship I have with MLTR.  the only problem with THAT is that I am
screening for MORE MLTRs :)  I don't give a fuck about ONS because I can get
laid ANY NIGHT within an hour of talking to the chick I am talking to... in the
WAY I want to with a chick that I WANT TO FUCK :)  a chick offering me ONS is
like a chick offering me a dollar bill.  I already HAVE dollar bills... what do
I want hers for?  of course, there are some chicks that are just so HOT that
you want to try them out, but barring that scenario, ONS can bring you much
more ANGUISH than the satisfaction that accompanies it... PLUS it is the SAME
SATISFACTION that I already get on a regular basis from MLTR. 

besides... it is OBVIOUS that chicks dig me because here SHE is, liking me
within 20 minutes of meeting me... what about the chicks that have experienced
me for days?  months?  years?  OH, she could only HOPE to be one of those! :)

for you, it is a good tactic though.

>Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>her last week, apparently).

I lost a rap to a low-self-esteem bitch that had a couple of relationships like
this as well.  I mean, I fucked her, but I didn't get to MLTR like I wanted
because she was SCARED that she wouldn't match up to the next bitch and that I
would NEXT her for no reason, like her exes did.  I tried to tell her I wanted
her for more than that, but she wasn't emotionally healthy enough to understand
or believe me.

>Ok, now Maniac has reached her head, and I take this deeper..
>I go on to tell her that I dont want just sex, I want rocks and gold
>I can get any girl in roppongi on a Saturday night and fuck her
>(not exactly true, but she doesnt know this.. goal is just to

she KNOWS that it happened to her VERY QUICKLY.  she ASSUMES she was not the
ONLY bitch to fall for you that quickly.  it is like reverse-social-proof. 
fucking a bitch FAST makes them think you can fuck other bitches FAST.

>'confirm' her worst fears so that she acts), but its not enough for
>me. I want connection, good sex, and romance, with an intelligent
>woman, and that is why I want to date you (psychicbabe).

nice line.  this is another thing I will consider.  talking-up MLTR to them.  
I never considered this either, MAINLY because if you tell a chick what you
want her to do then you never know if she is manipulating you by being that
way, or if she arrived there NATURALLY... on her own.  interesting, LOTS of
style-change material happening right around the new year :)

>Then all of the sudden, she asks me about HBass (the chick staying
>at my place over the holidays), and freaks out about it. I tell
>her that she already knows all this, and exactly what is her point
>here?

although I am a GREAT fan of "quoting", I find that there need to be times to
engage in it and times to NOT engage in it.  this will depend on what you want
with the chick.  it is the same way you can't go from being a CHUMP to a MAN in
a chick's eyes... but you CAN go from being a MAN into a CHUMP :)  if you start
out telling a chick that you have a girlfriend AND that you fuck her, you leave
yourself open for these pot-shots whenever chicks trip the fuck out and go into
their irrational rants from out of left-field.  all a bitch needs to know is
that you are "taken" so that you manage her relationship expectations.  any
more information and she feels like you will give her ALL the information. 
where does it stop?  are you going to tell her that you are fucking her?  that
you fucked her last night?  that you fucked her an hour before coming on this
date?  that you fucked YOUR WOMAN in her ass?  that she LIKES sucking dick? 
WHERE DOES IT STOP?

I ran into this problem with a chick where my relationship to her was BASED ON
trading current sex-stories.  when I got to the point where I didn't want to
tell her any more shit, she was EXPECTING me to tell her, and I realized that
if I wasn't telling her, and she wasn't telling me, then our "relationship" was
OVER.  before that, I had not realized how much I had compromised my position
by telling her CURRENT sex-shit.  think about it, and decide on your own LIMITS
to what you are willing to tell a chick about other chicks... besides, think
about the fact that she is going to KNOW that she will end up as STORIES to
other bitches right after you fuck her.  it will make her VERY self-conscious
about whatever she does with you and that could hinder her emotional states
tremendously.

>Then she stops again, and asks me if I am fucking her (maybe I
>should have said no..., but I had already said yes to her about this
>the first time I saw her)., she asks me why.. (I tell her because
>I am seeing her! like I told you the first time! I mean what do
>you expect?!?).
>
>She then puts on her bitch face, and talks in a stern voice,
>"then call me when you break her up, that is my decision, I am
>going home.".

THIS is retarded because she ALREADY knew that you were fucking her AND she
fucked you herself.  this is another problem with bitches having information
about other bitches.  they use it against themselves.  IMO, the purpose of her
knowing you have another girl or SEVERAL other girls is so she knows where she
stands in the RACE to be your MAIN BITCH.  if you are single, she has a good
chance at being that to you.  if you are "taken" she has NO CHANCE of being
that to you.  if you are SEEING bitches, then she has to COMPETE to be your #1.
 other than THAT, I think giving information about your other bitches is a
mistake...  I have made the SAME mistake up to this point, so I am not
crisicizing :)  however, I am changing that ASAP and I think you should
consider giving out information on a N2K basis (need to know).

besides, SHE is the one that NEEDS a fuck.  if it is not coming from YOU, a guy
she has fucked ALREADY and she LIKES how you did it or she wouldn't have come
back... she has to get it from a STRANGER whose sexual skills are in question
that might tie her up, fuck her in the ass or sell her to the highest bidder. 
bitches like to FRONT a lot about having ALL these sexual choices, but with all
the 8s, 9s, and 10s I have spoken to on an honest "one of the chicks" level,
they are ALL looking to have an EXCITING time, but not REALLY be in DANGER! 
you, OTOH have pussy AT HOME IN BED WAITING FOR YOU!  the only one to lose out
if she bails... is HER!  knowing that, I would have not even entertained her
bullshit OR called her on it, letting her know that I was getting laid tonight
REGARDLESS of whether SHE fucks or not.  that would take the fucking WIND out
of her sails :)

>I tell her I am planning to break her up (which is true) later, so
>it is nothing you should worry about. 

this, my friend :)  is a COP-OUT!  it is used VERY EFFECTIVELY by married men
to keep fucking their side-bitches, but WE are way above bullshit tactics like
this.  I commend you for thinking of this "on the fly", but PLEASE, PLEASE! 
hehe  I have MUCH more respect for you as a PUA than to hear some CRAP like
this from you :)  PLEASE think of something better for the next instance of a
chick trying to BLACKMAIL you into trading in a R-E-L-A-T-I-O-N-S-H-I-P where
you are getting EVERYTHING you want from a chick... for a ONS with HER! 
HAHAHAHAHAHA  >:)

I haven't run into a chick STUPID enough to try to disrespect my MLTR for being
with me... chicks have STARTED to say she is dumb for "letting" (as if she has
ANY say in the matter) her man fuck other chicks, and I have BROKEN THEIR
FUCKING ASSES listing the benefits that SHE is getting that they will most
likely NEVER have with a man... EVER!  and CERTAINLY don't have right now, or
they would not be talking to me in a bar... they would be with THEIR OWN MAN
conducting this FANTASY RELATIONSHIP that they are professing that my MLTR
should have :)  I have NEVER run into a chick that has even TRIED to break into
my relationship with MLTR because they KNOW I mean business.  all they can do
is become ANOTHER MLTR... and after they hear the QUALIFICATIONS, they KNOW
they can't even achieve THAT... only ONS and LJBF with me.  if some bitch EVER
suggested that I break up with MLTR in order to ONS her, I would  A) laugh in
her face and  B) immediately demand an EXPLANATION of the reasons why she
thinks she can knock MLTR out of the box AND make her perform ANY AND ALL
SKILLS that she CLAIMS to be better than MLTR at IMMEDIATELY!  put up or SHUT
THE FUCK UP!  the result would be the ONS ANYWAY, and she would still be LJBF
or NEXT because MLTR is NOT about sex... it is about compatability and I
PERSONALLY could not be with some bitch that needs to knock other chicks off in
order to gain status.  I gain status by BEING MYSELF and letting bitches make
INTELLIGENT, EDUCATED decisions to be with me.  any chick that wants to be with
me had better do the same.

>she gets upset, and starts
>screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
>just like her ex-bf, getting other girls while dating her, and how
>all guys just want sex..etc..

I would have told her "you wanna calm the fuck down?"  throwing tantrums and
making scenes are expressions of her ability to do ANYTHING in your presence. 
I personally don't tolerate that.

>Then she says.. ok, if you let me meet your GF at your house
>tonight, then I will let you have sex with me. [ha! I got her!]

ok.  thank God I happened to read the next line before I started typing this. 
I was JUST going to ask you WHY you are STILL letting her blackmail you into
fucking her... ESPECIALLY when she is the one that needs it and you don't :)

>I bounce back, and say, "what exactly makes you think I am
>desperate to have sex with you tonight?! Do you think I am
>just some stupid guy and you can manipulate me like that?
>No, you will not meet my GF, it is disrespectful to her to do
>that. You know the situation, it was clear to you from the
>beginning, and you accepted it. There is no more to talk about.
>I am not here only for sex, I can get that anywhere. Sex only
>of itself is of little value to me, I want more than that.

SWEET!  :)  break her fucking ASS maniac :)

>I then bring out the nuclear weapons! My tonality is very firm,
>and I eye fuck her, while telling her the following. First, I tell
>her that I already told her about my GF, she was clear about it
>right from the start, and she has NO excuse. Then I go on to tell
>her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
>that did NOT happen. So do NOT compare me to your ex. I am a
>different person, and EXCEPT better treatment than that if you
>ever want to see me again. She starts crying more, and hugging
>again.

ugh :/   fucking IDIOTS!   man, the shit some bitches put you through!  does
everyone SEE why we have to study this shit?

>I put her against wall, and tell her not to complain about me like
>I am her ex, I a am different person than he is.
>
>I tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>alone!

this is a good point.  I like to play it the other way:

ok... so now, you have told me that you want everything to be a 'perfect'
situation with a guy before making a move.  You want him to be ideal with
women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady... WHAT MAKES YOU THINK
HE WILL WANT YOU?   WHAT ARE YOU BRINGING TO THE TABLE THAT IS GOING TO MAKE A
MAN LIKE THAT CHOOSE YOU OVER ANY OTHER CHICK?

you wanna see some confusion?  you wanna see a bitch get BROKEN?  HAHAHAHA  >:)
 of course, I use this on chicks that I am just practicing on, because it
normally induces DEPRESSION, not horniness.  when they have to GO DEEP INSIDE
and dive BELOW THE SURFACE of their programming, they realize that they CAN NOT
TELL ME WHY A MAN WOULD WANT THEM!  they stall the fuck out dude :)  it's
amazing.  matter of fact, it's documented already.  look at my recent thread
with "telembe".  I let her say all this bullshit about what she wanted from a
guy in order to give up her virginity, then when she was finished talking about
what she WANTED, I asked her what she was OFFERING to a guy that was going to
give her all this committment and "love" and other bullshit and she said a
whole bunch of shit that ANY bitch can and WILL give to a man she likes.  she
might have THOUGHT she had something to offer a guy that was going to seperate
her from the pack, but she doesn't.  even GOOD PUSSY can't get a bitch any
credit because there are LOTS of bitches that can fuck and suck like pros...
elites AND sub-elites.  telembe NEVER told us what seperates her from the rest
of the bitches that might make a MAN like the one she wants even LOOK HER WAY! 
the reason is that there is NO reason! :)  bitches are programmed that MEN want
them... but they are NEVER told WHY.  the reason is that men like to FUCK and
get their dicks sucked.  they also like companionship and cooking and cleaning
and for a girl to look good on their arm so they can feel accomplished around
their buddies.  chicks THINK they are ENTITLED to a good man... but the GOOD
MEN... are picking GOOD WOMEN!  if they were SHINING like they think they are,
they would have been scooped up already and married or whatever they were
looking for because some guy would have spotted her and said "I'm not going to
let her go for ANYTHING" and she would be happy... at least according to her
programming.  OH, how I LOVE to see a bitch's face while she TRIES AND TRIES to
dig up ANY reason why a guy as great as the one she claims to want would EVER
choose her over any other bitch :)  the JOY the JOY that I feel as this POMPOUS
BITCH breaks the fuck down RIGHT IN FRONT OF MY FACE! :)  of course since I
broke her, I keep talking to her and ease her back to a decent state of being
and let her know that she can take steps to make herself into the woman that a
man would want, but she has to really KNOW HERSELF and KNOW MEN in order to
make an intelligent decision.  I am not into depressing chicks... unless they
TRULY DESERVE IT for all the depression they have caused men throughout their
tenure as FINE bitches :)  also, I have no desire to BREAK bitches and leave
them like that.  that just makes it WORSE for ALL OF US looking for FINE, yet
DECENT chicks.

>she cries, and says that is so true, that is her problem, she never
>takes the chance and loses out because she doesn't make the
>move on taken guys. Then I run my 'take chances routine' (if you take
>a chance, in the end, the result is usually good, but if you don't,
>just you get left behind, by yourself).. 

nice.  I like that one... emphasizing loss and loneliness.

>she cries more, says she
>needs to take the chance, and doesnt want to be alone.

she's done :)  nice work.  land her!

>She says she has to be careful, that all guys want just sex, and
>bitches about this for about 30 seconds.

as opposed to what?  what does she WANT guys to want?

>Now I start the 'you need me, I dont need you..you think I just want
>only sex, then you dont understand me at all.. if you think that is
>what I am only, then you do NOT deserve me.. I do no need you to go out
>with me if that is what you think I am.. I want connection, sex,
>passion, and closeness.. and if you haven't figured that out about
>me yet, then get another guy, because you dont understand me at all..

OK OK OK... you've CONVINCED me maniac :)  that's some good shit right there :)
 starting NOW, I am pitching for MLTR ONLY.  bitches that want ONS or LJBF will
get what they deserve from me... which isn't much.  I LOVE this idea of dissing
her for claiming that you are looking for ONS... or even just a "bootie-call"
type relationship :)  I love it.  I would feel so PROUD getting on her like
this.  sweet!  EXTREMELY congruent!  nice play!  this is going into my style,
starting RIGHT NOW!  :)

>I am doing this, because I know the left (logic) and right (emotions,
>passion) are fighting each other..they have been all night. Because the
>left doesn't accept the logic of the situation, but I know the right side
>dying for a shag,..she is trying to rationaize going out with a taken guy,
>but I have gotten her so excited tonight, that she needs that fuck.

THIS is the reason I never learned any of this shit until recently.  my
caveman-kino style before this involved ZERO talking.  totally kino and kissing
and PHYSICAL seduction with domineering EYE-CONTACT.  there was NO INFORMATION
for the left side to process at all.  EVERYTHING went STRAIGHT to the chick's
right side, and her left had to try to process the EMOTIONS and turn them into
a story that she could understand... in the meantime, she is PHYSICALLY falling
for the kino and wanting MORE AND MORE until we are fucking.  I never HAD to
talk to chicks before OR after fucking them because my PHYSICAL ATTACK is so
DEVASTATING!  I would just take them over PHYSICALLY and their right brains
would do ALL the work and the left would struggle to understand, but eventually
succumb to the onslaught!  ARG ARG! :)

thanks for explaining that to me :)

>As I touch her side of face, she goes doggy look, I kiss her, and she
>gets like screambabe, panting. I put leg between her, she widens, goes nuts
>totally. I ask her she likes me (in a tell her sort of way' you like me..'),
>she replies 'yes'. I say (stare her down) .. she asks "what should I do?"
>I say in a very strn fatherly voice while staring her down 4 inches from
>her head.. you will follow me..that is what you will do.. and you will do
>what I say. 'she says, 'I will'. I tongue her down more, run her crotch,
>she almost cums right there, then I take her to a love hotel (her first
>time!), no resistance what so ever.

interesting.  what just happened here?  did you somewhere dictate to her that
the terms of her being "your bitch" is that she has to sumbit to you fully? 
are you getting a verbal confirmation of that from her?  or is something else
going on... like she just plain UNDERSTANDS that you can move her to passions
that make her WANT to cum and that you are going to take her there and over the
edge?

another point... what do you guys think of foreplay on a chick.  he mentions
that she almost came right there... do you think it is good to get her to the
EDGE and leave her there so she is so horny, she will do ANYTHING for you to
make her cum, OR to give her an orgasm right there in her clothes to
demonstrate your sexual mastery over her?  personally, I am into the sexual
mastery thing because I notice a newfound RESPECT from a chick that has had
guys on top of her NAKED, fucking her for all they were worth and she never
came from it, and then I am just doing kino on her and fingering her and she
cums from just that.  do you think that making the chick cum on herself makes
her want sex MORE or want it LESS since she just got off?  take into account
that chicks are multi-orgasmic and that they feel sexier after cumming, not
DRAINED like guys.

>As I am fucking her, I am putting things in her head, like D.Shades reports.
>I tell her as she is screaming it feels deeper and deeper, closer and
>closer. She is going nuts will I am fucking her.

I need to reasearch this.  is this more right-brain, left-brain shit where her
left-brain is shut down because of the FIREWORKS that are going off in her mind
because of the sex, leaving her wide open to suggestion?  if you have any links
for this, please post.

>I stare her down, and I tell her you need me (during sex), she says yes.
>I tell her from now on you will follow me, and do what I say. She says
>'yes, I will'. I continue doing her, she says "it feels SO good, I really
>need that, I really want it, i love you inside me!".. she is fucking like a
>wild animal, loud voice, shouting and screaming, oh, I want it, give it
>to me, I want to come!

more of the same?

>Then she tells me anything is ok as long as I dont hate her..she doesnt
>want me to hate her. She wants me to hold/hug her, she cries a bit, then is
>ok again (seems to be thinking of her old bf she says). I touch her
>more, face goes totally doggy look, and finger her, she goes nuts, we start
>fucking again.

the "I don't want you to hate me" thing is very important in the D/s
relationship... not that you set this up like that, but that is the MAIN
incentive for her to follow your lead... that she does NOT want you to hate her
and CERTAINLY not to banish her.  when that is TRULY first and foremost in her
brain, she will regulate HERSELF and place herself in-line with your thinking
and what YOU want her to be.  she also won't try to blackmail you anymore
because she KNOWS it gets on your nerves and all THAT will do is get her
EJECTED sooner rather than later :)

>Her back is on the bed, and I am fucking her missionary, her legs are
>spread and wide in the air, which I am holding. I tell her "see, I control
>you, 

hehe ok... this is a little FAR-FETCHED for me at this point, but I have not
researched it yet :)  I DO like the next line though.

>I go deep in your body because it is the one way to reach you totally
>deep in your mind which no one else can do. 

interesting

>By conquering your body, I can
>conquer your mind (then I drill her a bit more after I finish the sentence so
>she goes more crazy). I play with your body because it lets me control
>your mind (then drill her some more..ha, it is like the ultimate form of
>reward hypnosis).

IS there such a thing as reward hypnosis?  links please? :)

>I ask her, so why you like me. She says she says, you are decisive and
>sometimes I am indecisive, so you make it easy for me. I want the guy
>to make it easy for me to decide what to do (important clue here Maniac!
>maybe most chicks are like this! Maybe this too is where I fucked up
>with HB Geek!)

I have heard this a lot too... only thing is that there is a lot of
RESPONSIBILITY that comes with telling a chick what to do, and if the VALUE of
owning her is not sufficient for me, I don't give a fuck WHAT she does enough
to want to lead her to a good time.

>Moral of the story.. keep your ground.. call all chick bullshit DIRECTLY.
>Make the chick risk fear losing the relationship if she doesn't capitulate
>and chances are she will back down, in spite of how it looks (and I could
>do this BECAUSE I had other choices.. another reason to be fucking
>several chicks at once). As well, it seemed that she was giving me all the
>bullshit in part because she WANTED me to call her on it, and then fuck her
good
>at the end of the night, which I obliged.

chicks give you shit-tests to find out if you are stronger than them and see
HOW you are going to control them.  chicks like the way I control them because
I NARROW their choices for them, but STILL make them choose.  they can choose
the path of ULTIMATE SATISFACTION, or they can choose the path of EJECTION and
being back on the dating scene meeting the SAME LAME GUYS every night :)

you had told her you had a girlfriend, but she seems to have NEEDED to know
that she really COULDN'T have you all to herself and that you really DIDN'T
NEED to fuck her that night or EVER.  you stuck to your guns (after letting her
get to you for a while :-) and she eventually ran out of logic and got
overridden with kino and gave up the fucking pussy like she came there to do :)

>Constructive comments/opinions welcome!
>
>Maniac High
>http://www.pickupguide.com

EXCELLENT!  keep up the GOOD WORK dude!  :)

---
From: erosla77@aol.com (ErosLA77)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 30 Dec 2000 20:12:47 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

>Subject: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit
special!]
>From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
>Date: Fri, Dec 29, 2000 10:37 PM
>Message-id: <92jvre$obh@nnrp1.deja.com>

>)this chick is a very highly educated, driven, professional
> career woman and earns likely a big 6 figure salary
>b)she is very mature, focused and spends all day in her office
> surrounded by sharks and other pirrhana type scumbag characters

 She's got to be in control ALL DAY LONG at work. Small wonder then, with a
man, she wants to fully SURRENDER control and be made to submit.  It's like all
those super-powerful Congressmen and Judges and the like who LOVE going to get
pissed-on and whipped by some Madame Dominatrix. 

>I regroup my thoughts.

 I admire your ability to do this in the field, Maniac. As you think about it,
what do you do internally to re-set yourself and keep yourself in a good frame
of mind when all this shit throws your way?

>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations

   Metahpor is a POWERFUL tool to move folks from a fixed perception to a new
one. Please, share your story!

> Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>her last week, apparently).

Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with fucking; it feels
good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the vulnerabilities.  So
when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which overcomes the
potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. She's worried about pain,
so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not only losing
out on the pleasure of screwing, BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out that if
she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even WORSE
crack-up.

  Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.

>he gets upset, and starts
>screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
>just like her ex-bf,

See? The fear of the pain of being hurt just like her ex-BF hurt her is now
rearing its ugly head.  She doesn't seem like a very emotionally stable person
in ANY event, let alone having just been dumped by a guy.  

>Then I go on to tell
>her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
>that did NOT happen

 Sharp thinking. Again, what do you do internally to keep your state solid and
your thinking sharp? THAT process internally is of great value, even more than
the specifics you share.  The specifics are like handing guys fish; good for a
nice meal and of value. But  how you get to the mind-set is TEACHING someone
HOW to fish so they can eat for life. 

>I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>alone!

 Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to her her
"ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she can then
accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!  

   Excellent...Maniac, I don't give a damn WHAT my orthodox SS followers say,
this is BRILLIANT stuff and I'd be proud to be your wing or have you as mine,
ANY FUCKIN' DAY of the week! Sir, I salute you!

>Now what I am doing with all the above, is not arguing the logic (too
>much)
>of this, because, of course she is right, and I know this.

 Actually, you ARE not arguing the logic, but you are USING the logic...HER
logic..HER way of viewing things.....pointing out WHY and HOW she loses and
what will happen if she doesn't stop it.   It's all centered around losing and
WHY she loses, based on what she has told you.  It IS logical, FROM her point
of view.  

 Great, Great stuff...sir, I salute you!

-----

From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]
Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2000 12:03:54 GMT

Replies to various people about psychicbabe:

Answers to various questions:

Was psychicbabe british, or Japanese?
She was a brit of Japanese ancestry (ie. she
looked 'j', but thought, acted and had an
english accent like a brit). This in my
opinion made it harder, because brit women
are so fucking F A T, and she was so
slender, sexy and attractive (and she dressed
to kill) compared to all of them. Lots of guys were
hitting on her (and she said she always got hit
on, and hated it.. trick was to not make it look
like a 'hit').

Why not a white chick? Well, I had the chance...
but.. at the conference where I met her, EVERY
brit. white chick there was in serious blimp bulge
territory.. very scary. Why is it so many caucasian
women are so FAT?

It was funny though, because something like 8 guys
(I counted) tried to hit on psychicbabe the night
I PU'd her. One guy was pretty good, the rest were
total AFC's..it was rather funny.

Re: Rocks -vs- gold.. how I use it (yes, it is
Jake's metephor. For RJ, search the original post
on fastseduction.com. It is also on pickupguide.com
someplace (if not it will be there in about 2 weeks,
I am revising the page this week). Basically, I intro
it as follows:
After chick says bullshit about wanting to go to
dinner and be friends or shit for 6 months before
becoming a GF, I say: Actually, I dont go to dinner
or stuff like that with ladies who are not my GF
CHick:  gasps!
Maniac: see, going to dinner, is an important step
in a relationship for me. I only share it with someone
special
chick: Huh?
Maniac: Well, let me put it this way, do you ever
sleep with a guy who is just your friend, or dont
care about?
chick: of course not!
Maniac: well, why do you think a guy should do any
different then?
Maniac: See, let me tell you a story. You ever hear
about 'rocks & gold'?
chick: no? what is it?
Maniac: Well, Relationships are valuable things.
And each partner is looking for something. It is like
diamonds (rocks) and gold. Both are valuable.

But women prefer diamonds to gold (usually), and
men prefer gold to diamonds (usually). Of course,
both are important, especially in a long term
relationship, but if a woman could choose, she would
prefer the diamonds  first, and the man would
prefer the gold  first. right?

chick: yeah, probably

Maniac: And (generally), a man can accept gold
without the diamonds, and a woman can accept
diamonds without any gold.

So in a relationship, a woman is mining for
diamonds, while the man is mining for gold.
While they are in the mine together, the
guy gives diamonds he finds to the woman, and
the woman gives the gold she finds, to the man.

But if you give a woman gold only, or a man
diamonds only.. neither is likely to be
very happy, and the relationship will soon
fall apart. In short, an exchange of sorts
takes place in a successful relationship.

And also, if a man expects just gold (sex),
but doesnt want to give her diamonds
(relationship & the mushy stuff), then she
will dump him fairly soon, because he is
playing/using her just for sex..

And if a woman expects just diamonds (walks,
attention, nice dinners, movies..etc) without
giving some gold (sex), then he (if he has any
clue about how to deal with women, though many
men do not, especially in North America) will
dump her because she is using/playing him just
for his personality.

A guy taking a chick to dinners, buying shit
and giving nice walks without sex is THE SAME
as a guy sleeping with a girl, and then kicking her
out right after the fuck is over. (chick says:
'yelch!'. Yes, thats right, and for the guy,
just dinners and buying shit is 'yelch', with
no sex, and no attention is exactly the same.

Because a woman will go to free dinner with
almost any guy, it has no value to me. But
I am like you, I want attention, and I want
to be made to feel special.

And although a girl will go to nice free dinners
with almost anyone, I also know that a girl will
not sleep with anyone. So I know if she does with me,
then it means she thinks I am important. And if
she wont, then it means she doesnt care about me
at all, so I really dont need to see her again,
I will just go find another girl.

Maybe you might think it is unusual for a guy
to think this way, but it is just my way.

See, I dont want to be played. Guys are always
getting played by girls for nice dinners, long
talks on the phone, and for their personalities.
It is the SAME as a girl being used for sex.
So I am happy to give plenty her diamonds, but at
the same time, I dont want to be played, so
I also expect her to want to give me gold.
And if she doesn't, it means she doesnt care about
me, is using me, or it means I am being played,
or I am stupid.

As well, experience has also showed me that
'friends first' almost NEVER results in a
relationship. I mean how many of your BFs were
your friend first (chick usually replies..uh,
zero).

Exactly, so that is why I never play 'friends
first'. Friends first means diamonds for the
lady, and no gold for the guy. That is like
the guy saying (ok, lets fuck for 6 months,
and if its good, we can go to dinner, and go
out, and you can be my GF). Would you like
that (chick: yelch!!).

Exactly.. so that is why it is far better,
that the lady meet me, get to know me, and
then I expect her to be smart enough to know
to take that chance THEN (or reject it, and I will
go get another lady) when it is offered to her.

So that is why I expect things that way in a
relationship with a lady.

After this, a chick is (usually) quite impressed,
or surprised and doesnt know what to say..

[When I recited this to psychicbabe, she actually told me
she was very impressed, that I understood relationships
so well ;-) ]

Had I been smart, I would have used it on HB
geek, and laid her, but after that failure I
thought about it, and then when the same situation
came up with Psychicbabe this week, I knew what
to do..

Ok, now on to other comments..

RJ writes
>Maniac writes:
> >I regroup my thoughts.
>
>  I admire your ability to do this in the field, Maniac. As you think
about it,
> what do you do internally to re-set yourself and keep yourself in a
good frame
> of mind when all this shit throws your way?

A couple things.. first, this PARTICULAR chick is of no importance
to me, because I am (likely) seeing 3 others this week. So it is
not as risky to me to be firm, and keep my ground.

Another important fact, is the way chick's brains are usually
wired. For a
chick, once she likes a given guy, it is hard for her to immediately
switch to another guy. it is far MORE risky, because a chick (unlike
men), usually cannot switch to another guy, once she ALREADY
likes a given guy (story is different BEFORE you got her to
like you..then SHE has more power than you).

So I play on this, and as a result I dont feel nervous/scared at all,
because there is far more to risk to her, than to risk to me. Because
she is stuck to me, but I am not stuck to her. (this also is why
'jerks' can get away with so much shit on any given chick, and why
she will tolerate it.. because her brain has now got her focussed
on THAT guy, and it is now a choice (in her mind), between him (and
his bullshit... or being alone (sure she can get another guy in 10
minutes, but she cannot build those nice feelings of 'attachment'
in 10 minutes.. that gives us men power, once we realize this).

Two, I am generally a very balanced level
headed person, and dont take any of this personally (as you already
know, RJ). Three (in this case), I had
already laid this chick, so I didnt care really if I laid her again
or not.. I already conquered her, and she (and I) already knew that.

If it is a new chick, sometimes, I get more nervous/fucked up (see
HB Geek). I am trying to keep my senses more when this happens

> > Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
> >problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
> >her last week, apparently).
>
> Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with
fucking; it feels

Not sure about this, I think she just simply wanted the fuck, but
wanted to feel she was important to me, and she didnt want to just
get played..

> good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the
vulnerabilities.  So
> when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which
overcomes the
> potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. She's worried
about pain

yes, thats right.

> so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not
only losing
> out on the pleasure of screwing,

Not really. I actually made it clear to her that I didnt care if
she bang me or not. The point was that she had to give her mind
to me, and respect me, and follow me (whether that is bang me,
make her take off her clothes in the window for me, or do my
dishes..whatever.. its not the banging that is important, it is
the submission to me that counts, and what she needs to give me
if she wants my attention at all).

> BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
> believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out
that if
> she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even
WORSE
> crack-up.

Yes

>   Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.
>
> >he gets upset, and starts
> >screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
> >just like her ex-bf,
>
> See? The fear of the pain of being hurt just like her ex-BF hurt her
is now
> rearing its ugly head.  She doesn't seem like a very emotionally
stable person
> in ANY event, let alone having just been dumped by a guy.

No, she is not stable at all. I think though, it is because she
bottles it up all day, to be the 'office bitch' that she has to
be in the daytime. This chick lives for her work. She has no other
life.

>
> >Then I go on to tell
> >her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
> >that did NOT happen
>
>  Sharp thinking. Again, what do you do internally to keep your state
solid and
> your thinking sharp? THAT process internally is of great value, even
more than
> the specifics you share.  The specifics are like handing guys fish;
good for a
> nice meal and of value. But  how you get to the mind-set is TEACHING
someone
> HOW to fish so they can eat for life.

Actually, the specifics are important I think. This is why lay/field
reports with details are so important. I think really shitty on my
feet. I really suck.. bad.

But if I have had that same experience before (with another chick),
or been in that same situation before, and
either succeeded (or failed, and then thought about how to handle it
right the next time), then I will handle it correctly this time.

I really believe in field experience. I have alot... really alot.
so I have seen many of these situations before. It is like chess,
or a foreign language. If you've been there before, and worked out
a solution, then you know what to do. You MUST get field experience.
It is CRUCIAL. And each time you fail, you go home, and see what
you did right/wrong, and what you would do if the same situation
happened again. This is why I also post the fuckup as well as
the lay reports.. they are very valuable to me in gathering my
thoughts and forcing me to think about what I did right/wrong,
as well as listening to the other's comments about them on this
NG.

I also look at the other's reports as well, and learn about
situations, and ask myself for each one, if it happened to me,
what would I do/how would I handle it. Eventually, after doing it
for a couple years (I have been at this in ernest for about 2
years now), you get better at it. Learning situations in PU, is
like learning the words of a foreign language, and how to connect
them all together.. how to move from a bad situation..to a good
one to get the chick in a horny state..

Also, I keep in mind alot about what MrSex4uNYC says about attitude,
and when I get stuck, I ask myself, what would NYC tell me right
now about this situation. He is very congruent, and if you think
things this way, it is easy to be clear what is the right way or
wrong way.

> >I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
> >with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
> >with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
> >and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
> >unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
> >alone!
>
>  Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to
her her
> "ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she
can then
> accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!

Yes, basically that is the idea. I am not sure that it means I am
an authority, but its more, to convey that she is clueless, she
is wrong, so to listen to herself will make her fuck up even more..
..so maybe she had better listen to me instead, and then she wont
fuckup as much.. basically that is the idea..

>    Excellent...Maniac, I don't give a damn WHAT my orthodox SS
followers say,

I didn't get this.. What are orthodox SS followers, and I had no
idea they were saying anything about this.. I really dont understand
what you mean here..

> >Now what I am doing with all the above, is not arguing the logic (too
> >much)
> >of this, because, of course she is right, and I know this.
>
>  Actually, you ARE not arguing the logic, but you are USING the
logic...HER
> logic..HER way of viewing things.....pointing out WHY and HOW she
loses and
> what will happen if she doesn't stop it.   It's all centered around
losing and
> WHY she loses, based on what she has told you.  It IS logical, FROM
her point
> of view.

Yes, basically that is the idea. What I meant was, is that her main
point is that she wants a monogamous BF, and doesn't want to be played.
But, I am playing her, and she (at some level) realizes that, so
in essense, her gut feel about this is totally correct.

But I am playing her desire for the fuck, and her fear of losing
out, which lets me bypassing her gut feel that she is being
played, and then I can get her to fuck anyways.

Good followups everyone!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

-----

From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]
Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2001 12:10:23 GMT

  "Dohn Joe"  wrote:
>  wrote in message news:92n7b96
@nnrp1.deja.com...
> [snip]
>
> The more I think of it, the more this seems to be a great PU.
> I think the PU in England is the gist of your piece of work.
>o I'd be glad to see more
> details on how you picked her up in England, that's the hardest work. How
> did you stand up the crowd? How did you make it not look like a PU?

I was using psychological 'jujitsu' (use the strength of your
opponant, against themself). There is a field report from 2 months
ago, that outlines the PU (check fastseduction.com archives).
Basically, I met her at a conference. I didnt talk to her much.
Then I followed her onto a bus that was taking us to the next
meeting place. A guy was hitting on her, and he sat with her.
I sat on the seat in front bymyself.

She (like most british bitches), started complaining about how
she hates men, and other bullshit. The guy on the bus with her
is taking this/agreeing with it (if I remember right).

I just turned around (and tonality and eye contact here is crucial),
and just tell her in a VERY authoritative voice, slowly.. "perhaps
you have just not met the right man yet, one you understands you,
deeply, and completely. But.. you never know the future.. now do you..
I used killed eye contact, spoke slowly, and continued "perhaps
if you open your mind more, you might find him.. by surprise, without
even expecting it, because often, that is the way it usually is..see"

Psychicbabe went "maybe", and then started more manhating bitching.

I then described the kind of man she wanted "one you could rely on,
but at the same time, be mysterious, and exciting in some unexpected
ways, because he just knew how to reach you deep inside you, and
your mind.. that is what your looking for..isnt' it?"

Psychicbabe: yes,

{continue PU, bunches of stuff from the ManiacPlan, if I remember
right}

The key here was the tonality and Eye-Fuck contact. That is what
did it more than the words I used. I just totally crushed her
with it..

> How did
> you get past her "bitch office" shield? I'm asking especially because, as I
> picture this woman, it would seem pretty intimidating for me to approach
> her.

I had the attitude that she obviously had never met a man that
knew how to give it to her right, which means that she obviously
needed ME far more than I needed her. That mindset made it easy.

> I admire your ability to take her from there into total submission.
> existing relationship than guys. That's why many (even HOT ones) find
> themselves in a dead end - boring or abusive - relationship, love to
> complain about it to whoever they find to listen, yet are unable to step out

EXACTLY!!

> of it. That's why the first fuck is hard - after that she is bound
> emotionally to you. You see,

>Women's sexuality is DISSOLVED in them.

Yes! you understand it!! (true for most, but not all chicks though,
some just like sport fucking, like we do)

> GREAT words to remember for all us RAFCs when we feel like beating the walls
> after a fuckup... I myself am so darn depressed when coming back after an
> unsuccessful encounter with a chick. Yes, each field experience is one more
> lesson

Yes, do NOT underestimately field experience. It is SO important.
I fucked up TONS (see all the fuckup reports I used to post a couple
years ago on ASF), and I still fuckup alot (see HBGeek, or HockeyBabe).
Over on cliff's list they say it takes 2..4 years to get good
at something, and 10 years to be a master. I TOTALLY agree.
I have only been at this for 2.. 2 1/2 years. And the more I learn,
the more I realize I still need to learn.. There is still TONS that
I dont know yet.

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

----
From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:08 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

I, for one, am really GLAD to see a post from RJ that has helped me move
forward in MY game :)  not that I am an ingrate hehe... his contribution to all
this is UNDENIABLE to begin with and if I hadn't stumbeled onto his site, I
would have still been using my caveman tactics and my MENTAL seduction game
would still be lacking.  as much as I appreciate his contribution to the
seduction game in general, I had been disappointed with all the flaming and
nonsense that he and others had/have been involved with because I thought that
this NG was BASED on USEFUL interaction between him and the rest of us, but I
found that not to be the case :(  not that ANYONE gives a fuck what I have to
say about this, but I wanted to back up into the PAST to make it clear that I
appreciate RJ's PERSONAL contribution to the NG TODAY.

In article <20001230151247.26801.00001467@ng-fi1.aol.com>, erosla77@aol.com
(ErosLA77) writes:

>>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations
> 
>   Metahpor is a POWERFUL tool to move folks from a fixed perception to a new
>one. Please, share your story!

I have been doing this without identifying it:

A) find out her perception (marriage, monogamy, sucking dick VS kissing...)
B) "quote" her a story illustrating a chick that saw things a DIFFERENT way
(the way I want HER to see things) and benefitted GREATLY from it (she is still
with me, she got married to the guy she wanted, she gained inner peace and
self-love...)
C) watch her AGREE with something that she just minutes ago BELIEVED was
incorrect, or not for her.

the most fascinating part is (C) because I didn't realize my powers of
validation, pacing then LEADING had developed so strongly.  this is partially
because I am an empath and can FEEL when a chick moves into different emotional
states so I can relate to her from within her own state and effectively "vulcan
mind-meld" with her, turning the TWO of us into a SINGLE, functioning entity so
that I can dictate for US... to a degree.

a frequent situation is chicks asking me if I am single.  basically, I explain
to them that I am in an "open" relationship.  they practically INVARIABLY
disrespect my MLTR for being stupid. "how can she go for that?" "I would have
dumped you" "I would never let a man see other women"...  sooooo :)  I let them
go on and on and get it all out and completely ENTRENCH themselves in the DREAM
of them being with a man like me AND dumping me or CHANGING me or whatever
their BULLSHIT FANTASIES are at the time.  THEN I go into the BENEFITS of being
MY PRIMARY relationship... :)  when I stack up the LIST of BENEFITS and it
stacks HIGHER than those bitches have in their OWN RELATIONSHIPS RIGHT NOW,
they start thinking.  they think about what LITTLE they really have in their
relationships that MY MLTR is getting.  they think about the TRUST and
COMPANIONSHIP between us that they DON'T HAVE with their borefriends.  they
think about how she is SEXUALLY SATISFIED... DAILY if she wants it.  she has
someone to give her the REAL DEAL on how men are and what we want from
chicks... not someone that's going to keep playing her until he is finished
fucking her.  they ALSO see how the other bitches (like them in the near
future) come and go and MLTR CONSTANTLY receives the benefits of being with a
man that does EVERYTHING for her that she could want... for the MERE price of
NOT bailing because I fuck other chicks :)  once I break it down to them, ALLLL
I see on their faces is ENVY.  matter of fact, they tend to look EMBARRASSED
when I ask THEM about THEIR relationships.  oh, that reminds me... the bitches
that DON'T HAVE A MAN AT ALL fare the WORST in these situations.  my MLTR has
NEVER-ENDING SATISFACTION... they have STORIES of what they WOULD DO... IF
they could get a man AT ALL!  :)

chicks would rather have 20% of a WINNER than 100% of a LOSER!

>> Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>>her last week, apparently).
>
>Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with fucking; it
feels
>good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the vulnerabilities.  So
>when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which overcomes the
>potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. 

wow!  VERY powerful :)  I had really considered these to be apples and
oranges... pain of emotions after sex and pain of LOSS of the individual. 
however, discomfort is discomfort.  I quit giving UTILITY to this PIVOT I was
using because I realized she had ZERO self-esteem and not many other redeeming
qualities other than her looks.  she went from LJBF to NEXT overnight.  I had
been using her for a pivot because of her looks, but her lack of personality
started to wear on me and finally, she had to go.  no more hanging out, no more
phone calling, no more help with her love-life... nothing... cold turkey. 
completely FORGOT about her.  about a month or so later, the holiday season
comes around and she  A) calls me  B) tells me she bought me something for
christmas (I bought her NOTHING, not even a CARD and didn't bother to get one
when she told me she bought me something)  C) tells me she wants to bring it TO
my house, and  D) shows up with gift in hand, READY to socialize and spend time
with me.  

this is the SAME bitch that NEVER went in her purse to even OFFER to throw in
money when I used to use her for a pivot.  I didn't mind paying for her though
because the benefits I got from being out with an attractive chick that KNOWS I
am out to get OTHER bitches and facilitates that was well worth it :)  hehe... 
too bad for her, MLTR was over and I received her gift, talked to her for a
while (where she told me her recent "relationship" blew the fuck up in her face
:-) and then ejected her to keep having fun with MLTR.

I have been using outfoxer's style of letting bitches get involved in bullshit
relationships, TELLING THEM the relationships are bullshit then letting them
fall FLAT on their faces and come CRAWLING back to me :)  I just haven't added
the part yet where I get indignant that they are giving sex to CHUMPS that use
them like BITCHES and throw them away.  hehe it is fun enough at this point
just to hear about their FAILURES from the horses' mouths and see the sad looks
on their faces, while I am CONSTANTLY SMILING :)

what you described is BASICALLY what happened to her, except NOT in the sexual
content, but in the companionship content.  she THOUGHT she had a solid
position with me as my pivot, so she didn't feel like paying for anything
because she thought I NEEDED her, not WANTED her.  as soon as I didn't want her
anymore and dumped her from LJBF to NEXT, she was OK with it UNTIL her
relationship BACKFIRED... THEN she decides she wants to get back in good with
ME, which she can't do because I don't give a fuck about her and except for
looks, she can't compete with MLTR AT ALL!

the pain of loneliness overrides the emotional pain of sex without
committment... fascinating :)

>She's worried about
>pain, so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not only
>losing out on the pleasure of screwing, BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
>believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out that if
>she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even WORSE
>crack-up.
>
>  Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.

ok, this is interesting too.  "this is why you fucked up with your ex and I
feel the same way about that particular topic".  you are FORECASTING her
EJECTION unless she changes her ways.  she is still WITH YOU and has a chance
to do the right thing instead of getting ejected.  she already knows how it
feels to BE ejected by her EX and doesn't WANT to go through that pain AGAIN
with you.  you dictate to her HOW she could have avoided it with her EX and she
learns how to avoid it with you and gets in line.  this is another reason why
DICTATING what you REQUIRE from chicks is good, because they have the roadmap
to success or FAILURE with you.  as long as you have demonstrated personality
AND value BEFORE getting to this with her, she will be in a state of "how can I
get my hands on this guy... and KEEP him?" and then you will tell her what she
needs to do to be CONSIDERED amongst your TOP chicks and then is is up to her
to either fulfill her womanly duties or... as you predicted... get ejected and
feel the PAIN OF SEPERATION all over again with someone that she ALREADY knows
she WANTS to be with... WHATEVER the cost.

everyone has their price.  I find, most times, chicks are TALKING with no
EXPERIENCE.  a chick told me that she dumped her borefriend because he laughed
at her.  I told her that the sex must not have been good because otherwise she
would have had to use more than THAT to justify dumping an entire relationship.
 she CLAIMED that sex had nothing to do with her decision and that he didn't
RESPECT her was why she dumped him.  I told her that if the sex had been what
it is SUPPOSED to be... I GUARANTEE her that she would NOT have thrown THAT
away because of some laughing and disrespect.  I also proceeded to laugh at her
AND disrespect her IN HER FACE and told her I don't care because we are not
dating... she can't DUMP ME!   she never ADMITTED that I was right... BUT... by
the end of the conversation, she was asking me WHAT SHE SHOULD DO TO MAKE HER
LOVE LIFE BETTER!  :/  gotcha!

>>I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>>alone!
>
> Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to her her
>"ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she can then
>accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!  

yes.  I really have not been making the MOST of pacing and leading.  I have
been seeing where they ATTACH THEMSELVES to my way of thinking and see me as an
authority.  I have not used this to MAKE POLICY for them... merely to open
their minds and get them to think more efficiently.  you are right though. 
once you capture them... LEAD THEM!  make SOME efficient use of your new
followers... even if you were only practicing or passing time by capturing them
:)

excellent post :)

------

From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:10 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

In article <92n7b96@nnrp1.deja.com>, maniac_high@yahoo.com writes:

>After chick says bullshit about wanting to go to
>dinner and be friends or shit for 6 months before
>becoming a GF, I say: Actually, I dont go to dinner
>or stuff like that with ladies who are not my GF
>CHick:  gasps!
>Maniac: see, going to dinner, is an important step
>in a relationship for me. I only share it with someone
>special
>chick: Huh?
>Maniac: Well, let me put it this way, do you ever
>sleep with a guy who is just your friend, or dont
>care about?
>chick: of course not!

[lots of good use of Jake's shit snipped]

this is interesting, though I couldn't tell if this is something you are GOING
to do, or something you DID already.  either way, IF you are congruent, this
will serve you well as an alternate form of screening.  most of the time, I
screen by ASKING chicks shit and listening to their answers while watching
their faces and body-language.  another way to do it is to basically DICTATE to
them what I need to even CONSIDER being with a chick in any capacity
whatsoever.  most of the time I don't do this though because I can tell already
that the chick is worthless.  I usually get into DICTATION when she asks me
about myself.  am I attached?  what do I look for in a woman? etc.  THEN, since
she asked, I get into the reasons I have chosen women in the past and why I am
still with them in the present.  as I do that, I lay down my laws WITHOUT
telling the chick I am talking to that she needs to get in line with this shit
or get the fuck out of my face.  I have had a couple of chicks blow themselves
out after this.

I was talking to a chick that I know from YEARS ago that started calling me
again and talking about nothing.  I tolerated her for an hour or so on two
different days  A) because I was bored and  B) because through her speech
patterns and recurring ideas, I was learning if she was worth anything to me at
all, considering I get everything I want or need from MLTR in the first place,
she only had a VERY LIMITED use to me, as GOOD backup-pussy.  MLTR is smarter,
more interesting, more fun, less psychotic... basically TRUMPED her in all
areas, so this chick had NO CREDIT with me whatsoever.  I ended up getting into
PRECISELY what you did in your post.  the KICKER was when I told her "I don't
even TALK to girls that I don't want to fuck".  since I had not fucked her AND
had not suggested that we get together (she BELIEVES in monogamous
relationships for herself and even if she fucked me one time, it would be
merely to relieve her own personal stress and I am not going to be there for
her for that.  I am looking for MORE MLTRs... anything else can go fuck off.  I
laughed at her way of being AND broke it down to her why it was so stupid AND
let her know in NO UNCERTAIN TERMS that I was not going to be involved in
ANYTHING CLOSE to what she claims to want for herself... she can STAY HORNY for
all I care) she INTELLIGENTLY asked me WHY I was talking to her...  I let her
know that I found her amusing and her way of living ineffective.  I pointed out
to her that in the YEARS since I had spoken to her last, ALL she had to show
for it was a bungh of jibberish about WANTING a monogamous relationship that
she HAS NOT ATTAINED IN ALL THESE YEARS!  I let her know that I had predicted
that she would REMAIN dissatisfied for years to come and my talking to her
allowed me to follow her LACK of progress while, in the meantime, I get laid
EVERY DAY by MLTR :)   I have not heard from her SINCE that conversation...
good riddance.  she knew what she HAD to do if she wanted more of my time.  she
knew what she was going to have to do IF she wanted to socialize with me at
all.  she felt like her DEVOTION to the idea of a monogamous relationship with
a NON-EXISTANT man was more important than getting fucked by a guy that she
KNOWS and LIKES.  she is an idiot, and will remain horny UNTIL she fucks the
wrong guy, then has NO ONE to comfort her because I will not be there because
she had her chance and BLEW IT!

I have ZERO TOLERANCE for chicks that want things their way.  if they LIKE
doing things MY WAY, then they can be with me...maybe... for a while... as long
as they still LOOK HOT :)   when I approach chicks, I ASSUME they will fail the
screen because statistics show that I require A LOT from a chick and most of
them are either distracted by work or other relationships or just are not
QUALITY enough to be with me.  I find it amusing how ridiculous the SAME girls
are that I used to DESIRE to go out with and that I USED TO dislike being
rejected by.

now, I meet and REJECT girls daily.  not actively, just after I meet them, I
make NO EFFORT to remain in contact with them and go off to talk to other
chicks, leaving them wondering WHY I was interested enough to approach, but
BECAME DISINTERESTED and ejected for a SIMILARLY-GOOD-LOOKING bitch :)

Experiment Report! How kinky are your coworkers?!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



A practice session using the techniques of PU!


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: ]Experiment Report! How kinky are YOUR co-workers?!
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 08:03:45 GMT

]Experiment Report! How kinky are YOUR co-workers?!

This report is about finding the deep dark secrets of
your co-workers (not necessarily to fuck them, but as
a good experiment in state transitioning in groups
rather than one-on-one).

Note, for those readers living in repressed countries
still in the sexual dark ages like the Islamic
Republic of Iran, or the United Stated of America,
I do not advice attempting this..trouble with the
legal system, sex harrassment shit, or loss of
your job could result.. For the rest of you living
in countries that have both feet planted firmly in
the 20th century, no problem, lets rock on- here
is the report!


Recently, I have been doing alot of work practicing
state transitioning. Ie. the goal is to take a
chick (or in this case, group of chicks) from the
"idle state" (ie. thinking about office bullshit
and work they have to do), and transition them
to the kinky "lets get crazy and fuck state" as
quickly as possible, and in as few steps as possible
using a process that will be consistantly successful.

Last night, we had one of these (usually) boring
office departmental dinner parties at a stuffy
restaurant in town. BORING!!

So I decided what better place to liven things up
and see what I can get away with using psychological
warfare and a little bit of alcohol in an otherwise
formal group setting.

I get there, and sit at a table with 1 guy, and
5 chicks. For the first 30 minutes, it is boring,
I let everyone talk about boring office shit so
that everyone can arrive, and the food can start.

First I arrange the waiter to bring drinks to the
table (we need it later for one of the games I
am going to do), and get started on that right away.
One of the chicks only drinks tea, but that is OK,
later she really got into it anyways in spite of
being stark sober.

At the table is sitting:
ChinaGuy - he is from China
Mombabe - she is a mom, but wild & crazy, 40s (starts
          by sitting at another table)
HB CaptHook - she had a mild eye infection and is
              wearing an eyepatch this week (starts by
              sitting at another table)
HBStrict - she only drinks tea, but is more action
           than she looks
ScaredChick - she thinks we are all wierd
HBWhoMe? - she looks SO straight, but is the kinkiest
           at the table we find out!
Bichick - we find out she had enjoyed some bi games

Other assorted people sitting farther, who dont
play in the games really..

After that, I start. Here is how I did it. Refer
to the 'Maniac plan' post I made a couple weeks ago
(it is archived in fastseduction.com, I will also put
it on my site in Jan. when the next big update
happens) for some of the terminology below. I move
all the chicks (as a group), through all the states
as follows:

[Current State: Idle: chicks talking about office bullshit]
Maniac>Bichick: So what did you do this weekend?
Bichick: Nothing really.. how about you?
Maniac>I went to my dance circle, I like salsa dance
Bichick: oh really? {other chicks starting to listen}
Maniac: Yeah, I went to Brazil this year too, it was so
        much fun, wanna see my pictures?
Bichick & others: 'yes!' (take out my digi-PC, show pictures
        of carnival in Rio, tback bikini babes, the gay parade
        and debauchery in the streets)
Maniac: You know, the culture is SO different, brazilian people
        are SO passionate!
All chicks: oh really?
Maniac: yep, after I left Rio, I went to Sao Paolo, and
        went into this bar and all of the sudden this brazilian
        chick grabbed me and started french kissing me (perform
        SP chick story from ManiacPlan).

[Current State: (A)dmiration & (M)an now achieved from ManiacPlan]
Bichick: Oh, HB Capthook lived in brazil a few years!
Maniac: really? {I go to her table, ask if she wants to see
        some brazil carnival pictures with us.. she runs over
        to our table}
Maniac>all chicks: you know, I respected that SP chick though
       because she was not afraid to take what she wants..
       kind of like Madonna (perform the Madonna story from
       ManiacPlan).
Maniac: Perform 'how to communicate to lady at all levels
        and pay attention to her and what she wants' story
        from ManiacPlan, while doing lots of Kino on
        HBCapthook sitting next to me as a demonstration.
        Others are watching and getting jealous..

[Now try to introduce the (S)ex state from ManiacPlan..
the goal here is to do the "questions game, but in a
group setting.. so I decide to do it via a drinking game]
Maniac: {now I try to introduce a drinking game called 'I
       never'}, Hey, do they have any good drinking games in
       Japan.
Chicks: {they suggest some really lame boring shit like
         remembering names of subway stations..boring!!!}
Maniac: Well, I know two games, Chandelliers {I describe this
        game.. but we wont play it, not sexual}, and then
        "I never" {I describe "I never"}.
[Now here, I think I dont have enough rapport yet to start
"I never" (a drinking version of "questions") and get it to
work well (ie. sexually), so first I preform the "Strawberry
fields" game in a group (in next post, and included below)

<>>

We play the game: (mombabe hears us laughing, comes
over & kicks Chinaguy out of his chair so she can sit
next to us)

Among the answers to "strawberry fields"
Bichick: "uh, I dont see any fence around the field!"
HB Capthook & mombabe: "as many as I can eat!"
HBStrict: "to the farmer.. uh.. Thank you {and bow}"

We were all laughing and rolling on the floor to the
various chicks answers to this game, with lots of "I cant
believe you?! really?!" reactions among the ladies..

[Current state in ManiacPlan: (S)ex now achieved, now
lets intensify and see what these chicks will say/do.
I am putting LOTS of shoulder/back kino on all the
ladies as the game is playing]

Maniac: OK, time for another game, we will play that
 "I never" game we talked about before. {Maniac explains
 howto play "I never"} [easy.. each person takes a turn,
 say "I never xxx", whoever did "xxx" has to take a drink.
 start light, get game sexual ASAP..]

Maniac: here is the opening question: "I never kissed a
 member of the opposite sex before I was 15 y.o."
{3 girls drink}
Maniac: your turn HBCaptHook
HBCaptHook: uh, I dont understand the game yet, can you do
  the next question Maniac?
Maniac: OK, I never kissed a guy on the first date
{we all drink}
HBCaptHook: OK I get it, my turn "I never had sex with a
 guy on the first date" {notice because of the setup with
 straberry fields here, that the chicks ON THEIR OWN, turned
 the game sexual without me having to do anything! This was
 what I worried about if I were to start the "I never" game
 before straberry fields.. the mood was just not sexual
 enough yet, and the game would have fizzled.. but now..
 no problem!}
{all but 1 chick drinks (HB afraid.. who is looking a bit
 uncomfortable now)}
Mombabe: I never kissed a member of the same sex
{Bichick drinks!.. lots of "oh really?!? and discussion
 ensues, but bichick wont delve into it anymore ;-) }
Bichick: I never had sex with more than 4 people in the
 room.
{bichick, HBstrict and HBWhoMe all drink!}
HBAfraid: I never went to california
{we all look at her wierd.. skip to next girl}
HBWhoMe: I never did sex as part of a performance in front
of others
{Maniac, Bichick and HBWhoMe drink.. HBStrict looks envious,
others gasp and are laughing.. rest of our dept, is looking
at us, like why we are having so much fun, and a bit wierdly,
fortunately they cannot hear what we are saying ;-)}
Maniac: I never had sex with someone and didn't know their
 name till the next morning.
{We all drink except HB afraid}
MomBabe: I never used tool, or vibrator during sex
{we all drink}
HBCaptHook: I never had sex with a cat?!
{we all look at her wierd.. no one drinks}
HBCaptHook: but it can happen, I saw it on video once!
{we look at her more strange, and make her drink for watching
the video}
HBAfraid: I cant think of any question
{we skip her, next girl}
..
Maniac: I never was tied/tied up my partner during sex
{Maniac, HB strict, HBCapthook and HBWhome all drink}

Maniac: I see, so who is "S", and who is "M" {explain to
 a couple clueless chicks which was which}
HBWhoMe and HBStrict are serious S type, Bichick is both.
HBStrict makes a pass at me, and I reply only if you are
serious.. she stares at me long (maybe a future there ;-) )
I shake hands and hug HBWhoMe, who is really into this
thread of questioning.

Mombabe now makes ajoke about why I went to lunch today
with this other chick (not in the game), and not her. I
tell her because she didn't ask me.. girls have to take
what they want, like that SP chick. I ask her if she
likes me, she says yes, and I gesture (and get) a cheek
kiss. I am CERTAIN I could have done a KC, or even one
of those 3way KCs, but I remember that this is an
experiment, and I do have to see all these people on Monday
again at work, so I dont push it.

now adminbabe (the dept head's secy) comes by our table
and asks how many of us are going to the prescheduled
after-party karaoke. Mombabe replies "none of us, we are
all going to a hotel".. HBCapthook adds in "a love hotel..".

[Final state: Dying to fuck: achieved]

Adminbabe looks at us wierd (she missed the whole thing),
and leaves. Mombabe now asks why I have such a harem tonight,
and then Bichick remarks how all the ladies in the office
really really like you Maniac.

I ask 'why?'
bichick says.. you smile, and laugh alot.. but there is
something else.. we all see it, but cant really
describe what it is {maniac opinion.. it is the way
I stare at chicks with the 'fuck me' luck, and all the
shoulder kino..etc, I do, even in the office}.

Supper now is wrapping up, we all have to go, I remark
that this table is fun, and that another night, we should
all meet again for beer and fun.. everyone agrees.

As we are going back, HBCaptHook and mombabe are grabbing
all over me, it was funny.

Some go home, and I split off from the group, as I have
a date with karatebabe at midnight in another part of
town..

Experiment over..

I learned that state transitioning is a very predictable,
reproduceable process, once you learn the tools to do it.
This was just my office staff that is around me, so made
a good subject for the experiment. I also realized, that
in groups, there is a sort of feed back effect, so you
can really accelerate things. It wasnt the alcohol because
HBstrict had nothing to drink, but was well into the
game too.

Because it was a group, I could skip steps "BVG,D,O" in
the ManiacPlan, and reach the last state.. (dying to fuck)
so I likely could have taken any (or all)
of those ladies back for a wild time in the sack (which I
wont do, because I work with them.. but there was nothing
stopping it, thats for sure)..

Fascinating..

Constructive Opinions/comments anyone?

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Doing proper ‘closes’

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

A way to set up the kiss close

From: erosla77@aol.com (ErosLA77) Ross Jeffries
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 26 Dec 2000 19:23:44 GMT
Subject: Re: What if...

>Subject: Re: What if...
>From: eclipse19@my-deja.com
>Date: Tue, Dec 26, 2000 12:04 AM
>Message-id: <929jdt$u6t$1@nnrp1.deja.com>
>
>In article <9299s4$o03$1@nnrp1.deja.com>,
>  charnel1278@my-deja.com wrote:
>> Hey all,
>>
>> I've checked out a Maniac's, and some others websites and most say
>that
>> when you ask "Do you wanna kiss me?", you're guaranteed a kiss, unless
>> you get a flat out NO.  None, from what I saw, said what to do when
>you
>> get that NO.  Do you continue on the conversation like nothing
>> happened? Do you come back with a similar question later in the
>> evening?  If so, won't she kinda feel that you're badgering her?
>> Granted, this won't happen often, but what if?....
>>
>> Laters.
>
> the standard (canned) reply to a "no" answer is "YOU really know how
>to ruin a moment....your old boyfriends must have hated that about you"
>I think i got this off tony or maniac's site, forget which one. I
>havent ran into a direct "no" answer myself so i havent field tested
>this, but im sure others have. From what i read(or remember anyhow)
>this will leave them stunned and they will show less resistance against
>another kiss.
>
>

 Hmmm......well, I like this "you really know how to ruin a moment" response
WITHOUT asking for the kiss first. "Asking" for anything, outside of the
presence of fun(as in, on the spur of the moment saying, "Hey...wouldn't it be
fun to go to a strip club? Let's go!))  seems pretty pathetic to me.  

    A good one is to notice her giving you that look and then say(and I got
this from a student, it is NOT mine).  "If ? were to ask you on a scale of one
to ten, how good a kisser are you, what would you say?"

 Listen for her answer, then say, "If you were to kiss me right now, how do you
think I'd rate you?"

  You do this ONLY when you see "the look".......

  "let's find out" you say and kiss her.  

IF she backs away from that, then the "you really know how to ruin a moment"
comment works great.  Come to think of it, this could really work for a
cancellation as well. 

---

From: "General Snafu" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: What if...
Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2000 22:57:08 GMT

If she says no to a kiss, ask for a BJ.  If she says no to the BJ, you are
SOL for the night.

 wrote in message
news:9299s4$o03$1@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Hey all,
>
> I've checked out a Maniac's, and some others websites and most say that
> when you ask "Do you wanna kiss me?", you're guaranteed a kiss, unless
> you get a flat out NO.  None, from what I saw, said what to do when you
> get that NO.  Do you continue on the conversation like nothing
> happened? Do you come back with a similar question later in the
> evening?  If so, won't she kinda feel that you're badgering her?
> Granted, this won't happen often, but what if?....
>
> Laters.
>
>
> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/

Maniac High's Pick Up Girls Guide and Seduction Website! » field

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Maniac uses a power opener to meet and tongue down a chick!


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Maniac meets HBOrderMe! Bar PU
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 05:00:36 GMT

Maniac meets HBOrderMe! Bar PU
001215

This is an interesting bar PU. .
used it to not lay the chick, but to get higher rapport
with the other guys around.

It is bo-nen-kai (end of year party) season in Japan.
After the party (boring, in a big hotel ballroom)
we go to the ni-ji-kai (after party) in a bar/disco
in Roppongi with a bunch of my coworkers (mostly guys,
and some ladies).

One AFC guy is really into this HB. He is making every
AFC mistake in the book (saying she is pretty, sucking
up to her..blah). Progress is really slow.

Me and all the guys are watching. He gets frustrated and
leaves for a bit. I move in on the chick (she is wearing
a high cut black dress, and fishnet stockings... very cute).

My opener is the strawberry game.. I just go up to her,
and say 'imagine you are in a field, and you see a strawberry
field ahead of you, with a fence around.. how high is the
fence'. She goes right into it.

Then I do the interpretation (see strawberry game post
for the game and interpretation) for her. I ask her what
she thinks (she said 1m high fence, 50 strawberries, sorry
to the farmer). She disagrees the interpretation. Then I
ask her what is your idea guy like (brad pitt). Then I say
besides his looks why you like him. Reply: he is really
guy.

Then I ask, what do you want most in a guy's character.
She says, 'I want him to lead, to decide for me what to do.'
Good.. Maniac keeps that in mind for what comes next. .

AFC guy comes back, and I let him have his chick back for
a while. He is doing more regular AFC stuff, though he
has at least initiated kino.. very good. He does this for
like 20 minutes, but isn't really breaking through.

He gets frustrated, goes. I tell the guys 'watch this',
and go up to the chick, and say I am going now, give me a
kiss. I get a cheek kiss.

I look straight into her eyes, and tell her 'thats not
good enough, look into my eyes.. what do you see.. now
give me a real kiss..' a long tonguedown with sexual kino
ensues.. Everyone else sees what I just did, after spending
not even a total of 5 minutes talking with this chick
from before.

I leave the chick, and go back to the guys.. 'that is how
it is supposed to be done'. Respect of me from my guy co-workers
now goes up 10x from whatever it was before, and was visibly
different in the office the next day.

AFC co-worker comes back and tells me how so much he is
in love with this girl (I guess he knew her from before as
a friend or co-worker or something..not sure.. I had never
met her before though). As a result, I defer to him, and let
him get AFC'd out.

I go back to the other guys, and just say, I could take her
(she lives really close actually, so I could just say I
live far and can I crash at her place.. I am sure the answer
would have been yes) whenever I want. They say 'why dont you'?

I reply, well, AFC guy is really into her, and he is a coworker
of mine who I respect, so I dont want to take his chick away
from him. There are lots of chicks to fuck, and this one means
nothing to me at all, but she is important to him, so best to
leave it at that.

I go on to say that all I wanted to know is that I COULD take her
home if I want (and I might next week or something, I got her
number) and now I know that, so it is enough for me, I dont
need more.

Respect from co-workers now goes up another 10x for this, because
I and they KNOW that this is true after what they just saw. .

He continues to AFC for a long while, and I get tired and go
home. Next day I hear that she blew him out almost as soon as I
left.

Now this was cool, because the goal wasn't really to lay the
chick (which I still might if I decide to see her again), but to
increase stature with co-workers, which can help in other ways
in my regular life.

Now one thing to note, is that I cannot do this every time (heck
not even close.. this is like the 3rd or 4th time it has ever happened
so directly like this). I was
really lucky, because of what she said to my 'what you like in
guy question', it was just so EASY to know what this chick
expected me to do, and it was really easy to stage it to happen
in front of all the other guys once I clued in on this.

I WISH I could do it everytime, but life isnt really like that ;-)
Mr. SMooth can do it though!

Constructive comments and opinions welcome!
Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Using the ‘color’ game to PU!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Using the 'color game' to do a PU!


From: tonymcneill@my-deja.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Colours Game - opinions?
Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 00:43:35 GMT

 Hi Guys,

I've just field tested this pattern / game for creating an erotic and
horny state - worked a dream:) I'd be interested to know what you think
of this and how it might be improved.....

I suppose it might work best with the more visually thinking babes.

This is not a 'word for word' pattern by any means, by the way - I just
kind of found myself going into it on the fly.....  here we go..

The PUA "notices" the colour (UK spelling by the way for those who might
feel the urge to correct me) of an object, item of clothing etc.

PUA - "I find these yellow walls (or whatever) quite uplifting;
especially in the winter. Isn't it nice to have some bright colours
around when it's so grey and dark outside?" "Do you think that colours
have an big effect on peoples' moods?".

HB - "Oh, yes, definitely."

PUA - "Hmmm. I was just wondering......I mean....... I was in one of
those New Age shops recently and they were selling lots of different
coloured sunglasses.... with the idea that, if you wanted to feel more
of a certain mood, or to look at the world in a certain way, you would
slip on a pair of sunglasses which would colour everything you looked at
in the desired tone" "Do you think that could work in any way?"

HB - "Well, maybe. I don't know really"

PUA - "Well, for example, my bedroom is a very pale blue colour and I
find this particular blue very restful" "I mean, can you imagine
sleeping very well in a pale blue room?" "Imagine you are really tired,
you know when your eyelids are heavy and you curl up with that fantastic
feeling of at last ... just letting go.... and .....giving
yourself...to....(sp perhaps?).. sleep'" "Do you have a sense of a
particular colour when you imagine that feeling?" (Make sure she's
imagining being sleepy).

HB - "Oh, maybe blue, or green" (or whatever). (If she doesn't come up
with one then maybe she could be asked to imagine the perfect colour for
a bedroom, but both of the HB subjects I tried got right into it.)

PUA "How about when you feel....really full of great ideas...... like
you have all sorts of inspiration flowing through you.?"

PUA then procedes to get HB to imagine a few other states (feeling very
inspired and spiritual (commenting on her choice of colour in a playful
way)...... bursting with energy ...... feeling very sensual,
relaxed and open (we're getting closer, gentlemen)......and eventually,
 being full of passion and horny), and slowly visualising a colour with
each one.

You get the picture - guiding her into these states,
comparing colours etc etc. I have tried this on two chicks, both of whom
LOVED the game and got right into imagining the states. One of them was
an ex who is of great value as a pivot / social proof (and a friend) so
I was testing the game with her rather than going for the lay and the
other HB, in spite of being pretty shy, blushed madly and was VISIBLY
remembering the joy of being fucked until she screamed with pleasure ;)
(At this point Tony is feeling a bit fucking pleased with himself).
I think this would have definitely resulted in a fuck had I not been
meeting her at lunchtime before going off to work :( (at this point Tony
is disgusted as well as pleased!!)

What do you 'real' PUAs think of this little game? As I said I somehow
went into it on the fly after having the idea while practicing
improvising patterns while driving, using things I saw on the road as
starting points for pattern-talk. So it's pretty new and I, as yet,
claim only to be a humble RAFC. Going to test it some more and post the
results....



Any suggestions or comments?

Tony

--
'Action' is the magic word

Setting up the Kiss Close

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

A way to set up the kiss close

From: erosla77@aol.com (ErosLA77) Ross Jeffries
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 26 Dec 2000 19:23:44 GMT
Subject: Re: What if...

>Subject: Re: What if...
>From: eclipse19@my-deja.com
>Date: Tue, Dec 26, 2000 12:04 AM
>Message-id: <929jdt$u6t@nnrp1.deja.com>
>
>In article <9299s4$o03@nnrp1.deja.com>,
>  charnel1278@my-deja.com wrote:
>> Hey all,
>>
>> I've checked out a Maniac's, and some others websites and most say
>that
>> when you ask "Do you wanna kiss me?", you're guaranteed a kiss, unless
>> you get a flat out NO.  None, from what I saw, said what to do when
>you
>> get that NO.  Do you continue on the conversation like nothing
>> happened? Do you come back with a similar question later in the
>> evening?  If so, won't she kinda feel that you're badgering her?
>> Granted, this won't happen often, but what if?....
>>
>> Laters.
>
> the standard (canned) reply to a "no" answer is "YOU really know how
>to ruin a moment....your old boyfriends must have hated that about you"
>I think i got this off tony or maniac's site, forget which one. I
>havent ran into a direct "no" answer myself so i havent field tested
>this, but im sure others have. From what i read(or remember anyhow)
>this will leave them stunned and they will show less resistance against
>another kiss.
>
>

 Hmmm......well, I like this "you really know how to ruin a moment" response
WITHOUT asking for the kiss first. "Asking" for anything, outside of the
presence of fun(as in, on the spur of the moment saying, "Hey...wouldn't it be
fun to go to a strip club? Let's go!))  seems pretty pathetic to me.  

    A good one is to notice her giving you that look and then say(and I got
this from a student, it is NOT mine).  "If ? were to ask you on a scale of one
to ten, how good a kisser are you, what would you say?"

 Listen for her answer, then say, "If you were to kiss me right now, how do you
think I'd rate you?"

  You do this ONLY when you see "the look".......

  "let's find out" you say and kiss her.  

IF she backs away from that, then the "you really know how to ruin a moment"
comment works great.  Come to think of it, this could really work for a
cancellation as well. 

---

From: "General Snafu" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: What if...
Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2000 22:57:08 GMT

If she says no to a kiss, ask for a BJ.  If she says no to the BJ, you are
SOL for the night.

 wrote in message
news:9299s4$o03@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Hey all,
>
> I've checked out a Maniac's, and some others websites and most say that
> when you ask "Do you wanna kiss me?", you're guaranteed a kiss, unless
> you get a flat out NO.  None, from what I saw, said what to do when you
> get that NO.  Do you continue on the conversation like nothing
> happened? Do you come back with a similar question later in the
> evening?  If so, won't she kinda feel that you're badgering her?
> Granted, this won't happen often, but what if?....
>
> Laters.
>
>
> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/

Game: The Wall and the Forest

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Maniac introduces "The Wall and the Forest", a PU game.



From maniac_high@yahoo.com 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Game: The wall and the forest
Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 16:18:24 GMT

Another one of those mindfuck games like 4 questions or the cube:

"The Wall and the Forest"

-You are walking in a field, you see a wall, how high is it, and
how do you get by it? [wall = pride, and also how you get past
obstacles]

-you continue walking, and you see a house [kind of house you dream
to have later in life]

-you see a key on the ground, you go to the house, does the key
open the door? [if yes, means you can get married]

-you go in the house (if you were able to open with the key), and
 on the first floor you see a table and chairs, how many chairs are
 there? [means how many people in your future family]

-now you go outside, and see to one direction a dense dark forest, and
 the other way, a less dense/brighter wooded area. Which way do you
 go? (dark forest=expect something, but unknown, take a chance)
     (bright wooded area=easygoing style/way)

-as you walk you then see a lake nearby. How big is it, and how deep
 is it? (big=size of your heart, depth=depth of your heart)

THE END


This game could be lethal for chicks who want to get married or
something like that. Make sure you answer the right answers when
you tell her "what your answers were" after you finish her turn!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Game: Forest

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Nightlight introduces 'forest game'!



From: nightlight9@hotmail.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: More like "4 questions" game?
Date: Thu, 02 Nov 2000 19:50:10 GMT

You mention all these, but most of them are not very useful in the
initial meeting because they are too cerebral and too random.  Try ones
that are more viceral.  You are walking in a dark forest.  How do you
feel.  (how she approaches life).  You could to a wall with a door.
What do you do? (how she approaches obsticalls).  You look down and see
a cup on the ground what is it made out of? (how she views wealth).
You come to some water, describe it. (how she views sexuality).
Always end with sexuality because it is  a good topic for PU and
demonstrates you are comfortable with women and people a sexual context.

BookGuy, my comments are based on experience and field testing.  Please
do the same if you reply.

--
NightLight9
Just be yourself... smooth with interesting questions and interesting
answers.

Game: Strawberry Fields

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Maniac introduces a PU game: Strawberry Fields!
[Note, this originally comes from the book 'Kokology']


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Game!: Strawberry fields
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 08:02:40 GMT

Game!: Strawberry fields
001117

This is a game to find out some things about how chicks
see sex. It is very popular in Japan & is a good state
transitioner

--

Intro: Hey, lets play a game!

Imagine you are alone in a field, and see a straberry field
in front of you with tasty strawberries.

There is a fence/gate around the field. How high is it?
(= how easy is this girl/guy to take sex)

Now you are in the straberry field, how many straberries
do you take?
(=how many BFs/GFs that person wants)

Ok, after you have finished enjoying the strawberries,
how do you feel about the farmer, who's field you took them
from?
(=how you feel to that person after fucking them)


The end

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

TPUA night PU’s HB Smallmouth and converts to a lay!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

[TPUA PU's a chick at night, and converts it into a lay!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com
]


Date Posted: 2000/09/25 05:21:37 AM EDT
Author: Tokyopua 
Subject: Re: HB Small Mouth PU  (Was Re: Calling all Tokyo PUA's)

Hey Maniac,

I didnt really intend that last post of mine as a field report, since it
wasnt too detailed.  But yeah, things have been going well on the PU despite
my severely limited time. So I will attempt a bit of a field report on the
initial PU here.  My PU efficiency factor has been really high recently,
maybe because I am only trying to PU when I feel really confident and often
times when I wasnt planning on it, so was really relaxed. I did a PU on a 19
year old HB college student in the train the other night and got her home
phone number.  It was easy cause she was reading Tokyo Classified, and I
asked her about it. I was really confident, and in only 2 stops got her to
really dig me.  In fact, when I asked her why she had studied English, she
said "So I could meet a guy like you!"  The only problem is finding time to
meet her again before I leave.

The PU I did on HB Small Mouth was not planned either, I just saw her
walking back home around my place at midnight, and somehow knew that despite
my frazled appearance after 2 hours of Jujitsu practice and carrying 40
pounds of luggage, I could do the PU on her.  My opening line was "I like
your hair" which I knew was lame and she must have heard often, but hey,
thats the price of using the 3 second rule sometimes.  I immediately
followed with asking her if she was a student, what kind of work she did,
etc.  Oddly, I didnt use my standard opener "Do you speak english" in the
whole conversation.  I will post my personal notes on the rest of the PU at
the end of this post just for reference, but they arent too coherent.  They
were the basis though for the plans I laid for the successful next date that
got me laid 3 days later.  (If I have time someday I will write up full
notes on that too.) Total time to lay in terms of time invested was
approximately 3.5 hours, about the same as HB Physics, my other recent
street PU who I did that same day.  This efficiency is possible if the
progression is done just right, I think.

 wrote in message news:8qfler$o1r@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Tokyo PUA,
>
> This is an excellent report.. You really rock!
>
> Where / how did you originally
> PU this chick though? Also, taking the chick over to see your
> weight training stuff is a clever idea.. liked that..!
> BTW, I thought you left already to the USA, how long are you still
> there for?

Right near my house in a dark alley at midnight on her way home!  She told
me later (post lay) that she was scared at first, but I had a really relaxed
attitude so she got comfortable with me afterwards.  As for the weight
training stuff later, it was great kino as I had her bend over slightly and
got right behind her to "help her with her form" while simultaneously
letting her slightly feel the form of my stiff wood pressed against her, and
other such intimate situations.

Still here till Oct 14 or so, with a trip to Taiwan and maybe Hawaii too
thrown in.

>
> ALso, do you usually go out alone, or with a wing. I noticed that
> you knew quite a few people in Roppongi, I guess you get out there
> quite a bit?

Been out there a lot since last February, maybe 10 times or so.  I guess
predominantly I go with a wing, but sometimes felt it screwed up my game.
Of course, my wings didnt know anything about seduction a la ASF, thats
probably why.  Of course, neither did I till June... I know Im much better
at street PU when alone though, thats for sure!  OTOH, when I went out to
clubs with you and Rio, I think my game was really improved and I was
learning all the time.
BTW, I have heard that someplace called club Earth near hamamatucho has
really hot babes, (bitch shield too, but who cares, right;-), so you guys
might want to check that out.  3000 Yen cover charge.  May be the new
alternative to Fura?

>
> > I managed to lay that HB Small Mouth
>
> EXCELLENT!
>
> >Ganbatte!  Im seeting HB Bi this weekend again (tonight), and HB
> >small the next day, and my ex-GF the next.  Im starting to feel like
> >Maniac juggling girls, but nothing will happen w/ my ex, so its not
> >so bad.
>
> Yes, I did that ALOT last year, and fucked a shitload of chicks that
> I cant even count now..
>
> but its really tiring and you do get sick of it after a while..
> so finally I just MLTR'd a few that I really liked, who also accepted
> that I fuck other chicks, and left it at that.. guess I got to get out
> more ;-)
> not sure if its the right way yet, but been doing it that way
> the last few months now.. We'll see ;-)

I think it goes in cycles.  Eventually you get tired of the MLTR's and have
to replace them.  To do that you will have to PU lotsa new chicks, lay them,
see if they dont eject when you break the news that there are others.  That
takes a lot of time, so then you want to go back to the easy life of having
a bunch of girls on call.  Then the cycle starts over.  Im just beginning to
get these girls into MLTR status, but now I have to leave.  But theres
always business trips ack here!

>
> If you are planning on hanging around TOkyo though, you should
> bring HB Bi and her friend to one of our fuck parties the next time..
> sounds like they'd be a good time.. maybe introduce them to Kipp or
> something since I am not there right now, before you leave.. or
> give me your departure date and see if they are interested and we
> can setup something with all the ladies, if this is your sort of thing..

Id consider it, but it will take more effort, and probably wont be anything
I can do until after Im gone and come back for business trips.  You see, I
worked it too good with HB Bi.  She is signing her letters with "Love" at
the end and is all into me now.  Made me the most awesome meal any woman has
ever made me, washed my clothes, gave me an amazing massage, etc.  When I
confronted her about our last threesome, she said that she felt jealous when
she saw me doing her friend, and claimed that was the only time she had ever
done something like that, that she isnt really Bi.
So right now I think she somehow sees a relationship in this, despite my
leaving?  I figure once Im gone I can get past that as reality sinks in and
maybe set up more stuff for any business trips I make back.

>
> Good post!
>
> Maniac
> http://www.pickupguide.com

Here are those notes I was talking about, for what they are worth:

-------------------------------------------
PU of HB Small:  happened in a dark alley shortcut to my house at midnight,
I approached carrying a 30 pound backpack on one shoulder and a 10 pound
bucket of protein powder in the other, and said,  $B!H (BExcuse me, your hair is
really beautiful. $B!I (B  She reacted favorably and said thanks, but kept
walking, slightly faster.  She seemed young, so I asked if she was a
student.  She said no, I asked what she does.  She said she works for a
cable company, I fluff talked about watching TV.  She asked what I do.  I
said I know its late but you should have coffee or tea with me at Jonathans
restaurant nearby.  She said no, so I said, OK, how do we meet again.  She
said give me your number and I said,  $B!H (BAh, but I know women, if I give you
my number you will get nervous and never call. $B!I (B  She said  $B!H (BNo, 
that wont
happen I promise. $B!I (B  I knew I didn $B!G (Bt have enough rapport or 
anything to
believe that, so really what I was just doing was stalling till I could set
up a firm date.

I got a pen and wrote my number and at this point we are standing on the
corner near my place.  I play on Japanese cuteness and write my name with
hearts by it.  (None of this is stuff I would be able to do in the US.)
Then I say, OK, when are we going to meet.  Its sort of a way to pace the
ongoing reality now that she has my number,its a logical extension.  The
number is just a formality to me, I want to set up the date.  After some
negotiation, I get a date set up for 6 PM Tuesday, her day off.  I had given
her alternatives between my place and eating in Tachikawa nearby (but both
already had the presuppostion that we are meeting for a date, so I don $B!G (Bt
care which she chooses).  She chose Italian in Tachikawa which is perfect
cause eating carbs increases seratonin (=relaxation), so I will lay on the
patterning after a while, maybe even order a glass of wine (more seratonin
and romance) for us both.  Then its a 5 minute taxi ride back to my place!

Anyway, we keep talking.  I get that she never has met a foreigner, that she
likes Richard Gere, cause he is  $B!H (BShibui $B!I (B. $B!! (B(=quiet, simple, 
sober,
tasteful, austere, parsimonious, etc.)  I asked her about her ideal man
while doing the (SP) thing.  She really accessed a lot and I was awakening
her creative centers.  I touched her a lot on the arm to anchor the good
feelings.   She said she really was too ideal, but that her ideal guy was
like her father, sweet and nice.  I asked if she wanted a guy who made her
feel safe, and she said yes.  I compared our hand sizes and got kino,
remarked at how small her hands were, that my big hands could protect her.
Complemented her smile and said that it seems like her eyes smile too and
she said that she is often told that.  She said I was skillful at
complementing and I said that I really meant it.

I mirrored her body positions a lot and this seemed to have a good effect.
She seemed really into it and wasn $B!G (Bt trying too hard to get away despite 
it
being after midnight and having to work the next day, only bringing up the
time when I did.  She was rubbing her earlobe, and later playing with her
ponytail in a really sexy way, all with the doggy dinner bowl look.
I also showed kanji ability and had her write her name, and demonstrated how
we could study English together, all using the Zaurus.  (BTW, Did you buy
one yet, Maniac? A useful tool in many ways.  You can turn it into a
portable digital photo album too, albeit poor quality...) She liked that.
At one point she asked what was in the bucket, I said protein powder and she
said  $B!H (Bnomitai! $B!I (B and I said  $B!H (B5 fun dake areba, nomeru 
yo. $B!I (B
(If you have 5
minutes I can give you a taste).  But she refused to go to my apartment and
I didn $B!G (Bt press the issue, I just reconfirmed our fun date on Tuesday, and
gave her a kiss goodnight, then took off.
----------------------------------

-T

ASF reader comments on above story

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website: 

http://www.pickupguide.com 

Many excellent followups to the Psychicbabe re-lay report!
Mrsex4unyc, RJ..etc..etc.

From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:05 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

In article <92jvre$obh@nnrp1.deja.com>, maniac_high@yahoo.com writes:

>The immediate gold to take care of this, is to now make the
>relationship very high stakes for her. I can do this because
>I know that she is into me (from what she said at the dinner),
>so the idea is to play it that if she doesnt do her job as a
>chick.. she will lose EVERYTHING as far as I am concern.
>Ok, that is the plan, here we go:

plan or no plan, essentially, you are telling her the truth.  on a long-enough
timeline, the survival rate for EVERYONE is ZERO.  sooner or later, everyone
you love will either leave you or die.  chicks don't seem to believe in this,
though it is the absolute truth.  they think that they can relate to you
FOREVER, REGARDLESS of what they do or how they act.  you are telling her HOW
she can REMAIN with you and what is going to get her EJECTED.  even though it
takes a long time, so it doesn't SEEM like this... this is what has happened to
EVERY chick's relationship that has gone away.  EVENTUALLY, she was not
fulfilling her womanly duties and her man left her for a   chick (younger,
sexier, richer, swallower...)  EVEN if she IS fulfilling her duties, if her man
like it from another chick MORE, she loses out either in a PERCENTAGE of her
benefits or she gets DUMPED and loses ALL of her benefits.  you are merely
explaining this to her and telling her what she needs to do IF she wants to be
with you... which you have already determined.  you are SELLING, and now you
are screening her to see if she is QUALIFIED and ABLE to buy.

>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations
>in relationship. 

I am getting to the point where I am going to do this.  I never do this with
chicks because I morph into whatever THEY are looking for and hook them that
way.  the thing for me is that being 10 months in with MLTR, she has REALLY
learned how to please me and the time I spend TEACHING her has become minimal
and the time I spend ENJOYING her is increasing :)  it is getting tougher and
tougher for other chicks to get my attention, because anything LESS than what I
have already is BULLSHIT to me.  the time I am spending talking to chicks is
mostly eliciting values and breaking their perceptions... just for fun :)  I
know IMMEDIATELY if I want sex from a chick, and if I don't, she is IMMEDIATELY
LJBF and I use her for practice and NEXT her at the end of the conversation.

I am seriously going to consider moving to a "demonstration of value -> SOI"
model, just because I have lost my patience with LISTENING to these bitches
talking about shit that really doesn't mean anything.  I know I am going to
NEXT them ANYWAY as soon as I realize they can't compete with MLTR, so why
listen to their shit FIRST?  I may as well let them know how great I am and
let them know what kind of woman I am willing to accept, and let them continue
from there.  there is also the cognitive dissonance issue of them KNOWING that
I am going to dump them if they are not sexy and CONTINUING to talk to me and
get to know me.  the more they talk to me, the more I hook them into
interacting with me.  the more they get hooked, the greater the PAIN OF
SEPERATION (credit: RJ) when they eventually get EJECTED.  since they KNOW
ahead of time what will get them ejected and they are still talking, they are
either planning to get in line OR setting themselves up for pain.  either way,
after SOI and their acceptance of the terms, there will have to be some sort of
TEST of their compliance.  even listening to what they have to say after SOI
counts as a REWARD for their entering into a "relationship" with me.  hmm... I
will consider this more.

>I go on to tell her that other girls I know also
>like me, ask me out alot, (doesn't matter if it is true or not,
>but chick 'competition logic' will kick in, and it will scare
>your mark to act). 

the reason I don't use this is that MLTR is an integral part of my life.  if I
were to play this "chicks dig me" card, it would belittle the actual
relationship I have with MLTR.  the only problem with THAT is that I am
screening for MORE MLTRs :)  I don't give a fuck about ONS because I can get
laid ANY NIGHT within an hour of talking to the chick I am talking to... in the
WAY I want to with a chick that I WANT TO FUCK :)  a chick offering me ONS is
like a chick offering me a dollar bill.  I already HAVE dollar bills... what do
I want hers for?  of course, there are some chicks that are just so HOT that
you want to try them out, but barring that scenario, ONS can bring you much
more ANGUISH than the satisfaction that accompanies it... PLUS it is the SAME
SATISFACTION that I already get on a regular basis from MLTR. 

besides... it is OBVIOUS that chicks dig me because here SHE is, liking me
within 20 minutes of meeting me... what about the chicks that have experienced
me for days?  months?  years?  OH, she could only HOPE to be one of those! :)

for you, it is a good tactic though.

>Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>her last week, apparently).

I lost a rap to a low-self-esteem bitch that had a couple of relationships like
this as well.  I mean, I fucked her, but I didn't get to MLTR like I wanted
because she was SCARED that she wouldn't match up to the next bitch and that I
would NEXT her for no reason, like her exes did.  I tried to tell her I wanted
her for more than that, but she wasn't emotionally healthy enough to understand
or believe me.

>Ok, now Maniac has reached her head, and I take this deeper..
>I go on to tell her that I dont want just sex, I want rocks and gold
>I can get any girl in roppongi on a Saturday night and fuck her
>(not exactly true, but she doesnt know this.. goal is just to

she KNOWS that it happened to her VERY QUICKLY.  she ASSUMES she was not the
ONLY bitch to fall for you that quickly.  it is like reverse-social-proof. 
fucking a bitch FAST makes them think you can fuck other bitches FAST.

>'confirm' her worst fears so that she acts), but its not enough for
>me. I want connection, good sex, and romance, with an intelligent
>woman, and that is why I want to date you (psychicbabe).

nice line.  this is another thing I will consider.  talking-up MLTR to them.  
I never considered this either, MAINLY because if you tell a chick what you
want her to do then you never know if she is manipulating you by being that
way, or if she arrived there NATURALLY... on her own.  interesting, LOTS of
style-change material happening right around the new year :)

>Then all of the sudden, she asks me about HBass (the chick staying
>at my place over the holidays), and freaks out about it. I tell
>her that she already knows all this, and exactly what is her point
>here?

although I am a GREAT fan of "quoting", I find that there need to be times to
engage in it and times to NOT engage in it.  this will depend on what you want
with the chick.  it is the same way you can't go from being a CHUMP to a MAN in
a chick's eyes... but you CAN go from being a MAN into a CHUMP :)  if you start
out telling a chick that you have a girlfriend AND that you fuck her, you leave
yourself open for these pot-shots whenever chicks trip the fuck out and go into
their irrational rants from out of left-field.  all a bitch needs to know is
that you are "taken" so that you manage her relationship expectations.  any
more information and she feels like you will give her ALL the information. 
where does it stop?  are you going to tell her that you are fucking her?  that
you fucked her last night?  that you fucked her an hour before coming on this
date?  that you fucked YOUR WOMAN in her ass?  that she LIKES sucking dick? 
WHERE DOES IT STOP?

I ran into this problem with a chick where my relationship to her was BASED ON
trading current sex-stories.  when I got to the point where I didn't want to
tell her any more shit, she was EXPECTING me to tell her, and I realized that
if I wasn't telling her, and she wasn't telling me, then our "relationship" was
OVER.  before that, I had not realized how much I had compromised my position
by telling her CURRENT sex-shit.  think about it, and decide on your own LIMITS
to what you are willing to tell a chick about other chicks... besides, think
about the fact that she is going to KNOW that she will end up as STORIES to
other bitches right after you fuck her.  it will make her VERY self-conscious
about whatever she does with you and that could hinder her emotional states
tremendously.

>Then she stops again, and asks me if I am fucking her (maybe I
>should have said no..., but I had already said yes to her about this
>the first time I saw her)., she asks me why.. (I tell her because
>I am seeing her! like I told you the first time! I mean what do
>you expect?!?).
>
>She then puts on her bitch face, and talks in a stern voice,
>"then call me when you break her up, that is my decision, I am
>going home.".

THIS is retarded because she ALREADY knew that you were fucking her AND she
fucked you herself.  this is another problem with bitches having information
about other bitches.  they use it against themselves.  IMO, the purpose of her
knowing you have another girl or SEVERAL other girls is so she knows where she
stands in the RACE to be your MAIN BITCH.  if you are single, she has a good
chance at being that to you.  if you are "taken" she has NO CHANCE of being
that to you.  if you are SEEING bitches, then she has to COMPETE to be your #1.
 other than THAT, I think giving information about your other bitches is a
mistake...  I have made the SAME mistake up to this point, so I am not
crisicizing :)  however, I am changing that ASAP and I think you should
consider giving out information on a N2K basis (need to know).

besides, SHE is the one that NEEDS a fuck.  if it is not coming from YOU, a guy
she has fucked ALREADY and she LIKES how you did it or she wouldn't have come
back... she has to get it from a STRANGER whose sexual skills are in question
that might tie her up, fuck her in the ass or sell her to the highest bidder. 
bitches like to FRONT a lot about having ALL these sexual choices, but with all
the 8s, 9s, and 10s I have spoken to on an honest "one of the chicks" level,
they are ALL looking to have an EXCITING time, but not REALLY be in DANGER! 
you, OTOH have pussy AT HOME IN BED WAITING FOR YOU!  the only one to lose out
if she bails... is HER!  knowing that, I would have not even entertained her
bullshit OR called her on it, letting her know that I was getting laid tonight
REGARDLESS of whether SHE fucks or not.  that would take the fucking WIND out
of her sails :)

>I tell her I am planning to break her up (which is true) later, so
>it is nothing you should worry about. 

this, my friend :)  is a COP-OUT!  it is used VERY EFFECTIVELY by married men
to keep fucking their side-bitches, but WE are way above bullshit tactics like
this.  I commend you for thinking of this "on the fly", but PLEASE, PLEASE! 
hehe  I have MUCH more respect for you as a PUA than to hear some CRAP like
this from you :)  PLEASE think of something better for the next instance of a
chick trying to BLACKMAIL you into trading in a R-E-L-A-T-I-O-N-S-H-I-P where
you are getting EVERYTHING you want from a chick... for a ONS with HER! 
HAHAHAHAHAHA  >:)

I haven't run into a chick STUPID enough to try to disrespect my MLTR for being
with me... chicks have STARTED to say she is dumb for "letting" (as if she has
ANY say in the matter) her man fuck other chicks, and I have BROKEN THEIR
FUCKING ASSES listing the benefits that SHE is getting that they will most
likely NEVER have with a man... EVER!  and CERTAINLY don't have right now, or
they would not be talking to me in a bar... they would be with THEIR OWN MAN
conducting this FANTASY RELATIONSHIP that they are professing that my MLTR
should have :)  I have NEVER run into a chick that has even TRIED to break into
my relationship with MLTR because they KNOW I mean business.  all they can do
is become ANOTHER MLTR... and after they hear the QUALIFICATIONS, they KNOW
they can't even achieve THAT... only ONS and LJBF with me.  if some bitch EVER
suggested that I break up with MLTR in order to ONS her, I would  A) laugh in
her face and  B) immediately demand an EXPLANATION of the reasons why she
thinks she can knock MLTR out of the box AND make her perform ANY AND ALL
SKILLS that she CLAIMS to be better than MLTR at IMMEDIATELY!  put up or SHUT
THE FUCK UP!  the result would be the ONS ANYWAY, and she would still be LJBF
or NEXT because MLTR is NOT about sex... it is about compatability and I
PERSONALLY could not be with some bitch that needs to knock other chicks off in
order to gain status.  I gain status by BEING MYSELF and letting bitches make
INTELLIGENT, EDUCATED decisions to be with me.  any chick that wants to be with
me had better do the same.

>she gets upset, and starts
>screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
>just like her ex-bf, getting other girls while dating her, and how
>all guys just want sex..etc..

I would have told her "you wanna calm the fuck down?"  throwing tantrums and
making scenes are expressions of her ability to do ANYTHING in your presence. 
I personally don't tolerate that.

>Then she says.. ok, if you let me meet your GF at your house
>tonight, then I will let you have sex with me. [ha! I got her!]

ok.  thank God I happened to read the next line before I started typing this. 
I was JUST going to ask you WHY you are STILL letting her blackmail you into
fucking her... ESPECIALLY when she is the one that needs it and you don't :)

>I bounce back, and say, "what exactly makes you think I am
>desperate to have sex with you tonight?! Do you think I am
>just some stupid guy and you can manipulate me like that?
>No, you will not meet my GF, it is disrespectful to her to do
>that. You know the situation, it was clear to you from the
>beginning, and you accepted it. There is no more to talk about.
>I am not here only for sex, I can get that anywhere. Sex only
>of itself is of little value to me, I want more than that.

SWEET!  :)  break her fucking ASS maniac :)

>I then bring out the nuclear weapons! My tonality is very firm,
>and I eye fuck her, while telling her the following. First, I tell
>her that I already told her about my GF, she was clear about it
>right from the start, and she has NO excuse. Then I go on to tell
>her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
>that did NOT happen. So do NOT compare me to your ex. I am a
>different person, and EXCEPT better treatment than that if you
>ever want to see me again. She starts crying more, and hugging
>again.

ugh :/   fucking IDIOTS!   man, the shit some bitches put you through!  does
everyone SEE why we have to study this shit?

>I put her against wall, and tell her not to complain about me like
>I am her ex, I a am different person than he is.
>
>I tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>alone!

this is a good point.  I like to play it the other way:

ok... so now, you have told me that you want everything to be a 'perfect'
situation with a guy before making a move.  You want him to be ideal with
women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady... WHAT MAKES YOU THINK
HE WILL WANT YOU?   WHAT ARE YOU BRINGING TO THE TABLE THAT IS GOING TO MAKE A
MAN LIKE THAT CHOOSE YOU OVER ANY OTHER CHICK?

you wanna see some confusion?  you wanna see a bitch get BROKEN?  HAHAHAHA  >:)
 of course, I use this on chicks that I am just practicing on, because it
normally induces DEPRESSION, not horniness.  when they have to GO DEEP INSIDE
and dive BELOW THE SURFACE of their programming, they realize that they CAN NOT
TELL ME WHY A MAN WOULD WANT THEM!  they stall the fuck out dude :)  it's
amazing.  matter of fact, it's documented already.  look at my recent thread
with "telembe".  I let her say all this bullshit about what she wanted from a
guy in order to give up her virginity, then when she was finished talking about
what she WANTED, I asked her what she was OFFERING to a guy that was going to
give her all this committment and "love" and other bullshit and she said a
whole bunch of shit that ANY bitch can and WILL give to a man she likes.  she
might have THOUGHT she had something to offer a guy that was going to seperate
her from the pack, but she doesn't.  even GOOD PUSSY can't get a bitch any
credit because there are LOTS of bitches that can fuck and suck like pros...
elites AND sub-elites.  telembe NEVER told us what seperates her from the rest
of the bitches that might make a MAN like the one she wants even LOOK HER WAY! 
the reason is that there is NO reason! :)  bitches are programmed that MEN want
them... but they are NEVER told WHY.  the reason is that men like to FUCK and
get their dicks sucked.  they also like companionship and cooking and cleaning
and for a girl to look good on their arm so they can feel accomplished around
their buddies.  chicks THINK they are ENTITLED to a good man... but the GOOD
MEN... are picking GOOD WOMEN!  if they were SHINING like they think they are,
they would have been scooped up already and married or whatever they were
looking for because some guy would have spotted her and said "I'm not going to
let her go for ANYTHING" and she would be happy... at least according to her
programming.  OH, how I LOVE to see a bitch's face while she TRIES AND TRIES to
dig up ANY reason why a guy as great as the one she claims to want would EVER
choose her over any other bitch :)  the JOY the JOY that I feel as this POMPOUS
BITCH breaks the fuck down RIGHT IN FRONT OF MY FACE! :)  of course since I
broke her, I keep talking to her and ease her back to a decent state of being
and let her know that she can take steps to make herself into the woman that a
man would want, but she has to really KNOW HERSELF and KNOW MEN in order to
make an intelligent decision.  I am not into depressing chicks... unless they
TRULY DESERVE IT for all the depression they have caused men throughout their
tenure as FINE bitches :)  also, I have no desire to BREAK bitches and leave
them like that.  that just makes it WORSE for ALL OF US looking for FINE, yet
DECENT chicks.

>she cries, and says that is so true, that is her problem, she never
>takes the chance and loses out because she doesn't make the
>move on taken guys. Then I run my 'take chances routine' (if you take
>a chance, in the end, the result is usually good, but if you don't,
>just you get left behind, by yourself).. 

nice.  I like that one... emphasizing loss and loneliness.

>she cries more, says she
>needs to take the chance, and doesnt want to be alone.

she's done :)  nice work.  land her!

>She says she has to be careful, that all guys want just sex, and
>bitches about this for about 30 seconds.

as opposed to what?  what does she WANT guys to want?

>Now I start the 'you need me, I dont need you..you think I just want
>only sex, then you dont understand me at all.. if you think that is
>what I am only, then you do NOT deserve me.. I do no need you to go out
>with me if that is what you think I am.. I want connection, sex,
>passion, and closeness.. and if you haven't figured that out about
>me yet, then get another guy, because you dont understand me at all..

OK OK OK... you've CONVINCED me maniac :)  that's some good shit right there :)
 starting NOW, I am pitching for MLTR ONLY.  bitches that want ONS or LJBF will
get what they deserve from me... which isn't much.  I LOVE this idea of dissing
her for claiming that you are looking for ONS... or even just a "bootie-call"
type relationship :)  I love it.  I would feel so PROUD getting on her like
this.  sweet!  EXTREMELY congruent!  nice play!  this is going into my style,
starting RIGHT NOW!  :)

>I am doing this, because I know the left (logic) and right (emotions,
>passion) are fighting each other..they have been all night. Because the
>left doesn't accept the logic of the situation, but I know the right side
>dying for a shag,..she is trying to rationaize going out with a taken guy,
>but I have gotten her so excited tonight, that she needs that fuck.

THIS is the reason I never learned any of this shit until recently.  my
caveman-kino style before this involved ZERO talking.  totally kino and kissing
and PHYSICAL seduction with domineering EYE-CONTACT.  there was NO INFORMATION
for the left side to process at all.  EVERYTHING went STRAIGHT to the chick's
right side, and her left had to try to process the EMOTIONS and turn them into
a story that she could understand... in the meantime, she is PHYSICALLY falling
for the kino and wanting MORE AND MORE until we are fucking.  I never HAD to
talk to chicks before OR after fucking them because my PHYSICAL ATTACK is so
DEVASTATING!  I would just take them over PHYSICALLY and their right brains
would do ALL the work and the left would struggle to understand, but eventually
succumb to the onslaught!  ARG ARG! :)

thanks for explaining that to me :)

>As I touch her side of face, she goes doggy look, I kiss her, and she
>gets like screambabe, panting. I put leg between her, she widens, goes nuts
>totally. I ask her she likes me (in a tell her sort of way' you like me..'),
>she replies 'yes'. I say (stare her down) .. she asks "what should I do?"
>I say in a very strn fatherly voice while staring her down 4 inches from
>her head.. you will follow me..that is what you will do.. and you will do
>what I say. 'she says, 'I will'. I tongue her down more, run her crotch,
>she almost cums right there, then I take her to a love hotel (her first
>time!), no resistance what so ever.

interesting.  what just happened here?  did you somewhere dictate to her that
the terms of her being "your bitch" is that she has to sumbit to you fully? 
are you getting a verbal confirmation of that from her?  or is something else
going on... like she just plain UNDERSTANDS that you can move her to passions
that make her WANT to cum and that you are going to take her there and over the
edge?

another point... what do you guys think of foreplay on a chick.  he mentions
that she almost came right there... do you think it is good to get her to the
EDGE and leave her there so she is so horny, she will do ANYTHING for you to
make her cum, OR to give her an orgasm right there in her clothes to
demonstrate your sexual mastery over her?  personally, I am into the sexual
mastery thing because I notice a newfound RESPECT from a chick that has had
guys on top of her NAKED, fucking her for all they were worth and she never
came from it, and then I am just doing kino on her and fingering her and she
cums from just that.  do you think that making the chick cum on herself makes
her want sex MORE or want it LESS since she just got off?  take into account
that chicks are multi-orgasmic and that they feel sexier after cumming, not
DRAINED like guys.

>As I am fucking her, I am putting things in her head, like D.Shades reports.
>I tell her as she is screaming it feels deeper and deeper, closer and
>closer. She is going nuts will I am fucking her.

I need to reasearch this.  is this more right-brain, left-brain shit where her
left-brain is shut down because of the FIREWORKS that are going off in her mind
because of the sex, leaving her wide open to suggestion?  if you have any links
for this, please post.

>I stare her down, and I tell her you need me (during sex), she says yes.
>I tell her from now on you will follow me, and do what I say. She says
>'yes, I will'. I continue doing her, she says "it feels SO good, I really
>need that, I really want it, i love you inside me!".. she is fucking like a
>wild animal, loud voice, shouting and screaming, oh, I want it, give it
>to me, I want to come!

more of the same?

>Then she tells me anything is ok as long as I dont hate her..she doesnt
>want me to hate her. She wants me to hold/hug her, she cries a bit, then is
>ok again (seems to be thinking of her old bf she says). I touch her
>more, face goes totally doggy look, and finger her, she goes nuts, we start
>fucking again.

the "I don't want you to hate me" thing is very important in the D/s
relationship... not that you set this up like that, but that is the MAIN
incentive for her to follow your lead... that she does NOT want you to hate her
and CERTAINLY not to banish her.  when that is TRULY first and foremost in her
brain, she will regulate HERSELF and place herself in-line with your thinking
and what YOU want her to be.  she also won't try to blackmail you anymore
because she KNOWS it gets on your nerves and all THAT will do is get her
EJECTED sooner rather than later :)

>Her back is on the bed, and I am fucking her missionary, her legs are
>spread and wide in the air, which I am holding. I tell her "see, I control
>you, 

hehe ok... this is a little FAR-FETCHED for me at this point, but I have not
researched it yet :)  I DO like the next line though.

>I go deep in your body because it is the one way to reach you totally
>deep in your mind which no one else can do. 

interesting

>By conquering your body, I can
>conquer your mind (then I drill her a bit more after I finish the sentence so
>she goes more crazy). I play with your body because it lets me control
>your mind (then drill her some more..ha, it is like the ultimate form of
>reward hypnosis).

IS there such a thing as reward hypnosis?  links please? :)

>I ask her, so why you like me. She says she says, you are decisive and
>sometimes I am indecisive, so you make it easy for me. I want the guy
>to make it easy for me to decide what to do (important clue here Maniac!
>maybe most chicks are like this! Maybe this too is where I fucked up
>with HB Geek!)

I have heard this a lot too... only thing is that there is a lot of
RESPONSIBILITY that comes with telling a chick what to do, and if the VALUE of
owning her is not sufficient for me, I don't give a fuck WHAT she does enough
to want to lead her to a good time.

>Moral of the story.. keep your ground.. call all chick bullshit DIRECTLY.
>Make the chick risk fear losing the relationship if she doesn't capitulate
>and chances are she will back down, in spite of how it looks (and I could
>do this BECAUSE I had other choices.. another reason to be fucking
>several chicks at once). As well, it seemed that she was giving me all the
>bullshit in part because she WANTED me to call her on it, and then fuck her
good
>at the end of the night, which I obliged.

chicks give you shit-tests to find out if you are stronger than them and see
HOW you are going to control them.  chicks like the way I control them because
I NARROW their choices for them, but STILL make them choose.  they can choose
the path of ULTIMATE SATISFACTION, or they can choose the path of EJECTION and
being back on the dating scene meeting the SAME LAME GUYS every night :)

you had told her you had a girlfriend, but she seems to have NEEDED to know
that she really COULDN'T have you all to herself and that you really DIDN'T
NEED to fuck her that night or EVER.  you stuck to your guns (after letting her
get to you for a while :-) and she eventually ran out of logic and got
overridden with kino and gave up the fucking pussy like she came there to do :)

>Constructive comments/opinions welcome!
>
>Maniac High
>http://www.pickupguide.com

EXCELLENT!  keep up the GOOD WORK dude!  :)

---
From: erosla77@aol.com (ErosLA77)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 30 Dec 2000 20:12:47 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

>Subject: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit
special!]
>From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
>Date: Fri, Dec 29, 2000 10:37 PM
>Message-id: <92jvre$obh@nnrp1.deja.com>

>)this chick is a very highly educated, driven, professional
> career woman and earns likely a big 6 figure salary
>b)she is very mature, focused and spends all day in her office
> surrounded by sharks and other pirrhana type scumbag characters

 She's got to be in control ALL DAY LONG at work. Small wonder then, with a
man, she wants to fully SURRENDER control and be made to submit.  It's like all
those super-powerful Congressmen and Judges and the like who LOVE going to get
pissed-on and whipped by some Madame Dominatrix. 

>I regroup my thoughts.

 I admire your ability to do this in the field, Maniac. As you think about it,
what do you do internally to re-set yourself and keep yourself in a good frame
of mind when all this shit throws your way?

>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations

   Metahpor is a POWERFUL tool to move folks from a fixed perception to a new
one. Please, share your story!

> Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>her last week, apparently).

Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with fucking; it feels
good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the vulnerabilities.  So
when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which overcomes the
potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. She's worried about pain,
so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not only losing
out on the pleasure of screwing, BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out that if
she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even WORSE
crack-up.

  Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.

>he gets upset, and starts
>screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
>just like her ex-bf,

See? The fear of the pain of being hurt just like her ex-BF hurt her is now
rearing its ugly head.  She doesn't seem like a very emotionally stable person
in ANY event, let alone having just been dumped by a guy.  

>Then I go on to tell
>her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
>that did NOT happen

 Sharp thinking. Again, what do you do internally to keep your state solid and
your thinking sharp? THAT process internally is of great value, even more than
the specifics you share.  The specifics are like handing guys fish; good for a
nice meal and of value. But  how you get to the mind-set is TEACHING someone
HOW to fish so they can eat for life. 

>I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>alone!

 Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to her her
"ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she can then
accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!  

   Excellent...Maniac, I don't give a damn WHAT my orthodox SS followers say,
this is BRILLIANT stuff and I'd be proud to be your wing or have you as mine,
ANY FUCKIN' DAY of the week! Sir, I salute you!

>Now what I am doing with all the above, is not arguing the logic (too
>much)
>of this, because, of course she is right, and I know this.

 Actually, you ARE not arguing the logic, but you are USING the logic...HER
logic..HER way of viewing things.....pointing out WHY and HOW she loses and
what will happen if she doesn't stop it.   It's all centered around losing and
WHY she loses, based on what she has told you.  It IS logical, FROM her point
of view.  

 Great, Great stuff...sir, I salute you!

-----

From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]
Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2000 12:03:54 GMT

Replies to various people about psychicbabe:

Answers to various questions:

Was psychicbabe british, or Japanese?
She was a brit of Japanese ancestry (ie. she
looked 'j', but thought, acted and had an
english accent like a brit). This in my
opinion made it harder, because brit women
are so fucking F A T, and she was so
slender, sexy and attractive (and she dressed
to kill) compared to all of them. Lots of guys were
hitting on her (and she said she always got hit
on, and hated it.. trick was to not make it look
like a 'hit').

Why not a white chick? Well, I had the chance...
but.. at the conference where I met her, EVERY
brit. white chick there was in serious blimp bulge
territory.. very scary. Why is it so many caucasian
women are so FAT?

It was funny though, because something like 8 guys
(I counted) tried to hit on psychicbabe the night
I PU'd her. One guy was pretty good, the rest were
total AFC's..it was rather funny.

Re: Rocks -vs- gold.. how I use it (yes, it is
Jake's metephor. For RJ, search the original post
on fastseduction.com. It is also on pickupguide.com
someplace (if not it will be there in about 2 weeks,
I am revising the page this week). Basically, I intro
it as follows:
After chick says bullshit about wanting to go to
dinner and be friends or shit for 6 months before
becoming a GF, I say: Actually, I dont go to dinner
or stuff like that with ladies who are not my GF
CHick:  gasps!
Maniac: see, going to dinner, is an important step
in a relationship for me. I only share it with someone
special
chick: Huh?
Maniac: Well, let me put it this way, do you ever
sleep with a guy who is just your friend, or dont
care about?
chick: of course not!
Maniac: well, why do you think a guy should do any
different then?
Maniac: See, let me tell you a story. You ever hear
about 'rocks & gold'?
chick: no? what is it?
Maniac: Well, Relationships are valuable things.
And each partner is looking for something. It is like
diamonds (rocks) and gold. Both are valuable.

But women prefer diamonds to gold (usually), and
men prefer gold to diamonds (usually). Of course,
both are important, especially in a long term
relationship, but if a woman could choose, she would
prefer the diamonds  first, and the man would
prefer the gold  first. right?

chick: yeah, probably

Maniac: And (generally), a man can accept gold
without the diamonds, and a woman can accept
diamonds without any gold.

So in a relationship, a woman is mining for
diamonds, while the man is mining for gold.
While they are in the mine together, the
guy gives diamonds he finds to the woman, and
the woman gives the gold she finds, to the man.

But if you give a woman gold only, or a man
diamonds only.. neither is likely to be
very happy, and the relationship will soon
fall apart. In short, an exchange of sorts
takes place in a successful relationship.

And also, if a man expects just gold (sex),
but doesnt want to give her diamonds
(relationship & the mushy stuff), then she
will dump him fairly soon, because he is
playing/using her just for sex..

And if a woman expects just diamonds (walks,
attention, nice dinners, movies..etc) without
giving some gold (sex), then he (if he has any
clue about how to deal with women, though many
men do not, especially in North America) will
dump her because she is using/playing him just
for his personality.

A guy taking a chick to dinners, buying shit
and giving nice walks without sex is THE SAME
as a guy sleeping with a girl, and then kicking her
out right after the fuck is over. (chick says:
'yelch!'. Yes, thats right, and for the guy,
just dinners and buying shit is 'yelch', with
no sex, and no attention is exactly the same.

Because a woman will go to free dinner with
almost any guy, it has no value to me. But
I am like you, I want attention, and I want
to be made to feel special.

And although a girl will go to nice free dinners
with almost anyone, I also know that a girl will
not sleep with anyone. So I know if she does with me,
then it means she thinks I am important. And if
she wont, then it means she doesnt care about me
at all, so I really dont need to see her again,
I will just go find another girl.

Maybe you might think it is unusual for a guy
to think this way, but it is just my way.

See, I dont want to be played. Guys are always
getting played by girls for nice dinners, long
talks on the phone, and for their personalities.
It is the SAME as a girl being used for sex.
So I am happy to give plenty her diamonds, but at
the same time, I dont want to be played, so
I also expect her to want to give me gold.
And if she doesn't, it means she doesnt care about
me, is using me, or it means I am being played,
or I am stupid.

As well, experience has also showed me that
'friends first' almost NEVER results in a
relationship. I mean how many of your BFs were
your friend first (chick usually replies..uh,
zero).

Exactly, so that is why I never play 'friends
first'. Friends first means diamonds for the
lady, and no gold for the guy. That is like
the guy saying (ok, lets fuck for 6 months,
and if its good, we can go to dinner, and go
out, and you can be my GF). Would you like
that (chick: yelch!!).

Exactly.. so that is why it is far better,
that the lady meet me, get to know me, and
then I expect her to be smart enough to know
to take that chance THEN (or reject it, and I will
go get another lady) when it is offered to her.

So that is why I expect things that way in a
relationship with a lady.

After this, a chick is (usually) quite impressed,
or surprised and doesnt know what to say..

[When I recited this to psychicbabe, she actually told me
she was very impressed, that I understood relationships
so well ;-) ]

Had I been smart, I would have used it on HB
geek, and laid her, but after that failure I
thought about it, and then when the same situation
came up with Psychicbabe this week, I knew what
to do..

Ok, now on to other comments..

RJ writes
>Maniac writes:
> >I regroup my thoughts.
>
>  I admire your ability to do this in the field, Maniac. As you think
about it,
> what do you do internally to re-set yourself and keep yourself in a
good frame
> of mind when all this shit throws your way?

A couple things.. first, this PARTICULAR chick is of no importance
to me, because I am (likely) seeing 3 others this week. So it is
not as risky to me to be firm, and keep my ground.

Another important fact, is the way chick's brains are usually
wired. For a
chick, once she likes a given guy, it is hard for her to immediately
switch to another guy. it is far MORE risky, because a chick (unlike
men), usually cannot switch to another guy, once she ALREADY
likes a given guy (story is different BEFORE you got her to
like you..then SHE has more power than you).

So I play on this, and as a result I dont feel nervous/scared at all,
because there is far more to risk to her, than to risk to me. Because
she is stuck to me, but I am not stuck to her. (this also is why
'jerks' can get away with so much shit on any given chick, and why
she will tolerate it.. because her brain has now got her focussed
on THAT guy, and it is now a choice (in her mind), between him (and
his bullshit... or being alone (sure she can get another guy in 10
minutes, but she cannot build those nice feelings of 'attachment'
in 10 minutes.. that gives us men power, once we realize this).

Two, I am generally a very balanced level
headed person, and dont take any of this personally (as you already
know, RJ). Three (in this case), I had
already laid this chick, so I didnt care really if I laid her again
or not.. I already conquered her, and she (and I) already knew that.

If it is a new chick, sometimes, I get more nervous/fucked up (see
HB Geek). I am trying to keep my senses more when this happens

> > Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
> >problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
> >her last week, apparently).
>
> Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with
fucking; it feels

Not sure about this, I think she just simply wanted the fuck, but
wanted to feel she was important to me, and she didnt want to just
get played..

> good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the
vulnerabilities.  So
> when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which
overcomes the
> potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. She's worried
about pain

yes, thats right.

> so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not
only losing
> out on the pleasure of screwing,

Not really. I actually made it clear to her that I didnt care if
she bang me or not. The point was that she had to give her mind
to me, and respect me, and follow me (whether that is bang me,
make her take off her clothes in the window for me, or do my
dishes..whatever.. its not the banging that is important, it is
the submission to me that counts, and what she needs to give me
if she wants my attention at all).

> BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
> believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out
that if
> she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even
WORSE
> crack-up.

Yes

>   Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.
>
> >he gets upset, and starts
> >screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
> >just like her ex-bf,
>
> See? The fear of the pain of being hurt just like her ex-BF hurt her
is now
> rearing its ugly head.  She doesn't seem like a very emotionally
stable person
> in ANY event, let alone having just been dumped by a guy.

No, she is not stable at all. I think though, it is because she
bottles it up all day, to be the 'office bitch' that she has to
be in the daytime. This chick lives for her work. She has no other
life.

>
> >Then I go on to tell
> >her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
> >that did NOT happen
>
>  Sharp thinking. Again, what do you do internally to keep your state
solid and
> your thinking sharp? THAT process internally is of great value, even
more than
> the specifics you share.  The specifics are like handing guys fish;
good for a
> nice meal and of value. But  how you get to the mind-set is TEACHING
someone
> HOW to fish so they can eat for life.

Actually, the specifics are important I think. This is why lay/field
reports with details are so important. I think really shitty on my
feet. I really suck.. bad.

But if I have had that same experience before (with another chick),
or been in that same situation before, and
either succeeded (or failed, and then thought about how to handle it
right the next time), then I will handle it correctly this time.

I really believe in field experience. I have alot... really alot.
so I have seen many of these situations before. It is like chess,
or a foreign language. If you've been there before, and worked out
a solution, then you know what to do. You MUST get field experience.
It is CRUCIAL. And each time you fail, you go home, and see what
you did right/wrong, and what you would do if the same situation
happened again. This is why I also post the fuckup as well as
the lay reports.. they are very valuable to me in gathering my
thoughts and forcing me to think about what I did right/wrong,
as well as listening to the other's comments about them on this
NG.

I also look at the other's reports as well, and learn about
situations, and ask myself for each one, if it happened to me,
what would I do/how would I handle it. Eventually, after doing it
for a couple years (I have been at this in ernest for about 2
years now), you get better at it. Learning situations in PU, is
like learning the words of a foreign language, and how to connect
them all together.. how to move from a bad situation..to a good
one to get the chick in a horny state..

Also, I keep in mind alot about what MrSex4uNYC says about attitude,
and when I get stuck, I ask myself, what would NYC tell me right
now about this situation. He is very congruent, and if you think
things this way, it is easy to be clear what is the right way or
wrong way.

> >I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
> >with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
> >with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
> >and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
> >unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
> >alone!
>
>  Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to
her her
> "ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she
can then
> accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!

Yes, basically that is the idea. I am not sure that it means I am
an authority, but its more, to convey that she is clueless, she
is wrong, so to listen to herself will make her fuck up even more..
..so maybe she had better listen to me instead, and then she wont
fuckup as much.. basically that is the idea..

>    Excellent...Maniac, I don't give a damn WHAT my orthodox SS
followers say,

I didn't get this.. What are orthodox SS followers, and I had no
idea they were saying anything about this.. I really dont understand
what you mean here..

> >Now what I am doing with all the above, is not arguing the logic (too
> >much)
> >of this, because, of course she is right, and I know this.
>
>  Actually, you ARE not arguing the logic, but you are USING the
logic...HER
> logic..HER way of viewing things.....pointing out WHY and HOW she
loses and
> what will happen if she doesn't stop it.   It's all centered around
losing and
> WHY she loses, based on what she has told you.  It IS logical, FROM
her point
> of view.

Yes, basically that is the idea. What I meant was, is that her main
point is that she wants a monogamous BF, and doesn't want to be played.
But, I am playing her, and she (at some level) realizes that, so
in essense, her gut feel about this is totally correct.

But I am playing her desire for the fuck, and her fear of losing
out, which lets me bypassing her gut feel that she is being
played, and then I can get her to fuck anyways.

Good followups everyone!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

-----

From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]
Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2001 12:10:23 GMT

  "Dohn Joe"  wrote:
>  wrote in message news:92n7b96
@nnrp1.deja.com...
> [snip]
>
> The more I think of it, the more this seems to be a great PU.
> I think the PU in England is the gist of your piece of work.
>o I'd be glad to see more
> details on how you picked her up in England, that's the hardest work. How
> did you stand up the crowd? How did you make it not look like a PU?

I was using psychological 'jujitsu' (use the strength of your
opponant, against themself). There is a field report from 2 months
ago, that outlines the PU (check fastseduction.com archives).
Basically, I met her at a conference. I didnt talk to her much.
Then I followed her onto a bus that was taking us to the next
meeting place. A guy was hitting on her, and he sat with her.
I sat on the seat in front bymyself.

She (like most british bitches), started complaining about how
she hates men, and other bullshit. The guy on the bus with her
is taking this/agreeing with it (if I remember right).

I just turned around (and tonality and eye contact here is crucial),
and just tell her in a VERY authoritative voice, slowly.. "perhaps
you have just not met the right man yet, one you understands you,
deeply, and completely. But.. you never know the future.. now do you..
I used killed eye contact, spoke slowly, and continued "perhaps
if you open your mind more, you might find him.. by surprise, without
even expecting it, because often, that is the way it usually is..see"

Psychicbabe went "maybe", and then started more manhating bitching.

I then described the kind of man she wanted "one you could rely on,
but at the same time, be mysterious, and exciting in some unexpected
ways, because he just knew how to reach you deep inside you, and
your mind.. that is what your looking for..isnt' it?"

Psychicbabe: yes,

{continue PU, bunches of stuff from the ManiacPlan, if I remember
right}

The key here was the tonality and Eye-Fuck contact. That is what
did it more than the words I used. I just totally crushed her
with it..

> How did
> you get past her "bitch office" shield? I'm asking especially because, as I
> picture this woman, it would seem pretty intimidating for me to approach
> her.

I had the attitude that she obviously had never met a man that
knew how to give it to her right, which means that she obviously
needed ME far more than I needed her. That mindset made it easy.

> I admire your ability to take her from there into total submission.
> existing relationship than guys. That's why many (even HOT ones) find
> themselves in a dead end - boring or abusive - relationship, love to
> complain about it to whoever they find to listen, yet are unable to step out

EXACTLY!!

> of it. That's why the first fuck is hard - after that she is bound
> emotionally to you. You see,

>Women's sexuality is DISSOLVED in them.

Yes! you understand it!! (true for most, but not all chicks though,
some just like sport fucking, like we do)

> GREAT words to remember for all us RAFCs when we feel like beating the walls
> after a fuckup... I myself am so darn depressed when coming back after an
> unsuccessful encounter with a chick. Yes, each field experience is one more
> lesson

Yes, do NOT underestimately field experience. It is SO important.
I fucked up TONS (see all the fuckup reports I used to post a couple
years ago on ASF), and I still fuckup alot (see HBGeek, or HockeyBabe).
Over on cliff's list they say it takes 2..4 years to get good
at something, and 10 years to be a master. I TOTALLY agree.
I have only been at this for 2.. 2 1/2 years. And the more I learn,
the more I realize I still need to learn.. There is still TONS that
I dont know yet.

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

----
From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:08 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

I, for one, am really GLAD to see a post from RJ that has helped me move
forward in MY game :)  not that I am an ingrate hehe... his contribution to all
this is UNDENIABLE to begin with and if I hadn't stumbeled onto his site, I
would have still been using my caveman tactics and my MENTAL seduction game
would still be lacking.  as much as I appreciate his contribution to the
seduction game in general, I had been disappointed with all the flaming and
nonsense that he and others had/have been involved with because I thought that
this NG was BASED on USEFUL interaction between him and the rest of us, but I
found that not to be the case :(  not that ANYONE gives a fuck what I have to
say about this, but I wanted to back up into the PAST to make it clear that I
appreciate RJ's PERSONAL contribution to the NG TODAY.

In article <20001230151247.26801.00001467@ng-fi1.aol.com>, erosla77@aol.com
(ErosLA77) writes:

>>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations
> 
>   Metahpor is a POWERFUL tool to move folks from a fixed perception to a new
>one. Please, share your story!

I have been doing this without identifying it:

A) find out her perception (marriage, monogamy, sucking dick VS kissing...)
B) "quote" her a story illustrating a chick that saw things a DIFFERENT way
(the way I want HER to see things) and benefitted GREATLY from it (she is still
with me, she got married to the guy she wanted, she gained inner peace and
self-love...)
C) watch her AGREE with something that she just minutes ago BELIEVED was
incorrect, or not for her.

the most fascinating part is (C) because I didn't realize my powers of
validation, pacing then LEADING had developed so strongly.  this is partially
because I am an empath and can FEEL when a chick moves into different emotional
states so I can relate to her from within her own state and effectively "vulcan
mind-meld" with her, turning the TWO of us into a SINGLE, functioning entity so
that I can dictate for US... to a degree.

a frequent situation is chicks asking me if I am single.  basically, I explain
to them that I am in an "open" relationship.  they practically INVARIABLY
disrespect my MLTR for being stupid. "how can she go for that?" "I would have
dumped you" "I would never let a man see other women"...  sooooo :)  I let them
go on and on and get it all out and completely ENTRENCH themselves in the DREAM
of them being with a man like me AND dumping me or CHANGING me or whatever
their BULLSHIT FANTASIES are at the time.  THEN I go into the BENEFITS of being
MY PRIMARY relationship... :)  when I stack up the LIST of BENEFITS and it
stacks HIGHER than those bitches have in their OWN RELATIONSHIPS RIGHT NOW,
they start thinking.  they think about what LITTLE they really have in their
relationships that MY MLTR is getting.  they think about the TRUST and
COMPANIONSHIP between us that they DON'T HAVE with their borefriends.  they
think about how she is SEXUALLY SATISFIED... DAILY if she wants it.  she has
someone to give her the REAL DEAL on how men are and what we want from
chicks... not someone that's going to keep playing her until he is finished
fucking her.  they ALSO see how the other bitches (like them in the near
future) come and go and MLTR CONSTANTLY receives the benefits of being with a
man that does EVERYTHING for her that she could want... for the MERE price of
NOT bailing because I fuck other chicks :)  once I break it down to them, ALLLL
I see on their faces is ENVY.  matter of fact, they tend to look EMBARRASSED
when I ask THEM about THEIR relationships.  oh, that reminds me... the bitches
that DON'T HAVE A MAN AT ALL fare the WORST in these situations.  my MLTR has
NEVER-ENDING SATISFACTION... they have STORIES of what they WOULD DO... IF
they could get a man AT ALL!  :)

chicks would rather have 20% of a WINNER than 100% of a LOSER!

>> Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>>her last week, apparently).
>
>Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with fucking; it
feels
>good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the vulnerabilities.  So
>when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which overcomes the
>potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. 

wow!  VERY powerful :)  I had really considered these to be apples and
oranges... pain of emotions after sex and pain of LOSS of the individual. 
however, discomfort is discomfort.  I quit giving UTILITY to this PIVOT I was
using because I realized she had ZERO self-esteem and not many other redeeming
qualities other than her looks.  she went from LJBF to NEXT overnight.  I had
been using her for a pivot because of her looks, but her lack of personality
started to wear on me and finally, she had to go.  no more hanging out, no more
phone calling, no more help with her love-life... nothing... cold turkey. 
completely FORGOT about her.  about a month or so later, the holiday season
comes around and she  A) calls me  B) tells me she bought me something for
christmas (I bought her NOTHING, not even a CARD and didn't bother to get one
when she told me she bought me something)  C) tells me she wants to bring it TO
my house, and  D) shows up with gift in hand, READY to socialize and spend time
with me.  

this is the SAME bitch that NEVER went in her purse to even OFFER to throw in
money when I used to use her for a pivot.  I didn't mind paying for her though
because the benefits I got from being out with an attractive chick that KNOWS I
am out to get OTHER bitches and facilitates that was well worth it :)  hehe... 
too bad for her, MLTR was over and I received her gift, talked to her for a
while (where she told me her recent "relationship" blew the fuck up in her face
:-) and then ejected her to keep having fun with MLTR.

I have been using outfoxer's style of letting bitches get involved in bullshit
relationships, TELLING THEM the relationships are bullshit then letting them
fall FLAT on their faces and come CRAWLING back to me :)  I just haven't added
the part yet where I get indignant that they are giving sex to CHUMPS that use
them like BITCHES and throw them away.  hehe it is fun enough at this point
just to hear about their FAILURES from the horses' mouths and see the sad looks
on their faces, while I am CONSTANTLY SMILING :)

what you described is BASICALLY what happened to her, except NOT in the sexual
content, but in the companionship content.  she THOUGHT she had a solid
position with me as my pivot, so she didn't feel like paying for anything
because she thought I NEEDED her, not WANTED her.  as soon as I didn't want her
anymore and dumped her from LJBF to NEXT, she was OK with it UNTIL her
relationship BACKFIRED... THEN she decides she wants to get back in good with
ME, which she can't do because I don't give a fuck about her and except for
looks, she can't compete with MLTR AT ALL!

the pain of loneliness overrides the emotional pain of sex without
committment... fascinating :)

>She's worried about
>pain, so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not only
>losing out on the pleasure of screwing, BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
>believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out that if
>she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even WORSE
>crack-up.
>
>  Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.

ok, this is interesting too.  "this is why you fucked up with your ex and I
feel the same way about that particular topic".  you are FORECASTING her
EJECTION unless she changes her ways.  she is still WITH YOU and has a chance
to do the right thing instead of getting ejected.  she already knows how it
feels to BE ejected by her EX and doesn't WANT to go through that pain AGAIN
with you.  you dictate to her HOW she could have avoided it with her EX and she
learns how to avoid it with you and gets in line.  this is another reason why
DICTATING what you REQUIRE from chicks is good, because they have the roadmap
to success or FAILURE with you.  as long as you have demonstrated personality
AND value BEFORE getting to this with her, she will be in a state of "how can I
get my hands on this guy... and KEEP him?" and then you will tell her what she
needs to do to be CONSIDERED amongst your TOP chicks and then is is up to her
to either fulfill her womanly duties or... as you predicted... get ejected and
feel the PAIN OF SEPERATION all over again with someone that she ALREADY knows
she WANTS to be with... WHATEVER the cost.

everyone has their price.  I find, most times, chicks are TALKING with no
EXPERIENCE.  a chick told me that she dumped her borefriend because he laughed
at her.  I told her that the sex must not have been good because otherwise she
would have had to use more than THAT to justify dumping an entire relationship.
 she CLAIMED that sex had nothing to do with her decision and that he didn't
RESPECT her was why she dumped him.  I told her that if the sex had been what
it is SUPPOSED to be... I GUARANTEE her that she would NOT have thrown THAT
away because of some laughing and disrespect.  I also proceeded to laugh at her
AND disrespect her IN HER FACE and told her I don't care because we are not
dating... she can't DUMP ME!   she never ADMITTED that I was right... BUT... by
the end of the conversation, she was asking me WHAT SHE SHOULD DO TO MAKE HER
LOVE LIFE BETTER!  :/  gotcha!

>>I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>>alone!
>
> Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to her her
>"ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she can then
>accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!  

yes.  I really have not been making the MOST of pacing and leading.  I have
been seeing where they ATTACH THEMSELVES to my way of thinking and see me as an
authority.  I have not used this to MAKE POLICY for them... merely to open
their minds and get them to think more efficiently.  you are right though. 
once you capture them... LEAD THEM!  make SOME efficient use of your new
followers... even if you were only practicing or passing time by capturing them
:)

excellent post :)

------

From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:10 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

In article <92n7b96@nnrp1.deja.com>, maniac_high@yahoo.com writes:

>After chick says bullshit about wanting to go to
>dinner and be friends or shit for 6 months before
>becoming a GF, I say: Actually, I dont go to dinner
>or stuff like that with ladies who are not my GF
>CHick:  gasps!
>Maniac: see, going to dinner, is an important step
>in a relationship for me. I only share it with someone
>special
>chick: Huh?
>Maniac: Well, let me put it this way, do you ever
>sleep with a guy who is just your friend, or dont
>care about?
>chick: of course not!

[lots of good use of Jake's shit snipped]

this is interesting, though I couldn't tell if this is something you are GOING
to do, or something you DID already.  either way, IF you are congruent, this
will serve you well as an alternate form of screening.  most of the time, I
screen by ASKING chicks shit and listening to their answers while watching
their faces and body-language.  another way to do it is to basically DICTATE to
them what I need to even CONSIDER being with a chick in any capacity
whatsoever.  most of the time I don't do this though because I can tell already
that the chick is worthless.  I usually get into DICTATION when she asks me
about myself.  am I attached?  what do I look for in a woman? etc.  THEN, since
she asked, I get into the reasons I have chosen women in the past and why I am
still with them in the present.  as I do that, I lay down my laws WITHOUT
telling the chick I am talking to that she needs to get in line with this shit
or get the fuck out of my face.  I have had a couple of chicks blow themselves
out after this.

I was talking to a chick that I know from YEARS ago that started calling me
again and talking about nothing.  I tolerated her for an hour or so on two
different days  A) because I was bored and  B) because through her speech
patterns and recurring ideas, I was learning if she was worth anything to me at
all, considering I get everything I want or need from MLTR in the first place,
she only had a VERY LIMITED use to me, as GOOD backup-pussy.  MLTR is smarter,
more interesting, more fun, less psychotic... basically TRUMPED her in all
areas, so this chick had NO CREDIT with me whatsoever.  I ended up getting into
PRECISELY what you did in your post.  the KICKER was when I told her "I don't
even TALK to girls that I don't want to fuck".  since I had not fucked her AND
had not suggested that we get together (she BELIEVES in monogamous
relationships for herself and even if she fucked me one time, it would be
merely to relieve her own personal stress and I am not going to be there for
her for that.  I am looking for MORE MLTRs... anything else can go fuck off.  I
laughed at her way of being AND broke it down to her why it was so stupid AND
let her know in NO UNCERTAIN TERMS that I was not going to be involved in
ANYTHING CLOSE to what she claims to want for herself... she can STAY HORNY for
all I care) she INTELLIGENTLY asked me WHY I was talking to her...  I let her
know that I found her amusing and her way of living ineffective.  I pointed out
to her that in the YEARS since I had spoken to her last, ALL she had to show
for it was a bungh of jibberish about WANTING a monogamous relationship that
she HAS NOT ATTAINED IN ALL THESE YEARS!  I let her know that I had predicted
that she would REMAIN dissatisfied for years to come and my talking to her
allowed me to follow her LACK of progress while, in the meantime, I get laid
EVERY DAY by MLTR :)   I have not heard from her SINCE that conversation...
good riddance.  she knew what she HAD to do if she wanted more of my time.  she
knew what she was going to have to do IF she wanted to socialize with me at
all.  she felt like her DEVOTION to the idea of a monogamous relationship with
a NON-EXISTANT man was more important than getting fucked by a guy that she
KNOWS and LIKES.  she is an idiot, and will remain horny UNTIL she fucks the
wrong guy, then has NO ONE to comfort her because I will not be there because
she had her chance and BLEW IT!

I have ZERO TOLERANCE for chicks that want things their way.  if they LIKE
doing things MY WAY, then they can be with me...maybe... for a while... as long
as they still LOOK HOT :)   when I approach chicks, I ASSUME they will fail the
screen because statistics show that I require A LOT from a chick and most of
them are either distracted by work or other relationships or just are not
QUALITY enough to be with me.  I find it amusing how ridiculous the SAME girls
are that I used to DESIRE to go out with and that I USED TO dislike being
rejected by.

now, I meet and REJECT girls daily.  not actively, just after I meet them, I
make NO EFFORT to remain in contact with them and go off to talk to other
chicks, leaving them wondering WHY I was interested enough to approach, but
BECAME DISINTERESTED and ejected for a SIMILARLY-GOOD-LOOKING bitch :)

Experiment Report! How kinky are your coworkers?!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



A practice session using the techniques of PU!


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: ]Experiment Report! How kinky are YOUR co-workers?!
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 08:03:45 GMT

]Experiment Report! How kinky are YOUR co-workers?!

This report is about finding the deep dark secrets of
your co-workers (not necessarily to fuck them, but as
a good experiment in state transitioning in groups
rather than one-on-one).

Note, for those readers living in repressed countries
still in the sexual dark ages like the Islamic
Republic of Iran, or the United Stated of America,
I do not advice attempting this..trouble with the
legal system, sex harrassment shit, or loss of
your job could result.. For the rest of you living
in countries that have both feet planted firmly in
the 20th century, no problem, lets rock on- here
is the report!


Recently, I have been doing alot of work practicing
state transitioning. Ie. the goal is to take a
chick (or in this case, group of chicks) from the
"idle state" (ie. thinking about office bullshit
and work they have to do), and transition them
to the kinky "lets get crazy and fuck state" as
quickly as possible, and in as few steps as possible
using a process that will be consistantly successful.

Last night, we had one of these (usually) boring
office departmental dinner parties at a stuffy
restaurant in town. BORING!!

So I decided what better place to liven things up
and see what I can get away with using psychological
warfare and a little bit of alcohol in an otherwise
formal group setting.

I get there, and sit at a table with 1 guy, and
5 chicks. For the first 30 minutes, it is boring,
I let everyone talk about boring office shit so
that everyone can arrive, and the food can start.

First I arrange the waiter to bring drinks to the
table (we need it later for one of the games I
am going to do), and get started on that right away.
One of the chicks only drinks tea, but that is OK,
later she really got into it anyways in spite of
being stark sober.

At the table is sitting:
ChinaGuy - he is from China
Mombabe - she is a mom, but wild & crazy, 40s (starts
          by sitting at another table)
HB CaptHook - she had a mild eye infection and is
              wearing an eyepatch this week (starts by
              sitting at another table)
HBStrict - she only drinks tea, but is more action
           than she looks
ScaredChick - she thinks we are all wierd
HBWhoMe? - she looks SO straight, but is the kinkiest
           at the table we find out!
Bichick - we find out she had enjoyed some bi games

Other assorted people sitting farther, who dont
play in the games really..

After that, I start. Here is how I did it. Refer
to the 'Maniac plan' post I made a couple weeks ago
(it is archived in fastseduction.com, I will also put
it on my site in Jan. when the next big update
happens) for some of the terminology below. I move
all the chicks (as a group), through all the states
as follows:

[Current State: Idle: chicks talking about office bullshit]
Maniac>Bichick: So what did you do this weekend?
Bichick: Nothing really.. how about you?
Maniac>I went to my dance circle, I like salsa dance
Bichick: oh really? {other chicks starting to listen}
Maniac: Yeah, I went to Brazil this year too, it was so
        much fun, wanna see my pictures?
Bichick & others: 'yes!' (take out my digi-PC, show pictures
        of carnival in Rio, tback bikini babes, the gay parade
        and debauchery in the streets)
Maniac: You know, the culture is SO different, brazilian people
        are SO passionate!
All chicks: oh really?
Maniac: yep, after I left Rio, I went to Sao Paolo, and
        went into this bar and all of the sudden this brazilian
        chick grabbed me and started french kissing me (perform
        SP chick story from ManiacPlan).

[Current State: (A)dmiration & (M)an now achieved from ManiacPlan]
Bichick: Oh, HB Capthook lived in brazil a few years!
Maniac: really? {I go to her table, ask if she wants to see
        some brazil carnival pictures with us.. she runs over
        to our table}
Maniac>all chicks: you know, I respected that SP chick though
       because she was not afraid to take what she wants..
       kind of like Madonna (perform the Madonna story from
       ManiacPlan).
Maniac: Perform 'how to communicate to lady at all levels
        and pay attention to her and what she wants' story
        from ManiacPlan, while doing lots of Kino on
        HBCapthook sitting next to me as a demonstration.
        Others are watching and getting jealous..

[Now try to introduce the (S)ex state from ManiacPlan..
the goal here is to do the "questions game, but in a
group setting.. so I decide to do it via a drinking game]
Maniac: {now I try to introduce a drinking game called 'I
       never'}, Hey, do they have any good drinking games in
       Japan.
Chicks: {they suggest some really lame boring shit like
         remembering names of subway stations..boring!!!}
Maniac: Well, I know two games, Chandelliers {I describe this
        game.. but we wont play it, not sexual}, and then
        "I never" {I describe "I never"}.
[Now here, I think I dont have enough rapport yet to start
"I never" (a drinking version of "questions") and get it to
work well (ie. sexually), so first I preform the "Strawberry
fields" game in a group (in next post, and included below)

<>>

We play the game: (mombabe hears us laughing, comes
over & kicks Chinaguy out of his chair so she can sit
next to us)

Among the answers to "strawberry fields"
Bichick: "uh, I dont see any fence around the field!"
HB Capthook & mombabe: "as many as I can eat!"
HBStrict: "to the farmer.. uh.. Thank you {and bow}"

We were all laughing and rolling on the floor to the
various chicks answers to this game, with lots of "I cant
believe you?! really?!" reactions among the ladies..

[Current state in ManiacPlan: (S)ex now achieved, now
lets intensify and see what these chicks will say/do.
I am putting LOTS of shoulder/back kino on all the
ladies as the game is playing]

Maniac: OK, time for another game, we will play that
 "I never" game we talked about before. {Maniac explains
 howto play "I never"} [easy.. each person takes a turn,
 say "I never xxx", whoever did "xxx" has to take a drink.
 start light, get game sexual ASAP..]

Maniac: here is the opening question: "I never kissed a
 member of the opposite sex before I was 15 y.o."
{3 girls drink}
Maniac: your turn HBCaptHook
HBCaptHook: uh, I dont understand the game yet, can you do
  the next question Maniac?
Maniac: OK, I never kissed a guy on the first date
{we all drink}
HBCaptHook: OK I get it, my turn "I never had sex with a
 guy on the first date" {notice because of the setup with
 straberry fields here, that the chicks ON THEIR OWN, turned
 the game sexual without me having to do anything! This was
 what I worried about if I were to start the "I never" game
 before straberry fields.. the mood was just not sexual
 enough yet, and the game would have fizzled.. but now..
 no problem!}
{all but 1 chick drinks (HB afraid.. who is looking a bit
 uncomfortable now)}
Mombabe: I never kissed a member of the same sex
{Bichick drinks!.. lots of "oh really?!? and discussion
 ensues, but bichick wont delve into it anymore ;-) }
Bichick: I never had sex with more than 4 people in the
 room.
{bichick, HBstrict and HBWhoMe all drink!}
HBAfraid: I never went to california
{we all look at her wierd.. skip to next girl}
HBWhoMe: I never did sex as part of a performance in front
of others
{Maniac, Bichick and HBWhoMe drink.. HBStrict looks envious,
others gasp and are laughing.. rest of our dept, is looking
at us, like why we are having so much fun, and a bit wierdly,
fortunately they cannot hear what we are saying ;-)}
Maniac: I never had sex with someone and didn't know their
 name till the next morning.
{We all drink except HB afraid}
MomBabe: I never used tool, or vibrator during sex
{we all drink}
HBCaptHook: I never had sex with a cat?!
{we all look at her wierd.. no one drinks}
HBCaptHook: but it can happen, I saw it on video once!
{we look at her more strange, and make her drink for watching
the video}
HBAfraid: I cant think of any question
{we skip her, next girl}
..
Maniac: I never was tied/tied up my partner during sex
{Maniac, HB strict, HBCapthook and HBWhome all drink}

Maniac: I see, so who is "S", and who is "M" {explain to
 a couple clueless chicks which was which}
HBWhoMe and HBStrict are serious S type, Bichick is both.
HBStrict makes a pass at me, and I reply only if you are
serious.. she stares at me long (maybe a future there ;-) )
I shake hands and hug HBWhoMe, who is really into this
thread of questioning.

Mombabe now makes ajoke about why I went to lunch today
with this other chick (not in the game), and not her. I
tell her because she didn't ask me.. girls have to take
what they want, like that SP chick. I ask her if she
likes me, she says yes, and I gesture (and get) a cheek
kiss. I am CERTAIN I could have done a KC, or even one
of those 3way KCs, but I remember that this is an
experiment, and I do have to see all these people on Monday
again at work, so I dont push it.

now adminbabe (the dept head's secy) comes by our table
and asks how many of us are going to the prescheduled
after-party karaoke. Mombabe replies "none of us, we are
all going to a hotel".. HBCapthook adds in "a love hotel..".

[Final state: Dying to fuck: achieved]

Adminbabe looks at us wierd (she missed the whole thing),
and leaves. Mombabe now asks why I have such a harem tonight,
and then Bichick remarks how all the ladies in the office
really really like you Maniac.

I ask 'why?'
bichick says.. you smile, and laugh alot.. but there is
something else.. we all see it, but cant really
describe what it is {maniac opinion.. it is the way
I stare at chicks with the 'fuck me' luck, and all the
shoulder kino..etc, I do, even in the office}.

Supper now is wrapping up, we all have to go, I remark
that this table is fun, and that another night, we should
all meet again for beer and fun.. everyone agrees.

As we are going back, HBCaptHook and mombabe are grabbing
all over me, it was funny.

Some go home, and I split off from the group, as I have
a date with karatebabe at midnight in another part of
town..

Experiment over..

I learned that state transitioning is a very predictable,
reproduceable process, once you learn the tools to do it.
This was just my office staff that is around me, so made
a good subject for the experiment. I also realized, that
in groups, there is a sort of feed back effect, so you
can really accelerate things. It wasnt the alcohol because
HBstrict had nothing to drink, but was well into the
game too.

Because it was a group, I could skip steps "BVG,D,O" in
the ManiacPlan, and reach the last state.. (dying to fuck)
so I likely could have taken any (or all)
of those ladies back for a wild time in the sack (which I
wont do, because I work with them.. but there was nothing
stopping it, thats for sure)..

Fascinating..

Constructive Opinions/comments anyone?

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Doing proper ‘closes’

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Maniac introduces "The Wall and the Forest", a PU game.



From maniac_high@yahoo.com 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Game: The wall and the forest
Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 16:18:24 GMT

Another one of those mindfuck games like 4 questions or the cube:

"The Wall and the Forest"

-You are walking in a field, you see a wall, how high is it, and
how do you get by it? [wall = pride, and also how you get past
obstacles]

-you continue walking, and you see a house [kind of house you dream
to have later in life]

-you see a key on the ground, you go to the house, does the key
open the door? [if yes, means you can get married]

-you go in the house (if you were able to open with the key), and
 on the first floor you see a table and chairs, how many chairs are
 there? [means how many people in your future family]

-now you go outside, and see to one direction a dense dark forest, and
 the other way, a less dense/brighter wooded area. Which way do you
 go? (dark forest=expect something, but unknown, take a chance)
     (bright wooded area=easygoing style/way)

-as you walk you then see a lake nearby. How big is it, and how deep
 is it? (big=size of your heart, depth=depth of your heart)

THE END


This game could be lethal for chicks who want to get married or
something like that. Make sure you answer the right answers when
you tell her "what your answers were" after you finish her turn!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Maniac High's Pick Up Girls Guide and Seduction Website! » field

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Maniac uses a power opener to meet and tongue down a chick!


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Maniac meets HBOrderMe! Bar PU
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 05:00:36 GMT

Maniac meets HBOrderMe! Bar PU
001215

This is an interesting bar PU. .
used it to not lay the chick, but to get higher rapport
with the other guys around.

It is bo-nen-kai (end of year party) season in Japan.
After the party (boring, in a big hotel ballroom)
we go to the ni-ji-kai (after party) in a bar/disco
in Roppongi with a bunch of my coworkers (mostly guys,
and some ladies).

One AFC guy is really into this HB. He is making every
AFC mistake in the book (saying she is pretty, sucking
up to her..blah). Progress is really slow.

Me and all the guys are watching. He gets frustrated and
leaves for a bit. I move in on the chick (she is wearing
a high cut black dress, and fishnet stockings... very cute).

My opener is the strawberry game.. I just go up to her,
and say 'imagine you are in a field, and you see a strawberry
field ahead of you, with a fence around.. how high is the
fence'. She goes right into it.

Then I do the interpretation (see strawberry game post
for the game and interpretation) for her. I ask her what
she thinks (she said 1m high fence, 50 strawberries, sorry
to the farmer). She disagrees the interpretation. Then I
ask her what is your idea guy like (brad pitt). Then I say
besides his looks why you like him. Reply: he is really
guy.

Then I ask, what do you want most in a guy's character.
She says, 'I want him to lead, to decide for me what to do.'
Good.. Maniac keeps that in mind for what comes next. .

AFC guy comes back, and I let him have his chick back for
a while. He is doing more regular AFC stuff, though he
has at least initiated kino.. very good. He does this for
like 20 minutes, but isn't really breaking through.

He gets frustrated, goes. I tell the guys 'watch this',
and go up to the chick, and say I am going now, give me a
kiss. I get a cheek kiss.

I look straight into her eyes, and tell her 'thats not
good enough, look into my eyes.. what do you see.. now
give me a real kiss..' a long tonguedown with sexual kino
ensues.. Everyone else sees what I just did, after spending
not even a total of 5 minutes talking with this chick
from before.

I leave the chick, and go back to the guys.. 'that is how
it is supposed to be done'. Respect of me from my guy co-workers
now goes up 10x from whatever it was before, and was visibly
different in the office the next day.

AFC co-worker comes back and tells me how so much he is
in love with this girl (I guess he knew her from before as
a friend or co-worker or something..not sure.. I had never
met her before though). As a result, I defer to him, and let
him get AFC'd out.

I go back to the other guys, and just say, I could take her
(she lives really close actually, so I could just say I
live far and can I crash at her place.. I am sure the answer
would have been yes) whenever I want. They say 'why dont you'?

I reply, well, AFC guy is really into her, and he is a coworker
of mine who I respect, so I dont want to take his chick away
from him. There are lots of chicks to fuck, and this one means
nothing to me at all, but she is important to him, so best to
leave it at that.

I go on to say that all I wanted to know is that I COULD take her
home if I want (and I might next week or something, I got her
number) and now I know that, so it is enough for me, I dont
need more.

Respect from co-workers now goes up another 10x for this, because
I and they KNOW that this is true after what they just saw. .

He continues to AFC for a long while, and I get tired and go
home. Next day I hear that she blew him out almost as soon as I
left.

Now this was cool, because the goal wasn't really to lay the
chick (which I still might if I decide to see her again), but to
increase stature with co-workers, which can help in other ways
in my regular life.

Now one thing to note, is that I cannot do this every time (heck
not even close.. this is like the 3rd or 4th time it has ever happened
so directly like this). I was
really lucky, because of what she said to my 'what you like in
guy question', it was just so EASY to know what this chick
expected me to do, and it was really easy to stage it to happen
in front of all the other guys once I clued in on this.

I WISH I could do it everytime, but life isnt really like that ;-)
Mr. SMooth can do it though!

Constructive comments and opinions welcome!
Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Using the ‘color’ game to PU!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Using the 'color game' to do a PU!


From: tonymcneill@my-deja.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Colours Game - opinions?
Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 00:43:35 GMT

 Hi Guys,

I've just field tested this pattern / game for creating an erotic and
horny state - worked a dream:) I'd be interested to know what you think
of this and how it might be improved.....

I suppose it might work best with the more visually thinking babes.

This is not a 'word for word' pattern by any means, by the way - I just
kind of found myself going into it on the fly.....  here we go..

The PUA "notices" the colour (UK spelling by the way for those who might
feel the urge to correct me) of an object, item of clothing etc.

PUA - "I find these yellow walls (or whatever) quite uplifting;
especially in the winter. Isn't it nice to have some bright colours
around when it's so grey and dark outside?" "Do you think that colours
have an big effect on peoples' moods?".

HB - "Oh, yes, definitely."

PUA - "Hmmm. I was just wondering......I mean....... I was in one of
those New Age shops recently and they were selling lots of different
coloured sunglasses.... with the idea that, if you wanted to feel more
of a certain mood, or to look at the world in a certain way, you would
slip on a pair of sunglasses which would colour everything you looked at
in the desired tone" "Do you think that could work in any way?"

HB - "Well, maybe. I don't know really"

PUA - "Well, for example, my bedroom is a very pale blue colour and I
find this particular blue very restful" "I mean, can you imagine
sleeping very well in a pale blue room?" "Imagine you are really tired,
you know when your eyelids are heavy and you curl up with that fantastic
feeling of at last ... just letting go.... and .....giving
yourself...to....(sp perhaps?).. sleep'" "Do you have a sense of a
particular colour when you imagine that feeling?" (Make sure she's
imagining being sleepy).

HB - "Oh, maybe blue, or green" (or whatever). (If she doesn't come up
with one then maybe she could be asked to imagine the perfect colour for
a bedroom, but both of the HB subjects I tried got right into it.)

PUA "How about when you feel....really full of great ideas...... like
you have all sorts of inspiration flowing through you.?"

PUA then procedes to get HB to imagine a few other states (feeling very
inspired and spiritual (commenting on her choice of colour in a playful
way)...... bursting with energy ...... feeling very sensual,
relaxed and open (we're getting closer, gentlemen)......and eventually,
 being full of passion and horny), and slowly visualising a colour with
each one.

You get the picture - guiding her into these states,
comparing colours etc etc. I have tried this on two chicks, both of whom
LOVED the game and got right into imagining the states. One of them was
an ex who is of great value as a pivot / social proof (and a friend) so
I was testing the game with her rather than going for the lay and the
other HB, in spite of being pretty shy, blushed madly and was VISIBLY
remembering the joy of being fucked until she screamed with pleasure ;)
(At this point Tony is feeling a bit fucking pleased with himself).
I think this would have definitely resulted in a fuck had I not been
meeting her at lunchtime before going off to work :( (at this point Tony
is disgusted as well as pleased!!)

What do you 'real' PUAs think of this little game? As I said I somehow
went into it on the fly after having the idea while practicing
improvising patterns while driving, using things I saw on the road as
starting points for pattern-talk. So it's pretty new and I, as yet,
claim only to be a humble RAFC. Going to test it some more and post the
results....



Any suggestions or comments?

Tony

--
'Action' is the magic word

Setting up the Kiss Close

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

A way to set up the kiss close

From: erosla77@aol.com (ErosLA77) Ross Jeffries
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 26 Dec 2000 19:23:44 GMT
Subject: Re: What if...

>Subject: Re: What if...
>From: eclipse19@my-deja.com
>Date: Tue, Dec 26, 2000 12:04 AM
>Message-id: <929jdt$u6t@nnrp1.deja.com>
>
>In article <9299s4$o03@nnrp1.deja.com>,
>  charnel1278@my-deja.com wrote:
>> Hey all,
>>
>> I've checked out a Maniac's, and some others websites and most say
>that
>> when you ask "Do you wanna kiss me?", you're guaranteed a kiss, unless
>> you get a flat out NO.  None, from what I saw, said what to do when
>you
>> get that NO.  Do you continue on the conversation like nothing
>> happened? Do you come back with a similar question later in the
>> evening?  If so, won't she kinda feel that you're badgering her?
>> Granted, this won't happen often, but what if?....
>>
>> Laters.
>
> the standard (canned) reply to a "no" answer is "YOU really know how
>to ruin a moment....your old boyfriends must have hated that about you"
>I think i got this off tony or maniac's site, forget which one. I
>havent ran into a direct "no" answer myself so i havent field tested
>this, but im sure others have. From what i read(or remember anyhow)
>this will leave them stunned and they will show less resistance against
>another kiss.
>
>

 Hmmm......well, I like this "you really know how to ruin a moment" response
WITHOUT asking for the kiss first. "Asking" for anything, outside of the
presence of fun(as in, on the spur of the moment saying, "Hey...wouldn't it be
fun to go to a strip club? Let's go!))  seems pretty pathetic to me.  

    A good one is to notice her giving you that look and then say(and I got
this from a student, it is NOT mine).  "If ? were to ask you on a scale of one
to ten, how good a kisser are you, what would you say?"

 Listen for her answer, then say, "If you were to kiss me right now, how do you
think I'd rate you?"

  You do this ONLY when you see "the look".......

  "let's find out" you say and kiss her.  

IF she backs away from that, then the "you really know how to ruin a moment"
comment works great.  Come to think of it, this could really work for a
cancellation as well. 

---

From: "General Snafu" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: What if...
Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2000 22:57:08 GMT

If she says no to a kiss, ask for a BJ.  If she says no to the BJ, you are
SOL for the night.

 wrote in message
news:9299s4$o03@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Hey all,
>
> I've checked out a Maniac's, and some others websites and most say that
> when you ask "Do you wanna kiss me?", you're guaranteed a kiss, unless
> you get a flat out NO.  None, from what I saw, said what to do when you
> get that NO.  Do you continue on the conversation like nothing
> happened? Do you come back with a similar question later in the
> evening?  If so, won't she kinda feel that you're badgering her?
> Granted, this won't happen often, but what if?....
>
> Laters.
>
>
> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/

Game: The Wall and the Forest

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Maniac introduces "The Wall and the Forest", a PU game.



From maniac_high@yahoo.com 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Game: The wall and the forest
Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 16:18:24 GMT

Another one of those mindfuck games like 4 questions or the cube:

"The Wall and the Forest"

-You are walking in a field, you see a wall, how high is it, and
how do you get by it? [wall = pride, and also how you get past
obstacles]

-you continue walking, and you see a house [kind of house you dream
to have later in life]

-you see a key on the ground, you go to the house, does the key
open the door? [if yes, means you can get married]

-you go in the house (if you were able to open with the key), and
 on the first floor you see a table and chairs, how many chairs are
 there? [means how many people in your future family]

-now you go outside, and see to one direction a dense dark forest, and
 the other way, a less dense/brighter wooded area. Which way do you
 go? (dark forest=expect something, but unknown, take a chance)
     (bright wooded area=easygoing style/way)

-as you walk you then see a lake nearby. How big is it, and how deep
 is it? (big=size of your heart, depth=depth of your heart)

THE END


This game could be lethal for chicks who want to get married or
something like that. Make sure you answer the right answers when
you tell her "what your answers were" after you finish her turn!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Game: Forest

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Nightlight introduces 'forest game'!



From: nightlight9@hotmail.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: More like "4 questions" game?
Date: Thu, 02 Nov 2000 19:50:10 GMT

You mention all these, but most of them are not very useful in the
initial meeting because they are too cerebral and too random.  Try ones
that are more viceral.  You are walking in a dark forest.  How do you
feel.  (how she approaches life).  You could to a wall with a door.
What do you do? (how she approaches obsticalls).  You look down and see
a cup on the ground what is it made out of? (how she views wealth).
You come to some water, describe it. (how she views sexuality).
Always end with sexuality because it is  a good topic for PU and
demonstrates you are comfortable with women and people a sexual context.

BookGuy, my comments are based on experience and field testing.  Please
do the same if you reply.

--
NightLight9
Just be yourself... smooth with interesting questions and interesting
answers.

Game: Strawberry Fields

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Maniac introduces a PU game: Strawberry Fields!
[Note, this originally comes from the book 'Kokology']


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Game!: Strawberry fields
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 08:02:40 GMT

Game!: Strawberry fields
001117

This is a game to find out some things about how chicks
see sex. It is very popular in Japan & is a good state
transitioner

--

Intro: Hey, lets play a game!

Imagine you are alone in a field, and see a straberry field
in front of you with tasty strawberries.

There is a fence/gate around the field. How high is it?
(= how easy is this girl/guy to take sex)

Now you are in the straberry field, how many straberries
do you take?
(=how many BFs/GFs that person wants)

Ok, after you have finished enjoying the strawberries,
how do you feel about the farmer, who's field you took them
from?
(=how you feel to that person after fucking them)


The end

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

TPUA night PU’s HB Smallmouth and converts to a lay!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

[TPUA PU's a chick at night, and converts it into a lay!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com
]


Date Posted: 2000/09/25 05:21:37 AM EDT
Author: Tokyopua 
Subject: Re: HB Small Mouth PU  (Was Re: Calling all Tokyo PUA's)

Hey Maniac,

I didnt really intend that last post of mine as a field report, since it
wasnt too detailed.  But yeah, things have been going well on the PU despite
my severely limited time. So I will attempt a bit of a field report on the
initial PU here.  My PU efficiency factor has been really high recently,
maybe because I am only trying to PU when I feel really confident and often
times when I wasnt planning on it, so was really relaxed. I did a PU on a 19
year old HB college student in the train the other night and got her home
phone number.  It was easy cause she was reading Tokyo Classified, and I
asked her about it. I was really confident, and in only 2 stops got her to
really dig me.  In fact, when I asked her why she had studied English, she
said "So I could meet a guy like you!"  The only problem is finding time to
meet her again before I leave.

The PU I did on HB Small Mouth was not planned either, I just saw her
walking back home around my place at midnight, and somehow knew that despite
my frazled appearance after 2 hours of Jujitsu practice and carrying 40
pounds of luggage, I could do the PU on her.  My opening line was "I like
your hair" which I knew was lame and she must have heard often, but hey,
thats the price of using the 3 second rule sometimes.  I immediately
followed with asking her if she was a student, what kind of work she did,
etc.  Oddly, I didnt use my standard opener "Do you speak english" in the
whole conversation.  I will post my personal notes on the rest of the PU at
the end of this post just for reference, but they arent too coherent.  They
were the basis though for the plans I laid for the successful next date that
got me laid 3 days later.  (If I have time someday I will write up full
notes on that too.) Total time to lay in terms of time invested was
approximately 3.5 hours, about the same as HB Physics, my other recent
street PU who I did that same day.  This efficiency is possible if the
progression is done just right, I think.

 wrote in message news:8qfler$o1r@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Tokyo PUA,
>
> This is an excellent report.. You really rock!
>
> Where / how did you originally
> PU this chick though? Also, taking the chick over to see your
> weight training stuff is a clever idea.. liked that..!
> BTW, I thought you left already to the USA, how long are you still
> there for?

Right near my house in a dark alley at midnight on her way home!  She told
me later (post lay) that she was scared at first, but I had a really relaxed
attitude so she got comfortable with me afterwards.  As for the weight
training stuff later, it was great kino as I had her bend over slightly and
got right behind her to "help her with her form" while simultaneously
letting her slightly feel the form of my stiff wood pressed against her, and
other such intimate situations.

Still here till Oct 14 or so, with a trip to Taiwan and maybe Hawaii too
thrown in.

>
> ALso, do you usually go out alone, or with a wing. I noticed that
> you knew quite a few people in Roppongi, I guess you get out there
> quite a bit?

Been out there a lot since last February, maybe 10 times or so.  I guess
predominantly I go with a wing, but sometimes felt it screwed up my game.
Of course, my wings didnt know anything about seduction a la ASF, thats
probably why.  Of course, neither did I till June... I know Im much better
at street PU when alone though, thats for sure!  OTOH, when I went out to
clubs with you and Rio, I think my game was really improved and I was
learning all the time.
BTW, I have heard that someplace called club Earth near hamamatucho has
really hot babes, (bitch shield too, but who cares, right;-), so you guys
might want to check that out.  3000 Yen cover charge.  May be the new
alternative to Fura?

>
> > I managed to lay that HB Small Mouth
>
> EXCELLENT!
>
> >Ganbatte!  Im seeting HB Bi this weekend again (tonight), and HB
> >small the next day, and my ex-GF the next.  Im starting to feel like
> >Maniac juggling girls, but nothing will happen w/ my ex, so its not
> >so bad.
>
> Yes, I did that ALOT last year, and fucked a shitload of chicks that
> I cant even count now..
>
> but its really tiring and you do get sick of it after a while..
> so finally I just MLTR'd a few that I really liked, who also accepted
> that I fuck other chicks, and left it at that.. guess I got to get out
> more ;-)
> not sure if its the right way yet, but been doing it that way
> the last few months now.. We'll see ;-)

I think it goes in cycles.  Eventually you get tired of the MLTR's and have
to replace them.  To do that you will have to PU lotsa new chicks, lay them,
see if they dont eject when you break the news that there are others.  That
takes a lot of time, so then you want to go back to the easy life of having
a bunch of girls on call.  Then the cycle starts over.  Im just beginning to
get these girls into MLTR status, but now I have to leave.  But theres
always business trips ack here!

>
> If you are planning on hanging around TOkyo though, you should
> bring HB Bi and her friend to one of our fuck parties the next time..
> sounds like they'd be a good time.. maybe introduce them to Kipp or
> something since I am not there right now, before you leave.. or
> give me your departure date and see if they are interested and we
> can setup something with all the ladies, if this is your sort of thing..

Id consider it, but it will take more effort, and probably wont be anything
I can do until after Im gone and come back for business trips.  You see, I
worked it too good with HB Bi.  She is signing her letters with "Love" at
the end and is all into me now.  Made me the most awesome meal any woman has
ever made me, washed my clothes, gave me an amazing massage, etc.  When I
confronted her about our last threesome, she said that she felt jealous when
she saw me doing her friend, and claimed that was the only time she had ever
done something like that, that she isnt really Bi.
So right now I think she somehow sees a relationship in this, despite my
leaving?  I figure once Im gone I can get past that as reality sinks in and
maybe set up more stuff for any business trips I make back.

>
> Good post!
>
> Maniac
> http://www.pickupguide.com

Here are those notes I was talking about, for what they are worth:

-------------------------------------------
PU of HB Small:  happened in a dark alley shortcut to my house at midnight,
I approached carrying a 30 pound backpack on one shoulder and a 10 pound
bucket of protein powder in the other, and said,  $B!H (BExcuse me, your hair is
really beautiful. $B!I (B  She reacted favorably and said thanks, but kept
walking, slightly faster.  She seemed young, so I asked if she was a
student.  She said no, I asked what she does.  She said she works for a
cable company, I fluff talked about watching TV.  She asked what I do.  I
said I know its late but you should have coffee or tea with me at Jonathans
restaurant nearby.  She said no, so I said, OK, how do we meet again.  She
said give me your number and I said,  $B!H (BAh, but I know women, if I give you
my number you will get nervous and never call. $B!I (B  She said  $B!H (BNo, 
that wont
happen I promise. $B!I (B  I knew I didn $B!G (Bt have enough rapport or 
anything to
believe that, so really what I was just doing was stalling till I could set
up a firm date.

I got a pen and wrote my number and at this point we are standing on the
corner near my place.  I play on Japanese cuteness and write my name with
hearts by it.  (None of this is stuff I would be able to do in the US.)
Then I say, OK, when are we going to meet.  Its sort of a way to pace the
ongoing reality now that she has my number,its a logical extension.  The
number is just a formality to me, I want to set up the date.  After some
negotiation, I get a date set up for 6 PM Tuesday, her day off.  I had given
her alternatives between my place and eating in Tachikawa nearby (but both
already had the presuppostion that we are meeting for a date, so I don $B!G (Bt
care which she chooses).  She chose Italian in Tachikawa which is perfect
cause eating carbs increases seratonin (=relaxation), so I will lay on the
patterning after a while, maybe even order a glass of wine (more seratonin
and romance) for us both.  Then its a 5 minute taxi ride back to my place!

Anyway, we keep talking.  I get that she never has met a foreigner, that she
likes Richard Gere, cause he is  $B!H (BShibui $B!I (B. $B!! (B(=quiet, simple, 
sober,
tasteful, austere, parsimonious, etc.)  I asked her about her ideal man
while doing the (SP) thing.  She really accessed a lot and I was awakening
her creative centers.  I touched her a lot on the arm to anchor the good
feelings.   She said she really was too ideal, but that her ideal guy was
like her father, sweet and nice.  I asked if she wanted a guy who made her
feel safe, and she said yes.  I compared our hand sizes and got kino,
remarked at how small her hands were, that my big hands could protect her.
Complemented her smile and said that it seems like her eyes smile too and
she said that she is often told that.  She said I was skillful at
complementing and I said that I really meant it.

I mirrored her body positions a lot and this seemed to have a good effect.
She seemed really into it and wasn $B!G (Bt trying too hard to get away despite 
it
being after midnight and having to work the next day, only bringing up the
time when I did.  She was rubbing her earlobe, and later playing with her
ponytail in a really sexy way, all with the doggy dinner bowl look.
I also showed kanji ability and had her write her name, and demonstrated how
we could study English together, all using the Zaurus.  (BTW, Did you buy
one yet, Maniac? A useful tool in many ways.  You can turn it into a
portable digital photo album too, albeit poor quality...) She liked that.
At one point she asked what was in the bucket, I said protein powder and she
said  $B!H (Bnomitai! $B!I (B and I said  $B!H (B5 fun dake areba, nomeru 
yo. $B!I (B
(If you have 5
minutes I can give you a taste).  But she refused to go to my apartment and
I didn $B!G (Bt press the issue, I just reconfirmed our fun date on Tuesday, and
gave her a kiss goodnight, then took off.
----------------------------------

-T

ASF reader comments on above story

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website: 

http://www.pickupguide.com 

Many excellent followups to the Psychicbabe re-lay report!
Mrsex4unyc, RJ..etc..etc.

From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:05 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

In article <92jvre$obh@nnrp1.deja.com>, maniac_high@yahoo.com writes:

>The immediate gold to take care of this, is to now make the
>relationship very high stakes for her. I can do this because
>I know that she is into me (from what she said at the dinner),
>so the idea is to play it that if she doesnt do her job as a
>chick.. she will lose EVERYTHING as far as I am concern.
>Ok, that is the plan, here we go:

plan or no plan, essentially, you are telling her the truth.  on a long-enough
timeline, the survival rate for EVERYONE is ZERO.  sooner or later, everyone
you love will either leave you or die.  chicks don't seem to believe in this,
though it is the absolute truth.  they think that they can relate to you
FOREVER, REGARDLESS of what they do or how they act.  you are telling her HOW
she can REMAIN with you and what is going to get her EJECTED.  even though it
takes a long time, so it doesn't SEEM like this... this is what has happened to
EVERY chick's relationship that has gone away.  EVENTUALLY, she was not
fulfilling her womanly duties and her man left her for a   chick (younger,
sexier, richer, swallower...)  EVEN if she IS fulfilling her duties, if her man
like it from another chick MORE, she loses out either in a PERCENTAGE of her
benefits or she gets DUMPED and loses ALL of her benefits.  you are merely
explaining this to her and telling her what she needs to do IF she wants to be
with you... which you have already determined.  you are SELLING, and now you
are screening her to see if she is QUALIFIED and ABLE to buy.

>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations
>in relationship. 

I am getting to the point where I am going to do this.  I never do this with
chicks because I morph into whatever THEY are looking for and hook them that
way.  the thing for me is that being 10 months in with MLTR, she has REALLY
learned how to please me and the time I spend TEACHING her has become minimal
and the time I spend ENJOYING her is increasing :)  it is getting tougher and
tougher for other chicks to get my attention, because anything LESS than what I
have already is BULLSHIT to me.  the time I am spending talking to chicks is
mostly eliciting values and breaking their perceptions... just for fun :)  I
know IMMEDIATELY if I want sex from a chick, and if I don't, she is IMMEDIATELY
LJBF and I use her for practice and NEXT her at the end of the conversation.

I am seriously going to consider moving to a "demonstration of value -> SOI"
model, just because I have lost my patience with LISTENING to these bitches
talking about shit that really doesn't mean anything.  I know I am going to
NEXT them ANYWAY as soon as I realize they can't compete with MLTR, so why
listen to their shit FIRST?  I may as well let them know how great I am and
let them know what kind of woman I am willing to accept, and let them continue
from there.  there is also the cognitive dissonance issue of them KNOWING that
I am going to dump them if they are not sexy and CONTINUING to talk to me and
get to know me.  the more they talk to me, the more I hook them into
interacting with me.  the more they get hooked, the greater the PAIN OF
SEPERATION (credit: RJ) when they eventually get EJECTED.  since they KNOW
ahead of time what will get them ejected and they are still talking, they are
either planning to get in line OR setting themselves up for pain.  either way,
after SOI and their acceptance of the terms, there will have to be some sort of
TEST of their compliance.  even listening to what they have to say after SOI
counts as a REWARD for their entering into a "relationship" with me.  hmm... I
will consider this more.

>I go on to tell her that other girls I know also
>like me, ask me out alot, (doesn't matter if it is true or not,
>but chick 'competition logic' will kick in, and it will scare
>your mark to act). 

the reason I don't use this is that MLTR is an integral part of my life.  if I
were to play this "chicks dig me" card, it would belittle the actual
relationship I have with MLTR.  the only problem with THAT is that I am
screening for MORE MLTRs :)  I don't give a fuck about ONS because I can get
laid ANY NIGHT within an hour of talking to the chick I am talking to... in the
WAY I want to with a chick that I WANT TO FUCK :)  a chick offering me ONS is
like a chick offering me a dollar bill.  I already HAVE dollar bills... what do
I want hers for?  of course, there are some chicks that are just so HOT that
you want to try them out, but barring that scenario, ONS can bring you much
more ANGUISH than the satisfaction that accompanies it... PLUS it is the SAME
SATISFACTION that I already get on a regular basis from MLTR. 

besides... it is OBVIOUS that chicks dig me because here SHE is, liking me
within 20 minutes of meeting me... what about the chicks that have experienced
me for days?  months?  years?  OH, she could only HOPE to be one of those! :)

for you, it is a good tactic though.

>Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>her last week, apparently).

I lost a rap to a low-self-esteem bitch that had a couple of relationships like
this as well.  I mean, I fucked her, but I didn't get to MLTR like I wanted
because she was SCARED that she wouldn't match up to the next bitch and that I
would NEXT her for no reason, like her exes did.  I tried to tell her I wanted
her for more than that, but she wasn't emotionally healthy enough to understand
or believe me.

>Ok, now Maniac has reached her head, and I take this deeper..
>I go on to tell her that I dont want just sex, I want rocks and gold
>I can get any girl in roppongi on a Saturday night and fuck her
>(not exactly true, but she doesnt know this.. goal is just to

she KNOWS that it happened to her VERY QUICKLY.  she ASSUMES she was not the
ONLY bitch to fall for you that quickly.  it is like reverse-social-proof. 
fucking a bitch FAST makes them think you can fuck other bitches FAST.

>'confirm' her worst fears so that she acts), but its not enough for
>me. I want connection, good sex, and romance, with an intelligent
>woman, and that is why I want to date you (psychicbabe).

nice line.  this is another thing I will consider.  talking-up MLTR to them.  
I never considered this either, MAINLY because if you tell a chick what you
want her to do then you never know if she is manipulating you by being that
way, or if she arrived there NATURALLY... on her own.  interesting, LOTS of
style-change material happening right around the new year :)

>Then all of the sudden, she asks me about HBass (the chick staying
>at my place over the holidays), and freaks out about it. I tell
>her that she already knows all this, and exactly what is her point
>here?

although I am a GREAT fan of "quoting", I find that there need to be times to
engage in it and times to NOT engage in it.  this will depend on what you want
with the chick.  it is the same way you can't go from being a CHUMP to a MAN in
a chick's eyes... but you CAN go from being a MAN into a CHUMP :)  if you start
out telling a chick that you have a girlfriend AND that you fuck her, you leave
yourself open for these pot-shots whenever chicks trip the fuck out and go into
their irrational rants from out of left-field.  all a bitch needs to know is
that you are "taken" so that you manage her relationship expectations.  any
more information and she feels like you will give her ALL the information. 
where does it stop?  are you going to tell her that you are fucking her?  that
you fucked her last night?  that you fucked her an hour before coming on this
date?  that you fucked YOUR WOMAN in her ass?  that she LIKES sucking dick? 
WHERE DOES IT STOP?

I ran into this problem with a chick where my relationship to her was BASED ON
trading current sex-stories.  when I got to the point where I didn't want to
tell her any more shit, she was EXPECTING me to tell her, and I realized that
if I wasn't telling her, and she wasn't telling me, then our "relationship" was
OVER.  before that, I had not realized how much I had compromised my position
by telling her CURRENT sex-shit.  think about it, and decide on your own LIMITS
to what you are willing to tell a chick about other chicks... besides, think
about the fact that she is going to KNOW that she will end up as STORIES to
other bitches right after you fuck her.  it will make her VERY self-conscious
about whatever she does with you and that could hinder her emotional states
tremendously.

>Then she stops again, and asks me if I am fucking her (maybe I
>should have said no..., but I had already said yes to her about this
>the first time I saw her)., she asks me why.. (I tell her because
>I am seeing her! like I told you the first time! I mean what do
>you expect?!?).
>
>She then puts on her bitch face, and talks in a stern voice,
>"then call me when you break her up, that is my decision, I am
>going home.".

THIS is retarded because she ALREADY knew that you were fucking her AND she
fucked you herself.  this is another problem with bitches having information
about other bitches.  they use it against themselves.  IMO, the purpose of her
knowing you have another girl or SEVERAL other girls is so she knows where she
stands in the RACE to be your MAIN BITCH.  if you are single, she has a good
chance at being that to you.  if you are "taken" she has NO CHANCE of being
that to you.  if you are SEEING bitches, then she has to COMPETE to be your #1.
 other than THAT, I think giving information about your other bitches is a
mistake...  I have made the SAME mistake up to this point, so I am not
crisicizing :)  however, I am changing that ASAP and I think you should
consider giving out information on a N2K basis (need to know).

besides, SHE is the one that NEEDS a fuck.  if it is not coming from YOU, a guy
she has fucked ALREADY and she LIKES how you did it or she wouldn't have come
back... she has to get it from a STRANGER whose sexual skills are in question
that might tie her up, fuck her in the ass or sell her to the highest bidder. 
bitches like to FRONT a lot about having ALL these sexual choices, but with all
the 8s, 9s, and 10s I have spoken to on an honest "one of the chicks" level,
they are ALL looking to have an EXCITING time, but not REALLY be in DANGER! 
you, OTOH have pussy AT HOME IN BED WAITING FOR YOU!  the only one to lose out
if she bails... is HER!  knowing that, I would have not even entertained her
bullshit OR called her on it, letting her know that I was getting laid tonight
REGARDLESS of whether SHE fucks or not.  that would take the fucking WIND out
of her sails :)

>I tell her I am planning to break her up (which is true) later, so
>it is nothing you should worry about. 

this, my friend :)  is a COP-OUT!  it is used VERY EFFECTIVELY by married men
to keep fucking their side-bitches, but WE are way above bullshit tactics like
this.  I commend you for thinking of this "on the fly", but PLEASE, PLEASE! 
hehe  I have MUCH more respect for you as a PUA than to hear some CRAP like
this from you :)  PLEASE think of something better for the next instance of a
chick trying to BLACKMAIL you into trading in a R-E-L-A-T-I-O-N-S-H-I-P where
you are getting EVERYTHING you want from a chick... for a ONS with HER! 
HAHAHAHAHAHA  >:)

I haven't run into a chick STUPID enough to try to disrespect my MLTR for being
with me... chicks have STARTED to say she is dumb for "letting" (as if she has
ANY say in the matter) her man fuck other chicks, and I have BROKEN THEIR
FUCKING ASSES listing the benefits that SHE is getting that they will most
likely NEVER have with a man... EVER!  and CERTAINLY don't have right now, or
they would not be talking to me in a bar... they would be with THEIR OWN MAN
conducting this FANTASY RELATIONSHIP that they are professing that my MLTR
should have :)  I have NEVER run into a chick that has even TRIED to break into
my relationship with MLTR because they KNOW I mean business.  all they can do
is become ANOTHER MLTR... and after they hear the QUALIFICATIONS, they KNOW
they can't even achieve THAT... only ONS and LJBF with me.  if some bitch EVER
suggested that I break up with MLTR in order to ONS her, I would  A) laugh in
her face and  B) immediately demand an EXPLANATION of the reasons why she
thinks she can knock MLTR out of the box AND make her perform ANY AND ALL
SKILLS that she CLAIMS to be better than MLTR at IMMEDIATELY!  put up or SHUT
THE FUCK UP!  the result would be the ONS ANYWAY, and she would still be LJBF
or NEXT because MLTR is NOT about sex... it is about compatability and I
PERSONALLY could not be with some bitch that needs to knock other chicks off in
order to gain status.  I gain status by BEING MYSELF and letting bitches make
INTELLIGENT, EDUCATED decisions to be with me.  any chick that wants to be with
me had better do the same.

>she gets upset, and starts
>screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
>just like her ex-bf, getting other girls while dating her, and how
>all guys just want sex..etc..

I would have told her "you wanna calm the fuck down?"  throwing tantrums and
making scenes are expressions of her ability to do ANYTHING in your presence. 
I personally don't tolerate that.

>Then she says.. ok, if you let me meet your GF at your house
>tonight, then I will let you have sex with me. [ha! I got her!]

ok.  thank God I happened to read the next line before I started typing this. 
I was JUST going to ask you WHY you are STILL letting her blackmail you into
fucking her... ESPECIALLY when she is the one that needs it and you don't :)

>I bounce back, and say, "what exactly makes you think I am
>desperate to have sex with you tonight?! Do you think I am
>just some stupid guy and you can manipulate me like that?
>No, you will not meet my GF, it is disrespectful to her to do
>that. You know the situation, it was clear to you from the
>beginning, and you accepted it. There is no more to talk about.
>I am not here only for sex, I can get that anywhere. Sex only
>of itself is of little value to me, I want more than that.

SWEET!  :)  break her fucking ASS maniac :)

>I then bring out the nuclear weapons! My tonality is very firm,
>and I eye fuck her, while telling her the following. First, I tell
>her that I already told her about my GF, she was clear about it
>right from the start, and she has NO excuse. Then I go on to tell
>her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
>that did NOT happen. So do NOT compare me to your ex. I am a
>different person, and EXCEPT better treatment than that if you
>ever want to see me again. She starts crying more, and hugging
>again.

ugh :/   fucking IDIOTS!   man, the shit some bitches put you through!  does
everyone SEE why we have to study this shit?

>I put her against wall, and tell her not to complain about me like
>I am her ex, I a am different person than he is.
>
>I tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>alone!

this is a good point.  I like to play it the other way:

ok... so now, you have told me that you want everything to be a 'perfect'
situation with a guy before making a move.  You want him to be ideal with
women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady... WHAT MAKES YOU THINK
HE WILL WANT YOU?   WHAT ARE YOU BRINGING TO THE TABLE THAT IS GOING TO MAKE A
MAN LIKE THAT CHOOSE YOU OVER ANY OTHER CHICK?

you wanna see some confusion?  you wanna see a bitch get BROKEN?  HAHAHAHA  >:)
 of course, I use this on chicks that I am just practicing on, because it
normally induces DEPRESSION, not horniness.  when they have to GO DEEP INSIDE
and dive BELOW THE SURFACE of their programming, they realize that they CAN NOT
TELL ME WHY A MAN WOULD WANT THEM!  they stall the fuck out dude :)  it's
amazing.  matter of fact, it's documented already.  look at my recent thread
with "telembe".  I let her say all this bullshit about what she wanted from a
guy in order to give up her virginity, then when she was finished talking about
what she WANTED, I asked her what she was OFFERING to a guy that was going to
give her all this committment and "love" and other bullshit and she said a
whole bunch of shit that ANY bitch can and WILL give to a man she likes.  she
might have THOUGHT she had something to offer a guy that was going to seperate
her from the pack, but she doesn't.  even GOOD PUSSY can't get a bitch any
credit because there are LOTS of bitches that can fuck and suck like pros...
elites AND sub-elites.  telembe NEVER told us what seperates her from the rest
of the bitches that might make a MAN like the one she wants even LOOK HER WAY! 
the reason is that there is NO reason! :)  bitches are programmed that MEN want
them... but they are NEVER told WHY.  the reason is that men like to FUCK and
get their dicks sucked.  they also like companionship and cooking and cleaning
and for a girl to look good on their arm so they can feel accomplished around
their buddies.  chicks THINK they are ENTITLED to a good man... but the GOOD
MEN... are picking GOOD WOMEN!  if they were SHINING like they think they are,
they would have been scooped up already and married or whatever they were
looking for because some guy would have spotted her and said "I'm not going to
let her go for ANYTHING" and she would be happy... at least according to her
programming.  OH, how I LOVE to see a bitch's face while she TRIES AND TRIES to
dig up ANY reason why a guy as great as the one she claims to want would EVER
choose her over any other bitch :)  the JOY the JOY that I feel as this POMPOUS
BITCH breaks the fuck down RIGHT IN FRONT OF MY FACE! :)  of course since I
broke her, I keep talking to her and ease her back to a decent state of being
and let her know that she can take steps to make herself into the woman that a
man would want, but she has to really KNOW HERSELF and KNOW MEN in order to
make an intelligent decision.  I am not into depressing chicks... unless they
TRULY DESERVE IT for all the depression they have caused men throughout their
tenure as FINE bitches :)  also, I have no desire to BREAK bitches and leave
them like that.  that just makes it WORSE for ALL OF US looking for FINE, yet
DECENT chicks.

>she cries, and says that is so true, that is her problem, she never
>takes the chance and loses out because she doesn't make the
>move on taken guys. Then I run my 'take chances routine' (if you take
>a chance, in the end, the result is usually good, but if you don't,
>just you get left behind, by yourself).. 

nice.  I like that one... emphasizing loss and loneliness.

>she cries more, says she
>needs to take the chance, and doesnt want to be alone.

she's done :)  nice work.  land her!

>She says she has to be careful, that all guys want just sex, and
>bitches about this for about 30 seconds.

as opposed to what?  what does she WANT guys to want?

>Now I start the 'you need me, I dont need you..you think I just want
>only sex, then you dont understand me at all.. if you think that is
>what I am only, then you do NOT deserve me.. I do no need you to go out
>with me if that is what you think I am.. I want connection, sex,
>passion, and closeness.. and if you haven't figured that out about
>me yet, then get another guy, because you dont understand me at all..

OK OK OK... you've CONVINCED me maniac :)  that's some good shit right there :)
 starting NOW, I am pitching for MLTR ONLY.  bitches that want ONS or LJBF will
get what they deserve from me... which isn't much.  I LOVE this idea of dissing
her for claiming that you are looking for ONS... or even just a "bootie-call"
type relationship :)  I love it.  I would feel so PROUD getting on her like
this.  sweet!  EXTREMELY congruent!  nice play!  this is going into my style,
starting RIGHT NOW!  :)

>I am doing this, because I know the left (logic) and right (emotions,
>passion) are fighting each other..they have been all night. Because the
>left doesn't accept the logic of the situation, but I know the right side
>dying for a shag,..she is trying to rationaize going out with a taken guy,
>but I have gotten her so excited tonight, that she needs that fuck.

THIS is the reason I never learned any of this shit until recently.  my
caveman-kino style before this involved ZERO talking.  totally kino and kissing
and PHYSICAL seduction with domineering EYE-CONTACT.  there was NO INFORMATION
for the left side to process at all.  EVERYTHING went STRAIGHT to the chick's
right side, and her left had to try to process the EMOTIONS and turn them into
a story that she could understand... in the meantime, she is PHYSICALLY falling
for the kino and wanting MORE AND MORE until we are fucking.  I never HAD to
talk to chicks before OR after fucking them because my PHYSICAL ATTACK is so
DEVASTATING!  I would just take them over PHYSICALLY and their right brains
would do ALL the work and the left would struggle to understand, but eventually
succumb to the onslaught!  ARG ARG! :)

thanks for explaining that to me :)

>As I touch her side of face, she goes doggy look, I kiss her, and she
>gets like screambabe, panting. I put leg between her, she widens, goes nuts
>totally. I ask her she likes me (in a tell her sort of way' you like me..'),
>she replies 'yes'. I say (stare her down) .. she asks "what should I do?"
>I say in a very strn fatherly voice while staring her down 4 inches from
>her head.. you will follow me..that is what you will do.. and you will do
>what I say. 'she says, 'I will'. I tongue her down more, run her crotch,
>she almost cums right there, then I take her to a love hotel (her first
>time!), no resistance what so ever.

interesting.  what just happened here?  did you somewhere dictate to her that
the terms of her being "your bitch" is that she has to sumbit to you fully? 
are you getting a verbal confirmation of that from her?  or is something else
going on... like she just plain UNDERSTANDS that you can move her to passions
that make her WANT to cum and that you are going to take her there and over the
edge?

another point... what do you guys think of foreplay on a chick.  he mentions
that she almost came right there... do you think it is good to get her to the
EDGE and leave her there so she is so horny, she will do ANYTHING for you to
make her cum, OR to give her an orgasm right there in her clothes to
demonstrate your sexual mastery over her?  personally, I am into the sexual
mastery thing because I notice a newfound RESPECT from a chick that has had
guys on top of her NAKED, fucking her for all they were worth and she never
came from it, and then I am just doing kino on her and fingering her and she
cums from just that.  do you think that making the chick cum on herself makes
her want sex MORE or want it LESS since she just got off?  take into account
that chicks are multi-orgasmic and that they feel sexier after cumming, not
DRAINED like guys.

>As I am fucking her, I am putting things in her head, like D.Shades reports.
>I tell her as she is screaming it feels deeper and deeper, closer and
>closer. She is going nuts will I am fucking her.

I need to reasearch this.  is this more right-brain, left-brain shit where her
left-brain is shut down because of the FIREWORKS that are going off in her mind
because of the sex, leaving her wide open to suggestion?  if you have any links
for this, please post.

>I stare her down, and I tell her you need me (during sex), she says yes.
>I tell her from now on you will follow me, and do what I say. She says
>'yes, I will'. I continue doing her, she says "it feels SO good, I really
>need that, I really want it, i love you inside me!".. she is fucking like a
>wild animal, loud voice, shouting and screaming, oh, I want it, give it
>to me, I want to come!

more of the same?

>Then she tells me anything is ok as long as I dont hate her..she doesnt
>want me to hate her. She wants me to hold/hug her, she cries a bit, then is
>ok again (seems to be thinking of her old bf she says). I touch her
>more, face goes totally doggy look, and finger her, she goes nuts, we start
>fucking again.

the "I don't want you to hate me" thing is very important in the D/s
relationship... not that you set this up like that, but that is the MAIN
incentive for her to follow your lead... that she does NOT want you to hate her
and CERTAINLY not to banish her.  when that is TRULY first and foremost in her
brain, she will regulate HERSELF and place herself in-line with your thinking
and what YOU want her to be.  she also won't try to blackmail you anymore
because she KNOWS it gets on your nerves and all THAT will do is get her
EJECTED sooner rather than later :)

>Her back is on the bed, and I am fucking her missionary, her legs are
>spread and wide in the air, which I am holding. I tell her "see, I control
>you, 

hehe ok... this is a little FAR-FETCHED for me at this point, but I have not
researched it yet :)  I DO like the next line though.

>I go deep in your body because it is the one way to reach you totally
>deep in your mind which no one else can do. 

interesting

>By conquering your body, I can
>conquer your mind (then I drill her a bit more after I finish the sentence so
>she goes more crazy). I play with your body because it lets me control
>your mind (then drill her some more..ha, it is like the ultimate form of
>reward hypnosis).

IS there such a thing as reward hypnosis?  links please? :)

>I ask her, so why you like me. She says she says, you are decisive and
>sometimes I am indecisive, so you make it easy for me. I want the guy
>to make it easy for me to decide what to do (important clue here Maniac!
>maybe most chicks are like this! Maybe this too is where I fucked up
>with HB Geek!)

I have heard this a lot too... only thing is that there is a lot of
RESPONSIBILITY that comes with telling a chick what to do, and if the VALUE of
owning her is not sufficient for me, I don't give a fuck WHAT she does enough
to want to lead her to a good time.

>Moral of the story.. keep your ground.. call all chick bullshit DIRECTLY.
>Make the chick risk fear losing the relationship if she doesn't capitulate
>and chances are she will back down, in spite of how it looks (and I could
>do this BECAUSE I had other choices.. another reason to be fucking
>several chicks at once). As well, it seemed that she was giving me all the
>bullshit in part because she WANTED me to call her on it, and then fuck her
good
>at the end of the night, which I obliged.

chicks give you shit-tests to find out if you are stronger than them and see
HOW you are going to control them.  chicks like the way I control them because
I NARROW their choices for them, but STILL make them choose.  they can choose
the path of ULTIMATE SATISFACTION, or they can choose the path of EJECTION and
being back on the dating scene meeting the SAME LAME GUYS every night :)

you had told her you had a girlfriend, but she seems to have NEEDED to know
that she really COULDN'T have you all to herself and that you really DIDN'T
NEED to fuck her that night or EVER.  you stuck to your guns (after letting her
get to you for a while :-) and she eventually ran out of logic and got
overridden with kino and gave up the fucking pussy like she came there to do :)

>Constructive comments/opinions welcome!
>
>Maniac High
>http://www.pickupguide.com

EXCELLENT!  keep up the GOOD WORK dude!  :)

---
From: erosla77@aol.com (ErosLA77)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 30 Dec 2000 20:12:47 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

>Subject: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit
special!]
>From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
>Date: Fri, Dec 29, 2000 10:37 PM
>Message-id: <92jvre$obh@nnrp1.deja.com>

>)this chick is a very highly educated, driven, professional
> career woman and earns likely a big 6 figure salary
>b)she is very mature, focused and spends all day in her office
> surrounded by sharks and other pirrhana type scumbag characters

 She's got to be in control ALL DAY LONG at work. Small wonder then, with a
man, she wants to fully SURRENDER control and be made to submit.  It's like all
those super-powerful Congressmen and Judges and the like who LOVE going to get
pissed-on and whipped by some Madame Dominatrix. 

>I regroup my thoughts.

 I admire your ability to do this in the field, Maniac. As you think about it,
what do you do internally to re-set yourself and keep yourself in a good frame
of mind when all this shit throws your way?

>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations

   Metahpor is a POWERFUL tool to move folks from a fixed perception to a new
one. Please, share your story!

> Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>her last week, apparently).

Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with fucking; it feels
good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the vulnerabilities.  So
when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which overcomes the
potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. She's worried about pain,
so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not only losing
out on the pleasure of screwing, BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out that if
she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even WORSE
crack-up.

  Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.

>he gets upset, and starts
>screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
>just like her ex-bf,

See? The fear of the pain of being hurt just like her ex-BF hurt her is now
rearing its ugly head.  She doesn't seem like a very emotionally stable person
in ANY event, let alone having just been dumped by a guy.  

>Then I go on to tell
>her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
>that did NOT happen

 Sharp thinking. Again, what do you do internally to keep your state solid and
your thinking sharp? THAT process internally is of great value, even more than
the specifics you share.  The specifics are like handing guys fish; good for a
nice meal and of value. But  how you get to the mind-set is TEACHING someone
HOW to fish so they can eat for life. 

>I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>alone!

 Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to her her
"ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she can then
accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!  

   Excellent...Maniac, I don't give a damn WHAT my orthodox SS followers say,
this is BRILLIANT stuff and I'd be proud to be your wing or have you as mine,
ANY FUCKIN' DAY of the week! Sir, I salute you!

>Now what I am doing with all the above, is not arguing the logic (too
>much)
>of this, because, of course she is right, and I know this.

 Actually, you ARE not arguing the logic, but you are USING the logic...HER
logic..HER way of viewing things.....pointing out WHY and HOW she loses and
what will happen if she doesn't stop it.   It's all centered around losing and
WHY she loses, based on what she has told you.  It IS logical, FROM her point
of view.  

 Great, Great stuff...sir, I salute you!

-----

From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]
Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2000 12:03:54 GMT

Replies to various people about psychicbabe:

Answers to various questions:

Was psychicbabe british, or Japanese?
She was a brit of Japanese ancestry (ie. she
looked 'j', but thought, acted and had an
english accent like a brit). This in my
opinion made it harder, because brit women
are so fucking F A T, and she was so
slender, sexy and attractive (and she dressed
to kill) compared to all of them. Lots of guys were
hitting on her (and she said she always got hit
on, and hated it.. trick was to not make it look
like a 'hit').

Why not a white chick? Well, I had the chance...
but.. at the conference where I met her, EVERY
brit. white chick there was in serious blimp bulge
territory.. very scary. Why is it so many caucasian
women are so FAT?

It was funny though, because something like 8 guys
(I counted) tried to hit on psychicbabe the night
I PU'd her. One guy was pretty good, the rest were
total AFC's..it was rather funny.

Re: Rocks -vs- gold.. how I use it (yes, it is
Jake's metephor. For RJ, search the original post
on fastseduction.com. It is also on pickupguide.com
someplace (if not it will be there in about 2 weeks,
I am revising the page this week). Basically, I intro
it as follows:
After chick says bullshit about wanting to go to
dinner and be friends or shit for 6 months before
becoming a GF, I say: Actually, I dont go to dinner
or stuff like that with ladies who are not my GF
CHick:  gasps!
Maniac: see, going to dinner, is an important step
in a relationship for me. I only share it with someone
special
chick: Huh?
Maniac: Well, let me put it this way, do you ever
sleep with a guy who is just your friend, or dont
care about?
chick: of course not!
Maniac: well, why do you think a guy should do any
different then?
Maniac: See, let me tell you a story. You ever hear
about 'rocks & gold'?
chick: no? what is it?
Maniac: Well, Relationships are valuable things.
And each partner is looking for something. It is like
diamonds (rocks) and gold. Both are valuable.

But women prefer diamonds to gold (usually), and
men prefer gold to diamonds (usually). Of course,
both are important, especially in a long term
relationship, but if a woman could choose, she would
prefer the diamonds  first, and the man would
prefer the gold  first. right?

chick: yeah, probably

Maniac: And (generally), a man can accept gold
without the diamonds, and a woman can accept
diamonds without any gold.

So in a relationship, a woman is mining for
diamonds, while the man is mining for gold.
While they are in the mine together, the
guy gives diamonds he finds to the woman, and
the woman gives the gold she finds, to the man.

But if you give a woman gold only, or a man
diamonds only.. neither is likely to be
very happy, and the relationship will soon
fall apart. In short, an exchange of sorts
takes place in a successful relationship.

And also, if a man expects just gold (sex),
but doesnt want to give her diamonds
(relationship & the mushy stuff), then she
will dump him fairly soon, because he is
playing/using her just for sex..

And if a woman expects just diamonds (walks,
attention, nice dinners, movies..etc) without
giving some gold (sex), then he (if he has any
clue about how to deal with women, though many
men do not, especially in North America) will
dump her because she is using/playing him just
for his personality.

A guy taking a chick to dinners, buying shit
and giving nice walks without sex is THE SAME
as a guy sleeping with a girl, and then kicking her
out right after the fuck is over. (chick says:
'yelch!'. Yes, thats right, and for the guy,
just dinners and buying shit is 'yelch', with
no sex, and no attention is exactly the same.

Because a woman will go to free dinner with
almost any guy, it has no value to me. But
I am like you, I want attention, and I want
to be made to feel special.

And although a girl will go to nice free dinners
with almost anyone, I also know that a girl will
not sleep with anyone. So I know if she does with me,
then it means she thinks I am important. And if
she wont, then it means she doesnt care about me
at all, so I really dont need to see her again,
I will just go find another girl.

Maybe you might think it is unusual for a guy
to think this way, but it is just my way.

See, I dont want to be played. Guys are always
getting played by girls for nice dinners, long
talks on the phone, and for their personalities.
It is the SAME as a girl being used for sex.
So I am happy to give plenty her diamonds, but at
the same time, I dont want to be played, so
I also expect her to want to give me gold.
And if she doesn't, it means she doesnt care about
me, is using me, or it means I am being played,
or I am stupid.

As well, experience has also showed me that
'friends first' almost NEVER results in a
relationship. I mean how many of your BFs were
your friend first (chick usually replies..uh,
zero).

Exactly, so that is why I never play 'friends
first'. Friends first means diamonds for the
lady, and no gold for the guy. That is like
the guy saying (ok, lets fuck for 6 months,
and if its good, we can go to dinner, and go
out, and you can be my GF). Would you like
that (chick: yelch!!).

Exactly.. so that is why it is far better,
that the lady meet me, get to know me, and
then I expect her to be smart enough to know
to take that chance THEN (or reject it, and I will
go get another lady) when it is offered to her.

So that is why I expect things that way in a
relationship with a lady.

After this, a chick is (usually) quite impressed,
or surprised and doesnt know what to say..

[When I recited this to psychicbabe, she actually told me
she was very impressed, that I understood relationships
so well ;-) ]

Had I been smart, I would have used it on HB
geek, and laid her, but after that failure I
thought about it, and then when the same situation
came up with Psychicbabe this week, I knew what
to do..

Ok, now on to other comments..

RJ writes
>Maniac writes:
> >I regroup my thoughts.
>
>  I admire your ability to do this in the field, Maniac. As you think
about it,
> what do you do internally to re-set yourself and keep yourself in a
good frame
> of mind when all this shit throws your way?

A couple things.. first, this PARTICULAR chick is of no importance
to me, because I am (likely) seeing 3 others this week. So it is
not as risky to me to be firm, and keep my ground.

Another important fact, is the way chick's brains are usually
wired. For a
chick, once she likes a given guy, it is hard for her to immediately
switch to another guy. it is far MORE risky, because a chick (unlike
men), usually cannot switch to another guy, once she ALREADY
likes a given guy (story is different BEFORE you got her to
like you..then SHE has more power than you).

So I play on this, and as a result I dont feel nervous/scared at all,
because there is far more to risk to her, than to risk to me. Because
she is stuck to me, but I am not stuck to her. (this also is why
'jerks' can get away with so much shit on any given chick, and why
she will tolerate it.. because her brain has now got her focussed
on THAT guy, and it is now a choice (in her mind), between him (and
his bullshit... or being alone (sure she can get another guy in 10
minutes, but she cannot build those nice feelings of 'attachment'
in 10 minutes.. that gives us men power, once we realize this).

Two, I am generally a very balanced level
headed person, and dont take any of this personally (as you already
know, RJ). Three (in this case), I had
already laid this chick, so I didnt care really if I laid her again
or not.. I already conquered her, and she (and I) already knew that.

If it is a new chick, sometimes, I get more nervous/fucked up (see
HB Geek). I am trying to keep my senses more when this happens

> > Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
> >problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
> >her last week, apparently).
>
> Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with
fucking; it feels

Not sure about this, I think she just simply wanted the fuck, but
wanted to feel she was important to me, and she didnt want to just
get played..

> good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the
vulnerabilities.  So
> when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which
overcomes the
> potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. She's worried
about pain

yes, thats right.

> so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not
only losing
> out on the pleasure of screwing,

Not really. I actually made it clear to her that I didnt care if
she bang me or not. The point was that she had to give her mind
to me, and respect me, and follow me (whether that is bang me,
make her take off her clothes in the window for me, or do my
dishes..whatever.. its not the banging that is important, it is
the submission to me that counts, and what she needs to give me
if she wants my attention at all).

> BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
> believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out
that if
> she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even
WORSE
> crack-up.

Yes

>   Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.
>
> >he gets upset, and starts
> >screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
> >just like her ex-bf,
>
> See? The fear of the pain of being hurt just like her ex-BF hurt her
is now
> rearing its ugly head.  She doesn't seem like a very emotionally
stable person
> in ANY event, let alone having just been dumped by a guy.

No, she is not stable at all. I think though, it is because she
bottles it up all day, to be the 'office bitch' that she has to
be in the daytime. This chick lives for her work. She has no other
life.

>
> >Then I go on to tell
> >her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
> >that did NOT happen
>
>  Sharp thinking. Again, what do you do internally to keep your state
solid and
> your thinking sharp? THAT process internally is of great value, even
more than
> the specifics you share.  The specifics are like handing guys fish;
good for a
> nice meal and of value. But  how you get to the mind-set is TEACHING
someone
> HOW to fish so they can eat for life.

Actually, the specifics are important I think. This is why lay/field
reports with details are so important. I think really shitty on my
feet. I really suck.. bad.

But if I have had that same experience before (with another chick),
or been in that same situation before, and
either succeeded (or failed, and then thought about how to handle it
right the next time), then I will handle it correctly this time.

I really believe in field experience. I have alot... really alot.
so I have seen many of these situations before. It is like chess,
or a foreign language. If you've been there before, and worked out
a solution, then you know what to do. You MUST get field experience.
It is CRUCIAL. And each time you fail, you go home, and see what
you did right/wrong, and what you would do if the same situation
happened again. This is why I also post the fuckup as well as
the lay reports.. they are very valuable to me in gathering my
thoughts and forcing me to think about what I did right/wrong,
as well as listening to the other's comments about them on this
NG.

I also look at the other's reports as well, and learn about
situations, and ask myself for each one, if it happened to me,
what would I do/how would I handle it. Eventually, after doing it
for a couple years (I have been at this in ernest for about 2
years now), you get better at it. Learning situations in PU, is
like learning the words of a foreign language, and how to connect
them all together.. how to move from a bad situation..to a good
one to get the chick in a horny state..

Also, I keep in mind alot about what MrSex4uNYC says about attitude,
and when I get stuck, I ask myself, what would NYC tell me right
now about this situation. He is very congruent, and if you think
things this way, it is easy to be clear what is the right way or
wrong way.

> >I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
> >with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
> >with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
> >and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
> >unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
> >alone!
>
>  Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to
her her
> "ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she
can then
> accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!

Yes, basically that is the idea. I am not sure that it means I am
an authority, but its more, to convey that she is clueless, she
is wrong, so to listen to herself will make her fuck up even more..
..so maybe she had better listen to me instead, and then she wont
fuckup as much.. basically that is the idea..

>    Excellent...Maniac, I don't give a damn WHAT my orthodox SS
followers say,

I didn't get this.. What are orthodox SS followers, and I had no
idea they were saying anything about this.. I really dont understand
what you mean here..

> >Now what I am doing with all the above, is not arguing the logic (too
> >much)
> >of this, because, of course she is right, and I know this.
>
>  Actually, you ARE not arguing the logic, but you are USING the
logic...HER
> logic..HER way of viewing things.....pointing out WHY and HOW she
loses and
> what will happen if she doesn't stop it.   It's all centered around
losing and
> WHY she loses, based on what she has told you.  It IS logical, FROM
her point
> of view.

Yes, basically that is the idea. What I meant was, is that her main
point is that she wants a monogamous BF, and doesn't want to be played.
But, I am playing her, and she (at some level) realizes that, so
in essense, her gut feel about this is totally correct.

But I am playing her desire for the fuck, and her fear of losing
out, which lets me bypassing her gut feel that she is being
played, and then I can get her to fuck anyways.

Good followups everyone!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

-----

From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]
Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2001 12:10:23 GMT

  "Dohn Joe"  wrote:
>  wrote in message news:92n7b96
@nnrp1.deja.com...
> [snip]
>
> The more I think of it, the more this seems to be a great PU.
> I think the PU in England is the gist of your piece of work.
>o I'd be glad to see more
> details on how you picked her up in England, that's the hardest work. How
> did you stand up the crowd? How did you make it not look like a PU?

I was using psychological 'jujitsu' (use the strength of your
opponant, against themself). There is a field report from 2 months
ago, that outlines the PU (check fastseduction.com archives).
Basically, I met her at a conference. I didnt talk to her much.
Then I followed her onto a bus that was taking us to the next
meeting place. A guy was hitting on her, and he sat with her.
I sat on the seat in front bymyself.

She (like most british bitches), started complaining about how
she hates men, and other bullshit. The guy on the bus with her
is taking this/agreeing with it (if I remember right).

I just turned around (and tonality and eye contact here is crucial),
and just tell her in a VERY authoritative voice, slowly.. "perhaps
you have just not met the right man yet, one you understands you,
deeply, and completely. But.. you never know the future.. now do you..
I used killed eye contact, spoke slowly, and continued "perhaps
if you open your mind more, you might find him.. by surprise, without
even expecting it, because often, that is the way it usually is..see"

Psychicbabe went "maybe", and then started more manhating bitching.

I then described the kind of man she wanted "one you could rely on,
but at the same time, be mysterious, and exciting in some unexpected
ways, because he just knew how to reach you deep inside you, and
your mind.. that is what your looking for..isnt' it?"

Psychicbabe: yes,

{continue PU, bunches of stuff from the ManiacPlan, if I remember
right}

The key here was the tonality and Eye-Fuck contact. That is what
did it more than the words I used. I just totally crushed her
with it..

> How did
> you get past her "bitch office" shield? I'm asking especially because, as I
> picture this woman, it would seem pretty intimidating for me to approach
> her.

I had the attitude that she obviously had never met a man that
knew how to give it to her right, which means that she obviously
needed ME far more than I needed her. That mindset made it easy.

> I admire your ability to take her from there into total submission.
> existing relationship than guys. That's why many (even HOT ones) find
> themselves in a dead end - boring or abusive - relationship, love to
> complain about it to whoever they find to listen, yet are unable to step out

EXACTLY!!

> of it. That's why the first fuck is hard - after that she is bound
> emotionally to you. You see,

>Women's sexuality is DISSOLVED in them.

Yes! you understand it!! (true for most, but not all chicks though,
some just like sport fucking, like we do)

> GREAT words to remember for all us RAFCs when we feel like beating the walls
> after a fuckup... I myself am so darn depressed when coming back after an
> unsuccessful encounter with a chick. Yes, each field experience is one more
> lesson

Yes, do NOT underestimately field experience. It is SO important.
I fucked up TONS (see all the fuckup reports I used to post a couple
years ago on ASF), and I still fuckup alot (see HBGeek, or HockeyBabe).
Over on cliff's list they say it takes 2..4 years to get good
at something, and 10 years to be a master. I TOTALLY agree.
I have only been at this for 2.. 2 1/2 years. And the more I learn,
the more I realize I still need to learn.. There is still TONS that
I dont know yet.

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

----
From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:08 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

I, for one, am really GLAD to see a post from RJ that has helped me move
forward in MY game :)  not that I am an ingrate hehe... his contribution to all
this is UNDENIABLE to begin with and if I hadn't stumbeled onto his site, I
would have still been using my caveman tactics and my MENTAL seduction game
would still be lacking.  as much as I appreciate his contribution to the
seduction game in general, I had been disappointed with all the flaming and
nonsense that he and others had/have been involved with because I thought that
this NG was BASED on USEFUL interaction between him and the rest of us, but I
found that not to be the case :(  not that ANYONE gives a fuck what I have to
say about this, but I wanted to back up into the PAST to make it clear that I
appreciate RJ's PERSONAL contribution to the NG TODAY.

In article <20001230151247.26801.00001467@ng-fi1.aol.com>, erosla77@aol.com
(ErosLA77) writes:

>>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations
> 
>   Metahpor is a POWERFUL tool to move folks from a fixed perception to a new
>one. Please, share your story!

I have been doing this without identifying it:

A) find out her perception (marriage, monogamy, sucking dick VS kissing...)
B) "quote" her a story illustrating a chick that saw things a DIFFERENT way
(the way I want HER to see things) and benefitted GREATLY from it (she is still
with me, she got married to the guy she wanted, she gained inner peace and
self-love...)
C) watch her AGREE with something that she just minutes ago BELIEVED was
incorrect, or not for her.

the most fascinating part is (C) because I didn't realize my powers of
validation, pacing then LEADING had developed so strongly.  this is partially
because I am an empath and can FEEL when a chick moves into different emotional
states so I can relate to her from within her own state and effectively "vulcan
mind-meld" with her, turning the TWO of us into a SINGLE, functioning entity so
that I can dictate for US... to a degree.

a frequent situation is chicks asking me if I am single.  basically, I explain
to them that I am in an "open" relationship.  they practically INVARIABLY
disrespect my MLTR for being stupid. "how can she go for that?" "I would have
dumped you" "I would never let a man see other women"...  sooooo :)  I let them
go on and on and get it all out and completely ENTRENCH themselves in the DREAM
of them being with a man like me AND dumping me or CHANGING me or whatever
their BULLSHIT FANTASIES are at the time.  THEN I go into the BENEFITS of being
MY PRIMARY relationship... :)  when I stack up the LIST of BENEFITS and it
stacks HIGHER than those bitches have in their OWN RELATIONSHIPS RIGHT NOW,
they start thinking.  they think about what LITTLE they really have in their
relationships that MY MLTR is getting.  they think about the TRUST and
COMPANIONSHIP between us that they DON'T HAVE with their borefriends.  they
think about how she is SEXUALLY SATISFIED... DAILY if she wants it.  she has
someone to give her the REAL DEAL on how men are and what we want from
chicks... not someone that's going to keep playing her until he is finished
fucking her.  they ALSO see how the other bitches (like them in the near
future) come and go and MLTR CONSTANTLY receives the benefits of being with a
man that does EVERYTHING for her that she could want... for the MERE price of
NOT bailing because I fuck other chicks :)  once I break it down to them, ALLLL
I see on their faces is ENVY.  matter of fact, they tend to look EMBARRASSED
when I ask THEM about THEIR relationships.  oh, that reminds me... the bitches
that DON'T HAVE A MAN AT ALL fare the WORST in these situations.  my MLTR has
NEVER-ENDING SATISFACTION... they have STORIES of what they WOULD DO... IF
they could get a man AT ALL!  :)

chicks would rather have 20% of a WINNER than 100% of a LOSER!

>> Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>>her last week, apparently).
>
>Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with fucking; it
feels
>good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the vulnerabilities.  So
>when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which overcomes the
>potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. 

wow!  VERY powerful :)  I had really considered these to be apples and
oranges... pain of emotions after sex and pain of LOSS of the individual. 
however, discomfort is discomfort.  I quit giving UTILITY to this PIVOT I was
using because I realized she had ZERO self-esteem and not many other redeeming
qualities other than her looks.  she went from LJBF to NEXT overnight.  I had
been using her for a pivot because of her looks, but her lack of personality
started to wear on me and finally, she had to go.  no more hanging out, no more
phone calling, no more help with her love-life... nothing... cold turkey. 
completely FORGOT about her.  about a month or so later, the holiday season
comes around and she  A) calls me  B) tells me she bought me something for
christmas (I bought her NOTHING, not even a CARD and didn't bother to get one
when she told me she bought me something)  C) tells me she wants to bring it TO
my house, and  D) shows up with gift in hand, READY to socialize and spend time
with me.  

this is the SAME bitch that NEVER went in her purse to even OFFER to throw in
money when I used to use her for a pivot.  I didn't mind paying for her though
because the benefits I got from being out with an attractive chick that KNOWS I
am out to get OTHER bitches and facilitates that was well worth it :)  hehe... 
too bad for her, MLTR was over and I received her gift, talked to her for a
while (where she told me her recent "relationship" blew the fuck up in her face
:-) and then ejected her to keep having fun with MLTR.

I have been using outfoxer's style of letting bitches get involved in bullshit
relationships, TELLING THEM the relationships are bullshit then letting them
fall FLAT on their faces and come CRAWLING back to me :)  I just haven't added
the part yet where I get indignant that they are giving sex to CHUMPS that use
them like BITCHES and throw them away.  hehe it is fun enough at this point
just to hear about their FAILURES from the horses' mouths and see the sad looks
on their faces, while I am CONSTANTLY SMILING :)

what you described is BASICALLY what happened to her, except NOT in the sexual
content, but in the companionship content.  she THOUGHT she had a solid
position with me as my pivot, so she didn't feel like paying for anything
because she thought I NEEDED her, not WANTED her.  as soon as I didn't want her
anymore and dumped her from LJBF to NEXT, she was OK with it UNTIL her
relationship BACKFIRED... THEN she decides she wants to get back in good with
ME, which she can't do because I don't give a fuck about her and except for
looks, she can't compete with MLTR AT ALL!

the pain of loneliness overrides the emotional pain of sex without
committment... fascinating :)

>She's worried about
>pain, so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not only
>losing out on the pleasure of screwing, BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
>believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out that if
>she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even WORSE
>crack-up.
>
>  Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.

ok, this is interesting too.  "this is why you fucked up with your ex and I
feel the same way about that particular topic".  you are FORECASTING her
EJECTION unless she changes her ways.  she is still WITH YOU and has a chance
to do the right thing instead of getting ejected.  she already knows how it
feels to BE ejected by her EX and doesn't WANT to go through that pain AGAIN
with you.  you dictate to her HOW she could have avoided it with her EX and she
learns how to avoid it with you and gets in line.  this is another reason why
DICTATING what you REQUIRE from chicks is good, because they have the roadmap
to success or FAILURE with you.  as long as you have demonstrated personality
AND value BEFORE getting to this with her, she will be in a state of "how can I
get my hands on this guy... and KEEP him?" and then you will tell her what she
needs to do to be CONSIDERED amongst your TOP chicks and then is is up to her
to either fulfill her womanly duties or... as you predicted... get ejected and
feel the PAIN OF SEPERATION all over again with someone that she ALREADY knows
she WANTS to be with... WHATEVER the cost.

everyone has their price.  I find, most times, chicks are TALKING with no
EXPERIENCE.  a chick told me that she dumped her borefriend because he laughed
at her.  I told her that the sex must not have been good because otherwise she
would have had to use more than THAT to justify dumping an entire relationship.
 she CLAIMED that sex had nothing to do with her decision and that he didn't
RESPECT her was why she dumped him.  I told her that if the sex had been what
it is SUPPOSED to be... I GUARANTEE her that she would NOT have thrown THAT
away because of some laughing and disrespect.  I also proceeded to laugh at her
AND disrespect her IN HER FACE and told her I don't care because we are not
dating... she can't DUMP ME!   she never ADMITTED that I was right... BUT... by
the end of the conversation, she was asking me WHAT SHE SHOULD DO TO MAKE HER
LOVE LIFE BETTER!  :/  gotcha!

>>I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>>alone!
>
> Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to her her
>"ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she can then
>accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!  

yes.  I really have not been making the MOST of pacing and leading.  I have
been seeing where they ATTACH THEMSELVES to my way of thinking and see me as an
authority.  I have not used this to MAKE POLICY for them... merely to open
their minds and get them to think more efficiently.  you are right though. 
once you capture them... LEAD THEM!  make SOME efficient use of your new
followers... even if you were only practicing or passing time by capturing them
:)

excellent post :)

------

From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:10 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

In article <92n7b96@nnrp1.deja.com>, maniac_high@yahoo.com writes:

>After chick says bullshit about wanting to go to
>dinner and be friends or shit for 6 months before
>becoming a GF, I say: Actually, I dont go to dinner
>or stuff like that with ladies who are not my GF
>CHick:  gasps!
>Maniac: see, going to dinner, is an important step
>in a relationship for me. I only share it with someone
>special
>chick: Huh?
>Maniac: Well, let me put it this way, do you ever
>sleep with a guy who is just your friend, or dont
>care about?
>chick: of course not!

[lots of good use of Jake's shit snipped]

this is interesting, though I couldn't tell if this is something you are GOING
to do, or something you DID already.  either way, IF you are congruent, this
will serve you well as an alternate form of screening.  most of the time, I
screen by ASKING chicks shit and listening to their answers while watching
their faces and body-language.  another way to do it is to basically DICTATE to
them what I need to even CONSIDER being with a chick in any capacity
whatsoever.  most of the time I don't do this though because I can tell already
that the chick is worthless.  I usually get into DICTATION when she asks me
about myself.  am I attached?  what do I look for in a woman? etc.  THEN, since
she asked, I get into the reasons I have chosen women in the past and why I am
still with them in the present.  as I do that, I lay down my laws WITHOUT
telling the chick I am talking to that she needs to get in line with this shit
or get the fuck out of my face.  I have had a couple of chicks blow themselves
out after this.

I was talking to a chick that I know from YEARS ago that started calling me
again and talking about nothing.  I tolerated her for an hour or so on two
different days  A) because I was bored and  B) because through her speech
patterns and recurring ideas, I was learning if she was worth anything to me at
all, considering I get everything I want or need from MLTR in the first place,
she only had a VERY LIMITED use to me, as GOOD backup-pussy.  MLTR is smarter,
more interesting, more fun, less psychotic... basically TRUMPED her in all
areas, so this chick had NO CREDIT with me whatsoever.  I ended up getting into
PRECISELY what you did in your post.  the KICKER was when I told her "I don't
even TALK to girls that I don't want to fuck".  since I had not fucked her AND
had not suggested that we get together (she BELIEVES in monogamous
relationships for herself and even if she fucked me one time, it would be
merely to relieve her own personal stress and I am not going to be there for
her for that.  I am looking for MORE MLTRs... anything else can go fuck off.  I
laughed at her way of being AND broke it down to her why it was so stupid AND
let her know in NO UNCERTAIN TERMS that I was not going to be involved in
ANYTHING CLOSE to what she claims to want for herself... she can STAY HORNY for
all I care) she INTELLIGENTLY asked me WHY I was talking to her...  I let her
know that I found her amusing and her way of living ineffective.  I pointed out
to her that in the YEARS since I had spoken to her last, ALL she had to show
for it was a bungh of jibberish about WANTING a monogamous relationship that
she HAS NOT ATTAINED IN ALL THESE YEARS!  I let her know that I had predicted
that she would REMAIN dissatisfied for years to come and my talking to her
allowed me to follow her LACK of progress while, in the meantime, I get laid
EVERY DAY by MLTR :)   I have not heard from her SINCE that conversation...
good riddance.  she knew what she HAD to do if she wanted more of my time.  she
knew what she was going to have to do IF she wanted to socialize with me at
all.  she felt like her DEVOTION to the idea of a monogamous relationship with
a NON-EXISTANT man was more important than getting fucked by a guy that she
KNOWS and LIKES.  she is an idiot, and will remain horny UNTIL she fucks the
wrong guy, then has NO ONE to comfort her because I will not be there because
she had her chance and BLEW IT!

I have ZERO TOLERANCE for chicks that want things their way.  if they LIKE
doing things MY WAY, then they can be with me...maybe... for a while... as long
as they still LOOK HOT :)   when I approach chicks, I ASSUME they will fail the
screen because statistics show that I require A LOT from a chick and most of
them are either distracted by work or other relationships or just are not
QUALITY enough to be with me.  I find it amusing how ridiculous the SAME girls
are that I used to DESIRE to go out with and that I USED TO dislike being
rejected by.

now, I meet and REJECT girls daily.  not actively, just after I meet them, I
make NO EFFORT to remain in contact with them and go off to talk to other
chicks, leaving them wondering WHY I was interested enough to approach, but
BECAME DISINTERESTED and ejected for a SIMILARLY-GOOD-LOOKING bitch :)

Experiment Report! How kinky are your coworkers?!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



A practice session using the techniques of PU!


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: ]Experiment Report! How kinky are YOUR co-workers?!
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 08:03:45 GMT

]Experiment Report! How kinky are YOUR co-workers?!

This report is about finding the deep dark secrets of
your co-workers (not necessarily to fuck them, but as
a good experiment in state transitioning in groups
rather than one-on-one).

Note, for those readers living in repressed countries
still in the sexual dark ages like the Islamic
Republic of Iran, or the United Stated of America,
I do not advice attempting this..trouble with the
legal system, sex harrassment shit, or loss of
your job could result.. For the rest of you living
in countries that have both feet planted firmly in
the 20th century, no problem, lets rock on- here
is the report!


Recently, I have been doing alot of work practicing
state transitioning. Ie. the goal is to take a
chick (or in this case, group of chicks) from the
"idle state" (ie. thinking about office bullshit
and work they have to do), and transition them
to the kinky "lets get crazy and fuck state" as
quickly as possible, and in as few steps as possible
using a process that will be consistantly successful.

Last night, we had one of these (usually) boring
office departmental dinner parties at a stuffy
restaurant in town. BORING!!

So I decided what better place to liven things up
and see what I can get away with using psychological
warfare and a little bit of alcohol in an otherwise
formal group setting.

I get there, and sit at a table with 1 guy, and
5 chicks. For the first 30 minutes, it is boring,
I let everyone talk about boring office shit so
that everyone can arrive, and the food can start.

First I arrange the waiter to bring drinks to the
table (we need it later for one of the games I
am going to do), and get started on that right away.
One of the chicks only drinks tea, but that is OK,
later she really got into it anyways in spite of
being stark sober.

At the table is sitting:
ChinaGuy - he is from China
Mombabe - she is a mom, but wild & crazy, 40s (starts
          by sitting at another table)
HB CaptHook - she had a mild eye infection and is
              wearing an eyepatch this week (starts by
              sitting at another table)
HBStrict - she only drinks tea, but is more action
           than she looks
ScaredChick - she thinks we are all wierd
HBWhoMe? - she looks SO straight, but is the kinkiest
           at the table we find out!
Bichick - we find out she had enjoyed some bi games

Other assorted people sitting farther, who dont
play in the games really..

After that, I start. Here is how I did it. Refer
to the 'Maniac plan' post I made a couple weeks ago
(it is archived in fastseduction.com, I will also put
it on my site in Jan. when the next big update
happens) for some of the terminology below. I move
all the chicks (as a group), through all the states
as follows:

[Current State: Idle: chicks talking about office bullshit]
Maniac>Bichick: So what did you do this weekend?
Bichick: Nothing really.. how about you?
Maniac>I went to my dance circle, I like salsa dance
Bichick: oh really? {other chicks starting to listen}
Maniac: Yeah, I went to Brazil this year too, it was so
        much fun, wanna see my pictures?
Bichick & others: 'yes!' (take out my digi-PC, show pictures
        of carnival in Rio, tback bikini babes, the gay parade
        and debauchery in the streets)
Maniac: You know, the culture is SO different, brazilian people
        are SO passionate!
All chicks: oh really?
Maniac: yep, after I left Rio, I went to Sao Paolo, and
        went into this bar and all of the sudden this brazilian
        chick grabbed me and started french kissing me (perform
        SP chick story from ManiacPlan).

[Current State: (A)dmiration & (M)an now achieved from ManiacPlan]
Bichick: Oh, HB Capthook lived in brazil a few years!
Maniac: really? {I go to her table, ask if she wants to see
        some brazil carnival pictures with us.. she runs over
        to our table}
Maniac>all chicks: you know, I respected that SP chick though
       because she was not afraid to take what she wants..
       kind of like Madonna (perform the Madonna story from
       ManiacPlan).
Maniac: Perform 'how to communicate to lady at all levels
        and pay attention to her and what she wants' story
        from ManiacPlan, while doing lots of Kino on
        HBCapthook sitting next to me as a demonstration.
        Others are watching and getting jealous..

[Now try to introduce the (S)ex state from ManiacPlan..
the goal here is to do the "questions game, but in a
group setting.. so I decide to do it via a drinking game]
Maniac: {now I try to introduce a drinking game called 'I
       never'}, Hey, do they have any good drinking games in
       Japan.
Chicks: {they suggest some really lame boring shit like
         remembering names of subway stations..boring!!!}
Maniac: Well, I know two games, Chandelliers {I describe this
        game.. but we wont play it, not sexual}, and then
        "I never" {I describe "I never"}.
[Now here, I think I dont have enough rapport yet to start
"I never" (a drinking version of "questions") and get it to
work well (ie. sexually), so first I preform the "Strawberry
fields" game in a group (in next post, and included below)

<>>

We play the game: (mombabe hears us laughing, comes
over & kicks Chinaguy out of his chair so she can sit
next to us)

Among the answers to "strawberry fields"
Bichick: "uh, I dont see any fence around the field!"
HB Capthook & mombabe: "as many as I can eat!"
HBStrict: "to the farmer.. uh.. Thank you {and bow}"

We were all laughing and rolling on the floor to the
various chicks answers to this game, with lots of "I cant
believe you?! really?!" reactions among the ladies..

[Current state in ManiacPlan: (S)ex now achieved, now
lets intensify and see what these chicks will say/do.
I am putting LOTS of shoulder/back kino on all the
ladies as the game is playing]

Maniac: OK, time for another game, we will play that
 "I never" game we talked about before. {Maniac explains
 howto play "I never"} [easy.. each person takes a turn,
 say "I never xxx", whoever did "xxx" has to take a drink.
 start light, get game sexual ASAP..]

Maniac: here is the opening question: "I never kissed a
 member of the opposite sex before I was 15 y.o."
{3 girls drink}
Maniac: your turn HBCaptHook
HBCaptHook: uh, I dont understand the game yet, can you do
  the next question Maniac?
Maniac: OK, I never kissed a guy on the first date
{we all drink}
HBCaptHook: OK I get it, my turn "I never had sex with a
 guy on the first date" {notice because of the setup with
 straberry fields here, that the chicks ON THEIR OWN, turned
 the game sexual without me having to do anything! This was
 what I worried about if I were to start the "I never" game
 before straberry fields.. the mood was just not sexual
 enough yet, and the game would have fizzled.. but now..
 no problem!}
{all but 1 chick drinks (HB afraid.. who is looking a bit
 uncomfortable now)}
Mombabe: I never kissed a member of the same sex
{Bichick drinks!.. lots of "oh really?!? and discussion
 ensues, but bichick wont delve into it anymore ;-) }
Bichick: I never had sex with more than 4 people in the
 room.
{bichick, HBstrict and HBWhoMe all drink!}
HBAfraid: I never went to california
{we all look at her wierd.. skip to next girl}
HBWhoMe: I never did sex as part of a performance in front
of others
{Maniac, Bichick and HBWhoMe drink.. HBStrict looks envious,
others gasp and are laughing.. rest of our dept, is looking
at us, like why we are having so much fun, and a bit wierdly,
fortunately they cannot hear what we are saying ;-)}
Maniac: I never had sex with someone and didn't know their
 name till the next morning.
{We all drink except HB afraid}
MomBabe: I never used tool, or vibrator during sex
{we all drink}
HBCaptHook: I never had sex with a cat?!
{we all look at her wierd.. no one drinks}
HBCaptHook: but it can happen, I saw it on video once!
{we look at her more strange, and make her drink for watching
the video}
HBAfraid: I cant think of any question
{we skip her, next girl}
..
Maniac: I never was tied/tied up my partner during sex
{Maniac, HB strict, HBCapthook and HBWhome all drink}

Maniac: I see, so who is "S", and who is "M" {explain to
 a couple clueless chicks which was which}
HBWhoMe and HBStrict are serious S type, Bichick is both.
HBStrict makes a pass at me, and I reply only if you are
serious.. she stares at me long (maybe a future there ;-) )
I shake hands and hug HBWhoMe, who is really into this
thread of questioning.

Mombabe now makes ajoke about why I went to lunch today
with this other chick (not in the game), and not her. I
tell her because she didn't ask me.. girls have to take
what they want, like that SP chick. I ask her if she
likes me, she says yes, and I gesture (and get) a cheek
kiss. I am CERTAIN I could have done a KC, or even one
of those 3way KCs, but I remember that this is an
experiment, and I do have to see all these people on Monday
again at work, so I dont push it.

now adminbabe (the dept head's secy) comes by our table
and asks how many of us are going to the prescheduled
after-party karaoke. Mombabe replies "none of us, we are
all going to a hotel".. HBCapthook adds in "a love hotel..".

[Final state: Dying to fuck: achieved]

Adminbabe looks at us wierd (she missed the whole thing),
and leaves. Mombabe now asks why I have such a harem tonight,
and then Bichick remarks how all the ladies in the office
really really like you Maniac.

I ask 'why?'
bichick says.. you smile, and laugh alot.. but there is
something else.. we all see it, but cant really
describe what it is {maniac opinion.. it is the way
I stare at chicks with the 'fuck me' luck, and all the
shoulder kino..etc, I do, even in the office}.

Supper now is wrapping up, we all have to go, I remark
that this table is fun, and that another night, we should
all meet again for beer and fun.. everyone agrees.

As we are going back, HBCaptHook and mombabe are grabbing
all over me, it was funny.

Some go home, and I split off from the group, as I have
a date with karatebabe at midnight in another part of
town..

Experiment over..

I learned that state transitioning is a very predictable,
reproduceable process, once you learn the tools to do it.
This was just my office staff that is around me, so made
a good subject for the experiment. I also realized, that
in groups, there is a sort of feed back effect, so you
can really accelerate things. It wasnt the alcohol because
HBstrict had nothing to drink, but was well into the
game too.

Because it was a group, I could skip steps "BVG,D,O" in
the ManiacPlan, and reach the last state.. (dying to fuck)
so I likely could have taken any (or all)
of those ladies back for a wild time in the sack (which I
wont do, because I work with them.. but there was nothing
stopping it, thats for sure)..

Fascinating..

Constructive Opinions/comments anyone?

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Doing proper ‘closes’

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Nightlight introduces 'forest game'!



From: nightlight9@hotmail.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: More like "4 questions" game?
Date: Thu, 02 Nov 2000 19:50:10 GMT

You mention all these, but most of them are not very useful in the
initial meeting because they are too cerebral and too random.  Try ones
that are more viceral.  You are walking in a dark forest.  How do you
feel.  (how she approaches life).  You could to a wall with a door.
What do you do? (how she approaches obsticalls).  You look down and see
a cup on the ground what is it made out of? (how she views wealth).
You come to some water, describe it. (how she views sexuality).
Always end with sexuality because it is  a good topic for PU and
demonstrates you are comfortable with women and people a sexual context.

BookGuy, my comments are based on experience and field testing.  Please
do the same if you reply.

--
NightLight9
Just be yourself... smooth with interesting questions and interesting
answers.

Maniac High's Pick Up Girls Guide and Seduction Website! » field

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Maniac uses a power opener to meet and tongue down a chick!


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Maniac meets HBOrderMe! Bar PU
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 05:00:36 GMT

Maniac meets HBOrderMe! Bar PU
001215

This is an interesting bar PU. .
used it to not lay the chick, but to get higher rapport
with the other guys around.

It is bo-nen-kai (end of year party) season in Japan.
After the party (boring, in a big hotel ballroom)
we go to the ni-ji-kai (after party) in a bar/disco
in Roppongi with a bunch of my coworkers (mostly guys,
and some ladies).

One AFC guy is really into this HB. He is making every
AFC mistake in the book (saying she is pretty, sucking
up to her..blah). Progress is really slow.

Me and all the guys are watching. He gets frustrated and
leaves for a bit. I move in on the chick (she is wearing
a high cut black dress, and fishnet stockings... very cute).

My opener is the strawberry game.. I just go up to her,
and say 'imagine you are in a field, and you see a strawberry
field ahead of you, with a fence around.. how high is the
fence'. She goes right into it.

Then I do the interpretation (see strawberry game post
for the game and interpretation) for her. I ask her what
she thinks (she said 1m high fence, 50 strawberries, sorry
to the farmer). She disagrees the interpretation. Then I
ask her what is your idea guy like (brad pitt). Then I say
besides his looks why you like him. Reply: he is really
guy.

Then I ask, what do you want most in a guy's character.
She says, 'I want him to lead, to decide for me what to do.'
Good.. Maniac keeps that in mind for what comes next. .

AFC guy comes back, and I let him have his chick back for
a while. He is doing more regular AFC stuff, though he
has at least initiated kino.. very good. He does this for
like 20 minutes, but isn't really breaking through.

He gets frustrated, goes. I tell the guys 'watch this',
and go up to the chick, and say I am going now, give me a
kiss. I get a cheek kiss.

I look straight into her eyes, and tell her 'thats not
good enough, look into my eyes.. what do you see.. now
give me a real kiss..' a long tonguedown with sexual kino
ensues.. Everyone else sees what I just did, after spending
not even a total of 5 minutes talking with this chick
from before.

I leave the chick, and go back to the guys.. 'that is how
it is supposed to be done'. Respect of me from my guy co-workers
now goes up 10x from whatever it was before, and was visibly
different in the office the next day.

AFC co-worker comes back and tells me how so much he is
in love with this girl (I guess he knew her from before as
a friend or co-worker or something..not sure.. I had never
met her before though). As a result, I defer to him, and let
him get AFC'd out.

I go back to the other guys, and just say, I could take her
(she lives really close actually, so I could just say I
live far and can I crash at her place.. I am sure the answer
would have been yes) whenever I want. They say 'why dont you'?

I reply, well, AFC guy is really into her, and he is a coworker
of mine who I respect, so I dont want to take his chick away
from him. There are lots of chicks to fuck, and this one means
nothing to me at all, but she is important to him, so best to
leave it at that.

I go on to say that all I wanted to know is that I COULD take her
home if I want (and I might next week or something, I got her
number) and now I know that, so it is enough for me, I dont
need more.

Respect from co-workers now goes up another 10x for this, because
I and they KNOW that this is true after what they just saw. .

He continues to AFC for a long while, and I get tired and go
home. Next day I hear that she blew him out almost as soon as I
left.

Now this was cool, because the goal wasn't really to lay the
chick (which I still might if I decide to see her again), but to
increase stature with co-workers, which can help in other ways
in my regular life.

Now one thing to note, is that I cannot do this every time (heck
not even close.. this is like the 3rd or 4th time it has ever happened
so directly like this). I was
really lucky, because of what she said to my 'what you like in
guy question', it was just so EASY to know what this chick
expected me to do, and it was really easy to stage it to happen
in front of all the other guys once I clued in on this.

I WISH I could do it everytime, but life isnt really like that ;-)
Mr. SMooth can do it though!

Constructive comments and opinions welcome!
Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Using the ‘color’ game to PU!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Using the 'color game' to do a PU!


From: tonymcneill@my-deja.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Colours Game - opinions?
Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 00:43:35 GMT

 Hi Guys,

I've just field tested this pattern / game for creating an erotic and
horny state - worked a dream:) I'd be interested to know what you think
of this and how it might be improved.....

I suppose it might work best with the more visually thinking babes.

This is not a 'word for word' pattern by any means, by the way - I just
kind of found myself going into it on the fly.....  here we go..

The PUA "notices" the colour (UK spelling by the way for those who might
feel the urge to correct me) of an object, item of clothing etc.

PUA - "I find these yellow walls (or whatever) quite uplifting;
especially in the winter. Isn't it nice to have some bright colours
around when it's so grey and dark outside?" "Do you think that colours
have an big effect on peoples' moods?".

HB - "Oh, yes, definitely."

PUA - "Hmmm. I was just wondering......I mean....... I was in one of
those New Age shops recently and they were selling lots of different
coloured sunglasses.... with the idea that, if you wanted to feel more
of a certain mood, or to look at the world in a certain way, you would
slip on a pair of sunglasses which would colour everything you looked at
in the desired tone" "Do you think that could work in any way?"

HB - "Well, maybe. I don't know really"

PUA - "Well, for example, my bedroom is a very pale blue colour and I
find this particular blue very restful" "I mean, can you imagine
sleeping very well in a pale blue room?" "Imagine you are really tired,
you know when your eyelids are heavy and you curl up with that fantastic
feeling of at last ... just letting go.... and .....giving
yourself...to....(sp perhaps?).. sleep'" "Do you have a sense of a
particular colour when you imagine that feeling?" (Make sure she's
imagining being sleepy).

HB - "Oh, maybe blue, or green" (or whatever). (If she doesn't come up
with one then maybe she could be asked to imagine the perfect colour for
a bedroom, but both of the HB subjects I tried got right into it.)

PUA "How about when you feel....really full of great ideas...... like
you have all sorts of inspiration flowing through you.?"

PUA then procedes to get HB to imagine a few other states (feeling very
inspired and spiritual (commenting on her choice of colour in a playful
way)...... bursting with energy ...... feeling very sensual,
relaxed and open (we're getting closer, gentlemen)......and eventually,
 being full of passion and horny), and slowly visualising a colour with
each one.

You get the picture - guiding her into these states,
comparing colours etc etc. I have tried this on two chicks, both of whom
LOVED the game and got right into imagining the states. One of them was
an ex who is of great value as a pivot / social proof (and a friend) so
I was testing the game with her rather than going for the lay and the
other HB, in spite of being pretty shy, blushed madly and was VISIBLY
remembering the joy of being fucked until she screamed with pleasure ;)
(At this point Tony is feeling a bit fucking pleased with himself).
I think this would have definitely resulted in a fuck had I not been
meeting her at lunchtime before going off to work :( (at this point Tony
is disgusted as well as pleased!!)

What do you 'real' PUAs think of this little game? As I said I somehow
went into it on the fly after having the idea while practicing
improvising patterns while driving, using things I saw on the road as
starting points for pattern-talk. So it's pretty new and I, as yet,
claim only to be a humble RAFC. Going to test it some more and post the
results....



Any suggestions or comments?

Tony

--
'Action' is the magic word

Setting up the Kiss Close

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

A way to set up the kiss close

From: erosla77@aol.com (ErosLA77) Ross Jeffries
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 26 Dec 2000 19:23:44 GMT
Subject: Re: What if...

>Subject: Re: What if...
>From: eclipse19@my-deja.com
>Date: Tue, Dec 26, 2000 12:04 AM
>Message-id: <929jdt$u6t@nnrp1.deja.com>
>
>In article <9299s4$o03@nnrp1.deja.com>,
>  charnel1278@my-deja.com wrote:
>> Hey all,
>>
>> I've checked out a Maniac's, and some others websites and most say
>that
>> when you ask "Do you wanna kiss me?", you're guaranteed a kiss, unless
>> you get a flat out NO.  None, from what I saw, said what to do when
>you
>> get that NO.  Do you continue on the conversation like nothing
>> happened? Do you come back with a similar question later in the
>> evening?  If so, won't she kinda feel that you're badgering her?
>> Granted, this won't happen often, but what if?....
>>
>> Laters.
>
> the standard (canned) reply to a "no" answer is "YOU really know how
>to ruin a moment....your old boyfriends must have hated that about you"
>I think i got this off tony or maniac's site, forget which one. I
>havent ran into a direct "no" answer myself so i havent field tested
>this, but im sure others have. From what i read(or remember anyhow)
>this will leave them stunned and they will show less resistance against
>another kiss.
>
>

 Hmmm......well, I like this "you really know how to ruin a moment" response
WITHOUT asking for the kiss first. "Asking" for anything, outside of the
presence of fun(as in, on the spur of the moment saying, "Hey...wouldn't it be
fun to go to a strip club? Let's go!))  seems pretty pathetic to me.  

    A good one is to notice her giving you that look and then say(and I got
this from a student, it is NOT mine).  "If ? were to ask you on a scale of one
to ten, how good a kisser are you, what would you say?"

 Listen for her answer, then say, "If you were to kiss me right now, how do you
think I'd rate you?"

  You do this ONLY when you see "the look".......

  "let's find out" you say and kiss her.  

IF she backs away from that, then the "you really know how to ruin a moment"
comment works great.  Come to think of it, this could really work for a
cancellation as well. 

---

From: "General Snafu" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: What if...
Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2000 22:57:08 GMT

If she says no to a kiss, ask for a BJ.  If she says no to the BJ, you are
SOL for the night.

 wrote in message
news:9299s4$o03@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Hey all,
>
> I've checked out a Maniac's, and some others websites and most say that
> when you ask "Do you wanna kiss me?", you're guaranteed a kiss, unless
> you get a flat out NO.  None, from what I saw, said what to do when you
> get that NO.  Do you continue on the conversation like nothing
> happened? Do you come back with a similar question later in the
> evening?  If so, won't she kinda feel that you're badgering her?
> Granted, this won't happen often, but what if?....
>
> Laters.
>
>
> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/

Game: The Wall and the Forest

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Maniac introduces "The Wall and the Forest", a PU game.



From maniac_high@yahoo.com 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Game: The wall and the forest
Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 16:18:24 GMT

Another one of those mindfuck games like 4 questions or the cube:

"The Wall and the Forest"

-You are walking in a field, you see a wall, how high is it, and
how do you get by it? [wall = pride, and also how you get past
obstacles]

-you continue walking, and you see a house [kind of house you dream
to have later in life]

-you see a key on the ground, you go to the house, does the key
open the door? [if yes, means you can get married]

-you go in the house (if you were able to open with the key), and
 on the first floor you see a table and chairs, how many chairs are
 there? [means how many people in your future family]

-now you go outside, and see to one direction a dense dark forest, and
 the other way, a less dense/brighter wooded area. Which way do you
 go? (dark forest=expect something, but unknown, take a chance)
     (bright wooded area=easygoing style/way)

-as you walk you then see a lake nearby. How big is it, and how deep
 is it? (big=size of your heart, depth=depth of your heart)

THE END


This game could be lethal for chicks who want to get married or
something like that. Make sure you answer the right answers when
you tell her "what your answers were" after you finish her turn!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Game: Forest

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Nightlight introduces 'forest game'!



From: nightlight9@hotmail.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: More like "4 questions" game?
Date: Thu, 02 Nov 2000 19:50:10 GMT

You mention all these, but most of them are not very useful in the
initial meeting because they are too cerebral and too random.  Try ones
that are more viceral.  You are walking in a dark forest.  How do you
feel.  (how she approaches life).  You could to a wall with a door.
What do you do? (how she approaches obsticalls).  You look down and see
a cup on the ground what is it made out of? (how she views wealth).
You come to some water, describe it. (how she views sexuality).
Always end with sexuality because it is  a good topic for PU and
demonstrates you are comfortable with women and people a sexual context.

BookGuy, my comments are based on experience and field testing.  Please
do the same if you reply.

--
NightLight9
Just be yourself... smooth with interesting questions and interesting
answers.

Game: Strawberry Fields

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Maniac introduces a PU game: Strawberry Fields!
[Note, this originally comes from the book 'Kokology']


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Game!: Strawberry fields
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 08:02:40 GMT

Game!: Strawberry fields
001117

This is a game to find out some things about how chicks
see sex. It is very popular in Japan & is a good state
transitioner

--

Intro: Hey, lets play a game!

Imagine you are alone in a field, and see a straberry field
in front of you with tasty strawberries.

There is a fence/gate around the field. How high is it?
(= how easy is this girl/guy to take sex)

Now you are in the straberry field, how many straberries
do you take?
(=how many BFs/GFs that person wants)

Ok, after you have finished enjoying the strawberries,
how do you feel about the farmer, who's field you took them
from?
(=how you feel to that person after fucking them)


The end

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

TPUA night PU’s HB Smallmouth and converts to a lay!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

[TPUA PU's a chick at night, and converts it into a lay!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com
]


Date Posted: 2000/09/25 05:21:37 AM EDT
Author: Tokyopua 
Subject: Re: HB Small Mouth PU  (Was Re: Calling all Tokyo PUA's)

Hey Maniac,

I didnt really intend that last post of mine as a field report, since it
wasnt too detailed.  But yeah, things have been going well on the PU despite
my severely limited time. So I will attempt a bit of a field report on the
initial PU here.  My PU efficiency factor has been really high recently,
maybe because I am only trying to PU when I feel really confident and often
times when I wasnt planning on it, so was really relaxed. I did a PU on a 19
year old HB college student in the train the other night and got her home
phone number.  It was easy cause she was reading Tokyo Classified, and I
asked her about it. I was really confident, and in only 2 stops got her to
really dig me.  In fact, when I asked her why she had studied English, she
said "So I could meet a guy like you!"  The only problem is finding time to
meet her again before I leave.

The PU I did on HB Small Mouth was not planned either, I just saw her
walking back home around my place at midnight, and somehow knew that despite
my frazled appearance after 2 hours of Jujitsu practice and carrying 40
pounds of luggage, I could do the PU on her.  My opening line was "I like
your hair" which I knew was lame and she must have heard often, but hey,
thats the price of using the 3 second rule sometimes.  I immediately
followed with asking her if she was a student, what kind of work she did,
etc.  Oddly, I didnt use my standard opener "Do you speak english" in the
whole conversation.  I will post my personal notes on the rest of the PU at
the end of this post just for reference, but they arent too coherent.  They
were the basis though for the plans I laid for the successful next date that
got me laid 3 days later.  (If I have time someday I will write up full
notes on that too.) Total time to lay in terms of time invested was
approximately 3.5 hours, about the same as HB Physics, my other recent
street PU who I did that same day.  This efficiency is possible if the
progression is done just right, I think.

 wrote in message news:8qfler$o1r@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Tokyo PUA,
>
> This is an excellent report.. You really rock!
>
> Where / how did you originally
> PU this chick though? Also, taking the chick over to see your
> weight training stuff is a clever idea.. liked that..!
> BTW, I thought you left already to the USA, how long are you still
> there for?

Right near my house in a dark alley at midnight on her way home!  She told
me later (post lay) that she was scared at first, but I had a really relaxed
attitude so she got comfortable with me afterwards.  As for the weight
training stuff later, it was great kino as I had her bend over slightly and
got right behind her to "help her with her form" while simultaneously
letting her slightly feel the form of my stiff wood pressed against her, and
other such intimate situations.

Still here till Oct 14 or so, with a trip to Taiwan and maybe Hawaii too
thrown in.

>
> ALso, do you usually go out alone, or with a wing. I noticed that
> you knew quite a few people in Roppongi, I guess you get out there
> quite a bit?

Been out there a lot since last February, maybe 10 times or so.  I guess
predominantly I go with a wing, but sometimes felt it screwed up my game.
Of course, my wings didnt know anything about seduction a la ASF, thats
probably why.  Of course, neither did I till June... I know Im much better
at street PU when alone though, thats for sure!  OTOH, when I went out to
clubs with you and Rio, I think my game was really improved and I was
learning all the time.
BTW, I have heard that someplace called club Earth near hamamatucho has
really hot babes, (bitch shield too, but who cares, right;-), so you guys
might want to check that out.  3000 Yen cover charge.  May be the new
alternative to Fura?

>
> > I managed to lay that HB Small Mouth
>
> EXCELLENT!
>
> >Ganbatte!  Im seeting HB Bi this weekend again (tonight), and HB
> >small the next day, and my ex-GF the next.  Im starting to feel like
> >Maniac juggling girls, but nothing will happen w/ my ex, so its not
> >so bad.
>
> Yes, I did that ALOT last year, and fucked a shitload of chicks that
> I cant even count now..
>
> but its really tiring and you do get sick of it after a while..
> so finally I just MLTR'd a few that I really liked, who also accepted
> that I fuck other chicks, and left it at that.. guess I got to get out
> more ;-)
> not sure if its the right way yet, but been doing it that way
> the last few months now.. We'll see ;-)

I think it goes in cycles.  Eventually you get tired of the MLTR's and have
to replace them.  To do that you will have to PU lotsa new chicks, lay them,
see if they dont eject when you break the news that there are others.  That
takes a lot of time, so then you want to go back to the easy life of having
a bunch of girls on call.  Then the cycle starts over.  Im just beginning to
get these girls into MLTR status, but now I have to leave.  But theres
always business trips ack here!

>
> If you are planning on hanging around TOkyo though, you should
> bring HB Bi and her friend to one of our fuck parties the next time..
> sounds like they'd be a good time.. maybe introduce them to Kipp or
> something since I am not there right now, before you leave.. or
> give me your departure date and see if they are interested and we
> can setup something with all the ladies, if this is your sort of thing..

Id consider it, but it will take more effort, and probably wont be anything
I can do until after Im gone and come back for business trips.  You see, I
worked it too good with HB Bi.  She is signing her letters with "Love" at
the end and is all into me now.  Made me the most awesome meal any woman has
ever made me, washed my clothes, gave me an amazing massage, etc.  When I
confronted her about our last threesome, she said that she felt jealous when
she saw me doing her friend, and claimed that was the only time she had ever
done something like that, that she isnt really Bi.
So right now I think she somehow sees a relationship in this, despite my
leaving?  I figure once Im gone I can get past that as reality sinks in and
maybe set up more stuff for any business trips I make back.

>
> Good post!
>
> Maniac
> http://www.pickupguide.com

Here are those notes I was talking about, for what they are worth:

-------------------------------------------
PU of HB Small:  happened in a dark alley shortcut to my house at midnight,
I approached carrying a 30 pound backpack on one shoulder and a 10 pound
bucket of protein powder in the other, and said,  $B!H (BExcuse me, your hair is
really beautiful. $B!I (B  She reacted favorably and said thanks, but kept
walking, slightly faster.  She seemed young, so I asked if she was a
student.  She said no, I asked what she does.  She said she works for a
cable company, I fluff talked about watching TV.  She asked what I do.  I
said I know its late but you should have coffee or tea with me at Jonathans
restaurant nearby.  She said no, so I said, OK, how do we meet again.  She
said give me your number and I said,  $B!H (BAh, but I know women, if I give you
my number you will get nervous and never call. $B!I (B  She said  $B!H (BNo, 
that wont
happen I promise. $B!I (B  I knew I didn $B!G (Bt have enough rapport or 
anything to
believe that, so really what I was just doing was stalling till I could set
up a firm date.

I got a pen and wrote my number and at this point we are standing on the
corner near my place.  I play on Japanese cuteness and write my name with
hearts by it.  (None of this is stuff I would be able to do in the US.)
Then I say, OK, when are we going to meet.  Its sort of a way to pace the
ongoing reality now that she has my number,its a logical extension.  The
number is just a formality to me, I want to set up the date.  After some
negotiation, I get a date set up for 6 PM Tuesday, her day off.  I had given
her alternatives between my place and eating in Tachikawa nearby (but both
already had the presuppostion that we are meeting for a date, so I don $B!G (Bt
care which she chooses).  She chose Italian in Tachikawa which is perfect
cause eating carbs increases seratonin (=relaxation), so I will lay on the
patterning after a while, maybe even order a glass of wine (more seratonin
and romance) for us both.  Then its a 5 minute taxi ride back to my place!

Anyway, we keep talking.  I get that she never has met a foreigner, that she
likes Richard Gere, cause he is  $B!H (BShibui $B!I (B. $B!! (B(=quiet, simple, 
sober,
tasteful, austere, parsimonious, etc.)  I asked her about her ideal man
while doing the (SP) thing.  She really accessed a lot and I was awakening
her creative centers.  I touched her a lot on the arm to anchor the good
feelings.   She said she really was too ideal, but that her ideal guy was
like her father, sweet and nice.  I asked if she wanted a guy who made her
feel safe, and she said yes.  I compared our hand sizes and got kino,
remarked at how small her hands were, that my big hands could protect her.
Complemented her smile and said that it seems like her eyes smile too and
she said that she is often told that.  She said I was skillful at
complementing and I said that I really meant it.

I mirrored her body positions a lot and this seemed to have a good effect.
She seemed really into it and wasn $B!G (Bt trying too hard to get away despite 
it
being after midnight and having to work the next day, only bringing up the
time when I did.  She was rubbing her earlobe, and later playing with her
ponytail in a really sexy way, all with the doggy dinner bowl look.
I also showed kanji ability and had her write her name, and demonstrated how
we could study English together, all using the Zaurus.  (BTW, Did you buy
one yet, Maniac? A useful tool in many ways.  You can turn it into a
portable digital photo album too, albeit poor quality...) She liked that.
At one point she asked what was in the bucket, I said protein powder and she
said  $B!H (Bnomitai! $B!I (B and I said  $B!H (B5 fun dake areba, nomeru 
yo. $B!I (B
(If you have 5
minutes I can give you a taste).  But she refused to go to my apartment and
I didn $B!G (Bt press the issue, I just reconfirmed our fun date on Tuesday, and
gave her a kiss goodnight, then took off.
----------------------------------

-T

ASF reader comments on above story

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website: 

http://www.pickupguide.com 

Many excellent followups to the Psychicbabe re-lay report!
Mrsex4unyc, RJ..etc..etc.

From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:05 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

In article <92jvre$obh@nnrp1.deja.com>, maniac_high@yahoo.com writes:

>The immediate gold to take care of this, is to now make the
>relationship very high stakes for her. I can do this because
>I know that she is into me (from what she said at the dinner),
>so the idea is to play it that if she doesnt do her job as a
>chick.. she will lose EVERYTHING as far as I am concern.
>Ok, that is the plan, here we go:

plan or no plan, essentially, you are telling her the truth.  on a long-enough
timeline, the survival rate for EVERYONE is ZERO.  sooner or later, everyone
you love will either leave you or die.  chicks don't seem to believe in this,
though it is the absolute truth.  they think that they can relate to you
FOREVER, REGARDLESS of what they do or how they act.  you are telling her HOW
she can REMAIN with you and what is going to get her EJECTED.  even though it
takes a long time, so it doesn't SEEM like this... this is what has happened to
EVERY chick's relationship that has gone away.  EVENTUALLY, she was not
fulfilling her womanly duties and her man left her for a   chick (younger,
sexier, richer, swallower...)  EVEN if she IS fulfilling her duties, if her man
like it from another chick MORE, she loses out either in a PERCENTAGE of her
benefits or she gets DUMPED and loses ALL of her benefits.  you are merely
explaining this to her and telling her what she needs to do IF she wants to be
with you... which you have already determined.  you are SELLING, and now you
are screening her to see if she is QUALIFIED and ABLE to buy.

>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations
>in relationship. 

I am getting to the point where I am going to do this.  I never do this with
chicks because I morph into whatever THEY are looking for and hook them that
way.  the thing for me is that being 10 months in with MLTR, she has REALLY
learned how to please me and the time I spend TEACHING her has become minimal
and the time I spend ENJOYING her is increasing :)  it is getting tougher and
tougher for other chicks to get my attention, because anything LESS than what I
have already is BULLSHIT to me.  the time I am spending talking to chicks is
mostly eliciting values and breaking their perceptions... just for fun :)  I
know IMMEDIATELY if I want sex from a chick, and if I don't, she is IMMEDIATELY
LJBF and I use her for practice and NEXT her at the end of the conversation.

I am seriously going to consider moving to a "demonstration of value -> SOI"
model, just because I have lost my patience with LISTENING to these bitches
talking about shit that really doesn't mean anything.  I know I am going to
NEXT them ANYWAY as soon as I realize they can't compete with MLTR, so why
listen to their shit FIRST?  I may as well let them know how great I am and
let them know what kind of woman I am willing to accept, and let them continue
from there.  there is also the cognitive dissonance issue of them KNOWING that
I am going to dump them if they are not sexy and CONTINUING to talk to me and
get to know me.  the more they talk to me, the more I hook them into
interacting with me.  the more they get hooked, the greater the PAIN OF
SEPERATION (credit: RJ) when they eventually get EJECTED.  since they KNOW
ahead of time what will get them ejected and they are still talking, they are
either planning to get in line OR setting themselves up for pain.  either way,
after SOI and their acceptance of the terms, there will have to be some sort of
TEST of their compliance.  even listening to what they have to say after SOI
counts as a REWARD for their entering into a "relationship" with me.  hmm... I
will consider this more.

>I go on to tell her that other girls I know also
>like me, ask me out alot, (doesn't matter if it is true or not,
>but chick 'competition logic' will kick in, and it will scare
>your mark to act). 

the reason I don't use this is that MLTR is an integral part of my life.  if I
were to play this "chicks dig me" card, it would belittle the actual
relationship I have with MLTR.  the only problem with THAT is that I am
screening for MORE MLTRs :)  I don't give a fuck about ONS because I can get
laid ANY NIGHT within an hour of talking to the chick I am talking to... in the
WAY I want to with a chick that I WANT TO FUCK :)  a chick offering me ONS is
like a chick offering me a dollar bill.  I already HAVE dollar bills... what do
I want hers for?  of course, there are some chicks that are just so HOT that
you want to try them out, but barring that scenario, ONS can bring you much
more ANGUISH than the satisfaction that accompanies it... PLUS it is the SAME
SATISFACTION that I already get on a regular basis from MLTR. 

besides... it is OBVIOUS that chicks dig me because here SHE is, liking me
within 20 minutes of meeting me... what about the chicks that have experienced
me for days?  months?  years?  OH, she could only HOPE to be one of those! :)

for you, it is a good tactic though.

>Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>her last week, apparently).

I lost a rap to a low-self-esteem bitch that had a couple of relationships like
this as well.  I mean, I fucked her, but I didn't get to MLTR like I wanted
because she was SCARED that she wouldn't match up to the next bitch and that I
would NEXT her for no reason, like her exes did.  I tried to tell her I wanted
her for more than that, but she wasn't emotionally healthy enough to understand
or believe me.

>Ok, now Maniac has reached her head, and I take this deeper..
>I go on to tell her that I dont want just sex, I want rocks and gold
>I can get any girl in roppongi on a Saturday night and fuck her
>(not exactly true, but she doesnt know this.. goal is just to

she KNOWS that it happened to her VERY QUICKLY.  she ASSUMES she was not the
ONLY bitch to fall for you that quickly.  it is like reverse-social-proof. 
fucking a bitch FAST makes them think you can fuck other bitches FAST.

>'confirm' her worst fears so that she acts), but its not enough for
>me. I want connection, good sex, and romance, with an intelligent
>woman, and that is why I want to date you (psychicbabe).

nice line.  this is another thing I will consider.  talking-up MLTR to them.  
I never considered this either, MAINLY because if you tell a chick what you
want her to do then you never know if she is manipulating you by being that
way, or if she arrived there NATURALLY... on her own.  interesting, LOTS of
style-change material happening right around the new year :)

>Then all of the sudden, she asks me about HBass (the chick staying
>at my place over the holidays), and freaks out about it. I tell
>her that she already knows all this, and exactly what is her point
>here?

although I am a GREAT fan of "quoting", I find that there need to be times to
engage in it and times to NOT engage in it.  this will depend on what you want
with the chick.  it is the same way you can't go from being a CHUMP to a MAN in
a chick's eyes... but you CAN go from being a MAN into a CHUMP :)  if you start
out telling a chick that you have a girlfriend AND that you fuck her, you leave
yourself open for these pot-shots whenever chicks trip the fuck out and go into
their irrational rants from out of left-field.  all a bitch needs to know is
that you are "taken" so that you manage her relationship expectations.  any
more information and she feels like you will give her ALL the information. 
where does it stop?  are you going to tell her that you are fucking her?  that
you fucked her last night?  that you fucked her an hour before coming on this
date?  that you fucked YOUR WOMAN in her ass?  that she LIKES sucking dick? 
WHERE DOES IT STOP?

I ran into this problem with a chick where my relationship to her was BASED ON
trading current sex-stories.  when I got to the point where I didn't want to
tell her any more shit, she was EXPECTING me to tell her, and I realized that
if I wasn't telling her, and she wasn't telling me, then our "relationship" was
OVER.  before that, I had not realized how much I had compromised my position
by telling her CURRENT sex-shit.  think about it, and decide on your own LIMITS
to what you are willing to tell a chick about other chicks... besides, think
about the fact that she is going to KNOW that she will end up as STORIES to
other bitches right after you fuck her.  it will make her VERY self-conscious
about whatever she does with you and that could hinder her emotional states
tremendously.

>Then she stops again, and asks me if I am fucking her (maybe I
>should have said no..., but I had already said yes to her about this
>the first time I saw her)., she asks me why.. (I tell her because
>I am seeing her! like I told you the first time! I mean what do
>you expect?!?).
>
>She then puts on her bitch face, and talks in a stern voice,
>"then call me when you break her up, that is my decision, I am
>going home.".

THIS is retarded because she ALREADY knew that you were fucking her AND she
fucked you herself.  this is another problem with bitches having information
about other bitches.  they use it against themselves.  IMO, the purpose of her
knowing you have another girl or SEVERAL other girls is so she knows where she
stands in the RACE to be your MAIN BITCH.  if you are single, she has a good
chance at being that to you.  if you are "taken" she has NO CHANCE of being
that to you.  if you are SEEING bitches, then she has to COMPETE to be your #1.
 other than THAT, I think giving information about your other bitches is a
mistake...  I have made the SAME mistake up to this point, so I am not
crisicizing :)  however, I am changing that ASAP and I think you should
consider giving out information on a N2K basis (need to know).

besides, SHE is the one that NEEDS a fuck.  if it is not coming from YOU, a guy
she has fucked ALREADY and she LIKES how you did it or she wouldn't have come
back... she has to get it from a STRANGER whose sexual skills are in question
that might tie her up, fuck her in the ass or sell her to the highest bidder. 
bitches like to FRONT a lot about having ALL these sexual choices, but with all
the 8s, 9s, and 10s I have spoken to on an honest "one of the chicks" level,
they are ALL looking to have an EXCITING time, but not REALLY be in DANGER! 
you, OTOH have pussy AT HOME IN BED WAITING FOR YOU!  the only one to lose out
if she bails... is HER!  knowing that, I would have not even entertained her
bullshit OR called her on it, letting her know that I was getting laid tonight
REGARDLESS of whether SHE fucks or not.  that would take the fucking WIND out
of her sails :)

>I tell her I am planning to break her up (which is true) later, so
>it is nothing you should worry about. 

this, my friend :)  is a COP-OUT!  it is used VERY EFFECTIVELY by married men
to keep fucking their side-bitches, but WE are way above bullshit tactics like
this.  I commend you for thinking of this "on the fly", but PLEASE, PLEASE! 
hehe  I have MUCH more respect for you as a PUA than to hear some CRAP like
this from you :)  PLEASE think of something better for the next instance of a
chick trying to BLACKMAIL you into trading in a R-E-L-A-T-I-O-N-S-H-I-P where
you are getting EVERYTHING you want from a chick... for a ONS with HER! 
HAHAHAHAHAHA  >:)

I haven't run into a chick STUPID enough to try to disrespect my MLTR for being
with me... chicks have STARTED to say she is dumb for "letting" (as if she has
ANY say in the matter) her man fuck other chicks, and I have BROKEN THEIR
FUCKING ASSES listing the benefits that SHE is getting that they will most
likely NEVER have with a man... EVER!  and CERTAINLY don't have right now, or
they would not be talking to me in a bar... they would be with THEIR OWN MAN
conducting this FANTASY RELATIONSHIP that they are professing that my MLTR
should have :)  I have NEVER run into a chick that has even TRIED to break into
my relationship with MLTR because they KNOW I mean business.  all they can do
is become ANOTHER MLTR... and after they hear the QUALIFICATIONS, they KNOW
they can't even achieve THAT... only ONS and LJBF with me.  if some bitch EVER
suggested that I break up with MLTR in order to ONS her, I would  A) laugh in
her face and  B) immediately demand an EXPLANATION of the reasons why she
thinks she can knock MLTR out of the box AND make her perform ANY AND ALL
SKILLS that she CLAIMS to be better than MLTR at IMMEDIATELY!  put up or SHUT
THE FUCK UP!  the result would be the ONS ANYWAY, and she would still be LJBF
or NEXT because MLTR is NOT about sex... it is about compatability and I
PERSONALLY could not be with some bitch that needs to knock other chicks off in
order to gain status.  I gain status by BEING MYSELF and letting bitches make
INTELLIGENT, EDUCATED decisions to be with me.  any chick that wants to be with
me had better do the same.

>she gets upset, and starts
>screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
>just like her ex-bf, getting other girls while dating her, and how
>all guys just want sex..etc..

I would have told her "you wanna calm the fuck down?"  throwing tantrums and
making scenes are expressions of her ability to do ANYTHING in your presence. 
I personally don't tolerate that.

>Then she says.. ok, if you let me meet your GF at your house
>tonight, then I will let you have sex with me. [ha! I got her!]

ok.  thank God I happened to read the next line before I started typing this. 
I was JUST going to ask you WHY you are STILL letting her blackmail you into
fucking her... ESPECIALLY when she is the one that needs it and you don't :)

>I bounce back, and say, "what exactly makes you think I am
>desperate to have sex with you tonight?! Do you think I am
>just some stupid guy and you can manipulate me like that?
>No, you will not meet my GF, it is disrespectful to her to do
>that. You know the situation, it was clear to you from the
>beginning, and you accepted it. There is no more to talk about.
>I am not here only for sex, I can get that anywhere. Sex only
>of itself is of little value to me, I want more than that.

SWEET!  :)  break her fucking ASS maniac :)

>I then bring out the nuclear weapons! My tonality is very firm,
>and I eye fuck her, while telling her the following. First, I tell
>her that I already told her about my GF, she was clear about it
>right from the start, and she has NO excuse. Then I go on to tell
>her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
>that did NOT happen. So do NOT compare me to your ex. I am a
>different person, and EXCEPT better treatment than that if you
>ever want to see me again. She starts crying more, and hugging
>again.

ugh :/   fucking IDIOTS!   man, the shit some bitches put you through!  does
everyone SEE why we have to study this shit?

>I put her against wall, and tell her not to complain about me like
>I am her ex, I a am different person than he is.
>
>I tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>alone!

this is a good point.  I like to play it the other way:

ok... so now, you have told me that you want everything to be a 'perfect'
situation with a guy before making a move.  You want him to be ideal with
women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady... WHAT MAKES YOU THINK
HE WILL WANT YOU?   WHAT ARE YOU BRINGING TO THE TABLE THAT IS GOING TO MAKE A
MAN LIKE THAT CHOOSE YOU OVER ANY OTHER CHICK?

you wanna see some confusion?  you wanna see a bitch get BROKEN?  HAHAHAHA  >:)
 of course, I use this on chicks that I am just practicing on, because it
normally induces DEPRESSION, not horniness.  when they have to GO DEEP INSIDE
and dive BELOW THE SURFACE of their programming, they realize that they CAN NOT
TELL ME WHY A MAN WOULD WANT THEM!  they stall the fuck out dude :)  it's
amazing.  matter of fact, it's documented already.  look at my recent thread
with "telembe".  I let her say all this bullshit about what she wanted from a
guy in order to give up her virginity, then when she was finished talking about
what she WANTED, I asked her what she was OFFERING to a guy that was going to
give her all this committment and "love" and other bullshit and she said a
whole bunch of shit that ANY bitch can and WILL give to a man she likes.  she
might have THOUGHT she had something to offer a guy that was going to seperate
her from the pack, but she doesn't.  even GOOD PUSSY can't get a bitch any
credit because there are LOTS of bitches that can fuck and suck like pros...
elites AND sub-elites.  telembe NEVER told us what seperates her from the rest
of the bitches that might make a MAN like the one she wants even LOOK HER WAY! 
the reason is that there is NO reason! :)  bitches are programmed that MEN want
them... but they are NEVER told WHY.  the reason is that men like to FUCK and
get their dicks sucked.  they also like companionship and cooking and cleaning
and for a girl to look good on their arm so they can feel accomplished around
their buddies.  chicks THINK they are ENTITLED to a good man... but the GOOD
MEN... are picking GOOD WOMEN!  if they were SHINING like they think they are,
they would have been scooped up already and married or whatever they were
looking for because some guy would have spotted her and said "I'm not going to
let her go for ANYTHING" and she would be happy... at least according to her
programming.  OH, how I LOVE to see a bitch's face while she TRIES AND TRIES to
dig up ANY reason why a guy as great as the one she claims to want would EVER
choose her over any other bitch :)  the JOY the JOY that I feel as this POMPOUS
BITCH breaks the fuck down RIGHT IN FRONT OF MY FACE! :)  of course since I
broke her, I keep talking to her and ease her back to a decent state of being
and let her know that she can take steps to make herself into the woman that a
man would want, but she has to really KNOW HERSELF and KNOW MEN in order to
make an intelligent decision.  I am not into depressing chicks... unless they
TRULY DESERVE IT for all the depression they have caused men throughout their
tenure as FINE bitches :)  also, I have no desire to BREAK bitches and leave
them like that.  that just makes it WORSE for ALL OF US looking for FINE, yet
DECENT chicks.

>she cries, and says that is so true, that is her problem, she never
>takes the chance and loses out because she doesn't make the
>move on taken guys. Then I run my 'take chances routine' (if you take
>a chance, in the end, the result is usually good, but if you don't,
>just you get left behind, by yourself).. 

nice.  I like that one... emphasizing loss and loneliness.

>she cries more, says she
>needs to take the chance, and doesnt want to be alone.

she's done :)  nice work.  land her!

>She says she has to be careful, that all guys want just sex, and
>bitches about this for about 30 seconds.

as opposed to what?  what does she WANT guys to want?

>Now I start the 'you need me, I dont need you..you think I just want
>only sex, then you dont understand me at all.. if you think that is
>what I am only, then you do NOT deserve me.. I do no need you to go out
>with me if that is what you think I am.. I want connection, sex,
>passion, and closeness.. and if you haven't figured that out about
>me yet, then get another guy, because you dont understand me at all..

OK OK OK... you've CONVINCED me maniac :)  that's some good shit right there :)
 starting NOW, I am pitching for MLTR ONLY.  bitches that want ONS or LJBF will
get what they deserve from me... which isn't much.  I LOVE this idea of dissing
her for claiming that you are looking for ONS... or even just a "bootie-call"
type relationship :)  I love it.  I would feel so PROUD getting on her like
this.  sweet!  EXTREMELY congruent!  nice play!  this is going into my style,
starting RIGHT NOW!  :)

>I am doing this, because I know the left (logic) and right (emotions,
>passion) are fighting each other..they have been all night. Because the
>left doesn't accept the logic of the situation, but I know the right side
>dying for a shag,..she is trying to rationaize going out with a taken guy,
>but I have gotten her so excited tonight, that she needs that fuck.

THIS is the reason I never learned any of this shit until recently.  my
caveman-kino style before this involved ZERO talking.  totally kino and kissing
and PHYSICAL seduction with domineering EYE-CONTACT.  there was NO INFORMATION
for the left side to process at all.  EVERYTHING went STRAIGHT to the chick's
right side, and her left had to try to process the EMOTIONS and turn them into
a story that she could understand... in the meantime, she is PHYSICALLY falling
for the kino and wanting MORE AND MORE until we are fucking.  I never HAD to
talk to chicks before OR after fucking them because my PHYSICAL ATTACK is so
DEVASTATING!  I would just take them over PHYSICALLY and their right brains
would do ALL the work and the left would struggle to understand, but eventually
succumb to the onslaught!  ARG ARG! :)

thanks for explaining that to me :)

>As I touch her side of face, she goes doggy look, I kiss her, and she
>gets like screambabe, panting. I put leg between her, she widens, goes nuts
>totally. I ask her she likes me (in a tell her sort of way' you like me..'),
>she replies 'yes'. I say (stare her down) .. she asks "what should I do?"
>I say in a very strn fatherly voice while staring her down 4 inches from
>her head.. you will follow me..that is what you will do.. and you will do
>what I say. 'she says, 'I will'. I tongue her down more, run her crotch,
>she almost cums right there, then I take her to a love hotel (her first
>time!), no resistance what so ever.

interesting.  what just happened here?  did you somewhere dictate to her that
the terms of her being "your bitch" is that she has to sumbit to you fully? 
are you getting a verbal confirmation of that from her?  or is something else
going on... like she just plain UNDERSTANDS that you can move her to passions
that make her WANT to cum and that you are going to take her there and over the
edge?

another point... what do you guys think of foreplay on a chick.  he mentions
that she almost came right there... do you think it is good to get her to the
EDGE and leave her there so she is so horny, she will do ANYTHING for you to
make her cum, OR to give her an orgasm right there in her clothes to
demonstrate your sexual mastery over her?  personally, I am into the sexual
mastery thing because I notice a newfound RESPECT from a chick that has had
guys on top of her NAKED, fucking her for all they were worth and she never
came from it, and then I am just doing kino on her and fingering her and she
cums from just that.  do you think that making the chick cum on herself makes
her want sex MORE or want it LESS since she just got off?  take into account
that chicks are multi-orgasmic and that they feel sexier after cumming, not
DRAINED like guys.

>As I am fucking her, I am putting things in her head, like D.Shades reports.
>I tell her as she is screaming it feels deeper and deeper, closer and
>closer. She is going nuts will I am fucking her.

I need to reasearch this.  is this more right-brain, left-brain shit where her
left-brain is shut down because of the FIREWORKS that are going off in her mind
because of the sex, leaving her wide open to suggestion?  if you have any links
for this, please post.

>I stare her down, and I tell her you need me (during sex), she says yes.
>I tell her from now on you will follow me, and do what I say. She says
>'yes, I will'. I continue doing her, she says "it feels SO good, I really
>need that, I really want it, i love you inside me!".. she is fucking like a
>wild animal, loud voice, shouting and screaming, oh, I want it, give it
>to me, I want to come!

more of the same?

>Then she tells me anything is ok as long as I dont hate her..she doesnt
>want me to hate her. She wants me to hold/hug her, she cries a bit, then is
>ok again (seems to be thinking of her old bf she says). I touch her
>more, face goes totally doggy look, and finger her, she goes nuts, we start
>fucking again.

the "I don't want you to hate me" thing is very important in the D/s
relationship... not that you set this up like that, but that is the MAIN
incentive for her to follow your lead... that she does NOT want you to hate her
and CERTAINLY not to banish her.  when that is TRULY first and foremost in her
brain, she will regulate HERSELF and place herself in-line with your thinking
and what YOU want her to be.  she also won't try to blackmail you anymore
because she KNOWS it gets on your nerves and all THAT will do is get her
EJECTED sooner rather than later :)

>Her back is on the bed, and I am fucking her missionary, her legs are
>spread and wide in the air, which I am holding. I tell her "see, I control
>you, 

hehe ok... this is a little FAR-FETCHED for me at this point, but I have not
researched it yet :)  I DO like the next line though.

>I go deep in your body because it is the one way to reach you totally
>deep in your mind which no one else can do. 

interesting

>By conquering your body, I can
>conquer your mind (then I drill her a bit more after I finish the sentence so
>she goes more crazy). I play with your body because it lets me control
>your mind (then drill her some more..ha, it is like the ultimate form of
>reward hypnosis).

IS there such a thing as reward hypnosis?  links please? :)

>I ask her, so why you like me. She says she says, you are decisive and
>sometimes I am indecisive, so you make it easy for me. I want the guy
>to make it easy for me to decide what to do (important clue here Maniac!
>maybe most chicks are like this! Maybe this too is where I fucked up
>with HB Geek!)

I have heard this a lot too... only thing is that there is a lot of
RESPONSIBILITY that comes with telling a chick what to do, and if the VALUE of
owning her is not sufficient for me, I don't give a fuck WHAT she does enough
to want to lead her to a good time.

>Moral of the story.. keep your ground.. call all chick bullshit DIRECTLY.
>Make the chick risk fear losing the relationship if she doesn't capitulate
>and chances are she will back down, in spite of how it looks (and I could
>do this BECAUSE I had other choices.. another reason to be fucking
>several chicks at once). As well, it seemed that she was giving me all the
>bullshit in part because she WANTED me to call her on it, and then fuck her
good
>at the end of the night, which I obliged.

chicks give you shit-tests to find out if you are stronger than them and see
HOW you are going to control them.  chicks like the way I control them because
I NARROW their choices for them, but STILL make them choose.  they can choose
the path of ULTIMATE SATISFACTION, or they can choose the path of EJECTION and
being back on the dating scene meeting the SAME LAME GUYS every night :)

you had told her you had a girlfriend, but she seems to have NEEDED to know
that she really COULDN'T have you all to herself and that you really DIDN'T
NEED to fuck her that night or EVER.  you stuck to your guns (after letting her
get to you for a while :-) and she eventually ran out of logic and got
overridden with kino and gave up the fucking pussy like she came there to do :)

>Constructive comments/opinions welcome!
>
>Maniac High
>http://www.pickupguide.com

EXCELLENT!  keep up the GOOD WORK dude!  :)

---
From: erosla77@aol.com (ErosLA77)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 30 Dec 2000 20:12:47 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

>Subject: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit
special!]
>From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
>Date: Fri, Dec 29, 2000 10:37 PM
>Message-id: <92jvre$obh@nnrp1.deja.com>

>)this chick is a very highly educated, driven, professional
> career woman and earns likely a big 6 figure salary
>b)she is very mature, focused and spends all day in her office
> surrounded by sharks and other pirrhana type scumbag characters

 She's got to be in control ALL DAY LONG at work. Small wonder then, with a
man, she wants to fully SURRENDER control and be made to submit.  It's like all
those super-powerful Congressmen and Judges and the like who LOVE going to get
pissed-on and whipped by some Madame Dominatrix. 

>I regroup my thoughts.

 I admire your ability to do this in the field, Maniac. As you think about it,
what do you do internally to re-set yourself and keep yourself in a good frame
of mind when all this shit throws your way?

>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations

   Metahpor is a POWERFUL tool to move folks from a fixed perception to a new
one. Please, share your story!

> Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>her last week, apparently).

Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with fucking; it feels
good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the vulnerabilities.  So
when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which overcomes the
potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. She's worried about pain,
so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not only losing
out on the pleasure of screwing, BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out that if
she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even WORSE
crack-up.

  Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.

>he gets upset, and starts
>screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
>just like her ex-bf,

See? The fear of the pain of being hurt just like her ex-BF hurt her is now
rearing its ugly head.  She doesn't seem like a very emotionally stable person
in ANY event, let alone having just been dumped by a guy.  

>Then I go on to tell
>her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
>that did NOT happen

 Sharp thinking. Again, what do you do internally to keep your state solid and
your thinking sharp? THAT process internally is of great value, even more than
the specifics you share.  The specifics are like handing guys fish; good for a
nice meal and of value. But  how you get to the mind-set is TEACHING someone
HOW to fish so they can eat for life. 

>I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>alone!

 Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to her her
"ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she can then
accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!  

   Excellent...Maniac, I don't give a damn WHAT my orthodox SS followers say,
this is BRILLIANT stuff and I'd be proud to be your wing or have you as mine,
ANY FUCKIN' DAY of the week! Sir, I salute you!

>Now what I am doing with all the above, is not arguing the logic (too
>much)
>of this, because, of course she is right, and I know this.

 Actually, you ARE not arguing the logic, but you are USING the logic...HER
logic..HER way of viewing things.....pointing out WHY and HOW she loses and
what will happen if she doesn't stop it.   It's all centered around losing and
WHY she loses, based on what she has told you.  It IS logical, FROM her point
of view.  

 Great, Great stuff...sir, I salute you!

-----

From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]
Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2000 12:03:54 GMT

Replies to various people about psychicbabe:

Answers to various questions:

Was psychicbabe british, or Japanese?
She was a brit of Japanese ancestry (ie. she
looked 'j', but thought, acted and had an
english accent like a brit). This in my
opinion made it harder, because brit women
are so fucking F A T, and she was so
slender, sexy and attractive (and she dressed
to kill) compared to all of them. Lots of guys were
hitting on her (and she said she always got hit
on, and hated it.. trick was to not make it look
like a 'hit').

Why not a white chick? Well, I had the chance...
but.. at the conference where I met her, EVERY
brit. white chick there was in serious blimp bulge
territory.. very scary. Why is it so many caucasian
women are so FAT?

It was funny though, because something like 8 guys
(I counted) tried to hit on psychicbabe the night
I PU'd her. One guy was pretty good, the rest were
total AFC's..it was rather funny.

Re: Rocks -vs- gold.. how I use it (yes, it is
Jake's metephor. For RJ, search the original post
on fastseduction.com. It is also on pickupguide.com
someplace (if not it will be there in about 2 weeks,
I am revising the page this week). Basically, I intro
it as follows:
After chick says bullshit about wanting to go to
dinner and be friends or shit for 6 months before
becoming a GF, I say: Actually, I dont go to dinner
or stuff like that with ladies who are not my GF
CHick:  gasps!
Maniac: see, going to dinner, is an important step
in a relationship for me. I only share it with someone
special
chick: Huh?
Maniac: Well, let me put it this way, do you ever
sleep with a guy who is just your friend, or dont
care about?
chick: of course not!
Maniac: well, why do you think a guy should do any
different then?
Maniac: See, let me tell you a story. You ever hear
about 'rocks & gold'?
chick: no? what is it?
Maniac: Well, Relationships are valuable things.
And each partner is looking for something. It is like
diamonds (rocks) and gold. Both are valuable.

But women prefer diamonds to gold (usually), and
men prefer gold to diamonds (usually). Of course,
both are important, especially in a long term
relationship, but if a woman could choose, she would
prefer the diamonds  first, and the man would
prefer the gold  first. right?

chick: yeah, probably

Maniac: And (generally), a man can accept gold
without the diamonds, and a woman can accept
diamonds without any gold.

So in a relationship, a woman is mining for
diamonds, while the man is mining for gold.
While they are in the mine together, the
guy gives diamonds he finds to the woman, and
the woman gives the gold she finds, to the man.

But if you give a woman gold only, or a man
diamonds only.. neither is likely to be
very happy, and the relationship will soon
fall apart. In short, an exchange of sorts
takes place in a successful relationship.

And also, if a man expects just gold (sex),
but doesnt want to give her diamonds
(relationship & the mushy stuff), then she
will dump him fairly soon, because he is
playing/using her just for sex..

And if a woman expects just diamonds (walks,
attention, nice dinners, movies..etc) without
giving some gold (sex), then he (if he has any
clue about how to deal with women, though many
men do not, especially in North America) will
dump her because she is using/playing him just
for his personality.

A guy taking a chick to dinners, buying shit
and giving nice walks without sex is THE SAME
as a guy sleeping with a girl, and then kicking her
out right after the fuck is over. (chick says:
'yelch!'. Yes, thats right, and for the guy,
just dinners and buying shit is 'yelch', with
no sex, and no attention is exactly the same.

Because a woman will go to free dinner with
almost any guy, it has no value to me. But
I am like you, I want attention, and I want
to be made to feel special.

And although a girl will go to nice free dinners
with almost anyone, I also know that a girl will
not sleep with anyone. So I know if she does with me,
then it means she thinks I am important. And if
she wont, then it means she doesnt care about me
at all, so I really dont need to see her again,
I will just go find another girl.

Maybe you might think it is unusual for a guy
to think this way, but it is just my way.

See, I dont want to be played. Guys are always
getting played by girls for nice dinners, long
talks on the phone, and for their personalities.
It is the SAME as a girl being used for sex.
So I am happy to give plenty her diamonds, but at
the same time, I dont want to be played, so
I also expect her to want to give me gold.
And if she doesn't, it means she doesnt care about
me, is using me, or it means I am being played,
or I am stupid.

As well, experience has also showed me that
'friends first' almost NEVER results in a
relationship. I mean how many of your BFs were
your friend first (chick usually replies..uh,
zero).

Exactly, so that is why I never play 'friends
first'. Friends first means diamonds for the
lady, and no gold for the guy. That is like
the guy saying (ok, lets fuck for 6 months,
and if its good, we can go to dinner, and go
out, and you can be my GF). Would you like
that (chick: yelch!!).

Exactly.. so that is why it is far better,
that the lady meet me, get to know me, and
then I expect her to be smart enough to know
to take that chance THEN (or reject it, and I will
go get another lady) when it is offered to her.

So that is why I expect things that way in a
relationship with a lady.

After this, a chick is (usually) quite impressed,
or surprised and doesnt know what to say..

[When I recited this to psychicbabe, she actually told me
she was very impressed, that I understood relationships
so well ;-) ]

Had I been smart, I would have used it on HB
geek, and laid her, but after that failure I
thought about it, and then when the same situation
came up with Psychicbabe this week, I knew what
to do..

Ok, now on to other comments..

RJ writes
>Maniac writes:
> >I regroup my thoughts.
>
>  I admire your ability to do this in the field, Maniac. As you think
about it,
> what do you do internally to re-set yourself and keep yourself in a
good frame
> of mind when all this shit throws your way?

A couple things.. first, this PARTICULAR chick is of no importance
to me, because I am (likely) seeing 3 others this week. So it is
not as risky to me to be firm, and keep my ground.

Another important fact, is the way chick's brains are usually
wired. For a
chick, once she likes a given guy, it is hard for her to immediately
switch to another guy. it is far MORE risky, because a chick (unlike
men), usually cannot switch to another guy, once she ALREADY
likes a given guy (story is different BEFORE you got her to
like you..then SHE has more power than you).

So I play on this, and as a result I dont feel nervous/scared at all,
because there is far more to risk to her, than to risk to me. Because
she is stuck to me, but I am not stuck to her. (this also is why
'jerks' can get away with so much shit on any given chick, and why
she will tolerate it.. because her brain has now got her focussed
on THAT guy, and it is now a choice (in her mind), between him (and
his bullshit... or being alone (sure she can get another guy in 10
minutes, but she cannot build those nice feelings of 'attachment'
in 10 minutes.. that gives us men power, once we realize this).

Two, I am generally a very balanced level
headed person, and dont take any of this personally (as you already
know, RJ). Three (in this case), I had
already laid this chick, so I didnt care really if I laid her again
or not.. I already conquered her, and she (and I) already knew that.

If it is a new chick, sometimes, I get more nervous/fucked up (see
HB Geek). I am trying to keep my senses more when this happens

> > Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
> >problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
> >her last week, apparently).
>
> Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with
fucking; it feels

Not sure about this, I think she just simply wanted the fuck, but
wanted to feel she was important to me, and she didnt want to just
get played..

> good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the
vulnerabilities.  So
> when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which
overcomes the
> potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. She's worried
about pain

yes, thats right.

> so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not
only losing
> out on the pleasure of screwing,

Not really. I actually made it clear to her that I didnt care if
she bang me or not. The point was that she had to give her mind
to me, and respect me, and follow me (whether that is bang me,
make her take off her clothes in the window for me, or do my
dishes..whatever.. its not the banging that is important, it is
the submission to me that counts, and what she needs to give me
if she wants my attention at all).

> BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
> believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out
that if
> she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even
WORSE
> crack-up.

Yes

>   Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.
>
> >he gets upset, and starts
> >screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
> >just like her ex-bf,
>
> See? The fear of the pain of being hurt just like her ex-BF hurt her
is now
> rearing its ugly head.  She doesn't seem like a very emotionally
stable person
> in ANY event, let alone having just been dumped by a guy.

No, she is not stable at all. I think though, it is because she
bottles it up all day, to be the 'office bitch' that she has to
be in the daytime. This chick lives for her work. She has no other
life.

>
> >Then I go on to tell
> >her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
> >that did NOT happen
>
>  Sharp thinking. Again, what do you do internally to keep your state
solid and
> your thinking sharp? THAT process internally is of great value, even
more than
> the specifics you share.  The specifics are like handing guys fish;
good for a
> nice meal and of value. But  how you get to the mind-set is TEACHING
someone
> HOW to fish so they can eat for life.

Actually, the specifics are important I think. This is why lay/field
reports with details are so important. I think really shitty on my
feet. I really suck.. bad.

But if I have had that same experience before (with another chick),
or been in that same situation before, and
either succeeded (or failed, and then thought about how to handle it
right the next time), then I will handle it correctly this time.

I really believe in field experience. I have alot... really alot.
so I have seen many of these situations before. It is like chess,
or a foreign language. If you've been there before, and worked out
a solution, then you know what to do. You MUST get field experience.
It is CRUCIAL. And each time you fail, you go home, and see what
you did right/wrong, and what you would do if the same situation
happened again. This is why I also post the fuckup as well as
the lay reports.. they are very valuable to me in gathering my
thoughts and forcing me to think about what I did right/wrong,
as well as listening to the other's comments about them on this
NG.

I also look at the other's reports as well, and learn about
situations, and ask myself for each one, if it happened to me,
what would I do/how would I handle it. Eventually, after doing it
for a couple years (I have been at this in ernest for about 2
years now), you get better at it. Learning situations in PU, is
like learning the words of a foreign language, and how to connect
them all together.. how to move from a bad situation..to a good
one to get the chick in a horny state..

Also, I keep in mind alot about what MrSex4uNYC says about attitude,
and when I get stuck, I ask myself, what would NYC tell me right
now about this situation. He is very congruent, and if you think
things this way, it is easy to be clear what is the right way or
wrong way.

> >I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
> >with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
> >with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
> >and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
> >unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
> >alone!
>
>  Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to
her her
> "ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she
can then
> accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!

Yes, basically that is the idea. I am not sure that it means I am
an authority, but its more, to convey that she is clueless, she
is wrong, so to listen to herself will make her fuck up even more..
..so maybe she had better listen to me instead, and then she wont
fuckup as much.. basically that is the idea..

>    Excellent...Maniac, I don't give a damn WHAT my orthodox SS
followers say,

I didn't get this.. What are orthodox SS followers, and I had no
idea they were saying anything about this.. I really dont understand
what you mean here..

> >Now what I am doing with all the above, is not arguing the logic (too
> >much)
> >of this, because, of course she is right, and I know this.
>
>  Actually, you ARE not arguing the logic, but you are USING the
logic...HER
> logic..HER way of viewing things.....pointing out WHY and HOW she
loses and
> what will happen if she doesn't stop it.   It's all centered around
losing and
> WHY she loses, based on what she has told you.  It IS logical, FROM
her point
> of view.

Yes, basically that is the idea. What I meant was, is that her main
point is that she wants a monogamous BF, and doesn't want to be played.
But, I am playing her, and she (at some level) realizes that, so
in essense, her gut feel about this is totally correct.

But I am playing her desire for the fuck, and her fear of losing
out, which lets me bypassing her gut feel that she is being
played, and then I can get her to fuck anyways.

Good followups everyone!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

-----

From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]
Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2001 12:10:23 GMT

  "Dohn Joe"  wrote:
>  wrote in message news:92n7b96
@nnrp1.deja.com...
> [snip]
>
> The more I think of it, the more this seems to be a great PU.
> I think the PU in England is the gist of your piece of work.
>o I'd be glad to see more
> details on how you picked her up in England, that's the hardest work. How
> did you stand up the crowd? How did you make it not look like a PU?

I was using psychological 'jujitsu' (use the strength of your
opponant, against themself). There is a field report from 2 months
ago, that outlines the PU (check fastseduction.com archives).
Basically, I met her at a conference. I didnt talk to her much.
Then I followed her onto a bus that was taking us to the next
meeting place. A guy was hitting on her, and he sat with her.
I sat on the seat in front bymyself.

She (like most british bitches), started complaining about how
she hates men, and other bullshit. The guy on the bus with her
is taking this/agreeing with it (if I remember right).

I just turned around (and tonality and eye contact here is crucial),
and just tell her in a VERY authoritative voice, slowly.. "perhaps
you have just not met the right man yet, one you understands you,
deeply, and completely. But.. you never know the future.. now do you..
I used killed eye contact, spoke slowly, and continued "perhaps
if you open your mind more, you might find him.. by surprise, without
even expecting it, because often, that is the way it usually is..see"

Psychicbabe went "maybe", and then started more manhating bitching.

I then described the kind of man she wanted "one you could rely on,
but at the same time, be mysterious, and exciting in some unexpected
ways, because he just knew how to reach you deep inside you, and
your mind.. that is what your looking for..isnt' it?"

Psychicbabe: yes,

{continue PU, bunches of stuff from the ManiacPlan, if I remember
right}

The key here was the tonality and Eye-Fuck contact. That is what
did it more than the words I used. I just totally crushed her
with it..

> How did
> you get past her "bitch office" shield? I'm asking especially because, as I
> picture this woman, it would seem pretty intimidating for me to approach
> her.

I had the attitude that she obviously had never met a man that
knew how to give it to her right, which means that she obviously
needed ME far more than I needed her. That mindset made it easy.

> I admire your ability to take her from there into total submission.
> existing relationship than guys. That's why many (even HOT ones) find
> themselves in a dead end - boring or abusive - relationship, love to
> complain about it to whoever they find to listen, yet are unable to step out

EXACTLY!!

> of it. That's why the first fuck is hard - after that she is bound
> emotionally to you. You see,

>Women's sexuality is DISSOLVED in them.

Yes! you understand it!! (true for most, but not all chicks though,
some just like sport fucking, like we do)

> GREAT words to remember for all us RAFCs when we feel like beating the walls
> after a fuckup... I myself am so darn depressed when coming back after an
> unsuccessful encounter with a chick. Yes, each field experience is one more
> lesson

Yes, do NOT underestimately field experience. It is SO important.
I fucked up TONS (see all the fuckup reports I used to post a couple
years ago on ASF), and I still fuckup alot (see HBGeek, or HockeyBabe).
Over on cliff's list they say it takes 2..4 years to get good
at something, and 10 years to be a master. I TOTALLY agree.
I have only been at this for 2.. 2 1/2 years. And the more I learn,
the more I realize I still need to learn.. There is still TONS that
I dont know yet.

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

----
From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:08 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

I, for one, am really GLAD to see a post from RJ that has helped me move
forward in MY game :)  not that I am an ingrate hehe... his contribution to all
this is UNDENIABLE to begin with and if I hadn't stumbeled onto his site, I
would have still been using my caveman tactics and my MENTAL seduction game
would still be lacking.  as much as I appreciate his contribution to the
seduction game in general, I had been disappointed with all the flaming and
nonsense that he and others had/have been involved with because I thought that
this NG was BASED on USEFUL interaction between him and the rest of us, but I
found that not to be the case :(  not that ANYONE gives a fuck what I have to
say about this, but I wanted to back up into the PAST to make it clear that I
appreciate RJ's PERSONAL contribution to the NG TODAY.

In article <20001230151247.26801.00001467@ng-fi1.aol.com>, erosla77@aol.com
(ErosLA77) writes:

>>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations
> 
>   Metahpor is a POWERFUL tool to move folks from a fixed perception to a new
>one. Please, share your story!

I have been doing this without identifying it:

A) find out her perception (marriage, monogamy, sucking dick VS kissing...)
B) "quote" her a story illustrating a chick that saw things a DIFFERENT way
(the way I want HER to see things) and benefitted GREATLY from it (she is still
with me, she got married to the guy she wanted, she gained inner peace and
self-love...)
C) watch her AGREE with something that she just minutes ago BELIEVED was
incorrect, or not for her.

the most fascinating part is (C) because I didn't realize my powers of
validation, pacing then LEADING had developed so strongly.  this is partially
because I am an empath and can FEEL when a chick moves into different emotional
states so I can relate to her from within her own state and effectively "vulcan
mind-meld" with her, turning the TWO of us into a SINGLE, functioning entity so
that I can dictate for US... to a degree.

a frequent situation is chicks asking me if I am single.  basically, I explain
to them that I am in an "open" relationship.  they practically INVARIABLY
disrespect my MLTR for being stupid. "how can she go for that?" "I would have
dumped you" "I would never let a man see other women"...  sooooo :)  I let them
go on and on and get it all out and completely ENTRENCH themselves in the DREAM
of them being with a man like me AND dumping me or CHANGING me or whatever
their BULLSHIT FANTASIES are at the time.  THEN I go into the BENEFITS of being
MY PRIMARY relationship... :)  when I stack up the LIST of BENEFITS and it
stacks HIGHER than those bitches have in their OWN RELATIONSHIPS RIGHT NOW,
they start thinking.  they think about what LITTLE they really have in their
relationships that MY MLTR is getting.  they think about the TRUST and
COMPANIONSHIP between us that they DON'T HAVE with their borefriends.  they
think about how she is SEXUALLY SATISFIED... DAILY if she wants it.  she has
someone to give her the REAL DEAL on how men are and what we want from
chicks... not someone that's going to keep playing her until he is finished
fucking her.  they ALSO see how the other bitches (like them in the near
future) come and go and MLTR CONSTANTLY receives the benefits of being with a
man that does EVERYTHING for her that she could want... for the MERE price of
NOT bailing because I fuck other chicks :)  once I break it down to them, ALLLL
I see on their faces is ENVY.  matter of fact, they tend to look EMBARRASSED
when I ask THEM about THEIR relationships.  oh, that reminds me... the bitches
that DON'T HAVE A MAN AT ALL fare the WORST in these situations.  my MLTR has
NEVER-ENDING SATISFACTION... they have STORIES of what they WOULD DO... IF
they could get a man AT ALL!  :)

chicks would rather have 20% of a WINNER than 100% of a LOSER!

>> Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>>her last week, apparently).
>
>Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with fucking; it
feels
>good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the vulnerabilities.  So
>when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which overcomes the
>potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. 

wow!  VERY powerful :)  I had really considered these to be apples and
oranges... pain of emotions after sex and pain of LOSS of the individual. 
however, discomfort is discomfort.  I quit giving UTILITY to this PIVOT I was
using because I realized she had ZERO self-esteem and not many other redeeming
qualities other than her looks.  she went from LJBF to NEXT overnight.  I had
been using her for a pivot because of her looks, but her lack of personality
started to wear on me and finally, she had to go.  no more hanging out, no more
phone calling, no more help with her love-life... nothing... cold turkey. 
completely FORGOT about her.  about a month or so later, the holiday season
comes around and she  A) calls me  B) tells me she bought me something for
christmas (I bought her NOTHING, not even a CARD and didn't bother to get one
when she told me she bought me something)  C) tells me she wants to bring it TO
my house, and  D) shows up with gift in hand, READY to socialize and spend time
with me.  

this is the SAME bitch that NEVER went in her purse to even OFFER to throw in
money when I used to use her for a pivot.  I didn't mind paying for her though
because the benefits I got from being out with an attractive chick that KNOWS I
am out to get OTHER bitches and facilitates that was well worth it :)  hehe... 
too bad for her, MLTR was over and I received her gift, talked to her for a
while (where she told me her recent "relationship" blew the fuck up in her face
:-) and then ejected her to keep having fun with MLTR.

I have been using outfoxer's style of letting bitches get involved in bullshit
relationships, TELLING THEM the relationships are bullshit then letting them
fall FLAT on their faces and come CRAWLING back to me :)  I just haven't added
the part yet where I get indignant that they are giving sex to CHUMPS that use
them like BITCHES and throw them away.  hehe it is fun enough at this point
just to hear about their FAILURES from the horses' mouths and see the sad looks
on their faces, while I am CONSTANTLY SMILING :)

what you described is BASICALLY what happened to her, except NOT in the sexual
content, but in the companionship content.  she THOUGHT she had a solid
position with me as my pivot, so she didn't feel like paying for anything
because she thought I NEEDED her, not WANTED her.  as soon as I didn't want her
anymore and dumped her from LJBF to NEXT, she was OK with it UNTIL her
relationship BACKFIRED... THEN she decides she wants to get back in good with
ME, which she can't do because I don't give a fuck about her and except for
looks, she can't compete with MLTR AT ALL!

the pain of loneliness overrides the emotional pain of sex without
committment... fascinating :)

>She's worried about
>pain, so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not only
>losing out on the pleasure of screwing, BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
>believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out that if
>she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even WORSE
>crack-up.
>
>  Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.

ok, this is interesting too.  "this is why you fucked up with your ex and I
feel the same way about that particular topic".  you are FORECASTING her
EJECTION unless she changes her ways.  she is still WITH YOU and has a chance
to do the right thing instead of getting ejected.  she already knows how it
feels to BE ejected by her EX and doesn't WANT to go through that pain AGAIN
with you.  you dictate to her HOW she could have avoided it with her EX and she
learns how to avoid it with you and gets in line.  this is another reason why
DICTATING what you REQUIRE from chicks is good, because they have the roadmap
to success or FAILURE with you.  as long as you have demonstrated personality
AND value BEFORE getting to this with her, she will be in a state of "how can I
get my hands on this guy... and KEEP him?" and then you will tell her what she
needs to do to be CONSIDERED amongst your TOP chicks and then is is up to her
to either fulfill her womanly duties or... as you predicted... get ejected and
feel the PAIN OF SEPERATION all over again with someone that she ALREADY knows
she WANTS to be with... WHATEVER the cost.

everyone has their price.  I find, most times, chicks are TALKING with no
EXPERIENCE.  a chick told me that she dumped her borefriend because he laughed
at her.  I told her that the sex must not have been good because otherwise she
would have had to use more than THAT to justify dumping an entire relationship.
 she CLAIMED that sex had nothing to do with her decision and that he didn't
RESPECT her was why she dumped him.  I told her that if the sex had been what
it is SUPPOSED to be... I GUARANTEE her that she would NOT have thrown THAT
away because of some laughing and disrespect.  I also proceeded to laugh at her
AND disrespect her IN HER FACE and told her I don't care because we are not
dating... she can't DUMP ME!   she never ADMITTED that I was right... BUT... by
the end of the conversation, she was asking me WHAT SHE SHOULD DO TO MAKE HER
LOVE LIFE BETTER!  :/  gotcha!

>>I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>>alone!
>
> Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to her her
>"ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she can then
>accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!  

yes.  I really have not been making the MOST of pacing and leading.  I have
been seeing where they ATTACH THEMSELVES to my way of thinking and see me as an
authority.  I have not used this to MAKE POLICY for them... merely to open
their minds and get them to think more efficiently.  you are right though. 
once you capture them... LEAD THEM!  make SOME efficient use of your new
followers... even if you were only practicing or passing time by capturing them
:)

excellent post :)

------

From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:10 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

In article <92n7b96@nnrp1.deja.com>, maniac_high@yahoo.com writes:

>After chick says bullshit about wanting to go to
>dinner and be friends or shit for 6 months before
>becoming a GF, I say: Actually, I dont go to dinner
>or stuff like that with ladies who are not my GF
>CHick:  gasps!
>Maniac: see, going to dinner, is an important step
>in a relationship for me. I only share it with someone
>special
>chick: Huh?
>Maniac: Well, let me put it this way, do you ever
>sleep with a guy who is just your friend, or dont
>care about?
>chick: of course not!

[lots of good use of Jake's shit snipped]

this is interesting, though I couldn't tell if this is something you are GOING
to do, or something you DID already.  either way, IF you are congruent, this
will serve you well as an alternate form of screening.  most of the time, I
screen by ASKING chicks shit and listening to their answers while watching
their faces and body-language.  another way to do it is to basically DICTATE to
them what I need to even CONSIDER being with a chick in any capacity
whatsoever.  most of the time I don't do this though because I can tell already
that the chick is worthless.  I usually get into DICTATION when she asks me
about myself.  am I attached?  what do I look for in a woman? etc.  THEN, since
she asked, I get into the reasons I have chosen women in the past and why I am
still with them in the present.  as I do that, I lay down my laws WITHOUT
telling the chick I am talking to that she needs to get in line with this shit
or get the fuck out of my face.  I have had a couple of chicks blow themselves
out after this.

I was talking to a chick that I know from YEARS ago that started calling me
again and talking about nothing.  I tolerated her for an hour or so on two
different days  A) because I was bored and  B) because through her speech
patterns and recurring ideas, I was learning if she was worth anything to me at
all, considering I get everything I want or need from MLTR in the first place,
she only had a VERY LIMITED use to me, as GOOD backup-pussy.  MLTR is smarter,
more interesting, more fun, less psychotic... basically TRUMPED her in all
areas, so this chick had NO CREDIT with me whatsoever.  I ended up getting into
PRECISELY what you did in your post.  the KICKER was when I told her "I don't
even TALK to girls that I don't want to fuck".  since I had not fucked her AND
had not suggested that we get together (she BELIEVES in monogamous
relationships for herself and even if she fucked me one time, it would be
merely to relieve her own personal stress and I am not going to be there for
her for that.  I am looking for MORE MLTRs... anything else can go fuck off.  I
laughed at her way of being AND broke it down to her why it was so stupid AND
let her know in NO UNCERTAIN TERMS that I was not going to be involved in
ANYTHING CLOSE to what she claims to want for herself... she can STAY HORNY for
all I care) she INTELLIGENTLY asked me WHY I was talking to her...  I let her
know that I found her amusing and her way of living ineffective.  I pointed out
to her that in the YEARS since I had spoken to her last, ALL she had to show
for it was a bungh of jibberish about WANTING a monogamous relationship that
she HAS NOT ATTAINED IN ALL THESE YEARS!  I let her know that I had predicted
that she would REMAIN dissatisfied for years to come and my talking to her
allowed me to follow her LACK of progress while, in the meantime, I get laid
EVERY DAY by MLTR :)   I have not heard from her SINCE that conversation...
good riddance.  she knew what she HAD to do if she wanted more of my time.  she
knew what she was going to have to do IF she wanted to socialize with me at
all.  she felt like her DEVOTION to the idea of a monogamous relationship with
a NON-EXISTANT man was more important than getting fucked by a guy that she
KNOWS and LIKES.  she is an idiot, and will remain horny UNTIL she fucks the
wrong guy, then has NO ONE to comfort her because I will not be there because
she had her chance and BLEW IT!

I have ZERO TOLERANCE for chicks that want things their way.  if they LIKE
doing things MY WAY, then they can be with me...maybe... for a while... as long
as they still LOOK HOT :)   when I approach chicks, I ASSUME they will fail the
screen because statistics show that I require A LOT from a chick and most of
them are either distracted by work or other relationships or just are not
QUALITY enough to be with me.  I find it amusing how ridiculous the SAME girls
are that I used to DESIRE to go out with and that I USED TO dislike being
rejected by.

now, I meet and REJECT girls daily.  not actively, just after I meet them, I
make NO EFFORT to remain in contact with them and go off to talk to other
chicks, leaving them wondering WHY I was interested enough to approach, but
BECAME DISINTERESTED and ejected for a SIMILARLY-GOOD-LOOKING bitch :)

Experiment Report! How kinky are your coworkers?!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



A practice session using the techniques of PU!


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: ]Experiment Report! How kinky are YOUR co-workers?!
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 08:03:45 GMT

]Experiment Report! How kinky are YOUR co-workers?!

This report is about finding the deep dark secrets of
your co-workers (not necessarily to fuck them, but as
a good experiment in state transitioning in groups
rather than one-on-one).

Note, for those readers living in repressed countries
still in the sexual dark ages like the Islamic
Republic of Iran, or the United Stated of America,
I do not advice attempting this..trouble with the
legal system, sex harrassment shit, or loss of
your job could result.. For the rest of you living
in countries that have both feet planted firmly in
the 20th century, no problem, lets rock on- here
is the report!


Recently, I have been doing alot of work practicing
state transitioning. Ie. the goal is to take a
chick (or in this case, group of chicks) from the
"idle state" (ie. thinking about office bullshit
and work they have to do), and transition them
to the kinky "lets get crazy and fuck state" as
quickly as possible, and in as few steps as possible
using a process that will be consistantly successful.

Last night, we had one of these (usually) boring
office departmental dinner parties at a stuffy
restaurant in town. BORING!!

So I decided what better place to liven things up
and see what I can get away with using psychological
warfare and a little bit of alcohol in an otherwise
formal group setting.

I get there, and sit at a table with 1 guy, and
5 chicks. For the first 30 minutes, it is boring,
I let everyone talk about boring office shit so
that everyone can arrive, and the food can start.

First I arrange the waiter to bring drinks to the
table (we need it later for one of the games I
am going to do), and get started on that right away.
One of the chicks only drinks tea, but that is OK,
later she really got into it anyways in spite of
being stark sober.

At the table is sitting:
ChinaGuy - he is from China
Mombabe - she is a mom, but wild & crazy, 40s (starts
          by sitting at another table)
HB CaptHook - she had a mild eye infection and is
              wearing an eyepatch this week (starts by
              sitting at another table)
HBStrict - she only drinks tea, but is more action
           than she looks
ScaredChick - she thinks we are all wierd
HBWhoMe? - she looks SO straight, but is the kinkiest
           at the table we find out!
Bichick - we find out she had enjoyed some bi games

Other assorted people sitting farther, who dont
play in the games really..

After that, I start. Here is how I did it. Refer
to the 'Maniac plan' post I made a couple weeks ago
(it is archived in fastseduction.com, I will also put
it on my site in Jan. when the next big update
happens) for some of the terminology below. I move
all the chicks (as a group), through all the states
as follows:

[Current State: Idle: chicks talking about office bullshit]
Maniac>Bichick: So what did you do this weekend?
Bichick: Nothing really.. how about you?
Maniac>I went to my dance circle, I like salsa dance
Bichick: oh really? {other chicks starting to listen}
Maniac: Yeah, I went to Brazil this year too, it was so
        much fun, wanna see my pictures?
Bichick & others: 'yes!' (take out my digi-PC, show pictures
        of carnival in Rio, tback bikini babes, the gay parade
        and debauchery in the streets)
Maniac: You know, the culture is SO different, brazilian people
        are SO passionate!
All chicks: oh really?
Maniac: yep, after I left Rio, I went to Sao Paolo, and
        went into this bar and all of the sudden this brazilian
        chick grabbed me and started french kissing me (perform
        SP chick story from ManiacPlan).

[Current State: (A)dmiration & (M)an now achieved from ManiacPlan]
Bichick: Oh, HB Capthook lived in brazil a few years!
Maniac: really? {I go to her table, ask if she wants to see
        some brazil carnival pictures with us.. she runs over
        to our table}
Maniac>all chicks: you know, I respected that SP chick though
       because she was not afraid to take what she wants..
       kind of like Madonna (perform the Madonna story from
       ManiacPlan).
Maniac: Perform 'how to communicate to lady at all levels
        and pay attention to her and what she wants' story
        from ManiacPlan, while doing lots of Kino on
        HBCapthook sitting next to me as a demonstration.
        Others are watching and getting jealous..

[Now try to introduce the (S)ex state from ManiacPlan..
the goal here is to do the "questions game, but in a
group setting.. so I decide to do it via a drinking game]
Maniac: {now I try to introduce a drinking game called 'I
       never'}, Hey, do they have any good drinking games in
       Japan.
Chicks: {they suggest some really lame boring shit like
         remembering names of subway stations..boring!!!}
Maniac: Well, I know two games, Chandelliers {I describe this
        game.. but we wont play it, not sexual}, and then
        "I never" {I describe "I never"}.
[Now here, I think I dont have enough rapport yet to start
"I never" (a drinking version of "questions") and get it to
work well (ie. sexually), so first I preform the "Strawberry
fields" game in a group (in next post, and included below)

<>>

We play the game: (mombabe hears us laughing, comes
over & kicks Chinaguy out of his chair so she can sit
next to us)

Among the answers to "strawberry fields"
Bichick: "uh, I dont see any fence around the field!"
HB Capthook & mombabe: "as many as I can eat!"
HBStrict: "to the farmer.. uh.. Thank you {and bow}"

We were all laughing and rolling on the floor to the
various chicks answers to this game, with lots of "I cant
believe you?! really?!" reactions among the ladies..

[Current state in ManiacPlan: (S)ex now achieved, now
lets intensify and see what these chicks will say/do.
I am putting LOTS of shoulder/back kino on all the
ladies as the game is playing]

Maniac: OK, time for another game, we will play that
 "I never" game we talked about before. {Maniac explains
 howto play "I never"} [easy.. each person takes a turn,
 say "I never xxx", whoever did "xxx" has to take a drink.
 start light, get game sexual ASAP..]

Maniac: here is the opening question: "I never kissed a
 member of the opposite sex before I was 15 y.o."
{3 girls drink}
Maniac: your turn HBCaptHook
HBCaptHook: uh, I dont understand the game yet, can you do
  the next question Maniac?
Maniac: OK, I never kissed a guy on the first date
{we all drink}
HBCaptHook: OK I get it, my turn "I never had sex with a
 guy on the first date" {notice because of the setup with
 straberry fields here, that the chicks ON THEIR OWN, turned
 the game sexual without me having to do anything! This was
 what I worried about if I were to start the "I never" game
 before straberry fields.. the mood was just not sexual
 enough yet, and the game would have fizzled.. but now..
 no problem!}
{all but 1 chick drinks (HB afraid.. who is looking a bit
 uncomfortable now)}
Mombabe: I never kissed a member of the same sex
{Bichick drinks!.. lots of "oh really?!? and discussion
 ensues, but bichick wont delve into it anymore ;-) }
Bichick: I never had sex with more than 4 people in the
 room.
{bichick, HBstrict and HBWhoMe all drink!}
HBAfraid: I never went to california
{we all look at her wierd.. skip to next girl}
HBWhoMe: I never did sex as part of a performance in front
of others
{Maniac, Bichick and HBWhoMe drink.. HBStrict looks envious,
others gasp and are laughing.. rest of our dept, is looking
at us, like why we are having so much fun, and a bit wierdly,
fortunately they cannot hear what we are saying ;-)}
Maniac: I never had sex with someone and didn't know their
 name till the next morning.
{We all drink except HB afraid}
MomBabe: I never used tool, or vibrator during sex
{we all drink}
HBCaptHook: I never had sex with a cat?!
{we all look at her wierd.. no one drinks}
HBCaptHook: but it can happen, I saw it on video once!
{we look at her more strange, and make her drink for watching
the video}
HBAfraid: I cant think of any question
{we skip her, next girl}
..
Maniac: I never was tied/tied up my partner during sex
{Maniac, HB strict, HBCapthook and HBWhome all drink}

Maniac: I see, so who is "S", and who is "M" {explain to
 a couple clueless chicks which was which}
HBWhoMe and HBStrict are serious S type, Bichick is both.
HBStrict makes a pass at me, and I reply only if you are
serious.. she stares at me long (maybe a future there ;-) )
I shake hands and hug HBWhoMe, who is really into this
thread of questioning.

Mombabe now makes ajoke about why I went to lunch today
with this other chick (not in the game), and not her. I
tell her because she didn't ask me.. girls have to take
what they want, like that SP chick. I ask her if she
likes me, she says yes, and I gesture (and get) a cheek
kiss. I am CERTAIN I could have done a KC, or even one
of those 3way KCs, but I remember that this is an
experiment, and I do have to see all these people on Monday
again at work, so I dont push it.

now adminbabe (the dept head's secy) comes by our table
and asks how many of us are going to the prescheduled
after-party karaoke. Mombabe replies "none of us, we are
all going to a hotel".. HBCapthook adds in "a love hotel..".

[Final state: Dying to fuck: achieved]

Adminbabe looks at us wierd (she missed the whole thing),
and leaves. Mombabe now asks why I have such a harem tonight,
and then Bichick remarks how all the ladies in the office
really really like you Maniac.

I ask 'why?'
bichick says.. you smile, and laugh alot.. but there is
something else.. we all see it, but cant really
describe what it is {maniac opinion.. it is the way
I stare at chicks with the 'fuck me' luck, and all the
shoulder kino..etc, I do, even in the office}.

Supper now is wrapping up, we all have to go, I remark
that this table is fun, and that another night, we should
all meet again for beer and fun.. everyone agrees.

As we are going back, HBCaptHook and mombabe are grabbing
all over me, it was funny.

Some go home, and I split off from the group, as I have
a date with karatebabe at midnight in another part of
town..

Experiment over..

I learned that state transitioning is a very predictable,
reproduceable process, once you learn the tools to do it.
This was just my office staff that is around me, so made
a good subject for the experiment. I also realized, that
in groups, there is a sort of feed back effect, so you
can really accelerate things. It wasnt the alcohol because
HBstrict had nothing to drink, but was well into the
game too.

Because it was a group, I could skip steps "BVG,D,O" in
the ManiacPlan, and reach the last state.. (dying to fuck)
so I likely could have taken any (or all)
of those ladies back for a wild time in the sack (which I
wont do, because I work with them.. but there was nothing
stopping it, thats for sure)..

Fascinating..

Constructive Opinions/comments anyone?

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Doing proper ‘closes’

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Maniac introduces a PU game: Strawberry Fields!
[Note, this originally comes from the book 'Kokology']


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Game!: Strawberry fields
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 08:02:40 GMT

Game!: Strawberry fields
001117

This is a game to find out some things about how chicks
see sex. It is very popular in Japan & is a good state
transitioner

--

Intro: Hey, lets play a game!

Imagine you are alone in a field, and see a straberry field
in front of you with tasty strawberries.

There is a fence/gate around the field. How high is it?
(= how easy is this girl/guy to take sex)

Now you are in the straberry field, how many straberries
do you take?
(=how many BFs/GFs that person wants)

Ok, after you have finished enjoying the strawberries,
how do you feel about the farmer, who's field you took them
from?
(=how you feel to that person after fucking them)


The end

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Maniac High's Pick Up Girls Guide and Seduction Website! » field

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Maniac uses a power opener to meet and tongue down a chick!


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Maniac meets HBOrderMe! Bar PU
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 05:00:36 GMT

Maniac meets HBOrderMe! Bar PU
001215

This is an interesting bar PU. .
used it to not lay the chick, but to get higher rapport
with the other guys around.

It is bo-nen-kai (end of year party) season in Japan.
After the party (boring, in a big hotel ballroom)
we go to the ni-ji-kai (after party) in a bar/disco
in Roppongi with a bunch of my coworkers (mostly guys,
and some ladies).

One AFC guy is really into this HB. He is making every
AFC mistake in the book (saying she is pretty, sucking
up to her..blah). Progress is really slow.

Me and all the guys are watching. He gets frustrated and
leaves for a bit. I move in on the chick (she is wearing
a high cut black dress, and fishnet stockings... very cute).

My opener is the strawberry game.. I just go up to her,
and say 'imagine you are in a field, and you see a strawberry
field ahead of you, with a fence around.. how high is the
fence'. She goes right into it.

Then I do the interpretation (see strawberry game post
for the game and interpretation) for her. I ask her what
she thinks (she said 1m high fence, 50 strawberries, sorry
to the farmer). She disagrees the interpretation. Then I
ask her what is your idea guy like (brad pitt). Then I say
besides his looks why you like him. Reply: he is really
guy.

Then I ask, what do you want most in a guy's character.
She says, 'I want him to lead, to decide for me what to do.'
Good.. Maniac keeps that in mind for what comes next. .

AFC guy comes back, and I let him have his chick back for
a while. He is doing more regular AFC stuff, though he
has at least initiated kino.. very good. He does this for
like 20 minutes, but isn't really breaking through.

He gets frustrated, goes. I tell the guys 'watch this',
and go up to the chick, and say I am going now, give me a
kiss. I get a cheek kiss.

I look straight into her eyes, and tell her 'thats not
good enough, look into my eyes.. what do you see.. now
give me a real kiss..' a long tonguedown with sexual kino
ensues.. Everyone else sees what I just did, after spending
not even a total of 5 minutes talking with this chick
from before.

I leave the chick, and go back to the guys.. 'that is how
it is supposed to be done'. Respect of me from my guy co-workers
now goes up 10x from whatever it was before, and was visibly
different in the office the next day.

AFC co-worker comes back and tells me how so much he is
in love with this girl (I guess he knew her from before as
a friend or co-worker or something..not sure.. I had never
met her before though). As a result, I defer to him, and let
him get AFC'd out.

I go back to the other guys, and just say, I could take her
(she lives really close actually, so I could just say I
live far and can I crash at her place.. I am sure the answer
would have been yes) whenever I want. They say 'why dont you'?

I reply, well, AFC guy is really into her, and he is a coworker
of mine who I respect, so I dont want to take his chick away
from him. There are lots of chicks to fuck, and this one means
nothing to me at all, but she is important to him, so best to
leave it at that.

I go on to say that all I wanted to know is that I COULD take her
home if I want (and I might next week or something, I got her
number) and now I know that, so it is enough for me, I dont
need more.

Respect from co-workers now goes up another 10x for this, because
I and they KNOW that this is true after what they just saw. .

He continues to AFC for a long while, and I get tired and go
home. Next day I hear that she blew him out almost as soon as I
left.

Now this was cool, because the goal wasn't really to lay the
chick (which I still might if I decide to see her again), but to
increase stature with co-workers, which can help in other ways
in my regular life.

Now one thing to note, is that I cannot do this every time (heck
not even close.. this is like the 3rd or 4th time it has ever happened
so directly like this). I was
really lucky, because of what she said to my 'what you like in
guy question', it was just so EASY to know what this chick
expected me to do, and it was really easy to stage it to happen
in front of all the other guys once I clued in on this.

I WISH I could do it everytime, but life isnt really like that ;-)
Mr. SMooth can do it though!

Constructive comments and opinions welcome!
Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Using the ‘color’ game to PU!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Using the 'color game' to do a PU!


From: tonymcneill@my-deja.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Colours Game - opinions?
Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 00:43:35 GMT

 Hi Guys,

I've just field tested this pattern / game for creating an erotic and
horny state - worked a dream:) I'd be interested to know what you think
of this and how it might be improved.....

I suppose it might work best with the more visually thinking babes.

This is not a 'word for word' pattern by any means, by the way - I just
kind of found myself going into it on the fly.....  here we go..

The PUA "notices" the colour (UK spelling by the way for those who might
feel the urge to correct me) of an object, item of clothing etc.

PUA - "I find these yellow walls (or whatever) quite uplifting;
especially in the winter. Isn't it nice to have some bright colours
around when it's so grey and dark outside?" "Do you think that colours
have an big effect on peoples' moods?".

HB - "Oh, yes, definitely."

PUA - "Hmmm. I was just wondering......I mean....... I was in one of
those New Age shops recently and they were selling lots of different
coloured sunglasses.... with the idea that, if you wanted to feel more
of a certain mood, or to look at the world in a certain way, you would
slip on a pair of sunglasses which would colour everything you looked at
in the desired tone" "Do you think that could work in any way?"

HB - "Well, maybe. I don't know really"

PUA - "Well, for example, my bedroom is a very pale blue colour and I
find this particular blue very restful" "I mean, can you imagine
sleeping very well in a pale blue room?" "Imagine you are really tired,
you know when your eyelids are heavy and you curl up with that fantastic
feeling of at last ... just letting go.... and .....giving
yourself...to....(sp perhaps?).. sleep'" "Do you have a sense of a
particular colour when you imagine that feeling?" (Make sure she's
imagining being sleepy).

HB - "Oh, maybe blue, or green" (or whatever). (If she doesn't come up
with one then maybe she could be asked to imagine the perfect colour for
a bedroom, but both of the HB subjects I tried got right into it.)

PUA "How about when you feel....really full of great ideas...... like
you have all sorts of inspiration flowing through you.?"

PUA then procedes to get HB to imagine a few other states (feeling very
inspired and spiritual (commenting on her choice of colour in a playful
way)...... bursting with energy ...... feeling very sensual,
relaxed and open (we're getting closer, gentlemen)......and eventually,
 being full of passion and horny), and slowly visualising a colour with
each one.

You get the picture - guiding her into these states,
comparing colours etc etc. I have tried this on two chicks, both of whom
LOVED the game and got right into imagining the states. One of them was
an ex who is of great value as a pivot / social proof (and a friend) so
I was testing the game with her rather than going for the lay and the
other HB, in spite of being pretty shy, blushed madly and was VISIBLY
remembering the joy of being fucked until she screamed with pleasure ;)
(At this point Tony is feeling a bit fucking pleased with himself).
I think this would have definitely resulted in a fuck had I not been
meeting her at lunchtime before going off to work :( (at this point Tony
is disgusted as well as pleased!!)

What do you 'real' PUAs think of this little game? As I said I somehow
went into it on the fly after having the idea while practicing
improvising patterns while driving, using things I saw on the road as
starting points for pattern-talk. So it's pretty new and I, as yet,
claim only to be a humble RAFC. Going to test it some more and post the
results....



Any suggestions or comments?

Tony

--
'Action' is the magic word

Setting up the Kiss Close

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

A way to set up the kiss close

From: erosla77@aol.com (ErosLA77) Ross Jeffries
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 26 Dec 2000 19:23:44 GMT
Subject: Re: What if...

>Subject: Re: What if...
>From: eclipse19@my-deja.com
>Date: Tue, Dec 26, 2000 12:04 AM
>Message-id: <929jdt$u6t@nnrp1.deja.com>
>
>In article <9299s4$o03@nnrp1.deja.com>,
>  charnel1278@my-deja.com wrote:
>> Hey all,
>>
>> I've checked out a Maniac's, and some others websites and most say
>that
>> when you ask "Do you wanna kiss me?", you're guaranteed a kiss, unless
>> you get a flat out NO.  None, from what I saw, said what to do when
>you
>> get that NO.  Do you continue on the conversation like nothing
>> happened? Do you come back with a similar question later in the
>> evening?  If so, won't she kinda feel that you're badgering her?
>> Granted, this won't happen often, but what if?....
>>
>> Laters.
>
> the standard (canned) reply to a "no" answer is "YOU really know how
>to ruin a moment....your old boyfriends must have hated that about you"
>I think i got this off tony or maniac's site, forget which one. I
>havent ran into a direct "no" answer myself so i havent field tested
>this, but im sure others have. From what i read(or remember anyhow)
>this will leave them stunned and they will show less resistance against
>another kiss.
>
>

 Hmmm......well, I like this "you really know how to ruin a moment" response
WITHOUT asking for the kiss first. "Asking" for anything, outside of the
presence of fun(as in, on the spur of the moment saying, "Hey...wouldn't it be
fun to go to a strip club? Let's go!))  seems pretty pathetic to me.  

    A good one is to notice her giving you that look and then say(and I got
this from a student, it is NOT mine).  "If ? were to ask you on a scale of one
to ten, how good a kisser are you, what would you say?"

 Listen for her answer, then say, "If you were to kiss me right now, how do you
think I'd rate you?"

  You do this ONLY when you see "the look".......

  "let's find out" you say and kiss her.  

IF she backs away from that, then the "you really know how to ruin a moment"
comment works great.  Come to think of it, this could really work for a
cancellation as well. 

---

From: "General Snafu" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: What if...
Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2000 22:57:08 GMT

If she says no to a kiss, ask for a BJ.  If she says no to the BJ, you are
SOL for the night.

 wrote in message
news:9299s4$o03@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Hey all,
>
> I've checked out a Maniac's, and some others websites and most say that
> when you ask "Do you wanna kiss me?", you're guaranteed a kiss, unless
> you get a flat out NO.  None, from what I saw, said what to do when you
> get that NO.  Do you continue on the conversation like nothing
> happened? Do you come back with a similar question later in the
> evening?  If so, won't she kinda feel that you're badgering her?
> Granted, this won't happen often, but what if?....
>
> Laters.
>
>
> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/

Game: The Wall and the Forest

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Maniac introduces "The Wall and the Forest", a PU game.



From maniac_high@yahoo.com 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Game: The wall and the forest
Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 16:18:24 GMT

Another one of those mindfuck games like 4 questions or the cube:

"The Wall and the Forest"

-You are walking in a field, you see a wall, how high is it, and
how do you get by it? [wall = pride, and also how you get past
obstacles]

-you continue walking, and you see a house [kind of house you dream
to have later in life]

-you see a key on the ground, you go to the house, does the key
open the door? [if yes, means you can get married]

-you go in the house (if you were able to open with the key), and
 on the first floor you see a table and chairs, how many chairs are
 there? [means how many people in your future family]

-now you go outside, and see to one direction a dense dark forest, and
 the other way, a less dense/brighter wooded area. Which way do you
 go? (dark forest=expect something, but unknown, take a chance)
     (bright wooded area=easygoing style/way)

-as you walk you then see a lake nearby. How big is it, and how deep
 is it? (big=size of your heart, depth=depth of your heart)

THE END


This game could be lethal for chicks who want to get married or
something like that. Make sure you answer the right answers when
you tell her "what your answers were" after you finish her turn!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Game: Forest

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Nightlight introduces 'forest game'!



From: nightlight9@hotmail.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: More like "4 questions" game?
Date: Thu, 02 Nov 2000 19:50:10 GMT

You mention all these, but most of them are not very useful in the
initial meeting because they are too cerebral and too random.  Try ones
that are more viceral.  You are walking in a dark forest.  How do you
feel.  (how she approaches life).  You could to a wall with a door.
What do you do? (how she approaches obsticalls).  You look down and see
a cup on the ground what is it made out of? (how she views wealth).
You come to some water, describe it. (how she views sexuality).
Always end with sexuality because it is  a good topic for PU and
demonstrates you are comfortable with women and people a sexual context.

BookGuy, my comments are based on experience and field testing.  Please
do the same if you reply.

--
NightLight9
Just be yourself... smooth with interesting questions and interesting
answers.

Game: Strawberry Fields

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Maniac introduces a PU game: Strawberry Fields!
[Note, this originally comes from the book 'Kokology']


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Game!: Strawberry fields
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 08:02:40 GMT

Game!: Strawberry fields
001117

This is a game to find out some things about how chicks
see sex. It is very popular in Japan & is a good state
transitioner

--

Intro: Hey, lets play a game!

Imagine you are alone in a field, and see a straberry field
in front of you with tasty strawberries.

There is a fence/gate around the field. How high is it?
(= how easy is this girl/guy to take sex)

Now you are in the straberry field, how many straberries
do you take?
(=how many BFs/GFs that person wants)

Ok, after you have finished enjoying the strawberries,
how do you feel about the farmer, who's field you took them
from?
(=how you feel to that person after fucking them)


The end

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

TPUA night PU’s HB Smallmouth and converts to a lay!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

[TPUA PU's a chick at night, and converts it into a lay!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com
]


Date Posted: 2000/09/25 05:21:37 AM EDT
Author: Tokyopua 
Subject: Re: HB Small Mouth PU  (Was Re: Calling all Tokyo PUA's)

Hey Maniac,

I didnt really intend that last post of mine as a field report, since it
wasnt too detailed.  But yeah, things have been going well on the PU despite
my severely limited time. So I will attempt a bit of a field report on the
initial PU here.  My PU efficiency factor has been really high recently,
maybe because I am only trying to PU when I feel really confident and often
times when I wasnt planning on it, so was really relaxed. I did a PU on a 19
year old HB college student in the train the other night and got her home
phone number.  It was easy cause she was reading Tokyo Classified, and I
asked her about it. I was really confident, and in only 2 stops got her to
really dig me.  In fact, when I asked her why she had studied English, she
said "So I could meet a guy like you!"  The only problem is finding time to
meet her again before I leave.

The PU I did on HB Small Mouth was not planned either, I just saw her
walking back home around my place at midnight, and somehow knew that despite
my frazled appearance after 2 hours of Jujitsu practice and carrying 40
pounds of luggage, I could do the PU on her.  My opening line was "I like
your hair" which I knew was lame and she must have heard often, but hey,
thats the price of using the 3 second rule sometimes.  I immediately
followed with asking her if she was a student, what kind of work she did,
etc.  Oddly, I didnt use my standard opener "Do you speak english" in the
whole conversation.  I will post my personal notes on the rest of the PU at
the end of this post just for reference, but they arent too coherent.  They
were the basis though for the plans I laid for the successful next date that
got me laid 3 days later.  (If I have time someday I will write up full
notes on that too.) Total time to lay in terms of time invested was
approximately 3.5 hours, about the same as HB Physics, my other recent
street PU who I did that same day.  This efficiency is possible if the
progression is done just right, I think.

 wrote in message news:8qfler$o1r@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Tokyo PUA,
>
> This is an excellent report.. You really rock!
>
> Where / how did you originally
> PU this chick though? Also, taking the chick over to see your
> weight training stuff is a clever idea.. liked that..!
> BTW, I thought you left already to the USA, how long are you still
> there for?

Right near my house in a dark alley at midnight on her way home!  She told
me later (post lay) that she was scared at first, but I had a really relaxed
attitude so she got comfortable with me afterwards.  As for the weight
training stuff later, it was great kino as I had her bend over slightly and
got right behind her to "help her with her form" while simultaneously
letting her slightly feel the form of my stiff wood pressed against her, and
other such intimate situations.

Still here till Oct 14 or so, with a trip to Taiwan and maybe Hawaii too
thrown in.

>
> ALso, do you usually go out alone, or with a wing. I noticed that
> you knew quite a few people in Roppongi, I guess you get out there
> quite a bit?

Been out there a lot since last February, maybe 10 times or so.  I guess
predominantly I go with a wing, but sometimes felt it screwed up my game.
Of course, my wings didnt know anything about seduction a la ASF, thats
probably why.  Of course, neither did I till June... I know Im much better
at street PU when alone though, thats for sure!  OTOH, when I went out to
clubs with you and Rio, I think my game was really improved and I was
learning all the time.
BTW, I have heard that someplace called club Earth near hamamatucho has
really hot babes, (bitch shield too, but who cares, right;-), so you guys
might want to check that out.  3000 Yen cover charge.  May be the new
alternative to Fura?

>
> > I managed to lay that HB Small Mouth
>
> EXCELLENT!
>
> >Ganbatte!  Im seeting HB Bi this weekend again (tonight), and HB
> >small the next day, and my ex-GF the next.  Im starting to feel like
> >Maniac juggling girls, but nothing will happen w/ my ex, so its not
> >so bad.
>
> Yes, I did that ALOT last year, and fucked a shitload of chicks that
> I cant even count now..
>
> but its really tiring and you do get sick of it after a while..
> so finally I just MLTR'd a few that I really liked, who also accepted
> that I fuck other chicks, and left it at that.. guess I got to get out
> more ;-)
> not sure if its the right way yet, but been doing it that way
> the last few months now.. We'll see ;-)

I think it goes in cycles.  Eventually you get tired of the MLTR's and have
to replace them.  To do that you will have to PU lotsa new chicks, lay them,
see if they dont eject when you break the news that there are others.  That
takes a lot of time, so then you want to go back to the easy life of having
a bunch of girls on call.  Then the cycle starts over.  Im just beginning to
get these girls into MLTR status, but now I have to leave.  But theres
always business trips ack here!

>
> If you are planning on hanging around TOkyo though, you should
> bring HB Bi and her friend to one of our fuck parties the next time..
> sounds like they'd be a good time.. maybe introduce them to Kipp or
> something since I am not there right now, before you leave.. or
> give me your departure date and see if they are interested and we
> can setup something with all the ladies, if this is your sort of thing..

Id consider it, but it will take more effort, and probably wont be anything
I can do until after Im gone and come back for business trips.  You see, I
worked it too good with HB Bi.  She is signing her letters with "Love" at
the end and is all into me now.  Made me the most awesome meal any woman has
ever made me, washed my clothes, gave me an amazing massage, etc.  When I
confronted her about our last threesome, she said that she felt jealous when
she saw me doing her friend, and claimed that was the only time she had ever
done something like that, that she isnt really Bi.
So right now I think she somehow sees a relationship in this, despite my
leaving?  I figure once Im gone I can get past that as reality sinks in and
maybe set up more stuff for any business trips I make back.

>
> Good post!
>
> Maniac
> http://www.pickupguide.com

Here are those notes I was talking about, for what they are worth:

-------------------------------------------
PU of HB Small:  happened in a dark alley shortcut to my house at midnight,
I approached carrying a 30 pound backpack on one shoulder and a 10 pound
bucket of protein powder in the other, and said,  $B!H (BExcuse me, your hair is
really beautiful. $B!I (B  She reacted favorably and said thanks, but kept
walking, slightly faster.  She seemed young, so I asked if she was a
student.  She said no, I asked what she does.  She said she works for a
cable company, I fluff talked about watching TV.  She asked what I do.  I
said I know its late but you should have coffee or tea with me at Jonathans
restaurant nearby.  She said no, so I said, OK, how do we meet again.  She
said give me your number and I said,  $B!H (BAh, but I know women, if I give you
my number you will get nervous and never call. $B!I (B  She said  $B!H (BNo, 
that wont
happen I promise. $B!I (B  I knew I didn $B!G (Bt have enough rapport or 
anything to
believe that, so really what I was just doing was stalling till I could set
up a firm date.

I got a pen and wrote my number and at this point we are standing on the
corner near my place.  I play on Japanese cuteness and write my name with
hearts by it.  (None of this is stuff I would be able to do in the US.)
Then I say, OK, when are we going to meet.  Its sort of a way to pace the
ongoing reality now that she has my number,its a logical extension.  The
number is just a formality to me, I want to set up the date.  After some
negotiation, I get a date set up for 6 PM Tuesday, her day off.  I had given
her alternatives between my place and eating in Tachikawa nearby (but both
already had the presuppostion that we are meeting for a date, so I don $B!G (Bt
care which she chooses).  She chose Italian in Tachikawa which is perfect
cause eating carbs increases seratonin (=relaxation), so I will lay on the
patterning after a while, maybe even order a glass of wine (more seratonin
and romance) for us both.  Then its a 5 minute taxi ride back to my place!

Anyway, we keep talking.  I get that she never has met a foreigner, that she
likes Richard Gere, cause he is  $B!H (BShibui $B!I (B. $B!! (B(=quiet, simple, 
sober,
tasteful, austere, parsimonious, etc.)  I asked her about her ideal man
while doing the (SP) thing.  She really accessed a lot and I was awakening
her creative centers.  I touched her a lot on the arm to anchor the good
feelings.   She said she really was too ideal, but that her ideal guy was
like her father, sweet and nice.  I asked if she wanted a guy who made her
feel safe, and she said yes.  I compared our hand sizes and got kino,
remarked at how small her hands were, that my big hands could protect her.
Complemented her smile and said that it seems like her eyes smile too and
she said that she is often told that.  She said I was skillful at
complementing and I said that I really meant it.

I mirrored her body positions a lot and this seemed to have a good effect.
She seemed really into it and wasn $B!G (Bt trying too hard to get away despite 
it
being after midnight and having to work the next day, only bringing up the
time when I did.  She was rubbing her earlobe, and later playing with her
ponytail in a really sexy way, all with the doggy dinner bowl look.
I also showed kanji ability and had her write her name, and demonstrated how
we could study English together, all using the Zaurus.  (BTW, Did you buy
one yet, Maniac? A useful tool in many ways.  You can turn it into a
portable digital photo album too, albeit poor quality...) She liked that.
At one point she asked what was in the bucket, I said protein powder and she
said  $B!H (Bnomitai! $B!I (B and I said  $B!H (B5 fun dake areba, nomeru 
yo. $B!I (B
(If you have 5
minutes I can give you a taste).  But she refused to go to my apartment and
I didn $B!G (Bt press the issue, I just reconfirmed our fun date on Tuesday, and
gave her a kiss goodnight, then took off.
----------------------------------

-T

ASF reader comments on above story

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website: 

http://www.pickupguide.com 

Many excellent followups to the Psychicbabe re-lay report!
Mrsex4unyc, RJ..etc..etc.

From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:05 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

In article <92jvre$obh@nnrp1.deja.com>, maniac_high@yahoo.com writes:

>The immediate gold to take care of this, is to now make the
>relationship very high stakes for her. I can do this because
>I know that she is into me (from what she said at the dinner),
>so the idea is to play it that if she doesnt do her job as a
>chick.. she will lose EVERYTHING as far as I am concern.
>Ok, that is the plan, here we go:

plan or no plan, essentially, you are telling her the truth.  on a long-enough
timeline, the survival rate for EVERYONE is ZERO.  sooner or later, everyone
you love will either leave you or die.  chicks don't seem to believe in this,
though it is the absolute truth.  they think that they can relate to you
FOREVER, REGARDLESS of what they do or how they act.  you are telling her HOW
she can REMAIN with you and what is going to get her EJECTED.  even though it
takes a long time, so it doesn't SEEM like this... this is what has happened to
EVERY chick's relationship that has gone away.  EVENTUALLY, she was not
fulfilling her womanly duties and her man left her for a   chick (younger,
sexier, richer, swallower...)  EVEN if she IS fulfilling her duties, if her man
like it from another chick MORE, she loses out either in a PERCENTAGE of her
benefits or she gets DUMPED and loses ALL of her benefits.  you are merely
explaining this to her and telling her what she needs to do IF she wants to be
with you... which you have already determined.  you are SELLING, and now you
are screening her to see if she is QUALIFIED and ABLE to buy.

>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations
>in relationship. 

I am getting to the point where I am going to do this.  I never do this with
chicks because I morph into whatever THEY are looking for and hook them that
way.  the thing for me is that being 10 months in with MLTR, she has REALLY
learned how to please me and the time I spend TEACHING her has become minimal
and the time I spend ENJOYING her is increasing :)  it is getting tougher and
tougher for other chicks to get my attention, because anything LESS than what I
have already is BULLSHIT to me.  the time I am spending talking to chicks is
mostly eliciting values and breaking their perceptions... just for fun :)  I
know IMMEDIATELY if I want sex from a chick, and if I don't, she is IMMEDIATELY
LJBF and I use her for practice and NEXT her at the end of the conversation.

I am seriously going to consider moving to a "demonstration of value -> SOI"
model, just because I have lost my patience with LISTENING to these bitches
talking about shit that really doesn't mean anything.  I know I am going to
NEXT them ANYWAY as soon as I realize they can't compete with MLTR, so why
listen to their shit FIRST?  I may as well let them know how great I am and
let them know what kind of woman I am willing to accept, and let them continue
from there.  there is also the cognitive dissonance issue of them KNOWING that
I am going to dump them if they are not sexy and CONTINUING to talk to me and
get to know me.  the more they talk to me, the more I hook them into
interacting with me.  the more they get hooked, the greater the PAIN OF
SEPERATION (credit: RJ) when they eventually get EJECTED.  since they KNOW
ahead of time what will get them ejected and they are still talking, they are
either planning to get in line OR setting themselves up for pain.  either way,
after SOI and their acceptance of the terms, there will have to be some sort of
TEST of their compliance.  even listening to what they have to say after SOI
counts as a REWARD for their entering into a "relationship" with me.  hmm... I
will consider this more.

>I go on to tell her that other girls I know also
>like me, ask me out alot, (doesn't matter if it is true or not,
>but chick 'competition logic' will kick in, and it will scare
>your mark to act). 

the reason I don't use this is that MLTR is an integral part of my life.  if I
were to play this "chicks dig me" card, it would belittle the actual
relationship I have with MLTR.  the only problem with THAT is that I am
screening for MORE MLTRs :)  I don't give a fuck about ONS because I can get
laid ANY NIGHT within an hour of talking to the chick I am talking to... in the
WAY I want to with a chick that I WANT TO FUCK :)  a chick offering me ONS is
like a chick offering me a dollar bill.  I already HAVE dollar bills... what do
I want hers for?  of course, there are some chicks that are just so HOT that
you want to try them out, but barring that scenario, ONS can bring you much
more ANGUISH than the satisfaction that accompanies it... PLUS it is the SAME
SATISFACTION that I already get on a regular basis from MLTR. 

besides... it is OBVIOUS that chicks dig me because here SHE is, liking me
within 20 minutes of meeting me... what about the chicks that have experienced
me for days?  months?  years?  OH, she could only HOPE to be one of those! :)

for you, it is a good tactic though.

>Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>her last week, apparently).

I lost a rap to a low-self-esteem bitch that had a couple of relationships like
this as well.  I mean, I fucked her, but I didn't get to MLTR like I wanted
because she was SCARED that she wouldn't match up to the next bitch and that I
would NEXT her for no reason, like her exes did.  I tried to tell her I wanted
her for more than that, but she wasn't emotionally healthy enough to understand
or believe me.

>Ok, now Maniac has reached her head, and I take this deeper..
>I go on to tell her that I dont want just sex, I want rocks and gold
>I can get any girl in roppongi on a Saturday night and fuck her
>(not exactly true, but she doesnt know this.. goal is just to

she KNOWS that it happened to her VERY QUICKLY.  she ASSUMES she was not the
ONLY bitch to fall for you that quickly.  it is like reverse-social-proof. 
fucking a bitch FAST makes them think you can fuck other bitches FAST.

>'confirm' her worst fears so that she acts), but its not enough for
>me. I want connection, good sex, and romance, with an intelligent
>woman, and that is why I want to date you (psychicbabe).

nice line.  this is another thing I will consider.  talking-up MLTR to them.  
I never considered this either, MAINLY because if you tell a chick what you
want her to do then you never know if she is manipulating you by being that
way, or if she arrived there NATURALLY... on her own.  interesting, LOTS of
style-change material happening right around the new year :)

>Then all of the sudden, she asks me about HBass (the chick staying
>at my place over the holidays), and freaks out about it. I tell
>her that she already knows all this, and exactly what is her point
>here?

although I am a GREAT fan of "quoting", I find that there need to be times to
engage in it and times to NOT engage in it.  this will depend on what you want
with the chick.  it is the same way you can't go from being a CHUMP to a MAN in
a chick's eyes... but you CAN go from being a MAN into a CHUMP :)  if you start
out telling a chick that you have a girlfriend AND that you fuck her, you leave
yourself open for these pot-shots whenever chicks trip the fuck out and go into
their irrational rants from out of left-field.  all a bitch needs to know is
that you are "taken" so that you manage her relationship expectations.  any
more information and she feels like you will give her ALL the information. 
where does it stop?  are you going to tell her that you are fucking her?  that
you fucked her last night?  that you fucked her an hour before coming on this
date?  that you fucked YOUR WOMAN in her ass?  that she LIKES sucking dick? 
WHERE DOES IT STOP?

I ran into this problem with a chick where my relationship to her was BASED ON
trading current sex-stories.  when I got to the point where I didn't want to
tell her any more shit, she was EXPECTING me to tell her, and I realized that
if I wasn't telling her, and she wasn't telling me, then our "relationship" was
OVER.  before that, I had not realized how much I had compromised my position
by telling her CURRENT sex-shit.  think about it, and decide on your own LIMITS
to what you are willing to tell a chick about other chicks... besides, think
about the fact that she is going to KNOW that she will end up as STORIES to
other bitches right after you fuck her.  it will make her VERY self-conscious
about whatever she does with you and that could hinder her emotional states
tremendously.

>Then she stops again, and asks me if I am fucking her (maybe I
>should have said no..., but I had already said yes to her about this
>the first time I saw her)., she asks me why.. (I tell her because
>I am seeing her! like I told you the first time! I mean what do
>you expect?!?).
>
>She then puts on her bitch face, and talks in a stern voice,
>"then call me when you break her up, that is my decision, I am
>going home.".

THIS is retarded because she ALREADY knew that you were fucking her AND she
fucked you herself.  this is another problem with bitches having information
about other bitches.  they use it against themselves.  IMO, the purpose of her
knowing you have another girl or SEVERAL other girls is so she knows where she
stands in the RACE to be your MAIN BITCH.  if you are single, she has a good
chance at being that to you.  if you are "taken" she has NO CHANCE of being
that to you.  if you are SEEING bitches, then she has to COMPETE to be your #1.
 other than THAT, I think giving information about your other bitches is a
mistake...  I have made the SAME mistake up to this point, so I am not
crisicizing :)  however, I am changing that ASAP and I think you should
consider giving out information on a N2K basis (need to know).

besides, SHE is the one that NEEDS a fuck.  if it is not coming from YOU, a guy
she has fucked ALREADY and she LIKES how you did it or she wouldn't have come
back... she has to get it from a STRANGER whose sexual skills are in question
that might tie her up, fuck her in the ass or sell her to the highest bidder. 
bitches like to FRONT a lot about having ALL these sexual choices, but with all
the 8s, 9s, and 10s I have spoken to on an honest "one of the chicks" level,
they are ALL looking to have an EXCITING time, but not REALLY be in DANGER! 
you, OTOH have pussy AT HOME IN BED WAITING FOR YOU!  the only one to lose out
if she bails... is HER!  knowing that, I would have not even entertained her
bullshit OR called her on it, letting her know that I was getting laid tonight
REGARDLESS of whether SHE fucks or not.  that would take the fucking WIND out
of her sails :)

>I tell her I am planning to break her up (which is true) later, so
>it is nothing you should worry about. 

this, my friend :)  is a COP-OUT!  it is used VERY EFFECTIVELY by married men
to keep fucking their side-bitches, but WE are way above bullshit tactics like
this.  I commend you for thinking of this "on the fly", but PLEASE, PLEASE! 
hehe  I have MUCH more respect for you as a PUA than to hear some CRAP like
this from you :)  PLEASE think of something better for the next instance of a
chick trying to BLACKMAIL you into trading in a R-E-L-A-T-I-O-N-S-H-I-P where
you are getting EVERYTHING you want from a chick... for a ONS with HER! 
HAHAHAHAHAHA  >:)

I haven't run into a chick STUPID enough to try to disrespect my MLTR for being
with me... chicks have STARTED to say she is dumb for "letting" (as if she has
ANY say in the matter) her man fuck other chicks, and I have BROKEN THEIR
FUCKING ASSES listing the benefits that SHE is getting that they will most
likely NEVER have with a man... EVER!  and CERTAINLY don't have right now, or
they would not be talking to me in a bar... they would be with THEIR OWN MAN
conducting this FANTASY RELATIONSHIP that they are professing that my MLTR
should have :)  I have NEVER run into a chick that has even TRIED to break into
my relationship with MLTR because they KNOW I mean business.  all they can do
is become ANOTHER MLTR... and after they hear the QUALIFICATIONS, they KNOW
they can't even achieve THAT... only ONS and LJBF with me.  if some bitch EVER
suggested that I break up with MLTR in order to ONS her, I would  A) laugh in
her face and  B) immediately demand an EXPLANATION of the reasons why she
thinks she can knock MLTR out of the box AND make her perform ANY AND ALL
SKILLS that she CLAIMS to be better than MLTR at IMMEDIATELY!  put up or SHUT
THE FUCK UP!  the result would be the ONS ANYWAY, and she would still be LJBF
or NEXT because MLTR is NOT about sex... it is about compatability and I
PERSONALLY could not be with some bitch that needs to knock other chicks off in
order to gain status.  I gain status by BEING MYSELF and letting bitches make
INTELLIGENT, EDUCATED decisions to be with me.  any chick that wants to be with
me had better do the same.

>she gets upset, and starts
>screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
>just like her ex-bf, getting other girls while dating her, and how
>all guys just want sex..etc..

I would have told her "you wanna calm the fuck down?"  throwing tantrums and
making scenes are expressions of her ability to do ANYTHING in your presence. 
I personally don't tolerate that.

>Then she says.. ok, if you let me meet your GF at your house
>tonight, then I will let you have sex with me. [ha! I got her!]

ok.  thank God I happened to read the next line before I started typing this. 
I was JUST going to ask you WHY you are STILL letting her blackmail you into
fucking her... ESPECIALLY when she is the one that needs it and you don't :)

>I bounce back, and say, "what exactly makes you think I am
>desperate to have sex with you tonight?! Do you think I am
>just some stupid guy and you can manipulate me like that?
>No, you will not meet my GF, it is disrespectful to her to do
>that. You know the situation, it was clear to you from the
>beginning, and you accepted it. There is no more to talk about.
>I am not here only for sex, I can get that anywhere. Sex only
>of itself is of little value to me, I want more than that.

SWEET!  :)  break her fucking ASS maniac :)

>I then bring out the nuclear weapons! My tonality is very firm,
>and I eye fuck her, while telling her the following. First, I tell
>her that I already told her about my GF, she was clear about it
>right from the start, and she has NO excuse. Then I go on to tell
>her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
>that did NOT happen. So do NOT compare me to your ex. I am a
>different person, and EXCEPT better treatment than that if you
>ever want to see me again. She starts crying more, and hugging
>again.

ugh :/   fucking IDIOTS!   man, the shit some bitches put you through!  does
everyone SEE why we have to study this shit?

>I put her against wall, and tell her not to complain about me like
>I am her ex, I a am different person than he is.
>
>I tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>alone!

this is a good point.  I like to play it the other way:

ok... so now, you have told me that you want everything to be a 'perfect'
situation with a guy before making a move.  You want him to be ideal with
women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady... WHAT MAKES YOU THINK
HE WILL WANT YOU?   WHAT ARE YOU BRINGING TO THE TABLE THAT IS GOING TO MAKE A
MAN LIKE THAT CHOOSE YOU OVER ANY OTHER CHICK?

you wanna see some confusion?  you wanna see a bitch get BROKEN?  HAHAHAHA  >:)
 of course, I use this on chicks that I am just practicing on, because it
normally induces DEPRESSION, not horniness.  when they have to GO DEEP INSIDE
and dive BELOW THE SURFACE of their programming, they realize that they CAN NOT
TELL ME WHY A MAN WOULD WANT THEM!  they stall the fuck out dude :)  it's
amazing.  matter of fact, it's documented already.  look at my recent thread
with "telembe".  I let her say all this bullshit about what she wanted from a
guy in order to give up her virginity, then when she was finished talking about
what she WANTED, I asked her what she was OFFERING to a guy that was going to
give her all this committment and "love" and other bullshit and she said a
whole bunch of shit that ANY bitch can and WILL give to a man she likes.  she
might have THOUGHT she had something to offer a guy that was going to seperate
her from the pack, but she doesn't.  even GOOD PUSSY can't get a bitch any
credit because there are LOTS of bitches that can fuck and suck like pros...
elites AND sub-elites.  telembe NEVER told us what seperates her from the rest
of the bitches that might make a MAN like the one she wants even LOOK HER WAY! 
the reason is that there is NO reason! :)  bitches are programmed that MEN want
them... but they are NEVER told WHY.  the reason is that men like to FUCK and
get their dicks sucked.  they also like companionship and cooking and cleaning
and for a girl to look good on their arm so they can feel accomplished around
their buddies.  chicks THINK they are ENTITLED to a good man... but the GOOD
MEN... are picking GOOD WOMEN!  if they were SHINING like they think they are,
they would have been scooped up already and married or whatever they were
looking for because some guy would have spotted her and said "I'm not going to
let her go for ANYTHING" and she would be happy... at least according to her
programming.  OH, how I LOVE to see a bitch's face while she TRIES AND TRIES to
dig up ANY reason why a guy as great as the one she claims to want would EVER
choose her over any other bitch :)  the JOY the JOY that I feel as this POMPOUS
BITCH breaks the fuck down RIGHT IN FRONT OF MY FACE! :)  of course since I
broke her, I keep talking to her and ease her back to a decent state of being
and let her know that she can take steps to make herself into the woman that a
man would want, but she has to really KNOW HERSELF and KNOW MEN in order to
make an intelligent decision.  I am not into depressing chicks... unless they
TRULY DESERVE IT for all the depression they have caused men throughout their
tenure as FINE bitches :)  also, I have no desire to BREAK bitches and leave
them like that.  that just makes it WORSE for ALL OF US looking for FINE, yet
DECENT chicks.

>she cries, and says that is so true, that is her problem, she never
>takes the chance and loses out because she doesn't make the
>move on taken guys. Then I run my 'take chances routine' (if you take
>a chance, in the end, the result is usually good, but if you don't,
>just you get left behind, by yourself).. 

nice.  I like that one... emphasizing loss and loneliness.

>she cries more, says she
>needs to take the chance, and doesnt want to be alone.

she's done :)  nice work.  land her!

>She says she has to be careful, that all guys want just sex, and
>bitches about this for about 30 seconds.

as opposed to what?  what does she WANT guys to want?

>Now I start the 'you need me, I dont need you..you think I just want
>only sex, then you dont understand me at all.. if you think that is
>what I am only, then you do NOT deserve me.. I do no need you to go out
>with me if that is what you think I am.. I want connection, sex,
>passion, and closeness.. and if you haven't figured that out about
>me yet, then get another guy, because you dont understand me at all..

OK OK OK... you've CONVINCED me maniac :)  that's some good shit right there :)
 starting NOW, I am pitching for MLTR ONLY.  bitches that want ONS or LJBF will
get what they deserve from me... which isn't much.  I LOVE this idea of dissing
her for claiming that you are looking for ONS... or even just a "bootie-call"
type relationship :)  I love it.  I would feel so PROUD getting on her like
this.  sweet!  EXTREMELY congruent!  nice play!  this is going into my style,
starting RIGHT NOW!  :)

>I am doing this, because I know the left (logic) and right (emotions,
>passion) are fighting each other..they have been all night. Because the
>left doesn't accept the logic of the situation, but I know the right side
>dying for a shag,..she is trying to rationaize going out with a taken guy,
>but I have gotten her so excited tonight, that she needs that fuck.

THIS is the reason I never learned any of this shit until recently.  my
caveman-kino style before this involved ZERO talking.  totally kino and kissing
and PHYSICAL seduction with domineering EYE-CONTACT.  there was NO INFORMATION
for the left side to process at all.  EVERYTHING went STRAIGHT to the chick's
right side, and her left had to try to process the EMOTIONS and turn them into
a story that she could understand... in the meantime, she is PHYSICALLY falling
for the kino and wanting MORE AND MORE until we are fucking.  I never HAD to
talk to chicks before OR after fucking them because my PHYSICAL ATTACK is so
DEVASTATING!  I would just take them over PHYSICALLY and their right brains
would do ALL the work and the left would struggle to understand, but eventually
succumb to the onslaught!  ARG ARG! :)

thanks for explaining that to me :)

>As I touch her side of face, she goes doggy look, I kiss her, and she
>gets like screambabe, panting. I put leg between her, she widens, goes nuts
>totally. I ask her she likes me (in a tell her sort of way' you like me..'),
>she replies 'yes'. I say (stare her down) .. she asks "what should I do?"
>I say in a very strn fatherly voice while staring her down 4 inches from
>her head.. you will follow me..that is what you will do.. and you will do
>what I say. 'she says, 'I will'. I tongue her down more, run her crotch,
>she almost cums right there, then I take her to a love hotel (her first
>time!), no resistance what so ever.

interesting.  what just happened here?  did you somewhere dictate to her that
the terms of her being "your bitch" is that she has to sumbit to you fully? 
are you getting a verbal confirmation of that from her?  or is something else
going on... like she just plain UNDERSTANDS that you can move her to passions
that make her WANT to cum and that you are going to take her there and over the
edge?

another point... what do you guys think of foreplay on a chick.  he mentions
that she almost came right there... do you think it is good to get her to the
EDGE and leave her there so she is so horny, she will do ANYTHING for you to
make her cum, OR to give her an orgasm right there in her clothes to
demonstrate your sexual mastery over her?  personally, I am into the sexual
mastery thing because I notice a newfound RESPECT from a chick that has had
guys on top of her NAKED, fucking her for all they were worth and she never
came from it, and then I am just doing kino on her and fingering her and she
cums from just that.  do you think that making the chick cum on herself makes
her want sex MORE or want it LESS since she just got off?  take into account
that chicks are multi-orgasmic and that they feel sexier after cumming, not
DRAINED like guys.

>As I am fucking her, I am putting things in her head, like D.Shades reports.
>I tell her as she is screaming it feels deeper and deeper, closer and
>closer. She is going nuts will I am fucking her.

I need to reasearch this.  is this more right-brain, left-brain shit where her
left-brain is shut down because of the FIREWORKS that are going off in her mind
because of the sex, leaving her wide open to suggestion?  if you have any links
for this, please post.

>I stare her down, and I tell her you need me (during sex), she says yes.
>I tell her from now on you will follow me, and do what I say. She says
>'yes, I will'. I continue doing her, she says "it feels SO good, I really
>need that, I really want it, i love you inside me!".. she is fucking like a
>wild animal, loud voice, shouting and screaming, oh, I want it, give it
>to me, I want to come!

more of the same?

>Then she tells me anything is ok as long as I dont hate her..she doesnt
>want me to hate her. She wants me to hold/hug her, she cries a bit, then is
>ok again (seems to be thinking of her old bf she says). I touch her
>more, face goes totally doggy look, and finger her, she goes nuts, we start
>fucking again.

the "I don't want you to hate me" thing is very important in the D/s
relationship... not that you set this up like that, but that is the MAIN
incentive for her to follow your lead... that she does NOT want you to hate her
and CERTAINLY not to banish her.  when that is TRULY first and foremost in her
brain, she will regulate HERSELF and place herself in-line with your thinking
and what YOU want her to be.  she also won't try to blackmail you anymore
because she KNOWS it gets on your nerves and all THAT will do is get her
EJECTED sooner rather than later :)

>Her back is on the bed, and I am fucking her missionary, her legs are
>spread and wide in the air, which I am holding. I tell her "see, I control
>you, 

hehe ok... this is a little FAR-FETCHED for me at this point, but I have not
researched it yet :)  I DO like the next line though.

>I go deep in your body because it is the one way to reach you totally
>deep in your mind which no one else can do. 

interesting

>By conquering your body, I can
>conquer your mind (then I drill her a bit more after I finish the sentence so
>she goes more crazy). I play with your body because it lets me control
>your mind (then drill her some more..ha, it is like the ultimate form of
>reward hypnosis).

IS there such a thing as reward hypnosis?  links please? :)

>I ask her, so why you like me. She says she says, you are decisive and
>sometimes I am indecisive, so you make it easy for me. I want the guy
>to make it easy for me to decide what to do (important clue here Maniac!
>maybe most chicks are like this! Maybe this too is where I fucked up
>with HB Geek!)

I have heard this a lot too... only thing is that there is a lot of
RESPONSIBILITY that comes with telling a chick what to do, and if the VALUE of
owning her is not sufficient for me, I don't give a fuck WHAT she does enough
to want to lead her to a good time.

>Moral of the story.. keep your ground.. call all chick bullshit DIRECTLY.
>Make the chick risk fear losing the relationship if she doesn't capitulate
>and chances are she will back down, in spite of how it looks (and I could
>do this BECAUSE I had other choices.. another reason to be fucking
>several chicks at once). As well, it seemed that she was giving me all the
>bullshit in part because she WANTED me to call her on it, and then fuck her
good
>at the end of the night, which I obliged.

chicks give you shit-tests to find out if you are stronger than them and see
HOW you are going to control them.  chicks like the way I control them because
I NARROW their choices for them, but STILL make them choose.  they can choose
the path of ULTIMATE SATISFACTION, or they can choose the path of EJECTION and
being back on the dating scene meeting the SAME LAME GUYS every night :)

you had told her you had a girlfriend, but she seems to have NEEDED to know
that she really COULDN'T have you all to herself and that you really DIDN'T
NEED to fuck her that night or EVER.  you stuck to your guns (after letting her
get to you for a while :-) and she eventually ran out of logic and got
overridden with kino and gave up the fucking pussy like she came there to do :)

>Constructive comments/opinions welcome!
>
>Maniac High
>http://www.pickupguide.com

EXCELLENT!  keep up the GOOD WORK dude!  :)

---
From: erosla77@aol.com (ErosLA77)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 30 Dec 2000 20:12:47 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

>Subject: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit
special!]
>From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
>Date: Fri, Dec 29, 2000 10:37 PM
>Message-id: <92jvre$obh@nnrp1.deja.com>

>)this chick is a very highly educated, driven, professional
> career woman and earns likely a big 6 figure salary
>b)she is very mature, focused and spends all day in her office
> surrounded by sharks and other pirrhana type scumbag characters

 She's got to be in control ALL DAY LONG at work. Small wonder then, with a
man, she wants to fully SURRENDER control and be made to submit.  It's like all
those super-powerful Congressmen and Judges and the like who LOVE going to get
pissed-on and whipped by some Madame Dominatrix. 

>I regroup my thoughts.

 I admire your ability to do this in the field, Maniac. As you think about it,
what do you do internally to re-set yourself and keep yourself in a good frame
of mind when all this shit throws your way?

>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations

   Metahpor is a POWERFUL tool to move folks from a fixed perception to a new
one. Please, share your story!

> Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>her last week, apparently).

Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with fucking; it feels
good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the vulnerabilities.  So
when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which overcomes the
potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. She's worried about pain,
so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not only losing
out on the pleasure of screwing, BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out that if
she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even WORSE
crack-up.

  Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.

>he gets upset, and starts
>screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
>just like her ex-bf,

See? The fear of the pain of being hurt just like her ex-BF hurt her is now
rearing its ugly head.  She doesn't seem like a very emotionally stable person
in ANY event, let alone having just been dumped by a guy.  

>Then I go on to tell
>her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
>that did NOT happen

 Sharp thinking. Again, what do you do internally to keep your state solid and
your thinking sharp? THAT process internally is of great value, even more than
the specifics you share.  The specifics are like handing guys fish; good for a
nice meal and of value. But  how you get to the mind-set is TEACHING someone
HOW to fish so they can eat for life. 

>I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>alone!

 Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to her her
"ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she can then
accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!  

   Excellent...Maniac, I don't give a damn WHAT my orthodox SS followers say,
this is BRILLIANT stuff and I'd be proud to be your wing or have you as mine,
ANY FUCKIN' DAY of the week! Sir, I salute you!

>Now what I am doing with all the above, is not arguing the logic (too
>much)
>of this, because, of course she is right, and I know this.

 Actually, you ARE not arguing the logic, but you are USING the logic...HER
logic..HER way of viewing things.....pointing out WHY and HOW she loses and
what will happen if she doesn't stop it.   It's all centered around losing and
WHY she loses, based on what she has told you.  It IS logical, FROM her point
of view.  

 Great, Great stuff...sir, I salute you!

-----

From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]
Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2000 12:03:54 GMT

Replies to various people about psychicbabe:

Answers to various questions:

Was psychicbabe british, or Japanese?
She was a brit of Japanese ancestry (ie. she
looked 'j', but thought, acted and had an
english accent like a brit). This in my
opinion made it harder, because brit women
are so fucking F A T, and she was so
slender, sexy and attractive (and she dressed
to kill) compared to all of them. Lots of guys were
hitting on her (and she said she always got hit
on, and hated it.. trick was to not make it look
like a 'hit').

Why not a white chick? Well, I had the chance...
but.. at the conference where I met her, EVERY
brit. white chick there was in serious blimp bulge
territory.. very scary. Why is it so many caucasian
women are so FAT?

It was funny though, because something like 8 guys
(I counted) tried to hit on psychicbabe the night
I PU'd her. One guy was pretty good, the rest were
total AFC's..it was rather funny.

Re: Rocks -vs- gold.. how I use it (yes, it is
Jake's metephor. For RJ, search the original post
on fastseduction.com. It is also on pickupguide.com
someplace (if not it will be there in about 2 weeks,
I am revising the page this week). Basically, I intro
it as follows:
After chick says bullshit about wanting to go to
dinner and be friends or shit for 6 months before
becoming a GF, I say: Actually, I dont go to dinner
or stuff like that with ladies who are not my GF
CHick:  gasps!
Maniac: see, going to dinner, is an important step
in a relationship for me. I only share it with someone
special
chick: Huh?
Maniac: Well, let me put it this way, do you ever
sleep with a guy who is just your friend, or dont
care about?
chick: of course not!
Maniac: well, why do you think a guy should do any
different then?
Maniac: See, let me tell you a story. You ever hear
about 'rocks & gold'?
chick: no? what is it?
Maniac: Well, Relationships are valuable things.
And each partner is looking for something. It is like
diamonds (rocks) and gold. Both are valuable.

But women prefer diamonds to gold (usually), and
men prefer gold to diamonds (usually). Of course,
both are important, especially in a long term
relationship, but if a woman could choose, she would
prefer the diamonds  first, and the man would
prefer the gold  first. right?

chick: yeah, probably

Maniac: And (generally), a man can accept gold
without the diamonds, and a woman can accept
diamonds without any gold.

So in a relationship, a woman is mining for
diamonds, while the man is mining for gold.
While they are in the mine together, the
guy gives diamonds he finds to the woman, and
the woman gives the gold she finds, to the man.

But if you give a woman gold only, or a man
diamonds only.. neither is likely to be
very happy, and the relationship will soon
fall apart. In short, an exchange of sorts
takes place in a successful relationship.

And also, if a man expects just gold (sex),
but doesnt want to give her diamonds
(relationship & the mushy stuff), then she
will dump him fairly soon, because he is
playing/using her just for sex..

And if a woman expects just diamonds (walks,
attention, nice dinners, movies..etc) without
giving some gold (sex), then he (if he has any
clue about how to deal with women, though many
men do not, especially in North America) will
dump her because she is using/playing him just
for his personality.

A guy taking a chick to dinners, buying shit
and giving nice walks without sex is THE SAME
as a guy sleeping with a girl, and then kicking her
out right after the fuck is over. (chick says:
'yelch!'. Yes, thats right, and for the guy,
just dinners and buying shit is 'yelch', with
no sex, and no attention is exactly the same.

Because a woman will go to free dinner with
almost any guy, it has no value to me. But
I am like you, I want attention, and I want
to be made to feel special.

And although a girl will go to nice free dinners
with almost anyone, I also know that a girl will
not sleep with anyone. So I know if she does with me,
then it means she thinks I am important. And if
she wont, then it means she doesnt care about me
at all, so I really dont need to see her again,
I will just go find another girl.

Maybe you might think it is unusual for a guy
to think this way, but it is just my way.

See, I dont want to be played. Guys are always
getting played by girls for nice dinners, long
talks on the phone, and for their personalities.
It is the SAME as a girl being used for sex.
So I am happy to give plenty her diamonds, but at
the same time, I dont want to be played, so
I also expect her to want to give me gold.
And if she doesn't, it means she doesnt care about
me, is using me, or it means I am being played,
or I am stupid.

As well, experience has also showed me that
'friends first' almost NEVER results in a
relationship. I mean how many of your BFs were
your friend first (chick usually replies..uh,
zero).

Exactly, so that is why I never play 'friends
first'. Friends first means diamonds for the
lady, and no gold for the guy. That is like
the guy saying (ok, lets fuck for 6 months,
and if its good, we can go to dinner, and go
out, and you can be my GF). Would you like
that (chick: yelch!!).

Exactly.. so that is why it is far better,
that the lady meet me, get to know me, and
then I expect her to be smart enough to know
to take that chance THEN (or reject it, and I will
go get another lady) when it is offered to her.

So that is why I expect things that way in a
relationship with a lady.

After this, a chick is (usually) quite impressed,
or surprised and doesnt know what to say..

[When I recited this to psychicbabe, she actually told me
she was very impressed, that I understood relationships
so well ;-) ]

Had I been smart, I would have used it on HB
geek, and laid her, but after that failure I
thought about it, and then when the same situation
came up with Psychicbabe this week, I knew what
to do..

Ok, now on to other comments..

RJ writes
>Maniac writes:
> >I regroup my thoughts.
>
>  I admire your ability to do this in the field, Maniac. As you think
about it,
> what do you do internally to re-set yourself and keep yourself in a
good frame
> of mind when all this shit throws your way?

A couple things.. first, this PARTICULAR chick is of no importance
to me, because I am (likely) seeing 3 others this week. So it is
not as risky to me to be firm, and keep my ground.

Another important fact, is the way chick's brains are usually
wired. For a
chick, once she likes a given guy, it is hard for her to immediately
switch to another guy. it is far MORE risky, because a chick (unlike
men), usually cannot switch to another guy, once she ALREADY
likes a given guy (story is different BEFORE you got her to
like you..then SHE has more power than you).

So I play on this, and as a result I dont feel nervous/scared at all,
because there is far more to risk to her, than to risk to me. Because
she is stuck to me, but I am not stuck to her. (this also is why
'jerks' can get away with so much shit on any given chick, and why
she will tolerate it.. because her brain has now got her focussed
on THAT guy, and it is now a choice (in her mind), between him (and
his bullshit... or being alone (sure she can get another guy in 10
minutes, but she cannot build those nice feelings of 'attachment'
in 10 minutes.. that gives us men power, once we realize this).

Two, I am generally a very balanced level
headed person, and dont take any of this personally (as you already
know, RJ). Three (in this case), I had
already laid this chick, so I didnt care really if I laid her again
or not.. I already conquered her, and she (and I) already knew that.

If it is a new chick, sometimes, I get more nervous/fucked up (see
HB Geek). I am trying to keep my senses more when this happens

> > Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
> >problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
> >her last week, apparently).
>
> Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with
fucking; it feels

Not sure about this, I think she just simply wanted the fuck, but
wanted to feel she was important to me, and she didnt want to just
get played..

> good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the
vulnerabilities.  So
> when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which
overcomes the
> potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. She's worried
about pain

yes, thats right.

> so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not
only losing
> out on the pleasure of screwing,

Not really. I actually made it clear to her that I didnt care if
she bang me or not. The point was that she had to give her mind
to me, and respect me, and follow me (whether that is bang me,
make her take off her clothes in the window for me, or do my
dishes..whatever.. its not the banging that is important, it is
the submission to me that counts, and what she needs to give me
if she wants my attention at all).

> BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
> believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out
that if
> she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even
WORSE
> crack-up.

Yes

>   Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.
>
> >he gets upset, and starts
> >screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
> >just like her ex-bf,
>
> See? The fear of the pain of being hurt just like her ex-BF hurt her
is now
> rearing its ugly head.  She doesn't seem like a very emotionally
stable person
> in ANY event, let alone having just been dumped by a guy.

No, she is not stable at all. I think though, it is because she
bottles it up all day, to be the 'office bitch' that she has to
be in the daytime. This chick lives for her work. She has no other
life.

>
> >Then I go on to tell
> >her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
> >that did NOT happen
>
>  Sharp thinking. Again, what do you do internally to keep your state
solid and
> your thinking sharp? THAT process internally is of great value, even
more than
> the specifics you share.  The specifics are like handing guys fish;
good for a
> nice meal and of value. But  how you get to the mind-set is TEACHING
someone
> HOW to fish so they can eat for life.

Actually, the specifics are important I think. This is why lay/field
reports with details are so important. I think really shitty on my
feet. I really suck.. bad.

But if I have had that same experience before (with another chick),
or been in that same situation before, and
either succeeded (or failed, and then thought about how to handle it
right the next time), then I will handle it correctly this time.

I really believe in field experience. I have alot... really alot.
so I have seen many of these situations before. It is like chess,
or a foreign language. If you've been there before, and worked out
a solution, then you know what to do. You MUST get field experience.
It is CRUCIAL. And each time you fail, you go home, and see what
you did right/wrong, and what you would do if the same situation
happened again. This is why I also post the fuckup as well as
the lay reports.. they are very valuable to me in gathering my
thoughts and forcing me to think about what I did right/wrong,
as well as listening to the other's comments about them on this
NG.

I also look at the other's reports as well, and learn about
situations, and ask myself for each one, if it happened to me,
what would I do/how would I handle it. Eventually, after doing it
for a couple years (I have been at this in ernest for about 2
years now), you get better at it. Learning situations in PU, is
like learning the words of a foreign language, and how to connect
them all together.. how to move from a bad situation..to a good
one to get the chick in a horny state..

Also, I keep in mind alot about what MrSex4uNYC says about attitude,
and when I get stuck, I ask myself, what would NYC tell me right
now about this situation. He is very congruent, and if you think
things this way, it is easy to be clear what is the right way or
wrong way.

> >I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
> >with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
> >with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
> >and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
> >unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
> >alone!
>
>  Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to
her her
> "ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she
can then
> accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!

Yes, basically that is the idea. I am not sure that it means I am
an authority, but its more, to convey that she is clueless, she
is wrong, so to listen to herself will make her fuck up even more..
..so maybe she had better listen to me instead, and then she wont
fuckup as much.. basically that is the idea..

>    Excellent...Maniac, I don't give a damn WHAT my orthodox SS
followers say,

I didn't get this.. What are orthodox SS followers, and I had no
idea they were saying anything about this.. I really dont understand
what you mean here..

> >Now what I am doing with all the above, is not arguing the logic (too
> >much)
> >of this, because, of course she is right, and I know this.
>
>  Actually, you ARE not arguing the logic, but you are USING the
logic...HER
> logic..HER way of viewing things.....pointing out WHY and HOW she
loses and
> what will happen if she doesn't stop it.   It's all centered around
losing and
> WHY she loses, based on what she has told you.  It IS logical, FROM
her point
> of view.

Yes, basically that is the idea. What I meant was, is that her main
point is that she wants a monogamous BF, and doesn't want to be played.
But, I am playing her, and she (at some level) realizes that, so
in essense, her gut feel about this is totally correct.

But I am playing her desire for the fuck, and her fear of losing
out, which lets me bypassing her gut feel that she is being
played, and then I can get her to fuck anyways.

Good followups everyone!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

-----

From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]
Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2001 12:10:23 GMT

  "Dohn Joe"  wrote:
>  wrote in message news:92n7b96
@nnrp1.deja.com...
> [snip]
>
> The more I think of it, the more this seems to be a great PU.
> I think the PU in England is the gist of your piece of work.
>o I'd be glad to see more
> details on how you picked her up in England, that's the hardest work. How
> did you stand up the crowd? How did you make it not look like a PU?

I was using psychological 'jujitsu' (use the strength of your
opponant, against themself). There is a field report from 2 months
ago, that outlines the PU (check fastseduction.com archives).
Basically, I met her at a conference. I didnt talk to her much.
Then I followed her onto a bus that was taking us to the next
meeting place. A guy was hitting on her, and he sat with her.
I sat on the seat in front bymyself.

She (like most british bitches), started complaining about how
she hates men, and other bullshit. The guy on the bus with her
is taking this/agreeing with it (if I remember right).

I just turned around (and tonality and eye contact here is crucial),
and just tell her in a VERY authoritative voice, slowly.. "perhaps
you have just not met the right man yet, one you understands you,
deeply, and completely. But.. you never know the future.. now do you..
I used killed eye contact, spoke slowly, and continued "perhaps
if you open your mind more, you might find him.. by surprise, without
even expecting it, because often, that is the way it usually is..see"

Psychicbabe went "maybe", and then started more manhating bitching.

I then described the kind of man she wanted "one you could rely on,
but at the same time, be mysterious, and exciting in some unexpected
ways, because he just knew how to reach you deep inside you, and
your mind.. that is what your looking for..isnt' it?"

Psychicbabe: yes,

{continue PU, bunches of stuff from the ManiacPlan, if I remember
right}

The key here was the tonality and Eye-Fuck contact. That is what
did it more than the words I used. I just totally crushed her
with it..

> How did
> you get past her "bitch office" shield? I'm asking especially because, as I
> picture this woman, it would seem pretty intimidating for me to approach
> her.

I had the attitude that she obviously had never met a man that
knew how to give it to her right, which means that she obviously
needed ME far more than I needed her. That mindset made it easy.

> I admire your ability to take her from there into total submission.
> existing relationship than guys. That's why many (even HOT ones) find
> themselves in a dead end - boring or abusive - relationship, love to
> complain about it to whoever they find to listen, yet are unable to step out

EXACTLY!!

> of it. That's why the first fuck is hard - after that she is bound
> emotionally to you. You see,

>Women's sexuality is DISSOLVED in them.

Yes! you understand it!! (true for most, but not all chicks though,
some just like sport fucking, like we do)

> GREAT words to remember for all us RAFCs when we feel like beating the walls
> after a fuckup... I myself am so darn depressed when coming back after an
> unsuccessful encounter with a chick. Yes, each field experience is one more
> lesson

Yes, do NOT underestimately field experience. It is SO important.
I fucked up TONS (see all the fuckup reports I used to post a couple
years ago on ASF), and I still fuckup alot (see HBGeek, or HockeyBabe).
Over on cliff's list they say it takes 2..4 years to get good
at something, and 10 years to be a master. I TOTALLY agree.
I have only been at this for 2.. 2 1/2 years. And the more I learn,
the more I realize I still need to learn.. There is still TONS that
I dont know yet.

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

----
From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:08 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

I, for one, am really GLAD to see a post from RJ that has helped me move
forward in MY game :)  not that I am an ingrate hehe... his contribution to all
this is UNDENIABLE to begin with and if I hadn't stumbeled onto his site, I
would have still been using my caveman tactics and my MENTAL seduction game
would still be lacking.  as much as I appreciate his contribution to the
seduction game in general, I had been disappointed with all the flaming and
nonsense that he and others had/have been involved with because I thought that
this NG was BASED on USEFUL interaction between him and the rest of us, but I
found that not to be the case :(  not that ANYONE gives a fuck what I have to
say about this, but I wanted to back up into the PAST to make it clear that I
appreciate RJ's PERSONAL contribution to the NG TODAY.

In article <20001230151247.26801.00001467@ng-fi1.aol.com>, erosla77@aol.com
(ErosLA77) writes:

>>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations
> 
>   Metahpor is a POWERFUL tool to move folks from a fixed perception to a new
>one. Please, share your story!

I have been doing this without identifying it:

A) find out her perception (marriage, monogamy, sucking dick VS kissing...)
B) "quote" her a story illustrating a chick that saw things a DIFFERENT way
(the way I want HER to see things) and benefitted GREATLY from it (she is still
with me, she got married to the guy she wanted, she gained inner peace and
self-love...)
C) watch her AGREE with something that she just minutes ago BELIEVED was
incorrect, or not for her.

the most fascinating part is (C) because I didn't realize my powers of
validation, pacing then LEADING had developed so strongly.  this is partially
because I am an empath and can FEEL when a chick moves into different emotional
states so I can relate to her from within her own state and effectively "vulcan
mind-meld" with her, turning the TWO of us into a SINGLE, functioning entity so
that I can dictate for US... to a degree.

a frequent situation is chicks asking me if I am single.  basically, I explain
to them that I am in an "open" relationship.  they practically INVARIABLY
disrespect my MLTR for being stupid. "how can she go for that?" "I would have
dumped you" "I would never let a man see other women"...  sooooo :)  I let them
go on and on and get it all out and completely ENTRENCH themselves in the DREAM
of them being with a man like me AND dumping me or CHANGING me or whatever
their BULLSHIT FANTASIES are at the time.  THEN I go into the BENEFITS of being
MY PRIMARY relationship... :)  when I stack up the LIST of BENEFITS and it
stacks HIGHER than those bitches have in their OWN RELATIONSHIPS RIGHT NOW,
they start thinking.  they think about what LITTLE they really have in their
relationships that MY MLTR is getting.  they think about the TRUST and
COMPANIONSHIP between us that they DON'T HAVE with their borefriends.  they
think about how she is SEXUALLY SATISFIED... DAILY if she wants it.  she has
someone to give her the REAL DEAL on how men are and what we want from
chicks... not someone that's going to keep playing her until he is finished
fucking her.  they ALSO see how the other bitches (like them in the near
future) come and go and MLTR CONSTANTLY receives the benefits of being with a
man that does EVERYTHING for her that she could want... for the MERE price of
NOT bailing because I fuck other chicks :)  once I break it down to them, ALLLL
I see on their faces is ENVY.  matter of fact, they tend to look EMBARRASSED
when I ask THEM about THEIR relationships.  oh, that reminds me... the bitches
that DON'T HAVE A MAN AT ALL fare the WORST in these situations.  my MLTR has
NEVER-ENDING SATISFACTION... they have STORIES of what they WOULD DO... IF
they could get a man AT ALL!  :)

chicks would rather have 20% of a WINNER than 100% of a LOSER!

>> Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>>her last week, apparently).
>
>Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with fucking; it
feels
>good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the vulnerabilities.  So
>when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which overcomes the
>potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. 

wow!  VERY powerful :)  I had really considered these to be apples and
oranges... pain of emotions after sex and pain of LOSS of the individual. 
however, discomfort is discomfort.  I quit giving UTILITY to this PIVOT I was
using because I realized she had ZERO self-esteem and not many other redeeming
qualities other than her looks.  she went from LJBF to NEXT overnight.  I had
been using her for a pivot because of her looks, but her lack of personality
started to wear on me and finally, she had to go.  no more hanging out, no more
phone calling, no more help with her love-life... nothing... cold turkey. 
completely FORGOT about her.  about a month or so later, the holiday season
comes around and she  A) calls me  B) tells me she bought me something for
christmas (I bought her NOTHING, not even a CARD and didn't bother to get one
when she told me she bought me something)  C) tells me she wants to bring it TO
my house, and  D) shows up with gift in hand, READY to socialize and spend time
with me.  

this is the SAME bitch that NEVER went in her purse to even OFFER to throw in
money when I used to use her for a pivot.  I didn't mind paying for her though
because the benefits I got from being out with an attractive chick that KNOWS I
am out to get OTHER bitches and facilitates that was well worth it :)  hehe... 
too bad for her, MLTR was over and I received her gift, talked to her for a
while (where she told me her recent "relationship" blew the fuck up in her face
:-) and then ejected her to keep having fun with MLTR.

I have been using outfoxer's style of letting bitches get involved in bullshit
relationships, TELLING THEM the relationships are bullshit then letting them
fall FLAT on their faces and come CRAWLING back to me :)  I just haven't added
the part yet where I get indignant that they are giving sex to CHUMPS that use
them like BITCHES and throw them away.  hehe it is fun enough at this point
just to hear about their FAILURES from the horses' mouths and see the sad looks
on their faces, while I am CONSTANTLY SMILING :)

what you described is BASICALLY what happened to her, except NOT in the sexual
content, but in the companionship content.  she THOUGHT she had a solid
position with me as my pivot, so she didn't feel like paying for anything
because she thought I NEEDED her, not WANTED her.  as soon as I didn't want her
anymore and dumped her from LJBF to NEXT, she was OK with it UNTIL her
relationship BACKFIRED... THEN she decides she wants to get back in good with
ME, which she can't do because I don't give a fuck about her and except for
looks, she can't compete with MLTR AT ALL!

the pain of loneliness overrides the emotional pain of sex without
committment... fascinating :)

>She's worried about
>pain, so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not only
>losing out on the pleasure of screwing, BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
>believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out that if
>she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even WORSE
>crack-up.
>
>  Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.

ok, this is interesting too.  "this is why you fucked up with your ex and I
feel the same way about that particular topic".  you are FORECASTING her
EJECTION unless she changes her ways.  she is still WITH YOU and has a chance
to do the right thing instead of getting ejected.  she already knows how it
feels to BE ejected by her EX and doesn't WANT to go through that pain AGAIN
with you.  you dictate to her HOW she could have avoided it with her EX and she
learns how to avoid it with you and gets in line.  this is another reason why
DICTATING what you REQUIRE from chicks is good, because they have the roadmap
to success or FAILURE with you.  as long as you have demonstrated personality
AND value BEFORE getting to this with her, she will be in a state of "how can I
get my hands on this guy... and KEEP him?" and then you will tell her what she
needs to do to be CONSIDERED amongst your TOP chicks and then is is up to her
to either fulfill her womanly duties or... as you predicted... get ejected and
feel the PAIN OF SEPERATION all over again with someone that she ALREADY knows
she WANTS to be with... WHATEVER the cost.

everyone has their price.  I find, most times, chicks are TALKING with no
EXPERIENCE.  a chick told me that she dumped her borefriend because he laughed
at her.  I told her that the sex must not have been good because otherwise she
would have had to use more than THAT to justify dumping an entire relationship.
 she CLAIMED that sex had nothing to do with her decision and that he didn't
RESPECT her was why she dumped him.  I told her that if the sex had been what
it is SUPPOSED to be... I GUARANTEE her that she would NOT have thrown THAT
away because of some laughing and disrespect.  I also proceeded to laugh at her
AND disrespect her IN HER FACE and told her I don't care because we are not
dating... she can't DUMP ME!   she never ADMITTED that I was right... BUT... by
the end of the conversation, she was asking me WHAT SHE SHOULD DO TO MAKE HER
LOVE LIFE BETTER!  :/  gotcha!

>>I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>>alone!
>
> Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to her her
>"ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she can then
>accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!  

yes.  I really have not been making the MOST of pacing and leading.  I have
been seeing where they ATTACH THEMSELVES to my way of thinking and see me as an
authority.  I have not used this to MAKE POLICY for them... merely to open
their minds and get them to think more efficiently.  you are right though. 
once you capture them... LEAD THEM!  make SOME efficient use of your new
followers... even if you were only practicing or passing time by capturing them
:)

excellent post :)

------

From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:10 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

In article <92n7b96@nnrp1.deja.com>, maniac_high@yahoo.com writes:

>After chick says bullshit about wanting to go to
>dinner and be friends or shit for 6 months before
>becoming a GF, I say: Actually, I dont go to dinner
>or stuff like that with ladies who are not my GF
>CHick:  gasps!
>Maniac: see, going to dinner, is an important step
>in a relationship for me. I only share it with someone
>special
>chick: Huh?
>Maniac: Well, let me put it this way, do you ever
>sleep with a guy who is just your friend, or dont
>care about?
>chick: of course not!

[lots of good use of Jake's shit snipped]

this is interesting, though I couldn't tell if this is something you are GOING
to do, or something you DID already.  either way, IF you are congruent, this
will serve you well as an alternate form of screening.  most of the time, I
screen by ASKING chicks shit and listening to their answers while watching
their faces and body-language.  another way to do it is to basically DICTATE to
them what I need to even CONSIDER being with a chick in any capacity
whatsoever.  most of the time I don't do this though because I can tell already
that the chick is worthless.  I usually get into DICTATION when she asks me
about myself.  am I attached?  what do I look for in a woman? etc.  THEN, since
she asked, I get into the reasons I have chosen women in the past and why I am
still with them in the present.  as I do that, I lay down my laws WITHOUT
telling the chick I am talking to that she needs to get in line with this shit
or get the fuck out of my face.  I have had a couple of chicks blow themselves
out after this.

I was talking to a chick that I know from YEARS ago that started calling me
again and talking about nothing.  I tolerated her for an hour or so on two
different days  A) because I was bored and  B) because through her speech
patterns and recurring ideas, I was learning if she was worth anything to me at
all, considering I get everything I want or need from MLTR in the first place,
she only had a VERY LIMITED use to me, as GOOD backup-pussy.  MLTR is smarter,
more interesting, more fun, less psychotic... basically TRUMPED her in all
areas, so this chick had NO CREDIT with me whatsoever.  I ended up getting into
PRECISELY what you did in your post.  the KICKER was when I told her "I don't
even TALK to girls that I don't want to fuck".  since I had not fucked her AND
had not suggested that we get together (she BELIEVES in monogamous
relationships for herself and even if she fucked me one time, it would be
merely to relieve her own personal stress and I am not going to be there for
her for that.  I am looking for MORE MLTRs... anything else can go fuck off.  I
laughed at her way of being AND broke it down to her why it was so stupid AND
let her know in NO UNCERTAIN TERMS that I was not going to be involved in
ANYTHING CLOSE to what she claims to want for herself... she can STAY HORNY for
all I care) she INTELLIGENTLY asked me WHY I was talking to her...  I let her
know that I found her amusing and her way of living ineffective.  I pointed out
to her that in the YEARS since I had spoken to her last, ALL she had to show
for it was a bungh of jibberish about WANTING a monogamous relationship that
she HAS NOT ATTAINED IN ALL THESE YEARS!  I let her know that I had predicted
that she would REMAIN dissatisfied for years to come and my talking to her
allowed me to follow her LACK of progress while, in the meantime, I get laid
EVERY DAY by MLTR :)   I have not heard from her SINCE that conversation...
good riddance.  she knew what she HAD to do if she wanted more of my time.  she
knew what she was going to have to do IF she wanted to socialize with me at
all.  she felt like her DEVOTION to the idea of a monogamous relationship with
a NON-EXISTANT man was more important than getting fucked by a guy that she
KNOWS and LIKES.  she is an idiot, and will remain horny UNTIL she fucks the
wrong guy, then has NO ONE to comfort her because I will not be there because
she had her chance and BLEW IT!

I have ZERO TOLERANCE for chicks that want things their way.  if they LIKE
doing things MY WAY, then they can be with me...maybe... for a while... as long
as they still LOOK HOT :)   when I approach chicks, I ASSUME they will fail the
screen because statistics show that I require A LOT from a chick and most of
them are either distracted by work or other relationships or just are not
QUALITY enough to be with me.  I find it amusing how ridiculous the SAME girls
are that I used to DESIRE to go out with and that I USED TO dislike being
rejected by.

now, I meet and REJECT girls daily.  not actively, just after I meet them, I
make NO EFFORT to remain in contact with them and go off to talk to other
chicks, leaving them wondering WHY I was interested enough to approach, but
BECAME DISINTERESTED and ejected for a SIMILARLY-GOOD-LOOKING bitch :)

Experiment Report! How kinky are your coworkers?!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



A practice session using the techniques of PU!


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: ]Experiment Report! How kinky are YOUR co-workers?!
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 08:03:45 GMT

]Experiment Report! How kinky are YOUR co-workers?!

This report is about finding the deep dark secrets of
your co-workers (not necessarily to fuck them, but as
a good experiment in state transitioning in groups
rather than one-on-one).

Note, for those readers living in repressed countries
still in the sexual dark ages like the Islamic
Republic of Iran, or the United Stated of America,
I do not advice attempting this..trouble with the
legal system, sex harrassment shit, or loss of
your job could result.. For the rest of you living
in countries that have both feet planted firmly in
the 20th century, no problem, lets rock on- here
is the report!


Recently, I have been doing alot of work practicing
state transitioning. Ie. the goal is to take a
chick (or in this case, group of chicks) from the
"idle state" (ie. thinking about office bullshit
and work they have to do), and transition them
to the kinky "lets get crazy and fuck state" as
quickly as possible, and in as few steps as possible
using a process that will be consistantly successful.

Last night, we had one of these (usually) boring
office departmental dinner parties at a stuffy
restaurant in town. BORING!!

So I decided what better place to liven things up
and see what I can get away with using psychological
warfare and a little bit of alcohol in an otherwise
formal group setting.

I get there, and sit at a table with 1 guy, and
5 chicks. For the first 30 minutes, it is boring,
I let everyone talk about boring office shit so
that everyone can arrive, and the food can start.

First I arrange the waiter to bring drinks to the
table (we need it later for one of the games I
am going to do), and get started on that right away.
One of the chicks only drinks tea, but that is OK,
later she really got into it anyways in spite of
being stark sober.

At the table is sitting:
ChinaGuy - he is from China
Mombabe - she is a mom, but wild & crazy, 40s (starts
          by sitting at another table)
HB CaptHook - she had a mild eye infection and is
              wearing an eyepatch this week (starts by
              sitting at another table)
HBStrict - she only drinks tea, but is more action
           than she looks
ScaredChick - she thinks we are all wierd
HBWhoMe? - she looks SO straight, but is the kinkiest
           at the table we find out!
Bichick - we find out she had enjoyed some bi games

Other assorted people sitting farther, who dont
play in the games really..

After that, I start. Here is how I did it. Refer
to the 'Maniac plan' post I made a couple weeks ago
(it is archived in fastseduction.com, I will also put
it on my site in Jan. when the next big update
happens) for some of the terminology below. I move
all the chicks (as a group), through all the states
as follows:

[Current State: Idle: chicks talking about office bullshit]
Maniac>Bichick: So what did you do this weekend?
Bichick: Nothing really.. how about you?
Maniac>I went to my dance circle, I like salsa dance
Bichick: oh really? {other chicks starting to listen}
Maniac: Yeah, I went to Brazil this year too, it was so
        much fun, wanna see my pictures?
Bichick & others: 'yes!' (take out my digi-PC, show pictures
        of carnival in Rio, tback bikini babes, the gay parade
        and debauchery in the streets)
Maniac: You know, the culture is SO different, brazilian people
        are SO passionate!
All chicks: oh really?
Maniac: yep, after I left Rio, I went to Sao Paolo, and
        went into this bar and all of the sudden this brazilian
        chick grabbed me and started french kissing me (perform
        SP chick story from ManiacPlan).

[Current State: (A)dmiration & (M)an now achieved from ManiacPlan]
Bichick: Oh, HB Capthook lived in brazil a few years!
Maniac: really? {I go to her table, ask if she wants to see
        some brazil carnival pictures with us.. she runs over
        to our table}
Maniac>all chicks: you know, I respected that SP chick though
       because she was not afraid to take what she wants..
       kind of like Madonna (perform the Madonna story from
       ManiacPlan).
Maniac: Perform 'how to communicate to lady at all levels
        and pay attention to her and what she wants' story
        from ManiacPlan, while doing lots of Kino on
        HBCapthook sitting next to me as a demonstration.
        Others are watching and getting jealous..

[Now try to introduce the (S)ex state from ManiacPlan..
the goal here is to do the "questions game, but in a
group setting.. so I decide to do it via a drinking game]
Maniac: {now I try to introduce a drinking game called 'I
       never'}, Hey, do they have any good drinking games in
       Japan.
Chicks: {they suggest some really lame boring shit like
         remembering names of subway stations..boring!!!}
Maniac: Well, I know two games, Chandelliers {I describe this
        game.. but we wont play it, not sexual}, and then
        "I never" {I describe "I never"}.
[Now here, I think I dont have enough rapport yet to start
"I never" (a drinking version of "questions") and get it to
work well (ie. sexually), so first I preform the "Strawberry
fields" game in a group (in next post, and included below)

<>>

We play the game: (mombabe hears us laughing, comes
over & kicks Chinaguy out of his chair so she can sit
next to us)

Among the answers to "strawberry fields"
Bichick: "uh, I dont see any fence around the field!"
HB Capthook & mombabe: "as many as I can eat!"
HBStrict: "to the farmer.. uh.. Thank you {and bow}"

We were all laughing and rolling on the floor to the
various chicks answers to this game, with lots of "I cant
believe you?! really?!" reactions among the ladies..

[Current state in ManiacPlan: (S)ex now achieved, now
lets intensify and see what these chicks will say/do.
I am putting LOTS of shoulder/back kino on all the
ladies as the game is playing]

Maniac: OK, time for another game, we will play that
 "I never" game we talked about before. {Maniac explains
 howto play "I never"} [easy.. each person takes a turn,
 say "I never xxx", whoever did "xxx" has to take a drink.
 start light, get game sexual ASAP..]

Maniac: here is the opening question: "I never kissed a
 member of the opposite sex before I was 15 y.o."
{3 girls drink}
Maniac: your turn HBCaptHook
HBCaptHook: uh, I dont understand the game yet, can you do
  the next question Maniac?
Maniac: OK, I never kissed a guy on the first date
{we all drink}
HBCaptHook: OK I get it, my turn "I never had sex with a
 guy on the first date" {notice because of the setup with
 straberry fields here, that the chicks ON THEIR OWN, turned
 the game sexual without me having to do anything! This was
 what I worried about if I were to start the "I never" game
 before straberry fields.. the mood was just not sexual
 enough yet, and the game would have fizzled.. but now..
 no problem!}
{all but 1 chick drinks (HB afraid.. who is looking a bit
 uncomfortable now)}
Mombabe: I never kissed a member of the same sex
{Bichick drinks!.. lots of "oh really?!? and discussion
 ensues, but bichick wont delve into it anymore ;-) }
Bichick: I never had sex with more than 4 people in the
 room.
{bichick, HBstrict and HBWhoMe all drink!}
HBAfraid: I never went to california
{we all look at her wierd.. skip to next girl}
HBWhoMe: I never did sex as part of a performance in front
of others
{Maniac, Bichick and HBWhoMe drink.. HBStrict looks envious,
others gasp and are laughing.. rest of our dept, is looking
at us, like why we are having so much fun, and a bit wierdly,
fortunately they cannot hear what we are saying ;-)}
Maniac: I never had sex with someone and didn't know their
 name till the next morning.
{We all drink except HB afraid}
MomBabe: I never used tool, or vibrator during sex
{we all drink}
HBCaptHook: I never had sex with a cat?!
{we all look at her wierd.. no one drinks}
HBCaptHook: but it can happen, I saw it on video once!
{we look at her more strange, and make her drink for watching
the video}
HBAfraid: I cant think of any question
{we skip her, next girl}
..
Maniac: I never was tied/tied up my partner during sex
{Maniac, HB strict, HBCapthook and HBWhome all drink}

Maniac: I see, so who is "S", and who is "M" {explain to
 a couple clueless chicks which was which}
HBWhoMe and HBStrict are serious S type, Bichick is both.
HBStrict makes a pass at me, and I reply only if you are
serious.. she stares at me long (maybe a future there ;-) )
I shake hands and hug HBWhoMe, who is really into this
thread of questioning.

Mombabe now makes ajoke about why I went to lunch today
with this other chick (not in the game), and not her. I
tell her because she didn't ask me.. girls have to take
what they want, like that SP chick. I ask her if she
likes me, she says yes, and I gesture (and get) a cheek
kiss. I am CERTAIN I could have done a KC, or even one
of those 3way KCs, but I remember that this is an
experiment, and I do have to see all these people on Monday
again at work, so I dont push it.

now adminbabe (the dept head's secy) comes by our table
and asks how many of us are going to the prescheduled
after-party karaoke. Mombabe replies "none of us, we are
all going to a hotel".. HBCapthook adds in "a love hotel..".

[Final state: Dying to fuck: achieved]

Adminbabe looks at us wierd (she missed the whole thing),
and leaves. Mombabe now asks why I have such a harem tonight,
and then Bichick remarks how all the ladies in the office
really really like you Maniac.

I ask 'why?'
bichick says.. you smile, and laugh alot.. but there is
something else.. we all see it, but cant really
describe what it is {maniac opinion.. it is the way
I stare at chicks with the 'fuck me' luck, and all the
shoulder kino..etc, I do, even in the office}.

Supper now is wrapping up, we all have to go, I remark
that this table is fun, and that another night, we should
all meet again for beer and fun.. everyone agrees.

As we are going back, HBCaptHook and mombabe are grabbing
all over me, it was funny.

Some go home, and I split off from the group, as I have
a date with karatebabe at midnight in another part of
town..

Experiment over..

I learned that state transitioning is a very predictable,
reproduceable process, once you learn the tools to do it.
This was just my office staff that is around me, so made
a good subject for the experiment. I also realized, that
in groups, there is a sort of feed back effect, so you
can really accelerate things. It wasnt the alcohol because
HBstrict had nothing to drink, but was well into the
game too.

Because it was a group, I could skip steps "BVG,D,O" in
the ManiacPlan, and reach the last state.. (dying to fuck)
so I likely could have taken any (or all)
of those ladies back for a wild time in the sack (which I
wont do, because I work with them.. but there was nothing
stopping it, thats for sure)..

Fascinating..

Constructive Opinions/comments anyone?

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Doing proper ‘closes’

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

[TPUA PU's a chick at night, and converts it into a lay!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com
]


Date Posted: 2000/09/25 05:21:37 AM EDT
Author: Tokyopua 
Subject: Re: HB Small Mouth PU  (Was Re: Calling all Tokyo PUA's)

Hey Maniac,

I didnt really intend that last post of mine as a field report, since it
wasnt too detailed.  But yeah, things have been going well on the PU despite
my severely limited time. So I will attempt a bit of a field report on the
initial PU here.  My PU efficiency factor has been really high recently,
maybe because I am only trying to PU when I feel really confident and often
times when I wasnt planning on it, so was really relaxed. I did a PU on a 19
year old HB college student in the train the other night and got her home
phone number.  It was easy cause she was reading Tokyo Classified, and I
asked her about it. I was really confident, and in only 2 stops got her to
really dig me.  In fact, when I asked her why she had studied English, she
said "So I could meet a guy like you!"  The only problem is finding time to
meet her again before I leave.

The PU I did on HB Small Mouth was not planned either, I just saw her
walking back home around my place at midnight, and somehow knew that despite
my frazled appearance after 2 hours of Jujitsu practice and carrying 40
pounds of luggage, I could do the PU on her.  My opening line was "I like
your hair" which I knew was lame and she must have heard often, but hey,
thats the price of using the 3 second rule sometimes.  I immediately
followed with asking her if she was a student, what kind of work she did,
etc.  Oddly, I didnt use my standard opener "Do you speak english" in the
whole conversation.  I will post my personal notes on the rest of the PU at
the end of this post just for reference, but they arent too coherent.  They
were the basis though for the plans I laid for the successful next date that
got me laid 3 days later.  (If I have time someday I will write up full
notes on that too.) Total time to lay in terms of time invested was
approximately 3.5 hours, about the same as HB Physics, my other recent
street PU who I did that same day.  This efficiency is possible if the
progression is done just right, I think.

 wrote in message news:8qfler$o1r$1@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Tokyo PUA,
>
> This is an excellent report.. You really rock!
>
> Where / how did you originally
> PU this chick though? Also, taking the chick over to see your
> weight training stuff is a clever idea.. liked that..!
> BTW, I thought you left already to the USA, how long are you still
> there for?

Right near my house in a dark alley at midnight on her way home!  She told
me later (post lay) that she was scared at first, but I had a really relaxed
attitude so she got comfortable with me afterwards.  As for the weight
training stuff later, it was great kino as I had her bend over slightly and
got right behind her to "help her with her form" while simultaneously
letting her slightly feel the form of my stiff wood pressed against her, and
other such intimate situations.

Still here till Oct 14 or so, with a trip to Taiwan and maybe Hawaii too
thrown in.

>
> ALso, do you usually go out alone, or with a wing. I noticed that
> you knew quite a few people in Roppongi, I guess you get out there
> quite a bit?

Been out there a lot since last February, maybe 10 times or so.  I guess
predominantly I go with a wing, but sometimes felt it screwed up my game.
Of course, my wings didnt know anything about seduction a la ASF, thats
probably why.  Of course, neither did I till June... I know Im much better
at street PU when alone though, thats for sure!  OTOH, when I went out to
clubs with you and Rio, I think my game was really improved and I was
learning all the time.
BTW, I have heard that someplace called club Earth near hamamatucho has
really hot babes, (bitch shield too, but who cares, right;-), so you guys
might want to check that out.  3000 Yen cover charge.  May be the new
alternative to Fura?

>
> > I managed to lay that HB Small Mouth
>
> EXCELLENT!
>
> >Ganbatte!  Im seeting HB Bi this weekend again (tonight), and HB
> >small the next day, and my ex-GF the next.  Im starting to feel like
> >Maniac juggling girls, but nothing will happen w/ my ex, so its not
> >so bad.
>
> Yes, I did that ALOT last year, and fucked a shitload of chicks that
> I cant even count now..
>
> but its really tiring and you do get sick of it after a while..
> so finally I just MLTR'd a few that I really liked, who also accepted
> that I fuck other chicks, and left it at that.. guess I got to get out
> more ;-)
> not sure if its the right way yet, but been doing it that way
> the last few months now.. We'll see ;-)

I think it goes in cycles.  Eventually you get tired of the MLTR's and have
to replace them.  To do that you will have to PU lotsa new chicks, lay them,
see if they dont eject when you break the news that there are others.  That
takes a lot of time, so then you want to go back to the easy life of having
a bunch of girls on call.  Then the cycle starts over.  Im just beginning to
get these girls into MLTR status, but now I have to leave.  But theres
always business trips ack here!

>
> If you are planning on hanging around TOkyo though, you should
> bring HB Bi and her friend to one of our fuck parties the next time..
> sounds like they'd be a good time.. maybe introduce them to Kipp or
> something since I am not there right now, before you leave.. or
> give me your departure date and see if they are interested and we
> can setup something with all the ladies, if this is your sort of thing..

Id consider it, but it will take more effort, and probably wont be anything
I can do until after Im gone and come back for business trips.  You see, I
worked it too good with HB Bi.  She is signing her letters with "Love" at
the end and is all into me now.  Made me the most awesome meal any woman has
ever made me, washed my clothes, gave me an amazing massage, etc.  When I
confronted her about our last threesome, she said that she felt jealous when
she saw me doing her friend, and claimed that was the only time she had ever
done something like that, that she isnt really Bi.
So right now I think she somehow sees a relationship in this, despite my
leaving?  I figure once Im gone I can get past that as reality sinks in and
maybe set up more stuff for any business trips I make back.

>
> Good post!
>
> Maniac
> http://www.pickupguide.com

Here are those notes I was talking about, for what they are worth:

-------------------------------------------
PU of HB Small:  happened in a dark alley shortcut to my house at midnight,
I approached carrying a 30 pound backpack on one shoulder and a 10 pound
bucket of protein powder in the other, and said,  $B!H (BExcuse me, your hair is
really beautiful. $B!I (B  She reacted favorably and said thanks, but kept
walking, slightly faster.  She seemed young, so I asked if she was a
student.  She said no, I asked what she does.  She said she works for a
cable company, I fluff talked about watching TV.  She asked what I do.  I
said I know its late but you should have coffee or tea with me at Jonathans
restaurant nearby.  She said no, so I said, OK, how do we meet again.  She
said give me your number and I said,  $B!H (BAh, but I know women, if I give you
my number you will get nervous and never call. $B!I (B  She said  $B!H (BNo, 
that wont
happen I promise. $B!I (B  I knew I didn $B!G (Bt have enough rapport or 
anything to
believe that, so really what I was just doing was stalling till I could set
up a firm date.

I got a pen and wrote my number and at this point we are standing on the
corner near my place.  I play on Japanese cuteness and write my name with
hearts by it.  (None of this is stuff I would be able to do in the US.)
Then I say, OK, when are we going to meet.  Its sort of a way to pace the
ongoing reality now that she has my number,its a logical extension.  The
number is just a formality to me, I want to set up the date.  After some
negotiation, I get a date set up for 6 PM Tuesday, her day off.  I had given
her alternatives between my place and eating in Tachikawa nearby (but both
already had the presuppostion that we are meeting for a date, so I don $B!G (Bt
care which she chooses).  She chose Italian in Tachikawa which is perfect
cause eating carbs increases seratonin (=relaxation), so I will lay on the
patterning after a while, maybe even order a glass of wine (more seratonin
and romance) for us both.  Then its a 5 minute taxi ride back to my place!

Anyway, we keep talking.  I get that she never has met a foreigner, that she
likes Richard Gere, cause he is  $B!H (BShibui $B!I (B. $B!! (B(=quiet, simple, 
sober,
tasteful, austere, parsimonious, etc.)  I asked her about her ideal man
while doing the (SP) thing.  She really accessed a lot and I was awakening
her creative centers.  I touched her a lot on the arm to anchor the good
feelings.   She said she really was too ideal, but that her ideal guy was
like her father, sweet and nice.  I asked if she wanted a guy who made her
feel safe, and she said yes.  I compared our hand sizes and got kino,
remarked at how small her hands were, that my big hands could protect her.
Complemented her smile and said that it seems like her eyes smile too and
she said that she is often told that.  She said I was skillful at
complementing and I said that I really meant it.

I mirrored her body positions a lot and this seemed to have a good effect.
She seemed really into it and wasn $B!G (Bt trying too hard to get away despite 
it
being after midnight and having to work the next day, only bringing up the
time when I did.  She was rubbing her earlobe, and later playing with her
ponytail in a really sexy way, all with the doggy dinner bowl look.
I also showed kanji ability and had her write her name, and demonstrated how
we could study English together, all using the Zaurus.  (BTW, Did you buy
one yet, Maniac? A useful tool in many ways.  You can turn it into a
portable digital photo album too, albeit poor quality...) She liked that.
At one point she asked what was in the bucket, I said protein powder and she
said  $B!H (Bnomitai! $B!I (B and I said  $B!H (B5 fun dake areba, nomeru 
yo. $B!I (B
(If you have 5
minutes I can give you a taste).  But she refused to go to my apartment and
I didn $B!G (Bt press the issue, I just reconfirmed our fun date on Tuesday, and
gave her a kiss goodnight, then took off.
----------------------------------

-T

Maniac High's Pick Up Girls Guide and Seduction Website! » field

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Maniac uses a power opener to meet and tongue down a chick!


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Maniac meets HBOrderMe! Bar PU
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 05:00:36 GMT

Maniac meets HBOrderMe! Bar PU
001215

This is an interesting bar PU. .
used it to not lay the chick, but to get higher rapport
with the other guys around.

It is bo-nen-kai (end of year party) season in Japan.
After the party (boring, in a big hotel ballroom)
we go to the ni-ji-kai (after party) in a bar/disco
in Roppongi with a bunch of my coworkers (mostly guys,
and some ladies).

One AFC guy is really into this HB. He is making every
AFC mistake in the book (saying she is pretty, sucking
up to her..blah). Progress is really slow.

Me and all the guys are watching. He gets frustrated and
leaves for a bit. I move in on the chick (she is wearing
a high cut black dress, and fishnet stockings... very cute).

My opener is the strawberry game.. I just go up to her,
and say 'imagine you are in a field, and you see a strawberry
field ahead of you, with a fence around.. how high is the
fence'. She goes right into it.

Then I do the interpretation (see strawberry game post
for the game and interpretation) for her. I ask her what
she thinks (she said 1m high fence, 50 strawberries, sorry
to the farmer). She disagrees the interpretation. Then I
ask her what is your idea guy like (brad pitt). Then I say
besides his looks why you like him. Reply: he is really
guy.

Then I ask, what do you want most in a guy's character.
She says, 'I want him to lead, to decide for me what to do.'
Good.. Maniac keeps that in mind for what comes next. .

AFC guy comes back, and I let him have his chick back for
a while. He is doing more regular AFC stuff, though he
has at least initiated kino.. very good. He does this for
like 20 minutes, but isn't really breaking through.

He gets frustrated, goes. I tell the guys 'watch this',
and go up to the chick, and say I am going now, give me a
kiss. I get a cheek kiss.

I look straight into her eyes, and tell her 'thats not
good enough, look into my eyes.. what do you see.. now
give me a real kiss..' a long tonguedown with sexual kino
ensues.. Everyone else sees what I just did, after spending
not even a total of 5 minutes talking with this chick
from before.

I leave the chick, and go back to the guys.. 'that is how
it is supposed to be done'. Respect of me from my guy co-workers
now goes up 10x from whatever it was before, and was visibly
different in the office the next day.

AFC co-worker comes back and tells me how so much he is
in love with this girl (I guess he knew her from before as
a friend or co-worker or something..not sure.. I had never
met her before though). As a result, I defer to him, and let
him get AFC'd out.

I go back to the other guys, and just say, I could take her
(she lives really close actually, so I could just say I
live far and can I crash at her place.. I am sure the answer
would have been yes) whenever I want. They say 'why dont you'?

I reply, well, AFC guy is really into her, and he is a coworker
of mine who I respect, so I dont want to take his chick away
from him. There are lots of chicks to fuck, and this one means
nothing to me at all, but she is important to him, so best to
leave it at that.

I go on to say that all I wanted to know is that I COULD take her
home if I want (and I might next week or something, I got her
number) and now I know that, so it is enough for me, I dont
need more.

Respect from co-workers now goes up another 10x for this, because
I and they KNOW that this is true after what they just saw. .

He continues to AFC for a long while, and I get tired and go
home. Next day I hear that she blew him out almost as soon as I
left.

Now this was cool, because the goal wasn't really to lay the
chick (which I still might if I decide to see her again), but to
increase stature with co-workers, which can help in other ways
in my regular life.

Now one thing to note, is that I cannot do this every time (heck
not even close.. this is like the 3rd or 4th time it has ever happened
so directly like this). I was
really lucky, because of what she said to my 'what you like in
guy question', it was just so EASY to know what this chick
expected me to do, and it was really easy to stage it to happen
in front of all the other guys once I clued in on this.

I WISH I could do it everytime, but life isnt really like that ;-)
Mr. SMooth can do it though!

Constructive comments and opinions welcome!
Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Using the ‘color’ game to PU!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Using the 'color game' to do a PU!


From: tonymcneill@my-deja.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Colours Game - opinions?
Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 00:43:35 GMT

 Hi Guys,

I've just field tested this pattern / game for creating an erotic and
horny state - worked a dream:) I'd be interested to know what you think
of this and how it might be improved.....

I suppose it might work best with the more visually thinking babes.

This is not a 'word for word' pattern by any means, by the way - I just
kind of found myself going into it on the fly.....  here we go..

The PUA "notices" the colour (UK spelling by the way for those who might
feel the urge to correct me) of an object, item of clothing etc.

PUA - "I find these yellow walls (or whatever) quite uplifting;
especially in the winter. Isn't it nice to have some bright colours
around when it's so grey and dark outside?" "Do you think that colours
have an big effect on peoples' moods?".

HB - "Oh, yes, definitely."

PUA - "Hmmm. I was just wondering......I mean....... I was in one of
those New Age shops recently and they were selling lots of different
coloured sunglasses.... with the idea that, if you wanted to feel more
of a certain mood, or to look at the world in a certain way, you would
slip on a pair of sunglasses which would colour everything you looked at
in the desired tone" "Do you think that could work in any way?"

HB - "Well, maybe. I don't know really"

PUA - "Well, for example, my bedroom is a very pale blue colour and I
find this particular blue very restful" "I mean, can you imagine
sleeping very well in a pale blue room?" "Imagine you are really tired,
you know when your eyelids are heavy and you curl up with that fantastic
feeling of at last ... just letting go.... and .....giving
yourself...to....(sp perhaps?).. sleep'" "Do you have a sense of a
particular colour when you imagine that feeling?" (Make sure she's
imagining being sleepy).

HB - "Oh, maybe blue, or green" (or whatever). (If she doesn't come up
with one then maybe she could be asked to imagine the perfect colour for
a bedroom, but both of the HB subjects I tried got right into it.)

PUA "How about when you feel....really full of great ideas...... like
you have all sorts of inspiration flowing through you.?"

PUA then procedes to get HB to imagine a few other states (feeling very
inspired and spiritual (commenting on her choice of colour in a playful
way)...... bursting with energy ...... feeling very sensual,
relaxed and open (we're getting closer, gentlemen)......and eventually,
 being full of passion and horny), and slowly visualising a colour with
each one.

You get the picture - guiding her into these states,
comparing colours etc etc. I have tried this on two chicks, both of whom
LOVED the game and got right into imagining the states. One of them was
an ex who is of great value as a pivot / social proof (and a friend) so
I was testing the game with her rather than going for the lay and the
other HB, in spite of being pretty shy, blushed madly and was VISIBLY
remembering the joy of being fucked until she screamed with pleasure ;)
(At this point Tony is feeling a bit fucking pleased with himself).
I think this would have definitely resulted in a fuck had I not been
meeting her at lunchtime before going off to work :( (at this point Tony
is disgusted as well as pleased!!)

What do you 'real' PUAs think of this little game? As I said I somehow
went into it on the fly after having the idea while practicing
improvising patterns while driving, using things I saw on the road as
starting points for pattern-talk. So it's pretty new and I, as yet,
claim only to be a humble RAFC. Going to test it some more and post the
results....



Any suggestions or comments?

Tony

--
'Action' is the magic word

Setting up the Kiss Close

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

A way to set up the kiss close

From: erosla77@aol.com (ErosLA77) Ross Jeffries
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 26 Dec 2000 19:23:44 GMT
Subject: Re: What if...

>Subject: Re: What if...
>From: eclipse19@my-deja.com
>Date: Tue, Dec 26, 2000 12:04 AM
>Message-id: <929jdt$u6t@nnrp1.deja.com>
>
>In article <9299s4$o03@nnrp1.deja.com>,
>  charnel1278@my-deja.com wrote:
>> Hey all,
>>
>> I've checked out a Maniac's, and some others websites and most say
>that
>> when you ask "Do you wanna kiss me?", you're guaranteed a kiss, unless
>> you get a flat out NO.  None, from what I saw, said what to do when
>you
>> get that NO.  Do you continue on the conversation like nothing
>> happened? Do you come back with a similar question later in the
>> evening?  If so, won't she kinda feel that you're badgering her?
>> Granted, this won't happen often, but what if?....
>>
>> Laters.
>
> the standard (canned) reply to a "no" answer is "YOU really know how
>to ruin a moment....your old boyfriends must have hated that about you"
>I think i got this off tony or maniac's site, forget which one. I
>havent ran into a direct "no" answer myself so i havent field tested
>this, but im sure others have. From what i read(or remember anyhow)
>this will leave them stunned and they will show less resistance against
>another kiss.
>
>

 Hmmm......well, I like this "you really know how to ruin a moment" response
WITHOUT asking for the kiss first. "Asking" for anything, outside of the
presence of fun(as in, on the spur of the moment saying, "Hey...wouldn't it be
fun to go to a strip club? Let's go!))  seems pretty pathetic to me.  

    A good one is to notice her giving you that look and then say(and I got
this from a student, it is NOT mine).  "If ? were to ask you on a scale of one
to ten, how good a kisser are you, what would you say?"

 Listen for her answer, then say, "If you were to kiss me right now, how do you
think I'd rate you?"

  You do this ONLY when you see "the look".......

  "let's find out" you say and kiss her.  

IF she backs away from that, then the "you really know how to ruin a moment"
comment works great.  Come to think of it, this could really work for a
cancellation as well. 

---

From: "General Snafu" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: What if...
Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2000 22:57:08 GMT

If she says no to a kiss, ask for a BJ.  If she says no to the BJ, you are
SOL for the night.

 wrote in message
news:9299s4$o03@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Hey all,
>
> I've checked out a Maniac's, and some others websites and most say that
> when you ask "Do you wanna kiss me?", you're guaranteed a kiss, unless
> you get a flat out NO.  None, from what I saw, said what to do when you
> get that NO.  Do you continue on the conversation like nothing
> happened? Do you come back with a similar question later in the
> evening?  If so, won't she kinda feel that you're badgering her?
> Granted, this won't happen often, but what if?....
>
> Laters.
>
>
> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/

Game: The Wall and the Forest

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Maniac introduces "The Wall and the Forest", a PU game.



From maniac_high@yahoo.com 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Game: The wall and the forest
Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 16:18:24 GMT

Another one of those mindfuck games like 4 questions or the cube:

"The Wall and the Forest"

-You are walking in a field, you see a wall, how high is it, and
how do you get by it? [wall = pride, and also how you get past
obstacles]

-you continue walking, and you see a house [kind of house you dream
to have later in life]

-you see a key on the ground, you go to the house, does the key
open the door? [if yes, means you can get married]

-you go in the house (if you were able to open with the key), and
 on the first floor you see a table and chairs, how many chairs are
 there? [means how many people in your future family]

-now you go outside, and see to one direction a dense dark forest, and
 the other way, a less dense/brighter wooded area. Which way do you
 go? (dark forest=expect something, but unknown, take a chance)
     (bright wooded area=easygoing style/way)

-as you walk you then see a lake nearby. How big is it, and how deep
 is it? (big=size of your heart, depth=depth of your heart)

THE END


This game could be lethal for chicks who want to get married or
something like that. Make sure you answer the right answers when
you tell her "what your answers were" after you finish her turn!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Game: Forest

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Nightlight introduces 'forest game'!



From: nightlight9@hotmail.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: More like "4 questions" game?
Date: Thu, 02 Nov 2000 19:50:10 GMT

You mention all these, but most of them are not very useful in the
initial meeting because they are too cerebral and too random.  Try ones
that are more viceral.  You are walking in a dark forest.  How do you
feel.  (how she approaches life).  You could to a wall with a door.
What do you do? (how she approaches obsticalls).  You look down and see
a cup on the ground what is it made out of? (how she views wealth).
You come to some water, describe it. (how she views sexuality).
Always end with sexuality because it is  a good topic for PU and
demonstrates you are comfortable with women and people a sexual context.

BookGuy, my comments are based on experience and field testing.  Please
do the same if you reply.

--
NightLight9
Just be yourself... smooth with interesting questions and interesting
answers.

Game: Strawberry Fields

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Maniac introduces a PU game: Strawberry Fields!
[Note, this originally comes from the book 'Kokology']


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Game!: Strawberry fields
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 08:02:40 GMT

Game!: Strawberry fields
001117

This is a game to find out some things about how chicks
see sex. It is very popular in Japan & is a good state
transitioner

--

Intro: Hey, lets play a game!

Imagine you are alone in a field, and see a straberry field
in front of you with tasty strawberries.

There is a fence/gate around the field. How high is it?
(= how easy is this girl/guy to take sex)

Now you are in the straberry field, how many straberries
do you take?
(=how many BFs/GFs that person wants)

Ok, after you have finished enjoying the strawberries,
how do you feel about the farmer, who's field you took them
from?
(=how you feel to that person after fucking them)


The end

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

TPUA night PU’s HB Smallmouth and converts to a lay!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

[TPUA PU's a chick at night, and converts it into a lay!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com
]


Date Posted: 2000/09/25 05:21:37 AM EDT
Author: Tokyopua 
Subject: Re: HB Small Mouth PU  (Was Re: Calling all Tokyo PUA's)

Hey Maniac,

I didnt really intend that last post of mine as a field report, since it
wasnt too detailed.  But yeah, things have been going well on the PU despite
my severely limited time. So I will attempt a bit of a field report on the
initial PU here.  My PU efficiency factor has been really high recently,
maybe because I am only trying to PU when I feel really confident and often
times when I wasnt planning on it, so was really relaxed. I did a PU on a 19
year old HB college student in the train the other night and got her home
phone number.  It was easy cause she was reading Tokyo Classified, and I
asked her about it. I was really confident, and in only 2 stops got her to
really dig me.  In fact, when I asked her why she had studied English, she
said "So I could meet a guy like you!"  The only problem is finding time to
meet her again before I leave.

The PU I did on HB Small Mouth was not planned either, I just saw her
walking back home around my place at midnight, and somehow knew that despite
my frazled appearance after 2 hours of Jujitsu practice and carrying 40
pounds of luggage, I could do the PU on her.  My opening line was "I like
your hair" which I knew was lame and she must have heard often, but hey,
thats the price of using the 3 second rule sometimes.  I immediately
followed with asking her if she was a student, what kind of work she did,
etc.  Oddly, I didnt use my standard opener "Do you speak english" in the
whole conversation.  I will post my personal notes on the rest of the PU at
the end of this post just for reference, but they arent too coherent.  They
were the basis though for the plans I laid for the successful next date that
got me laid 3 days later.  (If I have time someday I will write up full
notes on that too.) Total time to lay in terms of time invested was
approximately 3.5 hours, about the same as HB Physics, my other recent
street PU who I did that same day.  This efficiency is possible if the
progression is done just right, I think.

 wrote in message news:8qfler$o1r@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Tokyo PUA,
>
> This is an excellent report.. You really rock!
>
> Where / how did you originally
> PU this chick though? Also, taking the chick over to see your
> weight training stuff is a clever idea.. liked that..!
> BTW, I thought you left already to the USA, how long are you still
> there for?

Right near my house in a dark alley at midnight on her way home!  She told
me later (post lay) that she was scared at first, but I had a really relaxed
attitude so she got comfortable with me afterwards.  As for the weight
training stuff later, it was great kino as I had her bend over slightly and
got right behind her to "help her with her form" while simultaneously
letting her slightly feel the form of my stiff wood pressed against her, and
other such intimate situations.

Still here till Oct 14 or so, with a trip to Taiwan and maybe Hawaii too
thrown in.

>
> ALso, do you usually go out alone, or with a wing. I noticed that
> you knew quite a few people in Roppongi, I guess you get out there
> quite a bit?

Been out there a lot since last February, maybe 10 times or so.  I guess
predominantly I go with a wing, but sometimes felt it screwed up my game.
Of course, my wings didnt know anything about seduction a la ASF, thats
probably why.  Of course, neither did I till June... I know Im much better
at street PU when alone though, thats for sure!  OTOH, when I went out to
clubs with you and Rio, I think my game was really improved and I was
learning all the time.
BTW, I have heard that someplace called club Earth near hamamatucho has
really hot babes, (bitch shield too, but who cares, right;-), so you guys
might want to check that out.  3000 Yen cover charge.  May be the new
alternative to Fura?

>
> > I managed to lay that HB Small Mouth
>
> EXCELLENT!
>
> >Ganbatte!  Im seeting HB Bi this weekend again (tonight), and HB
> >small the next day, and my ex-GF the next.  Im starting to feel like
> >Maniac juggling girls, but nothing will happen w/ my ex, so its not
> >so bad.
>
> Yes, I did that ALOT last year, and fucked a shitload of chicks that
> I cant even count now..
>
> but its really tiring and you do get sick of it after a while..
> so finally I just MLTR'd a few that I really liked, who also accepted
> that I fuck other chicks, and left it at that.. guess I got to get out
> more ;-)
> not sure if its the right way yet, but been doing it that way
> the last few months now.. We'll see ;-)

I think it goes in cycles.  Eventually you get tired of the MLTR's and have
to replace them.  To do that you will have to PU lotsa new chicks, lay them,
see if they dont eject when you break the news that there are others.  That
takes a lot of time, so then you want to go back to the easy life of having
a bunch of girls on call.  Then the cycle starts over.  Im just beginning to
get these girls into MLTR status, but now I have to leave.  But theres
always business trips ack here!

>
> If you are planning on hanging around TOkyo though, you should
> bring HB Bi and her friend to one of our fuck parties the next time..
> sounds like they'd be a good time.. maybe introduce them to Kipp or
> something since I am not there right now, before you leave.. or
> give me your departure date and see if they are interested and we
> can setup something with all the ladies, if this is your sort of thing..

Id consider it, but it will take more effort, and probably wont be anything
I can do until after Im gone and come back for business trips.  You see, I
worked it too good with HB Bi.  She is signing her letters with "Love" at
the end and is all into me now.  Made me the most awesome meal any woman has
ever made me, washed my clothes, gave me an amazing massage, etc.  When I
confronted her about our last threesome, she said that she felt jealous when
she saw me doing her friend, and claimed that was the only time she had ever
done something like that, that she isnt really Bi.
So right now I think she somehow sees a relationship in this, despite my
leaving?  I figure once Im gone I can get past that as reality sinks in and
maybe set up more stuff for any business trips I make back.

>
> Good post!
>
> Maniac
> http://www.pickupguide.com

Here are those notes I was talking about, for what they are worth:

-------------------------------------------
PU of HB Small:  happened in a dark alley shortcut to my house at midnight,
I approached carrying a 30 pound backpack on one shoulder and a 10 pound
bucket of protein powder in the other, and said,  $B!H (BExcuse me, your hair is
really beautiful. $B!I (B  She reacted favorably and said thanks, but kept
walking, slightly faster.  She seemed young, so I asked if she was a
student.  She said no, I asked what she does.  She said she works for a
cable company, I fluff talked about watching TV.  She asked what I do.  I
said I know its late but you should have coffee or tea with me at Jonathans
restaurant nearby.  She said no, so I said, OK, how do we meet again.  She
said give me your number and I said,  $B!H (BAh, but I know women, if I give you
my number you will get nervous and never call. $B!I (B  She said  $B!H (BNo, 
that wont
happen I promise. $B!I (B  I knew I didn $B!G (Bt have enough rapport or 
anything to
believe that, so really what I was just doing was stalling till I could set
up a firm date.

I got a pen and wrote my number and at this point we are standing on the
corner near my place.  I play on Japanese cuteness and write my name with
hearts by it.  (None of this is stuff I would be able to do in the US.)
Then I say, OK, when are we going to meet.  Its sort of a way to pace the
ongoing reality now that she has my number,its a logical extension.  The
number is just a formality to me, I want to set up the date.  After some
negotiation, I get a date set up for 6 PM Tuesday, her day off.  I had given
her alternatives between my place and eating in Tachikawa nearby (but both
already had the presuppostion that we are meeting for a date, so I don $B!G (Bt
care which she chooses).  She chose Italian in Tachikawa which is perfect
cause eating carbs increases seratonin (=relaxation), so I will lay on the
patterning after a while, maybe even order a glass of wine (more seratonin
and romance) for us both.  Then its a 5 minute taxi ride back to my place!

Anyway, we keep talking.  I get that she never has met a foreigner, that she
likes Richard Gere, cause he is  $B!H (BShibui $B!I (B. $B!! (B(=quiet, simple, 
sober,
tasteful, austere, parsimonious, etc.)  I asked her about her ideal man
while doing the (SP) thing.  She really accessed a lot and I was awakening
her creative centers.  I touched her a lot on the arm to anchor the good
feelings.   She said she really was too ideal, but that her ideal guy was
like her father, sweet and nice.  I asked if she wanted a guy who made her
feel safe, and she said yes.  I compared our hand sizes and got kino,
remarked at how small her hands were, that my big hands could protect her.
Complemented her smile and said that it seems like her eyes smile too and
she said that she is often told that.  She said I was skillful at
complementing and I said that I really meant it.

I mirrored her body positions a lot and this seemed to have a good effect.
She seemed really into it and wasn $B!G (Bt trying too hard to get away despite 
it
being after midnight and having to work the next day, only bringing up the
time when I did.  She was rubbing her earlobe, and later playing with her
ponytail in a really sexy way, all with the doggy dinner bowl look.
I also showed kanji ability and had her write her name, and demonstrated how
we could study English together, all using the Zaurus.  (BTW, Did you buy
one yet, Maniac? A useful tool in many ways.  You can turn it into a
portable digital photo album too, albeit poor quality...) She liked that.
At one point she asked what was in the bucket, I said protein powder and she
said  $B!H (Bnomitai! $B!I (B and I said  $B!H (B5 fun dake areba, nomeru 
yo. $B!I (B
(If you have 5
minutes I can give you a taste).  But she refused to go to my apartment and
I didn $B!G (Bt press the issue, I just reconfirmed our fun date on Tuesday, and
gave her a kiss goodnight, then took off.
----------------------------------

-T

ASF reader comments on above story

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website: 

http://www.pickupguide.com 

Many excellent followups to the Psychicbabe re-lay report!
Mrsex4unyc, RJ..etc..etc.

From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:05 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

In article <92jvre$obh@nnrp1.deja.com>, maniac_high@yahoo.com writes:

>The immediate gold to take care of this, is to now make the
>relationship very high stakes for her. I can do this because
>I know that she is into me (from what she said at the dinner),
>so the idea is to play it that if she doesnt do her job as a
>chick.. she will lose EVERYTHING as far as I am concern.
>Ok, that is the plan, here we go:

plan or no plan, essentially, you are telling her the truth.  on a long-enough
timeline, the survival rate for EVERYONE is ZERO.  sooner or later, everyone
you love will either leave you or die.  chicks don't seem to believe in this,
though it is the absolute truth.  they think that they can relate to you
FOREVER, REGARDLESS of what they do or how they act.  you are telling her HOW
she can REMAIN with you and what is going to get her EJECTED.  even though it
takes a long time, so it doesn't SEEM like this... this is what has happened to
EVERY chick's relationship that has gone away.  EVENTUALLY, she was not
fulfilling her womanly duties and her man left her for a   chick (younger,
sexier, richer, swallower...)  EVEN if she IS fulfilling her duties, if her man
like it from another chick MORE, she loses out either in a PERCENTAGE of her
benefits or she gets DUMPED and loses ALL of her benefits.  you are merely
explaining this to her and telling her what she needs to do IF she wants to be
with you... which you have already determined.  you are SELLING, and now you
are screening her to see if she is QUALIFIED and ABLE to buy.

>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations
>in relationship. 

I am getting to the point where I am going to do this.  I never do this with
chicks because I morph into whatever THEY are looking for and hook them that
way.  the thing for me is that being 10 months in with MLTR, she has REALLY
learned how to please me and the time I spend TEACHING her has become minimal
and the time I spend ENJOYING her is increasing :)  it is getting tougher and
tougher for other chicks to get my attention, because anything LESS than what I
have already is BULLSHIT to me.  the time I am spending talking to chicks is
mostly eliciting values and breaking their perceptions... just for fun :)  I
know IMMEDIATELY if I want sex from a chick, and if I don't, she is IMMEDIATELY
LJBF and I use her for practice and NEXT her at the end of the conversation.

I am seriously going to consider moving to a "demonstration of value -> SOI"
model, just because I have lost my patience with LISTENING to these bitches
talking about shit that really doesn't mean anything.  I know I am going to
NEXT them ANYWAY as soon as I realize they can't compete with MLTR, so why
listen to their shit FIRST?  I may as well let them know how great I am and
let them know what kind of woman I am willing to accept, and let them continue
from there.  there is also the cognitive dissonance issue of them KNOWING that
I am going to dump them if they are not sexy and CONTINUING to talk to me and
get to know me.  the more they talk to me, the more I hook them into
interacting with me.  the more they get hooked, the greater the PAIN OF
SEPERATION (credit: RJ) when they eventually get EJECTED.  since they KNOW
ahead of time what will get them ejected and they are still talking, they are
either planning to get in line OR setting themselves up for pain.  either way,
after SOI and their acceptance of the terms, there will have to be some sort of
TEST of their compliance.  even listening to what they have to say after SOI
counts as a REWARD for their entering into a "relationship" with me.  hmm... I
will consider this more.

>I go on to tell her that other girls I know also
>like me, ask me out alot, (doesn't matter if it is true or not,
>but chick 'competition logic' will kick in, and it will scare
>your mark to act). 

the reason I don't use this is that MLTR is an integral part of my life.  if I
were to play this "chicks dig me" card, it would belittle the actual
relationship I have with MLTR.  the only problem with THAT is that I am
screening for MORE MLTRs :)  I don't give a fuck about ONS because I can get
laid ANY NIGHT within an hour of talking to the chick I am talking to... in the
WAY I want to with a chick that I WANT TO FUCK :)  a chick offering me ONS is
like a chick offering me a dollar bill.  I already HAVE dollar bills... what do
I want hers for?  of course, there are some chicks that are just so HOT that
you want to try them out, but barring that scenario, ONS can bring you much
more ANGUISH than the satisfaction that accompanies it... PLUS it is the SAME
SATISFACTION that I already get on a regular basis from MLTR. 

besides... it is OBVIOUS that chicks dig me because here SHE is, liking me
within 20 minutes of meeting me... what about the chicks that have experienced
me for days?  months?  years?  OH, she could only HOPE to be one of those! :)

for you, it is a good tactic though.

>Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>her last week, apparently).

I lost a rap to a low-self-esteem bitch that had a couple of relationships like
this as well.  I mean, I fucked her, but I didn't get to MLTR like I wanted
because she was SCARED that she wouldn't match up to the next bitch and that I
would NEXT her for no reason, like her exes did.  I tried to tell her I wanted
her for more than that, but she wasn't emotionally healthy enough to understand
or believe me.

>Ok, now Maniac has reached her head, and I take this deeper..
>I go on to tell her that I dont want just sex, I want rocks and gold
>I can get any girl in roppongi on a Saturday night and fuck her
>(not exactly true, but she doesnt know this.. goal is just to

she KNOWS that it happened to her VERY QUICKLY.  she ASSUMES she was not the
ONLY bitch to fall for you that quickly.  it is like reverse-social-proof. 
fucking a bitch FAST makes them think you can fuck other bitches FAST.

>'confirm' her worst fears so that she acts), but its not enough for
>me. I want connection, good sex, and romance, with an intelligent
>woman, and that is why I want to date you (psychicbabe).

nice line.  this is another thing I will consider.  talking-up MLTR to them.  
I never considered this either, MAINLY because if you tell a chick what you
want her to do then you never know if she is manipulating you by being that
way, or if she arrived there NATURALLY... on her own.  interesting, LOTS of
style-change material happening right around the new year :)

>Then all of the sudden, she asks me about HBass (the chick staying
>at my place over the holidays), and freaks out about it. I tell
>her that she already knows all this, and exactly what is her point
>here?

although I am a GREAT fan of "quoting", I find that there need to be times to
engage in it and times to NOT engage in it.  this will depend on what you want
with the chick.  it is the same way you can't go from being a CHUMP to a MAN in
a chick's eyes... but you CAN go from being a MAN into a CHUMP :)  if you start
out telling a chick that you have a girlfriend AND that you fuck her, you leave
yourself open for these pot-shots whenever chicks trip the fuck out and go into
their irrational rants from out of left-field.  all a bitch needs to know is
that you are "taken" so that you manage her relationship expectations.  any
more information and she feels like you will give her ALL the information. 
where does it stop?  are you going to tell her that you are fucking her?  that
you fucked her last night?  that you fucked her an hour before coming on this
date?  that you fucked YOUR WOMAN in her ass?  that she LIKES sucking dick? 
WHERE DOES IT STOP?

I ran into this problem with a chick where my relationship to her was BASED ON
trading current sex-stories.  when I got to the point where I didn't want to
tell her any more shit, she was EXPECTING me to tell her, and I realized that
if I wasn't telling her, and she wasn't telling me, then our "relationship" was
OVER.  before that, I had not realized how much I had compromised my position
by telling her CURRENT sex-shit.  think about it, and decide on your own LIMITS
to what you are willing to tell a chick about other chicks... besides, think
about the fact that she is going to KNOW that she will end up as STORIES to
other bitches right after you fuck her.  it will make her VERY self-conscious
about whatever she does with you and that could hinder her emotional states
tremendously.

>Then she stops again, and asks me if I am fucking her (maybe I
>should have said no..., but I had already said yes to her about this
>the first time I saw her)., she asks me why.. (I tell her because
>I am seeing her! like I told you the first time! I mean what do
>you expect?!?).
>
>She then puts on her bitch face, and talks in a stern voice,
>"then call me when you break her up, that is my decision, I am
>going home.".

THIS is retarded because she ALREADY knew that you were fucking her AND she
fucked you herself.  this is another problem with bitches having information
about other bitches.  they use it against themselves.  IMO, the purpose of her
knowing you have another girl or SEVERAL other girls is so she knows where she
stands in the RACE to be your MAIN BITCH.  if you are single, she has a good
chance at being that to you.  if you are "taken" she has NO CHANCE of being
that to you.  if you are SEEING bitches, then she has to COMPETE to be your #1.
 other than THAT, I think giving information about your other bitches is a
mistake...  I have made the SAME mistake up to this point, so I am not
crisicizing :)  however, I am changing that ASAP and I think you should
consider giving out information on a N2K basis (need to know).

besides, SHE is the one that NEEDS a fuck.  if it is not coming from YOU, a guy
she has fucked ALREADY and she LIKES how you did it or she wouldn't have come
back... she has to get it from a STRANGER whose sexual skills are in question
that might tie her up, fuck her in the ass or sell her to the highest bidder. 
bitches like to FRONT a lot about having ALL these sexual choices, but with all
the 8s, 9s, and 10s I have spoken to on an honest "one of the chicks" level,
they are ALL looking to have an EXCITING time, but not REALLY be in DANGER! 
you, OTOH have pussy AT HOME IN BED WAITING FOR YOU!  the only one to lose out
if she bails... is HER!  knowing that, I would have not even entertained her
bullshit OR called her on it, letting her know that I was getting laid tonight
REGARDLESS of whether SHE fucks or not.  that would take the fucking WIND out
of her sails :)

>I tell her I am planning to break her up (which is true) later, so
>it is nothing you should worry about. 

this, my friend :)  is a COP-OUT!  it is used VERY EFFECTIVELY by married men
to keep fucking their side-bitches, but WE are way above bullshit tactics like
this.  I commend you for thinking of this "on the fly", but PLEASE, PLEASE! 
hehe  I have MUCH more respect for you as a PUA than to hear some CRAP like
this from you :)  PLEASE think of something better for the next instance of a
chick trying to BLACKMAIL you into trading in a R-E-L-A-T-I-O-N-S-H-I-P where
you are getting EVERYTHING you want from a chick... for a ONS with HER! 
HAHAHAHAHAHA  >:)

I haven't run into a chick STUPID enough to try to disrespect my MLTR for being
with me... chicks have STARTED to say she is dumb for "letting" (as if she has
ANY say in the matter) her man fuck other chicks, and I have BROKEN THEIR
FUCKING ASSES listing the benefits that SHE is getting that they will most
likely NEVER have with a man... EVER!  and CERTAINLY don't have right now, or
they would not be talking to me in a bar... they would be with THEIR OWN MAN
conducting this FANTASY RELATIONSHIP that they are professing that my MLTR
should have :)  I have NEVER run into a chick that has even TRIED to break into
my relationship with MLTR because they KNOW I mean business.  all they can do
is become ANOTHER MLTR... and after they hear the QUALIFICATIONS, they KNOW
they can't even achieve THAT... only ONS and LJBF with me.  if some bitch EVER
suggested that I break up with MLTR in order to ONS her, I would  A) laugh in
her face and  B) immediately demand an EXPLANATION of the reasons why she
thinks she can knock MLTR out of the box AND make her perform ANY AND ALL
SKILLS that she CLAIMS to be better than MLTR at IMMEDIATELY!  put up or SHUT
THE FUCK UP!  the result would be the ONS ANYWAY, and she would still be LJBF
or NEXT because MLTR is NOT about sex... it is about compatability and I
PERSONALLY could not be with some bitch that needs to knock other chicks off in
order to gain status.  I gain status by BEING MYSELF and letting bitches make
INTELLIGENT, EDUCATED decisions to be with me.  any chick that wants to be with
me had better do the same.

>she gets upset, and starts
>screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
>just like her ex-bf, getting other girls while dating her, and how
>all guys just want sex..etc..

I would have told her "you wanna calm the fuck down?"  throwing tantrums and
making scenes are expressions of her ability to do ANYTHING in your presence. 
I personally don't tolerate that.

>Then she says.. ok, if you let me meet your GF at your house
>tonight, then I will let you have sex with me. [ha! I got her!]

ok.  thank God I happened to read the next line before I started typing this. 
I was JUST going to ask you WHY you are STILL letting her blackmail you into
fucking her... ESPECIALLY when she is the one that needs it and you don't :)

>I bounce back, and say, "what exactly makes you think I am
>desperate to have sex with you tonight?! Do you think I am
>just some stupid guy and you can manipulate me like that?
>No, you will not meet my GF, it is disrespectful to her to do
>that. You know the situation, it was clear to you from the
>beginning, and you accepted it. There is no more to talk about.
>I am not here only for sex, I can get that anywhere. Sex only
>of itself is of little value to me, I want more than that.

SWEET!  :)  break her fucking ASS maniac :)

>I then bring out the nuclear weapons! My tonality is very firm,
>and I eye fuck her, while telling her the following. First, I tell
>her that I already told her about my GF, she was clear about it
>right from the start, and she has NO excuse. Then I go on to tell
>her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
>that did NOT happen. So do NOT compare me to your ex. I am a
>different person, and EXCEPT better treatment than that if you
>ever want to see me again. She starts crying more, and hugging
>again.

ugh :/   fucking IDIOTS!   man, the shit some bitches put you through!  does
everyone SEE why we have to study this shit?

>I put her against wall, and tell her not to complain about me like
>I am her ex, I a am different person than he is.
>
>I tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>alone!

this is a good point.  I like to play it the other way:

ok... so now, you have told me that you want everything to be a 'perfect'
situation with a guy before making a move.  You want him to be ideal with
women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady... WHAT MAKES YOU THINK
HE WILL WANT YOU?   WHAT ARE YOU BRINGING TO THE TABLE THAT IS GOING TO MAKE A
MAN LIKE THAT CHOOSE YOU OVER ANY OTHER CHICK?

you wanna see some confusion?  you wanna see a bitch get BROKEN?  HAHAHAHA  >:)
 of course, I use this on chicks that I am just practicing on, because it
normally induces DEPRESSION, not horniness.  when they have to GO DEEP INSIDE
and dive BELOW THE SURFACE of their programming, they realize that they CAN NOT
TELL ME WHY A MAN WOULD WANT THEM!  they stall the fuck out dude :)  it's
amazing.  matter of fact, it's documented already.  look at my recent thread
with "telembe".  I let her say all this bullshit about what she wanted from a
guy in order to give up her virginity, then when she was finished talking about
what she WANTED, I asked her what she was OFFERING to a guy that was going to
give her all this committment and "love" and other bullshit and she said a
whole bunch of shit that ANY bitch can and WILL give to a man she likes.  she
might have THOUGHT she had something to offer a guy that was going to seperate
her from the pack, but she doesn't.  even GOOD PUSSY can't get a bitch any
credit because there are LOTS of bitches that can fuck and suck like pros...
elites AND sub-elites.  telembe NEVER told us what seperates her from the rest
of the bitches that might make a MAN like the one she wants even LOOK HER WAY! 
the reason is that there is NO reason! :)  bitches are programmed that MEN want
them... but they are NEVER told WHY.  the reason is that men like to FUCK and
get their dicks sucked.  they also like companionship and cooking and cleaning
and for a girl to look good on their arm so they can feel accomplished around
their buddies.  chicks THINK they are ENTITLED to a good man... but the GOOD
MEN... are picking GOOD WOMEN!  if they were SHINING like they think they are,
they would have been scooped up already and married or whatever they were
looking for because some guy would have spotted her and said "I'm not going to
let her go for ANYTHING" and she would be happy... at least according to her
programming.  OH, how I LOVE to see a bitch's face while she TRIES AND TRIES to
dig up ANY reason why a guy as great as the one she claims to want would EVER
choose her over any other bitch :)  the JOY the JOY that I feel as this POMPOUS
BITCH breaks the fuck down RIGHT IN FRONT OF MY FACE! :)  of course since I
broke her, I keep talking to her and ease her back to a decent state of being
and let her know that she can take steps to make herself into the woman that a
man would want, but she has to really KNOW HERSELF and KNOW MEN in order to
make an intelligent decision.  I am not into depressing chicks... unless they
TRULY DESERVE IT for all the depression they have caused men throughout their
tenure as FINE bitches :)  also, I have no desire to BREAK bitches and leave
them like that.  that just makes it WORSE for ALL OF US looking for FINE, yet
DECENT chicks.

>she cries, and says that is so true, that is her problem, she never
>takes the chance and loses out because she doesn't make the
>move on taken guys. Then I run my 'take chances routine' (if you take
>a chance, in the end, the result is usually good, but if you don't,
>just you get left behind, by yourself).. 

nice.  I like that one... emphasizing loss and loneliness.

>she cries more, says she
>needs to take the chance, and doesnt want to be alone.

she's done :)  nice work.  land her!

>She says she has to be careful, that all guys want just sex, and
>bitches about this for about 30 seconds.

as opposed to what?  what does she WANT guys to want?

>Now I start the 'you need me, I dont need you..you think I just want
>only sex, then you dont understand me at all.. if you think that is
>what I am only, then you do NOT deserve me.. I do no need you to go out
>with me if that is what you think I am.. I want connection, sex,
>passion, and closeness.. and if you haven't figured that out about
>me yet, then get another guy, because you dont understand me at all..

OK OK OK... you've CONVINCED me maniac :)  that's some good shit right there :)
 starting NOW, I am pitching for MLTR ONLY.  bitches that want ONS or LJBF will
get what they deserve from me... which isn't much.  I LOVE this idea of dissing
her for claiming that you are looking for ONS... or even just a "bootie-call"
type relationship :)  I love it.  I would feel so PROUD getting on her like
this.  sweet!  EXTREMELY congruent!  nice play!  this is going into my style,
starting RIGHT NOW!  :)

>I am doing this, because I know the left (logic) and right (emotions,
>passion) are fighting each other..they have been all night. Because the
>left doesn't accept the logic of the situation, but I know the right side
>dying for a shag,..she is trying to rationaize going out with a taken guy,
>but I have gotten her so excited tonight, that she needs that fuck.

THIS is the reason I never learned any of this shit until recently.  my
caveman-kino style before this involved ZERO talking.  totally kino and kissing
and PHYSICAL seduction with domineering EYE-CONTACT.  there was NO INFORMATION
for the left side to process at all.  EVERYTHING went STRAIGHT to the chick's
right side, and her left had to try to process the EMOTIONS and turn them into
a story that she could understand... in the meantime, she is PHYSICALLY falling
for the kino and wanting MORE AND MORE until we are fucking.  I never HAD to
talk to chicks before OR after fucking them because my PHYSICAL ATTACK is so
DEVASTATING!  I would just take them over PHYSICALLY and their right brains
would do ALL the work and the left would struggle to understand, but eventually
succumb to the onslaught!  ARG ARG! :)

thanks for explaining that to me :)

>As I touch her side of face, she goes doggy look, I kiss her, and she
>gets like screambabe, panting. I put leg between her, she widens, goes nuts
>totally. I ask her she likes me (in a tell her sort of way' you like me..'),
>she replies 'yes'. I say (stare her down) .. she asks "what should I do?"
>I say in a very strn fatherly voice while staring her down 4 inches from
>her head.. you will follow me..that is what you will do.. and you will do
>what I say. 'she says, 'I will'. I tongue her down more, run her crotch,
>she almost cums right there, then I take her to a love hotel (her first
>time!), no resistance what so ever.

interesting.  what just happened here?  did you somewhere dictate to her that
the terms of her being "your bitch" is that she has to sumbit to you fully? 
are you getting a verbal confirmation of that from her?  or is something else
going on... like she just plain UNDERSTANDS that you can move her to passions
that make her WANT to cum and that you are going to take her there and over the
edge?

another point... what do you guys think of foreplay on a chick.  he mentions
that she almost came right there... do you think it is good to get her to the
EDGE and leave her there so she is so horny, she will do ANYTHING for you to
make her cum, OR to give her an orgasm right there in her clothes to
demonstrate your sexual mastery over her?  personally, I am into the sexual
mastery thing because I notice a newfound RESPECT from a chick that has had
guys on top of her NAKED, fucking her for all they were worth and she never
came from it, and then I am just doing kino on her and fingering her and she
cums from just that.  do you think that making the chick cum on herself makes
her want sex MORE or want it LESS since she just got off?  take into account
that chicks are multi-orgasmic and that they feel sexier after cumming, not
DRAINED like guys.

>As I am fucking her, I am putting things in her head, like D.Shades reports.
>I tell her as she is screaming it feels deeper and deeper, closer and
>closer. She is going nuts will I am fucking her.

I need to reasearch this.  is this more right-brain, left-brain shit where her
left-brain is shut down because of the FIREWORKS that are going off in her mind
because of the sex, leaving her wide open to suggestion?  if you have any links
for this, please post.

>I stare her down, and I tell her you need me (during sex), she says yes.
>I tell her from now on you will follow me, and do what I say. She says
>'yes, I will'. I continue doing her, she says "it feels SO good, I really
>need that, I really want it, i love you inside me!".. she is fucking like a
>wild animal, loud voice, shouting and screaming, oh, I want it, give it
>to me, I want to come!

more of the same?

>Then she tells me anything is ok as long as I dont hate her..she doesnt
>want me to hate her. She wants me to hold/hug her, she cries a bit, then is
>ok again (seems to be thinking of her old bf she says). I touch her
>more, face goes totally doggy look, and finger her, she goes nuts, we start
>fucking again.

the "I don't want you to hate me" thing is very important in the D/s
relationship... not that you set this up like that, but that is the MAIN
incentive for her to follow your lead... that she does NOT want you to hate her
and CERTAINLY not to banish her.  when that is TRULY first and foremost in her
brain, she will regulate HERSELF and place herself in-line with your thinking
and what YOU want her to be.  she also won't try to blackmail you anymore
because she KNOWS it gets on your nerves and all THAT will do is get her
EJECTED sooner rather than later :)

>Her back is on the bed, and I am fucking her missionary, her legs are
>spread and wide in the air, which I am holding. I tell her "see, I control
>you, 

hehe ok... this is a little FAR-FETCHED for me at this point, but I have not
researched it yet :)  I DO like the next line though.

>I go deep in your body because it is the one way to reach you totally
>deep in your mind which no one else can do. 

interesting

>By conquering your body, I can
>conquer your mind (then I drill her a bit more after I finish the sentence so
>she goes more crazy). I play with your body because it lets me control
>your mind (then drill her some more..ha, it is like the ultimate form of
>reward hypnosis).

IS there such a thing as reward hypnosis?  links please? :)

>I ask her, so why you like me. She says she says, you are decisive and
>sometimes I am indecisive, so you make it easy for me. I want the guy
>to make it easy for me to decide what to do (important clue here Maniac!
>maybe most chicks are like this! Maybe this too is where I fucked up
>with HB Geek!)

I have heard this a lot too... only thing is that there is a lot of
RESPONSIBILITY that comes with telling a chick what to do, and if the VALUE of
owning her is not sufficient for me, I don't give a fuck WHAT she does enough
to want to lead her to a good time.

>Moral of the story.. keep your ground.. call all chick bullshit DIRECTLY.
>Make the chick risk fear losing the relationship if she doesn't capitulate
>and chances are she will back down, in spite of how it looks (and I could
>do this BECAUSE I had other choices.. another reason to be fucking
>several chicks at once). As well, it seemed that she was giving me all the
>bullshit in part because she WANTED me to call her on it, and then fuck her
good
>at the end of the night, which I obliged.

chicks give you shit-tests to find out if you are stronger than them and see
HOW you are going to control them.  chicks like the way I control them because
I NARROW their choices for them, but STILL make them choose.  they can choose
the path of ULTIMATE SATISFACTION, or they can choose the path of EJECTION and
being back on the dating scene meeting the SAME LAME GUYS every night :)

you had told her you had a girlfriend, but she seems to have NEEDED to know
that she really COULDN'T have you all to herself and that you really DIDN'T
NEED to fuck her that night or EVER.  you stuck to your guns (after letting her
get to you for a while :-) and she eventually ran out of logic and got
overridden with kino and gave up the fucking pussy like she came there to do :)

>Constructive comments/opinions welcome!
>
>Maniac High
>http://www.pickupguide.com

EXCELLENT!  keep up the GOOD WORK dude!  :)

---
From: erosla77@aol.com (ErosLA77)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 30 Dec 2000 20:12:47 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

>Subject: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit
special!]
>From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
>Date: Fri, Dec 29, 2000 10:37 PM
>Message-id: <92jvre$obh@nnrp1.deja.com>

>)this chick is a very highly educated, driven, professional
> career woman and earns likely a big 6 figure salary
>b)she is very mature, focused and spends all day in her office
> surrounded by sharks and other pirrhana type scumbag characters

 She's got to be in control ALL DAY LONG at work. Small wonder then, with a
man, she wants to fully SURRENDER control and be made to submit.  It's like all
those super-powerful Congressmen and Judges and the like who LOVE going to get
pissed-on and whipped by some Madame Dominatrix. 

>I regroup my thoughts.

 I admire your ability to do this in the field, Maniac. As you think about it,
what do you do internally to re-set yourself and keep yourself in a good frame
of mind when all this shit throws your way?

>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations

   Metahpor is a POWERFUL tool to move folks from a fixed perception to a new
one. Please, share your story!

> Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>her last week, apparently).

Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with fucking; it feels
good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the vulnerabilities.  So
when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which overcomes the
potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. She's worried about pain,
so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not only losing
out on the pleasure of screwing, BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out that if
she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even WORSE
crack-up.

  Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.

>he gets upset, and starts
>screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
>just like her ex-bf,

See? The fear of the pain of being hurt just like her ex-BF hurt her is now
rearing its ugly head.  She doesn't seem like a very emotionally stable person
in ANY event, let alone having just been dumped by a guy.  

>Then I go on to tell
>her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
>that did NOT happen

 Sharp thinking. Again, what do you do internally to keep your state solid and
your thinking sharp? THAT process internally is of great value, even more than
the specifics you share.  The specifics are like handing guys fish; good for a
nice meal and of value. But  how you get to the mind-set is TEACHING someone
HOW to fish so they can eat for life. 

>I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>alone!

 Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to her her
"ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she can then
accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!  

   Excellent...Maniac, I don't give a damn WHAT my orthodox SS followers say,
this is BRILLIANT stuff and I'd be proud to be your wing or have you as mine,
ANY FUCKIN' DAY of the week! Sir, I salute you!

>Now what I am doing with all the above, is not arguing the logic (too
>much)
>of this, because, of course she is right, and I know this.

 Actually, you ARE not arguing the logic, but you are USING the logic...HER
logic..HER way of viewing things.....pointing out WHY and HOW she loses and
what will happen if she doesn't stop it.   It's all centered around losing and
WHY she loses, based on what she has told you.  It IS logical, FROM her point
of view.  

 Great, Great stuff...sir, I salute you!

-----

From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]
Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2000 12:03:54 GMT

Replies to various people about psychicbabe:

Answers to various questions:

Was psychicbabe british, or Japanese?
She was a brit of Japanese ancestry (ie. she
looked 'j', but thought, acted and had an
english accent like a brit). This in my
opinion made it harder, because brit women
are so fucking F A T, and she was so
slender, sexy and attractive (and she dressed
to kill) compared to all of them. Lots of guys were
hitting on her (and she said she always got hit
on, and hated it.. trick was to not make it look
like a 'hit').

Why not a white chick? Well, I had the chance...
but.. at the conference where I met her, EVERY
brit. white chick there was in serious blimp bulge
territory.. very scary. Why is it so many caucasian
women are so FAT?

It was funny though, because something like 8 guys
(I counted) tried to hit on psychicbabe the night
I PU'd her. One guy was pretty good, the rest were
total AFC's..it was rather funny.

Re: Rocks -vs- gold.. how I use it (yes, it is
Jake's metephor. For RJ, search the original post
on fastseduction.com. It is also on pickupguide.com
someplace (if not it will be there in about 2 weeks,
I am revising the page this week). Basically, I intro
it as follows:
After chick says bullshit about wanting to go to
dinner and be friends or shit for 6 months before
becoming a GF, I say: Actually, I dont go to dinner
or stuff like that with ladies who are not my GF
CHick:  gasps!
Maniac: see, going to dinner, is an important step
in a relationship for me. I only share it with someone
special
chick: Huh?
Maniac: Well, let me put it this way, do you ever
sleep with a guy who is just your friend, or dont
care about?
chick: of course not!
Maniac: well, why do you think a guy should do any
different then?
Maniac: See, let me tell you a story. You ever hear
about 'rocks & gold'?
chick: no? what is it?
Maniac: Well, Relationships are valuable things.
And each partner is looking for something. It is like
diamonds (rocks) and gold. Both are valuable.

But women prefer diamonds to gold (usually), and
men prefer gold to diamonds (usually). Of course,
both are important, especially in a long term
relationship, but if a woman could choose, she would
prefer the diamonds  first, and the man would
prefer the gold  first. right?

chick: yeah, probably

Maniac: And (generally), a man can accept gold
without the diamonds, and a woman can accept
diamonds without any gold.

So in a relationship, a woman is mining for
diamonds, while the man is mining for gold.
While they are in the mine together, the
guy gives diamonds he finds to the woman, and
the woman gives the gold she finds, to the man.

But if you give a woman gold only, or a man
diamonds only.. neither is likely to be
very happy, and the relationship will soon
fall apart. In short, an exchange of sorts
takes place in a successful relationship.

And also, if a man expects just gold (sex),
but doesnt want to give her diamonds
(relationship & the mushy stuff), then she
will dump him fairly soon, because he is
playing/using her just for sex..

And if a woman expects just diamonds (walks,
attention, nice dinners, movies..etc) without
giving some gold (sex), then he (if he has any
clue about how to deal with women, though many
men do not, especially in North America) will
dump her because she is using/playing him just
for his personality.

A guy taking a chick to dinners, buying shit
and giving nice walks without sex is THE SAME
as a guy sleeping with a girl, and then kicking her
out right after the fuck is over. (chick says:
'yelch!'. Yes, thats right, and for the guy,
just dinners and buying shit is 'yelch', with
no sex, and no attention is exactly the same.

Because a woman will go to free dinner with
almost any guy, it has no value to me. But
I am like you, I want attention, and I want
to be made to feel special.

And although a girl will go to nice free dinners
with almost anyone, I also know that a girl will
not sleep with anyone. So I know if she does with me,
then it means she thinks I am important. And if
she wont, then it means she doesnt care about me
at all, so I really dont need to see her again,
I will just go find another girl.

Maybe you might think it is unusual for a guy
to think this way, but it is just my way.

See, I dont want to be played. Guys are always
getting played by girls for nice dinners, long
talks on the phone, and for their personalities.
It is the SAME as a girl being used for sex.
So I am happy to give plenty her diamonds, but at
the same time, I dont want to be played, so
I also expect her to want to give me gold.
And if she doesn't, it means she doesnt care about
me, is using me, or it means I am being played,
or I am stupid.

As well, experience has also showed me that
'friends first' almost NEVER results in a
relationship. I mean how many of your BFs were
your friend first (chick usually replies..uh,
zero).

Exactly, so that is why I never play 'friends
first'. Friends first means diamonds for the
lady, and no gold for the guy. That is like
the guy saying (ok, lets fuck for 6 months,
and if its good, we can go to dinner, and go
out, and you can be my GF). Would you like
that (chick: yelch!!).

Exactly.. so that is why it is far better,
that the lady meet me, get to know me, and
then I expect her to be smart enough to know
to take that chance THEN (or reject it, and I will
go get another lady) when it is offered to her.

So that is why I expect things that way in a
relationship with a lady.

After this, a chick is (usually) quite impressed,
or surprised and doesnt know what to say..

[When I recited this to psychicbabe, she actually told me
she was very impressed, that I understood relationships
so well ;-) ]

Had I been smart, I would have used it on HB
geek, and laid her, but after that failure I
thought about it, and then when the same situation
came up with Psychicbabe this week, I knew what
to do..

Ok, now on to other comments..

RJ writes
>Maniac writes:
> >I regroup my thoughts.
>
>  I admire your ability to do this in the field, Maniac. As you think
about it,
> what do you do internally to re-set yourself and keep yourself in a
good frame
> of mind when all this shit throws your way?

A couple things.. first, this PARTICULAR chick is of no importance
to me, because I am (likely) seeing 3 others this week. So it is
not as risky to me to be firm, and keep my ground.

Another important fact, is the way chick's brains are usually
wired. For a
chick, once she likes a given guy, it is hard for her to immediately
switch to another guy. it is far MORE risky, because a chick (unlike
men), usually cannot switch to another guy, once she ALREADY
likes a given guy (story is different BEFORE you got her to
like you..then SHE has more power than you).

So I play on this, and as a result I dont feel nervous/scared at all,
because there is far more to risk to her, than to risk to me. Because
she is stuck to me, but I am not stuck to her. (this also is why
'jerks' can get away with so much shit on any given chick, and why
she will tolerate it.. because her brain has now got her focussed
on THAT guy, and it is now a choice (in her mind), between him (and
his bullshit... or being alone (sure she can get another guy in 10
minutes, but she cannot build those nice feelings of 'attachment'
in 10 minutes.. that gives us men power, once we realize this).

Two, I am generally a very balanced level
headed person, and dont take any of this personally (as you already
know, RJ). Three (in this case), I had
already laid this chick, so I didnt care really if I laid her again
or not.. I already conquered her, and she (and I) already knew that.

If it is a new chick, sometimes, I get more nervous/fucked up (see
HB Geek). I am trying to keep my senses more when this happens

> > Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
> >problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
> >her last week, apparently).
>
> Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with
fucking; it feels

Not sure about this, I think she just simply wanted the fuck, but
wanted to feel she was important to me, and she didnt want to just
get played..

> good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the
vulnerabilities.  So
> when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which
overcomes the
> potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. She's worried
about pain

yes, thats right.

> so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not
only losing
> out on the pleasure of screwing,

Not really. I actually made it clear to her that I didnt care if
she bang me or not. The point was that she had to give her mind
to me, and respect me, and follow me (whether that is bang me,
make her take off her clothes in the window for me, or do my
dishes..whatever.. its not the banging that is important, it is
the submission to me that counts, and what she needs to give me
if she wants my attention at all).

> BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
> believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out
that if
> she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even
WORSE
> crack-up.

Yes

>   Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.
>
> >he gets upset, and starts
> >screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
> >just like her ex-bf,
>
> See? The fear of the pain of being hurt just like her ex-BF hurt her
is now
> rearing its ugly head.  She doesn't seem like a very emotionally
stable person
> in ANY event, let alone having just been dumped by a guy.

No, she is not stable at all. I think though, it is because she
bottles it up all day, to be the 'office bitch' that she has to
be in the daytime. This chick lives for her work. She has no other
life.

>
> >Then I go on to tell
> >her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
> >that did NOT happen
>
>  Sharp thinking. Again, what do you do internally to keep your state
solid and
> your thinking sharp? THAT process internally is of great value, even
more than
> the specifics you share.  The specifics are like handing guys fish;
good for a
> nice meal and of value. But  how you get to the mind-set is TEACHING
someone
> HOW to fish so they can eat for life.

Actually, the specifics are important I think. This is why lay/field
reports with details are so important. I think really shitty on my
feet. I really suck.. bad.

But if I have had that same experience before (with another chick),
or been in that same situation before, and
either succeeded (or failed, and then thought about how to handle it
right the next time), then I will handle it correctly this time.

I really believe in field experience. I have alot... really alot.
so I have seen many of these situations before. It is like chess,
or a foreign language. If you've been there before, and worked out
a solution, then you know what to do. You MUST get field experience.
It is CRUCIAL. And each time you fail, you go home, and see what
you did right/wrong, and what you would do if the same situation
happened again. This is why I also post the fuckup as well as
the lay reports.. they are very valuable to me in gathering my
thoughts and forcing me to think about what I did right/wrong,
as well as listening to the other's comments about them on this
NG.

I also look at the other's reports as well, and learn about
situations, and ask myself for each one, if it happened to me,
what would I do/how would I handle it. Eventually, after doing it
for a couple years (I have been at this in ernest for about 2
years now), you get better at it. Learning situations in PU, is
like learning the words of a foreign language, and how to connect
them all together.. how to move from a bad situation..to a good
one to get the chick in a horny state..

Also, I keep in mind alot about what MrSex4uNYC says about attitude,
and when I get stuck, I ask myself, what would NYC tell me right
now about this situation. He is very congruent, and if you think
things this way, it is easy to be clear what is the right way or
wrong way.

> >I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
> >with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
> >with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
> >and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
> >unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
> >alone!
>
>  Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to
her her
> "ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she
can then
> accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!

Yes, basically that is the idea. I am not sure that it means I am
an authority, but its more, to convey that she is clueless, she
is wrong, so to listen to herself will make her fuck up even more..
..so maybe she had better listen to me instead, and then she wont
fuckup as much.. basically that is the idea..

>    Excellent...Maniac, I don't give a damn WHAT my orthodox SS
followers say,

I didn't get this.. What are orthodox SS followers, and I had no
idea they were saying anything about this.. I really dont understand
what you mean here..

> >Now what I am doing with all the above, is not arguing the logic (too
> >much)
> >of this, because, of course she is right, and I know this.
>
>  Actually, you ARE not arguing the logic, but you are USING the
logic...HER
> logic..HER way of viewing things.....pointing out WHY and HOW she
loses and
> what will happen if she doesn't stop it.   It's all centered around
losing and
> WHY she loses, based on what she has told you.  It IS logical, FROM
her point
> of view.

Yes, basically that is the idea. What I meant was, is that her main
point is that she wants a monogamous BF, and doesn't want to be played.
But, I am playing her, and she (at some level) realizes that, so
in essense, her gut feel about this is totally correct.

But I am playing her desire for the fuck, and her fear of losing
out, which lets me bypassing her gut feel that she is being
played, and then I can get her to fuck anyways.

Good followups everyone!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

-----

From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]
Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2001 12:10:23 GMT

  "Dohn Joe"  wrote:
>  wrote in message news:92n7b96
@nnrp1.deja.com...
> [snip]
>
> The more I think of it, the more this seems to be a great PU.
> I think the PU in England is the gist of your piece of work.
>o I'd be glad to see more
> details on how you picked her up in England, that's the hardest work. How
> did you stand up the crowd? How did you make it not look like a PU?

I was using psychological 'jujitsu' (use the strength of your
opponant, against themself). There is a field report from 2 months
ago, that outlines the PU (check fastseduction.com archives).
Basically, I met her at a conference. I didnt talk to her much.
Then I followed her onto a bus that was taking us to the next
meeting place. A guy was hitting on her, and he sat with her.
I sat on the seat in front bymyself.

She (like most british bitches), started complaining about how
she hates men, and other bullshit. The guy on the bus with her
is taking this/agreeing with it (if I remember right).

I just turned around (and tonality and eye contact here is crucial),
and just tell her in a VERY authoritative voice, slowly.. "perhaps
you have just not met the right man yet, one you understands you,
deeply, and completely. But.. you never know the future.. now do you..
I used killed eye contact, spoke slowly, and continued "perhaps
if you open your mind more, you might find him.. by surprise, without
even expecting it, because often, that is the way it usually is..see"

Psychicbabe went "maybe", and then started more manhating bitching.

I then described the kind of man she wanted "one you could rely on,
but at the same time, be mysterious, and exciting in some unexpected
ways, because he just knew how to reach you deep inside you, and
your mind.. that is what your looking for..isnt' it?"

Psychicbabe: yes,

{continue PU, bunches of stuff from the ManiacPlan, if I remember
right}

The key here was the tonality and Eye-Fuck contact. That is what
did it more than the words I used. I just totally crushed her
with it..

> How did
> you get past her "bitch office" shield? I'm asking especially because, as I
> picture this woman, it would seem pretty intimidating for me to approach
> her.

I had the attitude that she obviously had never met a man that
knew how to give it to her right, which means that she obviously
needed ME far more than I needed her. That mindset made it easy.

> I admire your ability to take her from there into total submission.
> existing relationship than guys. That's why many (even HOT ones) find
> themselves in a dead end - boring or abusive - relationship, love to
> complain about it to whoever they find to listen, yet are unable to step out

EXACTLY!!

> of it. That's why the first fuck is hard - after that she is bound
> emotionally to you. You see,

>Women's sexuality is DISSOLVED in them.

Yes! you understand it!! (true for most, but not all chicks though,
some just like sport fucking, like we do)

> GREAT words to remember for all us RAFCs when we feel like beating the walls
> after a fuckup... I myself am so darn depressed when coming back after an
> unsuccessful encounter with a chick. Yes, each field experience is one more
> lesson

Yes, do NOT underestimately field experience. It is SO important.
I fucked up TONS (see all the fuckup reports I used to post a couple
years ago on ASF), and I still fuckup alot (see HBGeek, or HockeyBabe).
Over on cliff's list they say it takes 2..4 years to get good
at something, and 10 years to be a master. I TOTALLY agree.
I have only been at this for 2.. 2 1/2 years. And the more I learn,
the more I realize I still need to learn.. There is still TONS that
I dont know yet.

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

----
From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:08 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

I, for one, am really GLAD to see a post from RJ that has helped me move
forward in MY game :)  not that I am an ingrate hehe... his contribution to all
this is UNDENIABLE to begin with and if I hadn't stumbeled onto his site, I
would have still been using my caveman tactics and my MENTAL seduction game
would still be lacking.  as much as I appreciate his contribution to the
seduction game in general, I had been disappointed with all the flaming and
nonsense that he and others had/have been involved with because I thought that
this NG was BASED on USEFUL interaction between him and the rest of us, but I
found that not to be the case :(  not that ANYONE gives a fuck what I have to
say about this, but I wanted to back up into the PAST to make it clear that I
appreciate RJ's PERSONAL contribution to the NG TODAY.

In article <20001230151247.26801.00001467@ng-fi1.aol.com>, erosla77@aol.com
(ErosLA77) writes:

>>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations
> 
>   Metahpor is a POWERFUL tool to move folks from a fixed perception to a new
>one. Please, share your story!

I have been doing this without identifying it:

A) find out her perception (marriage, monogamy, sucking dick VS kissing...)
B) "quote" her a story illustrating a chick that saw things a DIFFERENT way
(the way I want HER to see things) and benefitted GREATLY from it (she is still
with me, she got married to the guy she wanted, she gained inner peace and
self-love...)
C) watch her AGREE with something that she just minutes ago BELIEVED was
incorrect, or not for her.

the most fascinating part is (C) because I didn't realize my powers of
validation, pacing then LEADING had developed so strongly.  this is partially
because I am an empath and can FEEL when a chick moves into different emotional
states so I can relate to her from within her own state and effectively "vulcan
mind-meld" with her, turning the TWO of us into a SINGLE, functioning entity so
that I can dictate for US... to a degree.

a frequent situation is chicks asking me if I am single.  basically, I explain
to them that I am in an "open" relationship.  they practically INVARIABLY
disrespect my MLTR for being stupid. "how can she go for that?" "I would have
dumped you" "I would never let a man see other women"...  sooooo :)  I let them
go on and on and get it all out and completely ENTRENCH themselves in the DREAM
of them being with a man like me AND dumping me or CHANGING me or whatever
their BULLSHIT FANTASIES are at the time.  THEN I go into the BENEFITS of being
MY PRIMARY relationship... :)  when I stack up the LIST of BENEFITS and it
stacks HIGHER than those bitches have in their OWN RELATIONSHIPS RIGHT NOW,
they start thinking.  they think about what LITTLE they really have in their
relationships that MY MLTR is getting.  they think about the TRUST and
COMPANIONSHIP between us that they DON'T HAVE with their borefriends.  they
think about how she is SEXUALLY SATISFIED... DAILY if she wants it.  she has
someone to give her the REAL DEAL on how men are and what we want from
chicks... not someone that's going to keep playing her until he is finished
fucking her.  they ALSO see how the other bitches (like them in the near
future) come and go and MLTR CONSTANTLY receives the benefits of being with a
man that does EVERYTHING for her that she could want... for the MERE price of
NOT bailing because I fuck other chicks :)  once I break it down to them, ALLLL
I see on their faces is ENVY.  matter of fact, they tend to look EMBARRASSED
when I ask THEM about THEIR relationships.  oh, that reminds me... the bitches
that DON'T HAVE A MAN AT ALL fare the WORST in these situations.  my MLTR has
NEVER-ENDING SATISFACTION... they have STORIES of what they WOULD DO... IF
they could get a man AT ALL!  :)

chicks would rather have 20% of a WINNER than 100% of a LOSER!

>> Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>>her last week, apparently).
>
>Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with fucking; it
feels
>good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the vulnerabilities.  So
>when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which overcomes the
>potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. 

wow!  VERY powerful :)  I had really considered these to be apples and
oranges... pain of emotions after sex and pain of LOSS of the individual. 
however, discomfort is discomfort.  I quit giving UTILITY to this PIVOT I was
using because I realized she had ZERO self-esteem and not many other redeeming
qualities other than her looks.  she went from LJBF to NEXT overnight.  I had
been using her for a pivot because of her looks, but her lack of personality
started to wear on me and finally, she had to go.  no more hanging out, no more
phone calling, no more help with her love-life... nothing... cold turkey. 
completely FORGOT about her.  about a month or so later, the holiday season
comes around and she  A) calls me  B) tells me she bought me something for
christmas (I bought her NOTHING, not even a CARD and didn't bother to get one
when she told me she bought me something)  C) tells me she wants to bring it TO
my house, and  D) shows up with gift in hand, READY to socialize and spend time
with me.  

this is the SAME bitch that NEVER went in her purse to even OFFER to throw in
money when I used to use her for a pivot.  I didn't mind paying for her though
because the benefits I got from being out with an attractive chick that KNOWS I
am out to get OTHER bitches and facilitates that was well worth it :)  hehe... 
too bad for her, MLTR was over and I received her gift, talked to her for a
while (where she told me her recent "relationship" blew the fuck up in her face
:-) and then ejected her to keep having fun with MLTR.

I have been using outfoxer's style of letting bitches get involved in bullshit
relationships, TELLING THEM the relationships are bullshit then letting them
fall FLAT on their faces and come CRAWLING back to me :)  I just haven't added
the part yet where I get indignant that they are giving sex to CHUMPS that use
them like BITCHES and throw them away.  hehe it is fun enough at this point
just to hear about their FAILURES from the horses' mouths and see the sad looks
on their faces, while I am CONSTANTLY SMILING :)

what you described is BASICALLY what happened to her, except NOT in the sexual
content, but in the companionship content.  she THOUGHT she had a solid
position with me as my pivot, so she didn't feel like paying for anything
because she thought I NEEDED her, not WANTED her.  as soon as I didn't want her
anymore and dumped her from LJBF to NEXT, she was OK with it UNTIL her
relationship BACKFIRED... THEN she decides she wants to get back in good with
ME, which she can't do because I don't give a fuck about her and except for
looks, she can't compete with MLTR AT ALL!

the pain of loneliness overrides the emotional pain of sex without
committment... fascinating :)

>She's worried about
>pain, so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not only
>losing out on the pleasure of screwing, BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
>believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out that if
>she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even WORSE
>crack-up.
>
>  Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.

ok, this is interesting too.  "this is why you fucked up with your ex and I
feel the same way about that particular topic".  you are FORECASTING her
EJECTION unless she changes her ways.  she is still WITH YOU and has a chance
to do the right thing instead of getting ejected.  she already knows how it
feels to BE ejected by her EX and doesn't WANT to go through that pain AGAIN
with you.  you dictate to her HOW she could have avoided it with her EX and she
learns how to avoid it with you and gets in line.  this is another reason why
DICTATING what you REQUIRE from chicks is good, because they have the roadmap
to success or FAILURE with you.  as long as you have demonstrated personality
AND value BEFORE getting to this with her, she will be in a state of "how can I
get my hands on this guy... and KEEP him?" and then you will tell her what she
needs to do to be CONSIDERED amongst your TOP chicks and then is is up to her
to either fulfill her womanly duties or... as you predicted... get ejected and
feel the PAIN OF SEPERATION all over again with someone that she ALREADY knows
she WANTS to be with... WHATEVER the cost.

everyone has their price.  I find, most times, chicks are TALKING with no
EXPERIENCE.  a chick told me that she dumped her borefriend because he laughed
at her.  I told her that the sex must not have been good because otherwise she
would have had to use more than THAT to justify dumping an entire relationship.
 she CLAIMED that sex had nothing to do with her decision and that he didn't
RESPECT her was why she dumped him.  I told her that if the sex had been what
it is SUPPOSED to be... I GUARANTEE her that she would NOT have thrown THAT
away because of some laughing and disrespect.  I also proceeded to laugh at her
AND disrespect her IN HER FACE and told her I don't care because we are not
dating... she can't DUMP ME!   she never ADMITTED that I was right... BUT... by
the end of the conversation, she was asking me WHAT SHE SHOULD DO TO MAKE HER
LOVE LIFE BETTER!  :/  gotcha!

>>I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>>alone!
>
> Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to her her
>"ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she can then
>accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!  

yes.  I really have not been making the MOST of pacing and leading.  I have
been seeing where they ATTACH THEMSELVES to my way of thinking and see me as an
authority.  I have not used this to MAKE POLICY for them... merely to open
their minds and get them to think more efficiently.  you are right though. 
once you capture them... LEAD THEM!  make SOME efficient use of your new
followers... even if you were only practicing or passing time by capturing them
:)

excellent post :)

------

From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:10 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

In article <92n7b96@nnrp1.deja.com>, maniac_high@yahoo.com writes:

>After chick says bullshit about wanting to go to
>dinner and be friends or shit for 6 months before
>becoming a GF, I say: Actually, I dont go to dinner
>or stuff like that with ladies who are not my GF
>CHick:  gasps!
>Maniac: see, going to dinner, is an important step
>in a relationship for me. I only share it with someone
>special
>chick: Huh?
>Maniac: Well, let me put it this way, do you ever
>sleep with a guy who is just your friend, or dont
>care about?
>chick: of course not!

[lots of good use of Jake's shit snipped]

this is interesting, though I couldn't tell if this is something you are GOING
to do, or something you DID already.  either way, IF you are congruent, this
will serve you well as an alternate form of screening.  most of the time, I
screen by ASKING chicks shit and listening to their answers while watching
their faces and body-language.  another way to do it is to basically DICTATE to
them what I need to even CONSIDER being with a chick in any capacity
whatsoever.  most of the time I don't do this though because I can tell already
that the chick is worthless.  I usually get into DICTATION when she asks me
about myself.  am I attached?  what do I look for in a woman? etc.  THEN, since
she asked, I get into the reasons I have chosen women in the past and why I am
still with them in the present.  as I do that, I lay down my laws WITHOUT
telling the chick I am talking to that she needs to get in line with this shit
or get the fuck out of my face.  I have had a couple of chicks blow themselves
out after this.

I was talking to a chick that I know from YEARS ago that started calling me
again and talking about nothing.  I tolerated her for an hour or so on two
different days  A) because I was bored and  B) because through her speech
patterns and recurring ideas, I was learning if she was worth anything to me at
all, considering I get everything I want or need from MLTR in the first place,
she only had a VERY LIMITED use to me, as GOOD backup-pussy.  MLTR is smarter,
more interesting, more fun, less psychotic... basically TRUMPED her in all
areas, so this chick had NO CREDIT with me whatsoever.  I ended up getting into
PRECISELY what you did in your post.  the KICKER was when I told her "I don't
even TALK to girls that I don't want to fuck".  since I had not fucked her AND
had not suggested that we get together (she BELIEVES in monogamous
relationships for herself and even if she fucked me one time, it would be
merely to relieve her own personal stress and I am not going to be there for
her for that.  I am looking for MORE MLTRs... anything else can go fuck off.  I
laughed at her way of being AND broke it down to her why it was so stupid AND
let her know in NO UNCERTAIN TERMS that I was not going to be involved in
ANYTHING CLOSE to what she claims to want for herself... she can STAY HORNY for
all I care) she INTELLIGENTLY asked me WHY I was talking to her...  I let her
know that I found her amusing and her way of living ineffective.  I pointed out
to her that in the YEARS since I had spoken to her last, ALL she had to show
for it was a bungh of jibberish about WANTING a monogamous relationship that
she HAS NOT ATTAINED IN ALL THESE YEARS!  I let her know that I had predicted
that she would REMAIN dissatisfied for years to come and my talking to her
allowed me to follow her LACK of progress while, in the meantime, I get laid
EVERY DAY by MLTR :)   I have not heard from her SINCE that conversation...
good riddance.  she knew what she HAD to do if she wanted more of my time.  she
knew what she was going to have to do IF she wanted to socialize with me at
all.  she felt like her DEVOTION to the idea of a monogamous relationship with
a NON-EXISTANT man was more important than getting fucked by a guy that she
KNOWS and LIKES.  she is an idiot, and will remain horny UNTIL she fucks the
wrong guy, then has NO ONE to comfort her because I will not be there because
she had her chance and BLEW IT!

I have ZERO TOLERANCE for chicks that want things their way.  if they LIKE
doing things MY WAY, then they can be with me...maybe... for a while... as long
as they still LOOK HOT :)   when I approach chicks, I ASSUME they will fail the
screen because statistics show that I require A LOT from a chick and most of
them are either distracted by work or other relationships or just are not
QUALITY enough to be with me.  I find it amusing how ridiculous the SAME girls
are that I used to DESIRE to go out with and that I USED TO dislike being
rejected by.

now, I meet and REJECT girls daily.  not actively, just after I meet them, I
make NO EFFORT to remain in contact with them and go off to talk to other
chicks, leaving them wondering WHY I was interested enough to approach, but
BECAME DISINTERESTED and ejected for a SIMILARLY-GOOD-LOOKING bitch :)

Experiment Report! How kinky are your coworkers?!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



A practice session using the techniques of PU!


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: ]Experiment Report! How kinky are YOUR co-workers?!
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 08:03:45 GMT

]Experiment Report! How kinky are YOUR co-workers?!

This report is about finding the deep dark secrets of
your co-workers (not necessarily to fuck them, but as
a good experiment in state transitioning in groups
rather than one-on-one).

Note, for those readers living in repressed countries
still in the sexual dark ages like the Islamic
Republic of Iran, or the United Stated of America,
I do not advice attempting this..trouble with the
legal system, sex harrassment shit, or loss of
your job could result.. For the rest of you living
in countries that have both feet planted firmly in
the 20th century, no problem, lets rock on- here
is the report!


Recently, I have been doing alot of work practicing
state transitioning. Ie. the goal is to take a
chick (or in this case, group of chicks) from the
"idle state" (ie. thinking about office bullshit
and work they have to do), and transition them
to the kinky "lets get crazy and fuck state" as
quickly as possible, and in as few steps as possible
using a process that will be consistantly successful.

Last night, we had one of these (usually) boring
office departmental dinner parties at a stuffy
restaurant in town. BORING!!

So I decided what better place to liven things up
and see what I can get away with using psychological
warfare and a little bit of alcohol in an otherwise
formal group setting.

I get there, and sit at a table with 1 guy, and
5 chicks. For the first 30 minutes, it is boring,
I let everyone talk about boring office shit so
that everyone can arrive, and the food can start.

First I arrange the waiter to bring drinks to the
table (we need it later for one of the games I
am going to do), and get started on that right away.
One of the chicks only drinks tea, but that is OK,
later she really got into it anyways in spite of
being stark sober.

At the table is sitting:
ChinaGuy - he is from China
Mombabe - she is a mom, but wild & crazy, 40s (starts
          by sitting at another table)
HB CaptHook - she had a mild eye infection and is
              wearing an eyepatch this week (starts by
              sitting at another table)
HBStrict - she only drinks tea, but is more action
           than she looks
ScaredChick - she thinks we are all wierd
HBWhoMe? - she looks SO straight, but is the kinkiest
           at the table we find out!
Bichick - we find out she had enjoyed some bi games

Other assorted people sitting farther, who dont
play in the games really..

After that, I start. Here is how I did it. Refer
to the 'Maniac plan' post I made a couple weeks ago
(it is archived in fastseduction.com, I will also put
it on my site in Jan. when the next big update
happens) for some of the terminology below. I move
all the chicks (as a group), through all the states
as follows:

[Current State: Idle: chicks talking about office bullshit]
Maniac>Bichick: So what did you do this weekend?
Bichick: Nothing really.. how about you?
Maniac>I went to my dance circle, I like salsa dance
Bichick: oh really? {other chicks starting to listen}
Maniac: Yeah, I went to Brazil this year too, it was so
        much fun, wanna see my pictures?
Bichick & others: 'yes!' (take out my digi-PC, show pictures
        of carnival in Rio, tback bikini babes, the gay parade
        and debauchery in the streets)
Maniac: You know, the culture is SO different, brazilian people
        are SO passionate!
All chicks: oh really?
Maniac: yep, after I left Rio, I went to Sao Paolo, and
        went into this bar and all of the sudden this brazilian
        chick grabbed me and started french kissing me (perform
        SP chick story from ManiacPlan).

[Current State: (A)dmiration & (M)an now achieved from ManiacPlan]
Bichick: Oh, HB Capthook lived in brazil a few years!
Maniac: really? {I go to her table, ask if she wants to see
        some brazil carnival pictures with us.. she runs over
        to our table}
Maniac>all chicks: you know, I respected that SP chick though
       because she was not afraid to take what she wants..
       kind of like Madonna (perform the Madonna story from
       ManiacPlan).
Maniac: Perform 'how to communicate to lady at all levels
        and pay attention to her and what she wants' story
        from ManiacPlan, while doing lots of Kino on
        HBCapthook sitting next to me as a demonstration.
        Others are watching and getting jealous..

[Now try to introduce the (S)ex state from ManiacPlan..
the goal here is to do the "questions game, but in a
group setting.. so I decide to do it via a drinking game]
Maniac: {now I try to introduce a drinking game called 'I
       never'}, Hey, do they have any good drinking games in
       Japan.
Chicks: {they suggest some really lame boring shit like
         remembering names of subway stations..boring!!!}
Maniac: Well, I know two games, Chandelliers {I describe this
        game.. but we wont play it, not sexual}, and then
        "I never" {I describe "I never"}.
[Now here, I think I dont have enough rapport yet to start
"I never" (a drinking version of "questions") and get it to
work well (ie. sexually), so first I preform the "Strawberry
fields" game in a group (in next post, and included below)

<>>

We play the game: (mombabe hears us laughing, comes
over & kicks Chinaguy out of his chair so she can sit
next to us)

Among the answers to "strawberry fields"
Bichick: "uh, I dont see any fence around the field!"
HB Capthook & mombabe: "as many as I can eat!"
HBStrict: "to the farmer.. uh.. Thank you {and bow}"

We were all laughing and rolling on the floor to the
various chicks answers to this game, with lots of "I cant
believe you?! really?!" reactions among the ladies..

[Current state in ManiacPlan: (S)ex now achieved, now
lets intensify and see what these chicks will say/do.
I am putting LOTS of shoulder/back kino on all the
ladies as the game is playing]

Maniac: OK, time for another game, we will play that
 "I never" game we talked about before. {Maniac explains
 howto play "I never"} [easy.. each person takes a turn,
 say "I never xxx", whoever did "xxx" has to take a drink.
 start light, get game sexual ASAP..]

Maniac: here is the opening question: "I never kissed a
 member of the opposite sex before I was 15 y.o."
{3 girls drink}
Maniac: your turn HBCaptHook
HBCaptHook: uh, I dont understand the game yet, can you do
  the next question Maniac?
Maniac: OK, I never kissed a guy on the first date
{we all drink}
HBCaptHook: OK I get it, my turn "I never had sex with a
 guy on the first date" {notice because of the setup with
 straberry fields here, that the chicks ON THEIR OWN, turned
 the game sexual without me having to do anything! This was
 what I worried about if I were to start the "I never" game
 before straberry fields.. the mood was just not sexual
 enough yet, and the game would have fizzled.. but now..
 no problem!}
{all but 1 chick drinks (HB afraid.. who is looking a bit
 uncomfortable now)}
Mombabe: I never kissed a member of the same sex
{Bichick drinks!.. lots of "oh really?!? and discussion
 ensues, but bichick wont delve into it anymore ;-) }
Bichick: I never had sex with more than 4 people in the
 room.
{bichick, HBstrict and HBWhoMe all drink!}
HBAfraid: I never went to california
{we all look at her wierd.. skip to next girl}
HBWhoMe: I never did sex as part of a performance in front
of others
{Maniac, Bichick and HBWhoMe drink.. HBStrict looks envious,
others gasp and are laughing.. rest of our dept, is looking
at us, like why we are having so much fun, and a bit wierdly,
fortunately they cannot hear what we are saying ;-)}
Maniac: I never had sex with someone and didn't know their
 name till the next morning.
{We all drink except HB afraid}
MomBabe: I never used tool, or vibrator during sex
{we all drink}
HBCaptHook: I never had sex with a cat?!
{we all look at her wierd.. no one drinks}
HBCaptHook: but it can happen, I saw it on video once!
{we look at her more strange, and make her drink for watching
the video}
HBAfraid: I cant think of any question
{we skip her, next girl}
..
Maniac: I never was tied/tied up my partner during sex
{Maniac, HB strict, HBCapthook and HBWhome all drink}

Maniac: I see, so who is "S", and who is "M" {explain to
 a couple clueless chicks which was which}
HBWhoMe and HBStrict are serious S type, Bichick is both.
HBStrict makes a pass at me, and I reply only if you are
serious.. she stares at me long (maybe a future there ;-) )
I shake hands and hug HBWhoMe, who is really into this
thread of questioning.

Mombabe now makes ajoke about why I went to lunch today
with this other chick (not in the game), and not her. I
tell her because she didn't ask me.. girls have to take
what they want, like that SP chick. I ask her if she
likes me, she says yes, and I gesture (and get) a cheek
kiss. I am CERTAIN I could have done a KC, or even one
of those 3way KCs, but I remember that this is an
experiment, and I do have to see all these people on Monday
again at work, so I dont push it.

now adminbabe (the dept head's secy) comes by our table
and asks how many of us are going to the prescheduled
after-party karaoke. Mombabe replies "none of us, we are
all going to a hotel".. HBCapthook adds in "a love hotel..".

[Final state: Dying to fuck: achieved]

Adminbabe looks at us wierd (she missed the whole thing),
and leaves. Mombabe now asks why I have such a harem tonight,
and then Bichick remarks how all the ladies in the office
really really like you Maniac.

I ask 'why?'
bichick says.. you smile, and laugh alot.. but there is
something else.. we all see it, but cant really
describe what it is {maniac opinion.. it is the way
I stare at chicks with the 'fuck me' luck, and all the
shoulder kino..etc, I do, even in the office}.

Supper now is wrapping up, we all have to go, I remark
that this table is fun, and that another night, we should
all meet again for beer and fun.. everyone agrees.

As we are going back, HBCaptHook and mombabe are grabbing
all over me, it was funny.

Some go home, and I split off from the group, as I have
a date with karatebabe at midnight in another part of
town..

Experiment over..

I learned that state transitioning is a very predictable,
reproduceable process, once you learn the tools to do it.
This was just my office staff that is around me, so made
a good subject for the experiment. I also realized, that
in groups, there is a sort of feed back effect, so you
can really accelerate things. It wasnt the alcohol because
HBstrict had nothing to drink, but was well into the
game too.

Because it was a group, I could skip steps "BVG,D,O" in
the ManiacPlan, and reach the last state.. (dying to fuck)
so I likely could have taken any (or all)
of those ladies back for a wild time in the sack (which I
wont do, because I work with them.. but there was nothing
stopping it, thats for sure)..

Fascinating..

Constructive Opinions/comments anyone?

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Doing proper ‘closes’

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website: 

http://www.pickupguide.com 

Many excellent followups to the Psychicbabe re-lay report!
Mrsex4unyc, RJ..etc..etc.

From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:05 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

In article <92jvre$obh$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, maniac_high@yahoo.com writes:

>The immediate gold to take care of this, is to now make the
>relationship very high stakes for her. I can do this because
>I know that she is into me (from what she said at the dinner),
>so the idea is to play it that if she doesnt do her job as a
>chick.. she will lose EVERYTHING as far as I am concern.
>Ok, that is the plan, here we go:

plan or no plan, essentially, you are telling her the truth.  on a long-enough
timeline, the survival rate for EVERYONE is ZERO.  sooner or later, everyone
you love will either leave you or die.  chicks don't seem to believe in this,
though it is the absolute truth.  they think that they can relate to you
FOREVER, REGARDLESS of what they do or how they act.  you are telling her HOW
she can REMAIN with you and what is going to get her EJECTED.  even though it
takes a long time, so it doesn't SEEM like this... this is what has happened to
EVERY chick's relationship that has gone away.  EVENTUALLY, she was not
fulfilling her womanly duties and her man left her for a   chick (younger,
sexier, richer, swallower...)  EVEN if she IS fulfilling her duties, if her man
like it from another chick MORE, she loses out either in a PERCENTAGE of her
benefits or she gets DUMPED and loses ALL of her benefits.  you are merely
explaining this to her and telling her what she needs to do IF she wants to be
with you... which you have already determined.  you are SELLING, and now you
are screening her to see if she is QUALIFIED and ABLE to buy.

>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations
>in relationship. 

I am getting to the point where I am going to do this.  I never do this with
chicks because I morph into whatever THEY are looking for and hook them that
way.  the thing for me is that being 10 months in with MLTR, she has REALLY
learned how to please me and the time I spend TEACHING her has become minimal
and the time I spend ENJOYING her is increasing :)  it is getting tougher and
tougher for other chicks to get my attention, because anything LESS than what I
have already is BULLSHIT to me.  the time I am spending talking to chicks is
mostly eliciting values and breaking their perceptions... just for fun :)  I
know IMMEDIATELY if I want sex from a chick, and if I don't, she is IMMEDIATELY
LJBF and I use her for practice and NEXT her at the end of the conversation.

I am seriously going to consider moving to a "demonstration of value -> SOI"
model, just because I have lost my patience with LISTENING to these bitches
talking about shit that really doesn't mean anything.  I know I am going to
NEXT them ANYWAY as soon as I realize they can't compete with MLTR, so why
listen to their shit FIRST?  I may as well let them know how great I am and
let them know what kind of woman I am willing to accept, and let them continue
from there.  there is also the cognitive dissonance issue of them KNOWING that
I am going to dump them if they are not sexy and CONTINUING to talk to me and
get to know me.  the more they talk to me, the more I hook them into
interacting with me.  the more they get hooked, the greater the PAIN OF
SEPERATION (credit: RJ) when they eventually get EJECTED.  since they KNOW
ahead of time what will get them ejected and they are still talking, they are
either planning to get in line OR setting themselves up for pain.  either way,
after SOI and their acceptance of the terms, there will have to be some sort of
TEST of their compliance.  even listening to what they have to say after SOI
counts as a REWARD for their entering into a "relationship" with me.  hmm... I
will consider this more.

>I go on to tell her that other girls I know also
>like me, ask me out alot, (doesn't matter if it is true or not,
>but chick 'competition logic' will kick in, and it will scare
>your mark to act). 

the reason I don't use this is that MLTR is an integral part of my life.  if I
were to play this "chicks dig me" card, it would belittle the actual
relationship I have with MLTR.  the only problem with THAT is that I am
screening for MORE MLTRs :)  I don't give a fuck about ONS because I can get
laid ANY NIGHT within an hour of talking to the chick I am talking to... in the
WAY I want to with a chick that I WANT TO FUCK :)  a chick offering me ONS is
like a chick offering me a dollar bill.  I already HAVE dollar bills... what do
I want hers for?  of course, there are some chicks that are just so HOT that
you want to try them out, but barring that scenario, ONS can bring you much
more ANGUISH than the satisfaction that accompanies it... PLUS it is the SAME
SATISFACTION that I already get on a regular basis from MLTR. 

besides... it is OBVIOUS that chicks dig me because here SHE is, liking me
within 20 minutes of meeting me... what about the chicks that have experienced
me for days?  months?  years?  OH, she could only HOPE to be one of those! :)

for you, it is a good tactic though.

>Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>her last week, apparently).

I lost a rap to a low-self-esteem bitch that had a couple of relationships like
this as well.  I mean, I fucked her, but I didn't get to MLTR like I wanted
because she was SCARED that she wouldn't match up to the next bitch and that I
would NEXT her for no reason, like her exes did.  I tried to tell her I wanted
her for more than that, but she wasn't emotionally healthy enough to understand
or believe me.

>Ok, now Maniac has reached her head, and I take this deeper..
>I go on to tell her that I dont want just sex, I want rocks and gold
>I can get any girl in roppongi on a Saturday night and fuck her
>(not exactly true, but she doesnt know this.. goal is just to

she KNOWS that it happened to her VERY QUICKLY.  she ASSUMES she was not the
ONLY bitch to fall for you that quickly.  it is like reverse-social-proof. 
fucking a bitch FAST makes them think you can fuck other bitches FAST.

>'confirm' her worst fears so that she acts), but its not enough for
>me. I want connection, good sex, and romance, with an intelligent
>woman, and that is why I want to date you (psychicbabe).

nice line.  this is another thing I will consider.  talking-up MLTR to them.  
I never considered this either, MAINLY because if you tell a chick what you
want her to do then you never know if she is manipulating you by being that
way, or if she arrived there NATURALLY... on her own.  interesting, LOTS of
style-change material happening right around the new year :)

>Then all of the sudden, she asks me about HBass (the chick staying
>at my place over the holidays), and freaks out about it. I tell
>her that she already knows all this, and exactly what is her point
>here?

although I am a GREAT fan of "quoting", I find that there need to be times to
engage in it and times to NOT engage in it.  this will depend on what you want
with the chick.  it is the same way you can't go from being a CHUMP to a MAN in
a chick's eyes... but you CAN go from being a MAN into a CHUMP :)  if you start
out telling a chick that you have a girlfriend AND that you fuck her, you leave
yourself open for these pot-shots whenever chicks trip the fuck out and go into
their irrational rants from out of left-field.  all a bitch needs to know is
that you are "taken" so that you manage her relationship expectations.  any
more information and she feels like you will give her ALL the information. 
where does it stop?  are you going to tell her that you are fucking her?  that
you fucked her last night?  that you fucked her an hour before coming on this
date?  that you fucked YOUR WOMAN in her ass?  that she LIKES sucking dick? 
WHERE DOES IT STOP?

I ran into this problem with a chick where my relationship to her was BASED ON
trading current sex-stories.  when I got to the point where I didn't want to
tell her any more shit, she was EXPECTING me to tell her, and I realized that
if I wasn't telling her, and she wasn't telling me, then our "relationship" was
OVER.  before that, I had not realized how much I had compromised my position
by telling her CURRENT sex-shit.  think about it, and decide on your own LIMITS
to what you are willing to tell a chick about other chicks... besides, think
about the fact that she is going to KNOW that she will end up as STORIES to
other bitches right after you fuck her.  it will make her VERY self-conscious
about whatever she does with you and that could hinder her emotional states
tremendously.

>Then she stops again, and asks me if I am fucking her (maybe I
>should have said no..., but I had already said yes to her about this
>the first time I saw her)., she asks me why.. (I tell her because
>I am seeing her! like I told you the first time! I mean what do
>you expect?!?).
>
>She then puts on her bitch face, and talks in a stern voice,
>"then call me when you break her up, that is my decision, I am
>going home.".

THIS is retarded because she ALREADY knew that you were fucking her AND she
fucked you herself.  this is another problem with bitches having information
about other bitches.  they use it against themselves.  IMO, the purpose of her
knowing you have another girl or SEVERAL other girls is so she knows where she
stands in the RACE to be your MAIN BITCH.  if you are single, she has a good
chance at being that to you.  if you are "taken" she has NO CHANCE of being
that to you.  if you are SEEING bitches, then she has to COMPETE to be your #1.
 other than THAT, I think giving information about your other bitches is a
mistake...  I have made the SAME mistake up to this point, so I am not
crisicizing :)  however, I am changing that ASAP and I think you should
consider giving out information on a N2K basis (need to know).

besides, SHE is the one that NEEDS a fuck.  if it is not coming from YOU, a guy
she has fucked ALREADY and she LIKES how you did it or she wouldn't have come
back... she has to get it from a STRANGER whose sexual skills are in question
that might tie her up, fuck her in the ass or sell her to the highest bidder. 
bitches like to FRONT a lot about having ALL these sexual choices, but with all
the 8s, 9s, and 10s I have spoken to on an honest "one of the chicks" level,
they are ALL looking to have an EXCITING time, but not REALLY be in DANGER! 
you, OTOH have pussy AT HOME IN BED WAITING FOR YOU!  the only one to lose out
if she bails... is HER!  knowing that, I would have not even entertained her
bullshit OR called her on it, letting her know that I was getting laid tonight
REGARDLESS of whether SHE fucks or not.  that would take the fucking WIND out
of her sails :)

>I tell her I am planning to break her up (which is true) later, so
>it is nothing you should worry about. 

this, my friend :)  is a COP-OUT!  it is used VERY EFFECTIVELY by married men
to keep fucking their side-bitches, but WE are way above bullshit tactics like
this.  I commend you for thinking of this "on the fly", but PLEASE, PLEASE! 
hehe  I have MUCH more respect for you as a PUA than to hear some CRAP like
this from you :)  PLEASE think of something better for the next instance of a
chick trying to BLACKMAIL you into trading in a R-E-L-A-T-I-O-N-S-H-I-P where
you are getting EVERYTHING you want from a chick... for a ONS with HER! 
HAHAHAHAHAHA  >:)

I haven't run into a chick STUPID enough to try to disrespect my MLTR for being
with me... chicks have STARTED to say she is dumb for "letting" (as if she has
ANY say in the matter) her man fuck other chicks, and I have BROKEN THEIR
FUCKING ASSES listing the benefits that SHE is getting that they will most
likely NEVER have with a man... EVER!  and CERTAINLY don't have right now, or
they would not be talking to me in a bar... they would be with THEIR OWN MAN
conducting this FANTASY RELATIONSHIP that they are professing that my MLTR
should have :)  I have NEVER run into a chick that has even TRIED to break into
my relationship with MLTR because they KNOW I mean business.  all they can do
is become ANOTHER MLTR... and after they hear the QUALIFICATIONS, they KNOW
they can't even achieve THAT... only ONS and LJBF with me.  if some bitch EVER
suggested that I break up with MLTR in order to ONS her, I would  A) laugh in
her face and  B) immediately demand an EXPLANATION of the reasons why she
thinks she can knock MLTR out of the box AND make her perform ANY AND ALL
SKILLS that she CLAIMS to be better than MLTR at IMMEDIATELY!  put up or SHUT
THE FUCK UP!  the result would be the ONS ANYWAY, and she would still be LJBF
or NEXT because MLTR is NOT about sex... it is about compatability and I
PERSONALLY could not be with some bitch that needs to knock other chicks off in
order to gain status.  I gain status by BEING MYSELF and letting bitches make
INTELLIGENT, EDUCATED decisions to be with me.  any chick that wants to be with
me had better do the same.

>she gets upset, and starts
>screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
>just like her ex-bf, getting other girls while dating her, and how
>all guys just want sex..etc..

I would have told her "you wanna calm the fuck down?"  throwing tantrums and
making scenes are expressions of her ability to do ANYTHING in your presence. 
I personally don't tolerate that.

>Then she says.. ok, if you let me meet your GF at your house
>tonight, then I will let you have sex with me. [ha! I got her!]

ok.  thank God I happened to read the next line before I started typing this. 
I was JUST going to ask you WHY you are STILL letting her blackmail you into
fucking her... ESPECIALLY when she is the one that needs it and you don't :)

>I bounce back, and say, "what exactly makes you think I am
>desperate to have sex with you tonight?! Do you think I am
>just some stupid guy and you can manipulate me like that?
>No, you will not meet my GF, it is disrespectful to her to do
>that. You know the situation, it was clear to you from the
>beginning, and you accepted it. There is no more to talk about.
>I am not here only for sex, I can get that anywhere. Sex only
>of itself is of little value to me, I want more than that.

SWEET!  :)  break her fucking ASS maniac :)

>I then bring out the nuclear weapons! My tonality is very firm,
>and I eye fuck her, while telling her the following. First, I tell
>her that I already told her about my GF, she was clear about it
>right from the start, and she has NO excuse. Then I go on to tell
>her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
>that did NOT happen. So do NOT compare me to your ex. I am a
>different person, and EXCEPT better treatment than that if you
>ever want to see me again. She starts crying more, and hugging
>again.

ugh :/   fucking IDIOTS!   man, the shit some bitches put you through!  does
everyone SEE why we have to study this shit?

>I put her against wall, and tell her not to complain about me like
>I am her ex, I a am different person than he is.
>
>I tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>alone!

this is a good point.  I like to play it the other way:

ok... so now, you have told me that you want everything to be a 'perfect'
situation with a guy before making a move.  You want him to be ideal with
women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady... WHAT MAKES YOU THINK
HE WILL WANT YOU?   WHAT ARE YOU BRINGING TO THE TABLE THAT IS GOING TO MAKE A
MAN LIKE THAT CHOOSE YOU OVER ANY OTHER CHICK?

you wanna see some confusion?  you wanna see a bitch get BROKEN?  HAHAHAHA  >:)
 of course, I use this on chicks that I am just practicing on, because it
normally induces DEPRESSION, not horniness.  when they have to GO DEEP INSIDE
and dive BELOW THE SURFACE of their programming, they realize that they CAN NOT
TELL ME WHY A MAN WOULD WANT THEM!  they stall the fuck out dude :)  it's
amazing.  matter of fact, it's documented already.  look at my recent thread
with "telembe".  I let her say all this bullshit about what she wanted from a
guy in order to give up her virginity, then when she was finished talking about
what she WANTED, I asked her what she was OFFERING to a guy that was going to
give her all this committment and "love" and other bullshit and she said a
whole bunch of shit that ANY bitch can and WILL give to a man she likes.  she
might have THOUGHT she had something to offer a guy that was going to seperate
her from the pack, but she doesn't.  even GOOD PUSSY can't get a bitch any
credit because there are LOTS of bitches that can fuck and suck like pros...
elites AND sub-elites.  telembe NEVER told us what seperates her from the rest
of the bitches that might make a MAN like the one she wants even LOOK HER WAY! 
the reason is that there is NO reason! :)  bitches are programmed that MEN want
them... but they are NEVER told WHY.  the reason is that men like to FUCK and
get their dicks sucked.  they also like companionship and cooking and cleaning
and for a girl to look good on their arm so they can feel accomplished around
their buddies.  chicks THINK they are ENTITLED to a good man... but the GOOD
MEN... are picking GOOD WOMEN!  if they were SHINING like they think they are,
they would have been scooped up already and married or whatever they were
looking for because some guy would have spotted her and said "I'm not going to
let her go for ANYTHING" and she would be happy... at least according to her
programming.  OH, how I LOVE to see a bitch's face while she TRIES AND TRIES to
dig up ANY reason why a guy as great as the one she claims to want would EVER
choose her over any other bitch :)  the JOY the JOY that I feel as this POMPOUS
BITCH breaks the fuck down RIGHT IN FRONT OF MY FACE! :)  of course since I
broke her, I keep talking to her and ease her back to a decent state of being
and let her know that she can take steps to make herself into the woman that a
man would want, but she has to really KNOW HERSELF and KNOW MEN in order to
make an intelligent decision.  I am not into depressing chicks... unless they
TRULY DESERVE IT for all the depression they have caused men throughout their
tenure as FINE bitches :)  also, I have no desire to BREAK bitches and leave
them like that.  that just makes it WORSE for ALL OF US looking for FINE, yet
DECENT chicks.

>she cries, and says that is so true, that is her problem, she never
>takes the chance and loses out because she doesn't make the
>move on taken guys. Then I run my 'take chances routine' (if you take
>a chance, in the end, the result is usually good, but if you don't,
>just you get left behind, by yourself).. 

nice.  I like that one... emphasizing loss and loneliness.

>she cries more, says she
>needs to take the chance, and doesnt want to be alone.

she's done :)  nice work.  land her!

>She says she has to be careful, that all guys want just sex, and
>bitches about this for about 30 seconds.

as opposed to what?  what does she WANT guys to want?

>Now I start the 'you need me, I dont need you..you think I just want
>only sex, then you dont understand me at all.. if you think that is
>what I am only, then you do NOT deserve me.. I do no need you to go out
>with me if that is what you think I am.. I want connection, sex,
>passion, and closeness.. and if you haven't figured that out about
>me yet, then get another guy, because you dont understand me at all..

OK OK OK... you've CONVINCED me maniac :)  that's some good shit right there :)
 starting NOW, I am pitching for MLTR ONLY.  bitches that want ONS or LJBF will
get what they deserve from me... which isn't much.  I LOVE this idea of dissing
her for claiming that you are looking for ONS... or even just a "bootie-call"
type relationship :)  I love it.  I would feel so PROUD getting on her like
this.  sweet!  EXTREMELY congruent!  nice play!  this is going into my style,
starting RIGHT NOW!  :)

>I am doing this, because I know the left (logic) and right (emotions,
>passion) are fighting each other..they have been all night. Because the
>left doesn't accept the logic of the situation, but I know the right side
>dying for a shag,..she is trying to rationaize going out with a taken guy,
>but I have gotten her so excited tonight, that she needs that fuck.

THIS is the reason I never learned any of this shit until recently.  my
caveman-kino style before this involved ZERO talking.  totally kino and kissing
and PHYSICAL seduction with domineering EYE-CONTACT.  there was NO INFORMATION
for the left side to process at all.  EVERYTHING went STRAIGHT to the chick's
right side, and her left had to try to process the EMOTIONS and turn them into
a story that she could understand... in the meantime, she is PHYSICALLY falling
for the kino and wanting MORE AND MORE until we are fucking.  I never HAD to
talk to chicks before OR after fucking them because my PHYSICAL ATTACK is so
DEVASTATING!  I would just take them over PHYSICALLY and their right brains
would do ALL the work and the left would struggle to understand, but eventually
succumb to the onslaught!  ARG ARG! :)

thanks for explaining that to me :)

>As I touch her side of face, she goes doggy look, I kiss her, and she
>gets like screambabe, panting. I put leg between her, she widens, goes nuts
>totally. I ask her she likes me (in a tell her sort of way' you like me..'),
>she replies 'yes'. I say (stare her down) .. she asks "what should I do?"
>I say in a very strn fatherly voice while staring her down 4 inches from
>her head.. you will follow me..that is what you will do.. and you will do
>what I say. 'she says, 'I will'. I tongue her down more, run her crotch,
>she almost cums right there, then I take her to a love hotel (her first
>time!), no resistance what so ever.

interesting.  what just happened here?  did you somewhere dictate to her that
the terms of her being "your bitch" is that she has to sumbit to you fully? 
are you getting a verbal confirmation of that from her?  or is something else
going on... like she just plain UNDERSTANDS that you can move her to passions
that make her WANT to cum and that you are going to take her there and over the
edge?

another point... what do you guys think of foreplay on a chick.  he mentions
that she almost came right there... do you think it is good to get her to the
EDGE and leave her there so she is so horny, she will do ANYTHING for you to
make her cum, OR to give her an orgasm right there in her clothes to
demonstrate your sexual mastery over her?  personally, I am into the sexual
mastery thing because I notice a newfound RESPECT from a chick that has had
guys on top of her NAKED, fucking her for all they were worth and she never
came from it, and then I am just doing kino on her and fingering her and she
cums from just that.  do you think that making the chick cum on herself makes
her want sex MORE or want it LESS since she just got off?  take into account
that chicks are multi-orgasmic and that they feel sexier after cumming, not
DRAINED like guys.

>As I am fucking her, I am putting things in her head, like D.Shades reports.
>I tell her as she is screaming it feels deeper and deeper, closer and
>closer. She is going nuts will I am fucking her.

I need to reasearch this.  is this more right-brain, left-brain shit where her
left-brain is shut down because of the FIREWORKS that are going off in her mind
because of the sex, leaving her wide open to suggestion?  if you have any links
for this, please post.

>I stare her down, and I tell her you need me (during sex), she says yes.
>I tell her from now on you will follow me, and do what I say. She says
>'yes, I will'. I continue doing her, she says "it feels SO good, I really
>need that, I really want it, i love you inside me!".. she is fucking like a
>wild animal, loud voice, shouting and screaming, oh, I want it, give it
>to me, I want to come!

more of the same?

>Then she tells me anything is ok as long as I dont hate her..she doesnt
>want me to hate her. She wants me to hold/hug her, she cries a bit, then is
>ok again (seems to be thinking of her old bf she says). I touch her
>more, face goes totally doggy look, and finger her, she goes nuts, we start
>fucking again.

the "I don't want you to hate me" thing is very important in the D/s
relationship... not that you set this up like that, but that is the MAIN
incentive for her to follow your lead... that she does NOT want you to hate her
and CERTAINLY not to banish her.  when that is TRULY first and foremost in her
brain, she will regulate HERSELF and place herself in-line with your thinking
and what YOU want her to be.  she also won't try to blackmail you anymore
because she KNOWS it gets on your nerves and all THAT will do is get her
EJECTED sooner rather than later :)

>Her back is on the bed, and I am fucking her missionary, her legs are
>spread and wide in the air, which I am holding. I tell her "see, I control
>you, 

hehe ok... this is a little FAR-FETCHED for me at this point, but I have not
researched it yet :)  I DO like the next line though.

>I go deep in your body because it is the one way to reach you totally
>deep in your mind which no one else can do. 

interesting

>By conquering your body, I can
>conquer your mind (then I drill her a bit more after I finish the sentence so
>she goes more crazy). I play with your body because it lets me control
>your mind (then drill her some more..ha, it is like the ultimate form of
>reward hypnosis).

IS there such a thing as reward hypnosis?  links please? :)

>I ask her, so why you like me. She says she says, you are decisive and
>sometimes I am indecisive, so you make it easy for me. I want the guy
>to make it easy for me to decide what to do (important clue here Maniac!
>maybe most chicks are like this! Maybe this too is where I fucked up
>with HB Geek!)

I have heard this a lot too... only thing is that there is a lot of
RESPONSIBILITY that comes with telling a chick what to do, and if the VALUE of
owning her is not sufficient for me, I don't give a fuck WHAT she does enough
to want to lead her to a good time.

>Moral of the story.. keep your ground.. call all chick bullshit DIRECTLY.
>Make the chick risk fear losing the relationship if she doesn't capitulate
>and chances are she will back down, in spite of how it looks (and I could
>do this BECAUSE I had other choices.. another reason to be fucking
>several chicks at once). As well, it seemed that she was giving me all the
>bullshit in part because she WANTED me to call her on it, and then fuck her
good
>at the end of the night, which I obliged.

chicks give you shit-tests to find out if you are stronger than them and see
HOW you are going to control them.  chicks like the way I control them because
I NARROW their choices for them, but STILL make them choose.  they can choose
the path of ULTIMATE SATISFACTION, or they can choose the path of EJECTION and
being back on the dating scene meeting the SAME LAME GUYS every night :)

you had told her you had a girlfriend, but she seems to have NEEDED to know
that she really COULDN'T have you all to herself and that you really DIDN'T
NEED to fuck her that night or EVER.  you stuck to your guns (after letting her
get to you for a while :-) and she eventually ran out of logic and got
overridden with kino and gave up the fucking pussy like she came there to do :)

>Constructive comments/opinions welcome!
>
>Maniac High
>http://www.pickupguide.com

EXCELLENT!  keep up the GOOD WORK dude!  :)

---
From: erosla77@aol.com (ErosLA77)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 30 Dec 2000 20:12:47 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

>Subject: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit
special!]
>From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
>Date: Fri, Dec 29, 2000 10:37 PM
>Message-id: <92jvre$obh$1@nnrp1.deja.com>

>)this chick is a very highly educated, driven, professional
> career woman and earns likely a big 6 figure salary
>b)she is very mature, focused and spends all day in her office
> surrounded by sharks and other pirrhana type scumbag characters

 She's got to be in control ALL DAY LONG at work. Small wonder then, with a
man, she wants to fully SURRENDER control and be made to submit.  It's like all
those super-powerful Congressmen and Judges and the like who LOVE going to get
pissed-on and whipped by some Madame Dominatrix. 

>I regroup my thoughts.

 I admire your ability to do this in the field, Maniac. As you think about it,
what do you do internally to re-set yourself and keep yourself in a good frame
of mind when all this shit throws your way?

>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations

   Metahpor is a POWERFUL tool to move folks from a fixed perception to a new
one. Please, share your story!

> Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>her last week, apparently).

Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with fucking; it feels
good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the vulnerabilities.  So
when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which overcomes the
potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. She's worried about pain,
so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not only losing
out on the pleasure of screwing, BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out that if
she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even WORSE
crack-up.

  Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.

>he gets upset, and starts
>screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
>just like her ex-bf,

See? The fear of the pain of being hurt just like her ex-BF hurt her is now
rearing its ugly head.  She doesn't seem like a very emotionally stable person
in ANY event, let alone having just been dumped by a guy.  

>Then I go on to tell
>her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
>that did NOT happen

 Sharp thinking. Again, what do you do internally to keep your state solid and
your thinking sharp? THAT process internally is of great value, even more than
the specifics you share.  The specifics are like handing guys fish; good for a
nice meal and of value. But  how you get to the mind-set is TEACHING someone
HOW to fish so they can eat for life. 

>I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>alone!

 Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to her her
"ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she can then
accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!  

   Excellent...Maniac, I don't give a damn WHAT my orthodox SS followers say,
this is BRILLIANT stuff and I'd be proud to be your wing or have you as mine,
ANY FUCKIN' DAY of the week! Sir, I salute you!

>Now what I am doing with all the above, is not arguing the logic (too
>much)
>of this, because, of course she is right, and I know this.

 Actually, you ARE not arguing the logic, but you are USING the logic...HER
logic..HER way of viewing things.....pointing out WHY and HOW she loses and
what will happen if she doesn't stop it.   It's all centered around losing and
WHY she loses, based on what she has told you.  It IS logical, FROM her point
of view.  

 Great, Great stuff...sir, I salute you!

-----

From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]
Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2000 12:03:54 GMT

Replies to various people about psychicbabe:

Answers to various questions:

Was psychicbabe british, or Japanese?
She was a brit of Japanese ancestry (ie. she
looked 'j', but thought, acted and had an
english accent like a brit). This in my
opinion made it harder, because brit women
are so fucking F A T, and she was so
slender, sexy and attractive (and she dressed
to kill) compared to all of them. Lots of guys were
hitting on her (and she said she always got hit
on, and hated it.. trick was to not make it look
like a 'hit').

Why not a white chick? Well, I had the chance...
but.. at the conference where I met her, EVERY
brit. white chick there was in serious blimp bulge
territory.. very scary. Why is it so many caucasian
women are so FAT?

It was funny though, because something like 8 guys
(I counted) tried to hit on psychicbabe the night
I PU'd her. One guy was pretty good, the rest were
total AFC's..it was rather funny.

Re: Rocks -vs- gold.. how I use it (yes, it is
Jake's metephor. For RJ, search the original post
on fastseduction.com. It is also on pickupguide.com
someplace (if not it will be there in about 2 weeks,
I am revising the page this week). Basically, I intro
it as follows:
After chick says bullshit about wanting to go to
dinner and be friends or shit for 6 months before
becoming a GF, I say: Actually, I dont go to dinner
or stuff like that with ladies who are not my GF
CHick:  gasps!
Maniac: see, going to dinner, is an important step
in a relationship for me. I only share it with someone
special
chick: Huh?
Maniac: Well, let me put it this way, do you ever
sleep with a guy who is just your friend, or dont
care about?
chick: of course not!
Maniac: well, why do you think a guy should do any
different then?
Maniac: See, let me tell you a story. You ever hear
about 'rocks & gold'?
chick: no? what is it?
Maniac: Well, Relationships are valuable things.
And each partner is looking for something. It is like
diamonds (rocks) and gold. Both are valuable.

But women prefer diamonds to gold (usually), and
men prefer gold to diamonds (usually). Of course,
both are important, especially in a long term
relationship, but if a woman could choose, she would
prefer the diamonds  first, and the man would
prefer the gold  first. right?

chick: yeah, probably

Maniac: And (generally), a man can accept gold
without the diamonds, and a woman can accept
diamonds without any gold.

So in a relationship, a woman is mining for
diamonds, while the man is mining for gold.
While they are in the mine together, the
guy gives diamonds he finds to the woman, and
the woman gives the gold she finds, to the man.

But if you give a woman gold only, or a man
diamonds only.. neither is likely to be
very happy, and the relationship will soon
fall apart. In short, an exchange of sorts
takes place in a successful relationship.

And also, if a man expects just gold (sex),
but doesnt want to give her diamonds
(relationship & the mushy stuff), then she
will dump him fairly soon, because he is
playing/using her just for sex..

And if a woman expects just diamonds (walks,
attention, nice dinners, movies..etc) without
giving some gold (sex), then he (if he has any
clue about how to deal with women, though many
men do not, especially in North America) will
dump her because she is using/playing him just
for his personality.

A guy taking a chick to dinners, buying shit
and giving nice walks without sex is THE SAME
as a guy sleeping with a girl, and then kicking her
out right after the fuck is over. (chick says:
'yelch!'. Yes, thats right, and for the guy,
just dinners and buying shit is 'yelch', with
no sex, and no attention is exactly the same.

Because a woman will go to free dinner with
almost any guy, it has no value to me. But
I am like you, I want attention, and I want
to be made to feel special.

And although a girl will go to nice free dinners
with almost anyone, I also know that a girl will
not sleep with anyone. So I know if she does with me,
then it means she thinks I am important. And if
she wont, then it means she doesnt care about me
at all, so I really dont need to see her again,
I will just go find another girl.

Maybe you might think it is unusual for a guy
to think this way, but it is just my way.

See, I dont want to be played. Guys are always
getting played by girls for nice dinners, long
talks on the phone, and for their personalities.
It is the SAME as a girl being used for sex.
So I am happy to give plenty her diamonds, but at
the same time, I dont want to be played, so
I also expect her to want to give me gold.
And if she doesn't, it means she doesnt care about
me, is using me, or it means I am being played,
or I am stupid.

As well, experience has also showed me that
'friends first' almost NEVER results in a
relationship. I mean how many of your BFs were
your friend first (chick usually replies..uh,
zero).

Exactly, so that is why I never play 'friends
first'. Friends first means diamonds for the
lady, and no gold for the guy. That is like
the guy saying (ok, lets fuck for 6 months,
and if its good, we can go to dinner, and go
out, and you can be my GF). Would you like
that (chick: yelch!!).

Exactly.. so that is why it is far better,
that the lady meet me, get to know me, and
then I expect her to be smart enough to know
to take that chance THEN (or reject it, and I will
go get another lady) when it is offered to her.

So that is why I expect things that way in a
relationship with a lady.

After this, a chick is (usually) quite impressed,
or surprised and doesnt know what to say..

[When I recited this to psychicbabe, she actually told me
she was very impressed, that I understood relationships
so well ;-) ]

Had I been smart, I would have used it on HB
geek, and laid her, but after that failure I
thought about it, and then when the same situation
came up with Psychicbabe this week, I knew what
to do..

Ok, now on to other comments..

RJ writes
>Maniac writes:
> >I regroup my thoughts.
>
>  I admire your ability to do this in the field, Maniac. As you think
about it,
> what do you do internally to re-set yourself and keep yourself in a
good frame
> of mind when all this shit throws your way?

A couple things.. first, this PARTICULAR chick is of no importance
to me, because I am (likely) seeing 3 others this week. So it is
not as risky to me to be firm, and keep my ground.

Another important fact, is the way chick's brains are usually
wired. For a
chick, once she likes a given guy, it is hard for her to immediately
switch to another guy. it is far MORE risky, because a chick (unlike
men), usually cannot switch to another guy, once she ALREADY
likes a given guy (story is different BEFORE you got her to
like you..then SHE has more power than you).

So I play on this, and as a result I dont feel nervous/scared at all,
because there is far more to risk to her, than to risk to me. Because
she is stuck to me, but I am not stuck to her. (this also is why
'jerks' can get away with so much shit on any given chick, and why
she will tolerate it.. because her brain has now got her focussed
on THAT guy, and it is now a choice (in her mind), between him (and
his bullshit... or being alone (sure she can get another guy in 10
minutes, but she cannot build those nice feelings of 'attachment'
in 10 minutes.. that gives us men power, once we realize this).

Two, I am generally a very balanced level
headed person, and dont take any of this personally (as you already
know, RJ). Three (in this case), I had
already laid this chick, so I didnt care really if I laid her again
or not.. I already conquered her, and she (and I) already knew that.

If it is a new chick, sometimes, I get more nervous/fucked up (see
HB Geek). I am trying to keep my senses more when this happens

> > Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
> >problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
> >her last week, apparently).
>
> Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with
fucking; it feels

Not sure about this, I think she just simply wanted the fuck, but
wanted to feel she was important to me, and she didnt want to just
get played..

> good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the
vulnerabilities.  So
> when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which
overcomes the
> potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. She's worried
about pain

yes, thats right.

> so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not
only losing
> out on the pleasure of screwing,

Not really. I actually made it clear to her that I didnt care if
she bang me or not. The point was that she had to give her mind
to me, and respect me, and follow me (whether that is bang me,
make her take off her clothes in the window for me, or do my
dishes..whatever.. its not the banging that is important, it is
the submission to me that counts, and what she needs to give me
if she wants my attention at all).

> BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
> believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out
that if
> she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even
WORSE
> crack-up.

Yes

>   Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.
>
> >he gets upset, and starts
> >screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
> >just like her ex-bf,
>
> See? The fear of the pain of being hurt just like her ex-BF hurt her
is now
> rearing its ugly head.  She doesn't seem like a very emotionally
stable person
> in ANY event, let alone having just been dumped by a guy.

No, she is not stable at all. I think though, it is because she
bottles it up all day, to be the 'office bitch' that she has to
be in the daytime. This chick lives for her work. She has no other
life.

>
> >Then I go on to tell
> >her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
> >that did NOT happen
>
>  Sharp thinking. Again, what do you do internally to keep your state
solid and
> your thinking sharp? THAT process internally is of great value, even
more than
> the specifics you share.  The specifics are like handing guys fish;
good for a
> nice meal and of value. But  how you get to the mind-set is TEACHING
someone
> HOW to fish so they can eat for life.

Actually, the specifics are important I think. This is why lay/field
reports with details are so important. I think really shitty on my
feet. I really suck.. bad.

But if I have had that same experience before (with another chick),
or been in that same situation before, and
either succeeded (or failed, and then thought about how to handle it
right the next time), then I will handle it correctly this time.

I really believe in field experience. I have alot... really alot.
so I have seen many of these situations before. It is like chess,
or a foreign language. If you've been there before, and worked out
a solution, then you know what to do. You MUST get field experience.
It is CRUCIAL. And each time you fail, you go home, and see what
you did right/wrong, and what you would do if the same situation
happened again. This is why I also post the fuckup as well as
the lay reports.. they are very valuable to me in gathering my
thoughts and forcing me to think about what I did right/wrong,
as well as listening to the other's comments about them on this
NG.

I also look at the other's reports as well, and learn about
situations, and ask myself for each one, if it happened to me,
what would I do/how would I handle it. Eventually, after doing it
for a couple years (I have been at this in ernest for about 2
years now), you get better at it. Learning situations in PU, is
like learning the words of a foreign language, and how to connect
them all together.. how to move from a bad situation..to a good
one to get the chick in a horny state..

Also, I keep in mind alot about what MrSex4uNYC says about attitude,
and when I get stuck, I ask myself, what would NYC tell me right
now about this situation. He is very congruent, and if you think
things this way, it is easy to be clear what is the right way or
wrong way.

> >I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
> >with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
> >with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
> >and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
> >unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
> >alone!
>
>  Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to
her her
> "ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she
can then
> accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!

Yes, basically that is the idea. I am not sure that it means I am
an authority, but its more, to convey that she is clueless, she
is wrong, so to listen to herself will make her fuck up even more..
..so maybe she had better listen to me instead, and then she wont
fuckup as much.. basically that is the idea..

>    Excellent...Maniac, I don't give a damn WHAT my orthodox SS
followers say,

I didn't get this.. What are orthodox SS followers, and I had no
idea they were saying anything about this.. I really dont understand
what you mean here..

> >Now what I am doing with all the above, is not arguing the logic (too
> >much)
> >of this, because, of course she is right, and I know this.
>
>  Actually, you ARE not arguing the logic, but you are USING the
logic...HER
> logic..HER way of viewing things.....pointing out WHY and HOW she
loses and
> what will happen if she doesn't stop it.   It's all centered around
losing and
> WHY she loses, based on what she has told you.  It IS logical, FROM
her point
> of view.

Yes, basically that is the idea. What I meant was, is that her main
point is that she wants a monogamous BF, and doesn't want to be played.
But, I am playing her, and she (at some level) realizes that, so
in essense, her gut feel about this is totally correct.

But I am playing her desire for the fuck, and her fear of losing
out, which lets me bypassing her gut feel that she is being
played, and then I can get her to fuck anyways.

Good followups everyone!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

-----

From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]
Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2001 12:10:23 GMT

  "Dohn Joe"  wrote:
>  wrote in message news:92n7b9$146
$1@nnrp1.deja.com...
> [snip]
>
> The more I think of it, the more this seems to be a great PU.
> I think the PU in England is the gist of your piece of work.
>o I'd be glad to see more
> details on how you picked her up in England, that's the hardest work. How
> did you stand up the crowd? How did you make it not look like a PU?

I was using psychological 'jujitsu' (use the strength of your
opponant, against themself). There is a field report from 2 months
ago, that outlines the PU (check fastseduction.com archives).
Basically, I met her at a conference. I didnt talk to her much.
Then I followed her onto a bus that was taking us to the next
meeting place. A guy was hitting on her, and he sat with her.
I sat on the seat in front bymyself.

She (like most british bitches), started complaining about how
she hates men, and other bullshit. The guy on the bus with her
is taking this/agreeing with it (if I remember right).

I just turned around (and tonality and eye contact here is crucial),
and just tell her in a VERY authoritative voice, slowly.. "perhaps
you have just not met the right man yet, one you understands you,
deeply, and completely. But.. you never know the future.. now do you..
I used killed eye contact, spoke slowly, and continued "perhaps
if you open your mind more, you might find him.. by surprise, without
even expecting it, because often, that is the way it usually is..see"

Psychicbabe went "maybe", and then started more manhating bitching.

I then described the kind of man she wanted "one you could rely on,
but at the same time, be mysterious, and exciting in some unexpected
ways, because he just knew how to reach you deep inside you, and
your mind.. that is what your looking for..isnt' it?"

Psychicbabe: yes,

{continue PU, bunches of stuff from the ManiacPlan, if I remember
right}

The key here was the tonality and Eye-Fuck contact. That is what
did it more than the words I used. I just totally crushed her
with it..

> How did
> you get past her "bitch office" shield? I'm asking especially because, as I
> picture this woman, it would seem pretty intimidating for me to approach
> her.

I had the attitude that she obviously had never met a man that
knew how to give it to her right, which means that she obviously
needed ME far more than I needed her. That mindset made it easy.

> I admire your ability to take her from there into total submission.
> existing relationship than guys. That's why many (even HOT ones) find
> themselves in a dead end - boring or abusive - relationship, love to
> complain about it to whoever they find to listen, yet are unable to step out

EXACTLY!!

> of it. That's why the first fuck is hard - after that she is bound
> emotionally to you. You see,

>Women's sexuality is DISSOLVED in them.

Yes! you understand it!! (true for most, but not all chicks though,
some just like sport fucking, like we do)

> GREAT words to remember for all us RAFCs when we feel like beating the walls
> after a fuckup... I myself am so darn depressed when coming back after an
> unsuccessful encounter with a chick. Yes, each field experience is one more
> lesson

Yes, do NOT underestimately field experience. It is SO important.
I fucked up TONS (see all the fuckup reports I used to post a couple
years ago on ASF), and I still fuckup alot (see HBGeek, or HockeyBabe).
Over on cliff's list they say it takes 2..4 years to get good
at something, and 10 years to be a master. I TOTALLY agree.
I have only been at this for 2.. 2 1/2 years. And the more I learn,
the more I realize I still need to learn.. There is still TONS that
I dont know yet.

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

----
From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:08 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

I, for one, am really GLAD to see a post from RJ that has helped me move
forward in MY game :)  not that I am an ingrate hehe... his contribution to all
this is UNDENIABLE to begin with and if I hadn't stumbeled onto his site, I
would have still been using my caveman tactics and my MENTAL seduction game
would still be lacking.  as much as I appreciate his contribution to the
seduction game in general, I had been disappointed with all the flaming and
nonsense that he and others had/have been involved with because I thought that
this NG was BASED on USEFUL interaction between him and the rest of us, but I
found that not to be the case :(  not that ANYONE gives a fuck what I have to
say about this, but I wanted to back up into the PAST to make it clear that I
appreciate RJ's PERSONAL contribution to the NG TODAY.

In article <20001230151247.26801.00001467@ng-fi1.aol.com>, erosla77@aol.com
(ErosLA77) writes:

>>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations
> 
>   Metahpor is a POWERFUL tool to move folks from a fixed perception to a new
>one. Please, share your story!

I have been doing this without identifying it:

A) find out her perception (marriage, monogamy, sucking dick VS kissing...)
B) "quote" her a story illustrating a chick that saw things a DIFFERENT way
(the way I want HER to see things) and benefitted GREATLY from it (she is still
with me, she got married to the guy she wanted, she gained inner peace and
self-love...)
C) watch her AGREE with something that she just minutes ago BELIEVED was
incorrect, or not for her.

the most fascinating part is (C) because I didn't realize my powers of
validation, pacing then LEADING had developed so strongly.  this is partially
because I am an empath and can FEEL when a chick moves into different emotional
states so I can relate to her from within her own state and effectively "vulcan
mind-meld" with her, turning the TWO of us into a SINGLE, functioning entity so
that I can dictate for US... to a degree.

a frequent situation is chicks asking me if I am single.  basically, I explain
to them that I am in an "open" relationship.  they practically INVARIABLY
disrespect my MLTR for being stupid. "how can she go for that?" "I would have
dumped you" "I would never let a man see other women"...  sooooo :)  I let them
go on and on and get it all out and completely ENTRENCH themselves in the DREAM
of them being with a man like me AND dumping me or CHANGING me or whatever
their BULLSHIT FANTASIES are at the time.  THEN I go into the BENEFITS of being
MY PRIMARY relationship... :)  when I stack up the LIST of BENEFITS and it
stacks HIGHER than those bitches have in their OWN RELATIONSHIPS RIGHT NOW,
they start thinking.  they think about what LITTLE they really have in their
relationships that MY MLTR is getting.  they think about the TRUST and
COMPANIONSHIP between us that they DON'T HAVE with their borefriends.  they
think about how she is SEXUALLY SATISFIED... DAILY if she wants it.  she has
someone to give her the REAL DEAL on how men are and what we want from
chicks... not someone that's going to keep playing her until he is finished
fucking her.  they ALSO see how the other bitches (like them in the near
future) come and go and MLTR CONSTANTLY receives the benefits of being with a
man that does EVERYTHING for her that she could want... for the MERE price of
NOT bailing because I fuck other chicks :)  once I break it down to them, ALLLL
I see on their faces is ENVY.  matter of fact, they tend to look EMBARRASSED
when I ask THEM about THEIR relationships.  oh, that reminds me... the bitches
that DON'T HAVE A MAN AT ALL fare the WORST in these situations.  my MLTR has
NEVER-ENDING SATISFACTION... they have STORIES of what they WOULD DO... IF
they could get a man AT ALL!  :)

chicks would rather have 20% of a WINNER than 100% of a LOSER!

>> Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>>her last week, apparently).
>
>Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with fucking; it
feels
>good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the vulnerabilities.  So
>when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which overcomes the
>potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. 

wow!  VERY powerful :)  I had really considered these to be apples and
oranges... pain of emotions after sex and pain of LOSS of the individual. 
however, discomfort is discomfort.  I quit giving UTILITY to this PIVOT I was
using because I realized she had ZERO self-esteem and not many other redeeming
qualities other than her looks.  she went from LJBF to NEXT overnight.  I had
been using her for a pivot because of her looks, but her lack of personality
started to wear on me and finally, she had to go.  no more hanging out, no more
phone calling, no more help with her love-life... nothing... cold turkey. 
completely FORGOT about her.  about a month or so later, the holiday season
comes around and she  A) calls me  B) tells me she bought me something for
christmas (I bought her NOTHING, not even a CARD and didn't bother to get one
when she told me she bought me something)  C) tells me she wants to bring it TO
my house, and  D) shows up with gift in hand, READY to socialize and spend time
with me.  

this is the SAME bitch that NEVER went in her purse to even OFFER to throw in
money when I used to use her for a pivot.  I didn't mind paying for her though
because the benefits I got from being out with an attractive chick that KNOWS I
am out to get OTHER bitches and facilitates that was well worth it :)  hehe... 
too bad for her, MLTR was over and I received her gift, talked to her for a
while (where she told me her recent "relationship" blew the fuck up in her face
:-) and then ejected her to keep having fun with MLTR.

I have been using outfoxer's style of letting bitches get involved in bullshit
relationships, TELLING THEM the relationships are bullshit then letting them
fall FLAT on their faces and come CRAWLING back to me :)  I just haven't added
the part yet where I get indignant that they are giving sex to CHUMPS that use
them like BITCHES and throw them away.  hehe it is fun enough at this point
just to hear about their FAILURES from the horses' mouths and see the sad looks
on their faces, while I am CONSTANTLY SMILING :)

what you described is BASICALLY what happened to her, except NOT in the sexual
content, but in the companionship content.  she THOUGHT she had a solid
position with me as my pivot, so she didn't feel like paying for anything
because she thought I NEEDED her, not WANTED her.  as soon as I didn't want her
anymore and dumped her from LJBF to NEXT, she was OK with it UNTIL her
relationship BACKFIRED... THEN she decides she wants to get back in good with
ME, which she can't do because I don't give a fuck about her and except for
looks, she can't compete with MLTR AT ALL!

the pain of loneliness overrides the emotional pain of sex without
committment... fascinating :)

>She's worried about
>pain, so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not only
>losing out on the pleasure of screwing, BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
>believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out that if
>she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even WORSE
>crack-up.
>
>  Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.

ok, this is interesting too.  "this is why you fucked up with your ex and I
feel the same way about that particular topic".  you are FORECASTING her
EJECTION unless she changes her ways.  she is still WITH YOU and has a chance
to do the right thing instead of getting ejected.  she already knows how it
feels to BE ejected by her EX and doesn't WANT to go through that pain AGAIN
with you.  you dictate to her HOW she could have avoided it with her EX and she
learns how to avoid it with you and gets in line.  this is another reason why
DICTATING what you REQUIRE from chicks is good, because they have the roadmap
to success or FAILURE with you.  as long as you have demonstrated personality
AND value BEFORE getting to this with her, she will be in a state of "how can I
get my hands on this guy... and KEEP him?" and then you will tell her what she
needs to do to be CONSIDERED amongst your TOP chicks and then is is up to her
to either fulfill her womanly duties or... as you predicted... get ejected and
feel the PAIN OF SEPERATION all over again with someone that she ALREADY knows
she WANTS to be with... WHATEVER the cost.

everyone has their price.  I find, most times, chicks are TALKING with no
EXPERIENCE.  a chick told me that she dumped her borefriend because he laughed
at her.  I told her that the sex must not have been good because otherwise she
would have had to use more than THAT to justify dumping an entire relationship.
 she CLAIMED that sex had nothing to do with her decision and that he didn't
RESPECT her was why she dumped him.  I told her that if the sex had been what
it is SUPPOSED to be... I GUARANTEE her that she would NOT have thrown THAT
away because of some laughing and disrespect.  I also proceeded to laugh at her
AND disrespect her IN HER FACE and told her I don't care because we are not
dating... she can't DUMP ME!   she never ADMITTED that I was right... BUT... by
the end of the conversation, she was asking me WHAT SHE SHOULD DO TO MAKE HER
LOVE LIFE BETTER!  :/  gotcha!

>>I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>>alone!
>
> Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to her her
>"ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she can then
>accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!  

yes.  I really have not been making the MOST of pacing and leading.  I have
been seeing where they ATTACH THEMSELVES to my way of thinking and see me as an
authority.  I have not used this to MAKE POLICY for them... merely to open
their minds and get them to think more efficiently.  you are right though. 
once you capture them... LEAD THEM!  make SOME efficient use of your new
followers... even if you were only practicing or passing time by capturing them
:)

excellent post :)

------

From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:10 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

In article <92n7b9$146$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, maniac_high@yahoo.com writes:

>After chick says bullshit about wanting to go to
>dinner and be friends or shit for 6 months before
>becoming a GF, I say: Actually, I dont go to dinner
>or stuff like that with ladies who are not my GF
>CHick:  gasps!
>Maniac: see, going to dinner, is an important step
>in a relationship for me. I only share it with someone
>special
>chick: Huh?
>Maniac: Well, let me put it this way, do you ever
>sleep with a guy who is just your friend, or dont
>care about?
>chick: of course not!

[lots of good use of Jake's shit snipped]

this is interesting, though I couldn't tell if this is something you are GOING
to do, or something you DID already.  either way, IF you are congruent, this
will serve you well as an alternate form of screening.  most of the time, I
screen by ASKING chicks shit and listening to their answers while watching
their faces and body-language.  another way to do it is to basically DICTATE to
them what I need to even CONSIDER being with a chick in any capacity
whatsoever.  most of the time I don't do this though because I can tell already
that the chick is worthless.  I usually get into DICTATION when she asks me
about myself.  am I attached?  what do I look for in a woman? etc.  THEN, since
she asked, I get into the reasons I have chosen women in the past and why I am
still with them in the present.  as I do that, I lay down my laws WITHOUT
telling the chick I am talking to that she needs to get in line with this shit
or get the fuck out of my face.  I have had a couple of chicks blow themselves
out after this.

I was talking to a chick that I know from YEARS ago that started calling me
again and talking about nothing.  I tolerated her for an hour or so on two
different days  A) because I was bored and  B) because through her speech
patterns and recurring ideas, I was learning if she was worth anything to me at
all, considering I get everything I want or need from MLTR in the first place,
she only had a VERY LIMITED use to me, as GOOD backup-pussy.  MLTR is smarter,
more interesting, more fun, less psychotic... basically TRUMPED her in all
areas, so this chick had NO CREDIT with me whatsoever.  I ended up getting into
PRECISELY what you did in your post.  the KICKER was when I told her "I don't
even TALK to girls that I don't want to fuck".  since I had not fucked her AND
had not suggested that we get together (she BELIEVES in monogamous
relationships for herself and even if she fucked me one time, it would be
merely to relieve her own personal stress and I am not going to be there for
her for that.  I am looking for MORE MLTRs... anything else can go fuck off.  I
laughed at her way of being AND broke it down to her why it was so stupid AND
let her know in NO UNCERTAIN TERMS that I was not going to be involved in
ANYTHING CLOSE to what she claims to want for herself... she can STAY HORNY for
all I care) she INTELLIGENTLY asked me WHY I was talking to her...  I let her
know that I found her amusing and her way of living ineffective.  I pointed out
to her that in the YEARS since I had spoken to her last, ALL she had to show
for it was a bungh of jibberish about WANTING a monogamous relationship that
she HAS NOT ATTAINED IN ALL THESE YEARS!  I let her know that I had predicted
that she would REMAIN dissatisfied for years to come and my talking to her
allowed me to follow her LACK of progress while, in the meantime, I get laid
EVERY DAY by MLTR :)   I have not heard from her SINCE that conversation...
good riddance.  she knew what she HAD to do if she wanted more of my time.  she
knew what she was going to have to do IF she wanted to socialize with me at
all.  she felt like her DEVOTION to the idea of a monogamous relationship with
a NON-EXISTANT man was more important than getting fucked by a guy that she
KNOWS and LIKES.  she is an idiot, and will remain horny UNTIL she fucks the
wrong guy, then has NO ONE to comfort her because I will not be there because
she had her chance and BLEW IT!

I have ZERO TOLERANCE for chicks that want things their way.  if they LIKE
doing things MY WAY, then they can be with me...maybe... for a while... as long
as they still LOOK HOT :)   when I approach chicks, I ASSUME they will fail the
screen because statistics show that I require A LOT from a chick and most of
them are either distracted by work or other relationships or just are not
QUALITY enough to be with me.  I find it amusing how ridiculous the SAME girls
are that I used to DESIRE to go out with and that I USED TO dislike being
rejected by.

now, I meet and REJECT girls daily.  not actively, just after I meet them, I
make NO EFFORT to remain in contact with them and go off to talk to other
chicks, leaving them wondering WHY I was interested enough to approach, but
BECAME DISINTERESTED and ejected for a SIMILARLY-GOOD-LOOKING bitch :)

Maniac High's Pick Up Girls Guide and Seduction Website! » field

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Maniac uses a power opener to meet and tongue down a chick!


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Maniac meets HBOrderMe! Bar PU
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 05:00:36 GMT

Maniac meets HBOrderMe! Bar PU
001215

This is an interesting bar PU. .
used it to not lay the chick, but to get higher rapport
with the other guys around.

It is bo-nen-kai (end of year party) season in Japan.
After the party (boring, in a big hotel ballroom)
we go to the ni-ji-kai (after party) in a bar/disco
in Roppongi with a bunch of my coworkers (mostly guys,
and some ladies).

One AFC guy is really into this HB. He is making every
AFC mistake in the book (saying she is pretty, sucking
up to her..blah). Progress is really slow.

Me and all the guys are watching. He gets frustrated and
leaves for a bit. I move in on the chick (she is wearing
a high cut black dress, and fishnet stockings... very cute).

My opener is the strawberry game.. I just go up to her,
and say 'imagine you are in a field, and you see a strawberry
field ahead of you, with a fence around.. how high is the
fence'. She goes right into it.

Then I do the interpretation (see strawberry game post
for the game and interpretation) for her. I ask her what
she thinks (she said 1m high fence, 50 strawberries, sorry
to the farmer). She disagrees the interpretation. Then I
ask her what is your idea guy like (brad pitt). Then I say
besides his looks why you like him. Reply: he is really
guy.

Then I ask, what do you want most in a guy's character.
She says, 'I want him to lead, to decide for me what to do.'
Good.. Maniac keeps that in mind for what comes next. .

AFC guy comes back, and I let him have his chick back for
a while. He is doing more regular AFC stuff, though he
has at least initiated kino.. very good. He does this for
like 20 minutes, but isn't really breaking through.

He gets frustrated, goes. I tell the guys 'watch this',
and go up to the chick, and say I am going now, give me a
kiss. I get a cheek kiss.

I look straight into her eyes, and tell her 'thats not
good enough, look into my eyes.. what do you see.. now
give me a real kiss..' a long tonguedown with sexual kino
ensues.. Everyone else sees what I just did, after spending
not even a total of 5 minutes talking with this chick
from before.

I leave the chick, and go back to the guys.. 'that is how
it is supposed to be done'. Respect of me from my guy co-workers
now goes up 10x from whatever it was before, and was visibly
different in the office the next day.

AFC co-worker comes back and tells me how so much he is
in love with this girl (I guess he knew her from before as
a friend or co-worker or something..not sure.. I had never
met her before though). As a result, I defer to him, and let
him get AFC'd out.

I go back to the other guys, and just say, I could take her
(she lives really close actually, so I could just say I
live far and can I crash at her place.. I am sure the answer
would have been yes) whenever I want. They say 'why dont you'?

I reply, well, AFC guy is really into her, and he is a coworker
of mine who I respect, so I dont want to take his chick away
from him. There are lots of chicks to fuck, and this one means
nothing to me at all, but she is important to him, so best to
leave it at that.

I go on to say that all I wanted to know is that I COULD take her
home if I want (and I might next week or something, I got her
number) and now I know that, so it is enough for me, I dont
need more.

Respect from co-workers now goes up another 10x for this, because
I and they KNOW that this is true after what they just saw. .

He continues to AFC for a long while, and I get tired and go
home. Next day I hear that she blew him out almost as soon as I
left.

Now this was cool, because the goal wasn't really to lay the
chick (which I still might if I decide to see her again), but to
increase stature with co-workers, which can help in other ways
in my regular life.

Now one thing to note, is that I cannot do this every time (heck
not even close.. this is like the 3rd or 4th time it has ever happened
so directly like this). I was
really lucky, because of what she said to my 'what you like in
guy question', it was just so EASY to know what this chick
expected me to do, and it was really easy to stage it to happen
in front of all the other guys once I clued in on this.

I WISH I could do it everytime, but life isnt really like that ;-)
Mr. SMooth can do it though!

Constructive comments and opinions welcome!
Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Using the ‘color’ game to PU!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Using the 'color game' to do a PU!


From: tonymcneill@my-deja.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Colours Game - opinions?
Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 00:43:35 GMT

 Hi Guys,

I've just field tested this pattern / game for creating an erotic and
horny state - worked a dream:) I'd be interested to know what you think
of this and how it might be improved.....

I suppose it might work best with the more visually thinking babes.

This is not a 'word for word' pattern by any means, by the way - I just
kind of found myself going into it on the fly.....  here we go..

The PUA "notices" the colour (UK spelling by the way for those who might
feel the urge to correct me) of an object, item of clothing etc.

PUA - "I find these yellow walls (or whatever) quite uplifting;
especially in the winter. Isn't it nice to have some bright colours
around when it's so grey and dark outside?" "Do you think that colours
have an big effect on peoples' moods?".

HB - "Oh, yes, definitely."

PUA - "Hmmm. I was just wondering......I mean....... I was in one of
those New Age shops recently and they were selling lots of different
coloured sunglasses.... with the idea that, if you wanted to feel more
of a certain mood, or to look at the world in a certain way, you would
slip on a pair of sunglasses which would colour everything you looked at
in the desired tone" "Do you think that could work in any way?"

HB - "Well, maybe. I don't know really"

PUA - "Well, for example, my bedroom is a very pale blue colour and I
find this particular blue very restful" "I mean, can you imagine
sleeping very well in a pale blue room?" "Imagine you are really tired,
you know when your eyelids are heavy and you curl up with that fantastic
feeling of at last ... just letting go.... and .....giving
yourself...to....(sp perhaps?).. sleep'" "Do you have a sense of a
particular colour when you imagine that feeling?" (Make sure she's
imagining being sleepy).

HB - "Oh, maybe blue, or green" (or whatever). (If she doesn't come up
with one then maybe she could be asked to imagine the perfect colour for
a bedroom, but both of the HB subjects I tried got right into it.)

PUA "How about when you feel....really full of great ideas...... like
you have all sorts of inspiration flowing through you.?"

PUA then procedes to get HB to imagine a few other states (feeling very
inspired and spiritual (commenting on her choice of colour in a playful
way)...... bursting with energy ...... feeling very sensual,
relaxed and open (we're getting closer, gentlemen)......and eventually,
 being full of passion and horny), and slowly visualising a colour with
each one.

You get the picture - guiding her into these states,
comparing colours etc etc. I have tried this on two chicks, both of whom
LOVED the game and got right into imagining the states. One of them was
an ex who is of great value as a pivot / social proof (and a friend) so
I was testing the game with her rather than going for the lay and the
other HB, in spite of being pretty shy, blushed madly and was VISIBLY
remembering the joy of being fucked until she screamed with pleasure ;)
(At this point Tony is feeling a bit fucking pleased with himself).
I think this would have definitely resulted in a fuck had I not been
meeting her at lunchtime before going off to work :( (at this point Tony
is disgusted as well as pleased!!)

What do you 'real' PUAs think of this little game? As I said I somehow
went into it on the fly after having the idea while practicing
improvising patterns while driving, using things I saw on the road as
starting points for pattern-talk. So it's pretty new and I, as yet,
claim only to be a humble RAFC. Going to test it some more and post the
results....



Any suggestions or comments?

Tony

--
'Action' is the magic word

Setting up the Kiss Close

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

A way to set up the kiss close

From: erosla77@aol.com (ErosLA77) Ross Jeffries
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 26 Dec 2000 19:23:44 GMT
Subject: Re: What if...

>Subject: Re: What if...
>From: eclipse19@my-deja.com
>Date: Tue, Dec 26, 2000 12:04 AM
>Message-id: <929jdt$u6t@nnrp1.deja.com>
>
>In article <9299s4$o03@nnrp1.deja.com>,
>  charnel1278@my-deja.com wrote:
>> Hey all,
>>
>> I've checked out a Maniac's, and some others websites and most say
>that
>> when you ask "Do you wanna kiss me?", you're guaranteed a kiss, unless
>> you get a flat out NO.  None, from what I saw, said what to do when
>you
>> get that NO.  Do you continue on the conversation like nothing
>> happened? Do you come back with a similar question later in the
>> evening?  If so, won't she kinda feel that you're badgering her?
>> Granted, this won't happen often, but what if?....
>>
>> Laters.
>
> the standard (canned) reply to a "no" answer is "YOU really know how
>to ruin a moment....your old boyfriends must have hated that about you"
>I think i got this off tony or maniac's site, forget which one. I
>havent ran into a direct "no" answer myself so i havent field tested
>this, but im sure others have. From what i read(or remember anyhow)
>this will leave them stunned and they will show less resistance against
>another kiss.
>
>

 Hmmm......well, I like this "you really know how to ruin a moment" response
WITHOUT asking for the kiss first. "Asking" for anything, outside of the
presence of fun(as in, on the spur of the moment saying, "Hey...wouldn't it be
fun to go to a strip club? Let's go!))  seems pretty pathetic to me.  

    A good one is to notice her giving you that look and then say(and I got
this from a student, it is NOT mine).  "If ? were to ask you on a scale of one
to ten, how good a kisser are you, what would you say?"

 Listen for her answer, then say, "If you were to kiss me right now, how do you
think I'd rate you?"

  You do this ONLY when you see "the look".......

  "let's find out" you say and kiss her.  

IF she backs away from that, then the "you really know how to ruin a moment"
comment works great.  Come to think of it, this could really work for a
cancellation as well. 

---

From: "General Snafu" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: What if...
Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2000 22:57:08 GMT

If she says no to a kiss, ask for a BJ.  If she says no to the BJ, you are
SOL for the night.

 wrote in message
news:9299s4$o03@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Hey all,
>
> I've checked out a Maniac's, and some others websites and most say that
> when you ask "Do you wanna kiss me?", you're guaranteed a kiss, unless
> you get a flat out NO.  None, from what I saw, said what to do when you
> get that NO.  Do you continue on the conversation like nothing
> happened? Do you come back with a similar question later in the
> evening?  If so, won't she kinda feel that you're badgering her?
> Granted, this won't happen often, but what if?....
>
> Laters.
>
>
> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/

Game: The Wall and the Forest

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Maniac introduces "The Wall and the Forest", a PU game.



From maniac_high@yahoo.com 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Game: The wall and the forest
Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 16:18:24 GMT

Another one of those mindfuck games like 4 questions or the cube:

"The Wall and the Forest"

-You are walking in a field, you see a wall, how high is it, and
how do you get by it? [wall = pride, and also how you get past
obstacles]

-you continue walking, and you see a house [kind of house you dream
to have later in life]

-you see a key on the ground, you go to the house, does the key
open the door? [if yes, means you can get married]

-you go in the house (if you were able to open with the key), and
 on the first floor you see a table and chairs, how many chairs are
 there? [means how many people in your future family]

-now you go outside, and see to one direction a dense dark forest, and
 the other way, a less dense/brighter wooded area. Which way do you
 go? (dark forest=expect something, but unknown, take a chance)
     (bright wooded area=easygoing style/way)

-as you walk you then see a lake nearby. How big is it, and how deep
 is it? (big=size of your heart, depth=depth of your heart)

THE END


This game could be lethal for chicks who want to get married or
something like that. Make sure you answer the right answers when
you tell her "what your answers were" after you finish her turn!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Game: Forest

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Nightlight introduces 'forest game'!



From: nightlight9@hotmail.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: More like "4 questions" game?
Date: Thu, 02 Nov 2000 19:50:10 GMT

You mention all these, but most of them are not very useful in the
initial meeting because they are too cerebral and too random.  Try ones
that are more viceral.  You are walking in a dark forest.  How do you
feel.  (how she approaches life).  You could to a wall with a door.
What do you do? (how she approaches obsticalls).  You look down and see
a cup on the ground what is it made out of? (how she views wealth).
You come to some water, describe it. (how she views sexuality).
Always end with sexuality because it is  a good topic for PU and
demonstrates you are comfortable with women and people a sexual context.

BookGuy, my comments are based on experience and field testing.  Please
do the same if you reply.

--
NightLight9
Just be yourself... smooth with interesting questions and interesting
answers.

Game: Strawberry Fields

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Maniac introduces a PU game: Strawberry Fields!
[Note, this originally comes from the book 'Kokology']


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Game!: Strawberry fields
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 08:02:40 GMT

Game!: Strawberry fields
001117

This is a game to find out some things about how chicks
see sex. It is very popular in Japan & is a good state
transitioner

--

Intro: Hey, lets play a game!

Imagine you are alone in a field, and see a straberry field
in front of you with tasty strawberries.

There is a fence/gate around the field. How high is it?
(= how easy is this girl/guy to take sex)

Now you are in the straberry field, how many straberries
do you take?
(=how many BFs/GFs that person wants)

Ok, after you have finished enjoying the strawberries,
how do you feel about the farmer, who's field you took them
from?
(=how you feel to that person after fucking them)


The end

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

TPUA night PU’s HB Smallmouth and converts to a lay!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

[TPUA PU's a chick at night, and converts it into a lay!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com
]


Date Posted: 2000/09/25 05:21:37 AM EDT
Author: Tokyopua 
Subject: Re: HB Small Mouth PU  (Was Re: Calling all Tokyo PUA's)

Hey Maniac,

I didnt really intend that last post of mine as a field report, since it
wasnt too detailed.  But yeah, things have been going well on the PU despite
my severely limited time. So I will attempt a bit of a field report on the
initial PU here.  My PU efficiency factor has been really high recently,
maybe because I am only trying to PU when I feel really confident and often
times when I wasnt planning on it, so was really relaxed. I did a PU on a 19
year old HB college student in the train the other night and got her home
phone number.  It was easy cause she was reading Tokyo Classified, and I
asked her about it. I was really confident, and in only 2 stops got her to
really dig me.  In fact, when I asked her why she had studied English, she
said "So I could meet a guy like you!"  The only problem is finding time to
meet her again before I leave.

The PU I did on HB Small Mouth was not planned either, I just saw her
walking back home around my place at midnight, and somehow knew that despite
my frazled appearance after 2 hours of Jujitsu practice and carrying 40
pounds of luggage, I could do the PU on her.  My opening line was "I like
your hair" which I knew was lame and she must have heard often, but hey,
thats the price of using the 3 second rule sometimes.  I immediately
followed with asking her if she was a student, what kind of work she did,
etc.  Oddly, I didnt use my standard opener "Do you speak english" in the
whole conversation.  I will post my personal notes on the rest of the PU at
the end of this post just for reference, but they arent too coherent.  They
were the basis though for the plans I laid for the successful next date that
got me laid 3 days later.  (If I have time someday I will write up full
notes on that too.) Total time to lay in terms of time invested was
approximately 3.5 hours, about the same as HB Physics, my other recent
street PU who I did that same day.  This efficiency is possible if the
progression is done just right, I think.

 wrote in message news:8qfler$o1r@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Tokyo PUA,
>
> This is an excellent report.. You really rock!
>
> Where / how did you originally
> PU this chick though? Also, taking the chick over to see your
> weight training stuff is a clever idea.. liked that..!
> BTW, I thought you left already to the USA, how long are you still
> there for?

Right near my house in a dark alley at midnight on her way home!  She told
me later (post lay) that she was scared at first, but I had a really relaxed
attitude so she got comfortable with me afterwards.  As for the weight
training stuff later, it was great kino as I had her bend over slightly and
got right behind her to "help her with her form" while simultaneously
letting her slightly feel the form of my stiff wood pressed against her, and
other such intimate situations.

Still here till Oct 14 or so, with a trip to Taiwan and maybe Hawaii too
thrown in.

>
> ALso, do you usually go out alone, or with a wing. I noticed that
> you knew quite a few people in Roppongi, I guess you get out there
> quite a bit?

Been out there a lot since last February, maybe 10 times or so.  I guess
predominantly I go with a wing, but sometimes felt it screwed up my game.
Of course, my wings didnt know anything about seduction a la ASF, thats
probably why.  Of course, neither did I till June... I know Im much better
at street PU when alone though, thats for sure!  OTOH, when I went out to
clubs with you and Rio, I think my game was really improved and I was
learning all the time.
BTW, I have heard that someplace called club Earth near hamamatucho has
really hot babes, (bitch shield too, but who cares, right;-), so you guys
might want to check that out.  3000 Yen cover charge.  May be the new
alternative to Fura?

>
> > I managed to lay that HB Small Mouth
>
> EXCELLENT!
>
> >Ganbatte!  Im seeting HB Bi this weekend again (tonight), and HB
> >small the next day, and my ex-GF the next.  Im starting to feel like
> >Maniac juggling girls, but nothing will happen w/ my ex, so its not
> >so bad.
>
> Yes, I did that ALOT last year, and fucked a shitload of chicks that
> I cant even count now..
>
> but its really tiring and you do get sick of it after a while..
> so finally I just MLTR'd a few that I really liked, who also accepted
> that I fuck other chicks, and left it at that.. guess I got to get out
> more ;-)
> not sure if its the right way yet, but been doing it that way
> the last few months now.. We'll see ;-)

I think it goes in cycles.  Eventually you get tired of the MLTR's and have
to replace them.  To do that you will have to PU lotsa new chicks, lay them,
see if they dont eject when you break the news that there are others.  That
takes a lot of time, so then you want to go back to the easy life of having
a bunch of girls on call.  Then the cycle starts over.  Im just beginning to
get these girls into MLTR status, but now I have to leave.  But theres
always business trips ack here!

>
> If you are planning on hanging around TOkyo though, you should
> bring HB Bi and her friend to one of our fuck parties the next time..
> sounds like they'd be a good time.. maybe introduce them to Kipp or
> something since I am not there right now, before you leave.. or
> give me your departure date and see if they are interested and we
> can setup something with all the ladies, if this is your sort of thing..

Id consider it, but it will take more effort, and probably wont be anything
I can do until after Im gone and come back for business trips.  You see, I
worked it too good with HB Bi.  She is signing her letters with "Love" at
the end and is all into me now.  Made me the most awesome meal any woman has
ever made me, washed my clothes, gave me an amazing massage, etc.  When I
confronted her about our last threesome, she said that she felt jealous when
she saw me doing her friend, and claimed that was the only time she had ever
done something like that, that she isnt really Bi.
So right now I think she somehow sees a relationship in this, despite my
leaving?  I figure once Im gone I can get past that as reality sinks in and
maybe set up more stuff for any business trips I make back.

>
> Good post!
>
> Maniac
> http://www.pickupguide.com

Here are those notes I was talking about, for what they are worth:

-------------------------------------------
PU of HB Small:  happened in a dark alley shortcut to my house at midnight,
I approached carrying a 30 pound backpack on one shoulder and a 10 pound
bucket of protein powder in the other, and said,  $B!H (BExcuse me, your hair is
really beautiful. $B!I (B  She reacted favorably and said thanks, but kept
walking, slightly faster.  She seemed young, so I asked if she was a
student.  She said no, I asked what she does.  She said she works for a
cable company, I fluff talked about watching TV.  She asked what I do.  I
said I know its late but you should have coffee or tea with me at Jonathans
restaurant nearby.  She said no, so I said, OK, how do we meet again.  She
said give me your number and I said,  $B!H (BAh, but I know women, if I give you
my number you will get nervous and never call. $B!I (B  She said  $B!H (BNo, 
that wont
happen I promise. $B!I (B  I knew I didn $B!G (Bt have enough rapport or 
anything to
believe that, so really what I was just doing was stalling till I could set
up a firm date.

I got a pen and wrote my number and at this point we are standing on the
corner near my place.  I play on Japanese cuteness and write my name with
hearts by it.  (None of this is stuff I would be able to do in the US.)
Then I say, OK, when are we going to meet.  Its sort of a way to pace the
ongoing reality now that she has my number,its a logical extension.  The
number is just a formality to me, I want to set up the date.  After some
negotiation, I get a date set up for 6 PM Tuesday, her day off.  I had given
her alternatives between my place and eating in Tachikawa nearby (but both
already had the presuppostion that we are meeting for a date, so I don $B!G (Bt
care which she chooses).  She chose Italian in Tachikawa which is perfect
cause eating carbs increases seratonin (=relaxation), so I will lay on the
patterning after a while, maybe even order a glass of wine (more seratonin
and romance) for us both.  Then its a 5 minute taxi ride back to my place!

Anyway, we keep talking.  I get that she never has met a foreigner, that she
likes Richard Gere, cause he is  $B!H (BShibui $B!I (B. $B!! (B(=quiet, simple, 
sober,
tasteful, austere, parsimonious, etc.)  I asked her about her ideal man
while doing the (SP) thing.  She really accessed a lot and I was awakening
her creative centers.  I touched her a lot on the arm to anchor the good
feelings.   She said she really was too ideal, but that her ideal guy was
like her father, sweet and nice.  I asked if she wanted a guy who made her
feel safe, and she said yes.  I compared our hand sizes and got kino,
remarked at how small her hands were, that my big hands could protect her.
Complemented her smile and said that it seems like her eyes smile too and
she said that she is often told that.  She said I was skillful at
complementing and I said that I really meant it.

I mirrored her body positions a lot and this seemed to have a good effect.
She seemed really into it and wasn $B!G (Bt trying too hard to get away despite 
it
being after midnight and having to work the next day, only bringing up the
time when I did.  She was rubbing her earlobe, and later playing with her
ponytail in a really sexy way, all with the doggy dinner bowl look.
I also showed kanji ability and had her write her name, and demonstrated how
we could study English together, all using the Zaurus.  (BTW, Did you buy
one yet, Maniac? A useful tool in many ways.  You can turn it into a
portable digital photo album too, albeit poor quality...) She liked that.
At one point she asked what was in the bucket, I said protein powder and she
said  $B!H (Bnomitai! $B!I (B and I said  $B!H (B5 fun dake areba, nomeru 
yo. $B!I (B
(If you have 5
minutes I can give you a taste).  But she refused to go to my apartment and
I didn $B!G (Bt press the issue, I just reconfirmed our fun date on Tuesday, and
gave her a kiss goodnight, then took off.
----------------------------------

-T

ASF reader comments on above story

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website: 

http://www.pickupguide.com 

Many excellent followups to the Psychicbabe re-lay report!
Mrsex4unyc, RJ..etc..etc.

From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:05 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

In article <92jvre$obh@nnrp1.deja.com>, maniac_high@yahoo.com writes:

>The immediate gold to take care of this, is to now make the
>relationship very high stakes for her. I can do this because
>I know that she is into me (from what she said at the dinner),
>so the idea is to play it that if she doesnt do her job as a
>chick.. she will lose EVERYTHING as far as I am concern.
>Ok, that is the plan, here we go:

plan or no plan, essentially, you are telling her the truth.  on a long-enough
timeline, the survival rate for EVERYONE is ZERO.  sooner or later, everyone
you love will either leave you or die.  chicks don't seem to believe in this,
though it is the absolute truth.  they think that they can relate to you
FOREVER, REGARDLESS of what they do or how they act.  you are telling her HOW
she can REMAIN with you and what is going to get her EJECTED.  even though it
takes a long time, so it doesn't SEEM like this... this is what has happened to
EVERY chick's relationship that has gone away.  EVENTUALLY, she was not
fulfilling her womanly duties and her man left her for a   chick (younger,
sexier, richer, swallower...)  EVEN if she IS fulfilling her duties, if her man
like it from another chick MORE, she loses out either in a PERCENTAGE of her
benefits or she gets DUMPED and loses ALL of her benefits.  you are merely
explaining this to her and telling her what she needs to do IF she wants to be
with you... which you have already determined.  you are SELLING, and now you
are screening her to see if she is QUALIFIED and ABLE to buy.

>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations
>in relationship. 

I am getting to the point where I am going to do this.  I never do this with
chicks because I morph into whatever THEY are looking for and hook them that
way.  the thing for me is that being 10 months in with MLTR, she has REALLY
learned how to please me and the time I spend TEACHING her has become minimal
and the time I spend ENJOYING her is increasing :)  it is getting tougher and
tougher for other chicks to get my attention, because anything LESS than what I
have already is BULLSHIT to me.  the time I am spending talking to chicks is
mostly eliciting values and breaking their perceptions... just for fun :)  I
know IMMEDIATELY if I want sex from a chick, and if I don't, she is IMMEDIATELY
LJBF and I use her for practice and NEXT her at the end of the conversation.

I am seriously going to consider moving to a "demonstration of value -> SOI"
model, just because I have lost my patience with LISTENING to these bitches
talking about shit that really doesn't mean anything.  I know I am going to
NEXT them ANYWAY as soon as I realize they can't compete with MLTR, so why
listen to their shit FIRST?  I may as well let them know how great I am and
let them know what kind of woman I am willing to accept, and let them continue
from there.  there is also the cognitive dissonance issue of them KNOWING that
I am going to dump them if they are not sexy and CONTINUING to talk to me and
get to know me.  the more they talk to me, the more I hook them into
interacting with me.  the more they get hooked, the greater the PAIN OF
SEPERATION (credit: RJ) when they eventually get EJECTED.  since they KNOW
ahead of time what will get them ejected and they are still talking, they are
either planning to get in line OR setting themselves up for pain.  either way,
after SOI and their acceptance of the terms, there will have to be some sort of
TEST of their compliance.  even listening to what they have to say after SOI
counts as a REWARD for their entering into a "relationship" with me.  hmm... I
will consider this more.

>I go on to tell her that other girls I know also
>like me, ask me out alot, (doesn't matter if it is true or not,
>but chick 'competition logic' will kick in, and it will scare
>your mark to act). 

the reason I don't use this is that MLTR is an integral part of my life.  if I
were to play this "chicks dig me" card, it would belittle the actual
relationship I have with MLTR.  the only problem with THAT is that I am
screening for MORE MLTRs :)  I don't give a fuck about ONS because I can get
laid ANY NIGHT within an hour of talking to the chick I am talking to... in the
WAY I want to with a chick that I WANT TO FUCK :)  a chick offering me ONS is
like a chick offering me a dollar bill.  I already HAVE dollar bills... what do
I want hers for?  of course, there are some chicks that are just so HOT that
you want to try them out, but barring that scenario, ONS can bring you much
more ANGUISH than the satisfaction that accompanies it... PLUS it is the SAME
SATISFACTION that I already get on a regular basis from MLTR. 

besides... it is OBVIOUS that chicks dig me because here SHE is, liking me
within 20 minutes of meeting me... what about the chicks that have experienced
me for days?  months?  years?  OH, she could only HOPE to be one of those! :)

for you, it is a good tactic though.

>Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>her last week, apparently).

I lost a rap to a low-self-esteem bitch that had a couple of relationships like
this as well.  I mean, I fucked her, but I didn't get to MLTR like I wanted
because she was SCARED that she wouldn't match up to the next bitch and that I
would NEXT her for no reason, like her exes did.  I tried to tell her I wanted
her for more than that, but she wasn't emotionally healthy enough to understand
or believe me.

>Ok, now Maniac has reached her head, and I take this deeper..
>I go on to tell her that I dont want just sex, I want rocks and gold
>I can get any girl in roppongi on a Saturday night and fuck her
>(not exactly true, but she doesnt know this.. goal is just to

she KNOWS that it happened to her VERY QUICKLY.  she ASSUMES she was not the
ONLY bitch to fall for you that quickly.  it is like reverse-social-proof. 
fucking a bitch FAST makes them think you can fuck other bitches FAST.

>'confirm' her worst fears so that she acts), but its not enough for
>me. I want connection, good sex, and romance, with an intelligent
>woman, and that is why I want to date you (psychicbabe).

nice line.  this is another thing I will consider.  talking-up MLTR to them.  
I never considered this either, MAINLY because if you tell a chick what you
want her to do then you never know if she is manipulating you by being that
way, or if she arrived there NATURALLY... on her own.  interesting, LOTS of
style-change material happening right around the new year :)

>Then all of the sudden, she asks me about HBass (the chick staying
>at my place over the holidays), and freaks out about it. I tell
>her that she already knows all this, and exactly what is her point
>here?

although I am a GREAT fan of "quoting", I find that there need to be times to
engage in it and times to NOT engage in it.  this will depend on what you want
with the chick.  it is the same way you can't go from being a CHUMP to a MAN in
a chick's eyes... but you CAN go from being a MAN into a CHUMP :)  if you start
out telling a chick that you have a girlfriend AND that you fuck her, you leave
yourself open for these pot-shots whenever chicks trip the fuck out and go into
their irrational rants from out of left-field.  all a bitch needs to know is
that you are "taken" so that you manage her relationship expectations.  any
more information and she feels like you will give her ALL the information. 
where does it stop?  are you going to tell her that you are fucking her?  that
you fucked her last night?  that you fucked her an hour before coming on this
date?  that you fucked YOUR WOMAN in her ass?  that she LIKES sucking dick? 
WHERE DOES IT STOP?

I ran into this problem with a chick where my relationship to her was BASED ON
trading current sex-stories.  when I got to the point where I didn't want to
tell her any more shit, she was EXPECTING me to tell her, and I realized that
if I wasn't telling her, and she wasn't telling me, then our "relationship" was
OVER.  before that, I had not realized how much I had compromised my position
by telling her CURRENT sex-shit.  think about it, and decide on your own LIMITS
to what you are willing to tell a chick about other chicks... besides, think
about the fact that she is going to KNOW that she will end up as STORIES to
other bitches right after you fuck her.  it will make her VERY self-conscious
about whatever she does with you and that could hinder her emotional states
tremendously.

>Then she stops again, and asks me if I am fucking her (maybe I
>should have said no..., but I had already said yes to her about this
>the first time I saw her)., she asks me why.. (I tell her because
>I am seeing her! like I told you the first time! I mean what do
>you expect?!?).
>
>She then puts on her bitch face, and talks in a stern voice,
>"then call me when you break her up, that is my decision, I am
>going home.".

THIS is retarded because she ALREADY knew that you were fucking her AND she
fucked you herself.  this is another problem with bitches having information
about other bitches.  they use it against themselves.  IMO, the purpose of her
knowing you have another girl or SEVERAL other girls is so she knows where she
stands in the RACE to be your MAIN BITCH.  if you are single, she has a good
chance at being that to you.  if you are "taken" she has NO CHANCE of being
that to you.  if you are SEEING bitches, then she has to COMPETE to be your #1.
 other than THAT, I think giving information about your other bitches is a
mistake...  I have made the SAME mistake up to this point, so I am not
crisicizing :)  however, I am changing that ASAP and I think you should
consider giving out information on a N2K basis (need to know).

besides, SHE is the one that NEEDS a fuck.  if it is not coming from YOU, a guy
she has fucked ALREADY and she LIKES how you did it or she wouldn't have come
back... she has to get it from a STRANGER whose sexual skills are in question
that might tie her up, fuck her in the ass or sell her to the highest bidder. 
bitches like to FRONT a lot about having ALL these sexual choices, but with all
the 8s, 9s, and 10s I have spoken to on an honest "one of the chicks" level,
they are ALL looking to have an EXCITING time, but not REALLY be in DANGER! 
you, OTOH have pussy AT HOME IN BED WAITING FOR YOU!  the only one to lose out
if she bails... is HER!  knowing that, I would have not even entertained her
bullshit OR called her on it, letting her know that I was getting laid tonight
REGARDLESS of whether SHE fucks or not.  that would take the fucking WIND out
of her sails :)

>I tell her I am planning to break her up (which is true) later, so
>it is nothing you should worry about. 

this, my friend :)  is a COP-OUT!  it is used VERY EFFECTIVELY by married men
to keep fucking their side-bitches, but WE are way above bullshit tactics like
this.  I commend you for thinking of this "on the fly", but PLEASE, PLEASE! 
hehe  I have MUCH more respect for you as a PUA than to hear some CRAP like
this from you :)  PLEASE think of something better for the next instance of a
chick trying to BLACKMAIL you into trading in a R-E-L-A-T-I-O-N-S-H-I-P where
you are getting EVERYTHING you want from a chick... for a ONS with HER! 
HAHAHAHAHAHA  >:)

I haven't run into a chick STUPID enough to try to disrespect my MLTR for being
with me... chicks have STARTED to say she is dumb for "letting" (as if she has
ANY say in the matter) her man fuck other chicks, and I have BROKEN THEIR
FUCKING ASSES listing the benefits that SHE is getting that they will most
likely NEVER have with a man... EVER!  and CERTAINLY don't have right now, or
they would not be talking to me in a bar... they would be with THEIR OWN MAN
conducting this FANTASY RELATIONSHIP that they are professing that my MLTR
should have :)  I have NEVER run into a chick that has even TRIED to break into
my relationship with MLTR because they KNOW I mean business.  all they can do
is become ANOTHER MLTR... and after they hear the QUALIFICATIONS, they KNOW
they can't even achieve THAT... only ONS and LJBF with me.  if some bitch EVER
suggested that I break up with MLTR in order to ONS her, I would  A) laugh in
her face and  B) immediately demand an EXPLANATION of the reasons why she
thinks she can knock MLTR out of the box AND make her perform ANY AND ALL
SKILLS that she CLAIMS to be better than MLTR at IMMEDIATELY!  put up or SHUT
THE FUCK UP!  the result would be the ONS ANYWAY, and she would still be LJBF
or NEXT because MLTR is NOT about sex... it is about compatability and I
PERSONALLY could not be with some bitch that needs to knock other chicks off in
order to gain status.  I gain status by BEING MYSELF and letting bitches make
INTELLIGENT, EDUCATED decisions to be with me.  any chick that wants to be with
me had better do the same.

>she gets upset, and starts
>screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
>just like her ex-bf, getting other girls while dating her, and how
>all guys just want sex..etc..

I would have told her "you wanna calm the fuck down?"  throwing tantrums and
making scenes are expressions of her ability to do ANYTHING in your presence. 
I personally don't tolerate that.

>Then she says.. ok, if you let me meet your GF at your house
>tonight, then I will let you have sex with me. [ha! I got her!]

ok.  thank God I happened to read the next line before I started typing this. 
I was JUST going to ask you WHY you are STILL letting her blackmail you into
fucking her... ESPECIALLY when she is the one that needs it and you don't :)

>I bounce back, and say, "what exactly makes you think I am
>desperate to have sex with you tonight?! Do you think I am
>just some stupid guy and you can manipulate me like that?
>No, you will not meet my GF, it is disrespectful to her to do
>that. You know the situation, it was clear to you from the
>beginning, and you accepted it. There is no more to talk about.
>I am not here only for sex, I can get that anywhere. Sex only
>of itself is of little value to me, I want more than that.

SWEET!  :)  break her fucking ASS maniac :)

>I then bring out the nuclear weapons! My tonality is very firm,
>and I eye fuck her, while telling her the following. First, I tell
>her that I already told her about my GF, she was clear about it
>right from the start, and she has NO excuse. Then I go on to tell
>her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
>that did NOT happen. So do NOT compare me to your ex. I am a
>different person, and EXCEPT better treatment than that if you
>ever want to see me again. She starts crying more, and hugging
>again.

ugh :/   fucking IDIOTS!   man, the shit some bitches put you through!  does
everyone SEE why we have to study this shit?

>I put her against wall, and tell her not to complain about me like
>I am her ex, I a am different person than he is.
>
>I tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>alone!

this is a good point.  I like to play it the other way:

ok... so now, you have told me that you want everything to be a 'perfect'
situation with a guy before making a move.  You want him to be ideal with
women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady... WHAT MAKES YOU THINK
HE WILL WANT YOU?   WHAT ARE YOU BRINGING TO THE TABLE THAT IS GOING TO MAKE A
MAN LIKE THAT CHOOSE YOU OVER ANY OTHER CHICK?

you wanna see some confusion?  you wanna see a bitch get BROKEN?  HAHAHAHA  >:)
 of course, I use this on chicks that I am just practicing on, because it
normally induces DEPRESSION, not horniness.  when they have to GO DEEP INSIDE
and dive BELOW THE SURFACE of their programming, they realize that they CAN NOT
TELL ME WHY A MAN WOULD WANT THEM!  they stall the fuck out dude :)  it's
amazing.  matter of fact, it's documented already.  look at my recent thread
with "telembe".  I let her say all this bullshit about what she wanted from a
guy in order to give up her virginity, then when she was finished talking about
what she WANTED, I asked her what she was OFFERING to a guy that was going to
give her all this committment and "love" and other bullshit and she said a
whole bunch of shit that ANY bitch can and WILL give to a man she likes.  she
might have THOUGHT she had something to offer a guy that was going to seperate
her from the pack, but she doesn't.  even GOOD PUSSY can't get a bitch any
credit because there are LOTS of bitches that can fuck and suck like pros...
elites AND sub-elites.  telembe NEVER told us what seperates her from the rest
of the bitches that might make a MAN like the one she wants even LOOK HER WAY! 
the reason is that there is NO reason! :)  bitches are programmed that MEN want
them... but they are NEVER told WHY.  the reason is that men like to FUCK and
get their dicks sucked.  they also like companionship and cooking and cleaning
and for a girl to look good on their arm so they can feel accomplished around
their buddies.  chicks THINK they are ENTITLED to a good man... but the GOOD
MEN... are picking GOOD WOMEN!  if they were SHINING like they think they are,
they would have been scooped up already and married or whatever they were
looking for because some guy would have spotted her and said "I'm not going to
let her go for ANYTHING" and she would be happy... at least according to her
programming.  OH, how I LOVE to see a bitch's face while she TRIES AND TRIES to
dig up ANY reason why a guy as great as the one she claims to want would EVER
choose her over any other bitch :)  the JOY the JOY that I feel as this POMPOUS
BITCH breaks the fuck down RIGHT IN FRONT OF MY FACE! :)  of course since I
broke her, I keep talking to her and ease her back to a decent state of being
and let her know that she can take steps to make herself into the woman that a
man would want, but she has to really KNOW HERSELF and KNOW MEN in order to
make an intelligent decision.  I am not into depressing chicks... unless they
TRULY DESERVE IT for all the depression they have caused men throughout their
tenure as FINE bitches :)  also, I have no desire to BREAK bitches and leave
them like that.  that just makes it WORSE for ALL OF US looking for FINE, yet
DECENT chicks.

>she cries, and says that is so true, that is her problem, she never
>takes the chance and loses out because she doesn't make the
>move on taken guys. Then I run my 'take chances routine' (if you take
>a chance, in the end, the result is usually good, but if you don't,
>just you get left behind, by yourself).. 

nice.  I like that one... emphasizing loss and loneliness.

>she cries more, says she
>needs to take the chance, and doesnt want to be alone.

she's done :)  nice work.  land her!

>She says she has to be careful, that all guys want just sex, and
>bitches about this for about 30 seconds.

as opposed to what?  what does she WANT guys to want?

>Now I start the 'you need me, I dont need you..you think I just want
>only sex, then you dont understand me at all.. if you think that is
>what I am only, then you do NOT deserve me.. I do no need you to go out
>with me if that is what you think I am.. I want connection, sex,
>passion, and closeness.. and if you haven't figured that out about
>me yet, then get another guy, because you dont understand me at all..

OK OK OK... you've CONVINCED me maniac :)  that's some good shit right there :)
 starting NOW, I am pitching for MLTR ONLY.  bitches that want ONS or LJBF will
get what they deserve from me... which isn't much.  I LOVE this idea of dissing
her for claiming that you are looking for ONS... or even just a "bootie-call"
type relationship :)  I love it.  I would feel so PROUD getting on her like
this.  sweet!  EXTREMELY congruent!  nice play!  this is going into my style,
starting RIGHT NOW!  :)

>I am doing this, because I know the left (logic) and right (emotions,
>passion) are fighting each other..they have been all night. Because the
>left doesn't accept the logic of the situation, but I know the right side
>dying for a shag,..she is trying to rationaize going out with a taken guy,
>but I have gotten her so excited tonight, that she needs that fuck.

THIS is the reason I never learned any of this shit until recently.  my
caveman-kino style before this involved ZERO talking.  totally kino and kissing
and PHYSICAL seduction with domineering EYE-CONTACT.  there was NO INFORMATION
for the left side to process at all.  EVERYTHING went STRAIGHT to the chick's
right side, and her left had to try to process the EMOTIONS and turn them into
a story that she could understand... in the meantime, she is PHYSICALLY falling
for the kino and wanting MORE AND MORE until we are fucking.  I never HAD to
talk to chicks before OR after fucking them because my PHYSICAL ATTACK is so
DEVASTATING!  I would just take them over PHYSICALLY and their right brains
would do ALL the work and the left would struggle to understand, but eventually
succumb to the onslaught!  ARG ARG! :)

thanks for explaining that to me :)

>As I touch her side of face, she goes doggy look, I kiss her, and she
>gets like screambabe, panting. I put leg between her, she widens, goes nuts
>totally. I ask her she likes me (in a tell her sort of way' you like me..'),
>she replies 'yes'. I say (stare her down) .. she asks "what should I do?"
>I say in a very strn fatherly voice while staring her down 4 inches from
>her head.. you will follow me..that is what you will do.. and you will do
>what I say. 'she says, 'I will'. I tongue her down more, run her crotch,
>she almost cums right there, then I take her to a love hotel (her first
>time!), no resistance what so ever.

interesting.  what just happened here?  did you somewhere dictate to her that
the terms of her being "your bitch" is that she has to sumbit to you fully? 
are you getting a verbal confirmation of that from her?  or is something else
going on... like she just plain UNDERSTANDS that you can move her to passions
that make her WANT to cum and that you are going to take her there and over the
edge?

another point... what do you guys think of foreplay on a chick.  he mentions
that she almost came right there... do you think it is good to get her to the
EDGE and leave her there so she is so horny, she will do ANYTHING for you to
make her cum, OR to give her an orgasm right there in her clothes to
demonstrate your sexual mastery over her?  personally, I am into the sexual
mastery thing because I notice a newfound RESPECT from a chick that has had
guys on top of her NAKED, fucking her for all they were worth and she never
came from it, and then I am just doing kino on her and fingering her and she
cums from just that.  do you think that making the chick cum on herself makes
her want sex MORE or want it LESS since she just got off?  take into account
that chicks are multi-orgasmic and that they feel sexier after cumming, not
DRAINED like guys.

>As I am fucking her, I am putting things in her head, like D.Shades reports.
>I tell her as she is screaming it feels deeper and deeper, closer and
>closer. She is going nuts will I am fucking her.

I need to reasearch this.  is this more right-brain, left-brain shit where her
left-brain is shut down because of the FIREWORKS that are going off in her mind
because of the sex, leaving her wide open to suggestion?  if you have any links
for this, please post.

>I stare her down, and I tell her you need me (during sex), she says yes.
>I tell her from now on you will follow me, and do what I say. She says
>'yes, I will'. I continue doing her, she says "it feels SO good, I really
>need that, I really want it, i love you inside me!".. she is fucking like a
>wild animal, loud voice, shouting and screaming, oh, I want it, give it
>to me, I want to come!

more of the same?

>Then she tells me anything is ok as long as I dont hate her..she doesnt
>want me to hate her. She wants me to hold/hug her, she cries a bit, then is
>ok again (seems to be thinking of her old bf she says). I touch her
>more, face goes totally doggy look, and finger her, she goes nuts, we start
>fucking again.

the "I don't want you to hate me" thing is very important in the D/s
relationship... not that you set this up like that, but that is the MAIN
incentive for her to follow your lead... that she does NOT want you to hate her
and CERTAINLY not to banish her.  when that is TRULY first and foremost in her
brain, she will regulate HERSELF and place herself in-line with your thinking
and what YOU want her to be.  she also won't try to blackmail you anymore
because she KNOWS it gets on your nerves and all THAT will do is get her
EJECTED sooner rather than later :)

>Her back is on the bed, and I am fucking her missionary, her legs are
>spread and wide in the air, which I am holding. I tell her "see, I control
>you, 

hehe ok... this is a little FAR-FETCHED for me at this point, but I have not
researched it yet :)  I DO like the next line though.

>I go deep in your body because it is the one way to reach you totally
>deep in your mind which no one else can do. 

interesting

>By conquering your body, I can
>conquer your mind (then I drill her a bit more after I finish the sentence so
>she goes more crazy). I play with your body because it lets me control
>your mind (then drill her some more..ha, it is like the ultimate form of
>reward hypnosis).

IS there such a thing as reward hypnosis?  links please? :)

>I ask her, so why you like me. She says she says, you are decisive and
>sometimes I am indecisive, so you make it easy for me. I want the guy
>to make it easy for me to decide what to do (important clue here Maniac!
>maybe most chicks are like this! Maybe this too is where I fucked up
>with HB Geek!)

I have heard this a lot too... only thing is that there is a lot of
RESPONSIBILITY that comes with telling a chick what to do, and if the VALUE of
owning her is not sufficient for me, I don't give a fuck WHAT she does enough
to want to lead her to a good time.

>Moral of the story.. keep your ground.. call all chick bullshit DIRECTLY.
>Make the chick risk fear losing the relationship if she doesn't capitulate
>and chances are she will back down, in spite of how it looks (and I could
>do this BECAUSE I had other choices.. another reason to be fucking
>several chicks at once). As well, it seemed that she was giving me all the
>bullshit in part because she WANTED me to call her on it, and then fuck her
good
>at the end of the night, which I obliged.

chicks give you shit-tests to find out if you are stronger than them and see
HOW you are going to control them.  chicks like the way I control them because
I NARROW their choices for them, but STILL make them choose.  they can choose
the path of ULTIMATE SATISFACTION, or they can choose the path of EJECTION and
being back on the dating scene meeting the SAME LAME GUYS every night :)

you had told her you had a girlfriend, but she seems to have NEEDED to know
that she really COULDN'T have you all to herself and that you really DIDN'T
NEED to fuck her that night or EVER.  you stuck to your guns (after letting her
get to you for a while :-) and she eventually ran out of logic and got
overridden with kino and gave up the fucking pussy like she came there to do :)

>Constructive comments/opinions welcome!
>
>Maniac High
>http://www.pickupguide.com

EXCELLENT!  keep up the GOOD WORK dude!  :)

---
From: erosla77@aol.com (ErosLA77)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 30 Dec 2000 20:12:47 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

>Subject: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit
special!]
>From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
>Date: Fri, Dec 29, 2000 10:37 PM
>Message-id: <92jvre$obh@nnrp1.deja.com>

>)this chick is a very highly educated, driven, professional
> career woman and earns likely a big 6 figure salary
>b)she is very mature, focused and spends all day in her office
> surrounded by sharks and other pirrhana type scumbag characters

 She's got to be in control ALL DAY LONG at work. Small wonder then, with a
man, she wants to fully SURRENDER control and be made to submit.  It's like all
those super-powerful Congressmen and Judges and the like who LOVE going to get
pissed-on and whipped by some Madame Dominatrix. 

>I regroup my thoughts.

 I admire your ability to do this in the field, Maniac. As you think about it,
what do you do internally to re-set yourself and keep yourself in a good frame
of mind when all this shit throws your way?

>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations

   Metahpor is a POWERFUL tool to move folks from a fixed perception to a new
one. Please, share your story!

> Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>her last week, apparently).

Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with fucking; it feels
good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the vulnerabilities.  So
when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which overcomes the
potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. She's worried about pain,
so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not only losing
out on the pleasure of screwing, BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out that if
she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even WORSE
crack-up.

  Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.

>he gets upset, and starts
>screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
>just like her ex-bf,

See? The fear of the pain of being hurt just like her ex-BF hurt her is now
rearing its ugly head.  She doesn't seem like a very emotionally stable person
in ANY event, let alone having just been dumped by a guy.  

>Then I go on to tell
>her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
>that did NOT happen

 Sharp thinking. Again, what do you do internally to keep your state solid and
your thinking sharp? THAT process internally is of great value, even more than
the specifics you share.  The specifics are like handing guys fish; good for a
nice meal and of value. But  how you get to the mind-set is TEACHING someone
HOW to fish so they can eat for life. 

>I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>alone!

 Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to her her
"ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she can then
accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!  

   Excellent...Maniac, I don't give a damn WHAT my orthodox SS followers say,
this is BRILLIANT stuff and I'd be proud to be your wing or have you as mine,
ANY FUCKIN' DAY of the week! Sir, I salute you!

>Now what I am doing with all the above, is not arguing the logic (too
>much)
>of this, because, of course she is right, and I know this.

 Actually, you ARE not arguing the logic, but you are USING the logic...HER
logic..HER way of viewing things.....pointing out WHY and HOW she loses and
what will happen if she doesn't stop it.   It's all centered around losing and
WHY she loses, based on what she has told you.  It IS logical, FROM her point
of view.  

 Great, Great stuff...sir, I salute you!

-----

From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]
Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2000 12:03:54 GMT

Replies to various people about psychicbabe:

Answers to various questions:

Was psychicbabe british, or Japanese?
She was a brit of Japanese ancestry (ie. she
looked 'j', but thought, acted and had an
english accent like a brit). This in my
opinion made it harder, because brit women
are so fucking F A T, and she was so
slender, sexy and attractive (and she dressed
to kill) compared to all of them. Lots of guys were
hitting on her (and she said she always got hit
on, and hated it.. trick was to not make it look
like a 'hit').

Why not a white chick? Well, I had the chance...
but.. at the conference where I met her, EVERY
brit. white chick there was in serious blimp bulge
territory.. very scary. Why is it so many caucasian
women are so FAT?

It was funny though, because something like 8 guys
(I counted) tried to hit on psychicbabe the night
I PU'd her. One guy was pretty good, the rest were
total AFC's..it was rather funny.

Re: Rocks -vs- gold.. how I use it (yes, it is
Jake's metephor. For RJ, search the original post
on fastseduction.com. It is also on pickupguide.com
someplace (if not it will be there in about 2 weeks,
I am revising the page this week). Basically, I intro
it as follows:
After chick says bullshit about wanting to go to
dinner and be friends or shit for 6 months before
becoming a GF, I say: Actually, I dont go to dinner
or stuff like that with ladies who are not my GF
CHick:  gasps!
Maniac: see, going to dinner, is an important step
in a relationship for me. I only share it with someone
special
chick: Huh?
Maniac: Well, let me put it this way, do you ever
sleep with a guy who is just your friend, or dont
care about?
chick: of course not!
Maniac: well, why do you think a guy should do any
different then?
Maniac: See, let me tell you a story. You ever hear
about 'rocks & gold'?
chick: no? what is it?
Maniac: Well, Relationships are valuable things.
And each partner is looking for something. It is like
diamonds (rocks) and gold. Both are valuable.

But women prefer diamonds to gold (usually), and
men prefer gold to diamonds (usually). Of course,
both are important, especially in a long term
relationship, but if a woman could choose, she would
prefer the diamonds  first, and the man would
prefer the gold  first. right?

chick: yeah, probably

Maniac: And (generally), a man can accept gold
without the diamonds, and a woman can accept
diamonds without any gold.

So in a relationship, a woman is mining for
diamonds, while the man is mining for gold.
While they are in the mine together, the
guy gives diamonds he finds to the woman, and
the woman gives the gold she finds, to the man.

But if you give a woman gold only, or a man
diamonds only.. neither is likely to be
very happy, and the relationship will soon
fall apart. In short, an exchange of sorts
takes place in a successful relationship.

And also, if a man expects just gold (sex),
but doesnt want to give her diamonds
(relationship & the mushy stuff), then she
will dump him fairly soon, because he is
playing/using her just for sex..

And if a woman expects just diamonds (walks,
attention, nice dinners, movies..etc) without
giving some gold (sex), then he (if he has any
clue about how to deal with women, though many
men do not, especially in North America) will
dump her because she is using/playing him just
for his personality.

A guy taking a chick to dinners, buying shit
and giving nice walks without sex is THE SAME
as a guy sleeping with a girl, and then kicking her
out right after the fuck is over. (chick says:
'yelch!'. Yes, thats right, and for the guy,
just dinners and buying shit is 'yelch', with
no sex, and no attention is exactly the same.

Because a woman will go to free dinner with
almost any guy, it has no value to me. But
I am like you, I want attention, and I want
to be made to feel special.

And although a girl will go to nice free dinners
with almost anyone, I also know that a girl will
not sleep with anyone. So I know if she does with me,
then it means she thinks I am important. And if
she wont, then it means she doesnt care about me
at all, so I really dont need to see her again,
I will just go find another girl.

Maybe you might think it is unusual for a guy
to think this way, but it is just my way.

See, I dont want to be played. Guys are always
getting played by girls for nice dinners, long
talks on the phone, and for their personalities.
It is the SAME as a girl being used for sex.
So I am happy to give plenty her diamonds, but at
the same time, I dont want to be played, so
I also expect her to want to give me gold.
And if she doesn't, it means she doesnt care about
me, is using me, or it means I am being played,
or I am stupid.

As well, experience has also showed me that
'friends first' almost NEVER results in a
relationship. I mean how many of your BFs were
your friend first (chick usually replies..uh,
zero).

Exactly, so that is why I never play 'friends
first'. Friends first means diamonds for the
lady, and no gold for the guy. That is like
the guy saying (ok, lets fuck for 6 months,
and if its good, we can go to dinner, and go
out, and you can be my GF). Would you like
that (chick: yelch!!).

Exactly.. so that is why it is far better,
that the lady meet me, get to know me, and
then I expect her to be smart enough to know
to take that chance THEN (or reject it, and I will
go get another lady) when it is offered to her.

So that is why I expect things that way in a
relationship with a lady.

After this, a chick is (usually) quite impressed,
or surprised and doesnt know what to say..

[When I recited this to psychicbabe, she actually told me
she was very impressed, that I understood relationships
so well ;-) ]

Had I been smart, I would have used it on HB
geek, and laid her, but after that failure I
thought about it, and then when the same situation
came up with Psychicbabe this week, I knew what
to do..

Ok, now on to other comments..

RJ writes
>Maniac writes:
> >I regroup my thoughts.
>
>  I admire your ability to do this in the field, Maniac. As you think
about it,
> what do you do internally to re-set yourself and keep yourself in a
good frame
> of mind when all this shit throws your way?

A couple things.. first, this PARTICULAR chick is of no importance
to me, because I am (likely) seeing 3 others this week. So it is
not as risky to me to be firm, and keep my ground.

Another important fact, is the way chick's brains are usually
wired. For a
chick, once she likes a given guy, it is hard for her to immediately
switch to another guy. it is far MORE risky, because a chick (unlike
men), usually cannot switch to another guy, once she ALREADY
likes a given guy (story is different BEFORE you got her to
like you..then SHE has more power than you).

So I play on this, and as a result I dont feel nervous/scared at all,
because there is far more to risk to her, than to risk to me. Because
she is stuck to me, but I am not stuck to her. (this also is why
'jerks' can get away with so much shit on any given chick, and why
she will tolerate it.. because her brain has now got her focussed
on THAT guy, and it is now a choice (in her mind), between him (and
his bullshit... or being alone (sure she can get another guy in 10
minutes, but she cannot build those nice feelings of 'attachment'
in 10 minutes.. that gives us men power, once we realize this).

Two, I am generally a very balanced level
headed person, and dont take any of this personally (as you already
know, RJ). Three (in this case), I had
already laid this chick, so I didnt care really if I laid her again
or not.. I already conquered her, and she (and I) already knew that.

If it is a new chick, sometimes, I get more nervous/fucked up (see
HB Geek). I am trying to keep my senses more when this happens

> > Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
> >problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
> >her last week, apparently).
>
> Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with
fucking; it feels

Not sure about this, I think she just simply wanted the fuck, but
wanted to feel she was important to me, and she didnt want to just
get played..

> good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the
vulnerabilities.  So
> when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which
overcomes the
> potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. She's worried
about pain

yes, thats right.

> so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not
only losing
> out on the pleasure of screwing,

Not really. I actually made it clear to her that I didnt care if
she bang me or not. The point was that she had to give her mind
to me, and respect me, and follow me (whether that is bang me,
make her take off her clothes in the window for me, or do my
dishes..whatever.. its not the banging that is important, it is
the submission to me that counts, and what she needs to give me
if she wants my attention at all).

> BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
> believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out
that if
> she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even
WORSE
> crack-up.

Yes

>   Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.
>
> >he gets upset, and starts
> >screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
> >just like her ex-bf,
>
> See? The fear of the pain of being hurt just like her ex-BF hurt her
is now
> rearing its ugly head.  She doesn't seem like a very emotionally
stable person
> in ANY event, let alone having just been dumped by a guy.

No, she is not stable at all. I think though, it is because she
bottles it up all day, to be the 'office bitch' that she has to
be in the daytime. This chick lives for her work. She has no other
life.

>
> >Then I go on to tell
> >her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
> >that did NOT happen
>
>  Sharp thinking. Again, what do you do internally to keep your state
solid and
> your thinking sharp? THAT process internally is of great value, even
more than
> the specifics you share.  The specifics are like handing guys fish;
good for a
> nice meal and of value. But  how you get to the mind-set is TEACHING
someone
> HOW to fish so they can eat for life.

Actually, the specifics are important I think. This is why lay/field
reports with details are so important. I think really shitty on my
feet. I really suck.. bad.

But if I have had that same experience before (with another chick),
or been in that same situation before, and
either succeeded (or failed, and then thought about how to handle it
right the next time), then I will handle it correctly this time.

I really believe in field experience. I have alot... really alot.
so I have seen many of these situations before. It is like chess,
or a foreign language. If you've been there before, and worked out
a solution, then you know what to do. You MUST get field experience.
It is CRUCIAL. And each time you fail, you go home, and see what
you did right/wrong, and what you would do if the same situation
happened again. This is why I also post the fuckup as well as
the lay reports.. they are very valuable to me in gathering my
thoughts and forcing me to think about what I did right/wrong,
as well as listening to the other's comments about them on this
NG.

I also look at the other's reports as well, and learn about
situations, and ask myself for each one, if it happened to me,
what would I do/how would I handle it. Eventually, after doing it
for a couple years (I have been at this in ernest for about 2
years now), you get better at it. Learning situations in PU, is
like learning the words of a foreign language, and how to connect
them all together.. how to move from a bad situation..to a good
one to get the chick in a horny state..

Also, I keep in mind alot about what MrSex4uNYC says about attitude,
and when I get stuck, I ask myself, what would NYC tell me right
now about this situation. He is very congruent, and if you think
things this way, it is easy to be clear what is the right way or
wrong way.

> >I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
> >with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
> >with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
> >and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
> >unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
> >alone!
>
>  Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to
her her
> "ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she
can then
> accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!

Yes, basically that is the idea. I am not sure that it means I am
an authority, but its more, to convey that she is clueless, she
is wrong, so to listen to herself will make her fuck up even more..
..so maybe she had better listen to me instead, and then she wont
fuckup as much.. basically that is the idea..

>    Excellent...Maniac, I don't give a damn WHAT my orthodox SS
followers say,

I didn't get this.. What are orthodox SS followers, and I had no
idea they were saying anything about this.. I really dont understand
what you mean here..

> >Now what I am doing with all the above, is not arguing the logic (too
> >much)
> >of this, because, of course she is right, and I know this.
>
>  Actually, you ARE not arguing the logic, but you are USING the
logic...HER
> logic..HER way of viewing things.....pointing out WHY and HOW she
loses and
> what will happen if she doesn't stop it.   It's all centered around
losing and
> WHY she loses, based on what she has told you.  It IS logical, FROM
her point
> of view.

Yes, basically that is the idea. What I meant was, is that her main
point is that she wants a monogamous BF, and doesn't want to be played.
But, I am playing her, and she (at some level) realizes that, so
in essense, her gut feel about this is totally correct.

But I am playing her desire for the fuck, and her fear of losing
out, which lets me bypassing her gut feel that she is being
played, and then I can get her to fuck anyways.

Good followups everyone!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

-----

From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]
Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2001 12:10:23 GMT

  "Dohn Joe"  wrote:
>  wrote in message news:92n7b96
@nnrp1.deja.com...
> [snip]
>
> The more I think of it, the more this seems to be a great PU.
> I think the PU in England is the gist of your piece of work.
>o I'd be glad to see more
> details on how you picked her up in England, that's the hardest work. How
> did you stand up the crowd? How did you make it not look like a PU?

I was using psychological 'jujitsu' (use the strength of your
opponant, against themself). There is a field report from 2 months
ago, that outlines the PU (check fastseduction.com archives).
Basically, I met her at a conference. I didnt talk to her much.
Then I followed her onto a bus that was taking us to the next
meeting place. A guy was hitting on her, and he sat with her.
I sat on the seat in front bymyself.

She (like most british bitches), started complaining about how
she hates men, and other bullshit. The guy on the bus with her
is taking this/agreeing with it (if I remember right).

I just turned around (and tonality and eye contact here is crucial),
and just tell her in a VERY authoritative voice, slowly.. "perhaps
you have just not met the right man yet, one you understands you,
deeply, and completely. But.. you never know the future.. now do you..
I used killed eye contact, spoke slowly, and continued "perhaps
if you open your mind more, you might find him.. by surprise, without
even expecting it, because often, that is the way it usually is..see"

Psychicbabe went "maybe", and then started more manhating bitching.

I then described the kind of man she wanted "one you could rely on,
but at the same time, be mysterious, and exciting in some unexpected
ways, because he just knew how to reach you deep inside you, and
your mind.. that is what your looking for..isnt' it?"

Psychicbabe: yes,

{continue PU, bunches of stuff from the ManiacPlan, if I remember
right}

The key here was the tonality and Eye-Fuck contact. That is what
did it more than the words I used. I just totally crushed her
with it..

> How did
> you get past her "bitch office" shield? I'm asking especially because, as I
> picture this woman, it would seem pretty intimidating for me to approach
> her.

I had the attitude that she obviously had never met a man that
knew how to give it to her right, which means that she obviously
needed ME far more than I needed her. That mindset made it easy.

> I admire your ability to take her from there into total submission.
> existing relationship than guys. That's why many (even HOT ones) find
> themselves in a dead end - boring or abusive - relationship, love to
> complain about it to whoever they find to listen, yet are unable to step out

EXACTLY!!

> of it. That's why the first fuck is hard - after that she is bound
> emotionally to you. You see,

>Women's sexuality is DISSOLVED in them.

Yes! you understand it!! (true for most, but not all chicks though,
some just like sport fucking, like we do)

> GREAT words to remember for all us RAFCs when we feel like beating the walls
> after a fuckup... I myself am so darn depressed when coming back after an
> unsuccessful encounter with a chick. Yes, each field experience is one more
> lesson

Yes, do NOT underestimately field experience. It is SO important.
I fucked up TONS (see all the fuckup reports I used to post a couple
years ago on ASF), and I still fuckup alot (see HBGeek, or HockeyBabe).
Over on cliff's list they say it takes 2..4 years to get good
at something, and 10 years to be a master. I TOTALLY agree.
I have only been at this for 2.. 2 1/2 years. And the more I learn,
the more I realize I still need to learn.. There is still TONS that
I dont know yet.

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

----
From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:08 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

I, for one, am really GLAD to see a post from RJ that has helped me move
forward in MY game :)  not that I am an ingrate hehe... his contribution to all
this is UNDENIABLE to begin with and if I hadn't stumbeled onto his site, I
would have still been using my caveman tactics and my MENTAL seduction game
would still be lacking.  as much as I appreciate his contribution to the
seduction game in general, I had been disappointed with all the flaming and
nonsense that he and others had/have been involved with because I thought that
this NG was BASED on USEFUL interaction between him and the rest of us, but I
found that not to be the case :(  not that ANYONE gives a fuck what I have to
say about this, but I wanted to back up into the PAST to make it clear that I
appreciate RJ's PERSONAL contribution to the NG TODAY.

In article <20001230151247.26801.00001467@ng-fi1.aol.com>, erosla77@aol.com
(ErosLA77) writes:

>>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations
> 
>   Metahpor is a POWERFUL tool to move folks from a fixed perception to a new
>one. Please, share your story!

I have been doing this without identifying it:

A) find out her perception (marriage, monogamy, sucking dick VS kissing...)
B) "quote" her a story illustrating a chick that saw things a DIFFERENT way
(the way I want HER to see things) and benefitted GREATLY from it (she is still
with me, she got married to the guy she wanted, she gained inner peace and
self-love...)
C) watch her AGREE with something that she just minutes ago BELIEVED was
incorrect, or not for her.

the most fascinating part is (C) because I didn't realize my powers of
validation, pacing then LEADING had developed so strongly.  this is partially
because I am an empath and can FEEL when a chick moves into different emotional
states so I can relate to her from within her own state and effectively "vulcan
mind-meld" with her, turning the TWO of us into a SINGLE, functioning entity so
that I can dictate for US... to a degree.

a frequent situation is chicks asking me if I am single.  basically, I explain
to them that I am in an "open" relationship.  they practically INVARIABLY
disrespect my MLTR for being stupid. "how can she go for that?" "I would have
dumped you" "I would never let a man see other women"...  sooooo :)  I let them
go on and on and get it all out and completely ENTRENCH themselves in the DREAM
of them being with a man like me AND dumping me or CHANGING me or whatever
their BULLSHIT FANTASIES are at the time.  THEN I go into the BENEFITS of being
MY PRIMARY relationship... :)  when I stack up the LIST of BENEFITS and it
stacks HIGHER than those bitches have in their OWN RELATIONSHIPS RIGHT NOW,
they start thinking.  they think about what LITTLE they really have in their
relationships that MY MLTR is getting.  they think about the TRUST and
COMPANIONSHIP between us that they DON'T HAVE with their borefriends.  they
think about how she is SEXUALLY SATISFIED... DAILY if she wants it.  she has
someone to give her the REAL DEAL on how men are and what we want from
chicks... not someone that's going to keep playing her until he is finished
fucking her.  they ALSO see how the other bitches (like them in the near
future) come and go and MLTR CONSTANTLY receives the benefits of being with a
man that does EVERYTHING for her that she could want... for the MERE price of
NOT bailing because I fuck other chicks :)  once I break it down to them, ALLLL
I see on their faces is ENVY.  matter of fact, they tend to look EMBARRASSED
when I ask THEM about THEIR relationships.  oh, that reminds me... the bitches
that DON'T HAVE A MAN AT ALL fare the WORST in these situations.  my MLTR has
NEVER-ENDING SATISFACTION... they have STORIES of what they WOULD DO... IF
they could get a man AT ALL!  :)

chicks would rather have 20% of a WINNER than 100% of a LOSER!

>> Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>>her last week, apparently).
>
>Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with fucking; it
feels
>good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the vulnerabilities.  So
>when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which overcomes the
>potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. 

wow!  VERY powerful :)  I had really considered these to be apples and
oranges... pain of emotions after sex and pain of LOSS of the individual. 
however, discomfort is discomfort.  I quit giving UTILITY to this PIVOT I was
using because I realized she had ZERO self-esteem and not many other redeeming
qualities other than her looks.  she went from LJBF to NEXT overnight.  I had
been using her for a pivot because of her looks, but her lack of personality
started to wear on me and finally, she had to go.  no more hanging out, no more
phone calling, no more help with her love-life... nothing... cold turkey. 
completely FORGOT about her.  about a month or so later, the holiday season
comes around and she  A) calls me  B) tells me she bought me something for
christmas (I bought her NOTHING, not even a CARD and didn't bother to get one
when she told me she bought me something)  C) tells me she wants to bring it TO
my house, and  D) shows up with gift in hand, READY to socialize and spend time
with me.  

this is the SAME bitch that NEVER went in her purse to even OFFER to throw in
money when I used to use her for a pivot.  I didn't mind paying for her though
because the benefits I got from being out with an attractive chick that KNOWS I
am out to get OTHER bitches and facilitates that was well worth it :)  hehe... 
too bad for her, MLTR was over and I received her gift, talked to her for a
while (where she told me her recent "relationship" blew the fuck up in her face
:-) and then ejected her to keep having fun with MLTR.

I have been using outfoxer's style of letting bitches get involved in bullshit
relationships, TELLING THEM the relationships are bullshit then letting them
fall FLAT on their faces and come CRAWLING back to me :)  I just haven't added
the part yet where I get indignant that they are giving sex to CHUMPS that use
them like BITCHES and throw them away.  hehe it is fun enough at this point
just to hear about their FAILURES from the horses' mouths and see the sad looks
on their faces, while I am CONSTANTLY SMILING :)

what you described is BASICALLY what happened to her, except NOT in the sexual
content, but in the companionship content.  she THOUGHT she had a solid
position with me as my pivot, so she didn't feel like paying for anything
because she thought I NEEDED her, not WANTED her.  as soon as I didn't want her
anymore and dumped her from LJBF to NEXT, she was OK with it UNTIL her
relationship BACKFIRED... THEN she decides she wants to get back in good with
ME, which she can't do because I don't give a fuck about her and except for
looks, she can't compete with MLTR AT ALL!

the pain of loneliness overrides the emotional pain of sex without
committment... fascinating :)

>She's worried about
>pain, so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not only
>losing out on the pleasure of screwing, BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
>believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out that if
>she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even WORSE
>crack-up.
>
>  Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.

ok, this is interesting too.  "this is why you fucked up with your ex and I
feel the same way about that particular topic".  you are FORECASTING her
EJECTION unless she changes her ways.  she is still WITH YOU and has a chance
to do the right thing instead of getting ejected.  she already knows how it
feels to BE ejected by her EX and doesn't WANT to go through that pain AGAIN
with you.  you dictate to her HOW she could have avoided it with her EX and she
learns how to avoid it with you and gets in line.  this is another reason why
DICTATING what you REQUIRE from chicks is good, because they have the roadmap
to success or FAILURE with you.  as long as you have demonstrated personality
AND value BEFORE getting to this with her, she will be in a state of "how can I
get my hands on this guy... and KEEP him?" and then you will tell her what she
needs to do to be CONSIDERED amongst your TOP chicks and then is is up to her
to either fulfill her womanly duties or... as you predicted... get ejected and
feel the PAIN OF SEPERATION all over again with someone that she ALREADY knows
she WANTS to be with... WHATEVER the cost.

everyone has their price.  I find, most times, chicks are TALKING with no
EXPERIENCE.  a chick told me that she dumped her borefriend because he laughed
at her.  I told her that the sex must not have been good because otherwise she
would have had to use more than THAT to justify dumping an entire relationship.
 she CLAIMED that sex had nothing to do with her decision and that he didn't
RESPECT her was why she dumped him.  I told her that if the sex had been what
it is SUPPOSED to be... I GUARANTEE her that she would NOT have thrown THAT
away because of some laughing and disrespect.  I also proceeded to laugh at her
AND disrespect her IN HER FACE and told her I don't care because we are not
dating... she can't DUMP ME!   she never ADMITTED that I was right... BUT... by
the end of the conversation, she was asking me WHAT SHE SHOULD DO TO MAKE HER
LOVE LIFE BETTER!  :/  gotcha!

>>I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>>alone!
>
> Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to her her
>"ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she can then
>accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!  

yes.  I really have not been making the MOST of pacing and leading.  I have
been seeing where they ATTACH THEMSELVES to my way of thinking and see me as an
authority.  I have not used this to MAKE POLICY for them... merely to open
their minds and get them to think more efficiently.  you are right though. 
once you capture them... LEAD THEM!  make SOME efficient use of your new
followers... even if you were only practicing or passing time by capturing them
:)

excellent post :)

------

From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:10 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

In article <92n7b96@nnrp1.deja.com>, maniac_high@yahoo.com writes:

>After chick says bullshit about wanting to go to
>dinner and be friends or shit for 6 months before
>becoming a GF, I say: Actually, I dont go to dinner
>or stuff like that with ladies who are not my GF
>CHick:  gasps!
>Maniac: see, going to dinner, is an important step
>in a relationship for me. I only share it with someone
>special
>chick: Huh?
>Maniac: Well, let me put it this way, do you ever
>sleep with a guy who is just your friend, or dont
>care about?
>chick: of course not!

[lots of good use of Jake's shit snipped]

this is interesting, though I couldn't tell if this is something you are GOING
to do, or something you DID already.  either way, IF you are congruent, this
will serve you well as an alternate form of screening.  most of the time, I
screen by ASKING chicks shit and listening to their answers while watching
their faces and body-language.  another way to do it is to basically DICTATE to
them what I need to even CONSIDER being with a chick in any capacity
whatsoever.  most of the time I don't do this though because I can tell already
that the chick is worthless.  I usually get into DICTATION when she asks me
about myself.  am I attached?  what do I look for in a woman? etc.  THEN, since
she asked, I get into the reasons I have chosen women in the past and why I am
still with them in the present.  as I do that, I lay down my laws WITHOUT
telling the chick I am talking to that she needs to get in line with this shit
or get the fuck out of my face.  I have had a couple of chicks blow themselves
out after this.

I was talking to a chick that I know from YEARS ago that started calling me
again and talking about nothing.  I tolerated her for an hour or so on two
different days  A) because I was bored and  B) because through her speech
patterns and recurring ideas, I was learning if she was worth anything to me at
all, considering I get everything I want or need from MLTR in the first place,
she only had a VERY LIMITED use to me, as GOOD backup-pussy.  MLTR is smarter,
more interesting, more fun, less psychotic... basically TRUMPED her in all
areas, so this chick had NO CREDIT with me whatsoever.  I ended up getting into
PRECISELY what you did in your post.  the KICKER was when I told her "I don't
even TALK to girls that I don't want to fuck".  since I had not fucked her AND
had not suggested that we get together (she BELIEVES in monogamous
relationships for herself and even if she fucked me one time, it would be
merely to relieve her own personal stress and I am not going to be there for
her for that.  I am looking for MORE MLTRs... anything else can go fuck off.  I
laughed at her way of being AND broke it down to her why it was so stupid AND
let her know in NO UNCERTAIN TERMS that I was not going to be involved in
ANYTHING CLOSE to what she claims to want for herself... she can STAY HORNY for
all I care) she INTELLIGENTLY asked me WHY I was talking to her...  I let her
know that I found her amusing and her way of living ineffective.  I pointed out
to her that in the YEARS since I had spoken to her last, ALL she had to show
for it was a bungh of jibberish about WANTING a monogamous relationship that
she HAS NOT ATTAINED IN ALL THESE YEARS!  I let her know that I had predicted
that she would REMAIN dissatisfied for years to come and my talking to her
allowed me to follow her LACK of progress while, in the meantime, I get laid
EVERY DAY by MLTR :)   I have not heard from her SINCE that conversation...
good riddance.  she knew what she HAD to do if she wanted more of my time.  she
knew what she was going to have to do IF she wanted to socialize with me at
all.  she felt like her DEVOTION to the idea of a monogamous relationship with
a NON-EXISTANT man was more important than getting fucked by a guy that she
KNOWS and LIKES.  she is an idiot, and will remain horny UNTIL she fucks the
wrong guy, then has NO ONE to comfort her because I will not be there because
she had her chance and BLEW IT!

I have ZERO TOLERANCE for chicks that want things their way.  if they LIKE
doing things MY WAY, then they can be with me...maybe... for a while... as long
as they still LOOK HOT :)   when I approach chicks, I ASSUME they will fail the
screen because statistics show that I require A LOT from a chick and most of
them are either distracted by work or other relationships or just are not
QUALITY enough to be with me.  I find it amusing how ridiculous the SAME girls
are that I used to DESIRE to go out with and that I USED TO dislike being
rejected by.

now, I meet and REJECT girls daily.  not actively, just after I meet them, I
make NO EFFORT to remain in contact with them and go off to talk to other
chicks, leaving them wondering WHY I was interested enough to approach, but
BECAME DISINTERESTED and ejected for a SIMILARLY-GOOD-LOOKING bitch :)

Experiment Report! How kinky are your coworkers?!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



A practice session using the techniques of PU!


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: ]Experiment Report! How kinky are YOUR co-workers?!
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 08:03:45 GMT

]Experiment Report! How kinky are YOUR co-workers?!

This report is about finding the deep dark secrets of
your co-workers (not necessarily to fuck them, but as
a good experiment in state transitioning in groups
rather than one-on-one).

Note, for those readers living in repressed countries
still in the sexual dark ages like the Islamic
Republic of Iran, or the United Stated of America,
I do not advice attempting this..trouble with the
legal system, sex harrassment shit, or loss of
your job could result.. For the rest of you living
in countries that have both feet planted firmly in
the 20th century, no problem, lets rock on- here
is the report!


Recently, I have been doing alot of work practicing
state transitioning. Ie. the goal is to take a
chick (or in this case, group of chicks) from the
"idle state" (ie. thinking about office bullshit
and work they have to do), and transition them
to the kinky "lets get crazy and fuck state" as
quickly as possible, and in as few steps as possible
using a process that will be consistantly successful.

Last night, we had one of these (usually) boring
office departmental dinner parties at a stuffy
restaurant in town. BORING!!

So I decided what better place to liven things up
and see what I can get away with using psychological
warfare and a little bit of alcohol in an otherwise
formal group setting.

I get there, and sit at a table with 1 guy, and
5 chicks. For the first 30 minutes, it is boring,
I let everyone talk about boring office shit so
that everyone can arrive, and the food can start.

First I arrange the waiter to bring drinks to the
table (we need it later for one of the games I
am going to do), and get started on that right away.
One of the chicks only drinks tea, but that is OK,
later she really got into it anyways in spite of
being stark sober.

At the table is sitting:
ChinaGuy - he is from China
Mombabe - she is a mom, but wild & crazy, 40s (starts
          by sitting at another table)
HB CaptHook - she had a mild eye infection and is
              wearing an eyepatch this week (starts by
              sitting at another table)
HBStrict - she only drinks tea, but is more action
           than she looks
ScaredChick - she thinks we are all wierd
HBWhoMe? - she looks SO straight, but is the kinkiest
           at the table we find out!
Bichick - we find out she had enjoyed some bi games

Other assorted people sitting farther, who dont
play in the games really..

After that, I start. Here is how I did it. Refer
to the 'Maniac plan' post I made a couple weeks ago
(it is archived in fastseduction.com, I will also put
it on my site in Jan. when the next big update
happens) for some of the terminology below. I move
all the chicks (as a group), through all the states
as follows:

[Current State: Idle: chicks talking about office bullshit]
Maniac>Bichick: So what did you do this weekend?
Bichick: Nothing really.. how about you?
Maniac>I went to my dance circle, I like salsa dance
Bichick: oh really? {other chicks starting to listen}
Maniac: Yeah, I went to Brazil this year too, it was so
        much fun, wanna see my pictures?
Bichick & others: 'yes!' (take out my digi-PC, show pictures
        of carnival in Rio, tback bikini babes, the gay parade
        and debauchery in the streets)
Maniac: You know, the culture is SO different, brazilian people
        are SO passionate!
All chicks: oh really?
Maniac: yep, after I left Rio, I went to Sao Paolo, and
        went into this bar and all of the sudden this brazilian
        chick grabbed me and started french kissing me (perform
        SP chick story from ManiacPlan).

[Current State: (A)dmiration & (M)an now achieved from ManiacPlan]
Bichick: Oh, HB Capthook lived in brazil a few years!
Maniac: really? {I go to her table, ask if she wants to see
        some brazil carnival pictures with us.. she runs over
        to our table}
Maniac>all chicks: you know, I respected that SP chick though
       because she was not afraid to take what she wants..
       kind of like Madonna (perform the Madonna story from
       ManiacPlan).
Maniac: Perform 'how to communicate to lady at all levels
        and pay attention to her and what she wants' story
        from ManiacPlan, while doing lots of Kino on
        HBCapthook sitting next to me as a demonstration.
        Others are watching and getting jealous..

[Now try to introduce the (S)ex state from ManiacPlan..
the goal here is to do the "questions game, but in a
group setting.. so I decide to do it via a drinking game]
Maniac: {now I try to introduce a drinking game called 'I
       never'}, Hey, do they have any good drinking games in
       Japan.
Chicks: {they suggest some really lame boring shit like
         remembering names of subway stations..boring!!!}
Maniac: Well, I know two games, Chandelliers {I describe this
        game.. but we wont play it, not sexual}, and then
        "I never" {I describe "I never"}.
[Now here, I think I dont have enough rapport yet to start
"I never" (a drinking version of "questions") and get it to
work well (ie. sexually), so first I preform the "Strawberry
fields" game in a group (in next post, and included below)

<>>

We play the game: (mombabe hears us laughing, comes
over & kicks Chinaguy out of his chair so she can sit
next to us)

Among the answers to "strawberry fields"
Bichick: "uh, I dont see any fence around the field!"
HB Capthook & mombabe: "as many as I can eat!"
HBStrict: "to the farmer.. uh.. Thank you {and bow}"

We were all laughing and rolling on the floor to the
various chicks answers to this game, with lots of "I cant
believe you?! really?!" reactions among the ladies..

[Current state in ManiacPlan: (S)ex now achieved, now
lets intensify and see what these chicks will say/do.
I am putting LOTS of shoulder/back kino on all the
ladies as the game is playing]

Maniac: OK, time for another game, we will play that
 "I never" game we talked about before. {Maniac explains
 howto play "I never"} [easy.. each person takes a turn,
 say "I never xxx", whoever did "xxx" has to take a drink.
 start light, get game sexual ASAP..]

Maniac: here is the opening question: "I never kissed a
 member of the opposite sex before I was 15 y.o."
{3 girls drink}
Maniac: your turn HBCaptHook
HBCaptHook: uh, I dont understand the game yet, can you do
  the next question Maniac?
Maniac: OK, I never kissed a guy on the first date
{we all drink}
HBCaptHook: OK I get it, my turn "I never had sex with a
 guy on the first date" {notice because of the setup with
 straberry fields here, that the chicks ON THEIR OWN, turned
 the game sexual without me having to do anything! This was
 what I worried about if I were to start the "I never" game
 before straberry fields.. the mood was just not sexual
 enough yet, and the game would have fizzled.. but now..
 no problem!}
{all but 1 chick drinks (HB afraid.. who is looking a bit
 uncomfortable now)}
Mombabe: I never kissed a member of the same sex
{Bichick drinks!.. lots of "oh really?!? and discussion
 ensues, but bichick wont delve into it anymore ;-) }
Bichick: I never had sex with more than 4 people in the
 room.
{bichick, HBstrict and HBWhoMe all drink!}
HBAfraid: I never went to california
{we all look at her wierd.. skip to next girl}
HBWhoMe: I never did sex as part of a performance in front
of others
{Maniac, Bichick and HBWhoMe drink.. HBStrict looks envious,
others gasp and are laughing.. rest of our dept, is looking
at us, like why we are having so much fun, and a bit wierdly,
fortunately they cannot hear what we are saying ;-)}
Maniac: I never had sex with someone and didn't know their
 name till the next morning.
{We all drink except HB afraid}
MomBabe: I never used tool, or vibrator during sex
{we all drink}
HBCaptHook: I never had sex with a cat?!
{we all look at her wierd.. no one drinks}
HBCaptHook: but it can happen, I saw it on video once!
{we look at her more strange, and make her drink for watching
the video}
HBAfraid: I cant think of any question
{we skip her, next girl}
..
Maniac: I never was tied/tied up my partner during sex
{Maniac, HB strict, HBCapthook and HBWhome all drink}

Maniac: I see, so who is "S", and who is "M" {explain to
 a couple clueless chicks which was which}
HBWhoMe and HBStrict are serious S type, Bichick is both.
HBStrict makes a pass at me, and I reply only if you are
serious.. she stares at me long (maybe a future there ;-) )
I shake hands and hug HBWhoMe, who is really into this
thread of questioning.

Mombabe now makes ajoke about why I went to lunch today
with this other chick (not in the game), and not her. I
tell her because she didn't ask me.. girls have to take
what they want, like that SP chick. I ask her if she
likes me, she says yes, and I gesture (and get) a cheek
kiss. I am CERTAIN I could have done a KC, or even one
of those 3way KCs, but I remember that this is an
experiment, and I do have to see all these people on Monday
again at work, so I dont push it.

now adminbabe (the dept head's secy) comes by our table
and asks how many of us are going to the prescheduled
after-party karaoke. Mombabe replies "none of us, we are
all going to a hotel".. HBCapthook adds in "a love hotel..".

[Final state: Dying to fuck: achieved]

Adminbabe looks at us wierd (she missed the whole thing),
and leaves. Mombabe now asks why I have such a harem tonight,
and then Bichick remarks how all the ladies in the office
really really like you Maniac.

I ask 'why?'
bichick says.. you smile, and laugh alot.. but there is
something else.. we all see it, but cant really
describe what it is {maniac opinion.. it is the way
I stare at chicks with the 'fuck me' luck, and all the
shoulder kino..etc, I do, even in the office}.

Supper now is wrapping up, we all have to go, I remark
that this table is fun, and that another night, we should
all meet again for beer and fun.. everyone agrees.

As we are going back, HBCaptHook and mombabe are grabbing
all over me, it was funny.

Some go home, and I split off from the group, as I have
a date with karatebabe at midnight in another part of
town..

Experiment over..

I learned that state transitioning is a very predictable,
reproduceable process, once you learn the tools to do it.
This was just my office staff that is around me, so made
a good subject for the experiment. I also realized, that
in groups, there is a sort of feed back effect, so you
can really accelerate things. It wasnt the alcohol because
HBstrict had nothing to drink, but was well into the
game too.

Because it was a group, I could skip steps "BVG,D,O" in
the ManiacPlan, and reach the last state.. (dying to fuck)
so I likely could have taken any (or all)
of those ladies back for a wild time in the sack (which I
wont do, because I work with them.. but there was nothing
stopping it, thats for sure)..

Fascinating..

Constructive Opinions/comments anyone?

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Doing proper ‘closes’

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



A practice session using the techniques of PU!


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: ]Experiment Report! How kinky are YOUR co-workers?!
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 08:03:45 GMT

]Experiment Report! How kinky are YOUR co-workers?!

This report is about finding the deep dark secrets of
your co-workers (not necessarily to fuck them, but as
a good experiment in state transitioning in groups
rather than one-on-one).

Note, for those readers living in repressed countries
still in the sexual dark ages like the Islamic
Republic of Iran, or the United Stated of America,
I do not advice attempting this..trouble with the
legal system, sex harrassment shit, or loss of
your job could result.. For the rest of you living
in countries that have both feet planted firmly in
the 20th century, no problem, lets rock on- here
is the report!


Recently, I have been doing alot of work practicing
state transitioning. Ie. the goal is to take a
chick (or in this case, group of chicks) from the
"idle state" (ie. thinking about office bullshit
and work they have to do), and transition them
to the kinky "lets get crazy and fuck state" as
quickly as possible, and in as few steps as possible
using a process that will be consistantly successful.

Last night, we had one of these (usually) boring
office departmental dinner parties at a stuffy
restaurant in town. BORING!!

So I decided what better place to liven things up
and see what I can get away with using psychological
warfare and a little bit of alcohol in an otherwise
formal group setting.

I get there, and sit at a table with 1 guy, and
5 chicks. For the first 30 minutes, it is boring,
I let everyone talk about boring office shit so
that everyone can arrive, and the food can start.

First I arrange the waiter to bring drinks to the
table (we need it later for one of the games I
am going to do), and get started on that right away.
One of the chicks only drinks tea, but that is OK,
later she really got into it anyways in spite of
being stark sober.

At the table is sitting:
ChinaGuy - he is from China
Mombabe - she is a mom, but wild & crazy, 40s (starts
          by sitting at another table)
HB CaptHook - she had a mild eye infection and is
              wearing an eyepatch this week (starts by
              sitting at another table)
HBStrict - she only drinks tea, but is more action
           than she looks
ScaredChick - she thinks we are all wierd
HBWhoMe? - she looks SO straight, but is the kinkiest
           at the table we find out!
Bichick - we find out she had enjoyed some bi games

Other assorted people sitting farther, who dont
play in the games really..

After that, I start. Here is how I did it. Refer
to the 'Maniac plan' post I made a couple weeks ago
(it is archived in fastseduction.com, I will also put
it on my site in Jan. when the next big update
happens) for some of the terminology below. I move
all the chicks (as a group), through all the states
as follows:

[Current State: Idle: chicks talking about office bullshit]
Maniac>Bichick: So what did you do this weekend?
Bichick: Nothing really.. how about you?
Maniac>I went to my dance circle, I like salsa dance
Bichick: oh really? {other chicks starting to listen}
Maniac: Yeah, I went to Brazil this year too, it was so
        much fun, wanna see my pictures?
Bichick & others: 'yes!' (take out my digi-PC, show pictures
        of carnival in Rio, tback bikini babes, the gay parade
        and debauchery in the streets)
Maniac: You know, the culture is SO different, brazilian people
        are SO passionate!
All chicks: oh really?
Maniac: yep, after I left Rio, I went to Sao Paolo, and
        went into this bar and all of the sudden this brazilian
        chick grabbed me and started french kissing me (perform
        SP chick story from ManiacPlan).

[Current State: (A)dmiration & (M)an now achieved from ManiacPlan]
Bichick: Oh, HB Capthook lived in brazil a few years!
Maniac: really? {I go to her table, ask if she wants to see
        some brazil carnival pictures with us.. she runs over
        to our table}
Maniac>all chicks: you know, I respected that SP chick though
       because she was not afraid to take what she wants..
       kind of like Madonna (perform the Madonna story from
       ManiacPlan).
Maniac: Perform 'how to communicate to lady at all levels
        and pay attention to her and what she wants' story
        from ManiacPlan, while doing lots of Kino on
        HBCapthook sitting next to me as a demonstration.
        Others are watching and getting jealous..

[Now try to introduce the (S)ex state from ManiacPlan..
the goal here is to do the "questions game, but in a
group setting.. so I decide to do it via a drinking game]
Maniac: {now I try to introduce a drinking game called 'I
       never'}, Hey, do they have any good drinking games in
       Japan.
Chicks: {they suggest some really lame boring shit like
         remembering names of subway stations..boring!!!}
Maniac: Well, I know two games, Chandelliers {I describe this
        game.. but we wont play it, not sexual}, and then
        "I never" {I describe "I never"}.
[Now here, I think I dont have enough rapport yet to start
"I never" (a drinking version of "questions") and get it to
work well (ie. sexually), so first I preform the "Strawberry
fields" game in a group (in next post, and included below)

<>>

We play the game: (mombabe hears us laughing, comes
over & kicks Chinaguy out of his chair so she can sit
next to us)

Among the answers to "strawberry fields"
Bichick: "uh, I dont see any fence around the field!"
HB Capthook & mombabe: "as many as I can eat!"
HBStrict: "to the farmer.. uh.. Thank you {and bow}"

We were all laughing and rolling on the floor to the
various chicks answers to this game, with lots of "I cant
believe you?! really?!" reactions among the ladies..

[Current state in ManiacPlan: (S)ex now achieved, now
lets intensify and see what these chicks will say/do.
I am putting LOTS of shoulder/back kino on all the
ladies as the game is playing]

Maniac: OK, time for another game, we will play that
 "I never" game we talked about before. {Maniac explains
 howto play "I never"} [easy.. each person takes a turn,
 say "I never xxx", whoever did "xxx" has to take a drink.
 start light, get game sexual ASAP..]

Maniac: here is the opening question: "I never kissed a
 member of the opposite sex before I was 15 y.o."
{3 girls drink}
Maniac: your turn HBCaptHook
HBCaptHook: uh, I dont understand the game yet, can you do
  the next question Maniac?
Maniac: OK, I never kissed a guy on the first date
{we all drink}
HBCaptHook: OK I get it, my turn "I never had sex with a
 guy on the first date" {notice because of the setup with
 straberry fields here, that the chicks ON THEIR OWN, turned
 the game sexual without me having to do anything! This was
 what I worried about if I were to start the "I never" game
 before straberry fields.. the mood was just not sexual
 enough yet, and the game would have fizzled.. but now..
 no problem!}
{all but 1 chick drinks (HB afraid.. who is looking a bit
 uncomfortable now)}
Mombabe: I never kissed a member of the same sex
{Bichick drinks!.. lots of "oh really?!? and discussion
 ensues, but bichick wont delve into it anymore ;-) }
Bichick: I never had sex with more than 4 people in the
 room.
{bichick, HBstrict and HBWhoMe all drink!}
HBAfraid: I never went to california
{we all look at her wierd.. skip to next girl}
HBWhoMe: I never did sex as part of a performance in front
of others
{Maniac, Bichick and HBWhoMe drink.. HBStrict looks envious,
others gasp and are laughing.. rest of our dept, is looking
at us, like why we are having so much fun, and a bit wierdly,
fortunately they cannot hear what we are saying ;-)}
Maniac: I never had sex with someone and didn't know their
 name till the next morning.
{We all drink except HB afraid}
MomBabe: I never used tool, or vibrator during sex
{we all drink}
HBCaptHook: I never had sex with a cat?!
{we all look at her wierd.. no one drinks}
HBCaptHook: but it can happen, I saw it on video once!
{we look at her more strange, and make her drink for watching
the video}
HBAfraid: I cant think of any question
{we skip her, next girl}
..
Maniac: I never was tied/tied up my partner during sex
{Maniac, HB strict, HBCapthook and HBWhome all drink}

Maniac: I see, so who is "S", and who is "M" {explain to
 a couple clueless chicks which was which}
HBWhoMe and HBStrict are serious S type, Bichick is both.
HBStrict makes a pass at me, and I reply only if you are
serious.. she stares at me long (maybe a future there ;-) )
I shake hands and hug HBWhoMe, who is really into this
thread of questioning.

Mombabe now makes ajoke about why I went to lunch today
with this other chick (not in the game), and not her. I
tell her because she didn't ask me.. girls have to take
what they want, like that SP chick. I ask her if she
likes me, she says yes, and I gesture (and get) a cheek
kiss. I am CERTAIN I could have done a KC, or even one
of those 3way KCs, but I remember that this is an
experiment, and I do have to see all these people on Monday
again at work, so I dont push it.

now adminbabe (the dept head's secy) comes by our table
and asks how many of us are going to the prescheduled
after-party karaoke. Mombabe replies "none of us, we are
all going to a hotel".. HBCapthook adds in "a love hotel..".

[Final state: Dying to fuck: achieved]

Adminbabe looks at us wierd (she missed the whole thing),
and leaves. Mombabe now asks why I have such a harem tonight,
and then Bichick remarks how all the ladies in the office
really really like you Maniac.

I ask 'why?'
bichick says.. you smile, and laugh alot.. but there is
something else.. we all see it, but cant really
describe what it is {maniac opinion.. it is the way
I stare at chicks with the 'fuck me' luck, and all the
shoulder kino..etc, I do, even in the office}.

Supper now is wrapping up, we all have to go, I remark
that this table is fun, and that another night, we should
all meet again for beer and fun.. everyone agrees.

As we are going back, HBCaptHook and mombabe are grabbing
all over me, it was funny.

Some go home, and I split off from the group, as I have
a date with karatebabe at midnight in another part of
town..

Experiment over..

I learned that state transitioning is a very predictable,
reproduceable process, once you learn the tools to do it.
This was just my office staff that is around me, so made
a good subject for the experiment. I also realized, that
in groups, there is a sort of feed back effect, so you
can really accelerate things. It wasnt the alcohol because
HBstrict had nothing to drink, but was well into the
game too.

Because it was a group, I could skip steps "BVG,D,O" in
the ManiacPlan, and reach the last state.. (dying to fuck)
so I likely could have taken any (or all)
of those ladies back for a wild time in the sack (which I
wont do, because I work with them.. but there was nothing
stopping it, thats for sure)..

Fascinating..

Constructive Opinions/comments anyone?

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Maniac High's Pick Up Girls Guide and Seduction Website! » field

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Maniac uses a power opener to meet and tongue down a chick!


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Maniac meets HBOrderMe! Bar PU
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 05:00:36 GMT

Maniac meets HBOrderMe! Bar PU
001215

This is an interesting bar PU. .
used it to not lay the chick, but to get higher rapport
with the other guys around.

It is bo-nen-kai (end of year party) season in Japan.
After the party (boring, in a big hotel ballroom)
we go to the ni-ji-kai (after party) in a bar/disco
in Roppongi with a bunch of my coworkers (mostly guys,
and some ladies).

One AFC guy is really into this HB. He is making every
AFC mistake in the book (saying she is pretty, sucking
up to her..blah). Progress is really slow.

Me and all the guys are watching. He gets frustrated and
leaves for a bit. I move in on the chick (she is wearing
a high cut black dress, and fishnet stockings... very cute).

My opener is the strawberry game.. I just go up to her,
and say 'imagine you are in a field, and you see a strawberry
field ahead of you, with a fence around.. how high is the
fence'. She goes right into it.

Then I do the interpretation (see strawberry game post
for the game and interpretation) for her. I ask her what
she thinks (she said 1m high fence, 50 strawberries, sorry
to the farmer). She disagrees the interpretation. Then I
ask her what is your idea guy like (brad pitt). Then I say
besides his looks why you like him. Reply: he is really
guy.

Then I ask, what do you want most in a guy's character.
She says, 'I want him to lead, to decide for me what to do.'
Good.. Maniac keeps that in mind for what comes next. .

AFC guy comes back, and I let him have his chick back for
a while. He is doing more regular AFC stuff, though he
has at least initiated kino.. very good. He does this for
like 20 minutes, but isn't really breaking through.

He gets frustrated, goes. I tell the guys 'watch this',
and go up to the chick, and say I am going now, give me a
kiss. I get a cheek kiss.

I look straight into her eyes, and tell her 'thats not
good enough, look into my eyes.. what do you see.. now
give me a real kiss..' a long tonguedown with sexual kino
ensues.. Everyone else sees what I just did, after spending
not even a total of 5 minutes talking with this chick
from before.

I leave the chick, and go back to the guys.. 'that is how
it is supposed to be done'. Respect of me from my guy co-workers
now goes up 10x from whatever it was before, and was visibly
different in the office the next day.

AFC co-worker comes back and tells me how so much he is
in love with this girl (I guess he knew her from before as
a friend or co-worker or something..not sure.. I had never
met her before though). As a result, I defer to him, and let
him get AFC'd out.

I go back to the other guys, and just say, I could take her
(she lives really close actually, so I could just say I
live far and can I crash at her place.. I am sure the answer
would have been yes) whenever I want. They say 'why dont you'?

I reply, well, AFC guy is really into her, and he is a coworker
of mine who I respect, so I dont want to take his chick away
from him. There are lots of chicks to fuck, and this one means
nothing to me at all, but she is important to him, so best to
leave it at that.

I go on to say that all I wanted to know is that I COULD take her
home if I want (and I might next week or something, I got her
number) and now I know that, so it is enough for me, I dont
need more.

Respect from co-workers now goes up another 10x for this, because
I and they KNOW that this is true after what they just saw. .

He continues to AFC for a long while, and I get tired and go
home. Next day I hear that she blew him out almost as soon as I
left.

Now this was cool, because the goal wasn't really to lay the
chick (which I still might if I decide to see her again), but to
increase stature with co-workers, which can help in other ways
in my regular life.

Now one thing to note, is that I cannot do this every time (heck
not even close.. this is like the 3rd or 4th time it has ever happened
so directly like this). I was
really lucky, because of what she said to my 'what you like in
guy question', it was just so EASY to know what this chick
expected me to do, and it was really easy to stage it to happen
in front of all the other guys once I clued in on this.

I WISH I could do it everytime, but life isnt really like that ;-)
Mr. SMooth can do it though!

Constructive comments and opinions welcome!
Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Using the ‘color’ game to PU!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Using the 'color game' to do a PU!


From: tonymcneill@my-deja.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Colours Game - opinions?
Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 00:43:35 GMT

 Hi Guys,

I've just field tested this pattern / game for creating an erotic and
horny state - worked a dream:) I'd be interested to know what you think
of this and how it might be improved.....

I suppose it might work best with the more visually thinking babes.

This is not a 'word for word' pattern by any means, by the way - I just
kind of found myself going into it on the fly.....  here we go..

The PUA "notices" the colour (UK spelling by the way for those who might
feel the urge to correct me) of an object, item of clothing etc.

PUA - "I find these yellow walls (or whatever) quite uplifting;
especially in the winter. Isn't it nice to have some bright colours
around when it's so grey and dark outside?" "Do you think that colours
have an big effect on peoples' moods?".

HB - "Oh, yes, definitely."

PUA - "Hmmm. I was just wondering......I mean....... I was in one of
those New Age shops recently and they were selling lots of different
coloured sunglasses.... with the idea that, if you wanted to feel more
of a certain mood, or to look at the world in a certain way, you would
slip on a pair of sunglasses which would colour everything you looked at
in the desired tone" "Do you think that could work in any way?"

HB - "Well, maybe. I don't know really"

PUA - "Well, for example, my bedroom is a very pale blue colour and I
find this particular blue very restful" "I mean, can you imagine
sleeping very well in a pale blue room?" "Imagine you are really tired,
you know when your eyelids are heavy and you curl up with that fantastic
feeling of at last ... just letting go.... and .....giving
yourself...to....(sp perhaps?).. sleep'" "Do you have a sense of a
particular colour when you imagine that feeling?" (Make sure she's
imagining being sleepy).

HB - "Oh, maybe blue, or green" (or whatever). (If she doesn't come up
with one then maybe she could be asked to imagine the perfect colour for
a bedroom, but both of the HB subjects I tried got right into it.)

PUA "How about when you feel....really full of great ideas...... like
you have all sorts of inspiration flowing through you.?"

PUA then procedes to get HB to imagine a few other states (feeling very
inspired and spiritual (commenting on her choice of colour in a playful
way)...... bursting with energy ...... feeling very sensual,
relaxed and open (we're getting closer, gentlemen)......and eventually,
 being full of passion and horny), and slowly visualising a colour with
each one.

You get the picture - guiding her into these states,
comparing colours etc etc. I have tried this on two chicks, both of whom
LOVED the game and got right into imagining the states. One of them was
an ex who is of great value as a pivot / social proof (and a friend) so
I was testing the game with her rather than going for the lay and the
other HB, in spite of being pretty shy, blushed madly and was VISIBLY
remembering the joy of being fucked until she screamed with pleasure ;)
(At this point Tony is feeling a bit fucking pleased with himself).
I think this would have definitely resulted in a fuck had I not been
meeting her at lunchtime before going off to work :( (at this point Tony
is disgusted as well as pleased!!)

What do you 'real' PUAs think of this little game? As I said I somehow
went into it on the fly after having the idea while practicing
improvising patterns while driving, using things I saw on the road as
starting points for pattern-talk. So it's pretty new and I, as yet,
claim only to be a humble RAFC. Going to test it some more and post the
results....



Any suggestions or comments?

Tony

--
'Action' is the magic word

Setting up the Kiss Close

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com

A way to set up the kiss close

From: erosla77@aol.com (ErosLA77) Ross Jeffries
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 26 Dec 2000 19:23:44 GMT
Subject: Re: What if...

>Subject: Re: What if...
>From: eclipse19@my-deja.com
>Date: Tue, Dec 26, 2000 12:04 AM
>Message-id: <929jdt$u6t@nnrp1.deja.com>
>
>In article <9299s4$o03@nnrp1.deja.com>,
>  charnel1278@my-deja.com wrote:
>> Hey all,
>>
>> I've checked out a Maniac's, and some others websites and most say
>that
>> when you ask "Do you wanna kiss me?", you're guaranteed a kiss, unless
>> you get a flat out NO.  None, from what I saw, said what to do when
>you
>> get that NO.  Do you continue on the conversation like nothing
>> happened? Do you come back with a similar question later in the
>> evening?  If so, won't she kinda feel that you're badgering her?
>> Granted, this won't happen often, but what if?....
>>
>> Laters.
>
> the standard (canned) reply to a "no" answer is "YOU really know how
>to ruin a moment....your old boyfriends must have hated that about you"
>I think i got this off tony or maniac's site, forget which one. I
>havent ran into a direct "no" answer myself so i havent field tested
>this, but im sure others have. From what i read(or remember anyhow)
>this will leave them stunned and they will show less resistance against
>another kiss.
>
>

 Hmmm......well, I like this "you really know how to ruin a moment" response
WITHOUT asking for the kiss first. "Asking" for anything, outside of the
presence of fun(as in, on the spur of the moment saying, "Hey...wouldn't it be
fun to go to a strip club? Let's go!))  seems pretty pathetic to me.  

    A good one is to notice her giving you that look and then say(and I got
this from a student, it is NOT mine).  "If ? were to ask you on a scale of one
to ten, how good a kisser are you, what would you say?"

 Listen for her answer, then say, "If you were to kiss me right now, how do you
think I'd rate you?"

  You do this ONLY when you see "the look".......

  "let's find out" you say and kiss her.  

IF she backs away from that, then the "you really know how to ruin a moment"
comment works great.  Come to think of it, this could really work for a
cancellation as well. 

---

From: "General Snafu" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: What if...
Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2000 22:57:08 GMT

If she says no to a kiss, ask for a BJ.  If she says no to the BJ, you are
SOL for the night.

 wrote in message
news:9299s4$o03@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Hey all,
>
> I've checked out a Maniac's, and some others websites and most say that
> when you ask "Do you wanna kiss me?", you're guaranteed a kiss, unless
> you get a flat out NO.  None, from what I saw, said what to do when you
> get that NO.  Do you continue on the conversation like nothing
> happened? Do you come back with a similar question later in the
> evening?  If so, won't she kinda feel that you're badgering her?
> Granted, this won't happen often, but what if?....
>
> Laters.
>
>
> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/

Game: The Wall and the Forest

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Maniac introduces "The Wall and the Forest", a PU game.



From maniac_high@yahoo.com 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Game: The wall and the forest
Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 16:18:24 GMT

Another one of those mindfuck games like 4 questions or the cube:

"The Wall and the Forest"

-You are walking in a field, you see a wall, how high is it, and
how do you get by it? [wall = pride, and also how you get past
obstacles]

-you continue walking, and you see a house [kind of house you dream
to have later in life]

-you see a key on the ground, you go to the house, does the key
open the door? [if yes, means you can get married]

-you go in the house (if you were able to open with the key), and
 on the first floor you see a table and chairs, how many chairs are
 there? [means how many people in your future family]

-now you go outside, and see to one direction a dense dark forest, and
 the other way, a less dense/brighter wooded area. Which way do you
 go? (dark forest=expect something, but unknown, take a chance)
     (bright wooded area=easygoing style/way)

-as you walk you then see a lake nearby. How big is it, and how deep
 is it? (big=size of your heart, depth=depth of your heart)

THE END


This game could be lethal for chicks who want to get married or
something like that. Make sure you answer the right answers when
you tell her "what your answers were" after you finish her turn!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Game: Forest

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Nightlight introduces 'forest game'!



From: nightlight9@hotmail.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: More like "4 questions" game?
Date: Thu, 02 Nov 2000 19:50:10 GMT

You mention all these, but most of them are not very useful in the
initial meeting because they are too cerebral and too random.  Try ones
that are more viceral.  You are walking in a dark forest.  How do you
feel.  (how she approaches life).  You could to a wall with a door.
What do you do? (how she approaches obsticalls).  You look down and see
a cup on the ground what is it made out of? (how she views wealth).
You come to some water, describe it. (how she views sexuality).
Always end with sexuality because it is  a good topic for PU and
demonstrates you are comfortable with women and people a sexual context.

BookGuy, my comments are based on experience and field testing.  Please
do the same if you reply.

--
NightLight9
Just be yourself... smooth with interesting questions and interesting
answers.

Game: Strawberry Fields

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com


Maniac introduces a PU game: Strawberry Fields!
[Note, this originally comes from the book 'Kokology']


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Game!: Strawberry fields
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 08:02:40 GMT

Game!: Strawberry fields
001117

This is a game to find out some things about how chicks
see sex. It is very popular in Japan & is a good state
transitioner

--

Intro: Hey, lets play a game!

Imagine you are alone in a field, and see a straberry field
in front of you with tasty strawberries.

There is a fence/gate around the field. How high is it?
(= how easy is this girl/guy to take sex)

Now you are in the straberry field, how many straberries
do you take?
(=how many BFs/GFs that person wants)

Ok, after you have finished enjoying the strawberries,
how do you feel about the farmer, who's field you took them
from?
(=how you feel to that person after fucking them)


The end

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

TPUA night PU’s HB Smallmouth and converts to a lay!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

[TPUA PU's a chick at night, and converts it into a lay!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com
]


Date Posted: 2000/09/25 05:21:37 AM EDT
Author: Tokyopua 
Subject: Re: HB Small Mouth PU  (Was Re: Calling all Tokyo PUA's)

Hey Maniac,

I didnt really intend that last post of mine as a field report, since it
wasnt too detailed.  But yeah, things have been going well on the PU despite
my severely limited time. So I will attempt a bit of a field report on the
initial PU here.  My PU efficiency factor has been really high recently,
maybe because I am only trying to PU when I feel really confident and often
times when I wasnt planning on it, so was really relaxed. I did a PU on a 19
year old HB college student in the train the other night and got her home
phone number.  It was easy cause she was reading Tokyo Classified, and I
asked her about it. I was really confident, and in only 2 stops got her to
really dig me.  In fact, when I asked her why she had studied English, she
said "So I could meet a guy like you!"  The only problem is finding time to
meet her again before I leave.

The PU I did on HB Small Mouth was not planned either, I just saw her
walking back home around my place at midnight, and somehow knew that despite
my frazled appearance after 2 hours of Jujitsu practice and carrying 40
pounds of luggage, I could do the PU on her.  My opening line was "I like
your hair" which I knew was lame and she must have heard often, but hey,
thats the price of using the 3 second rule sometimes.  I immediately
followed with asking her if she was a student, what kind of work she did,
etc.  Oddly, I didnt use my standard opener "Do you speak english" in the
whole conversation.  I will post my personal notes on the rest of the PU at
the end of this post just for reference, but they arent too coherent.  They
were the basis though for the plans I laid for the successful next date that
got me laid 3 days later.  (If I have time someday I will write up full
notes on that too.) Total time to lay in terms of time invested was
approximately 3.5 hours, about the same as HB Physics, my other recent
street PU who I did that same day.  This efficiency is possible if the
progression is done just right, I think.

 wrote in message news:8qfler$o1r@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Tokyo PUA,
>
> This is an excellent report.. You really rock!
>
> Where / how did you originally
> PU this chick though? Also, taking the chick over to see your
> weight training stuff is a clever idea.. liked that..!
> BTW, I thought you left already to the USA, how long are you still
> there for?

Right near my house in a dark alley at midnight on her way home!  She told
me later (post lay) that she was scared at first, but I had a really relaxed
attitude so she got comfortable with me afterwards.  As for the weight
training stuff later, it was great kino as I had her bend over slightly and
got right behind her to "help her with her form" while simultaneously
letting her slightly feel the form of my stiff wood pressed against her, and
other such intimate situations.

Still here till Oct 14 or so, with a trip to Taiwan and maybe Hawaii too
thrown in.

>
> ALso, do you usually go out alone, or with a wing. I noticed that
> you knew quite a few people in Roppongi, I guess you get out there
> quite a bit?

Been out there a lot since last February, maybe 10 times or so.  I guess
predominantly I go with a wing, but sometimes felt it screwed up my game.
Of course, my wings didnt know anything about seduction a la ASF, thats
probably why.  Of course, neither did I till June... I know Im much better
at street PU when alone though, thats for sure!  OTOH, when I went out to
clubs with you and Rio, I think my game was really improved and I was
learning all the time.
BTW, I have heard that someplace called club Earth near hamamatucho has
really hot babes, (bitch shield too, but who cares, right;-), so you guys
might want to check that out.  3000 Yen cover charge.  May be the new
alternative to Fura?

>
> > I managed to lay that HB Small Mouth
>
> EXCELLENT!
>
> >Ganbatte!  Im seeting HB Bi this weekend again (tonight), and HB
> >small the next day, and my ex-GF the next.  Im starting to feel like
> >Maniac juggling girls, but nothing will happen w/ my ex, so its not
> >so bad.
>
> Yes, I did that ALOT last year, and fucked a shitload of chicks that
> I cant even count now..
>
> but its really tiring and you do get sick of it after a while..
> so finally I just MLTR'd a few that I really liked, who also accepted
> that I fuck other chicks, and left it at that.. guess I got to get out
> more ;-)
> not sure if its the right way yet, but been doing it that way
> the last few months now.. We'll see ;-)

I think it goes in cycles.  Eventually you get tired of the MLTR's and have
to replace them.  To do that you will have to PU lotsa new chicks, lay them,
see if they dont eject when you break the news that there are others.  That
takes a lot of time, so then you want to go back to the easy life of having
a bunch of girls on call.  Then the cycle starts over.  Im just beginning to
get these girls into MLTR status, but now I have to leave.  But theres
always business trips ack here!

>
> If you are planning on hanging around TOkyo though, you should
> bring HB Bi and her friend to one of our fuck parties the next time..
> sounds like they'd be a good time.. maybe introduce them to Kipp or
> something since I am not there right now, before you leave.. or
> give me your departure date and see if they are interested and we
> can setup something with all the ladies, if this is your sort of thing..

Id consider it, but it will take more effort, and probably wont be anything
I can do until after Im gone and come back for business trips.  You see, I
worked it too good with HB Bi.  She is signing her letters with "Love" at
the end and is all into me now.  Made me the most awesome meal any woman has
ever made me, washed my clothes, gave me an amazing massage, etc.  When I
confronted her about our last threesome, she said that she felt jealous when
she saw me doing her friend, and claimed that was the only time she had ever
done something like that, that she isnt really Bi.
So right now I think she somehow sees a relationship in this, despite my
leaving?  I figure once Im gone I can get past that as reality sinks in and
maybe set up more stuff for any business trips I make back.

>
> Good post!
>
> Maniac
> http://www.pickupguide.com

Here are those notes I was talking about, for what they are worth:

-------------------------------------------
PU of HB Small:  happened in a dark alley shortcut to my house at midnight,
I approached carrying a 30 pound backpack on one shoulder and a 10 pound
bucket of protein powder in the other, and said,  $B!H (BExcuse me, your hair is
really beautiful. $B!I (B  She reacted favorably and said thanks, but kept
walking, slightly faster.  She seemed young, so I asked if she was a
student.  She said no, I asked what she does.  She said she works for a
cable company, I fluff talked about watching TV.  She asked what I do.  I
said I know its late but you should have coffee or tea with me at Jonathans
restaurant nearby.  She said no, so I said, OK, how do we meet again.  She
said give me your number and I said,  $B!H (BAh, but I know women, if I give you
my number you will get nervous and never call. $B!I (B  She said  $B!H (BNo, 
that wont
happen I promise. $B!I (B  I knew I didn $B!G (Bt have enough rapport or 
anything to
believe that, so really what I was just doing was stalling till I could set
up a firm date.

I got a pen and wrote my number and at this point we are standing on the
corner near my place.  I play on Japanese cuteness and write my name with
hearts by it.  (None of this is stuff I would be able to do in the US.)
Then I say, OK, when are we going to meet.  Its sort of a way to pace the
ongoing reality now that she has my number,its a logical extension.  The
number is just a formality to me, I want to set up the date.  After some
negotiation, I get a date set up for 6 PM Tuesday, her day off.  I had given
her alternatives between my place and eating in Tachikawa nearby (but both
already had the presuppostion that we are meeting for a date, so I don $B!G (Bt
care which she chooses).  She chose Italian in Tachikawa which is perfect
cause eating carbs increases seratonin (=relaxation), so I will lay on the
patterning after a while, maybe even order a glass of wine (more seratonin
and romance) for us both.  Then its a 5 minute taxi ride back to my place!

Anyway, we keep talking.  I get that she never has met a foreigner, that she
likes Richard Gere, cause he is  $B!H (BShibui $B!I (B. $B!! (B(=quiet, simple, 
sober,
tasteful, austere, parsimonious, etc.)  I asked her about her ideal man
while doing the (SP) thing.  She really accessed a lot and I was awakening
her creative centers.  I touched her a lot on the arm to anchor the good
feelings.   She said she really was too ideal, but that her ideal guy was
like her father, sweet and nice.  I asked if she wanted a guy who made her
feel safe, and she said yes.  I compared our hand sizes and got kino,
remarked at how small her hands were, that my big hands could protect her.
Complemented her smile and said that it seems like her eyes smile too and
she said that she is often told that.  She said I was skillful at
complementing and I said that I really meant it.

I mirrored her body positions a lot and this seemed to have a good effect.
She seemed really into it and wasn $B!G (Bt trying too hard to get away despite 
it
being after midnight and having to work the next day, only bringing up the
time when I did.  She was rubbing her earlobe, and later playing with her
ponytail in a really sexy way, all with the doggy dinner bowl look.
I also showed kanji ability and had her write her name, and demonstrated how
we could study English together, all using the Zaurus.  (BTW, Did you buy
one yet, Maniac? A useful tool in many ways.  You can turn it into a
portable digital photo album too, albeit poor quality...) She liked that.
At one point she asked what was in the bucket, I said protein powder and she
said  $B!H (Bnomitai! $B!I (B and I said  $B!H (B5 fun dake areba, nomeru 
yo. $B!I (B
(If you have 5
minutes I can give you a taste).  But she refused to go to my apartment and
I didn $B!G (Bt press the issue, I just reconfirmed our fun date on Tuesday, and
gave her a kiss goodnight, then took off.
----------------------------------

-T

ASF reader comments on above story

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website: 

http://www.pickupguide.com 

Many excellent followups to the Psychicbabe re-lay report!
Mrsex4unyc, RJ..etc..etc.

From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:05 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

In article <92jvre$obh@nnrp1.deja.com>, maniac_high@yahoo.com writes:

>The immediate gold to take care of this, is to now make the
>relationship very high stakes for her. I can do this because
>I know that she is into me (from what she said at the dinner),
>so the idea is to play it that if she doesnt do her job as a
>chick.. she will lose EVERYTHING as far as I am concern.
>Ok, that is the plan, here we go:

plan or no plan, essentially, you are telling her the truth.  on a long-enough
timeline, the survival rate for EVERYONE is ZERO.  sooner or later, everyone
you love will either leave you or die.  chicks don't seem to believe in this,
though it is the absolute truth.  they think that they can relate to you
FOREVER, REGARDLESS of what they do or how they act.  you are telling her HOW
she can REMAIN with you and what is going to get her EJECTED.  even though it
takes a long time, so it doesn't SEEM like this... this is what has happened to
EVERY chick's relationship that has gone away.  EVENTUALLY, she was not
fulfilling her womanly duties and her man left her for a   chick (younger,
sexier, richer, swallower...)  EVEN if she IS fulfilling her duties, if her man
like it from another chick MORE, she loses out either in a PERCENTAGE of her
benefits or she gets DUMPED and loses ALL of her benefits.  you are merely
explaining this to her and telling her what she needs to do IF she wants to be
with you... which you have already determined.  you are SELLING, and now you
are screening her to see if she is QUALIFIED and ABLE to buy.

>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations
>in relationship. 

I am getting to the point where I am going to do this.  I never do this with
chicks because I morph into whatever THEY are looking for and hook them that
way.  the thing for me is that being 10 months in with MLTR, she has REALLY
learned how to please me and the time I spend TEACHING her has become minimal
and the time I spend ENJOYING her is increasing :)  it is getting tougher and
tougher for other chicks to get my attention, because anything LESS than what I
have already is BULLSHIT to me.  the time I am spending talking to chicks is
mostly eliciting values and breaking their perceptions... just for fun :)  I
know IMMEDIATELY if I want sex from a chick, and if I don't, she is IMMEDIATELY
LJBF and I use her for practice and NEXT her at the end of the conversation.

I am seriously going to consider moving to a "demonstration of value -> SOI"
model, just because I have lost my patience with LISTENING to these bitches
talking about shit that really doesn't mean anything.  I know I am going to
NEXT them ANYWAY as soon as I realize they can't compete with MLTR, so why
listen to their shit FIRST?  I may as well let them know how great I am and
let them know what kind of woman I am willing to accept, and let them continue
from there.  there is also the cognitive dissonance issue of them KNOWING that
I am going to dump them if they are not sexy and CONTINUING to talk to me and
get to know me.  the more they talk to me, the more I hook them into
interacting with me.  the more they get hooked, the greater the PAIN OF
SEPERATION (credit: RJ) when they eventually get EJECTED.  since they KNOW
ahead of time what will get them ejected and they are still talking, they are
either planning to get in line OR setting themselves up for pain.  either way,
after SOI and their acceptance of the terms, there will have to be some sort of
TEST of their compliance.  even listening to what they have to say after SOI
counts as a REWARD for their entering into a "relationship" with me.  hmm... I
will consider this more.

>I go on to tell her that other girls I know also
>like me, ask me out alot, (doesn't matter if it is true or not,
>but chick 'competition logic' will kick in, and it will scare
>your mark to act). 

the reason I don't use this is that MLTR is an integral part of my life.  if I
were to play this "chicks dig me" card, it would belittle the actual
relationship I have with MLTR.  the only problem with THAT is that I am
screening for MORE MLTRs :)  I don't give a fuck about ONS because I can get
laid ANY NIGHT within an hour of talking to the chick I am talking to... in the
WAY I want to with a chick that I WANT TO FUCK :)  a chick offering me ONS is
like a chick offering me a dollar bill.  I already HAVE dollar bills... what do
I want hers for?  of course, there are some chicks that are just so HOT that
you want to try them out, but barring that scenario, ONS can bring you much
more ANGUISH than the satisfaction that accompanies it... PLUS it is the SAME
SATISFACTION that I already get on a regular basis from MLTR. 

besides... it is OBVIOUS that chicks dig me because here SHE is, liking me
within 20 minutes of meeting me... what about the chicks that have experienced
me for days?  months?  years?  OH, she could only HOPE to be one of those! :)

for you, it is a good tactic though.

>Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>her last week, apparently).

I lost a rap to a low-self-esteem bitch that had a couple of relationships like
this as well.  I mean, I fucked her, but I didn't get to MLTR like I wanted
because she was SCARED that she wouldn't match up to the next bitch and that I
would NEXT her for no reason, like her exes did.  I tried to tell her I wanted
her for more than that, but she wasn't emotionally healthy enough to understand
or believe me.

>Ok, now Maniac has reached her head, and I take this deeper..
>I go on to tell her that I dont want just sex, I want rocks and gold
>I can get any girl in roppongi on a Saturday night and fuck her
>(not exactly true, but she doesnt know this.. goal is just to

she KNOWS that it happened to her VERY QUICKLY.  she ASSUMES she was not the
ONLY bitch to fall for you that quickly.  it is like reverse-social-proof. 
fucking a bitch FAST makes them think you can fuck other bitches FAST.

>'confirm' her worst fears so that she acts), but its not enough for
>me. I want connection, good sex, and romance, with an intelligent
>woman, and that is why I want to date you (psychicbabe).

nice line.  this is another thing I will consider.  talking-up MLTR to them.  
I never considered this either, MAINLY because if you tell a chick what you
want her to do then you never know if she is manipulating you by being that
way, or if she arrived there NATURALLY... on her own.  interesting, LOTS of
style-change material happening right around the new year :)

>Then all of the sudden, she asks me about HBass (the chick staying
>at my place over the holidays), and freaks out about it. I tell
>her that she already knows all this, and exactly what is her point
>here?

although I am a GREAT fan of "quoting", I find that there need to be times to
engage in it and times to NOT engage in it.  this will depend on what you want
with the chick.  it is the same way you can't go from being a CHUMP to a MAN in
a chick's eyes... but you CAN go from being a MAN into a CHUMP :)  if you start
out telling a chick that you have a girlfriend AND that you fuck her, you leave
yourself open for these pot-shots whenever chicks trip the fuck out and go into
their irrational rants from out of left-field.  all a bitch needs to know is
that you are "taken" so that you manage her relationship expectations.  any
more information and she feels like you will give her ALL the information. 
where does it stop?  are you going to tell her that you are fucking her?  that
you fucked her last night?  that you fucked her an hour before coming on this
date?  that you fucked YOUR WOMAN in her ass?  that she LIKES sucking dick? 
WHERE DOES IT STOP?

I ran into this problem with a chick where my relationship to her was BASED ON
trading current sex-stories.  when I got to the point where I didn't want to
tell her any more shit, she was EXPECTING me to tell her, and I realized that
if I wasn't telling her, and she wasn't telling me, then our "relationship" was
OVER.  before that, I had not realized how much I had compromised my position
by telling her CURRENT sex-shit.  think about it, and decide on your own LIMITS
to what you are willing to tell a chick about other chicks... besides, think
about the fact that she is going to KNOW that she will end up as STORIES to
other bitches right after you fuck her.  it will make her VERY self-conscious
about whatever she does with you and that could hinder her emotional states
tremendously.

>Then she stops again, and asks me if I am fucking her (maybe I
>should have said no..., but I had already said yes to her about this
>the first time I saw her)., she asks me why.. (I tell her because
>I am seeing her! like I told you the first time! I mean what do
>you expect?!?).
>
>She then puts on her bitch face, and talks in a stern voice,
>"then call me when you break her up, that is my decision, I am
>going home.".

THIS is retarded because she ALREADY knew that you were fucking her AND she
fucked you herself.  this is another problem with bitches having information
about other bitches.  they use it against themselves.  IMO, the purpose of her
knowing you have another girl or SEVERAL other girls is so she knows where she
stands in the RACE to be your MAIN BITCH.  if you are single, she has a good
chance at being that to you.  if you are "taken" she has NO CHANCE of being
that to you.  if you are SEEING bitches, then she has to COMPETE to be your #1.
 other than THAT, I think giving information about your other bitches is a
mistake...  I have made the SAME mistake up to this point, so I am not
crisicizing :)  however, I am changing that ASAP and I think you should
consider giving out information on a N2K basis (need to know).

besides, SHE is the one that NEEDS a fuck.  if it is not coming from YOU, a guy
she has fucked ALREADY and she LIKES how you did it or she wouldn't have come
back... she has to get it from a STRANGER whose sexual skills are in question
that might tie her up, fuck her in the ass or sell her to the highest bidder. 
bitches like to FRONT a lot about having ALL these sexual choices, but with all
the 8s, 9s, and 10s I have spoken to on an honest "one of the chicks" level,
they are ALL looking to have an EXCITING time, but not REALLY be in DANGER! 
you, OTOH have pussy AT HOME IN BED WAITING FOR YOU!  the only one to lose out
if she bails... is HER!  knowing that, I would have not even entertained her
bullshit OR called her on it, letting her know that I was getting laid tonight
REGARDLESS of whether SHE fucks or not.  that would take the fucking WIND out
of her sails :)

>I tell her I am planning to break her up (which is true) later, so
>it is nothing you should worry about. 

this, my friend :)  is a COP-OUT!  it is used VERY EFFECTIVELY by married men
to keep fucking their side-bitches, but WE are way above bullshit tactics like
this.  I commend you for thinking of this "on the fly", but PLEASE, PLEASE! 
hehe  I have MUCH more respect for you as a PUA than to hear some CRAP like
this from you :)  PLEASE think of something better for the next instance of a
chick trying to BLACKMAIL you into trading in a R-E-L-A-T-I-O-N-S-H-I-P where
you are getting EVERYTHING you want from a chick... for a ONS with HER! 
HAHAHAHAHAHA  >:)

I haven't run into a chick STUPID enough to try to disrespect my MLTR for being
with me... chicks have STARTED to say she is dumb for "letting" (as if she has
ANY say in the matter) her man fuck other chicks, and I have BROKEN THEIR
FUCKING ASSES listing the benefits that SHE is getting that they will most
likely NEVER have with a man... EVER!  and CERTAINLY don't have right now, or
they would not be talking to me in a bar... they would be with THEIR OWN MAN
conducting this FANTASY RELATIONSHIP that they are professing that my MLTR
should have :)  I have NEVER run into a chick that has even TRIED to break into
my relationship with MLTR because they KNOW I mean business.  all they can do
is become ANOTHER MLTR... and after they hear the QUALIFICATIONS, they KNOW
they can't even achieve THAT... only ONS and LJBF with me.  if some bitch EVER
suggested that I break up with MLTR in order to ONS her, I would  A) laugh in
her face and  B) immediately demand an EXPLANATION of the reasons why she
thinks she can knock MLTR out of the box AND make her perform ANY AND ALL
SKILLS that she CLAIMS to be better than MLTR at IMMEDIATELY!  put up or SHUT
THE FUCK UP!  the result would be the ONS ANYWAY, and she would still be LJBF
or NEXT because MLTR is NOT about sex... it is about compatability and I
PERSONALLY could not be with some bitch that needs to knock other chicks off in
order to gain status.  I gain status by BEING MYSELF and letting bitches make
INTELLIGENT, EDUCATED decisions to be with me.  any chick that wants to be with
me had better do the same.

>she gets upset, and starts
>screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
>just like her ex-bf, getting other girls while dating her, and how
>all guys just want sex..etc..

I would have told her "you wanna calm the fuck down?"  throwing tantrums and
making scenes are expressions of her ability to do ANYTHING in your presence. 
I personally don't tolerate that.

>Then she says.. ok, if you let me meet your GF at your house
>tonight, then I will let you have sex with me. [ha! I got her!]

ok.  thank God I happened to read the next line before I started typing this. 
I was JUST going to ask you WHY you are STILL letting her blackmail you into
fucking her... ESPECIALLY when she is the one that needs it and you don't :)

>I bounce back, and say, "what exactly makes you think I am
>desperate to have sex with you tonight?! Do you think I am
>just some stupid guy and you can manipulate me like that?
>No, you will not meet my GF, it is disrespectful to her to do
>that. You know the situation, it was clear to you from the
>beginning, and you accepted it. There is no more to talk about.
>I am not here only for sex, I can get that anywhere. Sex only
>of itself is of little value to me, I want more than that.

SWEET!  :)  break her fucking ASS maniac :)

>I then bring out the nuclear weapons! My tonality is very firm,
>and I eye fuck her, while telling her the following. First, I tell
>her that I already told her about my GF, she was clear about it
>right from the start, and she has NO excuse. Then I go on to tell
>her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
>that did NOT happen. So do NOT compare me to your ex. I am a
>different person, and EXCEPT better treatment than that if you
>ever want to see me again. She starts crying more, and hugging
>again.

ugh :/   fucking IDIOTS!   man, the shit some bitches put you through!  does
everyone SEE why we have to study this shit?

>I put her against wall, and tell her not to complain about me like
>I am her ex, I a am different person than he is.
>
>I tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>alone!

this is a good point.  I like to play it the other way:

ok... so now, you have told me that you want everything to be a 'perfect'
situation with a guy before making a move.  You want him to be ideal with
women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady... WHAT MAKES YOU THINK
HE WILL WANT YOU?   WHAT ARE YOU BRINGING TO THE TABLE THAT IS GOING TO MAKE A
MAN LIKE THAT CHOOSE YOU OVER ANY OTHER CHICK?

you wanna see some confusion?  you wanna see a bitch get BROKEN?  HAHAHAHA  >:)
 of course, I use this on chicks that I am just practicing on, because it
normally induces DEPRESSION, not horniness.  when they have to GO DEEP INSIDE
and dive BELOW THE SURFACE of their programming, they realize that they CAN NOT
TELL ME WHY A MAN WOULD WANT THEM!  they stall the fuck out dude :)  it's
amazing.  matter of fact, it's documented already.  look at my recent thread
with "telembe".  I let her say all this bullshit about what she wanted from a
guy in order to give up her virginity, then when she was finished talking about
what she WANTED, I asked her what she was OFFERING to a guy that was going to
give her all this committment and "love" and other bullshit and she said a
whole bunch of shit that ANY bitch can and WILL give to a man she likes.  she
might have THOUGHT she had something to offer a guy that was going to seperate
her from the pack, but she doesn't.  even GOOD PUSSY can't get a bitch any
credit because there are LOTS of bitches that can fuck and suck like pros...
elites AND sub-elites.  telembe NEVER told us what seperates her from the rest
of the bitches that might make a MAN like the one she wants even LOOK HER WAY! 
the reason is that there is NO reason! :)  bitches are programmed that MEN want
them... but they are NEVER told WHY.  the reason is that men like to FUCK and
get their dicks sucked.  they also like companionship and cooking and cleaning
and for a girl to look good on their arm so they can feel accomplished around
their buddies.  chicks THINK they are ENTITLED to a good man... but the GOOD
MEN... are picking GOOD WOMEN!  if they were SHINING like they think they are,
they would have been scooped up already and married or whatever they were
looking for because some guy would have spotted her and said "I'm not going to
let her go for ANYTHING" and she would be happy... at least according to her
programming.  OH, how I LOVE to see a bitch's face while she TRIES AND TRIES to
dig up ANY reason why a guy as great as the one she claims to want would EVER
choose her over any other bitch :)  the JOY the JOY that I feel as this POMPOUS
BITCH breaks the fuck down RIGHT IN FRONT OF MY FACE! :)  of course since I
broke her, I keep talking to her and ease her back to a decent state of being
and let her know that she can take steps to make herself into the woman that a
man would want, but she has to really KNOW HERSELF and KNOW MEN in order to
make an intelligent decision.  I am not into depressing chicks... unless they
TRULY DESERVE IT for all the depression they have caused men throughout their
tenure as FINE bitches :)  also, I have no desire to BREAK bitches and leave
them like that.  that just makes it WORSE for ALL OF US looking for FINE, yet
DECENT chicks.

>she cries, and says that is so true, that is her problem, she never
>takes the chance and loses out because she doesn't make the
>move on taken guys. Then I run my 'take chances routine' (if you take
>a chance, in the end, the result is usually good, but if you don't,
>just you get left behind, by yourself).. 

nice.  I like that one... emphasizing loss and loneliness.

>she cries more, says she
>needs to take the chance, and doesnt want to be alone.

she's done :)  nice work.  land her!

>She says she has to be careful, that all guys want just sex, and
>bitches about this for about 30 seconds.

as opposed to what?  what does she WANT guys to want?

>Now I start the 'you need me, I dont need you..you think I just want
>only sex, then you dont understand me at all.. if you think that is
>what I am only, then you do NOT deserve me.. I do no need you to go out
>with me if that is what you think I am.. I want connection, sex,
>passion, and closeness.. and if you haven't figured that out about
>me yet, then get another guy, because you dont understand me at all..

OK OK OK... you've CONVINCED me maniac :)  that's some good shit right there :)
 starting NOW, I am pitching for MLTR ONLY.  bitches that want ONS or LJBF will
get what they deserve from me... which isn't much.  I LOVE this idea of dissing
her for claiming that you are looking for ONS... or even just a "bootie-call"
type relationship :)  I love it.  I would feel so PROUD getting on her like
this.  sweet!  EXTREMELY congruent!  nice play!  this is going into my style,
starting RIGHT NOW!  :)

>I am doing this, because I know the left (logic) and right (emotions,
>passion) are fighting each other..they have been all night. Because the
>left doesn't accept the logic of the situation, but I know the right side
>dying for a shag,..she is trying to rationaize going out with a taken guy,
>but I have gotten her so excited tonight, that she needs that fuck.

THIS is the reason I never learned any of this shit until recently.  my
caveman-kino style before this involved ZERO talking.  totally kino and kissing
and PHYSICAL seduction with domineering EYE-CONTACT.  there was NO INFORMATION
for the left side to process at all.  EVERYTHING went STRAIGHT to the chick's
right side, and her left had to try to process the EMOTIONS and turn them into
a story that she could understand... in the meantime, she is PHYSICALLY falling
for the kino and wanting MORE AND MORE until we are fucking.  I never HAD to
talk to chicks before OR after fucking them because my PHYSICAL ATTACK is so
DEVASTATING!  I would just take them over PHYSICALLY and their right brains
would do ALL the work and the left would struggle to understand, but eventually
succumb to the onslaught!  ARG ARG! :)

thanks for explaining that to me :)

>As I touch her side of face, she goes doggy look, I kiss her, and she
>gets like screambabe, panting. I put leg between her, she widens, goes nuts
>totally. I ask her she likes me (in a tell her sort of way' you like me..'),
>she replies 'yes'. I say (stare her down) .. she asks "what should I do?"
>I say in a very strn fatherly voice while staring her down 4 inches from
>her head.. you will follow me..that is what you will do.. and you will do
>what I say. 'she says, 'I will'. I tongue her down more, run her crotch,
>she almost cums right there, then I take her to a love hotel (her first
>time!), no resistance what so ever.

interesting.  what just happened here?  did you somewhere dictate to her that
the terms of her being "your bitch" is that she has to sumbit to you fully? 
are you getting a verbal confirmation of that from her?  or is something else
going on... like she just plain UNDERSTANDS that you can move her to passions
that make her WANT to cum and that you are going to take her there and over the
edge?

another point... what do you guys think of foreplay on a chick.  he mentions
that she almost came right there... do you think it is good to get her to the
EDGE and leave her there so she is so horny, she will do ANYTHING for you to
make her cum, OR to give her an orgasm right there in her clothes to
demonstrate your sexual mastery over her?  personally, I am into the sexual
mastery thing because I notice a newfound RESPECT from a chick that has had
guys on top of her NAKED, fucking her for all they were worth and she never
came from it, and then I am just doing kino on her and fingering her and she
cums from just that.  do you think that making the chick cum on herself makes
her want sex MORE or want it LESS since she just got off?  take into account
that chicks are multi-orgasmic and that they feel sexier after cumming, not
DRAINED like guys.

>As I am fucking her, I am putting things in her head, like D.Shades reports.
>I tell her as she is screaming it feels deeper and deeper, closer and
>closer. She is going nuts will I am fucking her.

I need to reasearch this.  is this more right-brain, left-brain shit where her
left-brain is shut down because of the FIREWORKS that are going off in her mind
because of the sex, leaving her wide open to suggestion?  if you have any links
for this, please post.

>I stare her down, and I tell her you need me (during sex), she says yes.
>I tell her from now on you will follow me, and do what I say. She says
>'yes, I will'. I continue doing her, she says "it feels SO good, I really
>need that, I really want it, i love you inside me!".. she is fucking like a
>wild animal, loud voice, shouting and screaming, oh, I want it, give it
>to me, I want to come!

more of the same?

>Then she tells me anything is ok as long as I dont hate her..she doesnt
>want me to hate her. She wants me to hold/hug her, she cries a bit, then is
>ok again (seems to be thinking of her old bf she says). I touch her
>more, face goes totally doggy look, and finger her, she goes nuts, we start
>fucking again.

the "I don't want you to hate me" thing is very important in the D/s
relationship... not that you set this up like that, but that is the MAIN
incentive for her to follow your lead... that she does NOT want you to hate her
and CERTAINLY not to banish her.  when that is TRULY first and foremost in her
brain, she will regulate HERSELF and place herself in-line with your thinking
and what YOU want her to be.  she also won't try to blackmail you anymore
because she KNOWS it gets on your nerves and all THAT will do is get her
EJECTED sooner rather than later :)

>Her back is on the bed, and I am fucking her missionary, her legs are
>spread and wide in the air, which I am holding. I tell her "see, I control
>you, 

hehe ok... this is a little FAR-FETCHED for me at this point, but I have not
researched it yet :)  I DO like the next line though.

>I go deep in your body because it is the one way to reach you totally
>deep in your mind which no one else can do. 

interesting

>By conquering your body, I can
>conquer your mind (then I drill her a bit more after I finish the sentence so
>she goes more crazy). I play with your body because it lets me control
>your mind (then drill her some more..ha, it is like the ultimate form of
>reward hypnosis).

IS there such a thing as reward hypnosis?  links please? :)

>I ask her, so why you like me. She says she says, you are decisive and
>sometimes I am indecisive, so you make it easy for me. I want the guy
>to make it easy for me to decide what to do (important clue here Maniac!
>maybe most chicks are like this! Maybe this too is where I fucked up
>with HB Geek!)

I have heard this a lot too... only thing is that there is a lot of
RESPONSIBILITY that comes with telling a chick what to do, and if the VALUE of
owning her is not sufficient for me, I don't give a fuck WHAT she does enough
to want to lead her to a good time.

>Moral of the story.. keep your ground.. call all chick bullshit DIRECTLY.
>Make the chick risk fear losing the relationship if she doesn't capitulate
>and chances are she will back down, in spite of how it looks (and I could
>do this BECAUSE I had other choices.. another reason to be fucking
>several chicks at once). As well, it seemed that she was giving me all the
>bullshit in part because she WANTED me to call her on it, and then fuck her
good
>at the end of the night, which I obliged.

chicks give you shit-tests to find out if you are stronger than them and see
HOW you are going to control them.  chicks like the way I control them because
I NARROW their choices for them, but STILL make them choose.  they can choose
the path of ULTIMATE SATISFACTION, or they can choose the path of EJECTION and
being back on the dating scene meeting the SAME LAME GUYS every night :)

you had told her you had a girlfriend, but she seems to have NEEDED to know
that she really COULDN'T have you all to herself and that you really DIDN'T
NEED to fuck her that night or EVER.  you stuck to your guns (after letting her
get to you for a while :-) and she eventually ran out of logic and got
overridden with kino and gave up the fucking pussy like she came there to do :)

>Constructive comments/opinions welcome!
>
>Maniac High
>http://www.pickupguide.com

EXCELLENT!  keep up the GOOD WORK dude!  :)

---
From: erosla77@aol.com (ErosLA77)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 30 Dec 2000 20:12:47 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

>Subject: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit
special!]
>From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
>Date: Fri, Dec 29, 2000 10:37 PM
>Message-id: <92jvre$obh@nnrp1.deja.com>

>)this chick is a very highly educated, driven, professional
> career woman and earns likely a big 6 figure salary
>b)she is very mature, focused and spends all day in her office
> surrounded by sharks and other pirrhana type scumbag characters

 She's got to be in control ALL DAY LONG at work. Small wonder then, with a
man, she wants to fully SURRENDER control and be made to submit.  It's like all
those super-powerful Congressmen and Judges and the like who LOVE going to get
pissed-on and whipped by some Madame Dominatrix. 

>I regroup my thoughts.

 I admire your ability to do this in the field, Maniac. As you think about it,
what do you do internally to re-set yourself and keep yourself in a good frame
of mind when all this shit throws your way?

>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations

   Metahpor is a POWERFUL tool to move folks from a fixed perception to a new
one. Please, share your story!

> Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>her last week, apparently).

Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with fucking; it feels
good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the vulnerabilities.  So
when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which overcomes the
potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. She's worried about pain,
so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not only losing
out on the pleasure of screwing, BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out that if
she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even WORSE
crack-up.

  Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.

>he gets upset, and starts
>screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
>just like her ex-bf,

See? The fear of the pain of being hurt just like her ex-BF hurt her is now
rearing its ugly head.  She doesn't seem like a very emotionally stable person
in ANY event, let alone having just been dumped by a guy.  

>Then I go on to tell
>her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
>that did NOT happen

 Sharp thinking. Again, what do you do internally to keep your state solid and
your thinking sharp? THAT process internally is of great value, even more than
the specifics you share.  The specifics are like handing guys fish; good for a
nice meal and of value. But  how you get to the mind-set is TEACHING someone
HOW to fish so they can eat for life. 

>I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>alone!

 Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to her her
"ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she can then
accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!  

   Excellent...Maniac, I don't give a damn WHAT my orthodox SS followers say,
this is BRILLIANT stuff and I'd be proud to be your wing or have you as mine,
ANY FUCKIN' DAY of the week! Sir, I salute you!

>Now what I am doing with all the above, is not arguing the logic (too
>much)
>of this, because, of course she is right, and I know this.

 Actually, you ARE not arguing the logic, but you are USING the logic...HER
logic..HER way of viewing things.....pointing out WHY and HOW she loses and
what will happen if she doesn't stop it.   It's all centered around losing and
WHY she loses, based on what she has told you.  It IS logical, FROM her point
of view.  

 Great, Great stuff...sir, I salute you!

-----

From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]
Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2000 12:03:54 GMT

Replies to various people about psychicbabe:

Answers to various questions:

Was psychicbabe british, or Japanese?
She was a brit of Japanese ancestry (ie. she
looked 'j', but thought, acted and had an
english accent like a brit). This in my
opinion made it harder, because brit women
are so fucking F A T, and she was so
slender, sexy and attractive (and she dressed
to kill) compared to all of them. Lots of guys were
hitting on her (and she said she always got hit
on, and hated it.. trick was to not make it look
like a 'hit').

Why not a white chick? Well, I had the chance...
but.. at the conference where I met her, EVERY
brit. white chick there was in serious blimp bulge
territory.. very scary. Why is it so many caucasian
women are so FAT?

It was funny though, because something like 8 guys
(I counted) tried to hit on psychicbabe the night
I PU'd her. One guy was pretty good, the rest were
total AFC's..it was rather funny.

Re: Rocks -vs- gold.. how I use it (yes, it is
Jake's metephor. For RJ, search the original post
on fastseduction.com. It is also on pickupguide.com
someplace (if not it will be there in about 2 weeks,
I am revising the page this week). Basically, I intro
it as follows:
After chick says bullshit about wanting to go to
dinner and be friends or shit for 6 months before
becoming a GF, I say: Actually, I dont go to dinner
or stuff like that with ladies who are not my GF
CHick:  gasps!
Maniac: see, going to dinner, is an important step
in a relationship for me. I only share it with someone
special
chick: Huh?
Maniac: Well, let me put it this way, do you ever
sleep with a guy who is just your friend, or dont
care about?
chick: of course not!
Maniac: well, why do you think a guy should do any
different then?
Maniac: See, let me tell you a story. You ever hear
about 'rocks & gold'?
chick: no? what is it?
Maniac: Well, Relationships are valuable things.
And each partner is looking for something. It is like
diamonds (rocks) and gold. Both are valuable.

But women prefer diamonds to gold (usually), and
men prefer gold to diamonds (usually). Of course,
both are important, especially in a long term
relationship, but if a woman could choose, she would
prefer the diamonds  first, and the man would
prefer the gold  first. right?

chick: yeah, probably

Maniac: And (generally), a man can accept gold
without the diamonds, and a woman can accept
diamonds without any gold.

So in a relationship, a woman is mining for
diamonds, while the man is mining for gold.
While they are in the mine together, the
guy gives diamonds he finds to the woman, and
the woman gives the gold she finds, to the man.

But if you give a woman gold only, or a man
diamonds only.. neither is likely to be
very happy, and the relationship will soon
fall apart. In short, an exchange of sorts
takes place in a successful relationship.

And also, if a man expects just gold (sex),
but doesnt want to give her diamonds
(relationship & the mushy stuff), then she
will dump him fairly soon, because he is
playing/using her just for sex..

And if a woman expects just diamonds (walks,
attention, nice dinners, movies..etc) without
giving some gold (sex), then he (if he has any
clue about how to deal with women, though many
men do not, especially in North America) will
dump her because she is using/playing him just
for his personality.

A guy taking a chick to dinners, buying shit
and giving nice walks without sex is THE SAME
as a guy sleeping with a girl, and then kicking her
out right after the fuck is over. (chick says:
'yelch!'. Yes, thats right, and for the guy,
just dinners and buying shit is 'yelch', with
no sex, and no attention is exactly the same.

Because a woman will go to free dinner with
almost any guy, it has no value to me. But
I am like you, I want attention, and I want
to be made to feel special.

And although a girl will go to nice free dinners
with almost anyone, I also know that a girl will
not sleep with anyone. So I know if she does with me,
then it means she thinks I am important. And if
she wont, then it means she doesnt care about me
at all, so I really dont need to see her again,
I will just go find another girl.

Maybe you might think it is unusual for a guy
to think this way, but it is just my way.

See, I dont want to be played. Guys are always
getting played by girls for nice dinners, long
talks on the phone, and for their personalities.
It is the SAME as a girl being used for sex.
So I am happy to give plenty her diamonds, but at
the same time, I dont want to be played, so
I also expect her to want to give me gold.
And if she doesn't, it means she doesnt care about
me, is using me, or it means I am being played,
or I am stupid.

As well, experience has also showed me that
'friends first' almost NEVER results in a
relationship. I mean how many of your BFs were
your friend first (chick usually replies..uh,
zero).

Exactly, so that is why I never play 'friends
first'. Friends first means diamonds for the
lady, and no gold for the guy. That is like
the guy saying (ok, lets fuck for 6 months,
and if its good, we can go to dinner, and go
out, and you can be my GF). Would you like
that (chick: yelch!!).

Exactly.. so that is why it is far better,
that the lady meet me, get to know me, and
then I expect her to be smart enough to know
to take that chance THEN (or reject it, and I will
go get another lady) when it is offered to her.

So that is why I expect things that way in a
relationship with a lady.

After this, a chick is (usually) quite impressed,
or surprised and doesnt know what to say..

[When I recited this to psychicbabe, she actually told me
she was very impressed, that I understood relationships
so well ;-) ]

Had I been smart, I would have used it on HB
geek, and laid her, but after that failure I
thought about it, and then when the same situation
came up with Psychicbabe this week, I knew what
to do..

Ok, now on to other comments..

RJ writes
>Maniac writes:
> >I regroup my thoughts.
>
>  I admire your ability to do this in the field, Maniac. As you think
about it,
> what do you do internally to re-set yourself and keep yourself in a
good frame
> of mind when all this shit throws your way?

A couple things.. first, this PARTICULAR chick is of no importance
to me, because I am (likely) seeing 3 others this week. So it is
not as risky to me to be firm, and keep my ground.

Another important fact, is the way chick's brains are usually
wired. For a
chick, once she likes a given guy, it is hard for her to immediately
switch to another guy. it is far MORE risky, because a chick (unlike
men), usually cannot switch to another guy, once she ALREADY
likes a given guy (story is different BEFORE you got her to
like you..then SHE has more power than you).

So I play on this, and as a result I dont feel nervous/scared at all,
because there is far more to risk to her, than to risk to me. Because
she is stuck to me, but I am not stuck to her. (this also is why
'jerks' can get away with so much shit on any given chick, and why
she will tolerate it.. because her brain has now got her focussed
on THAT guy, and it is now a choice (in her mind), between him (and
his bullshit... or being alone (sure she can get another guy in 10
minutes, but she cannot build those nice feelings of 'attachment'
in 10 minutes.. that gives us men power, once we realize this).

Two, I am generally a very balanced level
headed person, and dont take any of this personally (as you already
know, RJ). Three (in this case), I had
already laid this chick, so I didnt care really if I laid her again
or not.. I already conquered her, and she (and I) already knew that.

If it is a new chick, sometimes, I get more nervous/fucked up (see
HB Geek). I am trying to keep my senses more when this happens

> > Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
> >problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
> >her last week, apparently).
>
> Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with
fucking; it feels

Not sure about this, I think she just simply wanted the fuck, but
wanted to feel she was important to me, and she didnt want to just
get played..

> good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the
vulnerabilities.  So
> when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which
overcomes the
> potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. She's worried
about pain

yes, thats right.

> so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not
only losing
> out on the pleasure of screwing,

Not really. I actually made it clear to her that I didnt care if
she bang me or not. The point was that she had to give her mind
to me, and respect me, and follow me (whether that is bang me,
make her take off her clothes in the window for me, or do my
dishes..whatever.. its not the banging that is important, it is
the submission to me that counts, and what she needs to give me
if she wants my attention at all).

> BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
> believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out
that if
> she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even
WORSE
> crack-up.

Yes

>   Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.
>
> >he gets upset, and starts
> >screaming & crying while running down the street, saying how I am
> >just like her ex-bf,
>
> See? The fear of the pain of being hurt just like her ex-BF hurt her
is now
> rearing its ugly head.  She doesn't seem like a very emotionally
stable person
> in ANY event, let alone having just been dumped by a guy.

No, she is not stable at all. I think though, it is because she
bottles it up all day, to be the 'office bitch' that she has to
be in the daytime. This chick lives for her work. She has no other
life.

>
> >Then I go on to tell
> >her that her BF got a new chick after he got her, but in my case
> >that did NOT happen
>
>  Sharp thinking. Again, what do you do internally to keep your state
solid and
> your thinking sharp? THAT process internally is of great value, even
more than
> the specifics you share.  The specifics are like handing guys fish;
good for a
> nice meal and of value. But  how you get to the mind-set is TEACHING
someone
> HOW to fish so they can eat for life.

Actually, the specifics are important I think. This is why lay/field
reports with details are so important. I think really shitty on my
feet. I really suck.. bad.

But if I have had that same experience before (with another chick),
or been in that same situation before, and
either succeeded (or failed, and then thought about how to handle it
right the next time), then I will handle it correctly this time.

I really believe in field experience. I have alot... really alot.
so I have seen many of these situations before. It is like chess,
or a foreign language. If you've been there before, and worked out
a solution, then you know what to do. You MUST get field experience.
It is CRUCIAL. And each time you fail, you go home, and see what
you did right/wrong, and what you would do if the same situation
happened again. This is why I also post the fuckup as well as
the lay reports.. they are very valuable to me in gathering my
thoughts and forcing me to think about what I did right/wrong,
as well as listening to the other's comments about them on this
NG.

I also look at the other's reports as well, and learn about
situations, and ask myself for each one, if it happened to me,
what would I do/how would I handle it. Eventually, after doing it
for a couple years (I have been at this in ernest for about 2
years now), you get better at it. Learning situations in PU, is
like learning the words of a foreign language, and how to connect
them all together.. how to move from a bad situation..to a good
one to get the chick in a horny state..

Also, I keep in mind alot about what MrSex4uNYC says about attitude,
and when I get stuck, I ask myself, what would NYC tell me right
now about this situation. He is very congruent, and if you think
things this way, it is easy to be clear what is the right way or
wrong way.

> >I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
> >with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
> >with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
> >and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
> >unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
> >alone!
>
>  Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to
her her
> "ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she
can then
> accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!

Yes, basically that is the idea. I am not sure that it means I am
an authority, but its more, to convey that she is clueless, she
is wrong, so to listen to herself will make her fuck up even more..
..so maybe she had better listen to me instead, and then she wont
fuckup as much.. basically that is the idea..

>    Excellent...Maniac, I don't give a damn WHAT my orthodox SS
followers say,

I didn't get this.. What are orthodox SS followers, and I had no
idea they were saying anything about this.. I really dont understand
what you mean here..

> >Now what I am doing with all the above, is not arguing the logic (too
> >much)
> >of this, because, of course she is right, and I know this.
>
>  Actually, you ARE not arguing the logic, but you are USING the
logic...HER
> logic..HER way of viewing things.....pointing out WHY and HOW she
loses and
> what will happen if she doesn't stop it.   It's all centered around
losing and
> WHY she loses, based on what she has told you.  It IS logical, FROM
her point
> of view.

Yes, basically that is the idea. What I meant was, is that her main
point is that she wants a monogamous BF, and doesn't want to be played.
But, I am playing her, and she (at some level) realizes that, so
in essense, her gut feel about this is totally correct.

But I am playing her desire for the fuck, and her fear of losing
out, which lets me bypassing her gut feel that she is being
played, and then I can get her to fuck anyways.

Good followups everyone!

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

-----

From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]
Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2001 12:10:23 GMT

  "Dohn Joe"  wrote:
>  wrote in message news:92n7b96
@nnrp1.deja.com...
> [snip]
>
> The more I think of it, the more this seems to be a great PU.
> I think the PU in England is the gist of your piece of work.
>o I'd be glad to see more
> details on how you picked her up in England, that's the hardest work. How
> did you stand up the crowd? How did you make it not look like a PU?

I was using psychological 'jujitsu' (use the strength of your
opponant, against themself). There is a field report from 2 months
ago, that outlines the PU (check fastseduction.com archives).
Basically, I met her at a conference. I didnt talk to her much.
Then I followed her onto a bus that was taking us to the next
meeting place. A guy was hitting on her, and he sat with her.
I sat on the seat in front bymyself.

She (like most british bitches), started complaining about how
she hates men, and other bullshit. The guy on the bus with her
is taking this/agreeing with it (if I remember right).

I just turned around (and tonality and eye contact here is crucial),
and just tell her in a VERY authoritative voice, slowly.. "perhaps
you have just not met the right man yet, one you understands you,
deeply, and completely. But.. you never know the future.. now do you..
I used killed eye contact, spoke slowly, and continued "perhaps
if you open your mind more, you might find him.. by surprise, without
even expecting it, because often, that is the way it usually is..see"

Psychicbabe went "maybe", and then started more manhating bitching.

I then described the kind of man she wanted "one you could rely on,
but at the same time, be mysterious, and exciting in some unexpected
ways, because he just knew how to reach you deep inside you, and
your mind.. that is what your looking for..isnt' it?"

Psychicbabe: yes,

{continue PU, bunches of stuff from the ManiacPlan, if I remember
right}

The key here was the tonality and Eye-Fuck contact. That is what
did it more than the words I used. I just totally crushed her
with it..

> How did
> you get past her "bitch office" shield? I'm asking especially because, as I
> picture this woman, it would seem pretty intimidating for me to approach
> her.

I had the attitude that she obviously had never met a man that
knew how to give it to her right, which means that she obviously
needed ME far more than I needed her. That mindset made it easy.

> I admire your ability to take her from there into total submission.
> existing relationship than guys. That's why many (even HOT ones) find
> themselves in a dead end - boring or abusive - relationship, love to
> complain about it to whoever they find to listen, yet are unable to step out

EXACTLY!!

> of it. That's why the first fuck is hard - after that she is bound
> emotionally to you. You see,

>Women's sexuality is DISSOLVED in them.

Yes! you understand it!! (true for most, but not all chicks though,
some just like sport fucking, like we do)

> GREAT words to remember for all us RAFCs when we feel like beating the walls
> after a fuckup... I myself am so darn depressed when coming back after an
> unsuccessful encounter with a chick. Yes, each field experience is one more
> lesson

Yes, do NOT underestimately field experience. It is SO important.
I fucked up TONS (see all the fuckup reports I used to post a couple
years ago on ASF), and I still fuckup alot (see HBGeek, or HockeyBabe).
Over on cliff's list they say it takes 2..4 years to get good
at something, and 10 years to be a master. I TOTALLY agree.
I have only been at this for 2.. 2 1/2 years. And the more I learn,
the more I realize I still need to learn.. There is still TONS that
I dont know yet.

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

----
From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:08 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

I, for one, am really GLAD to see a post from RJ that has helped me move
forward in MY game :)  not that I am an ingrate hehe... his contribution to all
this is UNDENIABLE to begin with and if I hadn't stumbeled onto his site, I
would have still been using my caveman tactics and my MENTAL seduction game
would still be lacking.  as much as I appreciate his contribution to the
seduction game in general, I had been disappointed with all the flaming and
nonsense that he and others had/have been involved with because I thought that
this NG was BASED on USEFUL interaction between him and the rest of us, but I
found that not to be the case :(  not that ANYONE gives a fuck what I have to
say about this, but I wanted to back up into the PAST to make it clear that I
appreciate RJ's PERSONAL contribution to the NG TODAY.

In article <20001230151247.26801.00001467@ng-fi1.aol.com>, erosla77@aol.com
(ErosLA77) writes:

>>I tell her the rocks/gold story (I love this story, it is
>>excellent for dealing with chick bullshit) and my expectations
> 
>   Metahpor is a POWERFUL tool to move folks from a fixed perception to a new
>one. Please, share your story!

I have been doing this without identifying it:

A) find out her perception (marriage, monogamy, sucking dick VS kissing...)
B) "quote" her a story illustrating a chick that saw things a DIFFERENT way
(the way I want HER to see things) and benefitted GREATLY from it (she is still
with me, she got married to the guy she wanted, she gained inner peace and
self-love...)
C) watch her AGREE with something that she just minutes ago BELIEVED was
incorrect, or not for her.

the most fascinating part is (C) because I didn't realize my powers of
validation, pacing then LEADING had developed so strongly.  this is partially
because I am an empath and can FEEL when a chick moves into different emotional
states so I can relate to her from within her own state and effectively "vulcan
mind-meld" with her, turning the TWO of us into a SINGLE, functioning entity so
that I can dictate for US... to a degree.

a frequent situation is chicks asking me if I am single.  basically, I explain
to them that I am in an "open" relationship.  they practically INVARIABLY
disrespect my MLTR for being stupid. "how can she go for that?" "I would have
dumped you" "I would never let a man see other women"...  sooooo :)  I let them
go on and on and get it all out and completely ENTRENCH themselves in the DREAM
of them being with a man like me AND dumping me or CHANGING me or whatever
their BULLSHIT FANTASIES are at the time.  THEN I go into the BENEFITS of being
MY PRIMARY relationship... :)  when I stack up the LIST of BENEFITS and it
stacks HIGHER than those bitches have in their OWN RELATIONSHIPS RIGHT NOW,
they start thinking.  they think about what LITTLE they really have in their
relationships that MY MLTR is getting.  they think about the TRUST and
COMPANIONSHIP between us that they DON'T HAVE with their borefriends.  they
think about how she is SEXUALLY SATISFIED... DAILY if she wants it.  she has
someone to give her the REAL DEAL on how men are and what we want from
chicks... not someone that's going to keep playing her until he is finished
fucking her.  they ALSO see how the other bitches (like them in the near
future) come and go and MLTR CONSTANTLY receives the benefits of being with a
man that does EVERYTHING for her that she could want... for the MERE price of
NOT bailing because I fuck other chicks :)  once I break it down to them, ALLLL
I see on their faces is ENVY.  matter of fact, they tend to look EMBARRASSED
when I ask THEM about THEIR relationships.  oh, that reminds me... the bitches
that DON'T HAVE A MAN AT ALL fare the WORST in these situations.  my MLTR has
NEVER-ENDING SATISFACTION... they have STORIES of what they WOULD DO... IF
they could get a man AT ALL!  :)

chicks would rather have 20% of a WINNER than 100% of a LOSER!

>> Now she starts crying, and saying that was the
>>problem with her ex-BF, that chicks always chased him (he dumped
>>her last week, apparently).
>
>Ah, she has MIXED emotions. Pain AND pleasure associated with fucking; it
feels
>good but could lead to emotional betrayal because of the vulnerabilities.  So
>when you pull it all away, then she has the fear of loss, which overcomes the
>potential fear of potential emotional hurt later on. 

wow!  VERY powerful :)  I had really considered these to be apples and
oranges... pain of emotions after sex and pain of LOSS of the individual. 
however, discomfort is discomfort.  I quit giving UTILITY to this PIVOT I was
using because I realized she had ZERO self-esteem and not many other redeeming
qualities other than her looks.  she went from LJBF to NEXT overnight.  I had
been using her for a pivot because of her looks, but her lack of personality
started to wear on me and finally, she had to go.  no more hanging out, no more
phone calling, no more help with her love-life... nothing... cold turkey. 
completely FORGOT about her.  about a month or so later, the holiday season
comes around and she  A) calls me  B) tells me she bought me something for
christmas (I bought her NOTHING, not even a CARD and didn't bother to get one
when she told me she bought me something)  C) tells me she wants to bring it TO
my house, and  D) shows up with gift in hand, READY to socialize and spend time
with me.  

this is the SAME bitch that NEVER went in her purse to even OFFER to throw in
money when I used to use her for a pivot.  I didn't mind paying for her though
because the benefits I got from being out with an attractive chick that KNOWS I
am out to get OTHER bitches and facilitates that was well worth it :)  hehe... 
too bad for her, MLTR was over and I received her gift, talked to her for a
while (where she told me her recent "relationship" blew the fuck up in her face
:-) and then ejected her to keep having fun with MLTR.

I have been using outfoxer's style of letting bitches get involved in bullshit
relationships, TELLING THEM the relationships are bullshit then letting them
fall FLAT on their faces and come CRAWLING back to me :)  I just haven't added
the part yet where I get indignant that they are giving sex to CHUMPS that use
them like BITCHES and throw them away.  hehe it is fun enough at this point
just to hear about their FAILURES from the horses' mouths and see the sad looks
on their faces, while I am CONSTANTLY SMILING :)

what you described is BASICALLY what happened to her, except NOT in the sexual
content, but in the companionship content.  she THOUGHT she had a solid
position with me as my pivot, so she didn't feel like paying for anything
because she thought I NEEDED her, not WANTED her.  as soon as I didn't want her
anymore and dumped her from LJBF to NEXT, she was OK with it UNTIL her
relationship BACKFIRED... THEN she decides she wants to get back in good with
ME, which she can't do because I don't give a fuck about her and except for
looks, she can't compete with MLTR AT ALL!

the pain of loneliness overrides the emotional pain of sex without
committment... fascinating :)

>She's worried about
>pain, so you point out the pain if she DOESN'T bang you...the pain of not only
>losing out on the pleasure of screwing, BUT the pain of losing you and FURTHER
>believing she is doomed to lose. You just take her map and point out that if
>she doesn't drive where you want her to, she's going to have an even WORSE
>crack-up.
>
>  Once she accepts this, it's a done deal.

ok, this is interesting too.  "this is why you fucked up with your ex and I
feel the same way about that particular topic".  you are FORECASTING her
EJECTION unless she changes her ways.  she is still WITH YOU and has a chance
to do the right thing instead of getting ejected.  she already knows how it
feels to BE ejected by her EX and doesn't WANT to go through that pain AGAIN
with you.  you dictate to her HOW she could have avoided it with her EX and she
learns how to avoid it with you and gets in line.  this is another reason why
DICTATING what you REQUIRE from chicks is good, because they have the roadmap
to success or FAILURE with you.  as long as you have demonstrated personality
AND value BEFORE getting to this with her, she will be in a state of "how can I
get my hands on this guy... and KEEP him?" and then you will tell her what she
needs to do to be CONSIDERED amongst your TOP chicks and then is is up to her
to either fulfill her womanly duties or... as you predicted... get ejected and
feel the PAIN OF SEPERATION all over again with someone that she ALREADY knows
she WANTS to be with... WHATEVER the cost.

everyone has their price.  I find, most times, chicks are TALKING with no
EXPERIENCE.  a chick told me that she dumped her borefriend because he laughed
at her.  I told her that the sex must not have been good because otherwise she
would have had to use more than THAT to justify dumping an entire relationship.
 she CLAIMED that sex had nothing to do with her decision and that he didn't
RESPECT her was why she dumped him.  I told her that if the sex had been what
it is SUPPOSED to be... I GUARANTEE her that she would NOT have thrown THAT
away because of some laughing and disrespect.  I also proceeded to laugh at her
AND disrespect her IN HER FACE and told her I don't care because we are not
dating... she can't DUMP ME!   she never ADMITTED that I was right... BUT... by
the end of the conversation, she was asking me WHAT SHE SHOULD DO TO MAKE HER
LOVE LIFE BETTER!  :/  gotcha!

>>I  tell her that she wants everything to be a 'perfect' situation
>>with a guy before she makes a move. She wants him to be ideal
>>with women, skillful, handsome and know how to treat a lady..
>>and still be single!! I go on to tell her that that is TOTALLY
>>unrealistic! And THAT is why she loses! and she always ends up
>>alone!
>
> Powerful because it is 100% true. You have accurately described to her her
>"ruin" so now that she accepts you as an authority on who she IS she can then
>accept you as an authority on who she CAN be and WHERE she can be!  

yes.  I really have not been making the MOST of pacing and leading.  I have
been seeing where they ATTACH THEMSELVES to my way of thinking and see me as an
authority.  I have not used this to MAKE POLICY for them... merely to open
their minds and get them to think more efficiently.  you are right though. 
once you capture them... LEAD THEM!  make SOME efficient use of your new
followers... even if you were only practicing or passing time by capturing them
:)

excellent post :)

------

From: mrsex4unyc@aol.comedr4d (MrSex4uNYC)
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Date: 02 Jan 2001 18:58:10 GMT
Subject: Re: Re-Lay Report! Psyching out psychic babe! ..a chick bullshit special!]

In article <92n7b96@nnrp1.deja.com>, maniac_high@yahoo.com writes:

>After chick says bullshit about wanting to go to
>dinner and be friends or shit for 6 months before
>becoming a GF, I say: Actually, I dont go to dinner
>or stuff like that with ladies who are not my GF
>CHick:  gasps!
>Maniac: see, going to dinner, is an important step
>in a relationship for me. I only share it with someone
>special
>chick: Huh?
>Maniac: Well, let me put it this way, do you ever
>sleep with a guy who is just your friend, or dont
>care about?
>chick: of course not!

[lots of good use of Jake's shit snipped]

this is interesting, though I couldn't tell if this is something you are GOING
to do, or something you DID already.  either way, IF you are congruent, this
will serve you well as an alternate form of screening.  most of the time, I
screen by ASKING chicks shit and listening to their answers while watching
their faces and body-language.  another way to do it is to basically DICTATE to
them what I need to even CONSIDER being with a chick in any capacity
whatsoever.  most of the time I don't do this though because I can tell already
that the chick is worthless.  I usually get into DICTATION when she asks me
about myself.  am I attached?  what do I look for in a woman? etc.  THEN, since
she asked, I get into the reasons I have chosen women in the past and why I am
still with them in the present.  as I do that, I lay down my laws WITHOUT
telling the chick I am talking to that she needs to get in line with this shit
or get the fuck out of my face.  I have had a couple of chicks blow themselves
out after this.

I was talking to a chick that I know from YEARS ago that started calling me
again and talking about nothing.  I tolerated her for an hour or so on two
different days  A) because I was bored and  B) because through her speech
patterns and recurring ideas, I was learning if she was worth anything to me at
all, considering I get everything I want or need from MLTR in the first place,
she only had a VERY LIMITED use to me, as GOOD backup-pussy.  MLTR is smarter,
more interesting, more fun, less psychotic... basically TRUMPED her in all
areas, so this chick had NO CREDIT with me whatsoever.  I ended up getting into
PRECISELY what you did in your post.  the KICKER was when I told her "I don't
even TALK to girls that I don't want to fuck".  since I had not fucked her AND
had not suggested that we get together (she BELIEVES in monogamous
relationships for herself and even if she fucked me one time, it would be
merely to relieve her own personal stress and I am not going to be there for
her for that.  I am looking for MORE MLTRs... anything else can go fuck off.  I
laughed at her way of being AND broke it down to her why it was so stupid AND
let her know in NO UNCERTAIN TERMS that I was not going to be involved in
ANYTHING CLOSE to what she claims to want for herself... she can STAY HORNY for
all I care) she INTELLIGENTLY asked me WHY I was talking to her...  I let her
know that I found her amusing and her way of living ineffective.  I pointed out
to her that in the YEARS since I had spoken to her last, ALL she had to show
for it was a bungh of jibberish about WANTING a monogamous relationship that
she HAS NOT ATTAINED IN ALL THESE YEARS!  I let her know that I had predicted
that she would REMAIN dissatisfied for years to come and my talking to her
allowed me to follow her LACK of progress while, in the meantime, I get laid
EVERY DAY by MLTR :)   I have not heard from her SINCE that conversation...
good riddance.  she knew what she HAD to do if she wanted more of my time.  she
knew what she was going to have to do IF she wanted to socialize with me at
all.  she felt like her DEVOTION to the idea of a monogamous relationship with
a NON-EXISTANT man was more important than getting fucked by a guy that she
KNOWS and LIKES.  she is an idiot, and will remain horny UNTIL she fucks the
wrong guy, then has NO ONE to comfort her because I will not be there because
she had her chance and BLEW IT!

I have ZERO TOLERANCE for chicks that want things their way.  if they LIKE
doing things MY WAY, then they can be with me...maybe... for a while... as long
as they still LOOK HOT :)   when I approach chicks, I ASSUME they will fail the
screen because statistics show that I require A LOT from a chick and most of
them are either distracted by work or other relationships or just are not
QUALITY enough to be with me.  I find it amusing how ridiculous the SAME girls
are that I used to DESIRE to go out with and that I USED TO dislike being
rejected by.

now, I meet and REJECT girls daily.  not actively, just after I meet them, I
make NO EFFORT to remain in contact with them and go off to talk to other
chicks, leaving them wondering WHY I was interested enough to approach, but
BECAME DISINTERESTED and ejected for a SIMILARLY-GOOD-LOOKING bitch :)

Experiment Report! How kinky are your coworkers?!

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



A practice session using the techniques of PU!


From: maniac_high@yahoo.com
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: ]Experiment Report! How kinky are YOUR co-workers?!
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 08:03:45 GMT

]Experiment Report! How kinky are YOUR co-workers?!

This report is about finding the deep dark secrets of
your co-workers (not necessarily to fuck them, but as
a good experiment in state transitioning in groups
rather than one-on-one).

Note, for those readers living in repressed countries
still in the sexual dark ages like the Islamic
Republic of Iran, or the United Stated of America,
I do not advice attempting this..trouble with the
legal system, sex harrassment shit, or loss of
your job could result.. For the rest of you living
in countries that have both feet planted firmly in
the 20th century, no problem, lets rock on- here
is the report!


Recently, I have been doing alot of work practicing
state transitioning. Ie. the goal is to take a
chick (or in this case, group of chicks) from the
"idle state" (ie. thinking about office bullshit
and work they have to do), and transition them
to the kinky "lets get crazy and fuck state" as
quickly as possible, and in as few steps as possible
using a process that will be consistantly successful.

Last night, we had one of these (usually) boring
office departmental dinner parties at a stuffy
restaurant in town. BORING!!

So I decided what better place to liven things up
and see what I can get away with using psychological
warfare and a little bit of alcohol in an otherwise
formal group setting.

I get there, and sit at a table with 1 guy, and
5 chicks. For the first 30 minutes, it is boring,
I let everyone talk about boring office shit so
that everyone can arrive, and the food can start.

First I arrange the waiter to bring drinks to the
table (we need it later for one of the games I
am going to do), and get started on that right away.
One of the chicks only drinks tea, but that is OK,
later she really got into it anyways in spite of
being stark sober.

At the table is sitting:
ChinaGuy - he is from China
Mombabe - she is a mom, but wild & crazy, 40s (starts
          by sitting at another table)
HB CaptHook - she had a mild eye infection and is
              wearing an eyepatch this week (starts by
              sitting at another table)
HBStrict - she only drinks tea, but is more action
           than she looks
ScaredChick - she thinks we are all wierd
HBWhoMe? - she looks SO straight, but is the kinkiest
           at the table we find out!
Bichick - we find out she had enjoyed some bi games

Other assorted people sitting farther, who dont
play in the games really..

After that, I start. Here is how I did it. Refer
to the 'Maniac plan' post I made a couple weeks ago
(it is archived in fastseduction.com, I will also put
it on my site in Jan. when the next big update
happens) for some of the terminology below. I move
all the chicks (as a group), through all the states
as follows:

[Current State: Idle: chicks talking about office bullshit]
Maniac>Bichick: So what did you do this weekend?
Bichick: Nothing really.. how about you?
Maniac>I went to my dance circle, I like salsa dance
Bichick: oh really? {other chicks starting to listen}
Maniac: Yeah, I went to Brazil this year too, it was so
        much fun, wanna see my pictures?
Bichick & others: 'yes!' (take out my digi-PC, show pictures
        of carnival in Rio, tback bikini babes, the gay parade
        and debauchery in the streets)
Maniac: You know, the culture is SO different, brazilian people
        are SO passionate!
All chicks: oh really?
Maniac: yep, after I left Rio, I went to Sao Paolo, and
        went into this bar and all of the sudden this brazilian
        chick grabbed me and started french kissing me (perform
        SP chick story from ManiacPlan).

[Current State: (A)dmiration & (M)an now achieved from ManiacPlan]
Bichick: Oh, HB Capthook lived in brazil a few years!
Maniac: really? {I go to her table, ask if she wants to see
        some brazil carnival pictures with us.. she runs over
        to our table}
Maniac>all chicks: you know, I respected that SP chick though
       because she was not afraid to take what she wants..
       kind of like Madonna (perform the Madonna story from
       ManiacPlan).
Maniac: Perform 'how to communicate to lady at all levels
        and pay attention to her and what she wants' story
        from ManiacPlan, while doing lots of Kino on
        HBCapthook sitting next to me as a demonstration.
        Others are watching and getting jealous..

[Now try to introduce the (S)ex state from ManiacPlan..
the goal here is to do the "questions game, but in a
group setting.. so I decide to do it via a drinking game]
Maniac: {now I try to introduce a drinking game called 'I
       never'}, Hey, do they have any good drinking games in
       Japan.
Chicks: {they suggest some really lame boring shit like
         remembering names of subway stations..boring!!!}
Maniac: Well, I know two games, Chandelliers {I describe this
        game.. but we wont play it, not sexual}, and then
        "I never" {I describe "I never"}.
[Now here, I think I dont have enough rapport yet to start
"I never" (a drinking version of "questions") and get it to
work well (ie. sexually), so first I preform the "Strawberry
fields" game in a group (in next post, and included below)

<>>

We play the game: (mombabe hears us laughing, comes
over & kicks Chinaguy out of his chair so she can sit
next to us)

Among the answers to "strawberry fields"
Bichick: "uh, I dont see any fence around the field!"
HB Capthook & mombabe: "as many as I can eat!"
HBStrict: "to the farmer.. uh.. Thank you {and bow}"

We were all laughing and rolling on the floor to the
various chicks answers to this game, with lots of "I cant
believe you?! really?!" reactions among the ladies..

[Current state in ManiacPlan: (S)ex now achieved, now
lets intensify and see what these chicks will say/do.
I am putting LOTS of shoulder/back kino on all the
ladies as the game is playing]

Maniac: OK, time for another game, we will play that
 "I never" game we talked about before. {Maniac explains
 howto play "I never"} [easy.. each person takes a turn,
 say "I never xxx", whoever did "xxx" has to take a drink.
 start light, get game sexual ASAP..]

Maniac: here is the opening question: "I never kissed a
 member of the opposite sex before I was 15 y.o."
{3 girls drink}
Maniac: your turn HBCaptHook
HBCaptHook: uh, I dont understand the game yet, can you do
  the next question Maniac?
Maniac: OK, I never kissed a guy on the first date
{we all drink}
HBCaptHook: OK I get it, my turn "I never had sex with a
 guy on the first date" {notice because of the setup with
 straberry fields here, that the chicks ON THEIR OWN, turned
 the game sexual without me having to do anything! This was
 what I worried about if I were to start the "I never" game
 before straberry fields.. the mood was just not sexual
 enough yet, and the game would have fizzled.. but now..
 no problem!}
{all but 1 chick drinks (HB afraid.. who is looking a bit
 uncomfortable now)}
Mombabe: I never kissed a member of the same sex
{Bichick drinks!.. lots of "oh really?!? and discussion
 ensues, but bichick wont delve into it anymore ;-) }
Bichick: I never had sex with more than 4 people in the
 room.
{bichick, HBstrict and HBWhoMe all drink!}
HBAfraid: I never went to california
{we all look at her wierd.. skip to next girl}
HBWhoMe: I never did sex as part of a performance in front
of others
{Maniac, Bichick and HBWhoMe drink.. HBStrict looks envious,
others gasp and are laughing.. rest of our dept, is looking
at us, like why we are having so much fun, and a bit wierdly,
fortunately they cannot hear what we are saying ;-)}
Maniac: I never had sex with someone and didn't know their
 name till the next morning.
{We all drink except HB afraid}
MomBabe: I never used tool, or vibrator during sex
{we all drink}
HBCaptHook: I never had sex with a cat?!
{we all look at her wierd.. no one drinks}
HBCaptHook: but it can happen, I saw it on video once!
{we look at her more strange, and make her drink for watching
the video}
HBAfraid: I cant think of any question
{we skip her, next girl}
..
Maniac: I never was tied/tied up my partner during sex
{Maniac, HB strict, HBCapthook and HBWhome all drink}

Maniac: I see, so who is "S", and who is "M" {explain to
 a couple clueless chicks which was which}
HBWhoMe and HBStrict are serious S type, Bichick is both.
HBStrict makes a pass at me, and I reply only if you are
serious.. she stares at me long (maybe a future there ;-) )
I shake hands and hug HBWhoMe, who is really into this
thread of questioning.

Mombabe now makes ajoke about why I went to lunch today
with this other chick (not in the game), and not her. I
tell her because she didn't ask me.. girls have to take
what they want, like that SP chick. I ask her if she
likes me, she says yes, and I gesture (and get) a cheek
kiss. I am CERTAIN I could have done a KC, or even one
of those 3way KCs, but I remember that this is an
experiment, and I do have to see all these people on Monday
again at work, so I dont push it.

now adminbabe (the dept head's secy) comes by our table
and asks how many of us are going to the prescheduled
after-party karaoke. Mombabe replies "none of us, we are
all going to a hotel".. HBCapthook adds in "a love hotel..".

[Final state: Dying to fuck: achieved]

Adminbabe looks at us wierd (she missed the whole thing),
and leaves. Mombabe now asks why I have such a harem tonight,
and then Bichick remarks how all the ladies in the office
really really like you Maniac.

I ask 'why?'
bichick says.. you smile, and laugh alot.. but there is
something else.. we all see it, but cant really
describe what it is {maniac opinion.. it is the way
I stare at chicks with the 'fuck me' luck, and all the
shoulder kino..etc, I do, even in the office}.

Supper now is wrapping up, we all have to go, I remark
that this table is fun, and that another night, we should
all meet again for beer and fun.. everyone agrees.

As we are going back, HBCaptHook and mombabe are grabbing
all over me, it was funny.

Some go home, and I split off from the group, as I have
a date with karatebabe at midnight in another part of
town..

Experiment over..

I learned that state transitioning is a very predictable,
reproduceable process, once you learn the tools to do it.
This was just my office staff that is around me, so made
a good subject for the experiment. I also realized, that
in groups, there is a sort of feed back effect, so you
can really accelerate things. It wasnt the alcohol because
HBstrict had nothing to drink, but was well into the
game too.

Because it was a group, I could skip steps "BVG,D,O" in
the ManiacPlan, and reach the last state.. (dying to fuck)
so I likely could have taken any (or all)
of those ladies back for a wild time in the sack (which I
wont do, because I work with them.. but there was nothing
stopping it, thats for sure)..

Fascinating..

Constructive Opinions/comments anyone?

Maniac High
http://www.pickupguide.com

Doing proper ‘closes’

Maniac High — Fri, 14 May 2010 08:00:00 +0000

From the archives at Maniac High's Seduction Website:

http://www.pickupguide.com



Toecutter talks about 'closing'!


From toecutter@mail.com Thu Nov  2 10:44:01 2000
From: "toecutter" 
Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: More lessons from sales: Closing.
Date: Thu, 26 Oct 2000 15:40:13 GMT


Yesterday I did a brief outline on what was in the sales literature on
handling objections. Today I am going to attempt to address closing (this is
a much more difficult task). It is not an easy thing to write about. There
are whole books out there on this stage of the sales process alone. Suffice
to say that it is by far the most important. You can be perfect at the other
5 steps, but if you can not close, and ask for a call to action then you can
not sell (or get a fuck).

In fact salesmen say that there are 2 types of people in sales: The salesman
(who is better than simply an ordertaker; at least he can so some things on
his own ... if he is good he can generate leads, meet and initiate
conversation, elicit values, support the sale, handle objections, and
attempt to close). The other type is The Closer (he is the man that can
really deliver. He can sell, charm and hold the customer to the deal).
Closing a sale is the most important skill a sales person (or PUA) needs.
You can be charismatic, come up with the best leads, have incredible
presentation skills, but if you can't close, you can't sell (or PU).

There are three steps to closing a sale and they are:

A. Recognising the Time to Close
B. Deciding on Your Closing Technique
C. Making the Closing Statement

In recognising the time to close you need to watch your customer. (Needless
to say, Value needs to have been created first but some customers may know
they need your product before you open your mouth. You can just walk up to
the customer and close ... I have seen guys just walk up take a girl by the
hand and lead her out of a bar without a word ... CLOSERS). You close too
early (value has not been created or objections have not been overcome) you
loose the sale. You close too late, the customer is out of their
enthusiastic state, you will fall flat on your face again. Watch her state
and see the opportunity. In fact the whole time you are with her you should
be looking for that window of opportunity to close. Closing is the only
reason you are even there.

Some relevant closing techniques from sales I will outline below, but there
needs to be a technique. In the PU situation, I would use them for a #close,
or a date close (i.e. getting her out of the bar, or the supermarket queue
into a coffee shop or your home to see whatever it is that you say you want
to show them). It is a call for action. I make the reservation that you
should not use a verbal close to get her answering the question "Shall we go
and fuck?". This defies chick logic. Just get her to your house.

The closing statement needs to be smooth and delivered with confidence. This
is not a time for Umms and Ahhs. Once you have decided on your technique,
you are ready to make the closing statement. It is time to ask for the order
(or number or to leave together). There are some considerations that you
should understand so that your efforts to close will be successful:

* Stay in your normal discussion mode and tone. Don't telegraph what you are
going to do by a change in posture or tone of voice.
* Remember that you are asking for the order but don't pressure for a sale.
Move slowly but deliberately to the next step in the process, if there is
one.
* Expect your close to fail if you have not provided the value needed by the
prospect. Don't discount the failure, learn from it and do better next time.
* Ask questions if the close fails to determine what went wrong and see if
you can salvage the situation (the more high pressure the close you use, the
more you are going to have to work to retrieve the situation).

Okay, now for some of the techniques. See my post "Field report: A killer
#close including overcoming BF objections"
http://www.fastseduction.com/cgi-bin/search.cgi?action=retrieve&grp=1&mn=970
26921569650 for a field report using many of these techniques. I know the
close is far from perfect, but you can see my sales training shining through
in it. It includes the yes ladder, an invitational close (crossed with the
puppy dog, "try me, I am free"), fear factor close and pre-emptive objection
strike (I'll be discrete). I reckon that I got the fuck largely on the
strength of this close.

The main reason customers say "no" is a fear of making a decision. They say
"no" even if they want to buy from you. So, when a customer says "no," you
must re-sell by creating more value, or building up the required state and
close again. In order to do this, you must have more than one close to use.
Otherwise, they will leave and go fuck your competitor. Here are some:

The Power of Suggestion Close (called in NLP, time distortion) Help your
customers to see themselves using your product. Speak to them as though they
already owned it, and tie in a hot button benefit to its use: "When you use
these vitamins and herbs, after only a few weeks you'll notice that you have
more energy and that you feel healthier." or from in a pattern "Imagine us
at the coffee shop laughing together and having a good time, and later you
being at home feeling that you had a really good time and enjoyed yourself
spending time with me over coffee. Now when you think about what I am
saying, and all those feelings that I am talking about, doesn't it just make
sense that we go and have coffee together now?"

The Direct Close. (high risk, she could say "no", then she owns that no, and
you have to prove her wrong.) The obvious and most frequently used close is
the direct approach of asking for the order. Once you are sure in your mind
that you have done everything possible to overcome objections, and if you
feel that you can fulfill the prospects need, go for it. "If we want to
continue this conversation another time, I will need your phone number, here
is my pen."

The Invitational Close. If you want it, you have to ask for it. Don't just
wait for the customer to say, "I'll take it." They don't. Create the value,
then invite them to do it. Say, "Why don't you give it a try? Go ahead and
do it."

The Option Close. The more options you give someone, the better your chances
to close."Our truck is in this area twice a week, do want delivery on
Wednesday or Friday?" "Do you want this charged to your Visa or MasterCard?"
"I'll be in your area on Tuesday and Wednesday evenings, which would be a
better night for us to catch up and have coffee?" These choices require a
commitment and "no" is not offered as an option.

The yes ladder close (TokyoPUA calls this one the yes-set). The yes ladder
close builds a chain of "yes's" to questions the salesperson asks to help
lead the customer into saying yes to the sale. To put the customer in the
habit of saying yes, ask questions you're sure will get affirmative answers.
See that field report for an example.

The Puppy Dog Close (also called the Free Trial close) This close gets its
name from the pet store closing technique of letting customers hold the
animal they want to make it harder to resist, and even let them take it home
for a week. This close lets your buyers see for themselves your product's
quality. Make sure your customers hold, taste, feel, wear, try out your
product, take it home for a week even and bond with it. Let the prospect use
your product or service for a specified period of time with the
understanding that you will pick up a signed order after the trial period.

The Fear-Factor Close. This is very powerful because you are playing on
people's uncertainties, insecurities and fears. People want products and
services which minimize their risks whether it is personal or property
related. "This water purifier will protect you and your family from some of
the deadliest forms of bacteria in the water." Hard to implement, but I did
it with that $5 close in the field report.

The Readiness Close
This close checks the client's "buying temperature." With it you can also
find out if you are on the right path with your presentation or if you need
to change course. The great thing about this close is that it doesn't end
your presentation but instead tells you what direction to go.
A. "Does this make sense to you?"
B. "How do you feel about this so far?"
C. "Is this what you wanted?"
D. "Is this an improvement for you?"
Not sure how to implement this last one, and have been thinking about it
because it is so LOW risk. Any ideas?

Comments / suggestions / applications / more closes are welcome.

Toecutter.

P.S. There are guys out there in this group who obviously can not close (Ray
is the perfect example ... his Foxhunting crap I have read, but his handling
of objections only delays his need to close by dragging the thing out. He is
scared as shit of this step in the process, the call for action, and works
out complex strategies so that he feels like he is doing something, but it
never leads to the close. Realise that you NEED to close, and it is the only
reason you are even there).